/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.953968]

I have about 80k in holdings (mostly shares) and I'm thinking, shouldn't I just take it out and enjoy my youth? I could buy a nice car, get a better apartment, have parties etc. instead of saving it for a time that I will most likely not be able to have as much fun as I can now?

[Anonymous No.954188]

>>953968
It depends entirely on how you view life.

This isn't exactly a business question but a philosophical one. But in some sense you could make it a business question.

You risk dying before your retirement and never ever seeing that money of yours. So taking it out now you ensure you avoid that risk and enjoy your life as much as possible. You can also hedge your bets that you'll survive and just try to make as much as possible.

Prevailing wisdom is to remember to enjoy your money but not to the point you lose it all. Don't spend! Save! mentalities are a result of idiots that spend and never save. Going full blast in the other direction isn't smart either.

If you're unhappy with your apartment and your car go buy but don't go out to get a new car because "Well it's better and more expensive."

By all means throw parties and take vacations though. Just don't do it at a rate where you'll still be continuing to amass your wealth.

[Anonymous No.954192]

>>954188
Lol, just don't do it at a rate where you'll be continually losing money*

You should still be growing, just don't be concerned with saving ALL your money in order to maximize your wealth.

[Anonymous No.954197]

>>953968

You should really do this. Now is literally the best time for it

[Anonymous No.954492]

>>953968
Just note that $1 invested today will be, at a 8% annual return, worth $22 40 years from now.

[Anonymous No.955231]

>>954188

>Don't spend! Save! mentalities are a result of idiots that spend and never save

I honestly know more people that save everything than people who blow everything.

[Anonymous No.955238]

>>954492
>Just note that $1 invested today will be, at a 8% annual return, worth $22 40 years from now.

And so what?
Assuming op is around 20, you'll be 60+ years old. When you're 60 it doesn't even matter if you $3million or $10million. You'll have wished you worked less in your youth and spent more money on fun.

[Anonymous No.955240]

>>953968
I would say no, but if you want to do things like that, simply don't put as much into it, instead spending it on fun.

Just remember, you want to have fun later in life too. And the older you get the more expensive fun becomes.

[Anonymous No.955445]

>>955238
>When you're 60 it doesn't even matter if you $3million or $10million.
The difference in retirement lifestyle between $3m and $10m is pretty significant. The former is quite comfy, but the latter allows almost unlimited freedom and luxury plus the certainty of leaving a strong legacy to your children and grandchildren.

I realize you won't appreciate this because you're young and either of these numbers seem unimaginable and unattainable to you. But that's not an excuse for giving bad advice. Ruin your own life if you want, but ruining someone else's is just evil.

[Anonymous No.955537]

>>955445
I think the point was that when you're 60+ with a wrecked body, high chance of physical or mental disability and swallowing pills everyday just to survive, the fact that you have 10million won't matter much.

You're never going to reach old age and wish "man I really should've worked more and pinched every shekel like a kike when I was younger".

[Anonymous No.955561]

>>955537
>60+ with a wrecked body, high chance of physical or mental disability and swallowing pills everyday
Is this some stupid meme you fell for? You do know the AVERAGE lifespan in civilized countries is above 80 years, right? Stop being stupid.

[Anonymous No.955573]

>>955561
Yes you can survive to 80, but you're not really living. You're pretty much a vegetable that's physical and mental abilities are fleeting and doesn't understand the new world and its culture, everyone is sick of and wants to get away from.

Visit a retirement home sometime senpai. Look at the sadness in their eyes. All the money in the world doesn't help them. Ask them what they regret not doing in life, 100% chance none will say "Work more and spend less money so I could be a little richer right now!".

[Anonymous No.955594]

>>953968

Learn how to save and put it all in low-cost index funds.

[Anonymous No.955598]

>>955573
>You're pretty much a vegetable that's physical and mental abilities are fleeting and doesn't understand the new world and its culture, everyone is sick of and wants to get away from.
I'm sorry that your trailer trash family dies at 52 from chain-smoking menthols and huffing glue. I'm sorry that you'll fall into the same patterns and die early too. Not that anything of value will be lost, and I suppose if I'm being honest, I'm not sorry at all. Darwinism is brutal but ultimately fair. Your gene pool just doesn't doesn't good things.

Meanwhile, the 60 years in my family are active, vibrant and fit. They have complete and fulfilling lives filled with travel, socializing, hobbies, great cuisine.

I'd try to give you some advice, to maybe pull you out of the depressive funk that has gripped your life and plunged you into the nightmare of being a stupid NEET with no future. But some people are a lost case. Sorry kid, life is cruel.

