/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

>>9151952
I feel like it's probably because anime and related stuff is becoming more popular, which leads to a worse crowd as you get more cancer from normies and crazies.

Children and "tumblrinas".

I've seen a lot of cons going more "family friendly" as of recent. The convention puts a lot of money towards stupid children's activities, along with fucking with rave times. I'm not talking small children either, A lot of pre-teens and teens are fucking it up too. They have a mentality that they're funny and are good at producing things, therefore, they run shitty panels, photoshoots, and let their autism unleash. Now you have these teenage kids doing panels about diversity in cosplay when them themselves are white, or hosting Steven Universe photo shoots. The kids are just rowdy in general. It's like their mother dropped them off and said "fuck it all" for the weekend.

This is all just smaller conventions though. Bigger conventions are probably getting worse by normies, but I can't really figure it out too well.

I also kinda think it's because most people, at least where I'm from, just go there to buy weeb shit. It's just becoming so commercialized. Guess they've just turned it into a money-making machine.

>>9151965
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD4WiLYRQAg

Tumblr

Conventions used to be nerd social events, where all the nerds and shut ins would get together for a weekend to get away from the "normies", dress up like our favorite anime and game characters, talk about japanese stuff, buy japanese stuff and be general otaku before the term weeb was invented (yes, there were weebs back then, but we didn't call them weebs)

Now along comes social media, and mostly the popularity of facebook after Myspace and the scene era was dying down. Suddenly, this shit is spreading like wildfire. Not only are the nerds pre-2006/2008 getting involved, but their friends, their families. Also, keep in mind that before this period of time, people who were into anime had to go through great lengths to obtain it. Either trading 12th generation VHS tapes where you could barely watch them, and writing fics in snail mail fanzines, and eventually having binders of fansubs that you'd copy from your nerd friends. You had to have connections. Your gateway may have been on TV as some of the early series like Starblazers or Astroboy, or Sailor moon and Pokemon. I'm from the latter of these two. Keep in mind that most people that I graduated with considered these shows to be kids cartoons and would rather be watching Dawson's Creek around that time.

Now we've got Crunchyroll, Netflix (my normal af former manager was talking about watching anime on TV with her kids), nobody buys DVDs anymore, it's all streamed and easy to get ahold of.

CONT!

>>9152330
Suddenly all these Marvel movies start being pumped out within the last few years. Comic Cons have been a thing for a long time, but they are getting more and more attention. This is also around the time (end of 2000's start of 2010's) that you start to see less anime and more western media at conventions. Not to mention the whole anime industry reaching its peak in 07-08 and then begins to decline. A few good series here and there (Madoka, AoT, Kill la Kill etc) but it's nothing compared to what was being produced in the 90's and 00's.

Conventions used to be rare and cosplayers/fans would travel across the country to tiny shows of less than a thousand people. By 2007 good sized big convention, excluding AX is around 15,000 people. Otakon reaches the ballpark of 30,000+ (my first in was 4k, in todays terms, that is a small show not worth going to) Back then, a Storm trooper at an anime convention would look strange, and they did! How many Star Wars cosplayers did you see at your local con this year?

Suddenly, conventions just aren't events for a niche group of nerds with niche interests. Instead, these nerd things are trendy. Pokemon Go is popular with middle-aged white suburban "normie" couples. Old ladies ask if I'm at "comic con" when they encounter a lolita meetup.

Oh and Heroes of Cosplay, that helped too.

CONT (last post of my rambling I swear)

>Self proclaimed Cosplay stars making drama
>People wearing slutty outfits to family friendly events and then getting mad when told to change or leave
>Tumblr
>Tumblr safe zones popping up everywhere
>Price inflation on tickets of smaller cons
>People with shitty bodypaint ruining hotel furniture
Thats all I can think of at the moment.

Maybe it's because you've moved on from your yester years where everything was new and impressive. Now it really takes something amazing and specifically tailored to your tastes to impress you. Which is unlikely to happen with a large con.

>>9152342
I dont think thats true.

I see almost nothing even slightly impressive at smaller cons

but people get really creative for Dragoncon and the like. Theres almost always some giant super detailed mecha or dragon or something at bigger cons that people have been working on for years that are mindblowing.

>>9152339
So suddenly, conventions are inundated by normal people looking to get laid. Skimpy cosplays... these have always been around, always. However, now this is what people see and think of when it comes to conventions, not just things happening on the sidelines.

There have also always been room parties. I remember going to some at my first conventions, but they were laid back and chill, a bit of drinking some pizza and having a good time with friends or making new ones. Some conventions turn into outright drunken party cons.

Also, the crowds have gotten younger, more families and younger teens. I remember a time where teenagers or children were a rare sight. Social media and tumblr has had an impact, but personally, I don't feel it's as detrimental as the "mainstream" popularity of it all.

When it comes to merchandise you can buy at cons, it's all overpriced taobao. Back in the day we had Wizzywig, cell dealers, manga dealers, DVDs and VHS as far as the eye could see, tons of figures, snacks, plush, wallscrolls... I was just at Otakon. Saw less than that (and some not at all) but lots of the same stuff everywhere.

For one, I like that there's a lot of variety in the media being cosplayed these days and stuff I can find in the dealers room and artist alley. But some of the attendees that show up now, not so much. Hopefully sometime in a few years, the novelty of it will die off and things might start to normalize a little bit.

>>9151963
>anime and related stuff is becoming more popular
I barely see anything anime related at cons anymore, it's all western series and webcomics now. Even anime conventions have become more mixed.

>>9152341
Personally, I don't see an issue with having a safe/quiet space at cons and I think it'd benefit a lot of con-goers to have that since lmao, nerds tend to suffer from social anxiety pretty frequently.

>>9152356
I dont mind if theres like 1, but the last con I went to had atleast 3

>>9151952
I've found that most small, local cons are overpopulated by teens and families. They cater to a younger crowd. So, you're going to get dumb Tumblr panels or a million events for Undertale or SU. I've only enjoyed one local con and it was a comic con so much older audience and better panels. Also, better costume quality and people that I could actually hold a decent conversation with.

For me, bigger cons just attract a wider variety of people. Yeah, everything's getting a bit more mainstream but I honestly don't see that as a bad thing. I've never gone to cons to shop so none of that matters to me. I'm in it for the cosplay and I've seen people churn out more impressive work as the years have gone on. Because it's getting much bigger, there are more materials and tutorials available and more people are able to showcase their skills.

What ruins cons for me really is just people acting like idiots, which happens more at smaller cons. Teens don't really know how to behave like civilized people,especially at cons. I avoid most of the local anime cons like the plague.

>>9152363
What was the size of the con, though? Like, if you've got a HUGE con, having more than one space like that's going to be necessary so it doesn't get crowded.

If it's a small con, then more than one is likely overkill. If there's thousands of people, more than one is going to be necessary.

>>9151952
I have found that my big local con gets more boring every year. I think it's a combination of
>same stalls every year
>I'm not into the new generation of shonenshit like I was the old big three, and most merch is now SAO, SnK, or Fairy Tail related
>more and more overcrowded
>more focus on stuff I'm not into (TV shows, wrestling, LoL etc)
>I don't cosplay much anymore
>my old congoing gang has mostly split up (people moved out of the country for uni, or we just haven't kept in touch)
>I don't recognize most of the local cosplay community anymore, whereas I used to know pretty much everyone
I've basically gotten old and out of touch.

That said, there's a smaller local con which has drastically improved over the last three or so years and which I still thoroughly enjoy. Even though it's smaller, it's much more focused to my interests than the bigger con, and most of the attendees are old faces in the community. Better guests too.

>>9152374
it was like between small and medium, it only has like 2 floors and an outside area though

>>9152380
Three is a bit much, but I'd say ideally having one on both floors would be a good plan for quiet/safe spaces. Three is too many.

>oh no! cons no longer cater to me and my needs because i've moved out of the age group!

Get a fucking hold of yourselves. Cons are going to try and cater to what's popular. Sorry that you're too old and into niche stuff? Cons need to make money and they die out when they can't. SAO, SnK, comics, "nerdy things", cartoons, are all really popular and honestly would be a dumb business choice for a small con to try and limit themselves. Maybe once a con gets a little more situated they can be more choosey.

Small cons survive by 1) timing and 2) catering. The only small cons I've seen die locally is because of those two. They either timed it during other bigger cons and couldn't profit or became too niche and weren't able to draw a big enough crowd.

>>9151963
It is the complete opposite. Western cartoons, webcomics and such have become such a focal point that anime conventions are just that in name anymore. There is more people because media is easier to obtain, you can read almost anything online or watch things on crunchyroll, opposed to having to buy it in the store or torrenting stuff from like irc and downloading seperate files for subs. It's also the overall attitude of the tumblr generation. I'm not sure if that makes sense, but just their sheer focus on race and gender in media that it's very hard to talk about anything regarding fandom without any of that coming up in excess. Fandom has evolved and as a result, so have cons.

>>9151952
I think it's less to do with the incorporation of western cartoons and webcomics and more to do with the current mainstream obsession with "nerd culture"
the resurgence of cape movies catered to the general public, shows like TBBT popularizing conventions and the universal appeal of things like Pokemon GO and retooled cartoons from the 80s and 90s
basically, anime conventions aren't a 'super sekrit club' from outsiders anymore

>>9152470
>but muh super secret club
Nerd culture being mainstream now completely killed it but if the people getting into comics/anime/cosplay dont really like what they are buying/reading/watching/cosplaying then its going to go to shit and the culture and products of this change in popularity and direction are going to be shit. Nobody wants shit. People are now debating on weather its legit ok to cosplay a character without even knowing their source material at all. Cosplaying is literally dressing up as your favorite character and making it as good as you can as an homage to the character. To be cute. To celebrate the anime or comic you thought was so cool. It used to mean something and now people dont seem to still have the special magic otaku secret club feels anymore. Makes me sad yo.

>>9152499
There have always been people who ask whether it's 'ok' to cosplay something from a source they aren't familiar with. Take off your nostalgia goggles.

>>9152346
When it comes to shit sold at cons, I feel like it's getting really homogenized by the weird bleed over from other conventions.

It feels like all anime cons are just becoming generic nerd conventions, with Star Wars, Marvel, steampunk shit, bronies, and the worst of all: SuperWhoLock tumblrcunt faggots who ruin fucking everything. They're less bad than when Homestuck was huge, but I still wish they'd go away forever.

And then you go to the dealer's hall and you see the same t-shirt fortress, the same half dozen leather dealers selling the same shit, the same 2 or 3 cybergoth booths, too many damned places selling those awful Pop Vinyl figures, the occasional steampunk store of ugly hats with stupid goggles on them... Oh, and the fucking mystery box booth. That shit is everywhere now, too.

normies. normies ruined it.

but like anon said above, when i go to an anime con and i see dc/marvel comic shit it pisses me off. all that space could have been used for more anime merch. half the boths sell the same things too.

otakuthon had a lot less figures than i was expecting, but maybe i just have weird standards.

>>9151976
jesus what a special snowflake he is, calling people he doesn't know bitch on the internet

i've reported the video to youtube

The issue with comes near me is more that they cater to perverted men a lot more than women even though they outnumber them quite a lot. They pander to one of the worst and embarrassing parts of anime fandom. Every quiz will be about ecchi anime series and ignore shoujo or josei, they're organized by guys in their thirties who know all anime from the nineties so if you aren't into ecchi anime from the nineties though luck. Hentai dub over panels and the like will make the room smell like jizz the day after. Panels are hosted by awkward guys who just make awkard sex jokes. Things like j-fashion and j-pop can get no representation at cons. And there are now so many guys that only come to take pictures of the pretty girls in the hope they fall in love with them that they flood the hallways stalking girls around not caring about their cosplays.

i think a lot of it is the fact that there's a new con and nerd boom right now. A LOT of new cons are popping up all over the fucking place and its creating more competition.
Kids or teens will go to the smaller cons bc they're cheaper or closer so the better cons loose some of their crowds and have to cut back on stuff.
To say on topic or to stay relevant, they have to add more and more fandom stuff thats not anime related. Also, anime fans are usually fans of other stuff too, so this isn't always a terrible thing (depends who's running what).
I went to a small not very good comic con to help advertise an anime con and no one had heard of the anime con even though it was a much more established and bigger con.
To survive, anime cons need to get these non-anime specific fans to stay alive.

