Sony Bankruptcy Watch 2014

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Sony Bankruptcy Watch 2014 Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:21:28 2014 No.8953 [DELETED]

>SONY: We're Getting Out Of PCs, Spinning Off TVs, Cutting 5,000 Jobs, And Losing $1.1 Billion

http://www.businessinsider.com/sony-warns-of-11-billion-loss-2014-2

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:23:29 2014 No.8990 File: 289 KB, 571x800, 1392351801684.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Hirai has failed.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:28:29 2014 No.9081 File: 17 KB, 225x296, sad-sad-stringer.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>8990 He failed worse than Stringer.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:29:58 2014 No.9106 PlayStation Now will save them.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:31:58 2014 No.9139 >>9106 Probably not. The gaming division is tiny to the rest of the company.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:32:59 2014 No.9156 File: 42 KB, 394x458, 1381382164749.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >Sony will go bankrupt in your lifetime Serves them right, fucking jews.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:33:28 2014 No.9175 >>9156 So will Nintendo. Microsoft might as well. Windows will only last them so long.

Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:34:28 2014 No.9192

They're actually already in talks with investors and Third Point LLC about break up plants.

They even hired Morgan Stanley to mediate the dispute.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-05-30/sony-said-to-work-with-morgan-stanley-citigroup-on-loeb-plan.html?source=email_rt_mc_body

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:35:58 2014 No.9213 >>9192 That news hit in May, and now this news. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-09/sony-woes-seen-prelude-to-loeb-inspired-breakup-real-m-a.html It's actually happening. This was just posted a couple of days ago.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:36:28 2014 No.9240 >>9213 >>9192 lel i feel bad for idiots who bought PS4s

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:37:28 2014 No.9257 >>9175 you mean to tell me companies can't last forever. Shocking, truly.

Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:38:28 2014 No.9273

I have always held the greatest respect for Kaz Hirai and the Sony Corporation. However reading this makes me realize that Kaz is in serious trouble and he has failed in his efforts to revive the company.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-06/sony-ceo-credibility-takes-hit-with-1-1-billion-loss-forecast.html

So where do things go from here? I did a little math and looked at every yearly fiscal report from Sony and the results were definitely not good.

How can one company stay in business after making no profits for almost 9 years? The mind boggles.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:38:28 2014 No.9284 >>9257 Learn to use a question mark, faggot. Also, the key phrase was "in your lifetime." Cunt.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:40:28 2014 No.9300 File: 70 KB, 1399x546, i9RWqV82tcqED.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:40:58 2014 No.9309 File: 51 KB, 600x408, abe.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Don't worry. The Japanese Government will bail them out! Sony is Too Important for Japan to fail!

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:41:28 2014 No.9317 File: 1.58 MB, 640x429, generic kaz gif from google.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] I still don't see why Hirai is praised so much, he's utterly incompetent. Pic related, I see these all the time.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:42:28 2014 No.9330 >Sony >Electronics company What are you guys talking about, Sony is an insurance company.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:43:28 2014 No.9344 >>9309 http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5i_KiRNdWOgmIJLQmrINAmm--Hb2w?docId=CNG.73025d7a16c4c36681d0d0a2eed37df9.8c1

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:43:28 2014 No.9359 >>9309 Actually this is pretty much true, and this won't really affect their gaming portion really. That's still a profitable segment even if the consoles are sold at a loss. They're just dropping the dead weight.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:50:37 2014 No.9463 >>9317 Neogaf. That is why.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:53:37 2014 No.9509 >>9309 Actualy nope. The Japanese government is broke and they've already said they won't give Sony any more money.

Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:53:37 2014 No.9523

>>9317

Isn't sony structured in a way that it's hard for one-man CEO to do ANYTHING?

I remember a few years ago reading gawker media exclusive on Sony... Former Waito Piggu CEO of Sony tried his damn best to bring Sony to the XXI century, but he gets cockbloked by (mostly hardware) engineers in Japan.

Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:55:37 2014 No.9550

2005-20011 = Seven years without a profit confirmed by Kaz Hirai himself.

>Management is feeling a serious sense of crisis about the seven years of losses," said Executive Deputy President Kaz Hirai.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/tech/news/story/2011-11-02/sony-earnings/51038528/1?fullsite=true

2012 = 6.4 Billion Dollar Loss. The biggest in electronics history.

http://jobs.aol.com/videos/news-business-news/japans-sony-sees-record-6-4-billion-loss-on-tax-hit/517328944/

2013 = 1.1 Billion Dollar Loss

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-06/sony-ceo-credibility-takes-hit-with-1-1-billion-loss-forecast.html

2005 to 2013 = NO PROFITS AT ALL

Anyone who thinks this company has a future is lying to themselves.

>>	Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:58:37 2014 No.9593 File: 50 KB, 320x305, Cinealta.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] If Sony goes down... will their B2B electronics too? Hollywood would hate to lose a reliable partner for cinema cameras and projectors

Anonymous Thu Feb 13 23:59:37 2014 No.9603

Meanwhile Sony is selling their buildings, and their shares in other companies, and their other hard assets.

http://www.vgchartz.com/article/250786/sony-sells-tokyo-building-for-12-billion/

http://www.itpro.co.uk/asset-management/19324/sony-sells-second-tokyo-office

http://bgr.com/2013/01/18/sony-sells-nyc-headquarters-295521/

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:00:37 2014 No.9625 >>9593 Sony isn't even making that stuff any more. You gotta catch up with the news.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:01:37 2014 No.9642 >>9550 >>Management is feeling a serious sense of crisis about the seven years of losses," said Executive Deputy President Kaz Hirai. Goddamn... IF this was an American company, shareholders will be calling for Hirai and others heads!

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:02:37 2014 No.9660

>>9603

Sony is selling EVERYTHING

http://variety.com/2013/digital/news/sony-sells-stake-in-dena-to-nomura-1200002512/

http://www.worldofchemicals.com/media/sony-sells-chemical-products-business-to-japanese-bank/3544.html

http://www.businessweek.com/news/2011-12-27/sony-sells-lcd-venture-stake-to-samsung-after-losses.html

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:03:37 2014 No.9675 Funny thing is they were counting on Christmas to save the company. http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-11-07/sony-revival-hinges-on-christmas-success.html And now they're getting ready to post a loss in excess of 1.1 Billion.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:04:37 2014 No.9679 >>9625 no more projectors?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:04:37 2014 No.9687 >>9359 >That's still a profitable segment even if the consoles are sold at a loss. PS3 cost them billions and didn't recuperate the losses. PS4 wouldn't cover the PS3 losses for years (even if it is going to be immensely successful).

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:06:37 2014 No.9732 >>9687 wat I thought it's pretty much conventional wisdom now that PS3 broke even in 2009/10

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:06:37 2014 No.9733

Sony is at junk status at all three credit rating agencies,

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/11/20/fitch-affirms-sony-at-bb-with-negative-o-idUSFit67734820131120

This means no more loans, a high probability of default on all debts, and stocks that are soon to be worthless.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:11:37 2014 No.9824 Meanwhile I nearly doubled my stock when I bought at 11$. Take that stupid cunts.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:12:37 2014 No.9858 >>9732 It means that that they had stopped losing money on PS3. They're still in the red by the billions.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:12:37 2014 No.9859 >>9660 it's called restructuring you niggerfaggot And do you think that it's bad they sold vaio? The stock only went up ever since because it's been nothing but a loss maker.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:13:37 2014 No.9868 File: 106 KB, 600x425, bailouttttt.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] No wonder people are leaving the company. I would too.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:19:37 2014 No.9965 File: 67 KB, 400x295, laughingArtist%5B3%5D.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>9859 >Selling your home office >Selling billions in assets. >No profits for 8 years straight >Restructuring BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:20:37 2014 No.9991 >>9824 You didn't buy it at $11 because you don't own any stock at all. It's currently trading for $17. Sony stock used to trade for over $150 per share.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:24:37 2014 No.10076 Doomed company is doomed.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:26:37 2014 No.10106 >>9965 Meanwhile Chinkpads are getting ruined and vaio pcs are the only good non-apple laptops out there. >>9991 huh? Yes I did buy stock at 11 or 12.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:32:37 2014 No.10183

Samsung killed Sony's TV division.

Music devices went to being smart phones and wifi speakers.

Sony's PC and phones have always been mediocre.

They should go into new markets to save the company. Maybe house hold robotics, home 3d printers, cybernetics.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:38:37 2014 No.10273

>>9593
this

Sony makes some gud consumer electronics. Lots of good cameras, Sony Vegas Pro, stereos/recievers, the ps4, Blu-ray, *some* laptops, the z1.

If they go, i'll be truly sad. Them and Asus are one of the few who care about aesthetics of tech besides Apple

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:44:37 2014 No.10343

>>10183
Samsung TVs are shit even if they are the most popular. As always samsung also packs a bunch of cool features that sound great but don't work well in practice.

Sony android phones are about as good as it gets. Much better than shitwiz, or htc sense and they are pretty much the only company with a skin on android that isn't total slow bloated shit.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:50:37 2014 No.10436 >>10106 >apple laptops >good

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 00:52:37 2014 No.10449 >>10436 >thinkpads >not total even more overpriced than apple junk

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:09:21 2014 No.11435 >>10449 >thinkpads >sony your ignorance is showing

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:31:53 2014 No.11658 >>11435 Reading comprehension is hard

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:36:23 2014 No.11716 >>10273 >2014 >Sony >Good consumer electronics No. They've been doing the Sony tax even though their products have turned to shit. Vaio was shit too. They fall apart way too easy.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:38:53 2014 No.11736 >>8953 Lots of info not in this thread over here, by the way. >>3015

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:47:12 2014 No.11818 I can remember struggling with their CD DRM. Waste em.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 02:54:10 2014 No.11883 File: 265 KB, 607x850, 11223921768.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Sony will join a long list of electronics industry drop outs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 03:11:40 2014 No.12039 They fucked with anon. They deserve what they got.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 03:32:10 2014 No.12275 >>10449 >thinkpads are bad fuck off

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 03:43:10 2014 No.12383 thank god you told me, i just cancelled my orders

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:20:00 2014 No.12721

>>9732
The PS3 cost them so much in so many ways for so long that they never recouped. The PS3 eventually stopped actively losing them money, but the tiny stream of money they started to get from various sales was absolutely nothing in comparison to the amount of money they lost on making and selling it for years. Not to mention all the development costs to begin with, which were huge because it used the "Cell" processor which largely developed for the PS3. That's why the system was so expensive.

