/cgl/ - Cosplay & EGL

>>6437639
>>6437674
>>6437759
All of my boners

omg im falling in love with lolita all over again. im thankful for this thread. happy thanksgiving you guys<3

>Tfw if you dress Oldschool now, people will call you an ita

>>6437904
People only call you ita if you're ugly. If you're attractive then you can wear anything.

>>6437904
Only if you use bad lace.

Aw shit mang. Anyone remember this?
http://www.avantgauche.co.uk/

>>6437904
People always say this but it is totally untrue. If you wear good old school and older brand pieces people will seriously kiss your ass on DL.
This is just some stupid misconception started by butthurt noobs who got called out on a bad outfit and think anything black and white is "old school lolita" and we're not hipster enough to appreciate it.

I love oldschool sweet. There's just something really pretty about a dress when the focus is on the lace and adornments rather than on a print. Anyone have any more pink coords?

I run an Old School Lolita Tumblr if anyone is interested:
http://osloli.tumblr.com/

Updated fairly often~

>>6438309

>>6438309
This, this, a thousand times this.
I wish I had images to bump with

>>6438309

I don't see the appeal in old school because these
>>6437749
>>6437659
are so fucking ugly. The other ones (minus 2-3 cause they don't look old school to me) are mediocre at best.

The construction of the dresses (??? doesn't look any different from the non-printed stuff brand puts out), the lace (tacky), the frilly knee highs and frilly bloomers.... Am I not seeing something?!

>>6438600
too much emphasis on prints (other than basic florals) imo
i like http://fuckyeaholdschoollolita.tumblr.com/

>>6438814
what is objectively mediocre about them? what are you saying about the construction? this just sounds like a matter of taste

>>6438824
Of course my statement is a matter of taste and opinion. And people keep saying how much they love OSL because of the lace, details (ie pintucks), etc when I see the same amount of construction going into non-printed brand dresses nowadays. In fact they're a lot prettier (like metas pintucked, btssbs embroidery, aps dolce) than these lace monsters. So what is it that's so appealing about old school?

>>6438832
I like old-school for different reasons. for the relative simplicity of the really old stuff and some of the ways it was worn and styled (huge platform white or black MJs could go with everything, white lace went ON everything including dark colours, mini crowns and giant rectangle headdresses). For a lot of people it's a sentimental thing or their version of old school is "a time when OTT sweet prints were less popular".

>>6438309

>>6438814
How are 2 and three not oldschool? They're about as oldschool as it gets. I do agree that the two white ones you directed us to are ugly, though.

Some old and new elements.

>>6442196
One on the left is my dream dress. Pretty much given up hope since I'm a 35" bust and pretty sure that dress was 32" max? FML

>>6442243
The design is pretty simple, maybe sew one?

>>6442243
It goes beyond 32" for sure, I'm a little less than that but it's super saggy on me. Waist too.

>>6438309

What are the significant differences between old school and newer styles? I mostly see longer, lacier sleeves and more layered bodies in dress and lacier headgear. Is that about it?

>>6442336

Oh, and also far less intricately patterned fabric.

>>6442340
hair and makeup were much more simple. No wigs or circle lenses or any of that craziness.

>>6442336
old school used less poofy skirts, more white or black lace on white, black, pink or red, more Knee socks (over knee socks are more popular now), more rectangle headdresses and smaller headbows. Coords were usually all one color, or one color + black or white.

Is 1997 old school enough for you?

and here is a little 1998.

>>6442346
>>6442347


Ahh, I see. Thank you!

Some 1999

>>6442336
Less accessories or just a few more simple ones, real hair, lack of prints or very simple screenprint/embroidery ones, less poofy and more A-line skirts, higher above the knee. The dress was usually the most luxurious part and was covered in heirloom details rather than a print. Popular accessories then that you don't see much anymore include schoolgirl mary-janes, huge chunky platforms, headdresses and lacetopped kneesocks.

A coord would basically consist of a headdress or simple small headbow, lacy blouse and simple or lacy dress, tights or kneesocks, and simple heels or chunky platforms. Maybe some gloves, and/or a choker, but not much else. Makeup and hair are kept natural and simple.

