/ck/ - Food & Cooking

kek you can use those pul lthrough sharpeneers but I think they grind down your knifes really fast.

>>12980892
Only one? What grid is it?
keep practising, the first knife i sharpened with a stone was pretty shit, now im at a good level, not razor-sharp but good enough to slice through everything including fingers

>>12980982
It's 400/1000
The videos that I watched achieved very good results with a 1000 grid and said anything finer is not necessary, unless you care about the edge looking nicer, like a mirror polish

>>12981048
400/1000 isn't a bad starter and will definitely give you a good edge. You just need to find the right angle and practice. I guess that applies to most things in life really.
If you're getting dull knives your angle and/or technique is wrong. The great thing about something like this is that once you get a hang of it you can fix even the dullest blade, so unless you actually grind down the knife entirely you're not risking anything but your time.
You may be able to look up the best angle for your particular knife if it's a fairly fancy one.
>>12980895
I hate those things. I wouldn't mind the loss of metal if they gave a good edge, but the ones I've tried don't even do that.

Stone autismo is for people who don't cook

>>12980892
The problem with learning to sharpen without somebody who knows what they are doing is that many knives have a shitty edge from the factory and it can be trying even for a good sharpener to put on a good initial bevel. Many give up in frustration before they have succeeded. You basically have to put your own stamp on the edge, that takes some time at first. Painting the edge with some black sharpie marker to see whaat you are doing on the stone is very helpful here.

Make sure you have it at the proper angle, usually about 15 degrees per side.
It's surprising how many people mess this up

Would sticking a chopstick or something similar to the side of your knife make it any easier in grinding with the same angle repeatedly ?
I really need to sharpen my knives and I can't use sharpening steel for shit.
pic related, can't use that for shit.

>>12981297
To start with, don't try to Gordon Ramsay it midair.
Park it firmly on your cutting board and just run your knife down it like you're trying to peel off a slice.

>>12981321
Fair enough. I don't have one at the moment though it's just something I remember from when I tried at my folks' place. I'll keep that in mind anon, thanks.

>>12980892
When sharpening a knife do you start with the lowest or highest grit...?

>>12981673
lowest

>>12981297
>can't use a sharpening steel
Do you have arthritis or something? I'm struggling to imagine what difficulty you could possibly have...

>>12980892
Learn to use a honing steel and do it every time before you use the knife.
Actual sharpening shouldn't need to be done more than once every few months. If you can't do it right, pay someone else do it.
Some grocery store meat departments offer free knife sharpening.

>>12981212
>The problem with learning to sharpen without somebody who knows what they are doing is that many knives have a shitty edge from the factory
This really messed with me, it took me ages to get good edges on my knives the first time, then it appeared to be getting easier each time, so I figured my technique was just improving. Then I went to sharpen a new knife one day and suddenly couldn't achieve shit.

>>12980892
Once you've got "your" edge on a knife, it becomes a five minute, once or twice a year job; so it's not really therapeutic so much as a satisfying option to have available. It's a lot more enjoyable once you're getting reliable results though, it does feel like you're just casting about in the dark at first.

I was a butcher in a meat works for about 5 years, and that shit takes practice to master.

Buy a cheap knife, run it across concrete to blunt it, then sharpen it until it can shave your arm hairs.

Rinse and repeat until you can do it in under a couple of minutes.

And it all changes with Austenite, and Martensite and the specific hardness. Angle and grain, burr.

>>12980892
this is how it all starts. play safe britbong

>>12980892
>Or should I just keep practicing?
Do this until you have enough skill for it. After this, time to choose.
>stay with ahndsharpening
>get a fixed angel systhem
I bought a beginner set and went never back, more tahn enough to shave hair without needing alot skill

>>12982120

Britbongs had some of the best steel back in the from Sheffield. Better than Germany before they got good.

I'm not going to do a seminar, but what you need to learn is 'firm relaxed'. You need to learn the angle you're shooting for, with whetstones, you look at the leading edge and tip the blade until you see water and then hold that angle firmly but without force and skitter that blade, one side, then the other while observe the water coming out from the edge after you tip it. It's a little bubble and that's the angle you pick. After that you observe the edge after about 5 passes to make sure you're not rocking the edge. You want a neutral edge, not concave, not convex.