>>9152536

This. There will always be good panels and shit panels in varying proportion, and annoying people. Dealer curation can make or break a con. Anime North this year had one of the worst dealer halls I have ever seen, almost entirely shirts, pop vinyls and vidya. There was one booth selling back volumes of manga, and they had limited stock. There was a fuckhuge booth selling back issues of Marvel comics. So, so unbalanced.

>>9152548
Preach.

>>9152375
Yeah Armageddon is so boring now.

>>9152339
kill la kill is fucking garbage tho

>>9152646
Haha, how'd you know?

>>9152647
Please anon, tell us all about your enthralling and objectively correct opinions that no one disagrees with.

>>9152683
>same stalls every year
>more and more overcrowded
>more focus on stuff I'm not into (TV shows, wrestling, LoL etc)
>my old congoing gang has mostly split up (people moved out of the country for uni, or we just haven't kept in touch)
>I don't recognize most of the local cosplay community anymore, whereas I used to know pretty much everyone

I think all of the old NZ cosplay peeps feel this way.

>>9152711
True, it's pretty sad.

At least Overload is fun.

>>9151976
who the fuck is this negro. baka. baka, baka,

I think these days with Conventions rapid growth its hard to get a good balance.
My smaller local conventions are legit autism fests full of 12 year old kids and late 20 year olds who are just trying cosplay and buy their wigs from Poundland (britfag sorry). The huge cons like MCM London are shit fests, terrible organisation and full of normies, less autism than smaller conventions I feel but I fucking hate MCM London because it's the same as every single other mcm con out there just overcrowded to the max and full of "my cosplay is better than yours" cunts.

I'd love to see a Con that pops up that is just a chill old-school con. No fucking Homestuck, Steven Universe cancer running around and pushing autism into my face. No shit-tier guests that no one gives a shit about ( i always feel super bad for them when they have no one asking for autographs). 90% of cons are litreally no where to chill and sit down for an hour to calm down from the cons business so people are forced to sit of sticky floor blocking peoples way since they have no other choice.
Panels are something I rarely attend and when I do they're shit-tier or cringe, every con needs to step up their panel game to be honest.
"cosplay guests" - fucking stop. Don't take a local cosplayer with 1k likes and call them famous, no one cares about them, they may have an interesting costume but its nothing special.
FUCKING STOP MAKING MASQUERADE JUDGES NONE COSPLAYERS. This is more of a smaller con issue but I have seen so many masquerades with their random Z-list celebs judging a con with a £1k prize pool. They know nothing and judge with a complete bias mind, craftsmanship goes out the window.

>>9152349
where I'm at it's the opposite where the Comic cons have gotten more anime into it,

However any convention that subjects tv/books/comics/gaming/maybe movies will have anime/manga in them

I feel like most cons have started trying to appeal to everyone to make the most cash, but now they are starting to hit the point where they are going to lose the people who originally came for whatever the cons original focus was (anime/comics/etc.).

As an aside, the older I get, the less I give a shit about anime. I'm not sure if this is because it seems like you can't find a new series with a protagonist older than 18 these days or because my tastes are changing. Either way, I definitely find myself gravitating more towards general sci-fi or gaming cons rather than anime cons these days.

>>9152392
Are there any cons out there that focus solely on anime/Japanese stuff in general? I'm not even going to act like I'm not being some weeaboo elitist here. I'm just so tired of western shit.

For me, the cost of attending cons is getting more expensive. The big examples are Dragoncon (good luck getting a cheap hotel) or SDCC/NYCC (good luck even getting tickets)

For the combined total cost of going to these big cons you can take a nice vacation outside the US.

>>9152548
Not to mention the amount of guys who go just looking to find a gf/get laid and end up being creepy lurkers through out the con.

>>9152774
>FUCKING STOP MAKING MASQUERADE JUDGES NONE COSPLAYERS.

Fucking this. I've seen shit-tier cosplayers announcing they're guesting and judging at a con. At least have people who have experience crafting. Have a balance of textile and armour skilled cosplayers judging.

Not some pleb who sees "I built this armour in a week" and thinks it's impressive when it's not even sealed and half the paint has already flaked off.

Yes I'm speaking from past experience and I'm salty as fuck.

The constant allowing of SJW panels. Like come on keep it to fucking tumblr I just wanna see interesting panel topics again. I'm tired of Woe is Me or My Gender Identity at the Con, and so on. No one likes them. Then turn out is always just tumblrina types that just whine and bitch the entire time. Like come on, Dash Con wasn't clue enough it's a bad idea?

From the posts here it's mostly about US cons, right? I noticed that in the local con in my French city, it feels very different depending on whether the con takes place in April or in Winter (which is the regular edition). In April there are more weebs and less normies than during the Winter edition, because they're trying to make the Winter edition family friendly and focused more on Japan's and some chosen Asian country's cultures in general. And making it family friendly is pretty easy for them because the tickets are cheap in the first place but if the kids are young enough, they can enter the con center for free.

Meanwhile, I remember that in one of the cons in April, they invited a hentai artist like it was nothing and most booths were run by professionals who sell vidya and anime merchandises, cosplay and jfashion clothes and accessories and fanworks. Whereas in Winter alot of booths sell really kimonos and yukatas, pottery, more traditional things.

Personally I like both editions of the cons in general but I have a big preference for the April one. The atmosphere is different, it's more fun, and I felt that the Winter edition is less and less interesting overall. Sometimes during the Winter one I have clueless parents and normies asking me why people are disguised and looking stupid, and why there are so many nerds because they think I'm as clueless as them (because I don't cosplay I guess), it's annoying as fuck.

Sorry for rambling like that, my post isn't very coherent.

>>9152647
so is Aot, but many people like both and they're the new generation gateway anime along with tokyo ghoul and one punch meme

>>9152356
I don't mind rest areas since cons can be pretty exhausting mentally and physically. But calling them "safe spaces" really sounds stupid.

>>9152346
>drinking some pizza
sorry but I laughed

>>9152951
You need a couple of each kind of cosplayer, from the armor guy, to the prop guy, to the electronics guy, to the frilly seamstress.

I've seen far too many contest go to unamazing costumes because one of the judges was awestruck by the person's ability to sew something that wasn't from a pattern or because someone strung up a few simple LEDs into their costume from an ebay kit.

Really, you just need people who know what kind of shit is impressive and difficult and what isn't. The guy who creams his jeans because a prop lights up shouldn't be a judge anymore than the girl who squeals like a retard when she sees a cute dress.

>>9152967
This.

Quiet rooms are a good idea. Cosplay lounges, etc, are good ideas.

Instead we're getting "minority only safespaces". The entire con is supposed to be a safe space from mundanes, don't bring your normie political arguments in here and force them on us.

>>9152346
I thought the shitty taobao things were just a thing on my shitty country where you can't get real merch. Sad to know it is like that on the US as well.
I think they sell it because it is cheaper and you get more money for it though. What a shame.

>>9151976
there's literally nothing wrong with what this guy did. he's describing the kind of people we DONT want at cons: ass-talking tumblerinas

>>9152390
One of my local cons does the opposite. They pretty much catered to older fans. They pretty much posted a list of panels they wanted to see run rather than take applications. It was a mess.

>>9152971
>don't bring your normie political arguments in here and force them on us
This
Political shit should be banned from cons. It's an anime con after all. If you want to talk about good female anime characters, sure. If you want to talk about black characters in anime, okay that's cool. If you want to talk about real confirmed LGTB anime characters (not the THEY DID THIS UNRELATED THING SO THEY MUST TOTES BE GAY BI ACE OR TRANS GEEE shit), well, you're into something but it is still related.

But talking about the importance of tumblr in our society and how we should kill the patiarchy and how everyone is beautiful and shit is very stupid. It's not anime related. At all.

I think all these posts mostly has to do with cons becoming sellouts and trying to cash out in this nerd craze. That's why u see more western media in ur anime cons and more anime in ur western cons because every con is no longer trying to appeal to the nitche crowd but to the general public. And along with the general public comes with a lot of shit people who actually don't care for the media but are using cons as a weekend outing so you have less sense of a community. This drives up ticket, hotel, and parking costs and makes it more difficult to see guests because longer lines (in the case of anime expo the need to buy more tickets).

>>9152339
>a few good series
>Kill la Kill
sorry about your shit taste bro

>>9152548
What fucking rock have you been living under? con sluts have burlesque, cosplay belly dancing and your stupid "social constructs and ripping down the patriarchy with exposed tit fat" panels. The rest is aimed general audience. Just because you hate lewd panels does not mean they are aimed at men. God damnit your supposed empowering burlesque bullshit is more aimed at men then some awkward weeb making fun of bible black panel.

>>9152955
The hardest part would be finding a way to filter out all these shitty tumblr panels in the first place.

A lot of cons do first come first serve with panel sign up, but others are so starved for programming that they'll let anyone run a panel even if the person is only doing it to get a free badge.

If I were in charge, the first things to get rejected would be anything blatantly non-anime, followed by anything the puts identity politics or bullshit controversies as their top priority, followed by tutorial or workshop panels by people who have no kind of portfolio or proof of skill.

The focus should be to get good panels that make people want to come. You don't want a bunch of 15 year olds on stage gushing about their Steven Universe ships. You want interesting shit. Industry veterans and professionals. Artists and musicians.

Fan panels were fine 20 years ago when not everyone had the internet and people wanted a place to go to talk about their favorite series with other fans, but that shit is completely obsolete now.

>>9152958
Où ?

>>9152958
>>9153061
Heh. Toulouse I guess ?

I found the TGS better than most Paris cons. more room for stuff. less crowded. less people, but also less shitty cosplay and better ambiance.

>>9152958
Alexia?

>>9153042
Queef a pearl.

From a con running perspective, what's killing cons are comic cons as well as too many anime cons. Comic cons charge for guest autographs/photos. I can't even begin to tell you how many agents are now asking that of anime cons. I feel like Wizard world is setting a terrible standard. I wish the general populace could understand that I cant just reach out and get Matt Smith at our event without it costing them money too. That whole charging for guest autographs and photos thing is leaking more and more into the anime community. Typically most cons do at least a couple autographs for free however that seems to be changing.

>>9153078
It's been pointed out in this thread, but so much shit is getting really samey or not at all worth paying for.

Same shitty fan panels. Same shitty dealer's hall. Same shit cosplay contests where bad judges hand out awards arbitrarily.

When there's a convention or three every week, it just doesn't feel like it's worth it to go to any of them. Even the biggest ones only seem to get so many attendees because lots of people go out of habit and go to see their friends.

>>9153065
Lyon, but close enough I guess. Only went to Japan Expo in Paris once,it was too crowded but it had actual big booths and artist alley so it was worth it.

>>9153068
No.

>>9152330
>>9152339
>>9152346

I agree 100%, and I feel like I am part of the problem. I have never cosplayed and I feel bad for it. I'm 31 years old and I've been to alot of anime cons in my day. I remember the days where the dealers rooms had shit worth buying and people would actually cosplay anime.

I also do show up for the con night life these days. Big cons + nightlife with other nerds = fun. I do goto these cons to get away from normalfags but at the same time I contribute to the problem. I can be drunk at a con and still talk to you about why x anime is better then y anime and go really into why I have such opinions.

>>9152814

I can't speak for you, but I also feel like anime is losing its appeal. Its not that I'm getting out of it but anime these days is just trash is all. I can find an 80s/90s series I never heard of, watch it and still have that feeling of "this is fucking awesome" from when I was younger. New anime can't seem to do that for me.

>>9152948

I wound up having sex with a girl I met this past Otakon, her and I were talking about the fact that these cons were a way to get away from normalfags and hang out with other nerds. We both agreed that meeting another nerdy person similar to you and getting more intimate with them is probably one of the key reasons anime cons exist in the first place.

The point being, don't be mad at guys that are into the hobby AND looking for women, be mad at the normalfags who ghost cons to find cosplay sluts.

>>9152955

THIS

This was the 3rd Otakon in a row I saw some panels about gender or feminism in anime or some shit. Now, maybe these panels attract people but what is the point of them? Are they really supposed to make me think about how the portrayal of cartoon women is sexist or something? fuck outta here.

>>9153043

I would gladly volunteer to help you out with your con with those rules.

