/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

>>9562721
>I live in Europe and here I've never spoken face-to-face with POC who felt attacked because of "blackface":

that's because you live in Europe. i don't get why people keep asking this question. America has a history of enslaving Africans and making fun of African Americans with blackface, so some Americans will inevitably be offended by it. It is a cultural thing. That's all there is to it.

>>9562721
Do it well enough, and you can stop listening to the people who are angry.

>>9562724
So is it okay for Americans to look down upon any european/asian/everything else when they use paint?
I'm not planning on doing any very dark poc because I do not wanna offend anyone and I also do not want to portrait a character poorly.
Is it just an american thing? If I'll do it at Connichi I should be fine?

Oh, fuck off. The last thread about this was only last week.

>>9562721

Okay, so I decided to cosplay a famous, iconic rapper. I cornrowed and dyed my hair, picked out appropriate attire, taped down my boobs but the biggest issue is that I am a pasty, pasty, white person. Like I have vitiligo white person. I used appropriate colored makeup and did a decent enough job that everyone knew who I was and no one knocked me for it.

I don´t see what the issue is. It´s a costume, we do it to have fun and to show our support for what we like. People like to get pissed over everything because of the attention it gets them. Fuck, we all are fucking humans not fucking show dogs. Knock this crap off.

>>9562724
Africans enslave Africans to this day, they even started it, Europeans came in and like, wtf is this horse shit, but then some dude got smart and was like, I can use this, and made dat money son, so one village takes over another and instead of all of them being slaughtered the DSutch buy them and sell em to dumb Brits and the Brits are like, yo, we totally have a use for these guys, and instead of dying, there are a bunch that go on ships to this place where shit's cash, but it still sucks cause everything's new, and instead of getting eaten by lions and scavengers, the kids of those people are working in fields, and this happens for a while and those white people kill a bunch of other white people, and the guys that have been fighting a while are like, bro, come help us and we'll herlp you get free, k? So like, the guys that fight and don't die become freedmen, but all the women get upset, and like, the women aren't going to start another war, but another war happens anyway, and after everyone's like, well that was unexpected, and it takes a while for everyone to get used to things, and there are still some people that believe everything their parents tell them, and people of all colors and creeds keep climbinmg over each other like crabs in a bucket, just hurting each other and not getting anywhere, so like, it's not just black people that are the problem, but they're in that bucket too, climbing over everyone else to get ahead, but all they need to do is help their fellow man, and their fellow man needs to find themselves in this cruel world.

>Be white
>Have literally thousands of possible cosplays across all genres and mediums
>"Waaahhh I wanna cosplay one of the few non-white characters in this series because reason!"

Literally why

>>9562854
Oh, I don't know anon
>They respect and love the character
>They identify with them
>They love the character design
>They feel comfortable enough to choose a charcter they are not exactly like even if it triggers people like you
lItERAlly WHy

just ignore blacks and sjws who get mad about it
they're usually horrible people anyway

>>9562879
Not that anon, but you don't have to paint your skin to be that character. Cosplay whoever you want, but you literally don't need to paint your skin to look like a different race.

>>9562884
>just ignore blacks

gr8 advice anon.

>>9562884
That's what we do in Australia.

Don't do it. It's not necessary. Not only does it look dirty and greasy when white people try to paint their skin darker, if your skin tone is such a problem to you, be creative and make a colorswap of that character that would actually fit your skin. Or cosplay them with your existing skin color. Or don't cosplay them at all, even if you love the character. Just because you're European doesn't mean you're immune to the logic that using something that comes with social/emotional/mental baggage - like race - as a costume is a bad idea. Whether it's your intention or not, you're trivializing the struggles that come with that skin tone (and often, white people are just very deliberately making a mockery of other races with shitty/stupid costumes like pic related).
Some of us are brown/black for life, and make cosplay decisions to work with our skin (because painting yourself white is more of a struggle), or just ignore it and cosplay whatever they want. It's not as complicated or terrible as you think to work within your element.

>>9562721
you are such a liar. there are groups all over the EU of "POC" that oppose race face used in the EU. OP is racist looking for validation and a good trolling. End of thread. Move on.

>>9563055
>America vs everyone else
They're just an arrogant European trying to get the moral highground on Americans. They do this shit all of the time. It doesn't matter what era, which arena of discussion, popular opinion, or even the truth. Europeans will always be looking for a way to feel superior to Americans or blame them for their inadequacies

>>9563039
Agree with everything except the trivializing the struggles bit

>>9562785
Jesus Christ why did you write that and how is it relevant to the question at hand

>>9562889
That's not what they were saying though, they were implying that white/light-skinned cosplayers aren't allowed to cosplay dark-skinned characters because those belong to dark-skinned cosplayers or whatever.

>>9563039
>colorswap to white
So... whitewashing? That's even worse. Prepare to get accused of POC erasure and all sorts of shit.

>>9562890
>ignoring a potential threat

sauce on that grill?

>>9562730
whether or not it's okay, it's just a thing that will happen, I didn't like it so I moved somewhere far away to where people don't care, or you can stay put and live with it.

there was the news story a bit back about a korean who did mexican cosplay of an overwatch chacter, mexicans didn't give a fuck but a lot of americans cried about it, because mexicans are mostly a single race they do a lot of stuff that other people find weird, but they tend to not really be bothered by stuff like this as a result.

Fuck them OP, I'm sure you'll catch some flak but blackface is a non issue.

Shitty people cling to victimhood because it's the only thing interesting about thier identity. Racism is such a small issue in modern America that social justice warriors work themselves up to being offended by the most trivial things.

They can't admit that true racism is incredibly rare because they can't let go of thier precious victimhood status.
Sure, blackface has been used to mock black people in the past and it perpetuated a harmful stereotype. That's shitty, and people that did that were shitty.

But it was the intent not the act itself that people had an issue with. It's always the intent that matters. If someone does blackface to portray a character, and not to mock a race, then the act loses the intent to harm.

If your feelings are still hurt by the act, or if you are offended on behalf of black people... That sucks, but sorry, your feelings don't outweigh someone's rights to expression. You can't assign intent to harm just because you are hurt.