Ironically, the processor was utter garbage. Games on the system ran terribly because of it, major figures in the industry publicly trashed it as a waste of time etc. Hirai spouted out some silly defense about how it was "good" that developers couldn't "casually" develop for the system, since it would leave potential to be tapped more and more as time went on and the system got older. Apparently, nobody told him that hardware is useless without software.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:32:00 2014 No.12815 >lel lel Sony will go bankrupt hurr I don't know how business works I want /v/ermin to leave

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:37:00 2014 No.12849

>>12815
I don't, thats why I am here.
as far as I understand it the Playstation brand will preserve anyways, and Nintendo can afford to lose as much money are they do for roghly 60 years untill they go bankrupt (although shareholders mix up that calculation)

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:38:00 2014 No.12857 Maybe this gets them out of their rut. Nipnongs getting schooled by Koreans has been a running theme for some time now it seems. Just wait till a Korean gaming platform comes out.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:38:30 2014 No.12854 >>12815 Funny, because it is /v/ermin who circle-jerk over PS4 sales and post Kaz gifs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:39:30 2014 No.12864 >>12857 Koreans are all about the f2p PC games though

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:42:31 2014 No.12883

>>12864
Just saying that IF it happens, shit will be hella chaotic. A fucktonne of jap games use Korean know-how to make games work. If they get off their asses there's gonna be a mighty smackdown, especially since Korea has less reservations about catering to western tastes.
(Yes, I know this mostly applies to music and shit like the f2p games such as Tera and S4 league but still)

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:48:30 2014 No.12925

>>12849
>Nintendo can afford to lose as much money are they do for roghly 60 years untill they go bankrupt (although shareholders mix up that calculation)

They can't, when that was said 2 years ago they were holding 10 billion in pure cash, now they're holding 7 billion with a 1.2 billion loss due to stock buyback.

Problem with Nintendo right now is that their handheld market is dying and getting cornered by mobile devices and the console market is dead with Nintendo throwing money to save both.

Also with Nintendo shifting gears and going for the intensely competitive health industry due to not being able to compete in gaming anymore due to Iwata's philosophy of if you can't compete, you retreat, I doubt they'll be able to gain any grounds in that area because it would require a ton of resources and expertise in areas that Nintendo lacks at the moment.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:50:30 2014 No.12933

>>12883
Noone wants to get into the console business, it's a market where you lose a lot of money to get in and lose a lot of money to keep running without massive profits after the initial investments.

Korea thrives in mass producing high margin products, they'll never step foot into making consoles.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:53:18 2014 No.12959

>>12933
I see your point now, anon.
Do you think they'll push into the more traditional gaming market eventually? "Korean MMO" has almost become the antonym of "Western MMO" very few others can even get into that shit.
Think offline games will eventually come from there in high volume as well?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 04:56:47 2014 No.12993 >>12959 Korean gaming developers dont really make offline games, they focus only on online F2P games because that's how their mentality works.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 05:49:17 2014 No.13296

>>12925
>their handheld market is dying and getting cornered by mobile devices and the console market is dead
Their marketing is beyod retarded. They have no fucking idea what they are doing. A complete clusterfuck.

Would a customer know the difference between DS Lite, DSi, 3DS, 3DS XL or 2DS?
Why WOULDNT a customer think that Wii U is a fucking peripheral like Wii Balance Board, Wii Classic Controller, Wii Remote, Wii Speak or Wii Zapper?

Even Valve can't fuck up this hard with the SteamOS or Machines.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 05:57:35 2014 No.13361 What is this IBM is selling off everything and now Sony too? Cell wasn't that bad was it?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 06:00:05 2014 No.13387 >>13361 It was worse than you ever imagined, anon. http://news.cnet.com/sony-ps3-is-hard-to-develop-for-on-purpose/

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 08:35:38 2014 No.14337

>>9593
>>10273

RED is already eating their lunch in the pro-grade camera market and Cannon seems poised to re-take mid grade because surprise, surprise. Sony prices themselves out of mid-grade unlike Cannon.

Want a Handy-Cam? Fuck that. Go Pro. Hell, indie film makers just buy boxes of Go Pro's. Crank 2 was filmed by the directors literally filling shopping carts full of Go Pro cams at the local best buy.

See this is the whole Sony is in a complete hole and fucked part. Everything else is better. Even PS4 is fucking sheer luck that Microsoft and Nintendo shot themselves in the foot and Valve is busy pissing away all their consumer goodwill

Investor speculation is literally riding on more Apple involvement as Apple are sourcing camera sensors from Sony. Probably why Hirai is so afraid of spinning Pictures and Music as well, even though it would be insanely profitable. Apple would simply start a proxy war and start eating in with shareholders till they eventually pry it out.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 09:23:24 2014 No.14578

Is it my imagination, or like more than half of this thread was being posted by faggots from /v/? (I even saw one of the "sony is finished" pics which always gets posted there) Heck, the other thread about Sony possibly going bankrupt is way more informative and civil than this one

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 10:01:38 2014 No.14783 >>14578 Several posts are from fanboys, yeah, but there's some decent discussion.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 13:33:28 2014 No.16815

>>14578
>>14783

Actually it's a very common industry thing as well. Sony as a company has fanboys from your /v/ shitposters to your George Clooney's who prefer working with Sony Columbia (Mainly because he was bros with Howard Stringer and would get stupid budgets for vanity projects).

Seriously, the digital imaging Sony fanboys are scary. But at the minute I'd just make sure your facts are in order. As the board takes off, we will probably see more of it.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 13:39:57 2014 No.16877 >>9257 >five to ten thousand years from now >General Electric renamed General Unified Fundamental Force

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 13:48:57 2014 No.16974 >>10183 sont screwed the pooch bac in the early '00's with the MP3 walkman, the godawful software, and the rootkit debacle of 2005. it was a huge scandal then. i will never forgive them for suing liik shang out of business for selling PSP's greymarket.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 13:49:27 2014 No.16981

>>13296
Yeah this. i honestly stopped knowing the difference between nintendo consoles a good while ago. They seem to focus too much on gimmicks that takes enormous sums of money to develop that no one really wants, and then frequently fail to market the item.

Playstation as a brand will stay, hell, they may even become an independent subsidiary.

Brad Fri Feb 14 13:50:57 2014 No.16984

>>16877
>Implying General Electric will survive the Open Ecology revolution 50 years from now when everyone has the technology of todays multi-million-dollar high tech companies replabs inside a shed in the backyard ready to automatedly build whatever blueprint they decide to fork from designhub.open in minutes

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 13:54:57 2014 No.17018

>>16981
>Playstation as a brand will stay, hell, they may even become an independent subsidiary.

Kaz built SCE with Chris Deering and he will be far too prideful to ever allow that off as a spin off concern despite it making huge amounts of sense to keep it away from the rest of the company.

We're already seeing some horrible management with Driveclub delayed from Launch and rumored to be re-appearing in summer and The Order, a 3rd person shooter. Not even having online co-op. It's reeking of bad management, cost cutting, or both. Main company cancer is hitting SCE and it's really becoming apparent.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:25:46 2014 No.17316

>>14337
>Crank 2 was filmed by the directors literally filling shopping carts full of Go Pro cams at the local best buy.

Okay, I admit to not knowing much about cameras, but... why would they need so many Go Pros as opposed to, say, six at most?

I guess maybe I don't know how they work but it sort of sounds like buying a bunch of copies of a book in case you want to read it more than once.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:31:46 2014 No.17373 >>10183 I'll never get why, smart TVs are terrible.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:35:47 2014 No.17407 >>8953 This should probably be on /g/

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:38:46 2014 No.17439

>>16981
>They seem to focus too much on gimmicks that takes enormous sums of money to develop that no one really wants, and then frequently fail to market the item
Speaking about it can someone here explain why Sony thought "the Core" was a good idea?
I can't undertand how anyone could think we need a screenless fitness tracker that update every shit you do to the internet.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:40:16 2014 No.17454 >>17439 >explain why Sony thought "the Core" was a good idea? No. This cannot be done.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:43:16 2014 No.17498

>>17439
>I can't undertand how anyone could think we need a screenless fitness tracker that update every shit you do to the internet.
>update every shit you do to the internet.

645,750,000 twitter accounts and you can't see why some company thought it was a good idea to market something that's constantly uploading the minutae of what you do to the internet?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:46:46 2014 No.17523 >>17498 You raise a good point, has twitter made any money yet?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:52:16 2014 No.17587

>>17523

A quick google search says "no". I didn't say it was a good idea, but the logic behind it is pretty clear: "People love to share everything with the internet now, let's make something that does that."

Besides, Twitter itself doesn't make a profit, but that doesn't mean that people who make products that tie into it can't. Twitter has probably played a small role in smartphones blowing up as big as they have, there's all sorts of products that boast "Can automatically post to twitter!", other companies that do turn profits use twitter heavily in their marketing.

Twitter seems to be one of those weird things that makes other people money but not itself.

But anyway. Yeah, twitter proves that the market for constantly telling the internet mundane crap about yourself is there (in usage if not profit), Sony just fucked up in thinking they had the right implementation for that.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 14:59:16 2014 No.17661

>>17316

Simple. Most of the cameras were destroyed during the making of the film due to the shots they used like dropping cameras off buildings or even throwing them to simulate someone getting knocked over. After a camera was killed, they would just wrench out the SD Card from the wreckage and then hand it to the editor. Since the Go Pro would simply just cut out once the thing was done. They would easily get all their footage. And since Go Pros are tough bastards in the first place, most of the cameras survived except for cracked lenses. Smart film making and Crank 2 is a fucking hilariously good film.

That's why some indies at bottom level and all the extreme sports people use Go Pro. Versatile and tough.

