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/biz/ - Business & Finance

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855946 No.855946 [Reply] [Original]

What's up guys, I'm a 23 year old prop trader at one of the world's largest firms. Working in NYC trading equities, ETFs and ETNs. I'll be on for a couple of hours today if anyone has questions about the industry or trading in general.

>> No.855948

How did you get your start?

What kind of home do you live in?

>> No.855951

How do I get employed as a prop trader?

>> No.855953

>>855948
I started off as an analyst out of college and it sucked so hard. I had a friend working for this firm who got me an interview. I had been trading on my own for about 3 years so was pretty well qualified despite having a degree from just a mid tier school.

I rent a house in NJ with 4 roommates.

>> No.855954

>>855951
Have a bankroll. There are firms who will hire literally anyone with capital to put up. However, you will go broke doing this. Try and find a senior trader who will let you on his desk and that way you will have a mentor. That path is a lot more competitive.

>> No.855959

>>855954

Damn, that's it? Literally have money?

I've been trading for a year, getting more consistent, but still on a total loss. How did you get into one of the "world's largest firms" ?

>> No.855960

>>855946
Is Bogle right?
If so, how do you beat the market consistently?
If not, what is the point of your job?

>> No.855963

>>855959
I had a good connection to get an interview. My boss literally receives dozens of applications every day, very hard to get in on your own. If you are already a trader though that gives you huge leg up.

Prop firms are broker dealers, meaning they charge you commission to trade. So if they have an open desk, they will try and fill it to bring in revenue through your commissions. They can be kind of scummy and there is a high rate of turnover for new traders. Most will just burn through their small accounts and then the firm kicks them out.

>> No.855966

>>855963

So the prop trading firm gives you capital to trade with? Or do you have to bring your own?

Thanks for the info by the way, I always thought that working for a prop trading company especially as a beginner is a bit of a scam, but the prop firm guys have got to cover their ass somehow.

>> No.855967

>>855960
If you have a well-tested and actionable edge you can beat the market consistently.

Don't you find it convenient that the guy who says you can't beat the market ran a mutual fund company... come on man. lol

>> No.855974

>>855966
Yes it's basically a scam if you're new to trading. I have never seen a new trader become consistently profitable- this is a very tough market to navigate though. In 2009 people were making 6 or 7 figures right out of the gate. Today a lot of senior traders are failing to adapt and losing money.

The prop firm gives you leverage and structural support. You always have to bring in your own capital. So let's say you bring in 10k, they might match you with 100 or 200k in buying power. They will also give you a platform to trade from like Lightspeed or TOS and usually lower fees than a broker like etrade.

>> No.855979

>>855967
What does having an "edge" mean in layman's terms?

And I don't necessarily find it convenient, I just feel like he put his money where his mouth is and built a business around what he feels (and MANY others feel) is the most rational way of investing.

>> No.855981

>>855974

Damn, thanks for the info. I think it would probably be better for me to stay at home and trade rather than join a prop firm, plenty of brokers in the UK offer leverage. Wisdom and mentorship might be helpful but I fell I'm making great progress as a self taught trader.

What do you think of the VXX volatility? I was thinking of dropping £1k.

Also what indicators do you use? I use MacD and some moving averages. MacD tells me that the Dow futures has no more momentum to head upwards unless it holds its current price for some time.

>> No.855990

>>855981
I trade mostly based off the tape so the only indicators I use are a few moving averages for reference. I use bollinger bands on my daily charts for reference as well. Haven't really found many indicators to be very useful, but if it's making you money keep at it.

If you're making money on your own, then keep at it. Only come to a prop firm if you feel you need more leverage or need mentorship. In my case, I was killing it in the market for a while then hit a serious rough patch. That's when I came here, to find a mentor.

I would stay away from the vix structured products. I've made a few good trades on uvxy and svxy but in general I don't like how they trade. The only time I would touch these is in a time of market turmoil like a terrorist attack or something. Then uptick that shit!

