/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

Unless you are trying to be offensive by using stereotypes, there is nothing wrong with blackface. It is no different than painting yourself gray for homestuck cosplays.

>>9234933
Political correctness aside, it looks terrible. Body paint that imitates existing skin tones usually looks fake because you have something to compare it to in real life. This goes for both light skinned and dark skinned cosplayers. Not to mention using body paint that is significantly lighter or darker than your natural skin looks terrifying 99.9% of the time.
If you want to look good, choose to cosplay someone that already fits your appearance. Isn't that rule no. 1?!

>>9234933
It's deemed offensive, even in a serious context, because you're donning someone's race without having to take on the consequences of being said race. A white person can paint themselves darker to imitate a black character, but in doing so, they don't take on the struggles and history of an actual black person. It's become not so much just an issue of people doing it as a joke, but it's the fact that white people can dress as a black, Asian etc. character freely, without having to deal with the burdens many races have to deal with (I.e police brutality, racism, stereotyping etc.)

Idk, at the end of the day it's not up to white people to decide what's acceptable in terms of imitating a certain look and what's not. If the majority of Asian people don't want us pretending to be Asian, for example, even if it's for a day, it's really not up to us to argue with them. I don't see why it's such a big deal anyway. Just do good work on your cosplay and the race issue really doesn't matter.

>>9234933
>discussing racism on /pol/
Are you baiting or just genuinly new?

>>9234933
Lets not do this thread for the thousandth time

>>9234960
Not rule no. 1. But it does look bad and fake to lighten or darken your skin.

>>9234967
>but in doing so, they don't take on the struggles and history of an actual black person.
This isn't the movie "Avatar", we are all individual people, we aren't spiritually connected to each other and our ancestor's past.

>>9234979
>as if racism has ceased to exist
There's no way you're that dense. Racist aspect aside, it's dumb and always look ridiculous.

Skintone really isn't part of the costume. If the argument is "but accuracy!", you shouldn't be cosplaying that character at all and you should pick a character that already looks like you. If that's the argument, then people should only cosplay characters that are the same race as them and nobody else.

This has always been such an asinine argument to me.

>>9234933
Unless you're purposely being racist then no nothing is wrong with it

>wearing jfashion is racist
Probably in the future, when liberals go real crazy.
Reminds me of a story about a Japanese person wearing her traditional clothing in America and people got triggered over it.

>>9234952
>there is nothing wrong with blackface
>It is no different than painting yourself gray for homestuck cosplays.
You can't be serious.

>>9234933
>TL;DR Why is cultural appropriation wrong in the context of making a serious and character precise cosplay


Class 3 underprivileged black anon answering for you

IT LOOKS LIKE SHIT.
op image looks like a steaming pile of fucking garbage

if you want to look like shit and get laughed at or booed by the internet, go right the fuck ahead.

she looks like she rolled around in a pile of manure.


look, if you want to ignore the thousands of pale characters there are and cosplay one that doesn't suit you, fine. get a tan or something. just none of this greasepaint/brown makeup shit. if you can't tan, tough shit, cosplay a vampire or something and quit whining to us about "muh accuracy"

Taping your eyelids to look like an Asian person, painting your face to look like a black person, and putting a dot on your head to look like an Indian person are all forms of racism.

She could do her hair and makeup like Nicki Minaj without painting her face black. Minaj has a very unique style of makeup and dress; everyone would have recognized it.

The cosplayer could have done everything else with his costume sans the taped lids, and everyone would have recognized it.

Like I said in the last thread, Gyaru make a daily commitment to their color as part of an identity, not for shits and giggles.

Other examples are wearing the (not a bindi!) but the red dot specifically. The red dot itself is special and single young women have no point wearing it. (Bindis are appropriation because the decorative ones are worn by unmarried women anyways.)

A married old person wearing the kimono or makeup of a maiko may fall under appropriation. There were 10,000 other ways to wear a kimono that were more sensible.

Crosses and crucifixes are different. On one hand, some might say appropriation of a Christian or Catholic. I say differently because as a Christian, there is no significance in the picture of a cross or crucifix alone. It alone has little meaning.

>>9235043
bindis themselves are not necessarily appropriation*

(In fact, as far as I'm aware, if one starts geisha training later in life, they skip the elaborate maiko dress all together. Especially starting in the mid-20's)

>>9235043
A bindi is not like black face at all.

It's more like someonevwearing a rosary despite not being religious or believing in Jesus sacrificing himself or knowing about it at all

Am mexican, therefore mi opinions weight more for tumblr. IDGAF about muh culture appropriation, it's just a stupid thing invented in first world countries whose greatest concern is getting a house and pay student loans. I don't need people telling people on my behalf that dressing up as a mariachi is wrong because they ran out of real problems to worry about. I struggle more with trying to not get raped and killed on my way home than getting offended of that white guy with a zarape and brown face. Dress as a pirate? Did you knew they raped? Dress as a mummy ? Are you Egyptian enough? Dress as a vampire? That's Transylvanian culture appropriation. It's fucking stupid, you are just dressing up, not changing your entire background and faking being from a race you aren't

>>9235029
literally what is the difference? So what color pigment of the "line" drawn at that is "off limits".