Sony never acknowledged them with Handycam and got BTFO.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:00:46 2014 No.17686 >>17661 >Most of the cameras were destroyed during the making of the film due to the shots they used like dropping cameras off buildings or even throwing them to simulate someone getting knocked over. Ahaaaa.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:01:16 2014 No.17705

>>17587
>Twitter seems to be one of those weird things that makes other people money but not itself.
It's at an interesting crossroads, charge companies for ad space (the facebook model) and lose all your customers because ads are fucking annoying, or go broke.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:07:46 2014 No.17756

>>17587
The Core is a screenless fitness tracker, you can't chose what it update or not you can't even write anything with it. Those 645,750,000 accounts are full of attention seekings retards that write any fake shit to get few like thumbs or whatever, they won't buy anything that write the truth about their life and update anything that they won't let any other people know.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:09:46 2014 No.17775 >>17705 They really ought to start charging some of the companies that use them something. I mean, what's Old Spice gonna do, not use a twitter account?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:21:16 2014 No.17890 Meanwhile Nintendo has now been around for 125 years. gg Sony.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:23:16 2014 No.17917 >>17890 Yes, indeed, they're still the finest playing card company on the- Oh wait.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:24:46 2014 No.17928 >>8953 Sony is making huge profits but what weighs them down is the consumer electronics. What is happening is that Sony Electronics is terrible to adapting to new market demands the same can be said about Nintendo

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:29:46 2014 No.17980 >>17928 It seems like Sony is mostly pricing themselves out of the market they should be in, while Nintendo's response is always "A new gimmick will fix it!"

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:35:46 2014 No.18042 >>8953 COMMIT SUDOKU

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:38:46 2014 No.18078 >>12275 >lenovo didn't ruin thinkpad no u

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:41:16 2014 No.18106 Thank Moot for keeping fucking threads like these out of /v/ now. Have fun with your new board guys.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:41:46 2014 No.18113 >>17928 To be fair, Nintendo did construct 3 brand new buildings recently.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:45:16 2014 No.18169 >>17980 Sony will split up no doubt about it and the consumer electronics division would fold. Nintendo has the same ideas as Sony when it comes to proprietary gimmicks that the market does not want >>18113 And Nintendo is in a meltdown right now

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:47:16 2014 No.18182 >>18169 I fully expect them to make a profit in 2014

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:48:46 2014 No.18208 >>18182 Who ? If Sony media splits up of course but Nintendo (-23.48%) in the past couple of weeks is a huge wound to the company.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:50:16 2014 No.18245 >>18208 Nintendo

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:51:16 2014 No.18262 I currently have stock in sony right now. Just a few shares...Should i sell now and take a hit, or wait things out? My gut tells me to sell right now...What do you guys say?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:51:16 2014 No.18263 >>12721 Technically the processor wasn't garbage it's just that nobody had any experience in programming for the Cell. Compared to say x86 family architecture which is ubiquitous.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:52:46 2014 No.18270 What? Didn't they make a profit of like 43 trillion yen in 2012?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:53:46 2014 No.18280 >>18245 That is very optimistic of you seeing as that Japanese companies in general have not been able to adapt to new markets.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:54:16 2014 No.18292 >>18280 Then I will meet you here, on /biz/ next year.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:56:46 2014 No.18330 >>18270 Sony media is making profit not the consumer electronics

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 15:57:16 2014 No.18341 >>18330 Oooooh. Thanks.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:02:47 2014 No.18418 >>17775 Honestly, yea. Old Spice got popular again because of the rebranding they did with those commercial.s

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:06:46 2014 No.18461 Shitting sony here doesnt feel fun like in /v/ We need some xbox and nintendo doomed thread guys

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:09:46 2014 No.18490

>>18263

You're right but see -> >>13387

Another anon and I were talking about this link and he thought that Kaz only said that as a cover for their real intent.

To establish a monopoly by making it so that developers had to choose which architecture to focus their development on.

Blew up in their face either way.

Fun fact: They only went with x86 this time because Mark Cerny screamed at Kaz long enough for him to listen.

Based Cerny.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:10:46 2014 No.18503

>>18262

It keeps cratering before US opening each day because of the Nikkei having no faith and selling and the US seems to be losing steam in the turnaround (After those NPD's for vidya. Yikes. They sold more PS4 consoles but software units, which is the real bread and butter, were terrible for Sony systems and PS3 sold under 60K. When your profitable last gen console is canabalized quickly. You fucked up). And their film slate this quarter seems like it's going to be bad as well (Robocop will be a stinker. Word of mouth from Europe is mixed enough as is)

See if it runs 18 in the next two weeks if they announce more cuts or more sell offs and then get out. Long holding this year seems suicidal. Especially if the next quarter is a busy as well.

18/19 range and dump or hold out to see if Daniel Loeb gets real nasty and tries to get on the board. Then sell on that spike.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:11:16 2014 No.18521

>>18461

No we don't. Microsoft is doing fine, even with their weak Xbox branch.

Nintendo, I mean, I guess. They've only posted 1 quarter at a loss though (probably 2 now), but they've built a bunch of buildings and had insane sales predictions.

That alone isn't enough to sink them. It's not on a Sony-level of bleeding.

We can have a thread discussing Nintendo's future though.

>>	DAILY REMINDER Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:13:46 2014 No.18539 GLORIOUS KOREA > Shitpan

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:16:46 2014 No.18576

>>18461

This ain't /v/. Nintendo needs a re-org, especially in it's US approach. But they are fine financially.

Microsoft made half a billion off launch on xbone and has options while Paul Allen and ValuAct have been trying to get rid of Xbox for nearly a decade now (And they won't) . They are the polar opposite of doomed (Win 8 tablets. New hotness this year now that people are getting over the novelty of Android as a tab OS and finding you can actually do work on Win 8 and metro isn't ass)

I mean. Start it elsewhere but you will probably get murdered on /biz/. Especially since MS is a top tech stock for 2014 and expected to be a huge Bull.

Sony's more interesting anyway since it's the downfall of the last arrogant Japanese Zaibatsu crumbling before our eyes with the management who still think it's the 90's.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:22:08 2014 No.18634 >>17928 >>17980 I still don't see why Sony doesn't just make another batch of PVM's and sell them to retrogamers.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:26:38 2014 No.18658 >>18634 Is retrogaming really popular enough outside of US hipsters to make it worth it?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:31:24 2014 No.18686 >>18576 >But they are fine financially. >stocks are considerably down >>18634 Niche market and consumer electronics is dead

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:31:54 2014 No.18688

>>14578

OP from the other thread here.

That's because this thread is deliberately set up as bait for "Sony Is Doomed" jokes. I mean "Bankruptcy Watch", with an article we've seen a billion times, with no actual questions for discussion? Obviously bait.

Meanwhile I set up my thread with reasonable questions for actual discussion. The picture is a little tongue-in-cheek, but I figured it was harmless.

I think there's only one or two fanboys for Sony that posted. So it's been pretty good so far. I linked between the two threads so people on here could see some of the great info posted on the other thread.

I'll admit that a bit of bias shows in the OP, but only in the sense that I think Kaz is a failure/fraud, and have been disgusted with his management. Which pretty much all /biz/nessmen agree on. Even Loeb thinks so. I'm sorry if that's tainted actual discussion, but I can't help it.

Aside from that, I just used the term Sonyggers to represent delusional Sony fanboys who shit on me and others when we try to discuss actual Sony financials outside of SONY IS DOOMED. It was simply out of frustration with a stubborn fanbase.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:36:24 2014 No.18721 >>18503 Thanks for the advice anon!

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:39:25 2014 No.18744 If you guys are not fucking retarded, buy Sony now. Further Spinoff and selloff will cause their stock to surge

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:43:54 2014 No.18784

>>18688
I can write you wall of texts why Sony is a steal, but instead I will try to convince you with a short paragraph.

Sony market cap is 18 billion. Sony financial is $4.3 billion, Game division is at least $10 billion, movies at least $5 billion.

Plus all other nonsense, Sony is trading far below book value. All Sony has to do is sell off all their crap that's losing them money for capital, and suddenly their company looks attractive with valuation through the roof.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:44:25 2014 No.18786

>>18744

You imply spin or sell off from Kaz Hirai? L-O-Fuckin'-L

Buying now is wasting money. Wait till the market gives up on speculation like this week and it starts hitting 15 again (Give it a week or two) and the desperation kicks in or Loeb starts turning the screws.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:45:24 2014 No.18800 So after Sony and Nintendo get out of the game business, what will happen with a Microsoft monopoly?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:45:24 2014 No.18801 >>18786 They're selling vaio and spinning off parts of their TV division. Won't be long until they get rid of their disgusting batteries, semiconductor, and other devices killing their business.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:45:54 2014 No.18795 >>18784 Problem is management is retarded and the company is full of Yes Men since the Morita era. There needs to be a complete house cleaning and restructuring before that value can be unlocked.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:47:24 2014 No.18820 >>18800 Why would Sony get out of game business? Game profits makes up 20% of their operating income last quarter, and this is just the start with coming game licensing fees and online/cloud services.

>>	Pory-goon !cWl9wC/NZo Fri Feb 14 16:47:54 2014 No.18813 >>18800 Nintendo's value is shockingly entirely based on the game business. They might end up drifting to a producer of games and no longer in the console business if it keeps going the way it's going though.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:47:54 2014 No.18816 >>18784 Basically this.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:48:54 2014 No.18825 >>18813 Still will let Microsoft have a monopoly of the consoles. >>18820 because Sony is going bankrupt?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:48:54 2014 No.18826

>>18576

I disagree that they are fine financially, but I'd say that they aren't completely fucked. They HAVE to turn it around this year though. Their E3 needs to have hype to move units. Sonic Boom might help with the right advertising cross-promoting the show, and yes, catering to the younger audience (not to mention it might be a good game because ex-Naughty Dog devs). Lost World sold pretty well, though it didn't move units. MK8 too, though I highly doubt it'll move a whole lot. The big mover will be Smash. As to whether or not it'll sell a gorillion units, that depends on how good it is and how well they market it. Nintendo would be wise to delay the 3DS release in favour of the Wii U version (they are mostly fine on the 3DS front, especially as it is getting enough good titles right now that will sell: KIrby, Layton, Mario Golf, etc.). Also, obviously all marketing should be with the Wii U version.

If they build enough hype (announcing a release date a month ahead of time, and pumping out as many god-tier commercials as they can), they can have a winner. Short of that, they don't have any mainstream big titles planned so far.

This is probably the last year they could get away with Smash being a runaway hit because the competitors are still in infancy. As long as Sony and Microsoft don't have a major title to eclipse the hype (very unlikely looking at Sony's list, not sure what Microsoft would have up its sleeve), this is Nintendo's last big chance to finally take some of that marketshare back.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:49:24 2014 No.18835 >>18825 Why would they go bankrupt when they still have $8 billion in cash? they would sell off their other crap way before they abandon games.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:50:24 2014 No.18836

>>18801
This is what I'm thinking as well to be completely honest. They're just trimming the fat at this point.