[Anonymous No.955612]

>>955598
Lmao you're a probably a NEET as well and lashing out at others if you're on this board.

If you aren't, well enjoy your shitty life working all day through your best years. You deserve it buddy, one day when you're old you'll look at piles of money instead of memories and feel good.

[Anonymous No.955628]

>>955612
Oh wow, so I really struck a nerve huh? I haven't seen someone this triggered in a long time. Sorry (not sorry) kid.

No, I'm not a NEET and I don't regret working hard in my youth. I've successfully secured my future comfort and enjoyment for all the decades that I stroll this Earth. If I should become ill, I'm guaranteed the best and most effective healthcare in existence. And I'll leave a legacy that assures that my name will be remembered fondly my family as well as the countless strangers who's lives I've improved and will improve.

Who will remember you, anon? Would anyone want to?

[Anonymous No.955649]

>>955628
>I've successfully secured my future comfort and enjoyment for all the decades that I stroll this Earth. If I should become ill, I'm guaranteed the best and most effective healthcare in existence.

And yet you're right here with me on 4chan's business roleplay board.

Shouldn't someone like you with lots of money be actually doing things? Or do you enjoy pretending you have a lot of money?
Go spend some of your money to blow off steam then pal.

[Anonymous No.955661]

>>955649
>And yet you're right here with me on 4chan's business roleplay board.
You're such a schmuck its almost worth the effort to prove you wrong. But I'm not sure anything positive would be accomplished other than making you feel worse than you already do, and I'm not an evil person. Life has already dealt you a tough hand.

>Shouldn't someone like you with lots of money be actually doing things?
Why? I live off the interest and dividends in my investment portfolio, having long ago stopped needing to work. So I'm sitting here catching up on some TV while recovering from a long and exciting weekend of football games that I attended with family and friends. Making a few posts on 4chan at the same time isn't exactly taxing of my energies.

You're being pathetic, and I'm starting to feel bad about making you feel worse. But someone needs to give you a wake up call, kid. If not me, then who will?

[Anonymous No.955666]

>>955661
>is supposedly successful, living off investments
>STILL posts actively for hours on a website for NEETs during the day on a Monday

Yeah no you're not.

Anyone successful wouldn't be going out of his way to keep insulting and making assumptions about someone who disagreed with him and proposed a differing opinion, not even insulting you.

Keep roleplaying tho, supposed "rich guy" who's on a website of people he deems inferior. Look at the strawpoll senpai. 70% of the board is NEET or in college with no job.

[Anonymous No.955684]

>>955666
>Anyone successful wouldn't be going out of his way to keep insulting
I insult people on /biz/ because its part of 4chan culture. Maybe you're still a newfag, but we don't treat people with kid gloves here. Not to mention, the anonymity of the site lets me educate people like you without the wasted effort of being civil or polite. The message gets across much faster and much more succinctly, as evidence by the timidity in your recent posts.

>making assumptions about someone
I make assumptions because I'm an astute observer of human nature and have a lot of experience with a broad cross section of people. You're not a special snowflake, and like most other NEETs, you all share the same fundamental character flaws and biases. Nothing particular about you is sufficiently noteworthy to make my assumptions wrong.

Don't like it? Then stop being a meme. Become a more well-rounded person with intelligent and studied viewpoints. Until then, into the box you go.

>who's on a website of people he deems inferior
I never said anyone was inferior. I said you were stupid, deeply flawed, and have poor life prospects. So yes, I judge you harshly, but these are objective facts. And because I stuck a nerve, that makes you feel inferior. But don't project your insecurities onto me.

>supposed "rich guy"
And what if I provided proof that I'm wealthy? Would that make you any less stupid? Would that imply my judgement are more or less meritorious?

If the only reason you can function in the face of withering criticism (that you know is accurate) is to accuse me of lying about my net worth, what does that say about you? Worse yet, what if you're wrong?

Be careful what you wish for, kid.

[Anonymous No.955685]

>>955666
I'm a petrol engineer in the middle of nowhere rn. I have a satellite internet connection which allows me to shitpost in a truck while some lowlives set up the dynamite. You got rek't

[Anonymous No.955697]

>>955684
You're the one that seems to be projecting.

You're supposedly "very successful" yet you're on a board for NEETS, refreshing this thread every 20 mins for the last 4 hours. On a weekday. Yeah sounds believable.


I simply said that most older people usually regret things they didn't experience rather than taking copious amounts of stimulants and caffeine to earn $150k/yr or whatever.