>>9152375
You just hit the nail on the head. I hardly care about "this season's popular anime", I can't stand my local cosplay community due to all the pointless drama and how intolerant they have become to criticism, all the events and workshops are pretty much the same every time, and the cons here are now only a shell of what they once were as things went "full commercial". It used to be weird to see a paid lecture, now it's the norm with the hosts often being two unknown shits who don't even know what they are talking about (just hot glue everything and it will be fine).
Honestly, the only reason I still go to cons is because it's the only time our entire group is back together, something which has became nearly impossible as we all started settling down.

>>9153170
>pointless drama

Are you from north texas cuz i feel like youre from north texas

>>9153043
>A lot of cons do first come first serve with panel sign up, but others are so starved for programming that they'll let anyone run a panel even if the person is only doing it to get a free badge.

With cons like that, run your own panel!

I feel like a lot of cons are offering a lot less content while hiking up badge costs. Unless you're bringing in bigger guests, renting out more panel rooms, or having new events it just feels like price gouging.

My states formerly biggest con does this shit every year. This past year you only got a shitty wristband for a $60 3 day pass and they charged $10 more for an actual laminated con badge on a lanyard.
This con has not had new guests or new events in YEARS either.

>>9153178
Nope, mainland Europe. Then again pointless drama has infected nearly every cosplay community out there, so I can see why you might think that. These days if you don't sugar coat everything you say to the point of pure diabetes, you're bound to get involved into some meaningless drama. After all, how you dare you not blindly support someone and instead give her pointers so she can improve her skills, am I right?

>>9153244
The dfw community is so damn toxic, i imagine its basically the same everywhere, i just see mindless bullshit on fb every day it seems. And its always over some petty shit, like girl a cosplayed the same thing that girl b did and girl a hates girl b for other reasons, so it turns into a pissong contest between girl a and b. Cosplay drama is such bullshit. Not to mention to luxedolls drama, dont know what happened with that.

most of you outgrew everything, you are no longer the target market. That's all there is to it

>>9152897
To be honest, no. Despite cons like Otakon sticking to their charter, even if in name something is an anime con, the guests themselves bring the western cosplay and the demand for western panels.

Since when is "white" an insult

>>9153144
Anon you replied to and yea i hear you. I try to mix things up as far as panels but there's only so much I can do. It's really just too many cons going on. Heck even booking our event was annoying as fuck. We had to look at which con it was by and any dates we chose we'd be interfering with another con. I think that some of these smaller cons won't last too long though. It all depends on who's running the event along with staff. We'll see what happens.

>>9153277
Honestly, I've grown out of anime cons and I have much more fun at comic cons now. Most anime I just don't have the patience for anymore and I don't find it appealing. Most small anime cons are overrun by teens which, of course, it's geared towards them. I still enjoy my older anime and every once in awhile I'll find a new show that interests me but I no longer call myself an anime fan. I've decided that this was my last year going to anime cons.

>>9153355
"White" is tumblrs version of "Normie"

not really an insult, just implies that you're an asshole that snubs people/things for being different and tumblrs version implies that their "different" is usually skin color and/or culture

often times it is referred to someone being racist/prejudice
if someone makes a "IM A STUUUROOONG BLACK WOOMAN and I AINT NEED NO MAN" joke some might say "wow, that person is really white"

Just went to a Theory Of Trigger panel over the weekend at matsuricon and what I got was a Masculinity vs. Feminism panel featuring Gurren Lagann and Kill la kill. That was a turn off and some panels were just legitimately not ready or horrible public speakers.
Some were really good though and the reason to keep going back is to meet people in real life that like the same things you do. I can't settle for online only. You get the chance to buy the things you like and I always end up adding a few shows to my watch list.

>>9153043
I was talking about this on another thread a few weeks back, but my solution was coincidental. The con I've been brought on to help with is aligned quite closely with a lot of community groups - many of which are focused on mental health, disability, and youth services. We simply can't risk tumblr panels because they're not run by professionals and we can't look like we or the organisations are endorsing them.

Here in Vancouver it's a fucking mess of too many horribly run cons competing with each other. AE this weekend was so horribly organized I don't think a single staff member knew that they had a convention to run. And then artists having to choose between so many different shit tier conventions (AE, MiniComi, Summer Fest, NihonFest) and AR which is double the price for a table than any con the same size in Canada.
I've just given up on this province.

>>9153517
Personally, I find MiniComi a kind-of success -- it fulfills its role as a free (emphasis on this), small-scale artist-oriented event so I'm good with that.

Just for a bit of positivity: what cons get it right, or what sort of things do certain cons get right?

>>9153572
Make your own thread. This one is for bitching.

>>9153277
I wish I even knew where to start with planning a con, and I wish I had enough money to waste that I could make an anime/J-fashion/Japanese videogames only convention. No comics. No K-Pop. Pure weeb paradise.

>>9152971
>>9152988
What about a lot of anime that is charged with gender and social politics? Wouldn't the best way to be honoring involve talking about the same issues that they address?

>>9153043
Alright say a con put these things into practice and barely got enough panels submissions, now they're screwed.

The reasons why cons have shit panels is that others either don't bother learn how to do good panels or the people who can do good panels don't show up.

In short the con attendees have only themselves to blame

>>9153595
What anime is charged with gender and social politics exactly?

Hard mode: no fapbait thinly disguised as muh empowerment or tumblr delusion headcanons

>>9153042
No con near me has any panels like that, we have hentai panels, hentai AMV and hentai dub overs and such but nothing like what you describe aimed at women. And I wasn't talking about lewd panels, never did I even refer to them, I was talking about general panels that always have a virginal male host who's type of humor is lame sex jokes like "that's what she said". My complaint about hentai panels is that the cons tolerate perverts masturbating during them to the point the room becomes unusable for the next panel.

Also the closest thing I've heard of like "burlesque panel" was a con that wanted cosplay strippers so I don't think that was meant to empowering to the female con goer.

>>9153618
Wandering Son?

>>9152540

>>9153658
I'll give you that one, but in saying that I don't know anyone who'd want to discuss it at a con

>>9153658
I wouldn't say that series is charged with any kind of politics at all. It's all quite mellow and reasonable about the whole topic of transitioning.

There's a reason why tumblr SJWs have very little to say about the gender bender subgenre and it's because they either don't know it exists, or if they do, it doesn't mesh with their "FUCK WHITE PEOPLE SMASH DA PATRIARCHY" type of politics.

outside there being the 'too many cons' argument, I wanted to also note that of late i've seen many attendees who think we can pander to their every need.
>running dept for a con
>sitting at the table for closing ceremonies listening to what attendees are suggesting
>con director points to a girl in the front row
>no binding, just dressing very tomboyish
>she was raising her hand
>Con director: Yes, ma'am you in the front here
>Girl starts to erupt into tears while her friends console her
>everyone else in the room including us are confused
>girl starts to exclaim how "This is the reason we have gender identity issues in society"
>tells us that she's not a woman and her pronoun is something different
>never tells us what the pronoun is even after asking
>just continues crying and making a scene
>eventually calms down and tells us what she would like to see
>she wants to see us make badges that are red, yellow, and green
>that way people who dont feel comfortable with being touched/hugged dont have to say so
>she thinks that we could just go up to the registration line to get a new badge whenever we felt uncomfortable

I just thought of how clogged the reg lines would be as well as how expensive it would be to make 3 times the amount of badges we currently have.

a few months after the con
>riding with a friend down to a different con
>i bring up said story with what happened at our closing ceremonies
>him: Oh yea i know, her or should i say "Z"
>me: What?
>him: Yea she gets upset when people dont use the pronoun "Z"
>me: What...does that even mean?
>him: I dont know, i asked politely and she got upset. She gets upset at everyone for not knowing and makes scenes every time.
>me: Wow.

>>9153737
Adding to this story, according to the guy who rode down with me to the other con said this girl likes to wear a hat with the letter "Z" on it. She apparently shouts at people and points to the hat as well.

>>9153737
People like this need serious help. There isn't anything wrong with being trans but fuck sake there are 2 fucking genders. You're either Gender Fluid Or a Man/Woman. Parents really need to shut this "z" shit down as soon as the see it pop up, it unhealthy and just fucking annoying for everyone.

>>9153355
Since the new, degraded form of Social Justice that SJW practice gained mainstream media acceptance. Now it's not only enough for white folks to be working and advocating for the disadvantaged - you have to be actively ashamed for what ever advantages other white people might have, even if you don't get to share in them, and constantly apologize for them.

>>9153572
>>9153576
>Make your own thread. This one is for bitching.

Good idea for a thread, actually.

>I wish I even knew where to start with planning a con,

Also a good idea for a thread. Though I'd say start by volunteering with an established con you like, and working your way to ops level positions, so you have a clue how cons are organized and run. Otherwise, you could wind up with your very own Dashcon.

>>9153737
I'd like to suggest a card for her and friends.

>>9153798
>>9153737
My best friend is turning into one of these people and it's just a constant struggle. She got angry with one of our friends for referring to her as she even though she never told him that she wanted to be referred to as they/them.

I don't care about calling people whatever they want to be called but at some point you have to understand that not everybody is going to instantly know what pronouns you've decided to choose this week. There's someone I follow on Instagram that updates their profile almost every month with a new pronoun that they want people to use and I don't even know what to refer to them as anymore. Ran into them at a con and went out of my way to avoid using any specific terms because I was afraid of a blow-up.

>>9153881
Dashcon's main problem was that they didn't have good communication or experience. Some of their fandom committee mods were as young as 13 and the admins themselves had no idea how to budget or even be rational with their money. They paid thousands of dollars just to fly one of the admins in for the con - money that could have been better used to actually pay for the guests they'd booked. It's kind of funny just how manipulative everyone was but also wildly incompetent at the same time.

>>9153737
also, I have heard of cons doing something like a "stoplight" system but it wasn't an entirely separate badge. It was either something already attached to the badge or some kind of sticker that you could flip to whatever color. I think it's a good idea in theory but it's way too hard to implement effectively.

>>9153897
Being manipulative seems to be a requirement for SHW types,

>>9153897
Being manipulative seems to be a requirement for SJW types.

>>9153737
>>9153896
An otherwise excellent con last year invented a new rule that panelists and moderartors need to address invidiuals in the audience in gender neutral terms only, so they don't risk offending an attendee who doesn't look like the gender they think they're presenting as.

I am most annoyed by cons turning into lots of parties/drinking along with boudoir and swimsuit shoots from cosplayers wanting attention on their cosplay page.

>>9153896
I wish this pronoun meme would go away already

>>9153618
Kill la Kill represents the religous conflict taking place in Japan

http://www.studyofanime.com/2014/04/inspirations-kill-la-kill-and.html

Meanwhile you have Grave of the Fireflies which could be seen as either an anti-war movie or a glorification of the struggles of Japan's war torn generation to be used as a tool to garner respect from the youth

>>9153627
>My complaint about hentai panels is that the cons tolerate perverts masturbating during them to the point the room becomes unusable for the next panel.

Then that's the con's fault for running a shitty hentai room. Any con worth their salt runs does a hand check and sweeps the room with a blacklight. That stuff does wonders in preventing people from fapping.

>Also the closest thing I've heard of like "burlesque panel" was a con that wanted cosplay strippers so I don't think that was meant to empowering to the female con goer.

First of all burlesque is way different from stripping, second many female con goers go to these shows and third, many con burlesque tropes have girls of different shapes sizes and ethnicities so yes....many do find it empowering

>>9154003
Miyazaki grew up in the post Hiroshima-bombing era. A lot of his movies include small references to things like that. Grave of Fireflies obviously. Kiki's Delivery Service is set in an alternate Europe in the 50s where World War II never occurred. I believe The Wind Rises takes place during ww2 but I havn't seen it yet, Many of movies are anti-war in general.
A lot of anime is influenced by ww2 like that. That would make for an interesting panel.

>>9153933
So, people having fun annoys you? I don't get why people have an issue with others drinking. If they're not bothering you, why do you care?

Also, boudoir and swimsuit photoshoots aren't new.

>>9154022
That is true. It's just with Grave of the Fireflies was made with huge intention of making the younger generation respect their elders. You could argue that is more of a propaganda piece than a story

https://youtu.be/-TuvoRVR2FY?t=9m14s

>>9153618
Zankyō no Terror has some major post WWII amd generational differences going on in it. Like you know how Japan's military was basically neutered following WWII... And the current governmemt of the country has been trying to change that so that theor military can be used for more then defense. This has been met with protests from younger generations.