>>9562721
>my disappointment when I think this is a Tekken thread

>>9562854
Why do I like a character that doesn't look like me??? Oh my god, I must have already cosplayed every white character and now I feel bored and want to trigger somebody, there cannot be ANY other reason!!!
Or maybe I really love him, and he inspires me, and I want to be like him. And there's people who's gonna get offended even if I don't paint myself, so in the end I probably won't cosplay him at all.

From a black person (first gen. American). If you want to cosplay as black character, go ahead. To be honest as long as you are not doing it with an ill intent and it is done well, I think it is fine. People who are black and otherwise cosplay as characters with different skin-tones all of the time and this is no different . That is unless it is done with ill intent or making fun of that grouping. Another thing you don't need my approval or anyone else. In reality you can still do it ,even though there are are many who will disagree. The questions are simple when you wear this costume :
Do you approve of it ?
Do I mean to make fun of this grouping ?
I am prepared if someone says something not so nice?

If you decide to cosplay as the character, Have fun! ( even if you don't, what ever you decide good luck.)

>>9563291
Thanks, I needed to hear something like this :) I think I'm gonna do it someday.

Just cosplay the dark character. I don't whiten my skin when cosplaying fair skinned characters

>>9562724
So does Europe, and it's still going on but let's pretend Europe is less bad.

>>9564800
Europe is not "less bad", but here racism is more based on how you look.
Are you poc and well dressed? Only idiots would attack you. Do you also have a lot of money? They'll definitely won't look upon you, because you look like a reliable man.
What if the same man looks shabby? People will totally treat you in a bad way.
Skin color (in my own opinion) doesn't matter that much in Europe, people care more about your look as a whole.

I'd like to petition to ban all future blackface/racebait threads from cgl.

>>9564982
That's not racism then. People treat the homeless-looking white person the same way they treat homeless-looking POC, so they are equal.
The racism in Europe is mainly based on the fact that we don't have such diverse sociaties. Some people living in smaller cities see a black person only few times in their entire lives. Of course they're going to stare, they are not looking down on them though, as many assume.

>>9565022
Seconded

>>9562721
b8 but w/e

I wouldn't. It might be different in Europe but you're just asking for trouble. Nothing wrong with portraying a fictional character that you simply aren't the same race as.

>>9565022
They used to pop up occasionally but this is like the second right off the heels of the last one, which is super suspish.

>>9563279
Then blackface. But, your actions have consequences. You're not immune to criticism or consequence because of some arbitrarily defined, self-righteous, narcissistic moral high ground. I'm not even going to take the time to tear your argument apart.

>>9563291
From one black person to another, it's fine to cosplay black characters. But, this is about using blackface in order to do it.

>>9562724
>and making fun of African Americans with blackface

More like: "we want a nigger to perform, but we don't pay niggers, period." and then some guy got rich.

>>9562721
Whenever something like this happens in Europe all I see are white europeans claiming that blackface was never a thing in europe (it was - google it) or even worse that "racism doesn't exist in Europe!!!". Being non-white myself and having non-white friends I can comfortable say the vast majority of us are much more comfortable with you not changing your skin colour for a cosplay.

Plus, 99% of you look dirty as hell if you do try the paint/foundation method. People literally thought that Leon's darkened makeup for his AC character was "dirt from a sandstorm". If your attempt at looking like a different race has you looking like you smeared mud on your face (which most do), put the makeup down.

>>9565526
Forgot to say I'm European.

>>9563191
obvious american trying to prove he's the best race in the world

>>9565457
No one is immune to criticism, everyone faces consequences for thier actions. Do you think this is a new concept that you just had to share with me?

Of course OP will face consquences if he does blackface. I literally said that in the first fucking sentence.

My point is that the consequences are unjustified if all he does is try to portray a character as close as possible.

I don't think race defines the value of a person anymore than hair color or eye color or height or weight. I don't think having darker skin is in anyway something that someone should be ashamed of. So stop being ashamed of it, and realize nobody is keeping your social group down.

Your down because you as an individual are too weak to get up.

>>9565575
Today I learned that cosplay accuracy is more important than racial sensitivity. I also learned that anon knows nothing at all about race from a sociological standpoint.

>>9562854
Why wouldn't you? Nobody's stopping black/asian people from cosplaying white characters either. People are making things way too complicated. Cosplay isn't like show business where a black character is whitewashed and given to a white actor, anyone can cosplay whatever the fuck they want without a big producer removing them from the convention.

>>9565620
What about that last paragraph from OP? "one even told me that if someone buys make up, wig, eye contacts, outfits, and then doesn't paint his skin THAT would be offensive"
So what, should we never cosplay a POC because someone may be offended anyway? I can live without cosplaying a POC, but this sounds wrong.

>>9565936
Just don't paint your skin. Wigs, outfits, contacts, etc. is all fine since it's part of the character. But, blackface is still racist and shouldn't be done.

>>9565575
Blackface being racist has nothing to do with anyone being ashamed of their skin colour. You're a special kind of stupid if you think racism doesn't exist anymore.

>>9563279
"Racism is such a small issue in modern America"

I wish you weren't alive.

>>9568577
This. You can cosplay without painting your skin. Nothing is lost. 9 times of 10 you look disgusting and dirty when you try it, anyway.
Why are people so entitled about these things? If you need blackface/brownface so badly, go right ahead, but don't cry and complain when you get backlash. When it comes down to it, you're doing something that will make people feel shitty, whether or not you personally think it should.

>>9562721
That character is not black and Leonchiro is not white. Italians are tanned and semitic.

>>9562721
This isn't even blackface. If he wanted to, he could easily be this coloration after a few hours/days in the sun. Cosplayers need to stop being overly PC/sensitive about this type of shit. Save the blackfacing lynch mobs for real situations of black face.

>>9569527
cosplay "blackface" has become an all-encompassing term for "darkening your skin". Most are switching over to the term "raceface" cause of stuff like OP happening not necessarily targeting black skin tone.

Fucking summerfags.

>>9562721
stop being faggots you should be able to do niggerface if you want

>>9568958
It really is though, I mean there ARE racists here. Im not denying that. There are racists in every country.

But it's an incredibly small percentage that it has no real effect on a person's chance at equal opportunity.

And certainly you are not implying that if a cosplayer paints his/her face to more closely resemble a character than they are oppressing a minority?

I swear this is mostly just an unfortunate downside of the bar being raised so high over the years.