>>12981354

Honing steels don't really sharpen your blade (since they're not hard enough to actually remove material). They just align the blade to keep it straight.

You pretty much have to use a Whetstone.

>>12981704
It's not that I cannot use the device it's an issue about finding which angle I should grind the knife to and maintaining that I guess. It just seemed to me like it's not working that well.

>>12982366
Its not that finicky. You know what 90 degrees is, move the knife halfway between that and zero and you are at 45 degrees, then go halfway between that and zero and you are at 22 or so.

You've probably already dished your stones by not knowing what the fuck you're doing. Get a lapping stone or just pick up some lapped granite/marble and buy film.

>>12980892
this guy is excellent at sharpening and has pretty decent videos to boot

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC-1TUi3OPc2jSVWLNM2ARwg

>>12982366

You might need to negotiate with the device manufacturerer and come out with a seemingly decent desired negotiation before you try to come up with something that is good. You should talk with them.

>>12982640

You need to buy a lapping cat that has film on the Kennedy assassination. Then you can sharpen your political skills with regards to kitchen knives.

>>12982640

Dude, "lapping" is flattening. Are you flattening your knife or are you sharpening your knife? Jesus Christ, it's like watching toddlers try to hump.

>>12982341
Based retard
I watched that good eats episode and our chef was just spewing bullshit at that part.
A honing steel is abrasive and will (((sharpen))) your blade

Inb4 angry drunk luthier guy

>>12983117
>>12982759
Oh wait I mean in after

>>12980892
>Turns out I don't really enjoy it after all
hahah kek, lol, lmao WWWW this made me laugh

>>12982759
Either lap the shitty stone he has flat, or pick up some LAPPED granite(or plexiglass) and use 3m LAPPING FILM as your "stone". If you don't know what the fuck you're talking about, just don't comment.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/All-3M-Products/Semiconductor/Abrasives/CMP-and-Surface-Finishing-Materials/Lapping-Films/?N=5002385+8709350+8710644+8711017+8720870+8734569+3294857497&rt=r3

/ck/ can't even into knife sharpening.
This board is fucking horrible.

>>12983124

You people really are damaged. I fucking love that I've crippled an entire group of adult children. You goddamn screw ups are done in life, aren't you?

>>12983124

You're so scarred you're probably locked into your fucked up existence? Right? It's like watching an aut

>>12983124

Here's a recipe for you gibble brained assholes

1 Cast Iron Ceramic pot, small
2 Cups ground beef
3/4 Cup Onion fine dice
1/2 Cup Celery fine dice
1/2 Cup Carrot fine dice
1/2 tbsp oregano
1/2 tbsp basil
1 tsp rosemary
2 tbsp butter
1 tsp red wine vinegar
1 tsp red pepper flakes
1 tsp fresh ground 4 pepper blend
2 Cans Whole Tomato
1 Can Campbell's tomato soup.
1 Can Mushroom slices

Over medium high heat brown ground beef in cast iron pot and reserve. Add butter and onion, working the fond off the pan into the onion.
Brown onion then add carrot and celery and mix. Sweat mixture unti soft. Blitz one can of tomato to sauce consistency and add to pot, bring to a
boil and reduce heat accordingly, cleaning bottom of the pot with spatula. Cut second can of tomato into bit sized pieces and add. add spices and vinegar.
stir and bring to a strong simmer and cook for about 45 minutes. Simmer until a thick sauce consistency with a sweet flavour developing in the tomato.
Add soup, mushroom and ground beef and stir until thoroughly mixed. Spatula darkening sauce from the sides of pot and mix in.
Cook for another 30 minutes.

It's a simple sunday gravy done fast. I know you'll have to untangled the language but it's fast spaghetti sauce for you simple minded assholes.

>>12983915
>>12983919
>>12983927
Samefag

>>12983932

You're a rocket scientist.