>>9234989
so no one should cosplay homestuck, or at the very least, color themselves gray? ok. good luck with spreading that idea.

Here is a bombshell for you all; "race" doesn't exist, we are all apart of the human race. Skin color is literally no different than hair or eye color. Race is just something people made up hundreds of years ago to try and explain how they are above and better than barbarians and slaves.

>>9234975
>>9235042
Me I'm ok with that, but the problem, like the others anons said, is that race change make up is the part of a whole job, with special studies, and you need a lot of experience . it's already difficult to make a correct a body paint for h.s troll so a whole race change for a normal cosplayer is too hard, but if you have a lot of experience sfx makeup...

>>9235067
If you are too dumb to grasp the concept behind why painting yourself a color that no human actually is is okay but painting yourself the color of another race that actually exists is not I feel bad for you. You have to be legitimately retarded to think painting yourself lime green to look like an alien is the same as painting yourself to look like a black person.

>>9235042
In a blackface thread on /cgl/ I was told that tanning to cosplay a character of darker skin, it would be the same as black facing. How is it different from makeup? Besides the quality of the results

>>9235074
so dressing up as real people, like, say, Obama or Trump, is just as offensive too? Its the looking like real people that is bad?

>>9235043
So if you manipulate your eyeshape with glue/tape/whatever, it's cultural appropriation if you're aiming for "an asian monolid"

But if you wanted to obtain "this specific character's eyeshape" using this method, would it be considered cultural appropriation?

>>9235085
Dressing up from someone that isn't your race and changing features about yourself that are influenced by race is offensive. If I'm white and dress up as Donald trump it's alright, but if I try and dress up as Obama and put on black face and big fake ears to do so it is offensive.

I really don't see how the distinction is so hard for you to pick out unless, like I said, you are actually mentally challenged.

>>9235067
Except that there are specific biological differences between races.

>>9234960
This exactly

>>9235090
>changing features about yourself that are influenced by race is offensive
features by race? What does that even mean?
> if I try and dress up as Obama and put on black face and big fake ears to do so it is offensive.
So if I dress up as a white guy with big ears, and put on big fake ears, that wouldn't be offensive?
Why is the color of someone's skin so important? Why do you focus so much on skin color? Why not eye color or hair color or any of the other million genetic differences humans have.

>>9235098
>features by race? What does that even mean
Alright so you are either mentally retarded or just trolling at this point.

>>9235096
There are specific biological differences between all humans. Skin color isn't any more significant than anything else.

>>9235100
Not the anon you replied to, but I'm genuinely curious as well. What does it mean

>>9235103
You can't honesty believe that.

>>9235104
If you honestly can't distinguish races by features you're an idiot and there's no point in trying to explain anything to you because it isn't possible for you to understand such a concept with that little intelligence.

>>9235098
Oh my fucking god - sorry are the white people here challenged or are you doing this on purpose?

>If I dress like a white guy and put on big ears is that offensive?
Are you white? That part right there is fine. Does this person have big ears? Yes? Its offensive but IT. IS. NOT. RACISM.

>>9235106
Do you mean stereotypes like all asians got small eyes and flat noses, black people got curly hair, White people can't tan etc.?

Even if you didn't take these things into consideration, but still wanted to cosplay a character based on his/her specific design - maybe because both of you got the same faceshape/nose/body - it would still be considered cultural appropriation?
If yes, why?

>>9235100
go ahead, explain what the different human races are and what separates them.
nationality/geography places a big role in genetics, but there is no such thing as "race", unless you want to say there is a Sweden race, German race, French race, etc. Because they all have different leaning traits, such as, white Swedish people tend to be taller than white Americans. Both white, yet different traits.

>>9235110
Like I said, if you can't understand what I am talking about you are too stupid to ever grasp it and trying to explain it to you is useles.

>>9235112
>go ahead, explain what the different human races are and what separates them.
please see

>>9235115

and maybe go to a biology class if you aren't trolling and genuinely want to understand.

>>9235107
>Does this person have big ears? Yes? Its offensive
But my question is, where is the line drawn? If it is over-exaggerated, yea, its offensive, but if you are accurately changing your ear size, how is that any different than wearing a wig to change your hair color and shape?

>>9235115
>you are too stupid
wow, well, I'm sure convinced now.
Something I learned a while ago, if you hold a position that you can't defend, it probably isn't a position you should hold.

>>9235120
If you can't understand the line by coming to your own conclusions you are not socially aware. I'm sorry, it's not something that you can use a general rule for, it's something you have to have awareness of yourself and others to deduce depending on any given situation.