>> No.856007

>>855990

Which instruments/equities do you trade? I'm mainly on western index futures, sometimes commodities, but no individual stocks.

I'm guessing if you're using the ticker and some ma's, that you scalp, trading little and often?

Sorry if I'm coming off as annoying. Just that it's difficult to find people who are interested or knowledgable on trading.

Just made a trade on the dow futures, short at 17477, stop at 17520, tp ~ 17400.

>> No.856009

>>855979
Having an edge means you have a statistical advantage, like the house at a casino. Over the long term you can expect to make money.

As for this Bogle stuff, yes, the average human being will fail to beat the market over the long term. However I'm not an average person, I'm a professional and my job is to beat the market. You could say the average person would not be able to perform open heart surgery successfully... but the average doctor would.

>> No.856012

>>856007
Yeah I mainly scalp breakout setups in individual stocks right now. In this market I'm not seeing too much success with my swing trades, and indexes have been pretty range bound. I have a position in SUNE right now but that's my only overnight position.

>> No.856014

>>856007
DIA looks like it's setting up for a breakout over 175.50

>> No.856015

>>856014

we shall see which of the big boys blinks first

>> No.856018

>>855990
How "active" do you have to be to work with a prop trading firm? I've got about a million dollars that I've grown extremely quickly from a few hundred thousand dollars.

I'd be ecstatic to be given a few more million to trade with and make more money, but I wouldn't be day trading or coming into the office. I've got a couple long term positions that I've put on and am meaning to keep. How do they review performance? If the firm "grades" you based on how you did in a given quarter, then that's seems extremely short sighted and tells me that prop firms are filled with algo traders that are just riding the QE wave.

>> No.856019
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856019

>>855946
>I'm a 23 year old prop trader at one of the world's largest firms.
>world's largest firms.

Walmart is now trading stocks, eh?

>> No.856025

>>856018
We have algo traders, scalpers, swing and position traders here. My buddy had been riding GS all year and collecting dividends. Doesn't matter what the strategy is as long as you make money. Some guys to fundamental analysis and some are purely technical. Whatever works for you. The firm only takes a cut of the profit when you cut yourself a check.

>> No.856026

>>856012

for ticker-based-scalps I tend to go off the 200 day MA. Once the ticker has breached once and gone higher, is the buy signal. Sell signal is a cross back into the 200 dMA/whenever you feel it's overbought.

>> No.856029

>>856019
yeah sometimes it's hard to manage positions while I'm greeting people at the door but I'm a good multitasker

>> No.856031

>>856025
Didn't really answer my question. How long is a trader given to post good results? A year?

If you seem smart but fuck up, do they give you another year?

>> No.856034

>>856031
Most places will let you keep trading as long as you have equity to put up. I would say performance is seriously reviewed after your first 6 months then year. Depends on the firm though. On our desk you will be kicked off if you don't produce in 6 months, but you can still stay on with the firm.

>> No.856037
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856037

>>856026
Have you tried learning to read tape?

>> No.856038

>>856034
>6 months

Sorry, that's ridiculous. You're further convincing me that prop trading firms are run by bozos.

>> No.856039

>>856037

are you on about the ticker or the order book? Still a noob..

>> No.856041

>>856038
To expand, I think 2-3 years is a more appropriate timeframe at the minimum. There's a reason why lots of hedge funds lock in funds for years.

>> No.856046

>>856038
Well we are mostly daytraders so 6 months is a pretty long time. You seem to be missing the point that there's really no "evaluation" of performance like a normal job. You're not going to get a bonus, and nobody is going to yell at you for underproducing. You make what you make and if you make a million great, your boss will buy you a nice rolex. If you go broke, you're out. Some people trade for years and never make a profit, they're still here.

>> No.856049
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856049

>>856039
the ticker. Order book is good to know as well, but the tape is where your real info comes from.

>> No.856053

>>856041
You are not a hedge fund...