>>12983124

Where'd you go, gumby? This guy doesn't know a fucking thing about bows or violins, but he makes great drums https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0xhza8b_iM

Look up Hill bows though, their frogs are amazing.

>>12983936
>>12983950
Calm down retard.

>>12983124

You don't know what a frog is, do you?

>>12983124

See that? That's a sterling silver frog. With mother of pearl inlay.

>>12983955

What's retarded? Dipshit?

>>12983982
You, and your mass posting.

>>12983955

Have you dealt with these dirt people before? They're garbage humans that lurk on this board with no skills or intelligence. They're filth.

>>12983990

Jesus, Can the site handle it?! I have to shut down my mass posting.

>>12983993
Yes, and you're actually one of the retards that ruin this board.

>>12983997

OMG, fagchan as been destroyed. what a shame.

I've got burgers from dairy queen and half a big mac. I have to go sulk after destroying 4chan /cf/ pr sp,etjomg sorry I got off home row.

>>12983996
The site can handle it, but should anons have to? It would be completely different if you weren't a serial retard, and had actual informative, or entertaining posts.
Anyhoo I'm abandoning this thread, so don't bother responding to this post.

There's a good movie about 303 squadron on Netflix. Most of you childish assholes wouldn't watch it because you're fucking kids. It's about the battle of britain and the polish fighters who protected the country so you stupid kids could remain english.

>>12984013

You're a generic dumb cunt, who cares?

>>12984013

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZV5tgZlTEkQ

I love you fucking idiots.

>>12983915
>>12983919
>>12983927
>>12983936
>>12983950
>>12983959
>>12983976
>>12983982
>>12983993
>>12983996
>>12984003
>>12984020
>>12984029
How sad.

>>12984033

Your post is meaningful and we'll get back to you in time. You don't feel like a weird upset fuck up right?

>>12984033

You've typed a lot of things. are you ok?

>>12984037
>>12984042
You're being ignored.

>>12984051

Ina good way, by you fucking human garbage. I want you scum to scurry under your chairs. You're human garbage

>>12984055
You aren't too happy about being ignored are you.

>>12984059

I'm so unhappy.

>>12984061
Most trannies suffer from depression.

>>12984059

Sorry I'm trying to type something to you gibbles. I'm very unhappy.

>>12984066
You only need one post to share your gay feelings.

Use wine cork to strop after sharpening knife to get rid of the residual burr.

Or, you could buy a proper leather stropping block and coat it with proper stropping compound.

>>12984063

God I wish I loved dick. You're too stupid for this board.

>>12984070
You can love dick without wanting to be of a different gender than your biological sex. i.e. cis gay men, cis lesbian women, cis bisexuals

>>12984070
>God I wish I loved dick
Not "loving" dick doesn't exactly stop you from sucking dick though.

>>12980892
I think tradition steps in the way a bit too much when it comes to sharpening, single strokes repeated, constantly washing off the lather because they think the stone 'clogs', and being against completely dry stones (which works fine, it's just not great for the stone)
the real problem is, the stones we use with these techniques are not the stones these techniques were designed for.
natural whetstones are very different than compressed blocks, little less diamond stones.

I would recommend using a dish soap and circles, the lather that forms is thicker than water, acting more like an abrasive paste than just making a mess.
for non-cooking knives, spit is, relatively traditional, pocket knives and carving knives, it also gives good results but it wouldn't be worth doing on a large stone as you'd become very dry, but the similar consistency to dish soap is notable.
there are some downsides to this technique, like you might not be even on both sides, which isn't a real issue, since you can much more easily form that edge on whichever angle you prefer.

If you find that you dislike this technique, well you can always just set your stone aside and buy a pull sharpener
pull sharpeners are sort of shit, but they're a lot better than not sharpening your knives, and they're very cheap.
I would far rather someone uses a sharpener that does a rough uneven job than someone having chips in their blade.

steeling is something you can't avoid learning, and you should, it's just as important if not more important than sharpening your knife.
I'd recommend both a coarse, and a smooth steel.
but for steeling there is also something similar to a pull sharpener called a 'mouse trap'

hope this helps but I hope you don't give up on sharpening

>>12984069
cardboard and layers of paper also work to some extent but nothing replaces leather

>>12984092
What's your background?