This is why you're being called stupid btw, because you can't understand that.

>>9234960
Are you me? Cause this is exactly how I feel about it!

Plus, skin tone isn't exactly changing your race. This girl tried changing her nose too, but she just doesn't look Black. Merely like a White girl + unnatural skin tone + weird nose. Wtf is the point of doing that effort if you just end up looking weird/unflattering?

>>9235122
Ok, no joke, if your best arguement really is "it is that way because it just is", you really need to take time and really think about your beliefs. Thats how I would reason stuff in middle school, then started actually challenging myself and realized that, if I can't explain why I belief something, I shouldn't belief that thing. It really helps later in life, it helps you from being swayed by other people if you are always challenging what you hear and think.

I recommend you really re-evaluate your beliefs and really figure out what you actually do think is right or wrong. If you can't think of a rational explanation other than "just because thats how it is", then you should reconsider.

>>9235135
Anon, I don't have time to sit down and hold your hand while I explain an entire MAJOR aspect of human interaction to you. Your ignorance is unfortunate but it isn't my responsibility to educate you on it.

>>9235120
Look. Things that humans have such as default (NOT tanning. NOT makeup) skin color, facial features (big nose, small eyes), body features (long neck, large feet) that you do not have and you decide to take that and use for a costume is offensive because anything and all the hardships they may have and still be facing are things you can bypass because you can just take it off when you are done. Skin color is especially offensive because of all the deadly (or other bad) things that can and still do come out of having that color. It does NOT matter if you didn't MEAN to be offensive, you still were. And if people on a major scale are saying "please don't do this. Its offensive. Its uncomfortable. Long thought out answers." you should just not fucking do it. If you pointed at someone like Lol your nose is huge as fuck and they said please stop - you would, would you not? Same for skin color, eye shape, and everything else it includes. AND just because your black "friend" or asian coworker, or hispanic neighbor said it was okay, does not mean that it is. A small group of people not minding does not override the large group that wants you to cut it out.

I'm trying to explain this as easy as I can for you but its literally not that hard if you think it through. Jesus.

is this seriously happening

does this even belong here just because pikarin is in the OP

what the hell, /cgl/

>>9235144
Obviously it does since people are too stupid to understand where "accuracy" or "fashion" needs to end.

>>9235138
>you decide to take that and use for a costume is offensive because anything and all the hardships they may have and still be facing are things you can bypass because you can just take it off when you are done.
anon, its a costume, no one is secretly pretending to be the person they are dressed up as.
It doesn't make sense, you are literally saying that all costumes are offensive.
If you are actually saying that I can't dress up as a single person who belongs to a group of people who has ever faced hardships, then there literally is not a single person I could dress up as besides some fictional non human character.

>A small group of people not minding does not override the large group that wants you to cut it out.
Well, luckily crybullies are still a minority. I'm not going to change a single thing because some cry bully like yourself thinks they can go around telling people what to and not to do.
You are not the moral police, you do not have some divine idea of what is right or wrong. What makes you think you do, and you can tells others what is and isn't offensive?

>>9235138
Thank you for your opinion. I understand better now.

I do still believe that it wouldn't be cultural appropriation if a person were to cosplay a fictional character.
If for example a white cosplayer were to cosplay a Naruto character, even though the design might be portraying these "racial features" of a black person like dark skincolor, big nose etc, the darkskinned people of Naruto have never had the experiences that the darkskinned folk of IRL have. The cosplayer is simply portraying a race from a fictional world that is based on a 'race' from IRL. What do you think about this?

>>9235146
If my conversation is genuinely upsetting you, you don't have to answer. But I truly wish to have an insightful debate about this subject

>this thread

Y'all need to stop applying North American racial politics to people in other countries.
In other places, just darkening your skin for cosplay/emulating someone famous IS NOT OFFENSIVE. IT MAY BE TO YOU, BUT IT ISN'T TO THEM. Unless you're doing it to stereotype a black person or something.
Stop pushing this stupid subject and SJW ganging up on Pikarin for fucks sake.

>>9234933
Holy fuck OP you are seriously dense. Let me put it simply:

White people have been handing out shit on EVERY other race/skin colour/whatever term you wanna use for centuries. Slavery, genocide, war, the list goes on, literally because we decided our pasty asses are somehow better than any one else's. Now, all of a sudden, white people think it's all well and good to 'dress up' as the people they've been abusing since the dawn of civilisation.
You seriously think it's fine to paint your skin the same colour as someone we were segregating barely 50-60 years ago? It's offensive because after hundreds of years of treating poc as shit, people like you are arguing that we should get to paint our skin to look like characters who are still struggling for representation in all forms of media. We have fucking thousands of white characters to pick from.
Racism is still alive and well, and we don't get to dress up as the sufferers of said racism for a bit of 'fun' because 'waaaah why can't we muh accuracy'.