I remember the days when there was at least one "ambiguously brown" character in almost every Japanese franchise. Like Ed from Bebop, Casca, Anthy, Aisha, Kaolla Su, several classic Yu-gi-oh characters, Kei from Dirty Pair. Most of the time brown skin was used as a way to indicate the character being foreign.

Yet, back in the day black or brown people in the community were rarer than unicorns. Still, no one seemed to even think of changing their skin colour for any character. Most of the Ed's on Google images are stark white. Those were also the days where hardly anyone batted an eyelash at things like cheap wigs, no wig, or poor fabric choices. These days standards for what's even considered mildly good cosplay are so high, people aim higher for spot-on accuracy to the degree that I've seen people try and dodge prescription laws and risk fucking up their eyes to get coloured contacts.

There's still very few characters overall who are black, and not just ambiguous. The blackface dispute first went big after that one Korra cosplayer. If people just stopped feeling like they absolutely need to paint themselves darker to be accurate for a character, this would hardly be a discussion. Even if people cry "whitewashing" over a dark-skinned character being cosplayed by a pale person, again there are very, very few truly black characters and calling "whitewashing" on a character with no defined race (Korra) or a character who isn't black (Arab, Desi, Native, Hispanic, Latino all have plenty of light skinned people- I'm Arab myself) is ridiculous and those people are better off not being listened to just because they think simply being able to speak on the internet gives merit to their opinions.

>>9562884
I'm 100% black but my family and I are light skinned and even I am too scared to do stuff like that. I cosplayed Orpheus from Persona 3 and I just wore a black mask instead. I wish there were like a giant underground cosplay world meeting where we could all just agree that any color face paint is a go for everyone. Then again we'd still have the normies to worry about... fuck. I thing humanity is just hasn't evolved enough as a whole to be ok with this subject.

>>9565022
Yes, please.

>>9565533
>American
>race

if they can pull off changing their skin, and make it look good, sure.
But they probably can't and then they end up looking like they smeared nutella on themselves

>>9569815
Ohhhhhh myyyyyy goooood I felt my IQ drop drastically just by reading this

>>9562721
The inherent issue with blackface is that it carries such a negative history with it, so if done poorly it just screams "look at me, I'm a non-black person making fun of black appearance traits". But as a non-black POC, there's the issue where for white people, being able to wear blackface and then go back to being white is what's so wrong. You can be black for a day and still maintain your white privileges. The skin colour is a costume to you.

If you want to cosplay a POC character, go for it. I couldn't give less of a shit what you cosplay. Just don't colour your skin. And to the anons saying "people will accuse you of whitewashing", that's a load of garbage. Literally nobody does that, they'd rather you cosplay respectfully than blackface.

>>9562721
I think a better solution is to make sure you have the right backing tones, maybe tan a little, and then use lighter colored fabric choices so that there's the same color difference between your skin and the costume as there is for the characters

otherwise it'll look like you've just been rolling around in chocolate bars and it'll really stand out if you fuck up where to stop darkening on your hands vs palms

>>9571127
I'm sure you'll be fine anon, I promise you your IQ was really low to begin with. So, you know, look at the bright side!

>>9571131
Oh. The white privilege argument AGAIN.
Name one privilege that white people enjoy simply because of skin color?

And.. are you saying that the problem is that cosplayers who blackface can go back to being white? Do you really think being black is such a tragedy? Like it's a such negative thing to be a black person? That's fucking racist anon.

I bet you're one of those people that believe voter i.d. laws are racist because "the poor african-american community cant figure out how to get an i.d." "they are uneducated and dont know how to use the internet or find the DMV"

Fuck outta here, black people have overcome some of the most terrible treatment ever in history and it's an insult to imply that they can't handle someone painting thier face to portray a black character with accuracy.

>>9571165
It isn't about intelligence. It is about opportunity and access. Not sure if that anon meant it like that, but that's honestly what it boils down to. You're right that tokenism and patronizing behavior IS racist, but the thing about white privilege is that as a white person, we don't even see or know it exists because we benefit from it. I am assuming you're white of course, but I could obviously be wrong.

>>9571165
>Name one privilege that white people enjoy simply because of skin color?
Studies show that "black sounding" names often have their applications and resumes discarded in comparison to more "white sounding" names.

>And.. are you saying that the problem is that cosplayers who blackface can go back to being white? Do you really think being black is such a tragedy? Like it's a such negative thing to be a black person? That's fucking racist anon.
Anon is saying that any issues that come with being black are disregarded once the costume is removed. In the cosplay community, many black cosplayers are mistreated. In the nerd community in general, being black comes with much stigma. So, it's kind of shitty that black people can't change their skin if people treat them like shit because of it. Here's an anecdotal example. I cosplayed Pikachu once. I just wore a Kigu my friend gave me. I was called "niggachu" the entire con by almost every white person who saw me and they thought it was hilarious. I can't take off my skin in order to stop this from happening.

>I bet you're one of those people that believe voter i.d. laws are racist because "the poor african-american community cant figure out how to get an i.d." "they are uneducated and dont know how to use the internet or find the DMV"
The problem with voter ID laws is that they're not consistent from state to state. This can lead to lower voter turnout. There's also several studies which state non-white Hispanics and Blacks are required to show voter ID more often than their white counterparts. Whether this is race related or a symptom of when they go is up in the air.

>Fuck outta here, black people have overcome some of the most terrible treatment ever in history and it's an insult to imply that they can't handle someone painting [their] face to portray a black character with accuracy.
It's still racist. What is so hard to understand about that? It creates a shitty environment.

>>9562854
Lol like niggers don't cosplay non-black characters

>>9562889
No. You shouldn't be doing that costume if you're white. It is technically white washing or appropriating a black character's culture/looks. The insiuation is that the characters blacknss is not an important part of the character and can be replaced by a white person.

>>9571532
I know this is just some racist idiot baiting but
>The insiuation is that the characters blacknss is not an important part of the character and can be replaced by a white person.
This is usually exactly the case when it comes to anime or most fantasy/sci-fi. It would still be the same character if their skin was a different color.
Culture pertaining to race is often not that important and blackness isn't really explored as a character trait most of the time. It just isn't.

>>9571165
Anon below destroyed you pretty well, but yes that's pretty much what I meant. I'll write my own response.