Also Mawaru Penguindrum was imfluenced heavily by the Sarin Gas Attack. Like way more then i initially realized after reading more about Aum Shinrikyo.

>>9154037
>unironically linking Bennett the Sage
kys

>>9153933
>I have issues with what people do in hotel sights that are off con grounds!

>>9154005
You don't need to tell me that they're running it shitty, it's why I'm posting it in this thread.

And I brought up stripping because that's what cons near me have. I have never even heard of a con having burlesque show. I know damn well stripping isn't empowering and no where did I imply it was. How do you fail this much at reading comprehension?

>>9154052
>>Influenced by
Literally is an AU version of that attack. The whole show in general has a crazy amount of political commentary, and most if not all is lost on (the majority of) western audiences, which is really unfortunate.

>>9154037
The main intended statement of that film was the harmful aspects of pride. This has been stated over and over by the creators and is deeply resonating/important to those who grew up during wartime, as well as being a vaguely radical counterstatement so a society that values pride so highly. "Obey your elders" is a small part of that, but to say it's the main point greatly misrepresents the film.

>>9154124
I doubt your cons are hiring strippers. Most cons have burlesque shows. I've never heard of any con paying strippers. I'm gonna call bullshit unless you have proof.

I think trans people & nonbinary trans people especially get a bad rap because you only ever see the batshit insane people, who probably aren't even trans to begin with. Pronoun shit is usually not a big deal when it's unobtrustive. I write it on my name badge or pin a button to the badge lanyard. Tah dah, problem solved, no angst required.

More on topic, cons really need to screen their panels better. I was recently at a Cosplay 101 panel where the panelist said it wasn't necessary to seal body paint. What the fuck. No panel is better than an actively inaccurate panel. I know it's more work for the staff, but panelists should be required to submit their credentials for informative panels.

>>9153355
SJW here, never seen it used as an insult, even ironically. Dunno where people got the idea that it is.

>>9154137
>because I've never heard of it, it's not true
My local con has a cosplay strip show as part of its adult programming where they hire 2 professional strippers who just happen to be anime fans.
They also have panels like stripping 101 (last year) or how to look good naked.

http://www.animeblues.com/programming/programming/adult-track

As an actor
For the love of God
Don't let people host in character or improv panels without being formally or practically trained in acting or improv

>>9154147
Wait why do you identify as a SJW?
You do know there is a difference between advocating for real social justice issues and being a keyboard warrior a la Tumblr?

>>9154147
>Self-proclaimed SJW like it's something to be proud of
>Being a SJW and not getting triggered by the word white
You're a great oxymoron.

>>9153925
They shouldn't have to do this, people should be able to say her/him over there or "the guy/gal in ___ costume". If you get misgendered simply inform the individual they they prefer male or female.
No one should be offended if they are crossplaying or have a stereotypical gendered face. If you get offended by shit like this and throw a fit you are litreally cancer to cons.

>>9154154
YES YES YES

I love the the idea of character improv panels and think its a fantastic concept. However their reputation is crap because people who can't act are the only ones who host them

I WARNED YOU ALL 3 YEARS AGO
FUCK WESTERN SHIT
NOTHING BUT A CANCER
I TOLD YOU SO
I TOLD YOU SO
I TOLD YOU SO
SUCK MY BALLS

>>9154154
YES YES YES

See I love the idea of character based panels and audiences interacting with them. However the idea's reputation has went to shit due to how all the crappy non actors are the only ones that host these things

>>9154190
From my experience, improv panels at big cons hosted in big rooms are always worth going to. Improv panels at small cons are generally terrible. When an improv panel isn't even following the "Yes, and..." rule there is a problem.

I once ditched a guest of honor panel to attend an in-character improv panel in the next room over, because they were laughing so loud it interrupting the panel I was in - through a wall and over the microphone. It turned out to be a Free! variety show improv thing, which I'd glossed over because it sounded like a terrible idea. But all of the actors were hilarious and played off of each other super well, it was one of the best panels I went to all weekend. So I KNOW they can be good when done right.

Cons died when Homestuck gained mainstream popularity and people became indignant over the fact that if it isn't anime, it shouldn't be at anime cons. I remember long, weepy conversations at the forums for my local con (back when it had them) where Homestuck cosplayers were adamant that their irrelevant-to-an-anime-con panels had a placein programming. When the fandom broke up, they jumped onto western cartoons and film franchises and shoehorned those into cons too. If they had been told "no" from the start instead of idiot panel organizers saying "well it kind of looks like anime and there's a big following," I guarantee the con scene would be better today.

The whole race for popularity in cosplay at conventions is highly annoying, not so much ruining the con scene, but it's the in thing now. Every convention, large or small, there are always mediocre cosplayers selling prints of themselves at booths, running panels, being deemed as special "guests" like they're in the professional costume industry or some shit. Just give up already.

>>9152548
We've been their primary audience since day one. You're just too young to remember. Cry about it, lady.

Thirsty guys.
Attentionwhores.
People that don't care about anime and manga that go to cons.

>>9154155
I mean I'm a professional LGBT+ activist and counselor, and if 4chan's definition of SJW is someone who asks people their pronouns when it's unclear and runs "feminism in anime" panels, then that's apparently what I am.

>>9154254
That usually happens because cons are starved for programming as no one really submits. The Hoemstuck panel is both crazy and passionate so they'll actually get off their asses to do panels and support each other.

If you want cons to have better panels then people need to actually fill out the paperwork and start hosting.

Meanwhile if your con has a great panel then do your best to let the panelists and the higher ups know so they'll be encouraged to come back

>>9154276
This. Last year at a con I hosted 4 panels of the general subjects: 80s sci fi anime, historical fiction manga, lgbt shoujo stuff, and an undertale panel. They all had about the same attendance (a slight bit more for undertale) but the only panels I received any kind of feedback on or encouragement to do again were the latter two. Guess which ones I'm doing again? I try to go out of my way to make content for older audiences since that's my generation, but if they don't seem into it or supportive of it there's no reason for me to keep running them. And it's not like the latter two were game shows/fanservice/whatever; I usually only run academic styled stuff. If you want a certain kind of content and don't want to create it yourself, you sure as hella better support the content you do want to see more of.

>>9151952

>>9154309
>i-it's girls fault!
Go back to your containment board

>>9154309
>People start having fun
>Girls and Alpha's ruin everything
You must be the life at a party Anon...

I think the lack of standards from a lot of the attendees is detrimental. Cons can shovel shit for programming, guests, shopping, etc. because people will eat it up because there's little competition and they're "just glad we even have these events!" If there's no criticism or demands for improvement, how can a con better itself? It seems to be a sentiment among younger people who don't want to be perceived as mean. I once criticized a panel at a local con (it was improv but the actors just kinda mumbled and giggled out of embarrassment) on an online forum and was told that they did a great job and I should appreciate that they were doing the best they could.

>>9154272
The /cgl/ idea of a SJW is closer to someone who expects everyone to start every conversation by swapping pronouns and wants every variety of LGBT-related panel until they dorm a large proportion of the programming. It's people who take things to unworkable extremes who are cancer.

>>9154327
It's super hard to get panel feedback in general. Most cons have no system in place to get feedback to panelists or even take feedback at all. Though personally I agree that you shouldn't really be super negative about a hosting group online unless you know they're gonna see it- otherwise there really no point and you're just being abrasive. To take criticism someone has to know it exists. Push for cons to have feedback forms with sent out to panelists I've been pushing for that at my local circuit for years.

>>9154337
Neither of those things are really unworkable extremes though. I mean, ones a normal part of introductions for many people and I've seen seagulls go nuts over a single "_______ representation in fandom" being included in a schedule. Like I have no problem with people not liking certain types of programming but when people see shit like that and say it's what's ruining cons, they need more than a little self awareness/perspective check.

>>9154316
Unsure if more grossed out by ridiculous elitism or casual misogyny

>>9154338
Well, the part that bugs me about the anti-negativity sentiment I've observed is that, in this case, I was pretty mild and polite with my criticisms and even delivered them in a compliment sandwich. The thread itself was for discussing panels, too. I completely agree though - the feedback itself has to be constructive, but before that even happens there needs to be an avenue for the feedback in the first place.

>>9154338
As a convention staffer, what are the best things I can do for panelists to get them feedback? What have you found the most useful or helpful?

Physical forms, online forms, twitter hashtags? Panel feedback isn't something I've seen pimped at conventions I've been to, but if it will help improve the quality of my local con I'll gladly do the legwork to put a system in place.

>>9154343
I would in general agree that freaking out over a single panel is ridiculous, but that's the other extreme, 99% of people just stick to what they like.

I don't see how you think that asking every stranger for their pronoun is "normal". If someone presents themselves such that they look like one gender, it's normal to assume they are that gender. If they are in the 0.1% that don't, they shouldn't get their backs up over it. Now, if they want to inform people first in order to clear things up, that's fine, but cons seem to attract people who seem to expect people should just know...

>>9154366
(Same anon you're replying to)
I personally go with the strategy of assuming a masculine or feminine pronoun based on presentation appearance, but if someone looks like they're in cross play or I don't know what they're going for, I introduce myself (pretty obviously cis female) with she/her pronouns so I don't misgender and the person doesn't feel weird bringing it up. In a discussion centered around lgbt issues/in an lgbt space you can pretty much assume a much larger portion of the attending population uses different pronouns than you'd expect, so I always introduce myself with pronouns there. Context is important, luckily cons compartmentalize themselves pretty easily and people's self expression is pretty clear.

>>9154362
The cons over here always do an (extensive) online survey after each edition. These surveys feature questions about the con in general, as well as questions related to any event one has marked as attended. After each section people can enter any additional thoughts or suggestions which is key in receiving proper feedback for both the con, and all the competitions, panels, events, or workshops. It also never hurts to let people know you're listening to their complaints and decided to do something about "common issues #1 and #2".
As for how to motivate people (especially those who have no complaints) into taking the survey, cons often away X (VIP) tickets for next year's edition to a couple of people who took the survey. It doesn't really cost the con anything, but it sure as hell motivates people to spend the 5~10 minutes to fill in an online form.

>>9154138
Legit trans people, like the kind that just want to blend in and live normally, are such a minority that it's hard to recommend any con create any kind of special considerations for them, especially because they don't want to be treated differently.

Everyone else who claims to be trans is just trying to leverage identity politics to get special and preferential treatment, because the constant looming threat of an SJW mob crawling up your ass and eating your vital organs for being problematic has most people terrified to deny them.

Those obese teenaged girls who insist that they are trans without dysphoria, or who think that gender is just something you declare without changing absolutely anything about their lives are nothing but attention seeking assholes.

Being nonbinary isn't a real thing. Being Genderfluid isn't a real thing. All these new pronouns and genders are made up tumblr roleplay bullshit. They are not an oppressed minority and they are not facing and kind of harm because people aren't using the pronouns "bun/buns/bunself" and recognizing them as "treegendered"

>>9154362
My top recommendation: create an easy to remember link to a Google form (tinyurl slash panelfeedback, for example) and have posters up during con that pimp it as a feedback link. Also pimp it on your con media and Facebook page during and after the con. On the form, as people to provide a list of panels they attended, as well as how much they enjoyed it on a scale of 1-10 and what they liked/disliked. You should still have emails of panelists from their applications, so three weeks or so the con you can compile the feedback relevant to them, curate it if needed, and send it out.

>>9154272
SJW is a pejorative for someone who uses social justice like a club to brute force their way through conversations while claiming the moral high ground.

You do not want to be an SJW. You don't want to identify as one.

And for fuck's sake, don't ever run another "feminism in anime" panel because Japan wants none of your shit and has nothing to do with feminism.

>>9154375
>In a discussion centered around lgbt issues/in an lgbt space
That's the key. Cons are not lgbt events. Cons are there for people to enjoy themselves, and autists freaking out over pronouns destroy that athmosphere.

>>9154382
>>9154382
I mean pretty much the whole trans/activism community is in agreement that you're not trans without dysphoria and hold the same views as you re: people saying they have those identities when they just want attention, but nonbinary people are definitely a real legit thing and not relevant to your point.

>>9154393
Cons in general nah, but relevant panels sure. I made that clear, I thought. First part of that post was about cons in general, second was specific spaces.

>>9154407
>but nonbinary people are definitely a real legit thing and not relevant to your point.