You then somehow inferred that my family was trailer trash and I will die early just like them, all because I disagreed with your opinion.
- Now being that bitter doesn't really sound like something a successful person such as yourself would do. I would think when you're successful you actually enjoy things and are calm, instead of insulting people on an anonymous image board.

Mind telling me how you earned all your wealth and how old you are? I would be interested in hearing your next lies.
>Is supposedly successful and financially independent
>STILL comes to 4chan and rages like a retard, calls things "memes"
Lmao tbqh, kill yourself NEET

[Anonymous No.955713]

>>955697
>on a board for NEETS
It's a board for discussing business and finance. That you NEETs showed up is an unhappy coincidence.

>for the last 4 hours
Do you have any idea how much good television gets aired on Saturdays and Sundays? I know this won't make sense to you, but I was travelling, socializing, dining, and enjoying other forms of outdoor entertainment all weekend. I've got a considerable backlog of shows to catch up on.

>Mind telling me how you earned all your wealth and how old you are?
I'm in my 40's and I was a highly paid professional, until I retired recently. I'm sorry that you think there's an age limitation on browsing 4chan, but it doesn't work that way. Sure, some people become boring as they get older and move on. Me, well, I haven't lost my demented sense of humor yet.

It's funny how you stopped making rational arguments after I called you out for being so stupid. As a reminder, you claimed that all 60-year olds are senile vegetables living in hospices. Care to get back on topic, or would you rather continue down this path that leads to your continued humiliation?

[Anonymous No.955719]

>>955666
52% NEET or in college with no job or WITH a job but making less than 12k.
Not 70%.

[Anonymous No.955725]

>>955713
So you're in your 40's huh.

Married? Have kids?

Isn't there something else you should be doing besides sitting on 4chan and watching TV?

Again, what did you do to earn enough money to retire in your 40's? What was your job?

[Anonymous No.955736]

You have an +80k safety net, and you're going to piss it away? Are you mentally incontinent? You obviously are not struggling for survival, nor have any reluctance to invest, what is the problem? Keep doing what you're doing, and have fun on the weekend or take a damn vacation, that's what they are for

[Anonymous No.955750]

>>955725

You do realize that sometimes people like to just relax and do nothing at all, right?

Maybe his kids were at school and wife was doing something else.

[Anonymous No.955753]

>>955750
Yeah and he happens to go on 4chan all day. Especially /biz/ lmao.

What could a financially independent or successful person get from this board? It's literally memes, buy index funds or cryptocurrency shilling.

[Anonymous No.955771]

>>955753
>What could a financially independent or successful person get from this board?
I teach young people to avoid some of the financial mistakes that I made. People like you. I teach people like you to be less stupid.

And, on occasion, there are some very interesting threads and some insightful discussion. 4chan is unique that people can discuss things without applying the filter of political correctness or worrying about their reputation or their upvotes. In can, sometimes, lead to fascinating and heated debate.

>It's literally memes, buy index funds
That you would make this statement about index funds shows I still have a lot of work to do. If you wanted to start being less stupid you could start by basing your core portfolio around index funds so that you won't have such a shitty life later on.

If you wanted to have a non-meme discussion, you are free to start a non-meme thread. Make it interesting and and relevant, and people will come.

But you're not actually interested in any of that. You lie and claim that you are, but your posts prove otherwise. You want to perpetuate stupid meme threads by arguing against investment, against financial planning, against index funds, against the possibility that someone here might have infinitely more knowledge of business and financial than you.

I really don't to make this thread about me or my wealth. Its off topic and ultimately derails what is otherwise a legitimate and interesting question posed by OP.

tl;dr You're complaining that /biz/ is full of shit posts in a thread where your only contributions have been shit posts

The irony is palpable.

[Anonymous No.955773]

>>953968

It's about balance. Make a plan for retirement like: I want to retire in 15 years. Then you should have financial checkpoints along the way. If you're well above those checkpoints, you can spend the excess on fun stuff. Or, sacrifice and work one extra year and blow a year's worth of savings on fun, but throughout several years.

[Anonymous No.955776]

>>955753
>What could a financially independent or successful person get from this board?
I teach young people to avoid some of the financial mistakes that I made. People like you. I teach people like you to be less stupid.

And, on occasion, there are some very interesting threads and some insightful discussion. 4chan is unique that people can discuss things without applying the filter of political correctness or worrying about their reputation or their upvotes. It can, sometimes, lead to fascinating and heated debate.

>It's literally memes, buy index funds
That you would make this statement about index funds shows I still have a lot of work to do. If you wanted to start being less stupid you could start by basing your core portfolio around index funds so that you won't have such a shitty life later on.