You don't get to decide what's offensive and what's not to millions of people. It's precisely your gross attitude that makes blackface so offensive- a white person, having a sook because they can't do what they want, regardless of how derogatory and harmful it is to poc.

>>9235146
i'm scared

i'm not about to read through this clusterfuck of a thread but as a nipponese, here's my take:
emulating the features of another race/ethnicity for the sake of emulating the features of another race/ethnicity is wrong

people taping their eyes to look asian is shit because asians are always made fun of for their eyes, right? but those who are taping them can just take off the tape and go about their day. "appropriating" these things that are looked down upon/have been looked down upon throughout history is bad because the people who are doing it don't have to live with those features and deal with their implications.

like those lolcows who literally shoop themselves "asian" and lie about their ethnicity. why? they're making a parody of a culture by taking what they THINK it's about, what they THINK the people look like, and using it in order to gain social traction. they are taking what they THINK is "asian" and amplifying it by 100x, which is racist as fuck.

so yeah, blackface is fucked because of all of the bullshit that black people had to deal with throughout their history, especially in the americas. i don't see "ganguro" as offensive because they're not specifically going "LMAO LOOK I'M BLACK." but slapping on some paint for the sake of muh cosplay or muh fashion is parodying all of the awful things that black people had to face for the sake of their goddamn skin.

Asian anon living in Europe here. I don't fuking care about white people "yellowfacing" when cosplaying as much as mostly all asian cosplayers do fake eyelids to make our eyes looks bigger or use purple make-up primer and whitening bb-cream to do our skin white or whatever. I see definitely no problem and none of us does.
The only problem is your Tumblr social warriors and RACISM ALERT WE'RE SUFFERING BLACK PERSON ATTENTIONWHORING EVERYWHERE THEY CAN DO IT.
Yes we have a racism promlem.
Yes in usual life I also face some racism issues as you guys do.
No we're not supposed to see racism in cosplay. It's a moterfucking hobby. It's a motherfucking art. Unless some white girl doesn't do black charactes only cause "hahaha look guys I can be better black than ppl who were born black" it's not a fucking problem.
It's okay for all of us cosplayers to try make our favorite characters as good as we possible. And now you do forbid somebody to cosplay his favorite character because it's offensive to you. Isn't that offensive? Ok IT MAY LOOK BAD but also may not.
So you know what? I fuking main Ekko, I wanna cosplay Ekko and I don't fucking care about your feelings because I do it only with love to this character. I'd like to cosplay Ekko even if you all die.
Yeah call me a racist you dumb-ass social warrors. Open your eyes, normal people don't need your protect, go ahead and get a real job.

>>9235166
It's pretty ironic you act like we're getting #triggered over this when you throw this big of a hissy fit

>>9235166
you have to be 18+ to use this site

>>9235151
And because its a costume, you can afford to just skip changing your skin color or pulling your eyes into some caricature. No one said you can't dress like who ever you want just stop being offensive - If you really cared about accuracy, you'd only cosplay as white characters - and that excludes 99.9999999% of anime characters and we know thats obviously not it.
And I'm sorry that you never leave your little bubble because if you did you'd see that there are much more that "a small minority of crybabies" out there that do not like this. I'll be ignoring the rest of your comment since you're just being obtuse.

>>9235152
I think you can portray a character without changing your skin drastically. You bought up Naruto characters: You don't need to raid Sephora's darkest makeup to cosplay Karui. Just do it without all that. You don't need to bust out the paint to be Choi (Tamako Market). Theres no reason to spray paint yourself a thousand times because you wanna be Nygus (Soul Eater). If you really want to cosplay that character, you can do it without all that. If you have to rely on changing something like that to get the point across that you are that character, you didn't do a good job in the other aspects of that costume in the first place.

>>9235158
>we
>>9234979

>>9235172
And I'm sorry that you never leave your little bubble because if you did you'd see that there are much more that "a small minority of crybabies" out there that do not like this.
Well first, I said cry bullies, which are people who bully others by crying.
Outside of tumblr and college campuses, when have you ever heard someone complain about this? The small minority of SJWs are the only ones who think this should be stopped or whatever.

>>9235178
>outside of tumblr and college campuses, have you ever heard someone complain about this?

...are you referring to blackface/changing one's skin color? many people have an issue with that. i really don't understand where you're pulling that statement from.

>>9235172
Thank you for answering. I'm asian, but was born and grew up in the west, therefore I identify with western culture more than eastern. My skin color is too dark for many white and asian characters but yet too light for tan characters. Since my parents are from south-eastern asian countries, I do believe that I could pull off some tan characters, like Choi, she's cute.
But I was told even tanning for a cosplay would be 'black facing'. I don't follow politics much and I tried to stay away from this whole cultural appropriation thing, but now it might effect me and people around me, which is why I wanted to hear thoughts from around the world.
I'll think twice about involving skin color into my future cosplays and hear about the general opinion about it in my local comm. But thank you for explaining your opinion thoroughly

>>9235178
>, when have you ever heard someone complain about this
Do you not see the severe reactions to racism constantly played up in American news?

