/ck/ - Food & Cooking

>>11919968
Because I’m hungry

/thread

>>11919968
I don't buy factory farmed meat if that's what you're asking. I don't buy industrial produce either, for the same reason: it's a shit product that's shit for the enviornment.

I do buy meat from small local farms though. I also raise some myself. I'm not sure why you conflate all meat with factory-farmed horror.

>>11919968
kys

>>11919970
>/threading yourself

farm animals in the west generally live adequate lives in optimal conditions and then are calmly led to slaughter without an understanding or care of what's going on

>>11919968
plantBased amd redpilled
>>11919970
>>11919976
>>11919977
>>11919983
wrong and gaypilled

>>11919983
>in optimal conditions
Optimal for "cheap" maybe. Certainly not optimal for taste or health. Far from it, in fact. Industrial meat and produce fucking sucks.

>>11919968
I am gay btw if that matters.

Animals don't suffer and I don't care if they do now kys faggot

>>11919983
Completely false. 99% of all chickens in the US are raised in factory farms. 95% for pigs, and 78% for cattle. Nearly 60 billion land animals are killed each year to satiate the western diet. Keep in mind these animals also require massive amounts of grains and water for upkeep. The conditions they are born, and live in are extremely poor.
Free range and hunted meat does exist but its a very small minority of all meat gathered.

>>11920015
what about the animals who die so you can shitpost online? Or did you think that electricity generation and mining materials for computer chips and rechargeable batteries somehow aren't giant enviornmental disasters?

Why is it wrong to kill a cow for food but apparently it's not wrong to use your phone toy to shitpost online despite both causing harm? Is food not more important than shitposting?

>>11920000
>>11920015
yes most factory farmed animals are gross tasting and obese but that doesn't mean the animals are suffering in extremely poor conditions
farmers and packers generally care for the health and wellbeing of their animals simply because healthy, calm animals are worth more money than sick, dead and stressed ones

>>11920020
>nirvana fallacy
Crop fields do indeed disrupt the habitats of wild animals, and wild animals are also killed when harvesting plants. However, this point makes the case for a plant-based diet and not against it, since many more plants are required to produce a measure of animal flesh for food (often as high as 12:1) than are required to produce an equal measure of plants for food (which is obviously 1:1). Because of this, a plant-based diet causes less suffering and death than one that includes animals.
It is pertinent to note that the idea of perfect veganism is a non-vegan one. Such demands for perfection are imposed by critics of veganism, often as a precursor to lambasting vegans for not measuring up to an externally-imposed standard. That said, the actual and applied ethics of veganism are focused on causing the least possible harm to the fewest number of others. It is also noteworthy that the accidental deaths caused by growing and harvesting plants for food are ethically distinct from the intentional deaths caused by breeding and slaughtering animals for food. This is not to say that vegans are not responsible for the deaths they cause, but rather to point out that these deaths do not violate the vegan ethics stated above.

>>11920027
You didn't answer my question sweetie.

>>11920022
If they're gross tasting isn't that reason enough not to buy them?

>>11920015
>Pulling numbers straight out of your prolapsed ass

>>11920027
>equal measure of plants for food (which is obviously 1:1).

That's not true in the slightest. A pound of meat is far more nutrious than a pound of any veggie that you can name. Furthermore, animals can convert plants which humans cannot eat into a source that we can eat. And in addition, many animals can be fed the byproducts of crops raised for humans. For example, my family has a farm. We grow turnips and beets. The roots feed humans, and the green tops get fed to our cows. The cows eat "free" since they're just eating the byproduct of the human crop. Meanwhile the cow poop gets composted and fertilizes the fields. IT's a closed loop. If we got rid of the cows then we'd have to buy chemical fertilizers instead, which is a lot more harmful.

>>11920022
False again.
Raising animals indoors, or with limited access to the outdoors, lowers costs and provides animals with protection from weather and predators. They are invariably tightly packed, and raising them so close together risks the development and quick spread of disease. As a result farmers make extensive use of prophylactic antibiotics. Also tighly packing these animals together leads to stress and antisocial behaviors like tail-biting in pigs or pecking in chickens, and restricts species-typical behaviors, such as rooting (pigs) or dust-bathing (chickens). There are farms where these animals are atleast somewhat cared for, but its a very small minority.

