/ck/ - Food & Cooking

looks like a potato from one of those clone vats in Alien Resurrection

flour oil water salt sugar yeast time and heat

>>10001616
how do you make it look pretty?

>>10001611
I order bakers to prepare it for me.

>>10001618
With my hands. Also score cuts into the top. Sprinkle a SMALL amount of extra flour on to give it that look like it does in pictures but it's not necessary at all.

If I'm making sandwich bread with a rectangle baking pan

>>10001611

Actual baker here. For at home baking, there are a couple things that help a lot.

1) using a preferment. We don't all have space for a sourdough mother, but a simple poolish can elevate your bread significantly.

2) temperature. Use the formula "(desired dough temp x 4) - preferment temp - flour temp - air temp - 10" to get the temperature of water you need. Desired dough temp is usually between 76 and 82 degress depending on what type of bread you're making.

3) don't knead your bread. Opt for a couple of "stretches" over a very long bulk ferment. Let the dough ferment for about an hour, take it onto a floured surface, and stretch it, fold it over, rotate, and repeat. Do this process about 3 or 4 times over a 3 or 4 hour bulk fermentation.

>>10001639
>preferment
no one has time for that shit except housewives and unemployed bloggers that post pictures of bread on their site along with stories about how their grandma always used to make bread this way before the tragic dildo truck accident

>>10001653

A poolish takes literally 5 minutes to make.

>>10001653

Also, this is fucking bread. The single most common thing that ruins bread is impatience.

>>10001639
how does one preferment?

>>10001675

Look up formulas for bigas and poolishes. My bread bible is on loan to a friend so I don't have the numbers in front of me but it just involves making a portion of the dough the night before hand and letting it sit at room tempt over night. Poolishes contain a larger percentage of water than bigas, but they're both usually about half of the total mass of the final dough.

>>10001639

Also, forgot to mention, bake it in a dutch oven. 15 minutes with the lid on and then the rest with it off. It simulates the steam injection professional baking ovens have.

>>10001611
slice it please,

>>10001705
>dutch oven
how about a cast iron with a lid?

>>10001611
I use this recipe. Pretty easy but requires Dutch oven: http://www.lifeasastrawberry.com/easy-crusty-french-bread/

>>10001717
will do, but I'll give it a few minutes to cool.

>>10001718

Probably wouldn't be tall enough for a proper loaf.

Also, just buy this book. It doesn't have a large variety of breads in it but it will teach you the best ways to make some basic breads at home.

https://www.amazon.com/Flour-Water-Salt-Yeast-Fundamentals/dp/160774273X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1516242918&sr=8-1&keywords=flour+water+salt+yeast

>>10001717
sliced

>>10001827

That's actually not a terrible crumb. Could be a little bit more open but it doesn't look horrifyingly dense. From that angle it looks like with a little more fermentation and some more developed rounding skills it could have been a nice looking loaf of bread.

>>10001718
That's the best way. ignore the tripfag, use the lodge combo cooker or 5qt version, cook bread in the skillet with the bigger pan over it as the lid.

>>10001844
thanks!

what does one look for in a crumb? also how does one get comfy crusts with cuts like that?

Do perforated baguette pans do anything, are the worth the cost? I'm making calzones if that matters.

>>10001871

That actually sounds like it would work well. The big thing is you need to be cooking it inside something that can contain the steam for the first portion of the bake. Need dat oven spring.

>>10001879

>what does one look for in a crumb?

I like a moderately open crumb. If it has too many holes in it it's impossible to, say, spread butter on, or if you're making a sandwich, things fall through, but too dense of a crumb makes the process of actually eating the bread a chore. Pic related is the kind of crumb I tend to prefer.

> also how does one get comfy crusts with cuts like that?

The crust itself will be hard to replicate without a steam injected oven. Baking in a dutch oven or the setup >>10001871 mentioned will get you as close as you can short of that. As far as the cuts, just use a razor blade to score the dough right before you put it in the oven. Most cuts you're going to want to make in one smooth, quick motion, with the blade at a pretty shallow angle relative to the bread.

>>10001882

Never used 'em, but I've also never made baguettes at home. The oven at work has a solid deck but it's not completely smooth, so it might be worth a shot. Someone else might be able to answer a little better, though.

>>10001882

And honestly, for anything pizza related I just use a cast iron.