>>9235105
>>9235096
>>9235112
There are several distinct racial groups who posses specific phenotypes, genetic markers, and are at a risk for specific diseases, such as africans being at a greater risk for sickle-cell anemia, or hispanics(and blacks) being at a greater risk for diabetes. Denying this and the fact that these are clearly identifiable groups is just stupid.

So what's the difference between this and gyaru fashion? That's all 'fashion' but to me it looks like it's copying black skin and blonde hair.

>>9235193
Gyaru girls use that tan as part of their image and go to great lengths to keep it up, while Pikarin was slathering dark foundation to make herself darker to look like a black person as cosplay.

>>9235166
This is the double standard I'm talking about. I've posted here before about the double eyelid asians paint on to look like westerners, and it's all fine and good, but god forbid anyone over here tries to reverse it and go for a monolid. It's hypocrisy at its finest.

People keep writing it off as "Tumblr" or "Social Justice" like its a thing that only exists online or in small places.
Newsflash - there are people around the world (though I'll only speak of the main ones people bring up - Europe, Japan, and America) who disapprove of this and if you can't see it, you just aren't listening.

Storytime for the weebs: I and my white friend did a school switch years ago. When festival time rolls around, we're given yukatas to wear. They asked us to put them on and were more than happy to share their culture a bit. Girlfriend decides to tape her eyes because "teehee, I just want to be as close to asian as possible! I don't wanna stick out too much!" I told her it was a bad idea but just like the people here she said I was being too sensitive and "no one really cares!" so we go to go meet up with the family. Guess what? They were pissed. And very offended. As were the others we passed by and the ones who saw her when we showed up. And we were promptly taken home and she was asked to take the tape and the yukata off as nicely as possible given that she was still young. To make matters worse - they asked for her to be removed from their care. Its not just an American thing; no one likes being made into someone else's prop. Doesn't matter where you go.

>>9235186
Its fine. I'm glad I got my point across and that there was someone here who was actually listening. I kind of agree with the tanning thing because why do you need to do that just for a costume. Its why gyaru are different because that is a commitment for them. Either way, just make sure to listen when people are saying things because even if they're angry, there is usually something they are trying to get across.
I bet you'd make a cute Choi as well. Do you and don't feel bad for asking questions as long as you aren't being dense and all that. I'm trying to get this all out in one go so sorry if some things read as the same over and over again.

>>9235197
>because that is an everyday commitment for...*
May have typed a bit too fast there.

>>9235189
>There are several distinct racial groups who posses specific phenotypes, genetic markers, and are at a risk for specific diseases
This can be said about *anyone*. I, a white person, am more prone to things like diabetes opposed to other white people. Then there is stuff like lactose intolerance where there is a big difference between white people.

Where is the line to where someone is an entire different race?

>>9235185
>>9235187
changing your skin color isn't largely considered racism. Exaggerating certain features is.

>>9235200
Changing your skin color to be darker to look like a black person is racist. You cannot debate that without looking like a troll.

>>9235196
the thing is, are westerners made fun of on a large scale for having big eyes? no. it is a largely desirable trait to many. but others, namely westerners, have collectively made fun of the "asian"-looking eye as something that's undesirable and funny. don't pretend you haven't witnessed this. easterners are conforming to the western standards for beauty because that's what has been imposed on us for many years. when easterners are emulating the "big eye" look, it is because we have been told that our eyes aren't right.

>>9235195
Okay, I'll buy that it's a lifestyle for them. But it's still darkening the skin to look different. It's still copying a look of another race. But if we're gonna answer this with 'They're tanning, that's a natural skin color they can achieve', then don't use 'you can't tan for cosplay' as an excuse. I'm willing to concede it's rude and offensive to paint your skin, but if you can naturally get dark, then wanting a tan for one day in costume is no different than a tan for one day at the beach. Because guess what? You DON'T get to take that off after, and might enjoy it anyway.

>>9235197
Oh I got then, if it's blackface for a day, it is wrong, but if it's blackface as a fashion choice and done daily, it's okay.
Makes sense.

>>9235216
Now you're just being dense. I worry about your future.

>>9235216
Hahaha, basically. This is the thing I've been saying for forever.

>>9235067
KEK YOU REALLY TRIED THE 'we're all human' BIT? Please. Take that opinion and shove it far up your ass.

Oh and considering Homestuck is a made up thing, I don't think comparing it to real people is anything but stupid.