If you wanted to have a non-meme discussion, you are free to start a non-meme thread. Make it interesting and and relevant, and people will come.

But you're not actually interested in any of that. You lie and claim that you are, but your posts prove otherwise. You want to perpetuate stupid meme threads by arguing against investment, against financial planning, against index funds, against the possibility that someone here might have infinitely more knowledge of business and finance than you.

I really don't to make this thread about me or my wealth. Its off topic and ultimately derails what is otherwise a legitimate and interesting question posed by OP.

tl;dr You're complaining that /biz/ is full of shit posts in a thread where your only contributions have been shit posts

The irony is palpable.

[Anonymous No.955792]

>>955776
My entire point was that spending money in your youth isnt bad. Rational people would much rather enjoy a few vacations and a nice car(if they can afford it) over saving for their retirement.

When you need Viagra to keep an erection all the escorts in the world won't matter tbqh.

[Anonymous No.955817]

>>955792
>My entire point was that spending money in your youth isnt bad.
No it wasn't. We aren't so stupid that we can't scroll up and see what you actually wrote, faggot.

You claimed that saving is bad because everyone will be feeble and dying by the time they turn 60. That's your direct and actual statement.

>Honest question: why do you keep coming back for more abuse? Do you have no self-esteem at all? You're like a little kid who keeps touching a hot stove.

[Anonymous No.955967]

>>955817
>No it wasn't. We aren't so stupid that we can't scroll up and see what you actually wrote, faggot.

[Anonymous No.955985]

start some sort of business.

[Anonymous No.956002]

>>953968
Yeah dude buy a Maserati tomorrow #yolo #youngwildandfree

[Anonymous No.956007]

>>956002
>Yeah dude buy a Maserati tomorrow #yolo #youngwildandfree

Nah bro save all ur money for when ur old and weak XDDDDD!

Maybe when you're 75 you can pay the nurse that cleans your poop and brings you water to suck your penis with your saved million X:D)

[Anonymous No.956013]

>>956007
Back to /b/ or back twice to reddit

[Anonymous No.956015]

>>956013
Back to 9gag tbqh

go on senpai, if you work extra hard to make your boss richer maybe he'll reward you with an extra week unpaid vacation!

[Anonymous No.956023]

>>955697
>tbqh
>>955792
>tbqh
>>955697
>tbqh

Why are you samefagging on your phone? Did mommy kick you off the 'puter?

>You never answered my question about your lack of self-esteem. Looking forward to your reply...

[Anonymous No.956029]

>>956023
>He thinks tbqh is an uncommon meme

Search 'tbqh' in /biz/ or any board really archive f a m
tbqh

[Anonymous No.956038]

>>956023
>tbqh

Because desu is getting transformed into something else lad

[Anonymous No.956042]

>>956029
>control-f "tbqh"
>"3 found"
>all same shit posts
>all same retarded phrasing
>all same poor grammar
All your posts.

Sorry chief, you got rekt. Again.

>1 [phone]
>Please use this kid, seriously.

[Anonymous No.956052]

>>956042
>Retarded NEET masquerading as cool businessman thinks he beat anyone

tbqh I just read your posts and I'm wondering, do you think you're fooling anyone?

You are a Neet

[Anonymous No.956062]

Yes spend all your money now and slave away for the next 40 years, that's the sensible thing to do

[Anonymous No.956065]

>>956062
>Save all your money for 40 years then spend it when you can't make use of it anymore

[Anonymous No.956066]

lol at the ass blasted NEET in this thread.

On topic though:
OP, you have got to be nearing the point where your gains pass the amount you are actively contributing. From there it's only a few years until you will start passively making more than you spend in a year and can live freely. Don't blow your load to early.

[Anonymous No.956069]

>>956065
>Not retiring at your 30's
Nice fedora memes though, makes your asshurt from this whole thread palpable

[Anonymous No.956075]

>>956069
>>Not retiring at your 30's

>Implying you will, or know anyone in person who has retired in their 30's

I get it you may have read mr maymaystache's blog but my Jewish friend, you will not retire at 30.

Even being generous and giving you a $100k/yr salary, after taxes and necessities(unless you live with your parents and don't pay for anything), you won't be left with much, saving to even $1million will take a significant amount of time and $1milli isn't even that much for financial independence.

[Anonymous No.956082]

>>956075
Out of curiosity, what part of mmm makes you think it can't be done?

[Anonymous No.956089]

>>956082
The fact that he pinches every single shekel he can get his hands on, practically living like a homeless man just to retire a few years early, has a shitskin wife, and overall is just devaluing his life just so that he can save a tiny bit of money.