>>10001936
Why is that thought? Is it because it's a heat sink (has more mass), does a baking stone work the same way?

>>10002101

I'm not as well versed in pizza but my understanding is that having heat directly against the crust helps it crisp up and form into what you're expecting a pizza crust to be. I always preheat the cast iron in the oven so the dough starts crisping as soon as you put it on. Don't want the dough directly on the oven rack where it has the air around it to allow it expand and deform before the crust sets.

Headin in to work, now. I'll try to get some pictures of how production works for y'all.

Testing to make sure default settings on the phone don't take pictures with file sizes that are too big.

>>10001639
seconding this with the addition that you should bake in a dutch oven with the lid on for at least the first half of the bake time

>>10001827
your crumb is shockingly not that bad, OP.

>>10001611
I make mine in a dutch oven using the "stretch and fold" method and slow bulk fermentation. I also use sourdough starter now, for the most part, instead of commercial yeast. Every now and then I throw in some fun stuff like flax and caraway or walnuts and fig.

Almost too cold for her to start. Made it into the bakery without sliding out on any ice though.

>>10002295

Welcome to my domain.

>>10002307

These'll get me through the night. Gonna check the orders, run the numbers, and get some stuff set up before I'll have actual baking to post.

>>10002326
oh shit dude i have so many questions:

1) what kinds of flours do you use and in what ratios for different kinds of bread
2) do y'all mill your own or order?
3) sourdough or commercial yeast or hybrid?
4) aprox. how many loaves do you make per day?

>>10002336

We use King Arthur Sir Galahad. We only make one bread here. Can't say the exact ratios but it's a pretty dry dough.

It's a weird Frankenstein's monster of a bread. Uses poolish, biga, and commercial yeast.

We make between 250 to 600 loaves a day depending on orders.

>>10002336

Also, sorry. Still trying to figure out this image rotation shit.

>>10002352
a poolish AND a biga? what's the baker's percentage for these loaves?

Look at this beautiful boy. 4 decks that can hold 30 some loaves each and it stands at 8x8x16.

>>10002365
i just creamed my jeans. as a casual home baker who uses a dutch oven, that setup is my dream

>>10002365
you just dox yourself.

>>10002375
cozy what's your recipe?

>>10002359

Not gonna go too far into specifics.

>>10002380

How's that?

>>10002352
Poolish and biga are the same thing though.

>>10002388
for this 50% red fife, which i baked this summer when it was super hot, it was this:

Recipe for 2 loaves:
437g Red fife whole wheat flour
437g white bread flour
646g water
80g sourdough starter
23g salt


Mix water, starter and flour together, rest for 30 minutes autolyse. Sprinkle salt over dough and mix using the pinch and fold method until salt is incorporated. Rest another 30 minutes.
Stretch and fold every 30 minutes for 3 hours.
Divide, preshape, bench rest 10-15 minutes.
Shape and place in floured bannetons, cover and refrigerate 12-14 hours for cold proof.

Preheat oven with lidded dutch oven inside to 450F.
Remove dough from banneton, score, bake covered for 30 minutes. Uncover, bake additional 10-15 minutes.

these days i tend to do a longer super slow bulk ferment, but i keep the ratios about the same. the slow bulk is better in winter temps.

>>10002391
fair, fair

>>10002402
nah, they're two kinds of preferments but they're different ratios. personally, i prefer the crumb and crust texture of a poolish when i'm using commercial yeast

>>10002402

Poolish tends to be much wetter than biga. Poolish left, biga right.

>>10002409
c'mon baker, don't let me down -- lemme see your work station and mixer set up

>>10002409

Got my boards laid out. The dough will get divided, rounded, put on to these, and in turn, up on to the rack behind them. By the time the 104 loaves that constitute a batch are done being rounded and put up on the rack, the first ones will have rested enough to be shaped.

>>10001653
dude what
a preferment takes like 2 minutes to mix, the rest is just waiting.
that's like saying patching up a paint chip takes forever because you have to wait for the new paint to dry.

>>10002460
i'm assuming you divide the dough by weight? measure out 104 loaves takes a while so i get that that's plenty of rest during the preshape. i know you don't wanna get into detail, but can you give an general estimate of how long the bulk takes?

>>10002459

Hobart is used exclusively for mixing the start of the preferments. All the dough needs to go in the bigboi cause it's 200 lbs at a time.