>>9235200
Except that that's wrong:
Graph shows genetic differences between races, Source:
Xing J, Watkins WS, Witherspoon DJ, Zhang Y, Guthery SL, Thara R, Mowry BJ, Bulayeva K, Weiss RB, Jorde LB. 2009a. Fine-scaled human genetic structure revealed by SNP microarrays. Genome Res 19: 815–825.

>>9235204
>Changing your skin color to be darker to look like a black person is racist
why?
only arguement I have heard so far is "people are racist towards black people, so painting your skin black is bad", which is the stupidest thing I ever heard.
If anything, its racist to say that you can't paint your skin how ever you want, as if you "own" a color pigment

>>9235226
see
>>9235135
unless you want to actually present an argument.

>>9235223
If you are legit doing blackface every day you've probably been arrested/killed by this point.

>>9235208
jumping in (which is a terrible idea, probably) just to explain why people might find tanning for cosplay different than tanning for fashion:

when you tan as a fashion, you see that as changing how YOU look, regardless of your race and how people perceive you. no one on this thread has gotten pissed at white girls who tan until they are orange in the winter because they think it looks good on THEM.

when you tan to look like someone who is a different race than you as a costume, you are still trying to assume someone else's race. you are prentending to be black or Indian or darker skinned asian for a day and some people find that shitty.

I'm not going to go into whether or not it is, because it's more nuanced then straight up black face, but it's pretty easy to see why people would be unhappy with you.

>>9235236
>"You're racist because you won't let me be racist!"
Jesus christ~ Are you serious right now? Just stop.

>>9235234
>between races
looks like it differences between people of different geographic regions, which I have said is a thing. I'm arguing that there is no such thing a "race". The further away too groups are, the more genetic differences they have due to people typically not traveling very far to breed.

Also, i'm sorry, but I don't really understand the axis of the graph.

What if you're cosplaying as a Rhodesian during the Bush War?

>>9235246
>I don't really understand

I can tell.

>>9235246
How the fuck do you think race and evolution works? Those are genetically distinct populations. Strictly speaking since they still are biologically capable of breeding they're still the same species but they are genetically and phenotypically different enough that you could easily consider them subspecies. You can argue whether or not one subspecies is better than the other, or whether it'll hurt someone's feelings if you dress up as a different subspecies, but it's factually incorrect to claim race is purely a social construct.

>>9235249
>provides a graph with literally no reference as to what the axis even is
>is salty when someone asks

https://www.amazon.com/How-Lie-Statistics-Darrell-Huff/dp/0393310728

>>9235255
> provides citation to allow fact checking

This /pol/ discussion... Is this really the hill some of y'all want to die on?
I think my main thinking is,as a black person,it never crossed my mind to idk, paint my skin white for Sailor Moon. Most important thing for me would be to get the outfit correct, wig nicely done and makeup done. Typically look polished and not cringe. So how does this train of thought go through some people's mind of: " I like this character. They are brown. I must turn myself brown?"

>>9235255
>literally no reference

Uh, there is references provided.

>>9235240
It's basically what you all are saying.

>uwu Pikarin is racist
>Gyaru is okay because it's worn everyday

>>9235261
Gyaru is okay because they are living that every day and not trying to be black, instead darkening their skin because it's beautiful to them, while pikarin is being racist by darkening her skin to look like a black person.

>>9235261
Gyaru isn't black face, what Pikarin did is tho.

>came to see the drama

I'm getting out sAVE YOURSELVES

>>9235262
Have you seen the other Kawaii Pateen videos that are about looking like some celeb? They all include matching the skin color and yet only Pikarin gets called racist while it's just what they told her to do.

>>9235258
Thats what gets me. Concentrate on your costumes ffs. People will still know that you're Anthy without slathering yourself in something. Same thing if you were cosplaying Howl.

>>9235274
Because she's trying to be black. Just because she was told to do it doesn't excuse her from being racist.

>>9235262
Yeah, because B-GAL (Black Gal) isn't Japanese people trying to emulate Black people, right?

>>9235260
>>9235256
I meant on the graph or in the textpost. Yes, you can google it and read the 112 page paper but that is unreasonable and you know it. It's not that hard to state what this specific graph is actually measuring.

I'm not even saying your wrong, it looks like a good study. but don't be that guy on facebook who posts graphs because they look like they prove your point with half of the picture buried.

>>9235277
>one racist subtype of a fashion means the entire fashion is that way

K

WE WUZ JAPANESE AND SHEEEIIITT

>>9235277
This girl on the right's hair made me laugh out loud. Wish I could see the rest cause from this small pic I wanna save her haha.

>>9235277
let's just be honest here and admit that gyaru can be pretty racist sometimes. it's ruining everyone's arguments to pretend like they aren't.>>9235277

>>9235254
Because, where is the line to which someone is a different race? two people have different hair color, are they a different race? What if they also have different eye color, height, etc?