2000

more 2000

Sweet from 2000

curly pigtails!

>>6442394
Just FYI, "pretty" in the captions on these is "Angelic Pretty" prior to them becoming a dedicated lolita brand, and "Emily" is short for Emily Temple Cute. "Jane" is short hand for Jane Marple. (Most of these brands aren't abreviated like that these days, so I figured it was worth mentioning.)

Jane Marple and ETC, circa 2000

Some 2000 era MMM

I actually have a question about this.
If you were old school lolita, will you be considered and ita now? Because I'm not into all this glitz and glam stuff it's become.

Meta from 2000

>>6442409
>>6442385

What's this black bag that keeps popping up?
It's cute.

>>6442411
Some really ignorant noobs might think that if you are wearing black and white... but for the most part, as long as your things are well made you should be fine.

>>6442411
As long as what you're wearing is still of good quality (ie not a massive ebay lacemonster) and well coordinated, it shouldn't be.

And if someone says something, then whatever. Ignore them.

>>6442421
Looks like it's Vivienne Westwood from the logo.

Meta

>>6442432
I want Meta to do another nurse series!

meta (2004)

>>6442436
Didn't they do one relatively recently?

Is there a specific brand or time period people want, by any chance?

More 2004 Meta

I think this is somewher around 2001

this is such a funny looking dress, IMHO

Gothic Lolita Bible 4, I believe

GLB5, I think, still Meta

>>6442451
ah shit its moon kana! hated her music but she was so kawaii.

GLB 7

>>6442421
Vivenne Westwood. I think it was only available in Japan though. I tried to find one at the time but it was totally impossible!
It also came in pink leopard print.

>>6442454
It really is. It actually does look like a "doll" dress, frumpiness and all. I think a lot of older lolita dresses do - they're sort of puffy and unstreamlined in a way that seems awkward by the standards of modern taste, but I guess sort of worked with the original, more doll-like "look".

>>6442416
>dem peeking bloomers
Fuuuck, I know some people can't stand it and it can look age play as fuck if not done right, but I can't help but love some peeking bloomers

>>6442476
I remember this being in SO MANY street-snap photos at the time. The original Fruits book was FILLED with people carrying the pink-leopard print one.

>>6442436
>>6442440
They did one near the beginning of this year

>>6442487
How did I miss this? Brb regretting my life

>>6442483
Remember this one?
I wanted one of these so hard...

Am I not alone in preferring current day EGL to this old school stuff? I'm not really a fan out of the out of control lace and ageplay-esque looking stuff. It just looks a bit more subdued and refined to me nowadays.

>>6442604
I think both are nice, honestly. The current day-stuff is more geared towards sweet lolita. The older stuff looks almost gothic-esque.

More Meta

Meta

>>6442604
I like some modern stuff and some old school stuff, some of what I've been posting from the 90's is really, really, really old, and so it's from when the style was still becoming a thing and finding it's self, so some of it isn't as polished, IMHO.

Meta... not sure off hand when this is from though.

>>6442674
Same with this...

Woah, no circle lenses on everyone, natural hairs, people's clothes actually looked a bit more normal... how strange. J-fashion sure has evolved a lot, I didn't even notice.

>>6442675
Boz Circa 2000

Boz Circa 2002

More 2002 Boz

More old IW

Really old IW

>>6442701

oldschool coord

>>6442702

Anybody else remembering In The Starlight?

I made it mad by posting too fast....

AP circa 2002

Marchen Merry 1998

>>6442755

BTSSB & AatP

Could you guys help me identify an old school dress? If nothing else, can anyone tell me what year it was released? All I know about it is that it's by BTSSB and I have a matching headbow for it. It's not on Hello Lace or Lolibrary, which I assume is because it's old as hell and a non-print.

>>6442817
I can certainly try. Can you tell me anything else about it? Like where did you buy it, and did the seller say anything to indicate the age of the garment?

>>6442783
Is this really old school? I know the headdress and socks are reminiscent of it, but it seems like this is from when BTSSB was transitioning from old school to what it is today. I think these are from 2006 or so?