>>10002495
THE LIL GUY'S NAME IS HOBART I LOVE HIM

>>10002480

Yeah, each loaf is measured out on a balance scale. Bulk ferment is only a little over an hour cause 100 lbs of dough ferments much quicker than, say, 2 lbs.

>>10002495
don't forget to SALT>>10002502
>>10002502
It's a brand you silly man.

>>10002503

Posts are gonna slow down as I get into the thick of it. I'll keep y'all updated though.

>>10002505

Did that once in my first week. Never again. Do you know who I am or did you just put things together from my non-trip posts?

I had a sourdough starter that I had been using for a few months but I forgot to refrigerate it when I went away for a few days for christmas. When I came back it would still get sour but it didn't make any bubbles. Even after feeding it for a few days it never revived so I just used it all up along with some yeast for a batch of something like sourdough bread. Ever since then I've been doing just normal yeast leavened bread but it just doesn't taste as good. I don't want to make another one because I'm afraid of losing it again.

>>10002553
i'm sorry anon and I know why you're scared. it can take some time to learn to love after a loss like that.

>>10001827
look good

>>10002509

Flour, water, salt, yeast, and poolish are in. Biga goes in as it's combining.

>>10002571

This part is kind of hard to explain. It's essentially a pre-biga. Some of the biga for the day is taken and mixed into what is essentially a biga concentrate. That is left to ferment all day and is then combined with more flour and grains and water to make what will ultimately be the bigas for the next day. It's somewhere between a traditional biga and having a sourdough mother.

>>10002625

And just like that, the first batch of dough is done mixing. 208 lbs of perfectly temped, perfectly developed dough.

>>10002625
a carry-over biga makes sense

>>10002640
this is pornographic pls delete

>>10002640

Okay, I got about 20 minutes of down time if y'all have any questions. After that the day is in full swing. I'll try to post some snapshots of what's happening as I go along but I might not be able to reply until I get home.

>>10002535
I'm interested in getting into amateur bread baking. Where do I start?

>>10002666

I learned a sort of "feel it out as you go along" method on the commune I lived at but got into the actual science behind it with the books "Flour Water Salt Yeast" and "52 Loaves." I can't recommend a better starting point than those two books.

>>10002692
seconding FWSY, it's how i got my start baking at home

>>10002700

That's a damn fine looking loaf of bread, friend.

>>10002692
Any bare essential equipment I should have? Any type of breads and flours good for beginners? Sounds dumb, but are normal convection ovens ok for artisanal bread?

>>10002707

Digital thermometer, scale, and a Dutch oven are all must have items. When I waa doing home baking I'm pretty sure I used all purpose King Arthur flour.

Regular convection ovens are fine. The Dutch oven is what allows you to sort of replicate the steam injection that professional ovens have.

>>10002705
thanks, that means a lot coming from a professional!

>>10002707
convection ovens are fine. you'll need a dutch oven with a lid that can go up to 500F, a kitchen scale, and a banneton/brotform basket or two. i like King Arthur flours to start with, but you can get fancy with other flours after you get the hang of it

>>10002721
>>10002700
Thanks for the replies. Assuming i should get a baking rack and not a tray so the bottom gets a nice crust too, huh?

Here's a shot of the front of my beautiful boy.

>>10002740
If you have the time, can you tell us how you got into baking?

>>10002738
the dutch oven will take care of that, but yeah, you should place your dutch oven on a baking rack. i like to place a cookie sheet upside down on the rack below the dutch oven to reflect some of the direct heat and prevent the bottom crush from getting too hard.

>>10002744
seconding this

OP here. Trying to make a sourdough starter. No idea what I'm doing, just measured out 1:1 all purpose flour and water. Gonna put it on my fridge overnight.

>>10002738

Having a rack so that all sides of the bread can be exposed to the air as it cools helps a lot. Your bread should "sing" when it comes out of the oven, which is to say, you should hear a pretty apparent crackling noise as the hot crust meets the cooler air.

>>10002754
1:1 by weight or volume? don't put it in the fridge, leave it out very loosely covered on the counter (assuming you don't have any pests)

>>10002744

I lived on a hippy commune for about three years and one of the jobs there was baking daily bread for the 100 or so people there. I thought it would be cool to get into and a wonderful woman named Winnie basically taught me the essentials of bread baking. After I left the commune I read through the books I mentioned earlier, did some at home baking, and eventually just brought in a couple of loaves as my resume to a bakery in the city I moved to. Been here ever since.