Some people may call themselves nonbinary and that's a tag they are free to use, but it's not a real thing. It's literally something made up in gender studies courses by people with no scientific expertise and tumblr blogs run by surly teenagers. It has no basis in science, psychology, biology, or anything remotely scientific.

>>9154022
>Grave of Fireflies
>Miyazaki
You mean Isao Takahata, and Grave of the Fireflies and Kiki's Delivery Service were based on popular novels.

I went to a panel like this once, the whole "all these anime are based/inspired from ww2, war is bad, gundam/mecha represents the desire for power, etc" and they're the most pretentious "deep" analysis that sound like someone's high school paper. Artists are influenced by many different themes and concepts all the time (like Eva liking the visual aesthetics of crosses). Trying to have a panel to discuss this is putting words in the creators' mouths, especially when it's usually a non-Japanese person trying to interpret it. If I wanted to attend a panel about an anime's themes and symbolism, it would have to only be hosted by the creators of the anime.

>>9154414
Are you maybe confusing nonbinary with otherkin? Because yeah that's true for the latter.

>>9154415
You're probably one of those "the curtains are blue" fuckers lol

>>9154412
An anime convention is still not an appropriate place to even have such panels because an anime convention is not a "Feminism and LGBT Activism Gathering"

This thread is getting hella offtopic

>>9154424
I think it's a pretty appropriate example of how SJW shit kills conventions.

If it can ruin a thread, it can definitely ruin a massive complicated social event.

>>9154377
Thank you. I'll bring it up at the next staff meeting.

>>9154382
Conventions actually do have special considerations for trans people. Many conventions have options for trans people who do not want their legal name on their badge (at cons where the badge nick name is printed in addition to the legal name). Some conventions have a gender neutral bathrooms available (single stall or otherwise). They're things you don't know about because you don't look for them or ask staffers about them, but they exist.

> polite sage

>>9154276
There are 6 fucking homestuck panels at my upcoming anime con. 4 ask panels, 2 sleepoverstuck panels. why.

>>9154458
That's just bad panel management. Even if you want to have homestuck panels, just say yes to one of each.

>>9153576
>even knew where to start with planning a con

Volunteer as an enforcer for any one of PAX East/West/South. Learn what they do and copy it. Follow its lessons and you'll have the best organized anime convention in the country, better than AX and Otakon put together.

>>9153576
>I wish I even knew where to start with planning a con, and I wish I had enough money to waste that I could make an anime/J-fashion/Japanese videogames only convention. No comics. No K-Pop. Pure weeb paradise.

In the past, most conventions started as a few friends getting together for a day to play some games, watch some movies, and eat some food.

They'd use a community center or a small local hotel, or even just a nearby park. Then they'd invite more people for next year. And more the year after that. Everyone chips in a few bucks to rent a conference room or two, and it grows from there.

Long and short: Start small. Build up from there

>>9154338
>>9154327
>>9154305
I attended a couple of good history related panels at my last con and I would have probably given some feedback if the con program had some actual names or contact info next to the panel description. Or even a specific forum thread or section beyond general con feedback in the official con forum.

>>9154458
Are you talking about Saboten? Their panel schedule this year looks like garbage but I guess they had to fill over 400 panel slots this year so quantity over quality I guess.

>>9154412
>Cons in general nah, but relevant panels sure.

Ok. Earlier in this thread was an incident at an an end-of-con general feedback panel. See here >>9153737. This Z person proceeded to use an unintentional misgendering to make a scene instead of saying "sorry, but I'm male/queer/babyfur/attackhelicopter." Was it an appropriate reaction?

>>9154272
Don't call yourself an SJW. It's basically admitting that you're a bully who likes to use "equality" as a poor justification to hurt other people.

Cocky ego-centric staff killing the atmosphere and enjoyment for guests. People start new cons or volunteer for them solely for some stupid sense of fame and notoriety but lack the management experience and people skills to properly run a business that's intended to be entertaining and enjoyable for thousands of people.

So much bitching about "normies" in this thread, but if you took the "normies" out of dying or dead cons they'd still be dying or dead cons.

I don't like the social justice kids, but I fucking HATE the anti-sjws. The kids that like to cry every time their opinion isn't repeated back to them, and then turn around and accuses anyone who happens to disagree with them of doing the exact same thing.

Let these kids run their panels on feminism, or gender or whatever. You don't need to fucking go to it, so why are you bitching? You're the douchebags who have to ruin everything by turning into some kind of "them vs us" kinda shit. Ignore it and move on like an adult.

>>9154784

This is damn appropriate

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BGi6Q1pNbS0

>>9151976
ugh. that girl really is the embodiment of everything wrong with cons these days.

>>9154806
We also don't need 16 sjw panels on the schedule.

>>9153618
Yuri Kuma Arashi I guess. Sailor Moon kinda.

But part of the reason the younger crowd is gravitating towards western stuff is anime in general is still pretty shitty about breaking out of tropes that make money and a lot of it is isolating to potential fans who are won;t even bother going forward if this is in a first episode. Diehard anime fans have come to embrace these things as business as usual, but I don't think there's as many weeb kids these days being purists. There's really only 2-5 anime every season that have a shot at standing against the test of time anyway.

Meanwhile western shit like Marvel and several cartoons are actually trying and succeeding in creating interesting narratives and universes that are inclusive and entertaining for both kids and adults.

As for anime cons staying anime? You'd be pretty hard pressed to keep the SU and HM cosplyers out. And the panels are going to be completely up to the staffers. A lot of cons will just take whatever they can get especially if they can't pay out a lot for decent guests. And the last thing you want is some 16 year old throwing a bitchfit on FB because your con wouldn't accept their LGBT PoC in Anime panel.

>>9154806
People need things to do at conventions, and having lots of bad panels means there's not much for people to do. Combine that with a bad dealer's hall and lame big events and you've got a convention that's not worth going to.

Every single panel room costs a convention money to use. If you aren't putting it to use and creating reasons for people to come to your con each year, then it dies. One such way a con can waste that money is by stacking the program with "the homofeminist socioeconomics of British cheekbones" panels.

>>9154896
>Meanwhile western shit like Marvel and several cartoons are actually trying and succeeding in creating interesting narratives and universes that are inclusive and entertaining for both kids and adults

They aren't actually. Most of the western comics industry is doing miserably. There are single webcomics out there that are more profitable than Marvel's biggest tri-annual crossover events.

Lots of sites are giving the new racially and sexually reassigned characters tons of press, because the big comic sites are run by SJWs, but those characters are moving a miserably low number of books.

>>9154980
True. Marvel and DC are only now finding out that their pandering to SJW demands is getting them zero profit. The SJWs blow through like a tornado made up of trends and then blow off to the next controversy to shit all over.

Fem Thor made a laughing stock of itself and disrespected established characters/villains, Squirrel Girl is failing (and ugly as fuck), Angela Queen of Hell had people scratching their heads over bizarre commentary about Israel.

All of this talk about SJW stuff ruining cons has me excited for BlerDCon. Aka a convention to celebrate diversity in fandom (with a name that is specifically refrences black fans) that has literal quotas for the percentage of women, disabled, lgbt+, and poc to run panels and be in the AA... I can already see it failing miserably after one year.

As a con organiser who has been around for many years this is an interesting thread to read. (although it derailed quite a lot in some regards)

There are more and more cons coming up in our country, but the overall attendance is growing as well.

But I don't wanna see the same stuff at each convention, I fear it might lead to a con fatigue. So we try our best to keep the cons we run differently and innovative each year.

But there sure are many conventions around that are being run poorly and still lot's of people cater to them. Does that mean it has now become easy to get people to join you event? Have standards decreased that low?

I wonder...

>>9155029
Holy shit, reading that page sounds like it'll be a total flop... and almost even insulting. Under their "Featured Guests and Content" section they've got Women, LGBTQ, Disabled Fandom, and Geeks of Color. Sounds almost like they're animals in a zoo to go around and gawk at.

>>9155050
Yup. For too many of these social justice advocates, an actual disadvantaged person is only as valuable as the amount of oppressive labels that can be put on them. It's pure objectification.

>>9155050
I'm half trmpted to go. I mean I'm a disabled woman of color. I mean if only i wasn't straight and cis... I could be their queen.

>>9155014
There was a funny page of Wonder Woman where she lassoed some guy and complained about mansplaining after FORCING HIM TO TELL THE TRUTH

>>9155050
>>9155067
Someone please send a complaint in to them pointing that out.

>>9155068
Just tell them you're non-binary-non-newtonian-meta-genderschrodinger, and this week you might be cis, but next week you might be a lesbian drag queen, you just won't know what exactly until you observe yourself in the future.

I think cons are shit for me now because I've matured. I used to rarely ever go to panels and just sit and chat to people, and being 13-14 it was easy to make friends. I overlooked people's cringiness and people overlooked my age, because we were all immature.

However, now I feel really awkward at cons. The other day at Dublin Comic Con, a guy threw a Pokeball at me to try and "catch" me- when I was younger I would have laughed and chatted to him, but all I could feel was cringe and repulsion. Maybe I'm just becoming a bitch.

>>9152958
>>9153065
>>9153148

Marseille here, we have two big cons and I feel that it's reversed ; the one in november, despite having a children area (which is a fucking terrible idea) is way less normie-filled than the one around february/march, and all around way more interesting ; I actually consider it one of the best con I go to (I do all fo the big french ones and some of the smaller ones).

I may not even come to the one in march this year, it used to be pretty nice but it's been boring and empty these last few years, and I think that normies might actually represent the majority of attendees now.

>>9155094
I feel the same. I'd really like to make friends at cons and often set out to do just that, but most people just make me cringe and the people that do seem nice/interesting to me I'm too scared to approach.

My friends are all somewhat locally popular cosplayers so going to cons feels like competing for their attention for a night, and if I lose, I have to try to make friends which is always a gamble. I can get mad depressed when my friends are hanging out with others and I don't make friends that day and just end up back in my room.

Normie's and cosplay attention whores. Reeeeee!!!!

>>9152538
the problem with otakuthon is that the mtl comic con is so close to it
The crowd bleeds out thinking it's just another comic con, then they complain there's only little interesting stuff for them
so they started demanding merchandise, making panels etc.
this dude I hang out with (because I have no friends and he thinks we're friends) told me, in the same day, "I don't watch anime at all, I just come here because I really like comic con" and "This place is boring, I think next year I'll go staff so my ticket is free"
His highlights for the weekend are: Buying a Big Bang Theory shirt, wearing a cheapo ash cosplay I made for him in 30 mins because he kept complaining he didn't have a cosplay (he never cosplays and refuses to make his own shit), refusing to check out any anime I recommended, refusing to go to any anime panels besides the legend of korra one, going to a marvel panel and giving a lengthy speech on why pop vinyls aren't shit

This is what otakuthon is being forced to turn into, a small comic con because that crowd can't understand why a nerd convention isn't catered towards their tastes

>>9154417
no
pic related

>>9155115
Pretty much. I love the whole "normies ruin everything!" mentality that a lot of people have. Did you seriously think cons and cosplaying would be these niche, 'ONLY NERDS ALLOWED' communities forever? You want cons to expand and offer more content but how do you think that's going to happen if attendance numbers don't go up? They're going to try and appeal to a wider audience because that's what brings in the money.

"Nerd culture" becoming more accessible, and the awkward scaling of large events.

Years ago, conventions and IRL events were the only social meeting grounds for subculture. And even recently (10-15 years ago), internet-based communities were still pretty lacking. You had forums and fansites, but those were pretty anchored into one specific topic, and were slow moving. Now you have Facebook, and Tumblr, and IM, and hell even /cgl/ is probably guilty too. You can share a wealth of information about a diverse array of subjects quickly, and have it reach a wide audience. You can network and make friends a whole lot easier. You can get those shiny "attention points" through likes and reblogs.

At some of my first cons, I noticed a lot more in-depth panels, where the presenters would give very detailed talks. Now you can just make a text post on Tumblr about all of that, and probably have more people read and care. And perhaps many folks would rather read a few posts or watch a YoutTube video? But now cons are at a loss as to what to fill their time with.