Whatever tho, it's obviously better to have "tons" of money than meaningful memories and experiences, especially when you're young and flexible.

[Anonymous No.956095]

>>954492
And at 2% inflation, that $22 is only worth $10 after accounting for inflation.

[Anonymous No.956101]

>>956089
I dunno man. Him personally seems to be in the prime of his life and making a whole lot more meaningful memories doing what he is rather than being a wage slave.

Myself, at my current saving rate and with 4% actualized return, I'm going to to have 1 million around the age of 43, which will provide more than enough to live on.

[Anonymous No.956105]

>>956101
>Shitskin wife
>Lives like a stereotypical Jew meme
>Runs a shit blog to scrape up some money from morons

>Prime of his life

[Anonymous No.956107]

>>956069
>>956066
>#NEETREKT

[Anonymous No.956110]

>>956107
>neet roleplaying thinks he's a better neet than a neet

Senpai i am literally a hedge fund manager

[Anonymous No.956115]

>>956110
>NEET getting mocked for his stupidity for 12 hours straight
Kid I am literally a multi-millionaire

>Protip: one of us is telling the truth

[Anonymous No.956126]

>>956115
>>Protip: one of us is telling the truth

And it's me

>mfw you will literally roleplay for a few more years until your parents kick you out while i am an actual hedge fund manager

pic related, it's literally my face literally laughing at u

[Anonymous No.956144]

>>956105
im curious what his actual salary was when he was working. didnt he say he only had a real job for like 5 years or something?

[Anonymous No.956157]

>>956144
Honestly the "financial independence" meme has been really popular lately. It can't just be me but I've seen dozens of these sorts of blogs and YouTube channels.

They all talk about this "big secret" about cutting expenses, moving to Thailand/Phillipines/Venezuela/Somalia and living like a king, as if no one else discovered it yet, and as if it's actually good to live in a 3rd world country

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.956223]

>>956126
>And it's me
No, it's not.

Game over man.

[Anonymous No.956225]

>>956223
>#Rekt

Hello iHaz. Nice to see you still visit /biz/.

[Lambright for POTUS No.956242]

>>956223
that's legit.

[Anonymous No.956248]

>>956144
most he made individually in a year was around 160k adjusted for inflation i think

[Anonymous No.956255]

>>956223
Pretty good for an english major.

[Anonymous No.956256]

>>956223

Do you ever wish you had a family of your own? Part of me wishes I went your route.

[Anonymous No.956259]

>>956223

Hey iHaz if you're still here I need some advice relevant to this thread

I'm in my late 20s, running a small business I started in my early 20s. Right now I take home shit, like 65k/yr, and I basically blow all of it on lifestyle banking on a big payout when I sell the business down the track. Right now my stake is worth around 500k according to our most recent valuation, but we are still growing rapidly, doubling revenue every year.

Right now I only save a few hundred bucks per month and live like a baller, but I could easily save 10-15k/yr if I lived like a normal person. I have no debt and like 20k in other assets including my car.

Is it necessary to save my salary at all given my situation?

[Anonymous No.956266]

>>956223
Btfo

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.956317]

>>956255
>Pretty good for an english major.
I know, right? I can't help but chuckle every time I see English on the "shit tier" list of majors.

>>956256
>Do you ever wish you had a family of your own?
Sure, I think about the "road not taken" from time to time. But at the end of the day, I know how I'm wired. I'm not good at compromising, and I pretty much want things my way all the time. That's not a good recipe for a long-term relationship of equals.

>>956259
Necessary? I guess not, considering you've got an appreciating asset (the business) that's outpacing the average return of the market anyway. In theory, you could justify your approach on the grounds that you're investing in the future return of the business.

I should also point out that I've never advised people to live like paupers solely to increase their savings rate. I'm not a fan of "extreme retirement" and I believe that FIRE gurus like MMM are a bit scammy.

However, I seriously question whether it's a prudent approach. You're putting all your eggs into one basket, with no guarantee that the business will grow or even retain its value. One bad lawsuit, change in the market, new regulation, or whatever ... and suddenly your business is worth 25% of its former value.

You'll think I'm exaggerating, but recall that I've done lots of business bankruptcy cases. I've seen former million dollar companies sell for pennies, sometimes due to no fault of the owner.

If you're smart, you always have a plan B. Saving a chunk of your income should be your plan B. It'll be there in case the business doesn't provide enough for your future, or in case you need to start over for any reason. (Important to note that your 401k and IRA can't be seized by creditors, while your business can and will be taken from you if the shit hits the fan).