>Name one privilege that white people enjoy simply because of skin color?
Not being shot on sight despite committing murder? Compare Dylann Roof to Philando Castile. Dylann Roof murdered nine black people and the police arrested him and took him to Burger King. Philando Castile did nothing except tell the police he was reaching for his gun licence, and he was shot in front of his wife and child.

>Do you really think being black is such a tragedy?
Of course not. You're purposefully twisting my words. What I'm saying is that white people have privileges that black people do not, and that racism is still very well alive. Using blackface disregards these privileges and even laughs at black people because it's almost flaunting that their skin colour can be a costume solely for white people to put on for their entertainment and taken off whenever, no matter the intention of the cosplayer. White people can blackface and then take it off and resume a life where they're not discriminated against for their skin colour.

>I bet you're one of those people that believe voter i.d. laws are racist
You bet wrong. Can I have your $10?

>and it's an insult to imply that they can't handle someone painting thier face to portray a black character with accuracy.
You don't get to speak for them. Then again, so don't I (non-black POC here), but when you get so many POC (both black and non-black) telling white people to not blackface, brownface, yellowface etc then maybe there is a problem. Blackface also has such a negative history behind it, and trying to claim 'accuracy to a character' is just offensive. It's been weaponised by racists to mock and dehumanise black people and I don't think it can ever make a comeback without completely disregarding your respect for people of colour.

>>9571517
How many times do I have to say it? It's not racist for black people to cosplay white characters. It's not racist for white people to cosplay black characters. Just don't fucking blackface.

To add to my point though, there's so much more white rep than POC rep in media (and in anime's case, Asian rep than black rep). Are black people only supposed to cosplay black characters?

>>9571532
In my experience, a lot of black characters don't have their entire personas centred around the fact that they're black. They have their own detailed and complex personalities. Reducing them to just their race is kinda insulting.

>>9571536
>>9571545
Imagine a character you love. Someon spends a ridiculous amount of money to make a perfect costume/prop for the cahracter, but they cheap out and buy the wrng color wig/not where a wig.

You would insult that someone for not wearing the right color wig or at least wonder why they got lazy, right? Why? Because it's a detail about the character you love that they're screwing up.

Blackness is not the sole defining characteristic of most characters BUT IT IS A CHARACTERISTIC. To say otherwise or imply that I'm degrading them to just their color is a red hrring meant to distract from the fact your argument has no logical basis. Thanks for playing and stop cosplaying black people, okay.

>>9571552
See >>9569818. People cosplay characters of other skin colors all the time. It's only now that people have started going full autist, thinking they need to get everything right to the letter. No.
If the rest of the cosplay looks good, I (and most other sane people) won't sperg out. Skin tone and hair color are not comparable.
Honestly, I'd be more annoyed if that person painted their skin and looked like a shiny, greasy, mud-caked monstrosity in a bid to look like my favorite character (which is exactly the case 100% of the time, don't even try and pretend otherwise) than if they just worked with what they have and pulled it off despite not having their skin the exact same color.

>>9570527
Thank you for understanding wanting to cosplay a character is about love for the character and not hate.

>>9571552
I can still tell who a cosplayer is cosplaying if they don't blackface. If they wear the wrong wig? Yeah sure. I'd be like "what the heck". But you don't need to blackface to be cosplay accurate. Race is a characteristic, but I'd rather that characteristic be foregone than blackface. And saying people can't cosplay something because it's not their race is just plain stupid.

Cosplaying a black character as a white person doesn't detract from their persona. It doesn't stop the character from existing. It doesn't affect your love for the character. If a white person cosplaying your favourite black character puts you off, do you actually care for that character?

>>9571560
No one's debating that. Just don't fucking paint your skin.
Cosplay what you want. Ignore idiots who accuse you of "whitewashing".
The one thing everyone is asking you to avoid is brownface/blackface. That's literally it. This is not hard.

>>9571560
You don't need to be filled with hatred and have ill intentions to make bad choices though. You can love a character all you want, it doesn't stop blackface from being terrible.
I know in most cases cosplayers blackface without meaning to be offensive, but intent doesn't excuse the end result. Of course they don't deserve to be witch-hunted, but blackface cannot be excused either.

At the end of the day, here's the message: cosplay whatever you want. Don't raceface for the sake of accuracy. People will still recognise your character and appreciate the cosplay if you don't change your skin colour. It's literally that simple.

>>9571563
>If they wear the wrong wig? Yeah sure. I'd be like "what the heck"
>I can still tell who a cosplayer is cosplaying if they don't blackface

Literally contradicting yourself in your first sentences. You implicitly know blackface is wrong, yet you encourage white-washing in its place.

>>9571556
>People cosplay characters of other skin colors all the time
People used to wear black face all the time. People used to keep black salves all the time.
People used to do a lot of racist shit all the time, doesn't make it right and it never will be.

>>9571572
It's not "racist" to cosplay as a character that has dark skin, especially when they're one of those ambiguously brown characters whose personality has literally nothing to do with their race.
Blackface has roots in characterizing a race itself (instead of taking characters that just happen to be black, it's making a character of blackness) and making a mockery of it, which is why it's still ugly in cosplay.
I don't even know where to start with your comparison to slavery.
On some level, I know you're just one of the people who desperately wants to justify brownfacing/blackfacing trying to strawman, but I'm still doing this based on the risk that you're honestly this ignorant.

>>9571572
I meant "what the heck" as in I'm commenting on their questionable decision to have a different-coloured wig. That's a stylistic opinion, not a race opinion.
Boils down to this. Having a shit wig (i.e. inaccurate hair colour) doesn't have a racist history behind it. Changing your skin colour does. Understand that?
(Also a convenient red herring that you ignored the latter part of my post, but what do I know about arguments that have no logical bases? :^) )

>People used to wear black face all the time. People used to keep black salves all the time.
Yeah, and these are terrible things. Equating slavery and blackface to cosplaying a character respectfully is a bit of a reach though, don't you reckon

>>9571579
>>9571581
>It's not "racist" to cosplay as a character that has dark skin

YOU. DON'T. GET. TO. DEFINE. WHAT'S. RACIST. People are literally telling you that it offends them, that it dehumanizes them, and that is stands as an affront to human fucking dcency.