This leaves many mid-sized to smaller cons stuck with the Topic 101, Ask A Character, and Infamous Social Justice panels. Not because of some SJW Illuminati Conspiracy, but more likely because young adults are more willing to step up to the plate, despite them being young adults who don't have much experience with research/improv/political discourse/running a fucking panel without it turning into a spaghetti fest that could put Olive Garden out of business. But they're excited and love attention, and a good amount of the audience are young and dumb like them too, and will sit through a slideshow of memes or cosplayers from Trendy Thing giving shipbait.

Larger cons have a different experience. They get the big names from the industry, and can manage to have some smaller talks by people who know their shit, but the demand is just too damn high, and the venue too small.

>>9155157

This has become something of an issue. I accompanied a friend of mine to a small local con (about 450 people, which is more than i expected), and was astonished at what they had for panels. Rino Romano was the only guest I can remember (he may have been the only one), because their Sailor Moon panel was the biggest one they had.

The rest were pretty bare-bones. You had "Costume 101" and "Advanced Costume Class" which a lot of cons have. Then there was a Street Fighter panel which i really liked, as it was the only one that wasn't underwhelming. Also present was "Manga Meet and Greet" which was like a mingling thing with refreshments and a pretty large selection of manga provided in partnership with the local library and a nearby bookstore.

However it was the Undertale panel which really made me question how low you can go. Basically it was just the panelists and the audience debating the gender identities of the characters for like an hour, and had very little to do with the game otherwise.

When you have no experts or connections there's only so much you can do

>>9154896

Cons are branching out from just "anime" or "comics" to simply "pop/nerd culture" because they can reel in more numbers that way.

The explosive success of Marvel movies over the years along with the rise of Steven Universe or Adventure Time for example have been visible enough for people to see where to look for more attendance.

Anime, while experiencing new levels of popularity not seen here since the anime bubble popped about a decade ago, still faces the same problems its always had. Even with Crunchyroll giving NA viewers shows as they air in Japan, there are few that really leave a dent. Some like Monster Musume, Tokyo Ghoul, Attack on Titan, and One-Punch Man really took off over here in terms of general fanbases (I suppose you could also add Love Live to that list). Of course you also have the usual shonen fisticuffs shows (Bleach, Fairy Tail, etc), and the mahou shoujo mainstays (Madoka, CCS, Sailor Moon)

I think honing in the quality of panels is important. I'm not even talking about the content of the panel - I think saying "SJW panels suck" is a red herring. What we're looking at isn't a barrage of panels about unnecessary topics, we're looking at a shit ton of panels that *aren't run well*.

The Very Low Bar™ bare minimum we are not hitting:
> A panel should have fourty-five minutes worth of original content, that has been researched and rehearsed.

(15min allowed for introduction & conclusion)

That goes for informative panels as well as gameshows or improv, even clip shows. Informative panels should have original content written by the panelist, that they have put serious thought into, and have practiced delivering so they know they are both on time and confident speaking. Gameshow/Improv/Etc panels should have a set list of games or questions, with panelists who have rehearsed, and plants in the audience or on stage to keep things funny even when audience participation runs low. Clip shows should consist only of clips that the panelist has watched, with interesting commentary that if not pre-written they at least have an outline of what they want to say.

And ALL of that falls into the above instructions: Original content, researched & rehearsed.

Too many panelists say, "I understand the basic format of this, so I'll do it." And then don't do the back end work. An informative panel is not just a slide show. An improv panel isn't just standing on stage and googling improv games.

What makes a panel is CONTENT.

>>9155174
> the only guest I can remember

I think guest issues is another problem many cons are having. 00's weeb culture valued English dub voice actors, who were an easy way to pad out the guest list with marginally popular peple. Christ, the Vic Mignogna fangirls will forever haunt my memories. Now anime isn't the sole niche, and most people probably watch with subs anyway.

So who else is there to take up the mantle but "internet celeb" folk we all love to hate. We all groan and squabble over "cosplayers as guests" on here, but what sort of guests can small to medium sized cons expect to invite without blowing up their budget? (Other than the washed out old sci-fi actors who charge $20 for an autograph, which will also always be a small-con tradition!)

>>9155303
> A panel should have fourty-five minutes
I'd say 30 minutes is my ideal minimum, with buffer time also taking into consideration the infamous and ubiquitous "technical difficulties", but I agree with you on everything else.

I also think panel proposals should include more than just an info box of "lol so what is topic?".

If you're giving an informational talk record your performance from a previous con, or film it on webcam in your mom's basement if it's new. Submit your slides or a detailed outline of what you're going to cover.

If you're doing an entertainment panel, then you better have video proof that you all can marginally keep a crowd entertained. Give clips of pre-written skits or monologues, and/or bribe friends to do a dry run with interactive bits. If you try to make the excuse that "my panel members don't live near each other because we all met on Tumblr, but we discuss it on Discord sometimes (even though only 2/7 of us ever go on mic, so the rest could sound like Fran Drescher with bronchitis)" then we all know that shit is going to be bad, and you should be rejected.

>>9155468
I was able to get quite a good number of English VA's that weren't Vic mcgoogoo related. Many English dub VA's are easier to get and cheaper than flying in a seiyuu. Vic has actually been bitched at by his agent hence his disappearance from cons for a while. Todd habercorn is picking up where Vic left off in regards to having an ego and pulling some of the same shit Vic did.

Funko Pop figurines

>>9152988
>how everyone is beautiful and shit is very stupid.

I'm with ya. Gettin REALLLL tired of this "fat and Fabulous" cosplay BS. I work my ass off to have an ass! I'm fine with people cosplaying who they want, regardless of body size. But in terms of who cosplayed the character the best, it should be the person who stays in shape to fit the character's body type.

>>9155704
>But in terms of who cosplayed the character the best, it should be the person who stays in shape to fit the character's body type.

No, it should be that AND the one with the best cosplay.

You can be a 1:1 match appeareance-wise, but if you have a shit costume, you are a shit cosplayer.

>>9155704
I once saw good costumes get ignored for a fat in a hot glued mess. Because "SLAAAAAYYYYYY" and fierce and yeah giving zero fucks about your appearance and health is so empowering.

>>9155733
This is more of a symptom of social media having a net negative effect on all fandoms, hobbies, subcultures, and communities.

>>9155585
Every time I see a wall of these and their stupid looking beady sameface eyes I wonder why people don't buy nendroids if they want a cutsey tubby fig.

>>9155783
Western characters don't come in nendroids. Different target demographic.

>>9155783
Also, Nendos are like 60-80 dollarydoos.

>>9155094
same here. i just have less patience for the squeebs these days.

eh, panels suck, merch sucks, crowds suck, cosplayers suck. They've all severely degraded, and we should just go into hibernation. Wait for nerdy shit to become unpopular again.

>>9155783
Funko Pops are a grocery store impulse buy. Nendoroids are an investment in a piece of display art. Way different mentalities.

>>9155941
they just have bigger eyes you faggot.

>>9155997
No? Nendoroids are extremely versatile and fun to play with different scenes and swap their parts

>>9155785
Wrong. Several of the popular western fandoms are available as nendoroids like Marvel, DC, Star Wars, Disney and Linkin Park for some reason

I'm not on /toy/ a lot but I'm sure Funko Pops land in a tier even further down than what they refer to as "statue shit"

>>9156032

>>9156036

>>9156032
They both look like plastic garbage

>>9156038

>>9156042

>>9155997
The sculpt quality, paint shading, and number of posable interchanging pieces are exactly the same between these two items.

It's fine if you don't enjoy figure collecting, but let's not be erroneous here.

>>9156063
That's a lie, though. The Pop figure only has movement in its arms and the swords are sculpted into its hands. The Nendo has articulation in its arms and hips, and the legs can be twisted to angle the feet, along with various other arms, hands, and faces to switch out.

The pop has a few higher quality details (which don't actually show up in the real life version instead of their 3D models they use for advertising) but it looks like shit overall.

>>9156063
>Clearly sees multiple joints on nendoroid
>Only two on Funko

>number of posable interchanging pieces are exactly the same between these two items.
>??????

Are we even looking at the same thing?

>>9155941
Funko fill that niche market of
> "parents looking to buy gifts for their weeb children but dont give a shit enough to research better gifts"

They're the modern day equvlint of chinese fans and paper umbrellas

>>9156112
>>9156132
Anons, I think they were being sarcastic

>>9153618
Stop watching shitty shounen and AotYs and maybe you'll find some.

>>9154806
If the people who ran these panels were adults themselves or at least acted like such, there'd be less complaining. Guaranteed.

It's not an "us vs. them" war. It's about poorly-run programming.

I don't spend my money at an anime convention to go see 10+ hours of 16-year-old deerkin poopgenders who know nothing about anime or Japanese culture sitting in a room and whining.

it's almost as if panels at cons are being taken over by people who are too young and/or not knowledgeable enough to be speaking at actual LGBT and feminist events.

>>9156339
Stuff like Joker Game does have a certain amount of political intrigue, and every so often something comes along with a hint of social commentary, but the kind of social and gender identity politics shit that tumblr-obsessed retards go on about does not exist. It's literally just not there.

The only reason feminists try to cram their ass-backwards, completely moronic ideology into everything is because it's a quick and easy way for a stupid person with nothing interesting to say to insist that they are making an intellectual, important judgement about some Japanese cartoon.

When people make FEMINIST SAILOR MOON panels, all the are doing is wasting a slot on the schedule to prove what a blithering, self-important jackass they are.

>>9156514
Uhg, that's the thing, these "panelists" are all trying to apply western ideas to Japanese media. Of course it's all bullshit. To do this kind of topic well and accurately, you HAVE to take into account the immense cultural divide.

I really want to do an indepth panel on transgender characters in anime, and the cultural difference between western trans identity politics and Japans really interesting history with gender/sexuality subculture (such as okama culture). It's a super interesting topic to talk about, because there are characters and portrayals that to the western trans community would be considered horribly offensive, but to the Japanese community are actually beloved.

I'd love to talk about more than just the easy ones that appeal to western audiences like Wandering Son and Paradise Kiss - bring in examples like Hana from Tokyo Godfathers or Ivankov from One Piece.

But how the fuck do you differentiate a panel like that from the twenty other "diversity" panels run by ignorant and uneducated 12-year-olds? I feel like if I put all the time into documenting and researching it, no one would come but more 12-year-olds who wouldn't care.

>>9156828
Make it an 18+ panel? Not because of raunchy content, just because it's a complex topic that would be more suited to an older crowd.

>>9156828
That actually does sound interesting and it is an entirely different kind of thing from the tumblr panels were some pompous teenagers angrily declare that characters in series without any romance or sex are actually gendergaseous pansexuals.

Although, the people who would find that lecture/discussion interesting would avoid it on topic, and all the people who would be "triggered" by it and have nothing to offer, would flock in.

To nail down a few points of what hurts cons overall:

>Accessibility of weeb/nerd culture to normies which lead to a bunch of people who don't know jackshit about fandoms and have no passion for them who go to cons just to rave and drink.
>infiltration of SJW pandering. They ruin the overall quality of panels with shit like "Ask an Asexual" or "Anime for Black People". When these crappy panels fill up space we lose space for potentially more interesting Japanese culture related panels.
>Mixing Western media and Eastern media. Comics/sci-fi belong in their own cons and shouldn't mix with anime cons. It ruins the overall themes of the con, pushing out Japanese culture and also pushes out potentially more weeb goods for comic stuff.

I also don't understand all the SJW/normie sympathy in this thread. You all should know better.

>>9157010
Make Anime Cons Weeb Again.

>>9156828
The only real way I can see that flying is you put a lot of TLC in the panel description.

>>9157010
>infiltration of SJW pandering. They ruin the overall quality of panels with shit like "Ask an Asexual" or "Anime for Black People". When these crappy panels fill up space we lose space for potentially more interesting Japanese culture related panels

They're not taking a slot if there are no other panels being submitted. Many cons say they have problems with filling up programming but there's a need to as these SJW people are the only ones submitting, attending and supporting the panelists.

What do you want the con to do if they don't have enough non SJW panels to fill up even a quarter of their programming?

>>9157046
Most cons are first come first serve as I've seen here. So the problem isn't so much there's not enough. It's that they just take the first batch and deny anything else that comes in.

i haven't been to very many cons, but I'm honestly glad the majority of people at the ones I've been to don't act like you guys. What rotten attitudes you've displayed here.

>>9157066
Hence why I'm not going to any more anime cons.

>>9157066
I was thinking the same thing.