>>11920020
How are they giant environmental disasters?

>>11920042
The chemicals used to make rechargeable batteries are incredibly toxic, as is the process used to make them. It generates a great deal of highly poisonous waste. The same is true of the strip mining used to get the minerals used to make computer chips. Google it.

As for power generation: if you're lucky to live somewhere with a lot of geothermal then your'e OK. otherwise it's very bad. Most plants burn oil or coal which has obvious problems with smog. Nuclear has obvious problems too. Windmills massacre birds by the thousands. Hydro doesn't generate pollution, but the dams cause widespread flooding and habitat destruction.

>>11920032
Pretty loose definition of nutritious. There are a lot of micronutrients, phenolic compounds, antioxidants, and other phytonutrients abundant in plants especially greens

>>11920060
>>calories, micro- and macro- nutrients are a loose definition

Nope.jpg You want to talk about a real superfood? Liver.

>>11920054
It generates waste but thats not inherently the issue. It’s the possible spillover contamination from improper treatment and disposal

The strip mining is more of a human rights issue than anything

>>11920074
You’re using a loose definition of nutritious like I just said. Try reading. Do you need help?

>>11920078
What's wrong with muh strip mining other than it's a scary word you repeat?

>>11920114
It's just a Jewish buzzword like racism and global warming that shows the person is a brainwashed tard

>>11920114
In shithole countries they don't generally remediate the landscape, so it takes ages before some natural habitat returns.

>>11920114
>>11920124
Open up a book and read you dumb niggers

>>11920114
In this case it usually involves slave labor. I’m sure you can figure out what that entails.

>>11920147
That's an argument against shithole countries not strip mining
>>11920166
Not an argument
>>11920184
>muh Slave labor
Ooh more meaningless scare words

>>11919968
So I'm supposed to steal meat? I don't have the time or space to grown my own. This is a stupid question. How else am I supposed to get meat?

>>11920027
So it costs 12 vegetals to feed a cow but only 1 vegetal for human????

>>11919968
i legit do not care about animals that way. i like my cat and would not eat it, but some cows far away i couldn't care less

>>11920396
So you're okay with benefiting from the process as long as you're removed enough away from the act taking place?
Would you say its okay to eat at "Chef In Shackles", where the chef is wrongfully kept in captivity?

>>11919968
It provieds cheap but low quality meat for mases, also life has no value.
But once we get to produce lab meat on mass scale will you be happy?

>>11920487
>life has no value.
I disagree. I am quite grateful for my own life and the life that I share it with. As a living creature myself I cant help but value it. I also believe some life is worth more than others.
>produce lab meat on mass scale
Of course. I personally love meat but will not eat it because it directly contradicts with my love of life. Killing another animal when I don't need to would cause me great cognitive dissonance.

>>11920472
chef human? then no

animals aren't human bro, humans are where i try draw the line

>>11920718
so you're fine with the mistreatment of animals?

>>11920217
Trophic levels

>>11920718
Might as well eat your dog with that non existent ethical framework famalam

>>11919968
Yeah, let me support child abuse by buying vegetables from a poor farm that gets paid poorly and has to employ kids that have to work to support their family, let's keep buying clothes made by kids that have the same fate, but don't mess with the meat industry, poor animals can't talk and can't defend themselves. The world we live in is full of shit, nothing you ever do will change it, so stop crying like a little bitch and let others live. Fucking veganism is so individualistic, won't change shit if you eat meat or not, the production wont stop and everything will remain the same

>>11920993
Animals are not mistreated

>>11921028
There's nothing wrong with eating dogs

>>11919968
Fuck you sanctimonious faggots. I'm going to wear my leather and down, and enjoy the chili I made last night that should be finishing up soon.