>> No.856055

>>856046
>mostly daytraders

Yeah, pretty much what I thought. I hope you guys survive VIX exploding during the next downturn (which probably isn't that far away)

:P

>> No.856057

>>856041
Hedge Funds have strategies.

Arcades have their traders bring in their own capital. The trader either burns it, and the arcade gets a cut.

Or the trader will be succesful and the arcade gets a bigger cut.

They are basically selling the shovels during the gold rush.

>> No.856061
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856061

>>856049

This is what I understand when someone says "ticker"... fisher price broker too...

>> No.856064

>>856053
>>856057
What? Prop traders are basically the poor man's hedge fund. There really isn't that much of a distinction in general. Someone has some investing ideas and puts on some trades with other peoples' money.

>> No.856065

>>856055
You do realize that volatility is good for day traders right? People made a killing during the financial crisis. I made a boatload earlier this year shorting the downturn in oil and oil names. Volatility is a trader's best friend.

>> No.856066

>>856057
This guy gets it.

>> No.856068

>>856064
no...

First, you are confusing trading with investing. Second, as a prop trader you are using other people's money merely as leverage. You have the only equity stake.

>> No.856069

>>856061
ah ok. Sorry I should have just said the tape. The market TICK is a very different thing altogether.

>> No.856072

>>856065
According to what? I bet you that just as many day traders got shit on during the crisis. It's a double eded sword.

>> No.856074

>>856069

cool, thanks, I shall educate myself.

Jesus Christ this trade is taking ages...

>> No.856075

>>856074
Right now looks like IWM is going to lead this breakout if it happens. SPY and IWM setting up still

>> No.856076

>>856072
Right... ask any old timer about the crisis and his eyes will glaze over with longing.

>> No.856078

>>856068
Yeah, that's why it's the poor man's hedge fund. Your ass is on the line. Hedge fund partners have linear downside and a 10x upside.

If you don't consider your trades investments, then you must be hedging. You're not hedging. There is no distinction here.

>> No.856081

>>855946
My uncle's dog died and I got $10 inheritance. What should I invest in to be a millionaire by the end of the year?

>> No.856082

>>856078

okay friend, hope you gained a lot, spiritually, financially, and physically, from this 4chan argument on whether blue is blue.

>> No.856083

>>856076
Cool anecdotal evidence bro

>> No.856090

>>856064
>What? Prop traders are basically the poor man's hedge fund


NO !!!

If you set up a hedge fund you have either worked in an investment bank or an existing fund. You have a track record and connections to existing and/or prospective clients and raise a couple of Mlns to start off. You can do so because you did in the past and investors trust you.


If you have "an investing idea" it's likekly to go down the drain. That's why arcades even exist.

>> No.856094
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856094

>>856082
lol

>> No.856095

>>856081
3x long vix or you can fill out this online survey for a cool million. i'll post the link soon.

>> No.856100

>>856083
That's like the most basic anecdote of day trading... volatility is your friend. Unless you write options how are you going to make money if nothing is moving? Answer that one for me smart ass.

>> No.856105

>>856100
>how are you going to make money if nothing is moving

top kek. Nice strawman, dumbass. Enjoy your thread.

>> No.856107

>>855953
ayy fellow NJ stock bro, what county u in?

>> No.856111

>>856094
Time for HR to call me in

This is supposed to be a SFW board

>> No.856112

>>856111

those cunts are probably whacking it anyway

>> No.856123

>>856107
Passaic baby

>> No.856125

>>856105
But really... if you're so smart tell me how or get lost asshole.

>> No.856129

How large are these prop trading firms at the largest?

It sounds like it's one of those collection agencies, where people show up and only work on commission for those poor bastards who pay their debt after harassing people for 10 hours a day in a cubicle. Are they really salt mines like this?

>> No.856140

>>856129
No not like that. I've worked as a cold caller before and that blows dick. I love my job now, just hang out at the office and fuck around with my coworkers. I also get to work with some of the smartest people I've ever met which is such a huge plus. It is 100% commission based though.