>>6442498
Haha yes! I remember at one point I was really obsessed with Fruits (books), and spent my time tagging the pages with repeating people and items. That's how I first started following Choconyan and Junnyan, and when I first learned who Vivienne Westwood was (through these very bags). I was really young, so it was very new and exciting for me.

>>6442680
Actually, I think lolita clothing-wise looks a lot more normal than it did in the past. The skirts have gotten shorter, overknee socks have lost the large lace, "normal" shoes and purses in lolita has become completely acceptable and incredibly common, and the silhouettes have gotten much smoother and less bumpby/lacey. However, the prints are much detailed and attention-getting (as opposed to solid colors), and the use of crazy wigs/circle lenses/deco-accessories has made it more costumish in another way. But the clothes themselves I think have started to reflect mainstream clothing a lot more than in the past (as far as silhouettes and length and lace usage, not in terms of print).

>>6443017
Thanks, I really appreciate any help!

I bought it off the LJ comm from an Australian seller. The seller didn't have any info on it. I think they just called it a Pink Rose Lace OP or something. It has no waist ties or shirring and the sleeves are detachable with little buttons.

>>6442783
I need that entire outfit on the right.

>>6443045
Just checked: they're from even later, 2007.

>>6443045
It's from a brandbook so it's from between '05 and '08-ish, so not really old-school, no. You are right in that it's more of the transitional phase. I just tossed it in for the people who like the transitional phase since I'd been posting a lot of super-old stuff.

>>6442346
...actually they even wore tons of wigs back then but no crazy colored ones besides Moon Kana.

>>6443077
It's actually really cool to see what things went last. I noticed that even now, BTSSB will still used headdresses in their promotional photos, even though they were nearly obsolete by 2007 or 08. They seem to still use some of the "old school" image for advertising. I wonder why?

I miss all the blonde wigs with sausage curls....

baby coord circa 2002

>>6443092
Me too. Anywhere i could get a wig like this?

>>6443115
When I was looking, all I could find was from Bodyline and F+F and their wig quality is sort of meh. Passable for cosplay, not necessarily for fashion.

>>6443067
For years I've been terrified to get into Lolita because of all the DO NOT BREAK rules. I've been interested since this ( >>6442196 ) image was first published, and back then your skirt had to be within, what, 3 inches of your knees or else you were WHOAAA a scandalous slut!! You also had to wear kneesocks and RHS, period, end of discussion. Your headdress had to be tasteful, very rarely would you use white-lace-on-black or else you'd be tacky. You had to wear a blouse with your JSKs or else *scandalous slut!!* Your petticoat would have to give your skirt a cupcake shape of else WHOAAA that's not the lolita silhouette!!

...and your post, right there, made me realize that my definition of lolita is outdated and would make for a very frumpy girl. Those rules I believed in for so long don't seem to exist anymore. Cripes, how things have changed.

>>6443068
I realize common sense says it looks old school, but humor me for a moment; did the seller say it was really old and/or is there anything other than the design that makes you think it's old? Also, are there tags in english?

>>6443148

Yep, they really have. Honestly, both in the US and in Japan (but ESPECIALLY in the US), the current popular style of lolita really emphasizes bringing in elements from other styles and using creativity. There's still things you should/should not do, but if you have decent taste and know what works, the rules are MUCH more flexible. The more stylish people break rules regularly and are still applauded for it, because they manage to do it in appropriate ways. The most popular lolitas seem to be the one combining high street/mainstream blouses, bags , jewelry and shoes with brand main-pieces (skirts/dresses). Or, combining other styles in with it, like dolly kei, mori girl, gyaru, otome kei (or at least, otome kei as it's known in the US), cult party, creepy-cute, etc with lolita pieces.

>>6443196
Slightly off-topic, but, what is "cult party" fashion?

A lot of this late 90s/early 2000s stuff just looks like regular 90s goth mixed with doll-type aesthetics. It doesn't seem too weird to me that it's so out of style now when 90s goth is so over too. But maybe I'm talking out of my ass here.

>>6443068
Found it. Ok, so, you were sold a partial set, which is why you couldn't find it in lolibrary, and why I couldn't find it anywhere even though it practically screams 2005-era BTSSB.