People are acting like anime or nerd culture is EXCLUSIVE to basement-dwelling unsocial guys when its picked up a lot of traction in the "normie" world. I think it's fantastic how popular things have gotten because now I have more people to talk to about it and thus more friends with similar interests.

The things ruining cons are creepy smelly guys who don't dress up or buy anything and just stand around complaining about all the people not exactly like them.

>>9157066
Welcome to 4chan: The asshole of the internet, because the only thing that comes out of here is shit.

But underneath the bitching, the core of the problems presented in this thread has truth. Conventions are suffering in quality because of poorly run programming, and the saturation of off topic fandoms makes them feel less like weeb heaven. We're in a boom where so many conventions are popping up, that the over all quality is going down. Much of the merchandise available in dealers hall is all the same. Conventions don't have the same sacred appeal they once did, because with the advent of well organized nerdy social media there are now other ways to meet and talk to other anime fans.

The conversation is crude and rude, but the conclusion is accurate.

Not that all conventions are horrible, but that there is a pattern of problems that people have noticed and are annoyed at.

>>9155150
the issue is that increasing attendance and profit doesnt lead to expanding and better options
that actually always ends up homogenizing your options and broad sweeping strokes for maximizing profits
you cant mainstream something to improve it... look at card games now, video games now, etc. once they hit mainstream they become very bland and the same over and over...

>>9156828
I saw a really interesting panel at an anime event in my city about how most anime about rural japan, whether comedy or tragedy, is related to the fear of isolation that rural japan is facing right now as people are abandoning the rural towns. A lot of people thought it was boring, but I LOVED it. The panelist clearly did a lot of research and listed sources, which I thought was great.

If people actually did their research like this before these tumblr-y panels, I would be all about it.

Because they do shit like this and advertise at the mall by selling pictures with themselves to normies basically shouting "Hey come to this freakshow next weekend."

There are a lot of ways cons suck that go beyond SJWs and western invasion
>shitty mass
>shitty masquerade judoes
>crowd control
>shitty con book missing panels
>artist alley fanart rules
>artist alley not enforcing rules
>not enough reg booths
>fucking elevators

>>9157046
Here's some ideas. If the panel schedule is lacking good content or all the submissions are mostly trash
1) Stop giving free badges to insufferable shitheads who are just going to make the con look bad just because they need something on the schedule
2) Rent fewer rooms and condense the schedule to fit all the panels into those rooms
3) Do the above and turn unused panel rooms into meeting rooms, cool down rooms, snackbars, and cosplay repair and prep rooms.
4) Unfuck the video game room by putting all the Smashfags into their own room so 90% of the video game area doesn't have to be dominated by them.
5) Tag in volunteers and helpers. Can they play an instrument? Can they instruct people on basic yoga? Can they draw? Have them run instructional classes or just have them hanging out taking requests during those empty timeslots.

Letting people run panels about any dumb thing they want just because there's a perceived NEED for something to be there is just foolish and there are far better alternatives that few cons, if any, are actually doing.

>>9157240
okay but the OP specified that the shit show is recent, and all of that has existed since the dawn of conventions

>>9157134

(1/2)

You're just noticing the shit more than the good stuff.

Yeah there's more bad cons but there's also good stuff too. Hell thanks to modern technology almost everything about the con experience is improved from the "good ole days"

We have cons geared toward Toku, old monster movies, retro games, arcade games, anime, yaoi, comics entire series such as Star Trek or My Little Pony. The expansion of the con scene does mean there are more people trying to make something more mainstream but it also means you get a lot more of the niche market catered to.

Remember how much of a pain it was to find a cosplay group or organize a gathering? Cons and social media put that stuff on the schedule and you can easily locate them now.

Remember the old days of just trying to find pictures of yourself at cons and how you had to spend hours and hours looking through photobucket, blog and flicker pages from random users to find maybe 1 or 2 pictures of you that were not either too blurry, too dark or had your eyes looking like a nocturnal cat? Modern advances make it much easier to find photos, tag photos, share photos and BOOK A DAMN PHOTOGRAPHER!

Wigs are easier to find, you can actually buy color contacts without busting the damn bank. People know about Taobao and if you can't figure the site out then you can find a guide that will translate the steps for you.

Information is a lot easier to share and advanced techniques are becoming common knowledge, the overall costume quality has risen from modified closet cosplay to at least ebay/storebought level where people at least kinda look who they're trying to be.

>>9157262
Yes and no. I think they used to be much better orgnized but these days anyone can rent out a hotel and call it a con. Something like Dashcon wouldn't have happened 20 years ago.

>>9157275

(2/2)

Meanwhile you have the actual con events. Not only are we becoming aware of the actual staff of our favorite titles but we're also getting directors, character designers and key animators coming to the US. Panel variety has grown too, we're not just having lectures and how-tos. There's game shows, we have cons with multimedia games of cosplay chess where the pieces are doing choreographed fights. Social issues are being discussed, panels devoted to well loved web comics are cropping off as more people are paying attention to non traditional media.

Panels are teaching us how to draw, teaching us how to survive in Japan and teaching us how to show for rare Comiket merchandise. We're seeing anime influence the world of music, dance, pro wrestling and live adult entertainment.

All of this is happening across the nation and if you miss a panel or a guest you really like then some kind soul is bound to upload a video.

Cons are not stagnating, they're evolving and catering to many new and offbeat taste. Those who think they're not are ignoring the improvements

>>9157278
However think of all the other advances made.

> Buying badges is faster and thanks to QR codes you can pick them up easily
> Easier to promote and market a small con through word of mouth and social media thus its a lot more believable seeing a con get off the ground and not be dead in the water
> Finding and sharing photos of cosplay is way easier for everyone. Plus thanks to smart phones you know at the very least your outfit can be seen unlike the old days of disposable cameras and film.
> Going to cons is way less of a gamble as you can now see the con schedule online weeks before the event thus plan your weekend accordingly.
>Any schedule hiccups or changes can instantly be communicated through twitter and social media and you don't have to rely strictly on word of mouth.

Yes it was harder back in the day for a con to get started back in the day. While a lower bar of entry means more failures will crop up, it also means you are not shutting out potential success stories. CAX would not be where it is today if it weren't for the internet and social media spreading the word that an obscure web comic was going to do a con.

>>9157255
>1) Stop giving free badges to insufferable shitheads who are just going to make the con look bad just because they need something on the schedule

And how can we weed out the shitheads from the level headed people. There are great panel ideas and descriptions that turn out to be shit because the host sucks and shitty ideas that turned into amazing experiences.

Would you have some sort of "you must have X amount of expedience to submit" rule in effect

>>9157255
Sac Anime rents out only 2 panel rooms, uses th e rest for the activities you listed AND has a smash room/

Their programming still struggles to get good entries had will have multiple QA panels of the same series on their programming.

>>9157287
However giant cons like Fanime still manage to fix their line problem for 3 years and then somehow go backwards to 10 hour wait lines.

Besides I was mostly just pointing out that the majority of the thread is SJW and western blaming when there's plenty of of other things that make a shit con

>>9157282
THANK YOU. Yes, there are still areas that cons can improve upon but, overall, things have been steadily getting better. Conventions are never going back to the way they were in the early stages; it wouldn't make sense. I like that things are becoming more accessible. I've met cosplayers from across the country that I never would've otherwise because it's so much easier to meet people thanks to cons getting bigger. I know a lot of people have been saying that the market is oversaturated but I think the newer cons that pop up overnight rarely survive past the first year. It's the ones that provide worthwhile content and improve that see growth

>>9155041
I think that when the con scene as a whole is small people tend to settle for anything.
Only the ones who have had the opportunity to travel to bigger cons can tell which ones are shit.
It's the same thing in my country. In the capital we have like three or four cons per year where only one is acceptable and in the other parts you have literally two cities trying to organize cons. I live in the "sea capital" or whatever and it's the biggest thing around. Its sole purpose is milking kids for their money, but hey. They don't know better.

>>9157202
I think this is the type of panel that really is an age demographic interest. Me at 15 years old, who was your average con going weeb, would likely find it boring too, but 23 year old me would be fascinated by this sort of thing. As a majority of cons are either a) actually 15 year old weebs b) have the mindset of 15 year old weebs or c) not interested in this sort of thing anyway. The type that would love it are likely to sit through a university type lecture which not everyone is willing to do at a con.

>>9151952
When management decides quality > quantity

That's it plain and simple.

Staffing starts relying on gophers or volunteers who are of questionable quality, and generally suck(yes I know some try and do a good job but that is few).

Panels become the same old routine because "fuck it they have other ones going on!"

Vuneues lose focus since it is more important of getting people in the door than who comes in

More people = more profit, pander to lower common denominators


It also is because everyone and their grandma seems to be throwing cons around instead of, even as far back as a few years ago, cons were fewer but larger(atleast in the east coast). Not to mention "nerd culture" is in so people feel the need to go to cons even if they have nothing relative to their interests.

Social media of all kind. It happens to a lot of things, people use social media because it is "easy" but never check to see if people suggesting or complaining about X/Y/Z are legit.

Normies.

>>9152341
Can someone explain what a safe zone is to me?
Is there literal real life safe zones at cons? I thought this was just a meme

>>9157501
Yes and I have been to some cons that had them

What they are for
>people who feel uncomfortable in groups for long periods of time
>people who may get/be triggered
>people who feel misrepresented in some way gender/tumblrshit/etc
>people who suffer from social anxiety to cool off

What they turn into
>I need to sit down somewhere that isn't a floor
>I need to fix X in my cosplay
>Oh a wall outlet let me charge my phone
>I got a snack lemme eat it here

They literally turn into everything but what people say they are needed for because those people rarely ever go to the con. I've not seen a person who was using it for any other purpose.

Con staffer here, I run a video game room with actual Japanese arcade games. Its quite a struggle to convince cons of the worth of our service, even though we keep a game room constantly busy for the entire con. We are that thing to do when you have nothing else to do.

1. Don't give a shit about guests (like me)
2. Panels are shit
3. The regular video game room is smashed out
4. When all of the interesting stuff (AMV contest, cosplay contest) is over
5. When the fucking raves are on (we get amazingly popular as soon as that starts)

Cons are mismanaged by older folks who need to get with the times on the trends. If they paid more attention to what the fans really want to do, things would get better. Just my 2cts

>>9157507
At the con I'm running we call it a Chill Out room. Doesn't really indicate it's for anything in particular but lazing around. However, last con we kept a private office aside for anyone that seriously needed it, such as those with autism who might have a meltdown.

>>9157626
Which sounds fine and reasonable; I've seen cons do something similar. The thing that bugs me isn't the having of areas like this it's the shoehorned crap that follows it with the "safe space". I'm not sure if you are aware of some of the colored stickers cons are introducing for "okay or not okay to talk to me".

I think if you need to rely on safe spaces to go to a con, you may need to consider a few extra things before going to one.

>>9157639
The con I'm helping with is connected with a lot of local organisations centred around disability, youth services, and mental health. I don't think our auspice group would ever consider something like that because our cause is to get people interacting and connected with each other. Giving people excuses not to talk to one another, even if it's because of disability, isn't really something I could see them supporting. They've got a lot of staff who work with people with difficulties on a daily basis, so they know what they're doing.

Luckily it seems most of the locals coming in are already well-aware of the organisations due to interaction outside the con, so they know if they're feeling out of sorts they can go to their booths.

>>9157645
Ah, that's pretty cool not sure of too many cons that do something like that. Good on you m8

>>9157654
I know a few cons have started giving booth space to organisations centred around depression and such, but I dunno how well they're integrated with the con itself. We're pretty lucky to have a big group like that back us up. They don't always understand what we're aiming for since cons are a bit of a foreign concept to them, but they're learning.

>>9157609
Maybe you're overcharging or something?
The cons in my area bring Japanese game caps and such and it known to be a draw.

>>9151952
A lack of Nazi paraphernalia.

>>9157734

>>9157010

>Mixing Western media and Eastern media. Comics/sci-fi belong in their own cons and shouldn't mix with anime cons. It ruins the overall themes of the con, pushing out Japanese culture and also pushes out potentially more weeb goods for comic stuff.

Eh, yes and no. If it's a smaller con that wants to get as many numbers as possible it's not a terrible idea to get guests/content related to continued established western fandoms like Marvel or Star Wars.

Larger cons usually have the resources and connections to specialize in a specific area. Even then that doesn't stop anyone from going as Green Lantern to Anime Expo, and Marvel at one point did have a booth there iirc.