>> No.856145

>>856123
oh shit mane morris here. going to WPU in 13 days for my finance major but been trading all summer. doing pretty well swing trading upro but still down a lot from initial stupidity

>> No.856149
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856149

>>856145
what sucks is today i literally had my finger on the buy this morning for upro at 68.50 but i hesitated then it rocketed and i didnt want to chase

>> No.856155

>>856145
Good for you, keep learning. I used to trade while in class at MSU. The experience you get from the market can't be taught anywhere else.

>> No.856158

>>856149
Good job not chasing. That sounds a lot like myself... Always had a big problem with hesitating and then sitting with regret as I saw how much I would've made. Have to make strict rules for yourself and follow them.

>> No.856160

>>855946

Why does the ice melt in the shade?

>> No.856165

>>856160

because you touch yourself at night

>> No.856167

>>856155
nice man i plan to do the same, any thing u wish u knew going into college or things you wish you had done?

>> No.856191

>>856007

closed for a ten quid loss (lol pleb) at 17482, stupid trade, but my patience paid off.

The real question is, what were the reasons behind your call of the Dow going higher?

>> No.856195

>>855946
Do you have a degree, if not how did you get involved in trading?

>> No.856203

>>856195
I have a degree in finance but my trading is almost all self taught through books, blogs, webinars etc over several years.

>>856191
If you check out intraday charts of DIA, IWM, and SPY they were all consolidating at the high of day when you put that trade on. The longer they stay up there, the higher the chance is that the next move is in the same direction (up). Also this market has been so rangebound lately, I won't short anything near the bottom of the range. Not a bad trade thoguh, I know a lot of people shorting these rallies.

>>856167
Yeah, I wish I hadn't gone to college. Almost all of what I use today is self taught or can be found online for free. What I should have done is worked my ass off for a few years to save up some cash, and traded part time. I also wish I had paper traded more and learned how to backtest sooner. Would have saved me a ton of money. I made many stupid mistakes when starting out.

>> No.856205

>>856203
what were your main resources for information?

>> No.856221

>>856205
>>856205
Youtube and Twitter mainly. I follow a ton of traders on Twitter and I highly recommend it. Great community for learning. I would just watch every lesson and webinar you come across until you start to develop your own system or find a path you want to take. Then you can narrow down your research and get more in depth information.

Some of my favorite books on trading:

Trade Your Way to Personal Freedom
Reminiscences of a Stock Operator
The 5 Secrets To Highly Profitable Swing Trading
The Psychology of Trading

Anything by Michael Lewis or Jack Schwager is a must read as well.

>> No.856246

>>856221
you are a nice person. thanks for the help bro

>> No.856265

>>856246
Don't mention it. Trading is a tough business to get into and is totally unforgiving. Just hope I can give someone the help I never got when starting out.

>> No.856279

>>856203

Good points. Like the other dude said, thanks a lot, I and I'm sure plenty of other lurkers are grateful for the information and time taken to post.

>> No.856296

It sounds like OP is working at an arcade and not a reputable prop trading firm. The statements he's making ("It helps if traders have their own capital", "It's 100% commission based") are contrary to everything I know about legit prop trading firms like DE Shaw, Citadel, and DRW.

My advice: don't follow OP's advice.

>> No.856326
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856326

>>856296
Yeah good luck getting a job at Citadel buddy. I'll be rooting for ya.

>> No.856348

>>856296
DE Shaw and Citadel are hedge funds

>> No.856379

>>856221
Any good sites or trading videos where one can learn?

>> No.856416

>>856379
Check out Chat With Traders and branch out from there. This guy has a podcast where he interviews traders every week.

One site I really like is ThePatternSite for learning to spot patterns. That helped me a lot when I was starting out.

>> No.856438

>>856326
I didn't say anything about my seeking a job at Citadel. In fact I have no interest in working in the financial industry again. I simply called you out for what you are: a charlatan. You do not work at a legitimate proprietary trading firm, but rather what's known in the industry as an arcade.

>>856348
You're right. I should have said DRW, Spot, and Jump.