It's actually a set from 2010, Alice's Royal Tea Party Set, and the reason the dress is so old school looking, is because it's supposed to have an apron over it (hence the very simple design) http://lolibrary.org/node/3163 and because I'm pretty sure, it's a throw-back, design-wise, to the OP with Apron set they released on 2005 (http://lolibrary.org/node/4770))

image is the sax version sans sleeves and apron.

>>6443204
http://www.style-arena.jp/shop/dt/3/5?langType=en

>>6443148
I think the attitude towards other lolitas has also changed. Back in the early-mid 2000s, it was common to think that you had to ACT a certain way with the clothes you wore. You had to be a young lady, drink tea, act proper, always be modest, etc.

I don't know when this documentary was filmed, but
>part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iN9Hbu2w-I
>part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IhKLpcVa7-A
>part 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-xERf0TdBIc
>"Being a lolita is putting emphasis on what made a woman beautiful before, not what makes a woman beautiful today."
>"We reach young woman that do not want to identify themselves with other 12-13 year olds that wear booty shorts or try to have cleavage"
>"I like being able to be beautiful without being a bimbo.... You prance around half naked and any guy can whistle at you and think you're pretty. Why? Because you're half naked"

I'd like to think that people STILL don't continue to look 'down' on other girls because of how they dress, but the video really put a bad taste in my mouth :(

Lately I hear less and less about other girls dressing 'slutty,' unless it's a secret - USUALLY a troll - listed on BtB or someone just badmouthing others on CGL because of the anonymity. And this makes me much more happy to be involved in my lolita community, both online and in person.

Really, don't focus too much on the rules - think of it as a guideline. Our "lolita 10 commandments" (oh god, sorry for making a bible reference) evolves with us, but that does not mean that the past is wrong! Many still love the aesthetic views of sweet lolita because it reminds us less and less about all of these rules and more to focus on what WE think is pretty.

IDK SORRY FOR GOING OFF ON A TANGENT HERE'S A PRETTY DRAWING

>>6442604
Do noobs call everything they dislike "ageplay" now?

>>6443361
Do you have to call everyone you disagree with a "noob" to make yourself seem like more an experienced seagull?

I found a bunch of really old japanese lolita websites a few months ago. Really old as in there were photos from the late 90's on them. They seemed to be some sort of weird otaku lolita idol thing. I saved the hell out of the whole websites.

My folder of old school is all mixed up, so not all of these are from those sites.

Does anyone happen to remember this? And the huge shit storm it caused on EGL, despite the fact that this character dressed about a thousand times better than anyone on EGL at the time?

>>6443271
Oh wow, I even found the 2005 one and thought it was the one I had until I saw the bustle back.

Thanks again for finding it for me! I have no idea how I missed it. I'm a little sad it came without the apron, but I got the headbow so no real loss I suppose.

I'm pretty sure this is from the late 90s.

Pretty sure this is from the late 90s too. From one of those weird otaku idol typed japanese sites.

killl yourself

Can you please kill yourself?

>>6443445
I think I know this girl - she's so adorable and does amazing old school styled coordinates. She's quite tall but old-school works for her so well.

I love how old school looks - so thank you for this thread!

>>6443477
please tell for us noobs?

>>6438725
Thank you so much for this pic! It's a perfect image of the bag of my dreams!!!!
I've been having a hard time finding one

>>6443377
No, just the noobs.

>>6442482
You and me both anon.

On another note; When would you say oldschool changed over?

>>6443989
2006 to 2007 were kind of transitionary years, IMO, in between old and new school

>>6443989

2009? I think that's when maxipad headdresses stopped being ok, at least.

>>6443999
Maxipad headdresses were out of style long before 2009, though. More like 2006

>>6444005
Maybe 2007

>>6443999
>>6444005
I... I really like the rectangular headdresses...

>>6444011
As long as they look cute on you, and are good quality, who cares?

I hate to be the one to break this to you lolitas... but lolita shit has NEVER been "in style". They're costumes. You don't see people wearing this crap as a fashion anywhere outside harajuku.

Wear whatever lolita "style" you want. One is not more in or out than the other.

>>6444036
What about the stores outside Japan and the in Paris, San Fran, New York and other places like Osaka?