Then whether or not the stock goes up will be based on whether or not they start showing profits I don't expect it to go down anymore if the proper steps are taken.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:51:54 2014 No.18846 >>18820 Consumer electronics is losing more money they could try splitting the PlayStation brand but do not know if that would succeed

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:52:24 2014 No.18850 >>18826 Your entire post is basing their financials on your speculation of their video games. You havent taken ANY financial information into account. You've just proved you don't know what you're talking about.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:54:24 2014 No.18867 >>9309 Sony can only declare bankruptcy so many times

>>	Pory-goon !cWl9wC/NZo Fri Feb 14 16:55:54 2014 No.18887 >>18825 The console market isn't all the gaming business anymore. Look at Crappy Bird.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:57:54 2014 No.18907 >>18887 Crappy bird is makng profits and do not have to deal with distribution costs or even advertising. If the could focus on low cost solutions with high market share then we might see some change in the company.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:58:54 2014 No.18915 ITT: /v/ doesn't know how real world works

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:59:24 2014 No.18919

>>18850

Anon, Their financial success is inherently tied to their console sales which are low. Obviously they aren't suffering attach-rate issues (and Nintendo consoles often don't), so their main concern is getting people to actually buy Wii Us.

I am simply talking about console sales strategy and what will sell and what won't.

PS4 and Xbox Ones sold hugely because of hype. Hype is a powerful thing is generation, and I can only imagine that the only title capable of drumming up insane levels of hype is Smash.

But they need to be smart about it. Their American marketing is pisspoor.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 16:59:54 2014 No.18921 >>18800 Nintendo IS gaming business. They won't go willingly. They aren't broke either. Still, Microsoft will take most of Sony's share of the market.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:00:24 2014 No.18923 >>18836 If they get rid of their cancer, I guarantee you the stock will surge. Very hard to not show profit when you kick off the deadbeats eating away their very profitable sector (Financial, Games, Entertainment (Pictures and Music),

>>	Pory-goon !cWl9wC/NZo Fri Feb 14 17:00:54 2014 No.18931 >>18907 Yep, the mobile markets are now where the money's at. >>18915 What would you expect from /v/ideo gamers.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:04:24 2014 No.18964

>>18919
Again you don't know financials, regardless if their entire division of consoles, fail they'll still be fine financially.

Please let this topic be one of actually discussing financials rather than one of speculation on video games. Please look at their balance sheet and realize the potential that they can do with it before jumping on a speculation bandwagon because of video games. This is not /v/

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:05:24 2014 No.18979 >>18931 So mobile gaming is the future of gaming? Joy.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:06:54 2014 No.18993

>>18964
comma was supposed to be after fail

>>18915
but yes this is all I'm really seeing right now.

If you want to disagree that they're going to not do well in the video game industry or if their consoles won't sell that's one thing. If you want to talk about them with regards to what financial position they are that's another.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:07:24 2014 No.18999 >>18921 >. They aren't broke Depreciating stocks and loss in consumer confidence has said 'no' this year alone

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:07:24 2014 No.19001

>>18923

They need rid of Kaz Hirai and his yes men. This is what people don't get. The cancer starts with management and that management instead of selling TV, spun it into a 100% owned IPO by Sony so they can funnel more money into it and then sell it a bit easier for when they need to.

This is what you aren't getting. The cancer isn't just the divisions dragging them down. It's the retarded management making retarded decisions.

Also they need a huge cost cutting operation at gaming because their margin on it was ridiculously slim post PS4 launch that exhange rates were the real money maker on that profit (I would not be shocked without exchange it was $100 million or lower).

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:07:54 2014 No.19015 >>18979 Sadly yes that's where the money is to be had. This and facebook games

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:08:24 2014 No.19029 >>19015 Can't wait. I love paying money to play flash games I played on newgrounds 12 year ago.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:09:24 2014 No.19035 >>19015 Facebook games haven't had the same momentum as they did few years ago. For some reason they ignored the mobile market

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:09:54 2014 No.19037

>>18999
Just because their stock value goes down and consume confidence is low does not make them broke.

Their assets do, man is it really that hard to get to people? Is this what /biz/ is going to turn into? I thought this was actually going to be a respectable board. . .

>>	Pory-goon !cWl9wC/NZo Fri Feb 14 17:10:24 2014 No.19051 >>18979 It's cheap to enter and highly lucrative if you make it free to play but have costly upgrades.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:10:24 2014 No.19052 >>19037 >does not make them broke. When they have no money how can they spend money? Hmm? Assets for what?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:10:54 2014 No.19047

If we combine all sony's profitable sectors and project them on a yearly basis, with 1 billion outstanding shares, you're looking at $4 EPS (not accounting for their cash reserves and other equities).

Apply a 8x P/E ratio (conservative), and suddenly Sony is valued at least $32 per share, twice of what they are now.

Sony should just hire me to be their CEO. How fucking hard is it to just fire everybody from their deadbeat sectors?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:11:24 2014 No.19055 >>9175 Nintendo is not going down. Don't be a fanboy.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:11:24 2014 No.19057 >>19035 I think there were a few other factors as well but yeah objectively that amount of growth was eventually going to stop. The return on them is rather silly though was mainly what I was getting at.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:13:24 2014 No.19080

>>19052
Yes 500 billion in cash and 400 in short term liquid investments is NO money. I didn't think it took a business major to just look at this before factoring in their other assets, liabilities, and equity. Please just stop you're making yourself look silly man.

And also before factoring in so many ratios, so so so many ratios.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:13:54 2014 No.19088 >>18999 Do you even know what stocks are? I'm sorry to be an ass but if you quote a statement and write something unrelated you will get this kind of reaction. The income is shit, but that's it for now.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:14:24 2014 No.19092

>>19001
>Also they need a huge cost cutting operation at gaming because their margin on it was ridiculously slim post PS4 launch that exhange rates were the real money maker on that profit

I think the real money making machine from PS4 would be all the cloud services they are providing. Last statistic I heard was 50% ps4 owners have playstation plus? That's a huge customer base to advertise shits to or sell something like netflix

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:14:24 2014 No.19095 >>19080 FFS They have retained earnings in the trillions in addition to this

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:15:24 2014 No.19112 >>8953 Finally Sony will go down. Fuck sonyggers.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:16:24 2014 No.19117 >>19092 That's because Sony is sneaky and counted free trials.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:16:54 2014 No.19127

>>19088
I'm pulling out my hair right now, the next few days is going to decide if this is a troll board or a legit one. It's starting to look like the former which is upsetting. I actually thought this was going to be one of the legit 4chan boards. Maybe I should just get better at ignoring them and take the value from the people who look like they know what they're talking about.

It's just upsetting to me when the ignorant make other ignorant people even more ignorant. We should probably just capitalize on that though somehow. . . Use them to buy and sell stocks but generally these people aren't going to be the ones that have that kind of income

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:17:54 2014 No.19137 >>19092 Their cloud services may not be adopted en masse if the price is as high as rumours suggest. But the fact they are planning to incorporate devices that aren't PS4s will help.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:20:24 2014 No.19175

>>19080
>500 billion in cash

You do know that they do not have a giant vault that 'cash' on it? Nintendo is not Sony which means that they have no other businesses outside of it's niche market. What ratios? I think you are throwing words around without knowing exactly what you are talking about

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:22:24 2014 No.19189

>>12925
>Also with Nintendo shifting gears and going for the intensely competitive health industry due to not being able to compete in gaming anymore due to Iwata's philosophy of if you can't compete, you retreat, I doubt they'll be able to gain any grounds in that area because it would require a ton of resources and expertise in areas that Nintendo lacks at the moment

I would say it would be a horrible move but they have one lynchpin in how big Wii Fit got. It actually might be the right idea for them to tap that for all its worth while they still have the time.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:23:54 2014 No.19199 >>18993 Okay fine, anon. I will apply my argument to their consoles not selling. They have to turn it around this year if they want their consoles to sell. If I say that, we agree, yes?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:32:54 2014 No.19288

>>19175
http://i.imgur.com/DW4brB6.png
These are the cash and cash equivalents. Now what do these numbers say?

Common ratios: Debt to equity, Current Ratio, Quick Ratio

Many more but these are simple enough for you to understand.

>>19199
Yeah I completely agree from the Wii U's standpoint from the 3DS I think that's profitable but thats a different section. An alarming thing that you should be aware of to is Nintendo's current business model which I think you might be interested in.

They use their consoles to compete on price and after an individual purchases said console they're left with mainly first party title as the good ones. With this fact they have a monopoly on the software so people are forced to pay their prices and they never discount them. This makes their first party software sales higher than they actually should be and if they ever did go into a software only territory this should be something you think about. They'll have to start competing on price if they went to Microsoft and Sony, which will change how their software sales look. This however is my opinion however I feel it's something you may want to be aware of in the future if they go down this route.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:35:54 2014 No.19317 >>19137 There are probably a ton of netflix competitors, Sony just need to sign a contract with the next best thing and boom the stock will go up. Ps4 user base are only going to get larger

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:38:24 2014 No.19353 >>18688 >Meanwhile I set up my thread with reasonable questions for actual discussion. Yeah thats why you used the word "Sonygger"

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:40:44 2014 No.19367
File: 17 KB, 480x360, 0 (1).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>8953
When Anonymous™ hacked them and they offered a few free downloadable games as compensation for having your personal info & CC# stolen, it did a LOT of damage to their reputation.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:47:29 2014 No.19425 So does anybody who actually knows what they're talking about or is it just /v/ in here?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:50:29 2014 No.19453

>>19288
When i said different section I was trying to get at something to the extent.

It doesn't matter whether or not we respectfully agree or respectfully disagree. It's a completely separate point all together and I have no real interest in arguing that. Mine was just mainly in objectively explaining the financial position of the company.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:53:14 2014 No.19477

>>19288

The 3DS is slowing down in sales but it's doing good. I'm pretty much solely talking about the Wii U.

They need to push Smash to push the sales. It's their Hail Mary play, as it's most likely their only major franchise coming out this year that will attract the mass market.