>>11921080
They are born into tighly packed conditions, debeaked and tails docked, mothers deprived of their young, pumped with antibiotics and hormones, their bones cant support the flesh they put on, and theyre constantly stressed to the point of developing abnormal behavior, and then theyre slaughtered young because the flesh tastes better that way.
>animals are not mistreated
Why would you even post that when conditions in farms have been documented for years? Its not even a topic of contention because its common and public knowledge that factory farming conditions are abhorrent. The fuck

>>11919968
>Why do you support the meat industry by buying meat?
>The production of this meat involves billions of animals suffering in extremely poor conditions
Answered your own question.

>>11921032
As opposed to what? Buying meat from a factory farm which buys crops from a poor farm to feed its animals? Im not even vegan or vegetarian im just advocating for more ethical treatment of animals. Its entirely a business and if people stopped giving them business they'll downsize and thus things do not stay the same. Im sorry you have such a nihilistic view on life my dude.

>>11921196
There's no way to make killing an animal more ethical, also people won't stop consuming, the downsize of the meat industry just by lowering the consume is an utopia, won't happen. You can call it nihilism, but for me is just how life works

plants are treated even worse than animals.

>>11921028
Nothing wrong technically, but it would be a huge cultural taboo to do so and would isolate you as an antisocial freak

>>11921258
>informed consumers eat less meat
>demand for meat is reduced
>industry reacts
its not a utopia, its capitalism 101

>>11920531
Ok if you value "life" then think about it this way majority of those animals whould not exist if they weren't born just to be killed.
Those animals aren't even treated as animals but as a resource to be harvested.
>Killing another animal when I don't need to would cause me great cognitive dissonance
As someone who grew with contact of farm animals, fed the chickens, pigs etc.
I would be reluctant to kill them without real reason. I belive you should kill your own food.
But boy do i love taste of roasted meat.

>>11921080
If you think that is the case please work for a month as a butcher, that might change your opinion.

>>11921373
Creating life is a net neutral act. The context is what is important. Nurturing life just to strike it down to benefit from its physical form is unethical.

>>11921441
>Nurturing life just to strike it down to benefit from its physical form is unethical.
For me how is as importent as why.
I don't see anything wrong with killing animals either wild or captive as long as they did get to live and mass farming doesn't cut it for me.
Race for profits warps every industry just to get as much $ as posible no matter what.
Small scale farms with dozen chickens, few pigs and cows could not sustain demand but it was the best way IMO with relative autonomy.

>>11921441
>Nurturing life just to strike it down to benefit from its physical form is unethical.
Debatable by itself, but ill agree on the assumption that this life grows in a poor unnatural environment.

>>11921441
So growing soy is unethical

>>11919968

>If you value life at all

Nice assumption you've got there. It'd be a real shame if something were to happen to it...

>>11921541
I agree. However its far less egregious than killing sentient creatures. Something has to die to keep us alive, however in the year 2018 it doesn't have to be animals.

>>11921580
What is your alternative?
Veganism?

>>11921651
Plants ofcourse. There are many animal and insect products that are also harvestable without completely killing them outright. Im not even against animal farming and livestock if its ethically produced. I am 100% against factory farming though as the conditions and animal suffering are off the charts.

>>11921704
I guess you will have to wait for that. I can see insect farming becoming next big thing but if our civilization survives another 200 years without fucking everything up i'll be in awe.

Because meat is delicious. To argue there is some sort of moral obligation to reduce suffering is asinine. Life is infinite and as such, so is suffering.

>>11919968
animals aren't people

>>11921787
pretty grim outlook gamer
thankfully most people have a sense of empathy and thus wish to limit this pain for themselves and others

>another vegan thread

>>11921798

People are merely animals. Morality is a false dichotomy which you've been programed to believe in by kin selection and reciprocal altruism.

>>11921832
>people are merely animals
yikes

>>11921801
Selective empathy, which all forms of empathy are, is far from noble. It's more just to be absolute.

>>11921844

>can't read

You're a creationist, aren't you?

>>11921869
>quote what you say directly
>apparently can't read
cringe
>smug anime reaction pic
double cringe

>>11921885

>doesn't even try to deny being a creationist

How old is the Earth, Anon?