>> No.856467

>>856438
Why are you calling me a charlatan? I'm fully aware of how my firm operates.

I'm curious, coming from someone who doesn't know the difference between a hedge fund and a prop firm, what do you consider "legitimate"?

>> No.856472

>>856438

riiight and has he been anything but dishonest in this thread? You pleb.

Really though, this comes down to you begging for attention. If you want attention so bad, go and learn a money making skill, and then come here and make an AMA.

Anyway instead of asking questions in order to "expose the charlatan", you have made an accusation with no basis. Perhaps you should read the thread, if that cannot be done, Fuck off.

>> No.856474

>>856467
You claim to work at a proprietary trading firm, but you really don't. You are a member of an arcade. A legitimate proprietary trading firm will not ask you to put up any capital and will provide you a generous salary with good benefits.

And I'm well aware of the difference between a hedge fund and a proprietary trading firm. Unlike you I have experience working at both.

>> No.856478

>>856472
Buddy, read>>856140 and>>855954 and >>855974. He clearly states the firm he works for is 100% commission based and expects new traders to put up their own capital.

OP works at what is known as an arcade, not a proprietary trading firm.

>> No.856485

>>856474
You realize that even hedge fund managers are required to put up equity, right? Bullshit you've worked at both. Get lost loser.

>> No.856486

>>856485
>>856485
your a loser u get lost

>> No.856488

>>856485
>You realize that even hedge fund managers are required to put up equity, right?
Yes, I do realize this. They do this so they have "skin in the game" with their investors. What's your point?

>> No.856490

>>856478

okay Captain Autism, I was here from the beginning and OP has been nothing but honest in describing his working conditions.

>>855974

What more do you want you autistic shit gulper.

>> No.856494

>>856486
>>856488
>>856490
shut ur moufs, i make one of the bigges pay salaries in hedgfe fundge in the industry in the market right now.

listen up small time because im oingly going to say this one time to get rich NOW, invest in balloon animals and balloon animal stores.

>> No.856498

>>856494
i bought the party city IPO, when can i retire?

>> No.856502

>>856490
>Le autism maymay xD

op is a self-aggrandizing scumbag handing out shit advice to people like you who don't know any better. I hope you can see what is wrong with that.

>> No.856504

>>856502

help me know better plz

>> No.856506
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856506

>>856494

plz gib moni

>> No.856510

>>856502
I've been nothing but honest here. See my own post >>855974

Unlike 90% of the threads on /biz/ I am trying to contribute something and share my own experiences. What's your deal? Lose all your money in the market? Please stop posting here unless you have something useful to say.

>> No.856512

>>856488

the least you could do is offer yourself to an AMA, instead of trolling and pretending you're big in the game.

>> No.856527

>>856510
You're really not being honest. You say
>You always have to bring in your own capital
but this isn't true. Only arcades ask you to bring in your own capital, and only arcades are 100% commission based. The reputable proprietary trading firms ask you to bring no capital and will pay a salary and benefits.

>>856512
I'm not "big in the game" anymore. I've worked at a prop trading firm, a hedge fund, and a fund of funds investing in PE, VC, and HFs. But this was all in the past. AMA.

>> No.856529

>>856527
I would love to hear all about your time in the business.

>> No.856533

>>855946
Hey OP, good post, thanks for the info. I've always regarded day/technical trading as BS but you seem to be a smart guy so I have a few questions:

- Have you read "a random walk down wallstreet"?

- Do you think stock movements are randoms?

- If so, have you had any strategy/indicator that consistently predicts the movement of the stock?

>> No.856540

>>856533
I meant "if not" in the last question

>> No.856545

>>856527
By HF do you mean High Frequency? If so could you talk a bit more about you're background (university degree, etc)

I'm a management undergrad + finance masters who wants to get into algo trading. I've started learning the basics (black scholes, pricing derivatives, etc) but am still a noob. Do you think it's worthwhile investing the time (probably quite a few years) in learning more mathematical finance with the objective of setting up a diy algo trading unit at home or should I stick to passive index fund investing?