>changing hair color doesn't have a racist history.
Are you literally moronic or just willfully ignorant? From Nietzsche:
The Latin malus [Bad] (beside which I set melas [Greek: black, dark]) may designate the common man as the dark-colored, above all as the black-haired man ("hic niger est—" [From Horace's Satires]), as the pre-Aryan occupant of the soil of Italy who was distinguished most obviously from the blond, that is Aryan, conqueror race by his color; Gaelic, at any rate, offers us a precisely similar case—fin (for example in the name Fin-Gal), the distinguishing word for nobility, finally for the good, noble, pure, originally meant the blond-headed, in contradistinction to the dark, black-haired aboriginal inhabitants.

>>9571566
Can you imagine a world that one day moves past this to where it isn't terrible? Where no one has connotations of it being offensive. Guess we aren't close to it yet, maybe another 500 years, where no longer is a certain range of paint is not allowed because of the past. Where everyone doing what makes them happy is no an affront because your own skin color is some touchy feels button. Would you ever like to wake up in a world where you don't have to feel like your skin color is a issue at all, in the slightest, in any way shape or form? Because this line of thought is what perpetuates that for the rest of eternity. It being bad to be brown for a day implies there's something there to be upset over. Some century it has to be let go.

>>9571596
>YOU. DON'T. GET. TO. DEFINE. WHAT'S. RACIST.
I'm black. Straight out of Africa, in fact. I probably have more of a "right" to define it than you.
>quoting Nietzsche to pretend hair and skin color are similar
>holding any regard whatsoever for the "Aryan" meme
You're so obviously a white person RPing as black for points that it hurts. Just fucking quit. Go back to /pol/.
The one thing you should take away from this is: Cosplay whoever you want, just don't paint your skin.

>>9571602
The good news is, in 500 years white people will pretty much be gone and closed ethnicities will have largely died out. Hooray demographics!

>>9571609
>I'm black therefore I can tell other black people what's not racist.
pic related is you. Racism is an occurence on cultural and systemic levels. You're individual experience and beliefs do not override the the millions of others who disagree.

>>9571615
Let's see those "millions of others" who think cosplaying a character outside your own race without making a mockery of that race is racist.
Oh, wait. They don't exist. And if they do, there's maybe 3 of them total and they probably don't even cosplay so their opinions are worthless.

>>9571621
Have one of your white friends walk down a street in Englewood or Fuller Park in Chicago white washing a black character. Hell, MLK street in Atlanta. You'll find out real quick what people think of cultural appropriation.

>>9571624
Nothing will happen because they probably won't know the character, or they'll have more important things to worry about because the general population is not from Tumblr.

>>9571627
>the black people don't have heroes or read comics meme
K.

>>9571629
Most normies don't care about superheroes or comic characters outside of movies, no, and if they do, they certainly don't care enough to accost a random in a costume for "whitewashing".

>>9571631
Let us know how it goes then.

>>9571633
Do you have any news stories about white people getting in trouble IRL for cosplaying in public without blackfacing?

>>9571636
I would hope they're smart enough to know better. Though the higher liklihood is that they just stick to places with other white people so they don't get beat.

>>9571646
The burden of proof is on he who makes the claim, anon. If you can't prove that there'd be any backlash, well...
And your picture is of an actual racist caricature, not a brown character.

>>9571649
I suggested you trying an experiment to find out. Seems to me your claim that "black people don't mind/care being mocked" is the one that requires proof.

I can show you articles all day about people who don't like white people cosplaying other races if you prefer.

https://www.theodysseyonline.com/to-white-cosplayers-who-cosplay-as-poc-characters

>>9571655
You claimed "millions of others" cared, I disagreed and asked for proof, and you essentially told me to go out of my way to try and prove your own claim for you. Why don't you perform the experiment yourself if you're so sure?
>https://www.theodysseyonline.com/to-white-cosplayers-who-cosplay-as-poc-characters
>It is inevitable that this article will be read and the only thing taken away from it is that I am “forbidding” white cosplayers from embodying their favorite characters. What I am instead proposing is that white cosplayers recognize that they are invading a safe zone. I encourage white cosplayers to acknowledge their privilege in their ability to cosplay as both white and people of color characters without endangering themselves. I also urge white cosplayers to rethink their cosplays, and be mindful of the consequences of embodying a person of color character.
Even that article isn't actually saying that white people shouldn't cosplay as non-white characters.

>>9571662
>Why don't you perform the experiment yourself if you're so sure?
Because I'm not going to ask a white friend to be a racist douchebag?

She's literally saying to acknowledge the inherent racism in the act.

>>9571670
So, you're admitting that you have no evidence to back up your claims and also aren't interested in proving any of them. That's all I wanted to confirm, thanks.
The author of the article doesn't say that white people shouldn't cosplay characters that aren't white at any point whatsoever, either.

>>9571677
Try it sometime and see, I suppose. Don't pretend I didn't warn you.

>>9571678
If something would happen, you'd think there'd be evidence pointing to that (apart from one anonymous person insisting things on a Chinese basket-weaving forum).

>hey guys I'm new! I want to make a bait thread that you have already seen at least twice this year!

I want summer to be over.

>>9571681
Could be a sympton of a society that has divided itself along racial lines such that white people don't go to "black people places" or that black people are actively discriminated against when they go to cons.

>>9571711
Nice conjecture

>>9571715
Thanks. Glad you at least recognize that much.

>>9571726
>what is sarcasm

>>9571729
>i was only pretending to be retarded
You don't even know what the word means.

>>9571480
Thank you, that's an incredibly thought out reply.

Please note that I'm not the only one in this thread that doesn't equate blackface in cosplay as racist.

I'm sorry that you faced that kind of targeting bullying, fuck that shit. Bullies will pick out anything to target and hurt you. That doesn't necessarily imply that black people are the only ones getting bullied in the nerd/cosplay world though.
Women are constantly harrassed at cons, is there a movement to stop crossplaying? There probably is, seeing how people think these days, but does that make it right? Is it okay to tell someone they cant crossplay because they can stop being a woman later?
>>9571542

The discriminatory issues black people face in America have nothing to do with their skin color. It has to do with their culture. When 13% of the population is responsible for over 50% of violent crime you tend to view that population as a threat. Dylan Roof deserved to be shot, I'll agree with that 100% and Philandro Castille deserved to live and the cop that shot him was a fucking shitty cop who should never work again.

You know what privilege actually exists in America? Being raised in a 2 parent household. Black people raised in a 2 parent household do much better than white people raised by a single mother.