>>11921904
4.5 billion years, idk how that's relevant though

>>11919968
I keep buying and eating animals to lower the supply so we can all go vegan. You all need to do your part

>>11921945
No one needs to

>>11919968

The only reason i buy meat is to support ranchers. Ranchers are salt of the earth people and they deserve a nice comfy living

>>11919968
Reason: tasty flesh. Where is this lack of reason you speak of?

>>11919968
>The production of this meat involves billions of animals suffering in extremely poor conditions
hahahaha fucking retards

>>11919968
>If you value life at all
*If you value all life equally
I value my wife, my family, my friends, and my dog. I would kill you if it profited me and I knew I could get away with it, and I eat animals because they taste good.

>>11922861

Based and redpilled, albeit apparently dumb enough to marry 3dpd.

>>11919968
Because a 24 hour slow cooked pork shoulder is delicious. Stop making animals to tasty and maybe I'll stop

Why do I support the meat industry? Because meat is delicious and it makes you mad. Fucking LMAO this post makes me want to have a big juicy steak. Lmao fuck you op I'm going to go buy meat to grill to spite you.

>>11919970
YOU CAN'T /THREAD YOURSELF FAGGOT

>>11919968
there is no actual proof that life is valuable or has meaning.

>>11923282
>tfw no steak to eat right now.

atleast ive got some pepperoni pizza thats atleast 30% animal product

>>11919968
Life is both valueless and useless. I'll eat whatever meat I want I don't care.

You can also weigh the value of a life by the intelligence the animal had. Cows are fucking stupid. Chickens are fucking stupid. Not a single animal we use as livestock is intelligent.
As little as life means, their lives mean even less.

>>11919968
Because faggots like you will never shut up. I'm eating meat out of spite until you SHUT UP!!!!

>>11919968
>if you value life at all

Let me just stop you right there.

>>11920027
thanks, I was looking for this for my blog, but I didn't want to search for it, I wanted it to appear organically - I really appreciate it.

>>11919968
>vegan hypocrite
>Hands dripping with the blood of wild animals

Turns out vegan food production involves way more animal death than simple beef raised on grass.

Do vegans care about the blood on their hands??? HAHAHAHAAA fuck no.

http://theconversation.com/ordering-the-vegetarian-meal-theres-more-animal-blood-on-your-hands-4659

I mostly eat fish but every July me and the lads head to a local ranch to challenge some cows to a 2-on-2 game, Loser gets eaten. We haven't lost yet.

>>11926070
Cows raised on actual grass ranges are ideal. Im glad the majority of the beef in Australia is grass fed. Unfortunately they still factory farm chickens, pigs and other animals like the rest of the West. Id also like to state that over half of the world's maize, wheat, barley and soya goes to feeding livestock in factory farms. Combines and pesticides kill critters regardless of whether the crops are feeding animals or humans, but feeding humans meat requires more resources and makes for more dead critters than simply growing and feeding ourselves crops. Also there is a very clear distinction between interntionally killing animals (livestock) and unintentionally doing so (critter caught in a combine) See: Aquinas' Doctine of Double Effect
Im not vegan, im just advocating for less cruel methods of meat production.
Nice article but its weak also fuck Australia

I believe in reincarnation. Those animals had it coming. Karma is a bitch.

>>11919968
I'm more valuable than everyone and everything else. Animals and others should die for my pleasure.

>>11926646

>>11919968
you REALLY need to do more research vegan. vegetables get more pain than any animal but all vegans are know it all opinionated arseholes...

>>11926607
>Combines and pesticides kill critters regardless of whether the crops are feeding animals or humans,

(Does not really pertain to grass fed beef)

>but feeding humans meat requires more resources and makes for more dead critters than simply growing and feeding ourselves crops.

(Entirely not true, unless you are talking worst case scenario factory farming)

>Also there is a very clear distinction between intentionally killing animals (livestock) and unintentionally doing so

Dumping chemical pesticides on living creatures, with the express intent of genociding them, little rich to call that "unintentional"

http://theconversation.com/ordering-the-vegetarian-meal-theres-more-animal-blood-on-your-hands-4659

>>11926673
Even if this were true you're still causing more suffering by first feeding it to an animal before eating the animal itself rather than just eating the crops.

