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/biz/ - Business & Finance

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6117630 No.6117630 [Reply] [Original]

How can you claim this isn’t the bubble when this shit is on the front pages

>> No.6117675

>>6117630
cringe

>> No.6117702

>>6117630
No one is saying it isn't a bubble. It is. We all know it. But we're all smart enough to get rich within 1-2 years before it pops.

>> No.6117746

>>6117702
No, people on this board are actually saying it isn't a bubble. They may even be a majority, I'm not sure.

>> No.6117762

>>6117630
>reading the FT

its become a ultra leftist haven lately. might aswell read the guardian which is free

>> No.6117779

>>6117630
If it’s a bubble (it isn’t) then we’re not even close to the max yet. Go look at how large the dot com industry bubble was before it popped and realize that was fucking US only. Crypto is global.

>> No.6117788

>>6117702
>1-2 years

Delusion.

>> No.6117856

>>6117746
The only people who think it’s a bubble are retarded normie faggots who don’t understand the tech. They confuse a revolution with a bubble because they are retarded.

>> No.6118066

So we need to have a come to jesus meeting about what this "bubble" really is.

I predict the following : A few more years (1-3) before a "pop" and crypto crashes about 50-60% from it's peak.

Think about it this way. What did you invest into crypto when you first started? Take your gains right now and slash them in half. You should still be up a fucking ton.

The only people who will get completely blown the fuck out and burned bad will be the massive influx of normies and late investors when this shit starts ramping up to 5, 6, 10 trillion total marketcap.

Those of you who aren't able to cash out in advance will feel a bit hit as well, but when all is said and done you should still be up "bigly".

I predict world governments allowing crypto to persist just based on the following. As long as US dollars, Euros, etc are the desired reward in the end, and you cannot use bitcoin to buy a cheeseburger or pay a mortgage, why would they try to put a ban on crypto?

I mean really think about it. We all put our money into a big pool. Some of us make big profits and some of us get burned. But when you go to cash out your big profits, you get bent over by the government for 20-35% of your gains in taxes.

The real winner here is the government. Jill and steve both put 10 dollars into Dogecoin. Jill cashes out with 16 dollars after 6 months, and steve with 4 dollars. However Jill must give 2 dollars to the government in taxes.

This isnt a zero-sum game. The real winner is the government and this is why they will allow the game to continue. But ONLY if crypto cannot be adopted to the point where fiat is not the desired endgame currency.

>> No.6118258

>>6118066
>But ONLY if crypto cannot be adopted to the point where fiat is not the desired endgame currency
Trading in satoshis since I got my initial out. Buying tech and metal with crypto. Does this mean in 2 years when more normal normies like me do that, it is over?

>> No.6118384

>>6118258
They will shut down crypto whenever the total amount of crypto being used to buy actual things as a real currency exceeds the amount of tax revenue they generate by people cashing out.

Bob spends $1000 buying gold online with bitcoin
Susan sends $3000 to the government as taxes when she cashes out.

Government wins

Steve buys a $30,000 car online with bitcoin
Susan sends $2,000 to the government in taxes when she cashes out.

Government loses at this point, and they will shut it down to prevent further loss. They want you spending U.S. dollars so they can tax you. Not untaxable crypto. But as long as they are having a net positive they will allow it to continue.

>> No.6118501
File: 27 KB, 488x463, clappppp.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6118501

>>6117702
LET ME EXPLAIN TO YOU, BRAINLET

Bubbles due to their inherent nature of greater fool theory can't really decrease in growth for long periods of time without loosing the cattles faith.
They either grow ever increasing or exponential OR they pop when things stagnate for too long.

if crypto was to continually grow at last 30 days average % per day the total coin-marketcap in 2 years would be more than all the money in existence.

We are closer to the pop than you think.

>> No.6118594

>>6118501
This is a strong bull period, but there will be bear or stagnant periods soon.

The ecosystem will survive a while more.

>> No.6118651

>>6117779
The internet was useful already at thet time though. Crypto is not yet.
Crypto will be insanely important in the future but it doesnt even scratch the revolutionary usefulness the internet had in in practice in 1997 yet.

>> No.6118719

>>6118501
I think we've got 3-6 months left.

>> No.6118769

>>6118719
If we stay bull the entire time, sure.

You realize balance will return soon right? Or do you actually believe these shitcoins are all going to 1b marketcap?

>> No.6118799

>>6118719
Exblain

>> No.6118876
File: 155 KB, 2521x716, earlyadopterslol.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6118876

>>6118594
Next stagnant period will feel like a massive bubble pop to /biz/ though. Just like the 2013 pop wiped out a ton of alts, the next bear market will wipe out a lot of shitcoins and ICO tokens.

What Im saying is the way we trade right now wont be feasible at all once the next bearmarket comes in.

Before too long every normie that was going to get in in this cycle of media attention is in.

FFS check pic related

>> No.6118977

>>6117856
>The only people who think it’s a bubble are retarded normie faggots who don’t understand the tech. They confuse a revolution with a bubble because they are retarded.
Well a lot of people are fucking scared of crypto think of all the banks and governments, what choice do they have other than trying to convince people its a bubble

>> No.6118979

>>6118876
Cool. People who have done their due dilligence will survive and then we will have a new bull period of rapid growth.

The cycle will continue until it reaches unsustainable levels of 5-20t

We have several years left.

If this insane bull period is still ongoing in 2-3 months, I would begin to get nervous.

>> No.6119014
File: 56 KB, 403x448, 1513751543149.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6119014

>>6118501
you have absolutely no fucking idea how crypto market caps work, do you? protip: it's bullshit numbers.

>> No.6119117

>>6118876
How much of that comes from people refreshing page?