The fact is single motherhood is exponentially higher in the black community. That is the issue, and no white person is forcing black men to leave their pregnant girlfriends. Or as popular black culture calls them, "their bitches or their side piece"

>>9571744
>don't understand someone being sarcastic
>imply they weren't being sarcastic to save face
>"Y-Y-You don't even know what the word you just used means!"
Okay.

So I'm white and I lived in the north until my teens. When I moved to Florida I was immediately struck by how different the racial climate was. One of our old friends down here had a curfew in the white part of town when he was a teen because he was black. He had to be back to the black part of town before 8 pm. This curfew extended to all black people living in the area up until the 60's. One of my high school teachers recounted tales of segregated bathrooms and water fountains in public buildings. I've had customers refuse to take their food when my black manager handed it to them, claiming she had touched the food with her bare hands (she was handing them two to-go boxes, neatly packed in the kitchen). Said customer threw a bigger fit when she realized the manager she asked for was the black woman she was having a problem with.

So you do you, but if you post your cosplay online you are opening yourself up to a global perspective. Your part of the world may not have an active and aggressive racism present in day to day life, but it is very present here in the American South.

>>9571624
Are you saying that black people are aggressive and will beat up people?

>>9571911
That goes without saying.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xBNCw2MCwo

Fuck what people think, especially when it comes to cosplay. Blacks do whites, so whites should do blacks. Makeup never hurt anyone, it's performance.

>>9571911
>>9571932
Exactly, and this is the issue, they aren't aggressive because of their skin color or race. They are aggressive because the culture values aggression, the culture values hypersexuality. Modern popular black culture should be the most offensive thing to black people.

Black peoples have a hard enough feeling excluded in the massive ocean of peach that is nerd content.
Don't be a prick and do something that might make them uncomfortable and will definitely make you look ugly because "accuracy"

People can still tell who you're dressed as if you made the costume well. Goddamn.

These conversations always boil down to "I want to do something I know is shitty, but I don't want to be perceived as a shitty person, please help me find excuses for behavior I already know is terrible because I felt the need to ask in the first place"

Gutless worms. Either own up to being a racist or stop doing racist things.

>>9571148

>>9571572
>people "used to" keep black slaves all the time

The hajis still keep black slaves, but you don't hear the sjw's complaining about that. It's just more convenient to complain about accurate cosplay and "privilege" than it is to tackle the real issues.

>>9571968
Actually, there's a fair amount of evidence supporting the argument that race itself can play a role in behavior, although culture certainly plays a role in it.

I guess to answer OP's question as long as you avoid predominately black areas you should be fine. There's nothing inherently offensive about it but there's always the chance that Darquon or Jant'aneeesha might use it as an excuse to chimp out and lower property values in the area. Again.

>>9571749
Discrimination against women is very different from discrimination against black people. They're both terrible, but different. Blackface was made to be racist. Cross dressing was not.

It actually has a lot to do with skin color. But, since I'm on a phone, I'll keep this short and sweet. There are several laws explicitly designed to target black people including the war on drugs and three strikes. Crime is not a black thing; it's a poor thing. Black people tend to make less money, so are enticed to commit crimes to make ends meet. Even when committing the same crime, white people statistically spend less time in prison compared to their black counterparts. Schools in black neighborhoods tend to get less funding, and thus the education is shittier leading to black people to resort to crime. White people often get away with the murder of black people even when caught on camera.

>>9571968
What do you know about black culture? Nothing.

>>9572511
Yup. Nothing racist about blackface. And I'm gonna go ahead and assume you're racist with that "chimp out" comment.

>>9571911
No. They just have no patience for racism. You don't listen to what black people say and paint them as the villain when they tell you something is wrong, then get upset when one of the hem punches you, so you blame the whole race.

>>9572553
Sigh.. okay..

The heightened war on crack cocaine was pushed by black legislators tries of seeing their communities ravaged by drug use. Meth carries the same sentence and is mainly used by white. NOT racist.

Yes crime is a poor thing, and the number one factor in poverty is single parent households. NOT racist.

Criminals don't rely on crime to make ends meet. They don't make ends meet because they rely on crime.

Black murder other blacks and whites murder other whites at such significantly higher rates that it's really no comparison.

>>9562721
I don't care much about race in cosplay, just try and be accurate to the character. I feel it's easier to do a "brown face" than black. By brown I'm talking about ops picture. If they are white and can pull it off sure. But blacks and whites faces are so dissimilar that makeup can't really fix anything. Asians, Arabs ect are all easier to cosplay.

>>9563039
>Not only does it look dirty and greasy when white people try to paint their skin darker
Actually that's just how dark people look. You posted a pic of low quality cosplay to make your point, but you're just describing brown people and trying to act like it's different.

If it is so wrong then explain this wig.

>>9572637
Her eyes are giving me some uncanny valley vibes...

>>9572564
Actually, the war on drugs was designed by the Nixon administration in order to disrupt black and hippie communities. A former member of the Nixon administration admitted this a while ago.

You're ignoring things like education, school to prison pipeline, discrimination in the workplace, etc. which lead to poverty which leads to crime.

Actually, they do rely on crime. You can sleep on that "crime doesn't pay" bullshit when you're very president is committing crimes and staying in office. Even former criminals who do their time have trouble getting back into normal society and often aren't hired by vitriol of being a former criminal, leading to them going back to a life of crime.

Intraracial crime is the most common kind of crime. That doesn't change that interracial crime is often overlooked if the victim is black.

You're using the same arguments every black person has heard before as though you have a better understanding of black culture than black people. I'd actually be pretty surprised if you turned out to be black.

>>9572635
Did you just say all brown people look dirty and greasy?

>>9572635
Bait

>>9572559
If it's racist to speak honestly about the behaviors and traits of other groups, then I suppose I'm racist. That doesn't mean I'm wrong.

>>9572635
No, you look like shit when you try to paint your skin. Naturally dark people who were born with their skintone look good.
You'll never reach this level with your shitty greasepaint, sunburn and orange tan. Just accept it and work with what you have, pasty-chan.

>>9572709
What is ben nye?

>>9572711
I googled "Ben Nye on white skin", and all I got was pic related and a blog post saying
>No. I look like I've got a touch of liver disease. It's quite yellow, and I did blend like a mad woman.
RIP in pieces

>>9572721
Thats just one product they have out of hundreds.