>>11926658
Explain to me how this is not a rational view to hold.

>>11926680
Again, im glad Australia has a majory of grass fed beef and is a big exporter of it but unfortunately there is an incentive for factory farms to operate worldwide and thus grass fed beef will eventually be fazed out in favor of more efficient methods (high density factory farming) unless government regulations happen or informed consumers do business elsewhere. We have small scale pasture fed beef here in the US as well but its been slowly losing market share in favor of lower ticket-price factory farmed beef.
Also keep in mind that beef is the least factory farmed animal worldwide (78% of all beef is factory farmed, in comparison to roughly 90+ percent for chickens, pigs and turkeys.
Im not entirely sure what your argument is. The fact that grass fed beef (less than 4% of all beef production ) exists does not justify factory farming or the supporting factory farmed meat.

>>11919968
Because it pisses punk ass facists like you who for some insane resan, they think that everybody should listen to them...and I gotta tell you that with the exception of maybe your Mom, nobody gives a shit about what you think, say, or do...
>and I'm having a steak tonight in your honor, you skinny weasel shitbag...

>>11926680
grass fed beef is not a valid alternative. it requires massive swathes of deforested land to raise only a handful of cows which grow slower and have a lower slaughter yield due to their diet. its honestly the worst option because it practically wastes resources rather than takes advantage of them.

>>11926743
Carneyfag is trying to argue that grass fed beef is the least harmful despite; cows being killed, pastures getting foraged, pesticides being used, predators being killed for cattle protection, soil and grass being denatured and uprooted, land being cleared to displace habitats to modify and protect pastures, massive amounts of pollution and waste, grass fed cows still being fed grain, grass fed still having a shitty carrying capacity, and any evidence to the contrary really

>>11926743
>The fact that grass fed beef (less than 4% of all beef production ) exists does not justify factory farming or the supporting factory farmed meat.
Agreed.
But, it does mean that we don't have to go vegan.

>>11926806
Many beef cattle are raised on land which is otherwise worthless. Example: pretty much all of Texas. You don't have to deforest to raise cows.

Are cows like that more costly to raise? Yes. That's fine, I am happy to pay more for better quality and reduced harm.

>>11926806
Its so laughably horrifically inefficient. Grain fed isn’t just cheaper because of subsidies. It’s far less laborous and intensive, but I guess those farmers just aren’t cool enough

>>11926820
>But, it does mean that we don't have to go vegan.
Yeah that’s what he said from the get go, retard. You were too busy sperging out

>you dont have to deforest to raise cows
You do if you want to feed people on this utopic diet. Rocky land isn’t worthless either

>Are cows like that more costly to raise? Yes. That's fine
Not what he was arguing you numbskull lol

>>11926823
How much farming experience do you have? It sure sounds like virgins talking about sex in here. As expected from most clueless vegans.

Labor required for grazing cattle: zero. We just let them roam around the pasture.

Labor required for grain fed cattle: a lot. We have to pick up feed in trucks, drive it over to the feedlot, and fill feeders. That also creates pollution from the vehicles involved.

>>11926837
Laborous as in ineffecient.

>that also creates pollution
And grass fed cows emit more methane than grain fed.
Your mother being a cow does not make you an expert in agriculture

>>11926851
>Laborous as in ineffecient.
just say inefficient if that's what you mean.

>And grass fed cows emit more methane than grain fed.
That's nothing required to the pollution generated planting grain, harvesting grain, threshing grain, shipping grain, etc. Nor the poisons involved in keeping rodents out of silos and processing facilities, the fertilizer runoff from the grain fields, the pesticides used on said fields, etc.

You haven't answered my question about how much agricultural experience you have.

Sure is virgins discussing sex in here.