If you're smart enough to run a successful business, then you should be smart enough to find some middle ground.

[Anonymous No.956319]

>>956317
Hey iHaz, could you give me a super short synopsis of what you do?

I see English degree and business bankruptcy. Sounds like law? But your accounts look like you've done a lot of investing.

I'm just interested because I currently work at a law firm that deals with finances and I'm really looking to get into that field.

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.956340]

>>956319
>could you give me a super short synopsis of what you do?
Sure. I primarily do corporate restructurings, including bankruptcy. I've also worked on a variety of structured finance, private equity, and secured lending transactions. I worked in Biglaw for almost 20 years, including several years as a capital partner. Later, I opened my own firm.

[Anonymous No.956355]

>>956317

Thanks man, I am >>956259, I have changed computer so not sure if ID will persist

I really don't want to reduce my current quality of life, but based on your advice I think I will hold here for a while, and anything more I manage to pay myself in the next few years I'll stick straight into ETFs

I'm not a fan of extreme retirement either, in fact I probably won't ever fully retire. People decline rapidly after they retire. I want to own businesses as long as I can mentally handle it. Work 2 half-days per week and enjoy the other 5.

[Anonymous No.956362]

>>956340
I was in that thread where you got that other faggot who was talking about market timings.
You used the same time stamp.

You are actually a pretty good troll - baiting these neets with the 'kid' line and then they cant help but spring in the trap.

I like it keep it up.

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.956371]

>>956362
>I like it keep it up.
Thanks man. To be fair, I gave him every opportunity to stop calling me a liar, but even I have my limits. Just goes to show ... you never know who's on the other end of the computer.

[Anonymous No.956507]

>>956340
Thanks for the taking the time.

[Anonymous No.956859]

>>956362
He's posting for more than one year. He gave several other proofs. What he says is sensible, and his story is credible.

You have no reason to think he lies. After all, having more than $10 million is not that extraordinary, if you invest in low-cost index funds for 20+ years.

[Anonymous No.957341]

>>954492
Wait, is that number accurate? I wonder how many after 25. 30. Is there a site I can find these numbers?

Shit I need to step up my game.

[Anonymous No.957353]

>>955445
>>955561
>>955598
>>955628
>>955661
>>955684
>>955713
>>955776
>>955817
Dude I love you. Can you please be a trip. We need a lot more of you. Schooling a lot more kids like him.
Pretty please.
We can call you PawPaw.

[Anonymous No.957412]

>>955537
>You're never going to reach old age and wish "man I really should've worked more and pinched every shekel like a kike when I was younger".

You know that literally every single 50+ year old adult I've ever talked to has said that exact thing? All of them, across the board, wished they had saved more and wasted less.

Pro tip: most of the things you're spending money on are shit and will always be shit. That money is far, far more valuable than the things you're buying.

[Anonymous No.957416]

>>955713
>I'm in my 40's and I was a highly paid professional, until I retired recently
Aha, knew it was you. How's it going iHaz? Are you enjoying your retirement that you took waaaay too long to start?

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.957748]

>>957416
>Are you enjoying your retirement that you took waaaay too long to start?
Things are good, thanks. It's been interesting to see how people react IRL when I tell them that I've stopped working. Most either want to know how much it takes to do that, or, they think I'm crazy for not wanting to keep working.

>>957412
>All of them, across the board, wished they had saved more and wasted less.
This, +1, upvoted, liked, and subscribed.

Not to mention, I've literally NEVER heard anyone in their 40's, 50's or 60's say, "I wish I'd saved less when I was younger."

[Anonymous No.957776]

>>957748
iHaz, do you own any bitcoins?

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.957844]

>>957776
>do you own any bitcoins?
I do not. Bitcoin is not an investment. It's a speculative gamble on the adoption rate of the technology, and therefore it does not fit within my investing criteria.

I'll admit that I'm very intrigued by the concept of cryptocurrency, and it wouldn't surprise me if the technology eventually takes root, but I don't think Bitcoin will be the surviving protocol. Unless Bitcoin adopts features that address fraud and charge-back needs, it will never be accepted by mainstream financial institutions. However, these features are incompatible with the zealous commitment of Bitcoiners to perfect anonymity. And the market for an anonymous currency is miniscule compared to the market for a fully-functioning reversible mode of value exchange. Because anonymity and reversibility cannot peacefully co-exist within the Bitcoin protocol (to the best of my knowledge), I think Bitcoin will wither on the vine.

My guess is that some other protocol -- likely one developed by or with the support of the government -- will be the cryptocoin that actually takes hold and garners real and sustained public support.