>> No.856557

>>855946
what's your Sharpe ?

>> No.856559 [DELETED] 

>>856545
>By HF do you mean High Frequency?
Sorry, by HF I mean hedge funds, but I can still answer some of your question.

>could you talk a bit more about you're background (university degree, etc)
I graduated with an economics degree from a target university.

>Do you think it's worthwhile investing the time (probably quite a few years) in learning more mathematical finance
Yes. If you want to get into algo trading take as many math courses as you can. Most of the best algo traders didn't study finance, but math, physics, and engineering. The finance part is easy to learn outside of university; the math and engineering part isn't. To touch on another one of your questions, I've read Malkiel's "A Random Walk Down Wall Street" and I'd say it's my favorite finance book I've read.

>> No.856562

>>856545
>By HF do you mean High Frequency?
Sorry, by HF I mean hedge funds, but I can still answer some of your question.

>could you talk a bit more about you're background (university degree, etc)
I graduated with an economics degree from a target university.

>Do you think it's worthwhile investing the time (probably quite a few years) in learning more mathematical finance
Yes. If you want to get into algo trading take as many math courses as you can. Most of the best algo traders didn't study finance, but math, physics, and engineering. The finance part is easy to learn outside of university; the math and engineering part isn't.

To touch on another one of your questions, I've read Malkiel's "A Random Walk Down Wall Street" and I'd say it's my favorite finance book I've read. I think that markets are mostly but not perfectly efficient, and 99% of people would be best off following Malkiel's advice. That said, I think the best of the best traders do have an edge on the market, and having that edge can be wildly lucrative.

>> No.856565

OP! OP!

I'm planning on taking a job as a day at some company. They put up the capital and I get 60% of the profit, minus some fees. Only thing is I don't have any background in trading. They say that they want to see consistent profitability with very few losses... so I was wondering if you had any advice about pitfalls for new traders? Things to be wary of or things that will lose you your entire allowance for the day?

Thanks for the thread.

>> No.856662

>>856565
No company is stupid enough to give someone with no experience, no track record and no strategy any meaningful amount of money. Would you be handing out money like that?

>> No.856680

>>855979
Oil trader here. Edge is when you have record of winning in a certain market set up. Odds are the probability in percentage points that your trade will be successful within its tenor.

>> No.856685

>>856038
All trading firms (except for Goldman Sachs) are run by bozos. That is the rule.

>> No.856693

I have a 1,000 dollars to spend. Where should I invest it for quick returns. Up to 5 years max. What stocks should I be looking at? Should I look into ETF's?

>> No.856710

Anyone else imagining OP losing his shirt in the next market dump? Sounds like youre riding the QE wave and bull market, OP. I wouldnt be to overexposed.

That being said, good on you for taking a risk and giving it a shot. I think youre probably going to lose though considering the whole deal of 100% of the capital and only a share of the profit. They have to make money some how and no one else pays but the traders.

>> No.857040

>>856221
thanks

>> No.857075

>>856662
Yeah, its $325 for "training" (which I expect to be only the bare essentials) but I've looked it up and the opportunity is legit. They start you with like $2000 and bump up the people who don't screw the pooch.

>> No.857131

>>856049
How does trading off of that work?

>> No.857132

>>856221
Any particular Youtube channels you'd recommend?

>> No.857134

>>856710
He's a daytrader.

>> No.857228

>>857134

so if hes active the day the market dumps he might be fucked

>> No.857245

>>857228
He can shut it down before losing too much. Market moves a lot, but not THAT much, there'll be time to exit. The trend for stuff now is pretty much sideways, so as long as he stays with whatever emerging trend (which will be down), he'll probably be fine. It doesn't just drop in one day, it goes down for a while before, as buyers still struggle (until they can't, and it just drops).

>> No.857290

>>855967
>>Is Bogle right?
>Don't you find it convenient that the guy who says you can't beat the market ran a mutual fund company... come on man. lol
Eugene Fama did the same thing with Dimensional Funds. Are you saying his Nobel Prize is a fraud.