>>11926890
>That's nothing required to the pollution generated planting grain, harvesting grain, threshing grain, shipping grain,
Sure buddy

>nor the poisons
Pesticides exist everywhere in agriculture
https://agrilife.org/extensionento/resources/management-guides/managing-insect-pests-of-texas-forage-crops/hay-and-pasture-insects/
https://ag.tennessee.edu/EPP/Redbook/Pasture%20Insect%20Control%20Recommendations.pdf?Mobile=1
http://agpest.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/A-review-of-insecticide-use-on-pastures-and-forage-crops-in-New-Zealand.pdf

Not to mention the millions killed and displaced to protect these pastures
https://www.aphis.usda.gov/wildlife_damage/pdr/PDR-G_Report.php?fy=2017&fld=KILLED_EUTH&fld_val=0

>You haven't answered my question about how much agricultural experience you have.
Why should I? You already have the prejudice that I have none despite ironically clearly having almost no knowledge yourself

>Sure is virgins discussing sex in here.
You seem unusually acquainted with that idea

>>11926837
Its just more efficient to speedrun cows to maturity using hormones, antibiotics and high calorie diets than wait years for them to reach the same slaughter weight on a grass fed diet. Keep in mind indoor farms protect animals from weather and predators and concentrate resources making the entire operation streamlined.
Brazil is the second largest exporter of beef and the Amazon is steadily being deforested so said beef can feed on the fast growing grass underneath. This is considered a low yield activity and those same pastures eventually get replaced with soybean cultivation as it earns more $ per hectare than cattle.

Veganism is objectively the most humane agriculture
https://fewd.univie.ac.at/fileadmin/user_upload/inst_ethik_wiss_dialog/Matheny__G._2003_Defense_of_Veg__in_J._Agric_Ethics.pdf

Steven Davis can’t read or do math. And people have to cherrypick from his poorly constructed piece by using arbitrary flawed metrics like 25x more protein

>>11926930
Salmon really needs to get its shit together. What about white fish?

>>11926930
>>sure buddy
Why is your "pollution" graph limited to greenhouse emissions only?

>>Pesticides exist everywhere in agriculture
Nope. Not on my back 40 they don't. (or the front 32 either). Some places use huge amounts of pesticides. Other places use zero. It all depends on what you are raising and where. The only pesticide I use is a spot treatment for poison oak.

>>You already have the prejudice that I have none
It's not predjudice, anon. I have experience. I can tell you do not, because you speak like someone who has been propagandized, not someone with firsthand knowledge.

>>11926943
>Its just more efficient to speedrun cows to maturity using hormones, antibiotics and high calorie diets than wait years for them to reach the same slaughter weight on a grass fed diet.
I don't deny that. Factory farming does result in a cheaper end product. My point is that's not the only option though. And if you're talking specifically about labor in the true sense of the world, that's lower with grass feeding. The only reason why factory farming is more economical is because you can cram more cattle onto your land that way, not because the process itself is less labor intensive (it's actually the opposite).

>>Keep in mind indoor farms protect animals from weather and predators and concentrate resources making the entire operation streamlined.
You think your're educating me, but you actually have it backwards. Most ranchers around here just keep a donkey with their cows. The donkey is a guard animal and will defend the field from predators. A donkey is much cheaper than any other means of excluding predators, like fences or buildings.

I still feel really hungry after only eating vegetables. Meat fills me up.

>>11926966
>Why is your "pollution" graph limited to greenhouse emissions only?
Probably because we were talking about greenhouse emissions like methane? Are you a goldfish?

>Nope
Sorry. Facts don’t care about your feelings or lies. Pesticides exist everywhere. You don’t have magic shielding from pests and weeds. You might not consider organic herbicide a chemical, conehead, but I can assure you that it is
https://youtu.be/SsGJtWxrkZM

>It's not predjudice, anon.
Oh you dont know what that word means okay

>I can tell you do not
Lol stupid fucking loser

>I have experience
Evidently not very much if any. You’re not actually arguing any points I’m making and display a very limited spectrum of knowledge

>my propaganda is better!!!
Cool. Enjoy another night of crying yourself to sleep at 4AM

The main issue is having meat on demand. Frank the Boomer is too used to being able to pick up a steak on a moments notice from the supermarket, because he can’t plan for the future, like all boomers. If instead, you had to place an order to receive meat from a local rancher for whenever the next anima will be slaughtered, we could satisfy that meat urge with far less wastage, and far fewer animals in general, which would lead to better conditions for every animal in general.