As such, I don't have any rationale reason to own Bitcoin or any other current cryptocurrency at the present time.

[Anonymous No.957846]

>>953968
Just take out 20k and go an adventure. When you come back, you'll still have 60k saved up and be better off for it.

[Anonymous No.957854]

>>957844
Considering you are a millionaire what would you say is the lowest amount you would need to retire/be FI in your 40s

[Anonymous No.957902]

>>954492
>assuming you'll cash out before a recession
>assuming the 8% AVERAGE over the last 100 years continues
>assuming you don't live in a 30 year period of subpar growth

That 8% number is a fucking meme

[Anonymous No.957907]

>>953968
Here's the deal: I save a large sum of my money because I'm happy being a home body. I've traveled alot, and right now at this point in my life, I feel like staying home in my spare time. That being said I don't just save for retirement. I save in case I get laid off at 55 and am unemployable in my field. That way I don't have to eat cat food so I can pay my mortgage. At least then I can cruise to 591/2 to start withdrawing from retirement funds. My ultimate goal is to run out of money by 80-85 since, and let's be honest, I'll likely be in some nursing home and can't enjoy the money anyway. Might as well live off the govt dole and hope my family visits me for an hour on christmas.

>inb4 hurr durr don't pick a stupid field
Anyone saying this must have a crystal ball and can predict the future. For all we know in 25 years some fields will be god tier and others shit.

[Anonymous No.957908]

>>953968>>954192

Basically this.

If you're blowing all your money you'll just be fucked. Spend but spend with some foresight. Enjoy yourself but don't sacrifice your future. It's not worth clawing for instant gratification over the course of a year, after which it'll get stale, while forfeiting comfort for many years to follow.

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.957922]

>>957854
>what would you say is the lowest amount you would need to retire/be FI in your 40s
Impossible question to answer with any specificity because it depends so much on the quality and type of life you're willing to accept, and the things you're willing to compromise to get there.

My "minimum" numbers are much larger than would be applicable to most people. It's not that I'm out of touch with reality; it's that my goals are much larger than simple financial independence or extreme retirement. Indeed, as I have stated before, I personally think that there are fundamental flaws with the extreme retirement philosophy ... most notably that it simply replaces one type of financial stress (maximizing income and savings) with another (living for decades with a limited asset pool).

So for me, that meant my "minimum" amount included a huge discretionary bucket (for quality of life) and a huge cushion bucket (to eliminate risk and stress).

I'm not trying to dodge your question, but rather I'm hoping to explain why my "minimum" may not be informative or illustrative for you.

With that long-winded disclaimer out of the way, for me -- for my lifestyle, my wants, and my goals -- I was not comfortable giving up my earned income until I had accumulated between $3-4m in investable assets, which I projected to safety provide at least $120K annually.

[Anonymous No.957989]

>>957922
Nah that was what I was asking,
saw your statements on vanguard a couple of days ago and was wondering what a millionaire considers comfortable retirement income.

[Anonymous No.958007]

>>957922
Hello ihaz, i've been following your posts for quite some time now, but i have never interacted with you. With that said, I quite like your frame of mind and I wanted to ask you a question.

I'm a neet that is having currently a quarter life crisis; as I look back i'm 26 and have nothing to show for it, except a meager college credits of a course I didn't complete yet.

I can't help but keep having toughts that its too late, and by now I should've been much farther in life (at least a fucking graduation) and so, at this point its too late to even try and reverse it.

Considering how I fucked college almost ireversibily, i'm thinking about starting a business of my own and trying on a new path, but i can't help but feel its too late for that as well.

So my question is this, since college is sliping, is to late to start a bussines, learn how to invest and begin a new? is 27 too old?

Also you've mentioned above you made quite a few mistakes? Could you tell me more? Any major fuck ups?

Anyways thanks man, hoping to hear from you.

[Anonymous No.958132]

>>958007
In no way is 26-27 too old to get your financial house in order. You still have 30-40 years before the normal retirement age, which is plenty of time to compound your savings into a nice nest egg.

The bottom line is that you've got to make your current income your number one priority. Everything about financial health starts with your income. Be honest about your skills and talents, and find a path that provides a steady wage or salary. Work on improving yourself and your prospects so that your income increases with time.

As for starting a business, if you truly have the skillset to start your own business and see it through, then great. But most people don't. And you don't have a huge cushion of time to spend too many more years without getting on an upward income track. Taking risks is part of life. So is knowing when not to take risks.

