/ck/ - Food & Cooking

300 dorra

>>10262400
right:worn down and blunt within a month
left: japanese folded steel that will retain its form for 100,000 cuts

>>10262421
100 birrion dorra

>>10262434
right: costs $250, made of steel containing 0.7% sulfur, and is falling apart after 2 days because you washed it a few times
left: costs $150, made of steel containing 0.0004% sulfur, and will last a lifetime

>>10262448

well that's absolute horseshit. carbon steel is a miserable hassle to care for with regards to wetness, acid and chipping. it can hold a narrower bevel but its not all shits and giggles.

stainless, you can be lazier with and if you know how to sharpen a blade its in some cases easier to own.

its just different. left is hard mode with benefits

>>10262460
I don't understand your argument, anon-kun. they are both carbon steel. are you a human or is this one of the newfangled bots that sometimes makes mistakes?

>>10262465

for the love of christ. I assume one is a japanese high carbon knife and the other is stainless, no? yes they both have carbon in them.

why are you fucking around? just letme know if you're a childish assjole and o'll move on.

>>10262473
I think I have a guess. the left one is a kuro-uchi finish which can be achieved on both stainless and carbon steel. but you noticed it has a darker color and so you made some erroneous assumptions.

there is no need to feel embarrassed over this, anon-kun. not everyone cares about cutlery.

>>10262434
And yet an itamae will sharpen his knife on a whetstone before the start of every service. Why do they do this?

>>10262434
But thats not true, japanese steel is terrible; the reason their shit is 'folded x times' is to drive out impurities in an attempt to make it better. It will never be as strong as imported or european/american metals.

>>10262448
Uhh the knife on the left might be 150 but the one on the right sure as fuck isn't 250. Try maybe 20 bucks. Sheet metal stamped trash.

>>10262727
Japanese capacitors are really good, though. Folded over one thousand times. Can cut through anything.

>>10262742
http://bernal-cutlery.shoplightspeed.com/windmuehlenmesser-k-chef-9-carbon-plum-handle.html

>>10262774
Soft metals can be finely sharpened but their edge retention is terrible.
>>10262786
>The K Chef knife, or gyuto, is one based on a classic Japanese double-beveled design.
So wait this is a thread about a japanese knife vs a german companies take on a japanese knife then?

Also holy shit. I'd like to know the hours of usage between the two in the OP picture.

You'd be better off getting normally prices dexter-russels or hickorys or wusthofs before wasting your money on this trash.

>>10262786
We use victorinox at my work and guarantee you they will hold up better that that over priced shit.

>>10262727
That 1000 fold shit is from medieval times. With modern metallurgical science the end product is going to be the same regardless of the irons source

>>10262834
Then you must also disagree with the post it was in response to >>10262434 because all modern steel should be homogeneous.

>>10262813
google image search to find the thread
it’s basically a brand new knife
the construction is essentially western, the only thing “japanese” about it is the thin blade, which is not a japanese concept (it’s a french concept)

the fact is western knives have fallen so far that they slap on “japanese” on their marketing materials instead of raising their standards

this is what destroyed detroit

>>10262926
Made in china.

>>10262434
...and yet the food they touch will taste no different.

>>10262400
>forged steel vs sharpened sheet metal

is it even a question which would last longer lmao

>>10264510
>muh forged
t. knows nothing about knives

>>10262400
i mean they all just chop shit man

at first i was like...

>>10264748
...but then i was like

>>10264748
>>10264753

>>10264794

>>10264797
>>10264794

>>10264800
>>10264797
idk man them hands pretty white, just putting japanese in the title doesn't make them japanese

>>10264855

>>10264855
>>10264862

>>10264800
that's a sponge cake you asian monkey

>>10264855
Japs are whiter than Amerimutts

>>10262400
>tfw I still have my grandmother's Old Hickory brand butcher's knife.

One it gets a black patina it will last several life times, literally.

>>10265134
I have my great grandfather's.

I don't get the hype. They hold an edge worse than a 15 dollar knife from the asian market. Even after you resharpen it, it won't hold an edge. Just because somethings old doesn't mean it's good.

>>10265174
Seems like someone used it to stir hot coals or used a belt sander on it to sharpen it.

>>10265418
Nah. He was smarter than that.

Maybe he just got a bad batch. His wife wasn't always the sharpest tack in the box however, I could see her using it to help lift a pan off the stove with the fire on or something.

>>10264748
>>10264753
>>10264797
>>10264800
>>10264862
>>10264865

why would you ever stop posting these

>>10265174
I have one I stole from a house I rented in college 25 years ago

I can confirm it's dogshit

>>10265418

You know that belt sanders are colder than 1850rpm bench grinders, right? Do you involve yourself in anything regarding sharpening knives?

>>10265701
I make knives. I know precisely what a belt sander and bench grinder both can do to knives if used improperly. Do you throw away your knives and buy new ones when they are dull?

>>10265881

Yes, in fact I do. Have a look. Takes me an hour a year to sharpen these blades that cost 2 bucks per.

>>10265881

making knives only matter if you're a wood worker. Food knives are just throw away garbage.

>>10265881

it's not dull, its a tempering problem, didn't you know that?

All of you people just sound like you don't know a thing about metallurgy. Are all of you just playing a game?

>>10265891
> chefs choice with extra trivox
Good taste

>>10265897
Sure thing, kid.

>>10265914
Reading comprehension much: >>10265418

>>10265134
>it will last several life times, literally.
any piece of metal protected from rust will last several life times.