>>12984095
He read a few websites before posting.

>>12980892
You can buy an angle guide for sharpening if you can't eyeball it, and sharpening a single side (single bevel) is easier than doing both. Personally I don't see the point of sharpening both sides on cooking knives for myself.

>>12984095
i've got a fair mix of stuff under my belt but just the relevant stuff
well I was traditionally french trained, spent 3 years cutting meat, mostly pork, also worked in a fish restaurant which also did chicken
the circles works alright with mineral oil too, couldn't use soap on communal stones, those things got fucked over enough by coworkers putting water on the oil stones and oil on the water stones.
wood working I sharpened chisels fairly often but found a wheel of mfc impregnated with jewellers rough worked better than pricier wheels
was a bit aggressive for well loved carving knifes so I used a small stone for those

>>12984110
I spent a lot of time online trying to get good at sharpening before I realized how dumb some techniques really are, they work well but not if they're done improperly, which just about every average person teaching the techniques are.

>>12981048
In what way are your results lacking?

>>12984145
In your opinion, why do other people often do things incorrectly?

>>12982998
Not all are. They vary from completely smooth ceramic (glass) to slightly textured ceramic to smooth steel to textured steel to diamond coated rods. There are yet more variations, but that covers the most common ones with significant use differences.

>>12984145
>I spent a lot of time online trying to get good at sharpening before I realized how dumb some techniques really are
How many techniques are out there?
I only know of one.

>>12984156
teaching techniques is basically a game of telephone, whether it's that people are poor learners or poor teachers, information is easily lost
especially when people stop experimenting, or something changes about the material being used.

people far too often teach 'how' without understanding 'why'

even if the person is a prodigy, if they can't communicate on why it works, the big picture is being missed

>>12984165
far more than I know, tonnes of it's been lost over time I'm sure, some possibly for the better, like some people will use metal files on knives and that's just too coarse for anything sharper than a cleaver
there is a tonne of information available on the main techniques, but understanding how an edge behaves is more important

what I think helped me the most was looking into axe sharpening, because it got me curious about the whole sharpness vs durability debate, and with the type of work I was doing, you needed both
..which lead into more research about metal types and edge hardening techniques and stranger stuff like if it's possible to soften a blade temporarily and reharden it after sharpening, which turned out to be possible but just too much effort, probably something they did for swords though.
maybe one day I'll manufacture a tool sharpening rig that will be good enough get chinese knock off versions.

>>12981938
>This really messed with me
Not just you. I'd wager that this is responsible for 90% of people attempting to sharpen their knives themselves and failing and then giving it up for good.

>>12984400
That is a simple matter of reiterating the fact that most of the time, a first time sharpening on a knife is essentially a regrind for most people who are just good enough to keep a relatively consistent stroke. A sharpening stroke doesn't need to be perfect, but the more consistent it is, the less work it will be to get a decent edge. This is because angles matter, and freehanding trypically means there will be slight angle differences throughout the stroke, even if each stroke was magically perfect. Say you start the stroke at 20 degrees, it will likely sink or lift a few degrees as you get to mid stroke, and tend to correct at the finish for most people, even experienced and practiced sharpeners. Being able to adjust your angle to fit an edge that already exists is more difficult than simply maintaining a consistent stroke, so most people end up having to grind away a bunch of bevel before they can get close enough to the edge to make it notably finer. If you have ever had to grind out a large chip, you will know how much work that little bit of grinding down can be, but most people don't consider it. That is why there are 200 grit stones. A 1k is great for maintaining, but it takes quite a while if you're looking to put a different bevel angle on something.

>>12981321
This. Take the steel and put it as close to a 45 degree angle off the board as you can. Move your head around the steel to check it-- perspectives are fucky. Now you just need to alternate between vertical and horizontal strokes. Pressure should be moderate, but ease up if you feel the steel catching. If your steel's all fucked up, pick the least damaged path to sharpen on or just get a new steel.
Generally, less is more.