>>9572738
Okay, then can you post examples of it successfully making a white person look brown (and not like they just dumped a bucket of paint mixed with oil on themselves and called it a day)?
Because the things I'm seeing are dismal.
>She thought this looked good

>>9572744
Heres one. Bear in mind- 99% of people suck at body paint application. Take a look at homestucks, bronies, and steven universe cosplayers.
It can be done if the person knows what the fuck theyre doing.
There was another girl from germany that cosplayed a black dc character and did a decent job. I cant remember who she was cosplaying.
(Pic related is also a European cosplayer)

>>9572751
Anon, that looks really bad.
Her lips look like she's been trying to kiss a bottle of diesel. That wig looks matted as fuck, like it's been unearthed after 20 years.
Garnet isn't even that brown, she's dark red. Even the construction of the costume itself is a bit shoddy.
If that's meant to be a rare good example, you're really not helping yourself.

>>9572756
This was about make up application, not the cosplays construction overall.
Considering you completely ignored that aspect of it and focused on everything else, I assume you have nothing to remark about that.

>>9572759
I talked about the makeup application in literally the second sentence of my post, and the third one. The rest of the cosplay is the cherry on top of the shit sundae. I assume you have a case of selective reading.

>>9572762
You only mentioned her lips, nothing else.
But what ever.
Im sure youd nitpick every possible minute inaccuracy of what ever Id post anyway.
What about this one, then?

>>9572765
It should go without saying that she just looks grimy as fuck based on her lips alone, not to mention she didn't even get the character's color right (which means she failed on the accuracy front). It was a bad example.
That one does look better, mostly because she barely tried to change her actual skintone and just made herself look more warm-toned than cool. Still inaccurate to the character, though, which means she failed at what she was intending to do (be accurate) through changing her skin in the first place.
All you're introducing is that there's no way to do this "correctly" and look good. The closest you can get is a light tan before it starts to look bad.

>>9572771
>storm cosplayer is actually a black woman

Thank you for proving my point

>>9572773
>one drop rule
She literally looks so white that she can be mistaken for a white person who painted their skin. Wew.
You proved nothing except that you're petty and tryhard.

>>9572780
Forgot this: If that cosplayer really is part-black, you still don't have a single example of a white person being able to paint their skin brown and have it not look like shit.
You just shot yourself in the foot twice.

>>9572781
I actually only posted her to see if youd say shit about her "make up" looking bad. And hey look- you did!
Im not the one who shot themselves in the foot.

>>9572783
I didn't say the makeup looked bad, though. I said it actually did look better because it didn't look like >>9572751 and was far more subtle.
And then it turned out that it was so nice and subtle because that was her actual skintone, and she wasn't part of your magical 1% of white people who know how to paint their skin.
You tried.

>>9572785
Whether or not shes really white is irrelevant. I made the hypothosis that youd nitpick even an actual black woman, found a picture, posted it, and you did exactly what I predicted.
It wasnt because I couldnt find a good picture- its because I assumed that even if I did youd find something "wrong" with it.
And i was 100% right. You fell for the bait.

>>9572785
Not even that anon, but stop backpeddling so hard and moving goalposts.

>>9572790
Your attempt at a hypothesis doesn't change my point (and it wasn't "exactly what you predicted" because I said she looked better). It looked good because it looked like a light tan (though still inaccurate to the character, which means even if she was white, her painting her skin was useless and she could've gone without). And then it turned out to not even be a tan, but her actual skin. You basically fucked yourself over because you couldn't help grasping for a "Gotcha".
You inadvertently just proved me right when I said >>9572709.

>>9572792
>Not even that anon
Hmmm.
In any case, they're the one who moved the goalposts because they admitted they'd given up at that point and just wanted to "prove" that I'd nitpick anyone they posted.

>>9572798
You asked for a white person successfully looking brown, which >>9572751 provided. But you decided to nitpick it, then somehow shifting the goalposts to a white person looking accurate to the character? This just shows you didn't have any intention to agree in the first place.

Personally, I think the cosplayer in anon's image does indeed look decent even though not 100% accurate. Far from looking like they dumped a bucket of oily paint on themselves. Most of the body paint jobs I've seen at cons are tenfolds more disastrous.

>>9572803
How is it a nitpick? She didn't successfully look brown, she couldn't even figure out how to paint her mouth area correctly.
>somehow shifting the goalposts to a white person looking accurate to the character
Correct me if I'm wrong on this, but isn't the idea behind a white person brownfacing to cosplay to achieve greater accuracy to the character? If it doesn't look accurate, why would they do it?
>Personally, I think the cosplayer in anon's image does indeed look decent even though not 100% accurate.
Which one, the Garnet one or the one that actually turned out to be someone with black ancestry?

>>9572679
You actually are wrong though.

>>9572751
As a black person, this looks very unsettling. Only people who think this looks good are people who have never seen a black person irl.

>>9571542
Someone should really show you the statistics of black on white violence vs. white on black violence in the US

whoops here it is

why are arab boys so hot

they are either the hottest guys on earth or disgusting, there is no inbetween with them

>>9572903
>>9572906
Zayn is Pakistani, not Arab. Also most Arab guys are actually complete fuckboys. We even have a term for them, "Wallahbro" or "Wallahibro".

>>9572934
fuckboys or not they are hot

>>9572879
>claims someone is wrong
>provides no evidence to back up their argument

>>9572949
You're probably getting arabs mixed ups with persians.

>>9572655
What you are listing here are just excuses for crime after the fact.
The war on drugs is perpetuated by big government not white people, I don't like big government either. Sure, Nixon was trying to control slow the counter-culture movements with the war on drugs, I'll give you that, but as I said it was black legislators that really amped up the war against crack cocaine. This is the drug that most liberals point to because of the overwhelming majority of users are black men.

There is no prison pipeline,

Don't want to get picked up for drugs? Don't do drugs.

Want to stay out if jail? Don't commit crimes.

It really is that simple.

There is no disparity between whites and blacks in sentencing, other than the fact that it has been shown prosecutors are less likely to prove gulit when race is brought into the picture. Remember O.J.?

Inner city schools in black communities are underfunded because of the state of their communities. Businesses don't come to areas rife with crime, drugs, prostitution, and murder. The fucking criminals youre making excuses for are the only reason the schools are underfunded.