I'm aware of the current business model. And I wholeheartedly agree with you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:54:45 2014 No.19480 >>19288 But these numbers are not update to the current stock values they are more of summerizations of the company and what it might be worth

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:55:14 2014 No.19488 >>19425 I'd say it's half /v/irgins, and half /biz/nessmen.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:55:44 2014 No.19496 >>9175 >So will Nintendo you poor thing

>>	image Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:56:14 2014 No.19513 File: 89 KB, 679x657, 1361592601620.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >/v/ tards hear about a buisness board and immediately come here to say a company they dont like is going out of buisness fucking hell

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:56:44 2014 No.19509

>>19425
Few people do, few people don't I think the ones that do are proving themselves. It certainly has a greater filter on it for the moment.

But for someone like myself it's starting to wear a lot on my patience and it'll probably annoy most of the people who know what they're talking about. If that happens to more people like myself the board will most likely degrade.

Question is now is whether or not what the goal of this board is as my idea of the goal and the intentions moot made it with may be completely different. It'll mainly be up to moderators to enforce the integrity of the board if they want it to stay serious discussions and filter out the obvious trolls. /vr/ from what i've seen uses this practice and it helps maintain the integrity and quality people. But then this creates a circle jerk I guess.

There's never a right answer

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:57:44 2014 No.19520 >>19425 more are just /v/ tier fanboys, remember, this is kinda a containment board for console war thread about sales

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 17:59:44 2014 No.19539 so, we agree, sony is making the right moves, but too late? now that they are on purge, they should do it deep and just keep insurance, movies, music (and ill say video so fanboys wont bitch me, but must kill VITA)

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:02:45 2014 No.19578 File: 56 KB, 587x624, jew cat.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>19513 >yfw you realize shitty consolechild sales-flinging threads will be moved to /biz/

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:03:45 2014 No.19585

>>19480
You do realize when 2013 year ended and where we are currently in 2014 yes?

Quarterly reports, if the company so chooses is there for a reason. I say chooses because the regulations and rules change for companies in other countries, public or private. I'm speaking generally not specifically to any case at hand.

If you're going to bring into question you dont have a real-time first person view of everything on any company's financial position you probably should get an understanding of the business world.

This statement
>But these numbers are not update to the current stock values they are more of summerizations of the company and what it might be worth

is what is this I dont even.

It gives a hell of a lot better understanding and gives the time for auditors to verify these numbers are indeed correct. It's a lot more accurate then someone who has no understanding make accusations and speculating. Especially if you're under the impression that someone will just throw away all their money (in the billions) into nothing.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:05:44 2014 No.19599 Don't worry manchilds your PS4 will still be good.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:07:15 2014 No.19624

>>19137

The problem is the device roll out is all Sony ecosystem products.

Plus, fucking Rackspace and their own servers? That's a disaster and they should have been investing years back. Especially since it's now really stating to pay off for Amazon and Microsoft.

>>19317

Only Amazon Prime and everyone else is niche like CrunchyRoll. Others will just IPTV like Verizon. Sony is planning their own cloud IPTV as well. There is no one in that space. Netflix owns it.

>>19539
>so, we agree, sony is making the right moves, but too late?

Far too late. First thing Hirai should have done when he got into office was PC and TV gone. Severe cost cutting at Sony Computer Entertainment to refocus studios and re-focus the greenlight process for films and TV.

Instead. He just picked up where Howard Stringer left off and pushed his own pet projects on top of that like the Xperia and PS4. He's only making the right moves now, because he's been forced. And even then it's half hearted with how doggedly he's holding on to TV.

The undervalued nature comes from the people running it. The board needs a house clean or someone to scare the shit out of them like how Daniel Loeb got on the board at Yahoo and cleaned house (Doubt that will happen now though since Loeb was wrong on Sony and backed electronics. He's been very quiet since.)

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:09:44 2014 No.19642

>>19539
No one's in agreement here this was actually in question the entire time.

The educated people are objectively questioning it and providing logical arguments. Trying to understand the other side's view, how they got to that conclusion, what evidence they are using, and whether or not that's reliable and realistic.

I'm in the mindset that they are going to look profitable as a company once they get rid of the segments that aren't profitable and start to re-evaluate how they do certain things. However whether or not this may prove true time will tell. It won't happen overnight though

Everyone else is just fanboyism because they don't like the console or the company. They're speculating with no education (I don't mean degree I mean actual research and knowledge rather than your feelings on the matter because you rationalized to yourself that it makes sense)

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:10:14 2014 No.19649

>>19642
I shouldn't have said no one is in agreement. I should have said not everyone is in agreement.

Picking apart which sides and how many people that aren't samefagging is nearly impossible. Before factoring in and filtering out which ones are the educated opinions. I'm wasting too much time myself filtering them out because of the obvious ones that don't know financials trying to derail this into a nintendo thing. . .

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:12:15 2014 No.19673 >>19520 If that's what this is under the guise of finance and business then I'm probably done with this board. I'm hoping it doesnt turn out this was

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:12:44 2014 No.19666 File: 14 KB, 450x300, Dan Loeb.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>19578 We're ready. We have the facts. Console warriors will get BTFO, guaranteed or your shekkels back.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:17:14 2014 No.19720

>>19624
the problem with electronics and games in general is sony fucking arrogance.
once they saw themselves on the top, they thought they were unreachable and to mighty to fall, and started to make the wrong moves
over price as the main example, reduce products quality, etc, once Samsung stormed the market with better product and better price, they blew sony out of their high chair. and its been free fall from that point.

>>19642
sony can be profitable, he has 3 divison that are good at making money, but he is too stubborn to accept defeat, and remove the other ones, till he is without options, and I would give em a chance if they were caring for employees and shit, but they dont, they jsut dont want to show weakness out of sheer pride

also I think a massive clean out, will destroy the company name and value in the stock market in short term (some years later on when they show they can do shit, it will recover thou)

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:19:44 2014 No.19742 >>19673 depends on mods

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:22:14 2014 No.19773

>>19742
Yep and it's too early to find and pick the right mods or assume that mods are here as it's a new board.

Without proper moderation the board is going to end up that way. Which may have been the intention and goal of this board none of us really know at the end of the day.

Without moderation though the integrity isn't going to be enforced and the people who took this board serious will eventually leave.

On an unrelated note: That in my opinion is what is happening to /v/ right now and why the other video game related boards actually talk constructively about video games.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:23:14 2014 No.19774 19770 (alt+255) dont these guys have like, a LOT of assets?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:24:44 2014 No.19790 >>19774 and.. unless im wrong, and even bigger debt

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:25:44 2014 No.19800 >>19624 >>19539 It's not too late, they have enough cash to last 10 years. Cut the fat, and suddenly Sony is worth $30+

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:27:14 2014 No.19822 >>19790 do you have any numbers as to Sony's liabilities/assets? does anyone? i imagine they would have reported that to the stockholders

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:27:14 2014 No.19824 >>19800 this might help em on the long term, but on the short, will hurt the company name also they are killing just 1 of the putrid limbs.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:29:14 2014 No.19840 >>19822 is should be in the Q reports, but im not gonna lurk for that among 30 pages now have fun http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/financial/fr/13q3_sony.pdf this is up to Q3 2013 fiscal year

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:30:14 2014 No.19852 >>19840 wish me luck dude im goin in

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:33:14 2014 No.19879 >>19852 Keep all pets and breakable objects away from you while doing so. Some of their decisions can only be met with the purest of rage.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:34:01 2014 No.19902 >>19773 Do your part and report and get attention. There is potential in this board already and the fact we're getting great discussions out of something that would be shitposted to death on /v/ by now is proof it can do good.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:37:31 2014 No.19932

>>19902
/v/ cant discuss.

it always goes down to
>MUH COMPANY WILL LIVE FOREVER, YOURS WILL DIE CAUSE I SAY SO
now in all fairness, among the 3 big games.
Xbox is the more likely to be sold
but if this goes as an endurance fight, Ps4 will die first.

also there still to see if Net Impartiality will be ruled out as useless

in which case, Microsoft can royally fuck sony in USA

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:40:32 2014 No.19957 >>19840 fuck me i would have to call a broker to read this shit

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:44:31 2014 No.20003 sony is going to be fine you fucking /v/tards (presumably nintenchildren?) source: quads

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:45:01 2014 No.20018 >>19957 page 14 for assets the other 13 pages before is operating income (or loss) by division, money flow (in what was shit spend) and if they made or not sale forecasts for Q3 >>20003 see, this is why /biz/ is a containment board

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:45:31 2014 No.20014 >>20003 >seiriously implying you were going to get that evreyone was trying for 20000, bro.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:47:01 2014 No.20042 >>19932 >xbox is most likely to be sold i thought the 360 turned a profit? is MS looking to get out of hardware altogether?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:48:31 2014 No.20056 >>19852 >>19957 wow you guys are lazy. I read at least 3 financial reports on daily basis. Just go to page 14.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:49:01 2014 No.20071 >>19932 >net impartialty net neutrality?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:49:01 2014 No.20078

>>19902
I have been, I've done it on other boards as well. It's rather discouraging when you do it and it goes ignored for so long on other boards as well.

It's also rather discouraging when you're aware that part of the staff is the reason for it. However I shouldn't even know that much information so I'm just going to keep it that vague as that much could have already been inferred by simply speculating. I think a lot of people on /v/ actually tried to raise certain things to the attention of the proper staff already. I'm probably already risking a ban by saying this.

It just all seems so pointless in the end when nothing changes. . .