>>12983124
>>12983117
a friend of yours?

>>12980895
Can confirm. I had a cheap one from amazon that at first gave a really good edge that could pass any sharpness test, but after a year or less the knife was consumed past the edge and too thick to sharpen properly. But it was a $10 knife and $5 sharpener so not much was lost.

I looked at a knife sharpening video and they were telling me to pull the knife in the opposite direction from what I saw in shaving razor sharpening videos. It makes no sense so now I never sharpen anything.

>>12984502
Korin's video on sharpening is considered to be the consensus way to sharpen kitchen knives on water whetstones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z9DPlIZct_0

>>12984513
Consensus by who? Weebs don't count.

>>12984234

why would you think that softening and hardening a martensite mineral would do anything than fracture the mineral in question?

>>12984513

This is right, and when you start again, make sure you place water on the stone and watch the water come over the edge so you choose the angle with the water.

>>12981673
Highest. Come on, man.
You do the coarse sharpening first and then make the edge finer with a finer stone. Sometimes people finish on a strop which is a piece of leather. That would obviously do nothing if you started with it and then moved on to a coarse stone, right?

>>12981297
I think some people use layers of tape etc. to get a consistent angle. You'll want to learn to do without it sooner or later anyway, though.

>>12984559
Anons on /ck/ going by the past threads on knife sharpening. I guess that doesn't count since 4chin is full of weebs.

>>12984740
That's very true but I'm not trusting myself to hold an angle with as much precision as what sticking something to the side of the blade would do. Doing it manually does look great but functionality is what I'm after.

>>12984234

Code, can you relate a sunday gravy? I want your recipe.

>>12984744

If it rounds, you'll see it when you look at it in the light. God these threads suck.

Don't you guys have anything?

Is this were you ceberitic children fuck off in general? You turn to ice bergs?

>>12984750
See it's not about being afraid to have a rounded edge. We just have different expectations when it comes to a sharp knife. If I spend time on it, I want it to be significantly better, not "just okay".
Now unless you want to help somebody that's not as good as you at sharpening, please do feel free to fuck off anon.

>>12984760

You're a generic dumb cunt right? Keep going, these asshole will round their blades and no on will care that you're a stupid asshole that told them to do it. no on will care.

>>12984720
question everything!
but the ductility of most metals keeps them shattering, my bigger concern was warping.
it's still entirely viable to do for chisels and the like though, much easier to re-temper the tip of a tool than a full blade, my attempt did a number on the handle

>>12984745
I don't really keep recipes, and growing up we had meatless sauce for pasta, crushed tomatoes or just butter
the italians of /ck/ dislikes my sauces because they're absurdly simple, but the results are similar or better with less effort and cheaper ingredients.
>cook down some tomatoes
>shun olive oil in favour of animal fats which last far longer before going rancid
>use pre-ground spices instead of cranking my wrist for that fine grind
>putting in completely non-traditional ingredients like cocoa, sugars, and turkish coffee
>putting in ingredients via putting in foods that could be considered a package of other required ingredients, ie: that cheap iced tea I use for citric acid and sugar
you know why they call it sunday sauce right?
cause it takes them all sunday to make it despite most of those 'grandmas secret recipe' using premade tomato sauce
how horribly inefficient those italians

>>12984760

just so glad to be done with you morons. it's a relief.

>>12984787

yeah man, I already know that. THanks though. Ox tails, pork, sunday fucking gravy. God you're young.

>>12984787

Cook your goddamn tomato until it turns into sugar. How the fuck do you tell that to assholes.?

>>12984787
pic rel has me questioning your authority on things.

>>12984812

He's a generic dumb cunt. what do you need to know? Food looks ok.

>>12984812

In general, don't listen to hobo cook. Make your own decisions vs. poverty idiot. Savvy?