>>6444036
Oh sorry, let's just stop talking about the trends within lolita...... Because you say so. You've changed my whole point of view. Better watch where I step with all that knowledge you just dropped all over the place.

>>6444036
This was actually slightly motivational, in a way, I guess.

>>6444044
Costume stores for niche internet retards like yourself.

>>6444061
>calls us retards
>can't sage off topic comments
Well, I guess you won't be here long. Enjoy your stay while it lasts

Back on topic, behold glorious old school lolita

This has been interesting. I prefer the simpler color palettes, and like how so many girls are wearing shorter skirts, but I think I like the modern Lolita silhouette better.

>>6442710
Jesus, they didn't disappear that long ago, did they?

>>6444217
Didn't they come back with an Etsy store not so long ago, and then disappear again just as quickly?

Man, I'd forgotten how much I love old school. I only got into lolita as a lurker a few years ago (like 2008/2009 ish?), but my only resource was the US bible, which had translated content from 2004/2005. I remember discovering egl for the first time in like 2011, seeing the kawaii pastel explosion stuff and being like 'wtf happened'. I still prefer this style to what it is now, especially old school sweet.

Buming with In The Starlight because up until 2011 I thought they were still going, and I was pretty sad when I realized they weren't.

> tl;dr got into lolita because of old school years after old school happened, was confused by ott sweet, still prefer old school

>>6444399
Yes, they closed again because they hardly had any sales because for prices you could buy plenty of higher quality clothes at taobao.

I remember paying almost $200 for a dress when they had their 'popular' stage just to get my order done faster and with express shipping, now I can't even sell it for $40.

>>6442710
Back when their catalogue was entirely made to order instead of limited/dress-by-dress, I used to go through their entire site and list allllll the things I would buy once I got a job (I was 16 at the time)

I wish I still had this skirt, it was really nice

Most of these - Outside some of the more ill-fitting ones - Look a lot classier and much more attractive than the neon sweet cake in your hair stuff I see going on now. (Which really made me hate the whole subculture since it seemed to just take over everything.)

Didn't really like Lolita outside Classic until now but this "old school" sweet actually looks really cute.
The old-school gothic stuff really stood out as well and I'll be blunt in saying I'd find a woman wearing those older outfits quite attractive.
Thanks ladies.

Love,
Random Creepy Male Anon

>>6443115
Gothic Lolita Wigs has them. They're called 'ringlet' or something like that

>>6445191
This is cosplay

>>6443133
Bodyline's wigs are even better then GLW ones, they just make very bad photos.

Pic releated.

>>6445546
...and because we are talking about the ringlet ones.

Some very old Meta.

>>6445577
Damn, I'd love to get one of these but they'd probably be impossible to reset once they get frizzied out of place by wear :( How much product is in it to set the curls?

>>6445631
You just reset them the same way as curly wigs with the hot wather method but you need something that holds the ringlets's shape for that.

>>6442482
<3

I first learned about lolita around 2008, 2009 and that was when OTT was starting to appear. It was the old school stuff and the predominance of aristocrat styles that I particularly remember that made me fall in love. I was told that the rules were strict and that's what I loved, though I never seemed to see it overly enforced through bitching and snark. Lolita Secrets were generally pretty same, with the most awful secrets just being about sexual abuse, rather than secrets about fat/race/gender hate. I still stick by the rules and think that if you're not serious about covering that collarbone, those shoulders and thighs, then you're not a true lolita and just someone who wants to play dress-ups. That's the way I learned lolita and I'm hard pressed to change my mind now.
And I just want to point out, black with white lace was never a no-no, it was just a "noobs avoid and to be done by experienced lolitas only." Sort of like a right of passage, showing your skill with the fashion by coordinating a blackxwhite and not look like shit.

>>6445962
>>6445969
Why so many lace monsters in old-school Lolita?

>>6445974
jane mai is one of my favorite lolitas. lolita crush

>>6446165
>>6446165
Old School is Old School. Lace monsters are lace monsters.

2-3 rows of decent lace, does not a milanoo monster make.

>>6444061
>>6444036

Wow what the fuck is wrong with you? Your dog die or something?