Just because someone put their principals into action doesn't mean they're acting out of self-interest.

Unless you have a valid, evidence-based, criticism about index investing, I suggest you shut your mouth on the topic. There's already enough rubes in the world.

Enjoy your smelly NJ shithole with your 4 roomates, faggot. Livin' the dream.

>> No.857352

>>855967

>Don't you find it convenient that the guy who says you can't beat the market ran a mutual fund company... come on man. lol

Do you even understand what it means to "beat the market"?

It means that you get your information before the market gets it and you react before the market does so you are always ahead and therefore you profit.

Now as a normal person I really don't see where you'd get all this new mint information from?!

>> No.857421

>>855967
>If you have a well-tested and actionable edge you can beat the market consistently.
hi stevie

>> No.857468

>>857352
I actually thought the argument meant the average person can't "beat" the market, in that he can't get a better return than the average market return.

>> No.858091

Are there any books that you read that furthered your knowledge and ability in stock trading?

>> No.858118

>>856545
>setting up a diy algo trading unit at home
Why bother spending all that time learning math just to loose all of your money with your diy black box? There is a reason that knowledge quants command high salaries, its b/c setting up profitable algo trading strategies is really fucking hard.

On a serious note, if you want to get into the quant world you definitely need to have a good understanding of mathematics and programming. A management/finance degree isn't going to help much in getting your foot in the door when you're competing against math/physics/engineering candidates.

At my firm we very rarely hired finance/business types or those having too much previous Wall St experience for actual trading/quant/PM roles.

>>856685
>All trading firms (except for Goldman Sachs) are run by bozos. That is the rule.

What is RenTec, Quantlab, PDT, HRT, Edgestream, Hard Eight, TGS and countless others. GS is good but they certainly aren't the only ones making money over extended periods of time.

>> No.858119

>>856494
shut the fuck up dick fuld

>>856562
>>856562
I disagree, "efficient markets" means something slightly different to everybody. In my view, the markets are quite inefficient. Recent examples include the huge dead cat bounce of oil, people believing Greece can ever pay back the debt, and the huge sticky capex in miners expecting the commodities boom to last. Oh, and let's not forget the PBOC sponsored Chinese equities bubble...

In a tangential point, even large systemic issues such as CDOs and the Euro Zone are deeply flawed. How can things be reasonably priced if they aren't even understood properly? I'll concede that on a purely micro view of S&P500 stocks that the market is highly efficient.

>> No.858120
File: 35 KB, 152x157, biden.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
858120

>>855967
>If you have a well-tested and actionable edge you can beat the market consistently.

Fucking dropped.

>> No.858121

>>857468
The key word is consistently.

>> No.858130

>>855946
I'm a gollege student with 10k savings. I'm gettings a few k extra during my study years. Im not getting pretty much anything from my parents and I've never gotten. I want to get wealthy, and I'm willing to risk all my savings. If i lose it all I wont be fucked because I have a good job history.
So I want to trade leverages on daily basis. Currently I've been using a trade site which takes 0.2-0.5% slice. The graphs are shit and trades are slow. Can you recommend a place to trade in for an European (Im finnish)? Do you have tips? Books to read?

>> No.858133

>>858118
I study engineering physics and mathematics (one year down) and I'm possibly taking system analysis as my major. Do you have any tips for getting in to the financial business?
I have have relatively good job history for my age and I'm doing pretty well in selling during summer.

>> No.858770
File: 283 KB, 657x389, l.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
858770

> I had a good connection to get an interview.
you see this is why our current global order sucks

fuck nepotism

fuck randomness

vote NFS 1.0

> >>>/sci/7474037

>> No.859019

>>856019
>Walmart is bigger than amazon

>> No.859617

lol @ the selling... we bear market now

possibly one last hit up to 18000 for the DJIA. Otherwise it's support at 16000... (1 week chart 180 dma).