>>10265891
>pull-through sharpener
cringed

>>10265891
>>10265881
Hello knife expert anons. My chef's knife has some small chips in it that I would like to repair. The same goes for a chinese cleaver my mom has been using for a couple years. Do you all suggest a whetstone and if so what grit? Or are electric grinders just the way to go?

>>10265040
glad im european :(

>knife elitism
>buying a mirrion dorrar knife when you can cut shit fine with a knife that came in a $5 cutlery set

The cook fedora.

>>10262434
Literally the opposite of the truth. Cheap knives are made with steel too hard to sharpen because people with cheap knives never sharpen them.

Good knives need a hone every few days of abuse but they can be honed easily.

>>10266173
>steel too hard to sharpen
>plugs in dremel
Sorry kid, nothin personnel.

>not making your own knife

>>10266244
lol it's not even that expensive, and it's a good skill to learn

>>10266259
plus you get exactly what you want, right hardness, right steel, right handle shape, right blade size
No need to search or complain

>they don't sharpen bones from the animal after slaughter and use them as knives

A $15 electric knife sharpener is all you need for the kitchen on cheap knives that will do everything you need in the kitchen. Why do you autists think that you need something crazy expensive to cook? It isn't valyrian steel, reddit faggots.

>>10266259
>makes a (beautiful) chefs knife
>doesn't know how to hold a chefs knife and incorporates his incompetence into the design

>>10266303
This anon gets it. A good knife is great, but a mediocre knife gets the job done perfectly fine. No point in spending $200 on a knife and then an knife sharpening kit if $20 and a cheap pull-through sharpener works fine most of the time.

>>10266005
Recently re-edged a couple old knives with a 400/1000 waterstone. Had to tip one of them, just sort of sacrificed the very end of the 400 side. Took an hour or two each. Could've been faster with lower grits but it's mostly not needed and I'd still have had to buy high grits to finish. Same with a grindstone; faster but more expensive. All down to a value proposition, really.

>>10266334
I think the guy who made it wanted to demonstrate it could be made with less than 200$ worth of tools, the design is iffy, but the craftsmanship if pretty good

>>10266346
Going even further, I don't think "most of the time" even applies here. I challenge anyone here to explain to me what cuisine you need a $200 knife for. Meat isn't difficult to work with cheap knives, wtf is the reason for really expensive knives unless you are a professional chef? And as a professional chef, I would be wanting a knife that keeps an edge for a long time, not some shit that you have upkeep on. Just have tools for your trade that lasts for awhile like every other trade out there.

>>10266202
Yeh. First time writing I made a point of saying hone instead of sharpen, but it got lost in rewording.

You could throw a cheapo on the grindstone every couple months and it'd be sharp as you like. Hell, a very real solution is to buy a new kiwi when the old one gets dull, but ultimately this argument is ended by realizing there are plenty of other factors to why nice knives are expensive, like balance, handle design and blade geometry, without even considering aesthetics, dick-waving, and collection as a hobby itself.

>>10262439
Tpbp

>>10262477
You enjoy cocks in the mouth

>>10266378
Mincing shallots and slicing garlic come to mind. Beef Tartare just got added to my station so I have to hand mince ribeyes now. Would be pretty annoying without a good blade. Also have to cut slices of a tart made of rolled carrot slices without disturbing them.

Japanese hand-cut noodles require a specific, sort of bearded axe looking cleaver to make full board contact. Honesukes apparently make for really efficient poultry processing.

So yeah, there are reasons. Not necessarily compelling or applicable reasons, but they exist. And as far as edge retention, many of the tasks mentioned require the knives to be as sharp as possible at the moment of the task so you'd be sharpening your knife either way. May as well make it easy to sharpen.

>>10264753

Oh, I get it. It's folded a million times.

>>10266473
Shallots and garlic are doable with a duller knife, just can't go as fast. Mincing meat by hand is practically impossible without a sharp knife, but a meat grinder isn't too expensive. The only one that's really applicable there is cutting the tart. Sure, if you're working in a restaurant, the knife will probably matter more often, but you're also probably not using your own at that point.

Good knives are a godsend, I won't deny. They're just expensive as fuck, and I'd rather deal with having to stab my tomato to get through the skin than toss out a couple hundred bucks and a lot of time in care.

>>10262400
>knife on the right
>you didn't even try to strop to de-burr and make the edge stand up straight

Fuck this shit.

>>10266980
it’s a speck of dust
get your eyes checked

>>10266005
>some small chips in it that I would like to repair
Unless those chips have a noticeable effect on the cutting ability of knife I wouldnt do anything about them. Even if they are just the depth of the bevel grinding them out will take years out of the lifespan of your knife, just for aesthetic reasons. Look at the chips as a good excuse to sharpen your knife more often. The chips will vanish all by themselves over time, just from regular sharpening.

>>10266126
Obviously you have never cut shit with a truly good knife. The difference is huge. Notice I said "good" not expensive. Plenty of expensive knives just dont cut very well to be honest.

>>10266173
>Cheap knives are made with steel too hard to sharpen
Bullshit. Cheap knives are soft as butter, with an HRC between 50 and 52. If you take cheap steel aand harden it too the point that it gets "too hard to sharpen" it will be as brittle as spun sugar. That is the main difference between cheap and expensive steels, the latter can be hardened to 60 HRC and sometimes way over without becoming too brittle even for hard use.

>>10268061
> grinding them out will take years out of the lifespan of your knife
I will never understand the insane hysteria about grinding an edge

people will spend $200 extra for 0.05% better edge holding and then treat the knife like a priceless museum artifact thus defeating the purpose of a good knife

own your tools, don’t be owned by them

>>10264748

>beat well
>uses a fork