The rest of the picture is pretty easy once you have a steady income. So easy, in fact, that you shouldn't even worry about it. Just save as much as is reasonable in your circumstances. Set aside an emergency fund in cash covering 3-6 months normal living expenses. Then invest in diversified, low-cost index funds for the core of your account (a Vanguard all-in-one fund is a great place to start). Don't touch your savings except in cases of real emergency. All really simple stuff, really. So don't stress about it. Job first; the rest comes later.

>Also you've mentioned above you made quite a few mistakes? Could you tell me more? Any major fuck ups?
Nothing major, thankfully. I've been excessively reckless in my early investing, and came close to getting badly burned by the dot-com bubble. My carefree dalliances into options and margin trading added way more risk than I realized and that I should have been comfortable bearing. Fortunately I had sufficient gains to offset the inevitable losses that it didn't set me backwards, but it easily could have been quite bad for me.

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.958134]

>>958007
In no way is 26-27 too old to get your financial house in order. You still have 30-40 years before the normal retirement age, which is plenty of time to compound your savings into a nice nest egg.

The bottom line is that you've got to make your current income your number one priority. Everything about financial health starts with your income. Be honest about your skills and talents, and find a path that provides a steady wage or salary. Work on improving yourself and your prospects so that your income increases with time.

As for starting a business, if you truly have the skillset to start your own business and see it through, then great. But most people don't. And you don't have a huge cushion of time to spend too many more years without getting on an upward income track. Taking risks is part of life. So is knowing when not to take risks.

The rest of the picture is pretty easy once you have a steady income. So easy, in fact, that you shouldn't even worry about it. Just save as much as is reasonable in your circumstances. Set aside an emergency fund in cash covering 3-6 months normal living expenses. Then invest in diversified, low-cost index funds for the core of your account (a Vanguard all-in-one fund is a great place to start). Don't touch your savings except in cases of real emergency. All really simple stuff, really. So don't stress about it. Job first; the rest comes later.

>Also you've mentioned above you made quite a few mistakes? Could you tell me more? Any major fuck ups?
Nothing major, thankfully. I've been excessively reckless in my early investing, and came close to getting badly burned by the dot-com bubble. My carefree dalliances into options and margin trading added way more risk than I realized and that I should have been comfortable bearing. Fortunately I had sufficient gains to offset the inevitable losses that it didn't set me backwards, but it easily could have been quite bad for me.

[Anonymous No.958188]

>>957341
It's just math mate.

1 * 1.08^40

[Anonymous No.958201]

>>958134

>index funds

As a fellow Vanguardfag with a lot of his eggs in index funds, this worries me somewhat:

http://www.morningstar.com/cover/videocenter.aspx?id=718639

[iHaz !MILLiOnz/Q No.958235]

>>958201
It should worry you to a degree. Or more accurately stated, you should factor it into your expectations and planning. Jack has been pretty accurate about his 10-year bond return predictions, but much less accurate about his 10-year equity return predictions. Despite that, he may very well be correct that the next 10 years might show lean equity returns.

The real question, though, is what to do with this information. Not investing isn't an option because that has a guaranteed negative real return. Active investing (as opposed to to indexing) suffers from the same deficiencies in bear markets and bull markets, historically. Real estate, international investing, and alternative investing each could outperform ... and could easily underperform as well. Speculative gambles like forex, commodities, and cryptocurrencies are still crap shoots.

So at the end of the day, we're left to rely on the principles of diversification. Spread your bets around so you don't miss the hot sectors, whatever they may be. Also, ten years of slow markets (if it happens) isn't that important for young investors or for older investors with fully-funded balances. Who it really hurts is the 40-50 year olds who got started late in their savings, and who also might have missed much of the recent bull rally. Everyone else will be fine.

Lastly, let's remember that all wealth is relative. If the markets are crawling along at 4% or whatever, then the vast majority of people are seeing their wealth grow at 4% or less. All you have to do to keep from falling behind is to keep pace. Indeed, often times, keeping pace results in you getting ahead if you follow disciplined long-term buy-and-hold tax-efficient strategies (such as indexing).

At the end of the day, I hope Jack is wrong on his speculative predictions, and that future equity returns remain strong. But either way, I think even Jack would tell you to stay the course.

[Anonymous No.958288]

>>958235

Sound advice. I've got US and International shares on my plate, but I'll help myself to some REIT ETFs.

I think this is the only truly diverse REIT ETF on the ASX.

https://www.spdrs.com.au/etf/fund/fund_detail_DJRE.html#

0.5% management fee though... I've been spoiled by Vanguard.

[Anonymous No.959753]

>>953968
bump