Humans have a huge variety of genes, at what point is someone so different that we need to say they are a different race?

>>9235276
Yet nobody complains about the "how to look korean" and other racist tutorials by other people on Kawaii Pateen.

>>9235248
Underrated post

OP
>discussing racism on /pol/
They basically are neo nazis, you would get laughed at

>People getting so triggered over muh racism and cultural appropriashun
Cringe

>>9235290
Because no one brought it up until now. We've been talking about Pikarin and her fuckup and what that entails for everyone else and in general. Multiple people have mentioned to not try to be another race in general but feel free to continue pretending like you don't see that.

>>9235264
Pikarin is a retarded otahime anyway

>>9235290
Nah those are weird too. I do find that amongst my Korean friends there is a style of makeup they prefer (dewy skin, straight brows, etc) but I cringe when I see someone slathering tons of super white bbcream in order to appear like their favorite Kpop idol (this can be debatable too, because my roommate from Shanghai uses too light BBCream, however after talking to her, the cultural reason isn't simply "look western," it is just fairer is prettier. Whole nother topic for another time).

Regardless, you can emulate the makeup tips without all that.

Seriously...are people this hardheaded?
If someone comes out and says to stop pissing on their porch, do you stand there going "But whyyyyyy?"
Just don't do it and everything will be fine. Fine for you and fine for everyone else. Jesus fuck.

>>9235290
You must not lurk in the parts of the internet that I do, because lately any white girl who so much as buys a lip tint is a accused of yellow face and cultural appropriation. So is gyaru makeup, korean straight eyebrows, and circle lenses.

WE

WAZ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkaX6tyq9pI

>Be spic
>brown skin, brown hair, brown eyes
>wear blue/green circle lenses erryday
>wear light hair tones erryday
It's not racist if I do it for fashion like a gyaru, right? Or is it not racist because you can't be racist to white people?

>>9235302
The cultural appropriation card is so strange to me as a poc. Some things are clearly rude to other cultures to do but some things, like circle lenses, straight brows, lip tint, doesn't make sense.
From my experience many of the people yelling cultural appropriation tend to be "white guilt" kind of people. You almost have to be searching for something stereotypical about a race to then call cultural appropriation, or even think you can speak for a culture that isn't yours.

>>9235299
It's not their porch. No one holds the rights to any skin color, no matter what your liberal professor told you in cultural marxism 101.

>>9235244
This is the best counterargument to what I said prior that I have heard yet. Thank you. I still feel differently, but I appreciate you explaining this.

>>9235311
"No one holds any rights to skin color" lmdao - are you the same person who was crying about how we're all just one~ race, the human race~

>>9235311
Did you pull those out of your ~triggered~ word bank?

>>9235308
It's not racist because green and blue eyes are

1. not exclusive to white people
2. you aren't trying to be white(I assume)

Just like it wouldn't be racist for a white girl to think black hair and brown eyes is cute and try and wear those. If she thought it's cute because that's what asian girls look like and she wants to be Asian and she tried to look Asian that's where it gets racist.

>>9235324
I am desperately trying to look white or at least half-white. I dislike my own people and am not proud of my heritage.

>>9235299
Nips don't give a fuck if you wear kimono. The kimono industry loves shekels.

What they are offended by is fat fuck hook nosed white women dressing like a cute 2D girl. In Japan there is at least an attempt to transcend to higher beauty even if you have the wrong face or wrong figure. But in the west's marxist culture slums you can be 400 pounds have a large public mound, spray paint your hair yellow and call yourself Sailor Moon. "Celebrate all cosplayers XD!"

>>9235326
I feel like that is a personal issue that /cgl/ can't help with. Nearly every culture has their ignorance and embarrassments.

>>9235319
>>9235322
Those are great replies, but I'll continue to wear my borderline blackface and no one can sue me because what I said is true. Luckily I live in a racist country so I don't get any social repercussions either.

>>9235330
you sound like such an embarrassing fucking weab

>>9235311
this^
saying "this is MINE, your race isn't allowed to do this!" is racist of it self.

>>9235319
I was, and I'm not sure how that is relevant. We are all individuals, we aren't defined or connected to each other in some spiritual or historic sense.

>>9235322
I just assumed the most likely source for such a retarded way of thinking.

>>9235333
>goes to mcdonalds dressed like this
>calls others embarrassing

stay delusional, tumblr fattass

>>9235334
That comment, your first one, and this one are all stupid. You wanna turn it back around and call it racist because people called you out on your racism for using skin color as a costume? You can't even get your own idea correct in your own mind.

>>9235336
How does this have anything to do with the topic at hand? Nice strawman.

>>9235336
maybe one day glorious nipon will accept you, until then you will just have to deal with the less perfect rest of the world <3

>>9235336
>I would ever step foot inside a McDonald's
>I cosplay
>I'm fat

pls

>>9234933
Because black people are ugly so going as black face is considered making fun of how ugly they are.