>>9572655
It seems to me that if any racial privilege exists, it's BLACK privilege.

Black people get an automatic 230 points added to SAT scores in some schools making it easier for them to get in. Asians on the other hand -50 on their scores. Also there are tons of scholarships only for minorities and more only for black students. I maintained a 4.0 and got one scholarship, other minority students I talked to had a 3.0 or lower and got multiple, and they still lived at home.

Thats BLACK privilege.

Same in the workplace, due to anti discrimation laws businesses are expected to maintain a percentage of black employees. I work with a black man who has made mistakes that cost the company thousands of dollars already this year but he still has a job, they recently let go a white guy because he wasn't doing enough on his down time.

That's BLACK privilege.

But the ultimate privilege black people get to enjoy is that no matter how shitty they are, no matter how much they commit crimes and how disrespectful they act towards women or elders or authority, no matter what terrible terrible act a black person commits there will always be an army of people like you to jump in and make excuses for their behavior. To shout INSTITUTIONAL RACISM! And blame the system. Meanwhile everyone else is held accountable for their actions, and judged as an individual by the content of their character not the color of their skin.

And according to this, if someone does something so small as paint their face to match a character, they are justified targets for aggression. Social justice warriors will make excuses for MURDER and DRUG DEALING to defend a black person but if your a white person doing black face there can never be any excuse.

BLACK PRIVILEGE.

>>9573139
>that entire post
That happened lmao

>>9572751
How are we not discussing the mustache of foundation clinging to her lip fur?

>>9573139
Chill out white boy.

Black people don't get bonus points. Stop buying into bullshit.
http://thecommunicatedstereotype.com/no-minorities-do-not-earn-bonus-points-on-the-sat/

Anti discrimination laws aren't used to maintain a certain number of black employees. It just means you can't treat people like shit. The government won't even investigate unless someone files a complaint.
https://www.dol.gov/oasam/programs/history/herman/reports/futurework/conference/staffing/9.7_discrimination.htm

How shitty who is? How much crime who commits? How disrespectful who is? This just seems like a generalization. You're making it out to seem like black people aren't held accountable for their actions and are never punished for anything they do. You're saying literally every other race is.

Black privilege.

>>9573130
>For his first five years in office, Reagan slowly strengthened drug enforcement by creating mandatory minimum sentencing and forfeiture of cash and real estate for drug offenses, policies far more detrimental to poor blacks than any other sector affected by the new laws[...] The Reagan administration began shoring public opinion against "crack", encouraging DEA official Robert Putnam to play up the harmful effects of the drug. Stories of "crack whores" and "crack babies" became commonplace; by 1986, Time had declared "crack" the issue of the year.
It affected the black community more than any other. Do you have any sources that it was black politicians though?

There is a prison pipeline.

There was a huge issue with cops planting drugs on people, but going into detail will make me sound crazy.

Staying out of jail is hard when you're targeted by police and punished for crimes you didn't commit.

Yes, black people get harsher sentences.
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/17/opinion/sunday/unequal-sentences-for-blacks-and-whites.html

The schools being underfunded is the reason for the criminals. I guess it's circular logic. Not getting into the fact that the state of one's community is how we decide schools should have funding. Seems like a race issue that has evolved into a class issue.

>>9565533
Not a race dumb as

>>9572751
This looks so fucking bad. Why is her neck uneven? Why did she draw a lip mustache?

>>9572883
>>9573315
>>9573916
You're just nitpicking. Stop moving the goalposts. You're not even talking about the makeup application. She looks great.

Another related topic, should Lolita be okay? It is kinda cultural appropriation..

>>9572744

This one

>>9574012
For who? Europeans wearing japanese clothes, or japanese for ripping off european fashion?

>>9574334
Same girl. This still looks really awkward and sunburnt.

>>9573139
How retarded do you have to be to believe Black people get points added to their SATs?

LMAO, how have you survived this long? You don't seem smart enough to walk and chew gum at the same time.

>>9574012
People bitching about "cultural appropriation" is absolutely retarded, and even moreso when talking about Japanese fashion which, outside of traditional clothing, "appropriates" a fuck-ton from European fashion. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but complaining about an American wearing Japanese clothing inspired by European clothing is just retarded.

>>9574401
It happens, but like i said in some schools not all schools. Some schools factor in race in the acceptance metric and black students get a slack on SAT scores because black SAT scores aren't factored as heavily.

>>9573999
Okay, Jan

Fresh from comic con.

Really, you think this nasty look is ~more authentic?~

>>9562721
seagulls, are you serious?
there are TWO /pol/ threads on your main page right now. stop feeding them.

when a thread reaches over 30% bait volume, it's time to abandon the thread. sage and i'm very disappointed in you all.

You should never go blackface for cosplay.

I don't care about offending black people, the reason you should never do it is because it will never look good. Even if you do manage to match the skin tone perfectly, your underlying facial features will not imitate the ethnicity you are trying to mimic. Paleontologists can identify the ethnicity from bones, something that makeup isn't going to change. With enough contouring work on your makeup and maybe some prosthetics to widen some features it could look good, but at that point, it just seems like to much work for a hallway convention costume. Given that the community is so accepting of cross-play, AUs, ODs and OCs I really don't think anyone is going to be offended if your skin tone isn't perfect. POC give no fucks about it either, so why should you?

I literally can't fucking believe you guys were so retarded as to take this shit bait of a thread

>>9576481
I mean normally I roll my eyes at obvious bait on /cgl/ but not every controversial discussion is "bait", even if it is a topic that's been run into the ground.

>>9573904
Your reply (and those like it) give me hope for cgl. Screw the mras, racists, and bigots trying to bring their bullshit onto the board.

>>9574334
I have wanted to cosplay Anthy for ages. As I'm both white and incredibly pale-skinned, I have not (and will not) cosplay her. I'd have no problem doing it and not painting my skin, but I will not be one of those white women in a bindi. Nope. Not happening.

i fucking hate how much tumblr is infecting other places. can all you social justice cucks confine yourself to that shit hole of a website? thanks.

>>9573315
Are you an idiot? White people always look like that when they overline, it has nothing to do with character being black.

>>9569815
You are unqualified to make ANY of these statements and sound extremely ignorant. Please leave.

>>9574584
You sound like Becky with the bad grades. You mad cuz a nigga is smarter than you?