>>11919968
sage the bot you faggots

>>11926977
Labor (the ability to do work) can also be called energy. You can measure and compare systems by analyzing the energy invested vs energy gained. Energy invested into grain fed beef returns more energy($$) than grass fed, and thus I can claim that it is less labor intensive. Pollution is another story as capitalism doesn't give a fuck about the environment.
Also attacking experience instead of arguments is an ad hominem, and personal experience is anecdotal. Nobody cares that you raise a few cows on your own land. Your methods are not scalable nor efficient enough to feed hundreds of millions.

>>11927000
>Probably because we were talking about greenhouse emissions like methane?
Perhaps you were, I stated pollution in general.

>You don’t have magic shielding from pests and weeds.
I don't need magic shielding. Cows eat weeds too. Pests aren't a problem because I'm not planting crops. The grass and natural plants just grow on their own. You don't need to fertilize or spray unless you keep too many cows on the land.

>>Evidently not very much if any.
says the guy who belives that "Everybody sprays"

>>Cool. Enjoy another night of crying yourself to sleep at 4AM
Why would I cry myself to sleep because you, a virgin, keep talking about sex you've never had?

>>11926977
>I dont deny that
Then you have no argument. Everything else you’ve argued isn’t a point he’s made

>The donkey is a guard animal and will defend the field from predators
The donkey is not a guard. It’s simply territorial. Donkeys are not immunity idols and are absolutely far more expensive than properly done fencing. But sure, throw another mouth to feed and pollutant into the mix to justify your delusions

>>11927019
>Perhaps you were
You literally replied to a point about emissions. And then proceeded to list things about grain that pertained strictly to transportation. Desperate. Adding in other pollution really doesn’t do you favors either as waste runoff and pesticides from pastures only ups the ante, not sure why you blazenly dismiss emissions. Probably another retarded climate denier.

>Cows eat weeds
And weeds eat up your grass and soil at a much faster rate. That’s pretty basic agricultural stuff, Cotton Eye Joe.

>Pests aren't a problem because I'm not planting crops.
Pests also disrupt grass and soil. You’re obviously at the actual experience disadvantage here, champ.

>says the guy who belives that "Everybody sprays"
Says the guy who says it doesn’t exist in Texas, that pests only disrupt crops, that transportation emissions from grain are far more polluting, would you like me to continue?

>Why would I cry myself to sleep
Because you’re incredibly pathetic and do this autistic shitshow 20 hours a day. Also evidently a virgin if it wasn’t obvious enough
You should take a B12 supplement. You seem pretty foggy in the head. Probably genetic tho

>>11919968
I buy meat because I can't afford to hunt all year round. And if you think of yourself as a vegan who's not an annoying fanatic, you're wrong.

>>11927251
>i support the industrial process of harvesting meat even though it causes unnecessary suffering for billions of animals because 'i cant hunt year round'
no sir it just doesn't add up

>>11927324
eating one deer slays one deer
buying a cow's worth of meat creates demand for one more cow
Shooting a deer is not shooting a billion deer
Buying a package of ground beef does not cause billions of cows to suffer

>>11927336
Without the support of the individuals benefiting from it the system would not exist.

>>11919968
I only buy free range organic meat and poultry products. I don't support battery farming in any fashion.

It's not only more inhumane than I am comfortable with, but it has led to the population at large accepting a product with vastly lower quality just because it's cheap.

I don't cook with garbage ingredients.

>>11921801
Something tells me you don't give a shit about mosquitoes, or any animal that isn't cute or didn't have a Michael Moore documentary made about it.

Because I can't recall the last time a vegetarian meal satisfied me
And I'm broke as shit anyway so I could afford the good options
And I just learned how to cook a good stir-fry
Give me a break

>>11919968
i dont care personally i have 0 problems cutting the throat of a pig for meat

>>11927355
People will keep eating it unless you regulate each person's meat intake or come with a good alternative.

It is not my fault that the only way to get meat at a reasonable price is produced unethically. Fix the problem instead of telling me to go without, because that isn't my job.

>>11923656
Yes I can, friend.

>>11928230
No.