>>10002707
OP here again. You should listen to the pros but I figured my experience might help. I have very little equipment, just a mixing bowl, a cast iron without a lid and a convection oven. I'll probably try picking up FWSY and a sacle soon. Pic related is my recipe. As the title implies, don't kneed it too much.
>>10002757
By weight. Well, I don't have a scale so it's a guess. 3/4 cup flour 1/4 cup water. I'm storing it on top of my fridge, not on it.
>very closely covered
gotcha, thanks

>>10002784
*loosely covered

>>10002774
It's like a movie, you should sell your story.

>>10002784
I appreciate the input. I suspect the simplest bread making can produce some of the most authentic and best breads you can find.

Batch one after being transferred to tubs to bulk ferment for another hour before shaping. Bout to mix batch two.

Batch two is done. Gonna smoke a cig and then get all the dry ingredients for tomorrow's preferments mixed. I'll take pictures throughout the rest of the day and post em up when I get home, and I might have a couple moments where I can check back in.

Thanks for being interested in this, y'all. Makes me feel like I'm doing something of value.

One last protip before I go. If you listen to The Menzingers while baking your bread it is scientifically proven to come out perfect.

>>10001620
what a disgusting fucking slob, that girl

>>10002929
you take that back

Back with some shiz.

>>10003837

>>10003842

>>10003852

>>10003854

Aaaaaand some video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMZv5dV9k2M

>>10003875

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCzBjjkrE10

>>10002553
Actually the best advice for that happening again is to start a new starter and feed it the old starter 3-4 days in so the old yeasts and new combine. It all ends up over taken by fresh wild local yeasts whenever it's exposed to air anyway (so if you get Amish bread starter in Philly and bring it to LA eventually the LA yeast strains will be all the starter has given a month or so)

>>10002754
Make sure it's 1:1 by weight or it won't come out right.
And room temperature, not in an airtight container (it needs to breathe) but with a cloth or cheese cloth over it to discourage mold spores from getting in.

I made a pretty decent whole wheat honey bread the other day and want to move into Baugettes I only have a Dutch oven anyone have any advice on not having it come out terrible? I made a bit of bread back a decade ago so I know like the basics but I'm trying to up my baking game.

>>10001611
looks pretty good for a turd

>>10003875
>>10003882
etc.

very cool, you have some nice looking bread, and technique to boot.

>>10001611
>How does /ck/ make their bread?
with no yeast
>water
>flower
>mix to dough
>leave to rest for about 12-24h
>make dough as flat as possible
>bake
now you know my secrets

>>10003983

Baguettes are tricky. For one, unless you have a super weird dutch oven, your baguettes probably aren't going to fit inside it, so there's an issue.

Additionally, how hydrated baguette dough is always ends up posing some challenges. You'll need to keep your work surfaces and hands liberally floured. On top of that, the strength of the dough needs to be pretty much perfect or you won't get any oven spring and the crumb will be all fucked up.

Sorry that there weren't any actual tips in there. I don't really have any except for "try it until you get it right," because with baguettes, that's often just what it takes.

>>10004001

Thanks, anon.

>>10004015
t. Unga

>>10004138
granpa

>>10004138
>bread. good.
>yeast. bad

>>10003983

I don't know how magic you want your bread to be, but a home oven at 250 celsius and a cup of hot water to steam it up just before putting the bread in has made great crispy baguettes for me.

>>10004023
do you ever worry about baker's lung?

>>10004876

I figure I'm probably screwed either way. I smoke, inhale flour every day, and I ran a sawmill for two years where I'd inhale a nice variety of sawdusts.

It' also a distinct possibility that the CSI detective kit I hit when I was a kid contained massive quantities of asbestos in the fingerprint dusting kit.

>>10004456
>>10004017
Thanks I figured I can't fit the Baugettes in my Dutch which I kinda why I was asking how to not have it be awful. I can try the cup at the bottom of the oven. And I'll keep that all in mind it might take a few tries I'll probably post here once I get an attempt or two in and need more advice or to update.

>>10002326
>be baker
>buy shitty hotdog bun anyway
on a scale of 0 to 0, how low is your self-confidence?

>>10005702

>7/11 hotdogs
>not a perfect drunken midnight snack

It's okay to let yourself enjoy things, anon.