>>12981673
higher grit is the finer, lower grit is coarse.
coarse first to rough out the shape and remove any chips or dings, you don't need to do coarse every time, but it's important to do when you need to do it.
then fine, which you should do every few times you use your knife, but it's okay if you don't and end up putting it off, as long as you keep steeling it properly
then any stropping/polishing desired, if you lack a strop or anything for polishing, a light steeling will do to remove that gritty-cut feeling

>>12981297
when I was first learning, and well sometimes even now on certain knives I suppose, I would use the tip of my finger as a spacer with the blade along its length
it's not the most precise way of doing it but it's a good estimate
Make sure you know the angle of your edge, some knives come sharpened at 20, some at 15, some at 21.5, just kinda all over the place, and thats just assuming it's a simple v grind, which most are

>>12984804
lmao just add sugar works for ragu

Hahahahahahahaha How The Fuck Is Sunday Sauce Real Hahahaha Mario Just Walk Away From The Crock Like Luigi Close Your Oven Haha

>>12984812
no where near the worst thing i've posted visually, it does have some pink to it but my camera is fucked, probably because i've repeatedly goobered it with grease and eggs so many times
I should have used the bigger piece I had though, but I couldn't do both the butter and tallow for comparison if I did that, I only have so much tummy space
I wouldn't consider myself an authority on much aside from industrial processes

>>12984836
I honestly wouldn't want people blindly listening to me in any situation, I'd rather it just gets people thinking
could you imagine if someone blamed me for ruining an important dinner they made because they never tried it before hand and then never made adjustments for the guests in mind?
not everyones gonna like sweet meats

>>12983976
Is that your own work or your dad's? I thought generally bow makers don't cross over into violins, and vice versa.

>>12980892
Lansky sharpener with the blade clamp.
I thought it was a meme until I tried one. Holy shit was I wrong. Knives come out sharper in less than half the time and there’s no guesswork involved.
Easily worth the money.

Is a single 1000 grit stone enough for just basic stuff cutting meat/vetgetables?
Any recommendations?

>>12981673
Lowest grit is coarsest. That’s where you start.
You do low grit to fix any nicks in your blade edge and to get a basic sharp edge quickly.
Once the edge is sharp and cuts straight, you go up to the higher grits to smooth out that edge so stuff doesn’t drag on the blade. That’s where you start to get insanely sharp blades.

>>12984901

Repair bows, make violins. In general. Pernambuco is hard to come by but we can do that doo.

>>12985036
Use a coarse blade like a 300 for basic shit and to get a sharp edge quickly.

>>12985042
I mean I'm sure you can, but is that a thing in practice? Specialization is usually a thing in most professions. Like, a T&E lawyer is going to suck at criminal defense, although they CAN do it.

>>12984901

The rosin you use on the horse hair is what you use to fuse the horsehair in the tip and the frog after you wrap it. You melt the rosin with an alcohol flame.

>>12985051

Well, if you're looking to win competitions, you generally focus. My Dad is a master cello maker. But the skill from working at Heinl's definitely covers making bows. At least Hill quality.

http://www.violincello.com/violin.html

its only worth stone technique for wood chisels. knives are best done on an old treadle grinder. sharpen towards the blade, finish with a steel or the back of another knife. for filleting knives, strop a few times dry, and twice wet. alternatively finish on the palm of a working hand.
too perfect edge like a straight razor will blunt fast. you need staves from a rough grind. for older iron knives, never grind. gently hammer the very edge to draw it sharp while work hardening it

>>12985343
>treadle grinder

Jesus, what about a simple band sander? Like most knife makers use?

>>12984435
>>12981321
>>12981354
It’s odd because you guys made it sound kinda hard to use on of those, but I remember at my first job as a prep cook I used these all the fucking time and I was really good at it.

Good to know I’m naturally good at sharpening knives, I guess.

>>12984786
Work on your reading comprehension anon.

>>12986106
It's not hard at all, I'm merely telling Anon to start with the hone parked so he can get a feel for what the angle is supposed to be.
You're not special.

>>12984092
>cardboard and layers of paper also work to some extent but nothing replaces leather
Balsa + a compound or two isn't bad and happens to be super cheap. I use iron oxide and chromium oxide mixed with a bit of neetsfoot oil on all my strops.