Kind of like voting in a democracy I guess

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:49:32 2014 No.20063 >>19902 This. Reporting so far has been very helpful. Look what just happened in this thread. The other thread proves to me there is hope for this board.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:49:32 2014 No.20069

>>20042
year over year, Xb360 started to make money in the last years, but is you + and - ALL year, Xbox division is big red mark all across the board in Microsoft, and with the slow start of Xbone vs PS4, investors want its head

Ps3 was the same in 7th gen, it was not sold cause Is kaz favorite kid in the class, no matter how awful it did

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:50:01 2014 No.20081 >>20056 some of us do this for fun, not for a living (not me yet, till I have enough savings to start to invest )

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:51:01 2014 No.20091 >>20071 that shit... they changd the term in some spanish new and I confuse it when I do the translation back.. sorry

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:51:01 2014 No.20092 >>20063 >>20078 Maybe I'm wrong then, I'll keep faith. I just assumed people were deleting their posts, but if that's the case maybe there is hope with this board.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:53:31 2014 No.20108 >>19840 >http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/financial/fr/13q3_sony.pdf from what i could gleam assets: $149,080 liabilities: $121,003 im retarded, right? they dont actually have $149,080?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:55:31 2014 No.20133 its funny to watch the shit /v/ does when shilling for their company, just because they literally make it up as they go along like referring to SCEA as "the gaming division"

>>	Official Wrinkle Face™ creat(...) Fri Feb 14 18:55:31 2014 No.20140 >>8953 le love hug (^_¥} post this is 3 other threads to receive le love hug (^_¥}

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:55:31 2014 No.20142 >>20092 >I just assumed people were deleting their posts >shitposters doing right \| >>20108 ..thats on millions anon 149,080 x 1,000,000 = 149,080,000,000 = 149.08 billions dollars read the small text above the chart

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:57:01 2014 No.20157

>>20108
that's in millions of USD, whether or not that actually have that amount in assets is broken down by a few factors. I think what you're referring to is cash and no they do not have that much in cash/ cash equivalents that is their total book value of their assets

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:57:31 2014 No.20155 >>20142 your right dude, maybe i SHOULD read shit once in a while

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 18:58:01 2014 No.20172 >>20157 this is the equivalent if they sell all they have, even the kitchen

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:00:31 2014 No.20184

>>20142
I actually didn't read the content of their posts and look back to see what was deleted. Going back through a thread over and over again is very time consuming.

I also don't want to assume all were shit posters but some people just uneducated and realized they were doing harm. Maybe I'm just naive though for giving people that benefit of the doubt.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:02:02 2014 No.20211

>>20172
Not necessarily true as some assets are valued at fair value and some at cost - amortization/depreciation, other factors etc. It wouldn't be at the same amount, but this is a simple way of explaining it.

I'm not sure why you're quoting me though unless you did it to add to my post in which case thank you.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:03:01 2014 No.20219 >>20211 add

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:05:31 2014 No.20232

>>20069

Explained it on /v/ a couple of times but there's a lot to the Xbox brand you can't get across with just posting the netloss chart that I can now post on /biz/ without shitposting and "NUH UH ITS DEAD". Thankfully. Also this is probably a two part post so buckle your shit up for some 888 DIDNT READ SHIT

For one. The original Xbox was not just a living room trojan. It was a trojan for the entire company. Bill was interested in the future of "Big Data" and wanted to expand out services to enterprise with the rise of broadband. So with the investment into Xbox came the investment into a massive server network at Microsoft locations around the world. Xbox Live wasn't just a gamer network. It was MIcrosoft saying "We can handle huge amounts of data like videogames and voice coms at the same time". And I mean, Live was revolutionary at that point as most PC games didn't have integrated solutions and vent was super clunky and buggy. Enterprise bought in huge to MS servers because they proved it. And when Nvida refused to drop component costs. They made a new box and rushed it to market to expand on servers even more. They were making hand over fist on enterprise thanks to Xbox fueling the R&D.

That was Bill's goal. A living room box and branching MS out into services. MS planed a $10-15 billion write down on the original Xbox because it was always meant to be a loss leader. And it worked. Why do you think they intergrated more into xbone? They want to show enterprise that cloud service work and work well with Skydrive and more.

(end of part 1)

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:07:01 2014 No.20249
File: 313 KB, 300x182, 1391960506860.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>20133
>on /v/
>sonys stock had taken a dive that day, at least 4 threads about it
>go into one of them and ask how this impacts video games
>"sony being bankrupt would surely impact video games, it would save them!"
>ask how a dip stock prices would indicate impending bankruptcy
>"if the stock hits 0, sony is bankrupt. dont you know anything about buisness?"

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:10:31 2014 No.20281 File: 54 KB, 192x220, 1367041441224.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>20249 >>"if the stock hits 0, sony is bankrupt.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:10:31 2014 No.20282 >>20249 Well they are not wrong. If Sony hits 0 then it probably bankrupted

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:11:32 2014 No.20291 >>20249 If this is the case we probably shouldnt let ourselves turn into shitposting about them. Let them be ignorant while we aren't and actually be constructive about it. Otherwise that's just going to encourage them to come here and shitpost.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:12:01 2014 No.20305 >>20282 you get out of bussiness before stocks hit 0

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:12:31 2014 No.20301

>>20232

Paul Allen always wanted Xbox dead. He hates the branching of MS. Hated it beyond going OS and workstation back then. Hates it going beyond servers and infastructure now. He shittalked Seamus Blackley and Ed Fries behind their backs constantly. That his head showed up again isn't surprisng. Neither is ValuAct who wanted it dead since the 360. Investors are going to want the least profitable parts cut, even if they do feed into the rest of the company. That's their job, to make the most money (Even though Bing underlies a huge amount of R&D that flows into enterprise solutions)

Xbox is a complex part of the MS infrastructure that even Ballmer's old "Guns to heads" approach between divisions wasn't allowed to touch or Bill would get really mad as it produced so much R&D that flowed back into enterprise. It's genius. It's why there's wacky ideas like making AI's based on player behaviours and computing it using Azure before distributing it. Enterprise and Universities are stroking their dicks wanting that sort of R&D (And having played Forza 5 at launch and recently at a friends house, it shockingly works well. It's gone from idiotic demolition derby to actual competitive races. Game needs more track content badly though.).

And that's why they keep xbox. It's value goes beyond the box itself and with the new "One Microsoft" structure and re-org. It's only going to be even more important to them as R&D comes in and out with Azure. With SkyDrive. With Kinect.

It's Bill's box. He knows what he's doing. It's not being sold unless they get a really good split IPO offer that MS can control the infrastructure with. (Though apparently he's not buying his xbone till Kinect Sports Rivals comes out according to his AMA. Some people have some weird tastes. Sataya Nadella bought his at Christmas but then Nadella's supposedly a big Halo fan. Guess who may be responsible for all those halo related codenames like Threshhold and Cortana lately?)

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:13:31 2014 No.20317 >>20282 Correlation and causation two different things. I suggest you read this funny comic http://imgur.com/aONOD

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:16:01 2014 No.20355 >>20301 >he shittalked Seamus Blackley and Ed Fries behind their backs "behind their backs" seems to imply that they didnt nake these statements publicly. Care to elaborate?

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:16:01 2014 No.20360

>>20317
I probably should start downloading and posting these images, after all this is an imageboard.

Although this subsection doesn't really seem like it should be the primary focus of images this seems like a discussion board. If it was primarily image based then it would just be spewing memes at each other all day like a few of the other ones.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:20:31 2014 No.20403 >>20317 >that comic Heh There might be a lot of Dilbert posted on this board.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:27:04 2014 No.20483

>>18418

Yeah, but TV commercials aren't enough. You've gotta do the full court press these days... hell, even if they uploaded their commercials to youtube, the way to get people seeing them fastest is to tweet about it.

Twitter has become an essential part of a lot of companies' advertising departments, they'd likely pay to keep using it.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:29:04 2014 No.20497

>>20355

Boardroom politics. Paul Allen was talking shit about them in the board room. Apparently Ballmer told Blackley, Fries and J Allard because he wanted them to know the resistance they were up against and the project might have been canned. Ballmer didn't like Xbox either till Fries, Blackley and Allard gave a passionate defense to the board that convinced Ballmer and most of the board to go with it. (Apparently one of the meetings just before it launched and the hype they were getting over Halo had Ballmer pounding the table yelling "THATS WHAT THE NEWS WILL BE SAYING! XBOX! XBOX! XBOX!". Man, I'll miss Ballmer stories).

You should read the two books Dean Takashi made on it. They are really good. Think of Emily Rogers "Dolphin Story" article except for Xbox.

Also consider that Ed Fries is now insane and advising on Ouya so take some of the stories with a pinch of salt though.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:29:04 2014 No.20498 >>18521 >Microsoft is doing fine, even with their weak Xbox branch. I thought I'd heard something about their current crop of investors and whatnot making a big push to dump their peripherals market, including the XBox and the Surface.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:32:04 2014 No.20533

>>20301
I know/understand Xbox is meant to be multimedia box for the living room, and it used gaming and the ez-est way to get inside the houses.

but some of the ideas are..lets call em... before their time.

the whole cloud/ stream idea is cool but the internet as a network and as a service is way behind to actually provide this enough support to this.
add to it ISP data plans and caps and severed limited speeds per region per zone, make things worst.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:34:04 2014 No.20545 >>20301 >It's Bill's box. He knows what he's doing. Bill Gates is not even a chairman at Microsoft anymore.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:35:34 2014 No.20556 >>20498 they just dont want leaking holes, but the company as a whole is doing fine

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:36:34 2014 No.20565 >>20545 I think he still involved in R&D in the company and xbox was his idea

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:38:34 2014 No.20576 >>20565 He's a "Technology Advisor" whatever that is supposed to mean.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:42:34 2014 No.20624

>>20498

Just like the last 10 years. They will be ignored. Especially since the branch has been fairly strong and Surface has really picked up recently. The mexican stand off Google's having with Phone vendors is also going to be interesting as Samsung is looking to be offering a phone with Galaxy 5 specs, but with Windows Phone OS instead (Shots fucking fired. And Samsung's rich enough to tell Google to fuck off by spending billions too). It's why the business media were starting to call 2014 the year of MS. They are picking themselves back off the ground and Their products are getting interesting again.

>>20533

Well that's the thing. It's Bill's Blue Sky Box. It has problems. It's not perfect.

But I was mainly trying to give context on why Microsoft won't sell xbox. It's too integral to the company. Especially now the biggest growing division is servers and Xbox live has been feeding those servers with R&D for years. Too intertwined for it to be sold without some major, major pains on both companies end.

I just wanted to kinda put the kill on the whole "They will sell it" because /v/ threads used to get the exact same slide when Sony finances came into question.

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:48:34 2014 No.20696

>>20624
they might not sell it, but then they better see a way to make investors happy about it.

also, back to internet, as long as they depend on this, the whole xbox idea is limited to what ISP do and want
if they really want to make this a huge success in the way they want, most have their own network of internet.

this can only nbe done by 2 ways, buy and already existing company and their infraestructure.

or do it from scratch, like google wants with Googlefiber

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 19:59:21 2014 No.20831

>>20696
>they might not sell it, but then they better see a way to make investors happy about it.