Leave the poor sambos alone

>>9235339

Because fat commies who spew out bullshit ideas like "cultural appropriation" are just distracting from the fact that most people are genuinely offended by ugly people such as yourself.

>>9235349
kek

basically this tho if we're being honest about it

>>9235349
2edgy4u

>>9235333
He's right though. Fat bitches need to stop cosplaying. It does as much harm to society as men who expose themselves to children.

>>9235350
>>9235353

>>9235339
Not that guy, but Japanese people do find fat cosplayers offending often, fat shaming is kind of part of their culture since they have a lower incidence of obesity etc.
So it is kind of related to the OP discussion, as if you're fat you shouldn't cosplay in front of Japanese people.

>>9235356
Respect their culture. If they don't want fat women representing their culture that is their right as poc's.

>>9235356
Because they value themselves and haven't been lied to that being unhealthy and overweight is "okay". They still have a classical concept of beauty. The west used to, but they lost it. Interestingly, it's why western weeaboos can't draw animu, and why nips are so good at it. They still understand that being visually appealing isn't completely superficial.

This is the different between cultural marxism and a real culture.

>>9235358
and if you can't figure out why then you're just too stupid to understand

>>9235360
Beautifully worded m8

>>9235360
Spot the japanophile

>>9235043
Asians use eye tape all the time to imitate white people's eye shapes. Is that appropriating white culture?

Or are you one of those racists who believe white people don't have any culture?

so what about dressing up as someone of the opposite sex? I see a lot of women cosplay men and vice versa. How is flattening your chest, or putting balloon under your shirt different than painting your skin? Or is it also offensive.

Better question, what ISN'T offensive? I feel that would be a shorter list.

>>9235418
Miserable women make the rules. Your first mistake was trying to apply logic to female and minority hysterics Kek.

>>9235418
>How is flattening your chest, or putting balloon under your shirt different than painting your skin? Or is it also offensive.
That's empowering you shitlord. The fact that you thought women doing -something- is offensive shows that you're a misogynist and a racist.

>>9235404
Spot the fatty.

>>9234933
>I understand it's wrong
That's it. The end. Next.

>>9235282
It's showing variations in the principle components of population structure, using SNP microarray which pretty much measures differences in certain alleles. The general principle is that the further away a group on the graph is, the more genetic differences there are. The graph shows clear, major differences in several primary components between African, European, East, and South Asian groups.

I guess I'm kind of used to school where it's just assumed you'd read the paper if given a chart and a citation like this, although I guess I should have included the doi, which is 10.1101/gr.085589.108
Though the authors of the paper seem most interested in the genetic differences between different castes in India, which while it doesn't directly say so implies the differences between the major groupings are so major and established they barely warrant a mention. And the possibility that a caste system could have such an impact that it majorly influences human evolution is incredibly interesting desu. That alone would excite most of the people I talk with. And they cite several articles on the topic of Indian castes that were published in Nature, which has a major impact factor.

>>9234933
This thread is OT. Why must we have it every week? 99% of the people who make threads like this don't even frequent this board.

wait, In English you don't use the term species for humans?

>>9235324
>If she thought it's cute because that's what asian girls look like and she wants to be Asian and she tried to look Asian that's where it gets racist.
>>9234967
>offensive, even in a serious context, because you're donning someone's race without having to take on the consequences of being said race.
>>9235138
>you decide to take that and use for a costume is offensive because anything and all the hardships they may have and still be facing are things you can bypass because you can just take it off when you are done.

Going by these logics, then every crossplayer, brolita and drag queen is inherently sexist, mysogynistic and appropriative because men are taking on the trappings of women without dealing with the burdens women face every day. (sexism, fear of sexual assault, catcalls, creepshots, etc) We should call out crossplayers on social media and tell them to stop!


>>9235996
Species is used for humans in english, mostly when using the scientific term homo sapiens. Race is generally used for human groups with visible differences like white/black/asian. Similar to speaking about different breeds of dog, but "race" is never used when speaking about animals for some reason. Race is less fixed in definition and sometimes used for contradicting meanings. For example, "human race" refers to the species.

Cosplay is COSTUME play and not RACE play. It's all about your costume for god's sake! It's not a competition to see who looks like a clone of their favourite anime character etc it's all about dressing up to look like the character using clothes and accessories it's not about pretending to be a different race for the day. And if you realllllly want to look the same as your chosen character PICK ANOTHER ONE! Simple...

It's only bad if you are white or if you are male or if you are heterosexual. Just ignore the special snowflake SJW tumblrites

t. spic

>>9235063
I like how everyone just ignored this post because it's the realest shit in this thread.

>>9235185
but where are you pulling this statement from?

>>9235206
>the thing is, are westerners made fun of on a large scale for having big eyes? no.
yes, that's where big eye animu comes from