Smaller cons that seem to be popping up everywhere just don't seem sustainable when people will just save up and go the distance to a bigger event that actually has the good stuff they're looking for.

Even if the Sentai Filmworks booth is still selling the same merch from Akame Ga Kill and Persona 4 that they were selling last year (and that you can probably find on the internet), they still have contests and other things going on.

>>9157282
>directors, character designers and key animators
Haven't large cons always had these kinds of guests? Pic related. But what about small cons? This year my local con (year 12?) only had some random cosplay guest.

>game shows, how to draw, Japan travel tips
Pretty sure these types of panels have been around for a long time too, at least since I started.

This year my local "anime" had an equal amount of anime related panels and comic related ones. But that's not even counting the other random ones, like Disney related or "Adventures Indie Filmmaking". Amazingly there were no SJW panels though.

I find ways to enjoy pretty much any con, but for me, a HUGE killer is if a con is overrun by fucking Deadpool cosplayers. Those faggots ruin EVERYTHING

Safe space used to be a place where women could go to breastfeed that wasn't a bathroom stall. I don't know how the hell they became places to...I'm not sure what they're supposed to be there for? To be LGBTQFKYBSP#$+ away from people who won't use slurs at you? With the exception of late nights where people are drunk I've never seen harassment like that happen.

Is it there to get away from creepers? Because if so there's clearly a differentry problem that needs to get addressed

>>9157449
What?

>>9158621
Labeling someplace a "Safe Space" is shorthand for "I should be able to leverage my feelings as an unquestionable reason to demand people do exactly what I want, because otherwise I'll cry harassment, claim I've suffered emotional trauma, and then relentlessly torment anyone in charge for daring to challenge my undeserved feelings of authority and superiority"

>>9157202
People assume that this is an attack on SJW culture when it isn't.

Topics like feminism, gender identity, race, and sexual orientation in anime can make good panels. You just need people who actually know what they're talking about, which is the problem - they don't. They approach everything with a very Western perspective and most of them haven't watched nearly enough anime and will end up talking about Steven Universe or something about half an hour into the panel. Therefore, an hour of my time was wasted listening to 16 year old girls babble on about nothing.

I'm convinced conventions welcome these types of panel because they want to be "inclusive" and somehow think it makes minority groups feel more welcome. It's based around fear and patting themselves on the back.

>>9159594
Couldn't it (at least partially) also be because people who are more knowledgeable and/or qualified to lead a panel aren't submitting to cons because they're too busy/uninterested (or in the case of first come first serve submissions, these people aren't as eager to submit as younger teens)?

>>9159601
This is a statement I wish was pushed around more. If you are unsatisifed with the programming then its up to the attendees to do something. Far too often we shrug our shoulders and think that someone else will sweep in and give us what we want but the unfortunately truth is that we're all shrugging and not giving.

>>9159646
If people aren't submitting enough, though, the people in charge should look at that as a problem and look into a way of fixing it.

desu 90% of the time when I'm at cons I don't even use english in order to avoid that sjw shit. because if I misgender someone by not using their 4000+ pronouns that I don't know, they can't scream at me because I just "didn't know". They do get flustered.

Another note tho, one thing that kills me absolutely is when staff doesn't know where shit even is. Ive been in multiple situation of missing panels and concerts and the staff being of absolutely no help.

>>9160236
Usually if people are not submitting it means

A: There are not enough people coming to the con in general
B: The con provides no intensives for panels
C: The con is attracting people who would rather spectate rather than participate


A and B are easy to deal with but what about C

>>9154250
What con as this at?

>>9154393
A large portion of people who attend cons are in the lgbt bracket.

>>9157010
I feel like "Anime For Black People" would be a pretty fun joke panel late at night

>>9157217
Is that San Japan

>>9157010
I think one way to fix the rave/dance party normies would be to have the DJs play only weeb music, all the time. No top 40 club hits or the usual whatever is played at normal raves. OP/EDs, remixes of OP/EDs, eurobeat, lolicore, future bass, even some future funk/vaporwave that samples japanese music. The normies either get bored and leave or they like it and maybe start exploring on their own, assimilating into new fans.

>Mixing Western media and Eastern media. Comics/sci-fi belong in their own cons and shouldn't mix with anime cons.
While I agree with this in principle, it needs to be remembered that anime cons started as offshoots of sci-fi cons. People began "intruding" on scifi cons by adding anime video rooms showing things like Yamato and Harlock, and then grew into their own private meetups and independent conventions. These somehow ended up growing larger than all the scifi and comic cons until the likes of SDCC went full commercial Hollywod and it became a massive public E3 of comic and scifi tv and movies.

At this point though, I think the whole homestuck/MLP/Undertale/RWBY/etc group needs to have its own separate events. They don't fit in anime but I think their culture also doesn't quite fit with the average comic book and cartoon fan.

>>9157288
>And how can we weed out the shitheads from the level headed people.
Force applicants to submit their slides, or a video of them rehearsing the panel, or their script if they can't upload video. Any of these would be evidence that they are prepared in advance to fill the panel time with good content.

>>9160689
>intensives
incentives

Sorry, it's the grammar national socialist in me.

>>9162098
No this is for one of those "Comic Cons" that started popping up everywhere in the past couple of years

>>9162150
Are you really proposing the idea that fandoms get their own separate cons? We already have Bronycon, which is a shitfest. And there are waaaaay too many cons popping up everywhere that don't even last a year because the organizers aren't equipped to handle an event.

I think people should really get over the fact that anime cons aren't strictly animu anymore. Comic cons aren't strictly comics. Sci-fi cons aren't strictly sci-fi. People have varied interests and, yes, they WILL bleed over into other areas.

That being said, I do agree that panels should have stricter rules when it comes to content and who's presenting them. Some people don't prepare at all and a good panel turns into an hour of rambling. I'm also all for less panels desu. Or at least more variety. I don't want to sit for an hour and listen to someone talk. There need to be more workshops and panels that get the audience involved. I go to cons mostly for the cosplay because every panel that I've been to has bored me half to death. Informational panels have their place but I feel like the number of them should decrease.

>>9162322
Also, I am a fan of cons that encompass a wider area. I'd rather go to something that caters to more than just anime or comics. (Hence why Dragoncon is so popular)

>>9162327
I think Dragoncon does it right by having lots of events that are unique. A lot of times, I go to anime cons and don't see a single panel that I haven't already seen before, and that's a bummer.

>>9162322
I think it's reasonable people don't want bronies or flavor-of-the-moment garbage like Homestuck to be pandered to at something like an anime con.

Drama

Honestly most cons I go to I have a blast till I look at the internet talking about it or go in a group.

I've recently been starting to host panels and they seem to be going really well. It's kinda insane though because I always have slides and notes on hand that I would love to submit to cons but they so very rarely ask for proof of concept. All I ever do is give a brief description of my panel and cross my fingers that they understand I know what I'm doing.

>>9155303
>Informative panels should have original content written by the panelist, that they have put serious thought into, and have practiced delivering so they know they are both on time and confident speaking.

This so much. One of my most well received panels was one where I basically assembled a dozen or so anime that I thought were "obscure" or just under appreciated. I've seen a lot of anime but I was surprised just how few people in the room had heard of anything I talked about. For each one I outlined the reasons why I thought it was significant or intriguing and then attempted to tie it back to more popular anime (which they did better on but still). Then I showed a short clip or video of the anime to give them a taste of what I described. Sometimes it was a trailer, maybe a clip, and even once an AMV.

They ate it up and so many stuck around after the panel to ask me follow up questions. It made me realize that maybe I'm doing a better job running panels then I thought I would.

>>9162150


>I think one way to fix the rave/dance party normies would be to have the DJs play only weeb music, all the time. No top 40 club hits or the usual whatever is played at normal raves. OP/EDs, remixes of OP/EDs, eurobeat, lolicore, future bass, even some future funk/vaporwave that samples japanese music. The normies either get bored and leave or they like it and maybe start exploring on their own, assimilating into new fans.

What about 80's/90's pop. You know when anime was booming and boy bands and girl groups were the rage? But lil jon's shots? Fuck thats gotta go and get its own con

>>9162416
Yes, Morning musume, SMAP, Ayumi Hamazaki, all that stuff too.

>>9162416
80s and 90s boy and girl bands would be a wonderful alternitive to the shit usually played. It sucks that raves at cons are usually always targeted towards teenagers.

>>9153886
This is hilarious because both parties are pathetic

>>9162416
That's....not a rave then. It's a dance. Also, what rave is playing "shots"? Raves are for electronic music.

>>9163080

We included dance parties as well. But yeah, that is part of our dj's playset, it's a safe playset but he is quite popular.

>>9162081
No, just the people who are vocal are, and not even everyone claiming to be actually is. People who freak out over pronouns tend to be the ones who aren't actually LGBT.

Most people at cons are either straight or are only saying they are LGBT to fit into SJW culture.

>>9160689
There are also cons where the information on becoming a panelist isn't easy enough to find. People should be able to find this information when they look under "panels" on the convention's site.

Another problem is when panel registration is too complicated for the average weeb to figure out.

>>9153236

Ohayocon? Ohayocon a shit with awful programming and yet I still go every year

>>9162416
On second thought, there is a time and place for lil jon in anime convnetions
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAtP1j4dhgY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZmK2NHrqX4

Waiting in line in the summer heat for 6 hours to book a room for next year then end up not getting one. I'm pretty sure that ruined Colossalcon for a bunch of people.

Great con for partying and just having a good time with cosplayers, but not worth that. Our crew is going to try out Colossal East next year instead.

>>9164493

Where and when is Colossal East? I'm hesitant about them splintering into two cons, but after this year's insane race to book we are reminded that the Calahari reached its capacity last year and the con comittee doesn't want to move

>>9155124
>I think next year I'll go staff so my ticket is free

HAHAHAHAHA

In actuality, staff ticket aren't free regardless of the convention. That ticket will always come with blood, sweat and tears.
Not only that, being a staff is actually demanding regardless of your position, this shatters the dreams of a lot 1st year staff who never worked at an event before.

In a more con administration-wise, people should realize that the staff roster is never stable: a lot of people come in and a lot of people move on. In a lot of cases, the "old breed" leave without a successor/protege so the next generation has to learn from scratch or an unsuited person takes the position. Small cons are doomed when this happens, larger cons are slowly driven to the ground unless some messiahs shows up.

Honestly what kills cons for me is the internet and the drama that follows.

Aside from one, maybe 2, cons I have been to I have always had a blast till I go online(fb/tumblr/etc) or come onto /cgl/ and listen to the bullshit fallout of unimportant nonsensical crap.

>>9165658
Then just don't read it?

>>9151952
tumblr and manchildren who think making a convention is oh so easy way to get money and power over fucking weebnerds

>>9165681
I try not to but it gets harder and harder every year

>>9152365
>What ruins cons for me really is just people acting like idiots, which happens more at smaller cons. Teens don't really know how to behave like civilized people,especially at cons. I avoid most of the local anime cons like the plague.

Completely agreed, Imo the best are middle sized cons. Bigger than local meetup, but smaller than the huge stuff. Because those attract huge amounts of assholes as well

>>9166832
Damn, you've got issues. It's not like your hand is sentient and goes to seek out this shit on its own. You want to see it, you need it, you're addicted. You need a psychologist.

>>9166832
Seriously as a staff I like reading this because it gives me the bigger picture of things I wasnt able to see, hear or feel during con.
But for you, you need to stop going on the Internet if you don't want to see this

The stupid youtubers that go to these cons just to make fun of the guys who enjoy to go there.
The drunk 16 yo.
The Sluts that go there just to get some attention from socially retarded shut ins.

I remember when a not so well done cosplay got as much attention as a bought 10/10.

>>9153858
Why do white people think that SJW's are only affecting white people?

Yes, they are explicitly targeting whites but you also have to realize that they are also working under the assumption that minorities and women are infantile and incapable of making something of themselves. That's why we get retarded concepts like 'institutionalized racism' or stupid words to set white people apart from everyone else like 'people of color'. And it's a fucking headache because a lot of the times it's white people advocating for this crap and filling the heads of their pet minorities with this nonsense.

This is why SJW's eat themselves after a time.

>>9155098
Which one are you talking about in november ? HERO Festival, or a smaller one ?