I think last quarter when they had a profitable SKU putting over $500 million into the profit margins will keep a lot of them. Another thing that you could never explain on /v/ is that as it stands, the board is pro-Xbox. And with it's profitable performance. Will likely stay that way.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 20:05:21 2014 No.20893 >>20831 not sure about the board,but the last I remember is that investors and I think the new CEO are against it

Anonymous Fri Feb 14 20:25:22 2014 No.21108

>>19055
>>19496

Hahaha. I always knew Nintendo fanboys are the ones going against sony as much as the xbox fanboy do.

As for the financial calamity Sony is going through, I dont think they'll be bankrupt just yet.
If they dont turn things around in 5 years, maybe.

But then, it'll be a sad, sad day for gaming.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 20:27:51 2014 No.21125 How long until this board gets ravaged by the feds for insider trading?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 20:30:25 2014 No.21155 >>21125 not likely, but will be fun to see it happen >>21108 >they dont like my favorite company so?

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 21:22:24 2014 No.21649 >>21155 >>they dont like my favorite company wtf are you talking about? Anyway, this board is pretty good. Hopefully, it can keep console babies out.

>>	Anonymous Fri Feb 14 21:27:54 2014 No.21692 >>21649 it depends all out in moderators

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 00:08:31 2014 No.22882 Short it down

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 00:10:01 2014 No.22901 >>22882 wut

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 00:57:31 2014 No.23231 >>9550 HOLY FUCKING SHIT

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 01:01:32 2014 No.23262 >>18262 Jesus get out while you still can!!

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 01:02:01 2014 No.23274
File: 24 KB, 276x268, everythingisfine.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Here's my thing about holding onto the TV division. If Sony manages to stay above water in the medium term, wouldn't streamlining and concentrating their TV production onto high end consumer lines pay off? As far as I can tell, it seems that they are attempting to recapture a segment of the market with their 4K lineup as the best product available in the TV market. Based on trends towards consumer demand for resolution and ratio closer and closer to cinema standards, getting a one up in 4K and UHDTV seems natural. They currently face little competition in this specific market, it is plausible that their headstart would allow them to establish a dominance through similar quality, affordable lines down the road where others (Samsung especially) might scramble to catch up.

While the TV business will never be the bread and butter it was before smartphones and tablets, its not going anywhere. People will want large screens for living spaces long after we're all dead, if Sony can adapt to serve the business it was built on, consumer electronics, shouldn't they? I could see Sony turning around their TV business in three years, and make enough smart choices to encourage investors away from the window ledge in a third of the time.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 03:41:01 2014 No.24400 >>23274 same as with PS4 for gaming, Sony is betting all from their TV division on 4K, cause remember how retarded high/fast was the transition and adoption to HD tv

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 05:05:21 2014 No.25006 What has Samsung done right that Sony failed at?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 05:13:21 2014 No.25062 >>25006 quality and price

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 05:41:43 2014 No.25189 >>12721 >Apparently, nobody told him that hardware is useless without software that I like. FTFY

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 05:54:38 2014 No.25253

>>9550

I don't know if we're just ignoring 10-ks for the sake of bait but you can fuck right off if you're just going to blatantly lie like that.

http://www.sony.net/SonyInfo/IR/financial/fr/12q4_sony.pdf

Also I thought it was common knowledge that Sony has posted an operating profit every year except 2012 and that they have been financed by debt, thus incurring interest expenses, as well as Japan having an absurdly high combined tax rate of 41% that is currently being reduced and is planned be reduced to under 30%.

Yeah lets just fucking ignore all that and look at a single metric that doesn't tell us jack shit.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 06:04:38 2014 No.25302 >>16984 >GE >good >relevant fuck off jack welch

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 09:24:34 2014 No.26290

>>23274

Problem with that is that as soon as Sony announced that at CES the next day Vizio announced their 4K line will arrive just before Sony at $1000 start point. Samsung and LG will be bringing the 4K's they have on market down to more low-to-mid range pricing. They are already BTFO before they even launched.

Hell, Lenovo went one further and announced their 4K monitors will have a native android OS controlling them with Netflix, Amazon Instant and Plex pre-installed.

The reason people are down on TV is that Sony acts like they are market leader when they got blown out the very next day they announced their 4K slate.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 10:32:51 2014 No.26735 How are they spending so much money? Can't they just raise prices and shit?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 10:34:51 2014 No.26746 >>23262 >selling sony while they are in process of spin off can't be this dumb

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 10:46:52 2014 No.26828

>>23274
Instead of holding on their TV division in hopes that it may recover one day (and burning cash reserves while at it), they can just sell it quite a sum along with their other major loss sector.

Sony would be worth more than $30 in a couple months after they do this

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:09:21 2014 No.26957 >>26828 You will pull TV manufacturing from Hirai's cold dead hands. No, really. They are that convinced they can make a comeback with TV. Spinning it off was only a half-hearted measure on Hirai's part.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:20:26 2014 No.27013

>>26735
If they raise the price, demand for their goods in theory should decrease so they will lose out on sales. I don't think they should increase price because they are not as innovative as their competition, so tech-heads would not pay the extra money for the goods and also households will not pay the extra money.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:24:56 2014 No.27045 Ok I have a question: What does this mean for the PS4? I'm asking this because I haven't bought one yet, and I don't want to buy one and then find that Sony has gone bust with no-one making games for it any longer.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:25:56 2014 No.27053 Okay, so when should I purchase a Vita?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:26:56 2014 No.27070 File: 93 KB, 680x497, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >both Sony and Nintendo will go bankrupt in your lifetime The console fanboy faggotry will finally cease

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:27:56 2014 No.27079 >>27070 PC fag pls go

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:27:56 2014 No.27080

>>27045
The PlayStation brand would be sold as an asset, another company could take over the operation. If you remember what happened to THQ, they went bankrupt and sold their development teams to other companies like Volition, they were purchased as an asset and are now doing the same thing but just in a different business. If I were you I would buy one, Sony wont go bankrupt

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:28:56 2014 No.27088 File: 23 KB, 286x286, image.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>27079 I play PC and PS3 mang

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:31:26 2014 No.27106 >>27080 Thanks. Didn't know if this struggle for Sony at the moment would lead to the PS brand going as well. Was under the impression that with it being so iconic they would never let it go.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:33:26 2014 No.27123

>>27106

They won't. But I wouldn't expect it to be the same as the PS2 or PS3. There will be lots of cost cutting. Pushing subscriptions and ads and more. There's been reports that Sony are now advertising in private messages between PSN members as well (For the last of Us DLC but you know where that road heads if you post here).

I think the real interesting part would be if Kaz Hirai gets replaced as CEO and a real cost cutting axe man gets the job and SCE is no longer given free reign. That would be very interesting.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:34:27 2014 No.27127

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/video-news/video-sonys-waterproof-walkman-sold-in-bottle-of-water-in-new-zealand-30010188.html

This is pretty cool, good marketing strategy.

You really shouldn't believe that Sony will die, this thread sort of reminds me of 'IT'S HAPPENING' threads on /pol/ where little things get blown out of proportion

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:37:56 2014 No.27150

>>27127
>You really shouldn't believe that Sony will die

No one does. We believe they will be spun off and sold piecemeal till only Sony Life, their insurance branch, is left. We're just discussing how they are managing to run themselves into the ground at the minute despite having a successful product (That makes a razor slim margin profit).

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:38:26 2014 No.27152 >>27045 Don't listen to retards on this board. Sony is not going to bankrupt, not for at least 10 years given their cash reserves

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:38:56 2014 No.27156 >>27127 >You really shouldn't believe that Sony will die Personally I don't but it's also naive to think that's not possible. There are huge companies that have crashed and burned in the past.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:39:56 2014 No.27166

>>27150
>We believe they will be spun off and sold piecemeal till only Sony Life, their insurance branch

You don't know what you're talking about. Their picture, music, and game still rake in a lot of profits, why the hell would Sony sell those departments.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:40:27 2014 No.27173

>>27123
Ah ok, thanks mate.

>>27127
>this thread sort of reminds me of 'IT'S HAPPENING' threads on /pol/ where little things get blown out of proportion
Fuck me, you should see the occassional Yellowstone threads on it - the retardation is astounding.

>>27152
That's what I thought.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:41:26 2014 No.27185 >>27166 Especially now since Playstation is just a cash cow. They did all the hard work of promoting and creating it, why would they sell it when the 'sitting back and racking in the cash' period has just begun?

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:43:56 2014 No.27200

>>27156
Those large companies usually are losing money across the board. Sony's profitable sectors actually rakes in >$1 billion in operating income per quarter. Sony has very ludicrous departments that is being dragged down by their semi-conductors and some of their electronics.

Literally all they have to do is sell those deadbeats and everybody will surge in to buy Sony stocks

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:44:57 2014 No.27204

>>27166

>Picture

Lost money during the summer and has been run like shit the last few years. Unreliable and needs a spin off

>Music

Only consistent profit maker and still at slim margin

>Gaming

OhWaitYoureSerious.gif

No wait, the Sony fanboys on /v/ found these threads. Wonderful.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:44:57 2014 No.27206 >>26735 Sony products are already at a premium price already, close to that of how Apple would price their products. The reason why no one buys their PC and TVs.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:45:26 2014 No.27220

>>27185
PS4 raked them in $4.2 billion in revenue and $172 million operating income last quarter, and this is just from selling the hardware and few packages.

The cashcow hasn't even arrived. When game licensing kicks in and their cloud services launch, they are going to swim in cash as those PS plus, cloud TV's, and other online services margin are very high.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:46:56 2014 No.27225 >>9550 18000 years of losses!!

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:48:26 2014 No.27236

>>27204
>Lost money during the summer and has been run like shit the last few years. Unreliable and needs a spin off

Bullshit. Their picture has always been profitable except for ONE quarter.

>>Gaming OhWaitYoureSerious.gif

you're fucking retarded. Did you bother looking at Sony's last quarter financial report? Their game sector accounts for 17% of company's profits and 20% of their total revenue. THIS HASN'T EVEN FACTOR IN the real money cash that will be coming for PS4

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:49:26 2014 No.27243 Jesus fuck. This thread is retarded. There's fanboys from /v/ shitting up the board already and it's only two days old.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:54:27 2014 No.27297

>>27220

Except software sales right now are abysmal (even the Xbox One is beating them in software sales). And this doesn't seem to be turning around any time soon.

The Cloud Services may not take off either because of the rumoured price tag.

>Cloud TVs

Don't make me laugh.

>>27220

For a record breaking console launch, that is a joke. The profit margins are razor thin, and as I said earlier software sales are terrible.

$172 million is a drop in a bucket of the overall debt. With Kaz hanging onto TV as a 100% wholly owned IPO, they're going to keep bleeding.

PlayStation isn't going to save them. And many signs point to them possibly windowdressing it for selling off as a last resort (burying sales numbers like with the Vita, PSNow being used on non-PlayStation devices).

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:58:56 2014 No.27337 >>27297 But the Playstation 4 is outselling the xbox http://venturebeat.com/2014/02/13/january-2014-npd-playstation-4-extends-its-lead/

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:59:57 2014 No.27349 And then sony buys all the anime in japan and offer it on google`

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 11:59:57 2014 No.27352

>>27220
You realize that's only because they deliberately used favourable exchange rates, right? Why would they pad their numbers if they were doing so well? Oh wait, it's because you're speculating due to your investment in the brand. We don't need your fanfiction here.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:01:26 2014 No.27367 >>27349 They should actually go into anime, their games and movie development teams are pretty great, why not sell something that japan loves most?

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:01:26 2014 No.27373

>>27297
>Except software sales right now are abysmal (even the Xbox One is beating them in software sales). And this doesn't seem to be turning around any time soon.

Duh. Hence the cash cow will be coming soon

>The Cloud Services may not take off either because of the rumoured price tag.

Nobody cares about rumors

>Cloud TVs Don't make me laugh.

What is netflix

>For a record breaking console launch, that is a joke. The profit margins are razor thin, and as I said earlier software sales are terrible.

You are fucking retarded, just stop talking. Bulk of console's profits come from software and game license, which is inevitable when you have popular product.

Alot of people have ps4, alot of developers is going to make game for ps4. This isn't rocket science

>$172 million is a drop in a bucket of the overall debt.

Debt shouldn't even be part of this discussion. They're not going to sell one of their best profitable sector regardless of debt. They have enough cash reserves to last 10+ years, debt isn't going to be an issue.

They are selling their PC and spinning off TV. Not a huge stretch that they will sell their batteries and semi-conductor next, shreding off $150m costs from entertainment and hopefully other loss-lead devices.

If you have any balls at all and wants to make some serious money, this is near once in a decade opportunity. risk is high but the returns are so much higher, loaded up on 2015 and 2016 Jan $22 and $25 strike calls.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:01:56 2014 No.27370 >>27337 Anon. I just said that software sales on the Xbox were higher. Not hardware. Xbox is doing decent hardware wise, but both consoles slumped in January. I can understand the confusion though.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:02:56 2014 No.27379 >>27297 >(even the Xbox One is beating them in software sales). False. MS press release lumps in Xbox One and Xbox 360 software sales together.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:03:56 2014 No.27387 >>27370 Right, and that article also says that ps4 softwareware outsold xboxone software

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:05:26 2014 No.27403

>>27370
You shouldn't care about software sales this early into a console live. There are barely any games for both hardware, and developers are sitting on the side line waiting for clear numbers to take their side.

Console sales didn't slump, it was within expected range.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:06:26 2014 No.27405

I am buying 1000 shares of sony on Monday.

Bad news is good news in this fucking retarded economy.

>5,000 jobs cut
>THEERRE MAKIN CHANGES!!!

>failed product launch
>THEREEEE GONNA MAKE CHAnges!

It has always been a shit product and a shit company. Since 1995 it has been that way.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:07:56 2014 No.27415 >>27405 Sony is trading far below book value. I wish they would cut every job possible in their loss lead sectors

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:08:57 2014 No.27429 >>27373 not him but they did a bullshit move with tv. theres no reason to think they will sell off more divisions as the ceo clearly is no longer thinking rationally.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:09:56 2014 No.27436 >>27367 They are. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aniplex Music is also heavily involved, obviously.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:10:26 2014 No.27445 >>27352 Dude, go read the report. I don't want to waste anymore time with you Their enclosure have accounted for exchange rates. p.s profit is still profit

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:13:26 2014 No.27470

>>27429
This is pure speculation, but I believe CEO spinoff TV to save face from die hard Japan nationalists and Sony consumers. I see them IPO and strip away their TV sectors slowly

Batteries and semi-conductors are not national/brand icon, I don't see him having any problem selling it off like he did with Vaio.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:16:30 2014 No.27485 >guy spouts bullshit >prove him wrong >doesn't confess to being stupid and doesn't reply tfw

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:17:30 2014 No.27490 >>27470 that would make sense, good speculation. thank you.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:18:30 2014 No.27499 >>27485 There isn't right or wrong in investing, just winners and losers. Unless you try to argue the fundamentals, then you are just retarded.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:24:30 2014 No.27536 >>27485 You both are wrong.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:25:33 2014 No.27545 >>27536 wow, such philosophy! You got a degree in that?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:27:33 2014 No.27554 >>27490 of course I can be wrong and Sony end up not selling shit, loss my investments.but given the upsides and how cheap the 2015 call premiums are, I'll take the risks.

>>	BismuthVectoring !FRESHtYylA Sat Feb 15 12:48:39 2014 No.27679 >>9550 But what did they do? How could they fail so hard?

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 12:51:39 2014 No.27703

>>27220
>>27236
>>27373

>$172 million operating income
>Pumped by Favorable Yen/Dollar exchange rate
>"B-B-But Cash Cow from licencing!"

OK. From this evidence Sony will be alive because they have retarded enough investors to keep pumping money into it like this guy.

$172 million on the biggest selling product of the year would have heads rolling at Apple and Samsung. Xbox division made three times that number and was more profitable than Sony as a company (And that was only 1/13th of Microsoft's profit of $6.5bn for that quarter).

Seriously. You don't see the bigger picture at all. Their margins are terrible and are being pumped by favorable exchange rate. They are in an extremely piss poor state with razor thin margins with a cowardly CEO who cannot let go of his unprofitable pet projects.

BismuthVectoring !FRESHtYylA Sat Feb 15 13:04:41 2014 No.27788

>>25253
The debt's eventually gonna run out. And then Sony's fucked.

>>14337

>Even PS4 is fucking sheer luck that Microsoft and Nintendo shot themselves in the foot and Valve is busy pissing away all their consumer goodwill

>This console generation has ushered an age of retardation

>>12959
Korean market only exists because Koreans are autists will play anything that looks like Starcraft and has sexy or cute girls.

Basically the Korean market exists only because instant gratification has been discovered to be a mid-profit, low risk market wheni it comes to games. Basically exists like nightclubs do: You amke a shitty games. X cute thing makes it popular for some years, something else become popular and you drop your game and make a new one.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 13:19:29 2014 No.27895 I bought Vita and 10 games on it. You can't blame this shit on me.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 14:10:14 2014 No.28226 >>25062 >korean shit >quality heh samsung is just the best jewing, manipulating, viral adveritsing, fud spewnig, cheating, unethical consumer electronics company in the world i hope north korea nukes them

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 14:21:16 2014 No.28310

>>27703
>Xbox division made three times that number
>investors keeping company afloat

Holy fuck you are deluded and stupid. Microsoft group their entire xbox division with "Devices & Consumer segments", which includes skype, windows home, search engines, etc. You cannot compare that with game segments

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 14:52:17 2014 No.28625

>>27788

That's definitely not how debt works. So long as you keep paying back and fulfilling the terms of the loan so as to avoid technical default, you can theoretically borrow infinitely. The reason credit agencies lower their ratings for Sony is because they're risky. They are profitable, but not as much as they want them to be. They face a lot of risks, but they're risks for the future, not today. As is Sony is still in a very good position to succeed because unlike all these other companies, they have profitable sections of their business. In reality, American investors clash with Japanese employees because conglomeration and family are not American values in business. Sony is responding because Kaz isn't an idiot and knows they need to make changes that Japanese won't be fond of.

And really, anyone who has used their products over the past 30 years knows they're just as good now as they've always been. They need to work on everything that comes after you build the television and game console.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 14:55:19 2014 No.28661 >>27703 >make the most popular video game console >mostly export it to us/eu and receive favorable gains on exchange rate >implying they will ever stop doing this captcha: scheTh General

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 15:00:19 2014 No.28709

>>28625

>Kaz isn't an idiot. (Probably the most incorrect thing in this entire thread.)
>Sony products are just as good now as they've always been
>-$1.1 billion projected loss = profitable

Opinion discarded.

>>28310

First of all search engines doesn't mean shit because Bing has lost them a ton. Second of all, it's well-known that M$ has made more profit off their boxes than Sony, and has only sold about 1.5 million less. Regardless of whether it's not 3x the amount, they've made more than Sony has on PS4s, guaranteed.

He's right about investors keeping the company afloat in the sense that investors are excited for the idea that Sony will split up its divisions finally with enough pressure.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 15:10:45 2014 No.28817 >>12815 The correct term is /v/irgin, you retard.

Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:11:07 2014 No.29510

>>28310

Devices and Consumer Hardware = Xbox and Surface. Made $411 million. Surface lost $23 million. Everything else was Xbox.

Devices and Consumer Other includes Skype and bing etc along with digital purchases and subscriptions with Xbox Live. Made $431 million.

Assume that Xbox live made over $100 million (Pretty much a given) and you have your half a billion.

Math is very useful on /biz/ compared to /v/

>>28625

If Sony can convince you that selling rebadged LG Panels and rebadged Chink Brick phones to you is "As good quality" as the Walkman and Trinitron at their peak. Then god help you, because we can't.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:17:07 2014 No.29605 >>26735 >raise prices and shit? more? have you seen sony 4K TV prices?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:26:12 2014 No.29723 >>27070 to /v/ with you

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:28:12 2014 No.29753 >>27220 >PS4 raked them in $4.2 billion in revenue and $172 >make 0.17B out of 4.2B >4% profit margin so sony is now working on starving rates?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:29:12 2014 No.29761 232

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:31:12 2014 No.29778 >>29761 whats the cap for this board? 300?

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:35:13 2014 No.29835 >>29753 You also have to account for Dollar/Yen exchange on that since Sony trades in Yen. >>29778 Yep. But this is a trial board anyway and mootykins probably wants us at 300.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:37:13 2014 No.29854 >>29778 Yeah. Someone should archive this shit though.

>>	Anonymous Sat Feb 15 16:38:13 2014 No.29881 >>29854 we should continue in other thread and here is the archive http://archive.foolz.us/biz/thread/8953

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/biz/ - Business & Finance