>> No.6119156

>>6117630
The Bitcoin bubble is imo collapsing, never to return.
The next bubble is going to be ethereum

>> No.6119238

>>6119156
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTf5j9LDObk

>> No.6119273

>>6119014
Bubbles due to their inherent nature of greater fool theory can't really decrease in growth for long periods of time without loosing the cattles faith.
They either grow ever increasing or exponential OR they pop when things stagnate for too long.

How you calculate does not matter. Once the dumb monney stops flowing its bear market time since there is ZERO buy pressure other than speculation. And of course marketcaps are BS but its the best metric we have to look at inflow of money. Of course only a fraction of "marketcap" actually has to be invested in order to reach astonomical values.

>> No.6119310

hodl is such a girl/soyboy meme

say hold like a real man

>> No.6119370

>>6119117
its the 47th most visited page in the US. Nobody who got in since August can even remotely call himself early adopter.

f5ing has no effect they collect data from browser plugins

>> No.6119530

>>6118876

>Before too long every normie that was going to get in in this cycle of media attention is in.

This hype-train isn't even close to critical-mass yet. The media cycle right now gets people hyped up, but the no-coiner jealousy of seeing your neighbour go on holiday with their gains will drive the rest of the adoption.

Only idiots will buy because CNBC told them to. Only losers will buy because the people around them got on the boat before them, and there's a whole lot of losers in the world.

Also, rank 46 is fucking nothing. 95% of the world literally uses Amazon, FB, Google, Youtube & Twitter. 46 is TINY.

>286m visits to coinmarketcap December 2017.

That's 14m people visiting 20 times. I visited a LOT more than 20 times in December.

We're nowhere near global adoption. Not even close.

>> No.6119556

>>6119273
The problem (or in benefit to us) with this "bubble" is that it's global, differing from the ones we had before.
It could go much much higher.

>> No.6119585
File: 305 KB, 1386x1047, 1515370554747.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6119585

>>6117630
That's still normie shit. Wait until literal shit coins reach the front page, then you'll know we're in a bubble.

>bahable bubbabal

>> No.6119634

>>6119530
I mean to be fair I visit coinmarketcap like 5-10 times per day

>> No.6119638

>>6118651

You were not an adult in 1999. If you were you’d fucking know that no one took the internet seriously in the run up to the bubble.

>> No.6119684

>>6118501
>if crypto was to continually grow at last 30 days average % per day
IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF IF
Yeah, but it won't, and you'll look like a fool making a retarded assumption and then base other assumptions on that.

>> No.6119790

You fags realize that even though people may read this shit they arent going to go out and buy crypto?
Muh sudden influx of normies into the market.. Huur.. Bitch please no one cares about adventurous gamblers and their couple hundred bucks. Go to any other board on 4chan and talk about crypto, anons here still think its a scam repeating the same old bullshit from 2012 about how it may be banned any day now. Majority of 4chan users still uncertain about crypto and brainlets here think that we've reached the peak just because shit is coming up in your facebook feeds.

Get real. Why are you cunts even here if you think this is nothing more than a short lived bubble waiting to pop at any moment because people you dont like are getting involved. Its clear none of you believe in the tech.

>> No.6119791

>>6119684
Yes it wont, you are correct.
Thats what Im saying you monumental brainlet.

And when it wont, for months, normies will realize they wont be instant millionaires and pull out en mass, giving us bear market

>> No.6119833

>>6119556
You should google "this time its different"

>>6119638
I was 15 and using the internet very seriously

>> No.6119838

>>6119790
I mean i believe in the tech but theres only like 4 coins in the top 100 that have actual promising tech behind them anon.

>> No.6119881

>>6119791

Which means more opportunity to buy ;)

>> No.6119908

>>6119838
coming up with a gimmick like "This is the bitcoin for youtubers, or this is the bitcoin for dentists" is not revolutionary just so you know.

>> No.6119961

>>6119833
>You should google "this time its different"
what? this time IT'S ACTUALLY DIFFERENT.
I'm pointing you to a FACT. not an illusion.
Investing in crypto is much much easier, and almost anyone has access, is not only US-centered, people from all around the world can throw like 100 bucks in this thing.
I'm not saying it WILL be like that, but that it COULD, because it's global. I'm speculating just like you are.

>> No.6119979

>>6119790
>Its clear none of you believe in the tech.
I bought my first coins in 2012 and head the same shit in 2013.

Crypto will take over but there will be massive bearmarkeets before it happens.
crypto isnt ready for mainstream adoption anytime soon. Internet actually was when the bubble got going.

>> No.6120093

>>6119961
>what? this time IT'S ACTUALLY DIFFERENT.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Just because you have your tokens on a distributed ledger and its easy to buy does not change human psychology or market forces.
Being easy to buy everywhere and being global just means the market plays out faster, which is what has been happening. IT IS A REASON NOT TO EXPECT FOR THE BUBBLE TO LAST AS LONG AS DOT COM

>> No.6120129

>>6118876
>the next bear market will wipe out a lot of shitcoins and ICO tokens.

Why would it? do those shitcoins "companies" have huge expenses, like 100+ salaries to pay, offices to rent, products to transform, etc?

>> No.6120152

>>6119881
Yes :) I will be there with you buying

>> No.6120169

>>6119838
Still in early infancy stages my brother. Australian Treasury is already modelling scenarios for the widespread adoption of distributed ledger technology and smart contracts by 2030.

>> No.6120175

>>6120093
I'm pointing a difference in regards to the dot com bubble you fucking imbecile, which is actually very relevant and you just dismiss it as absolutely nothing only because "muh everything is the same as ever".

>> No.6120189

I love how you guys are freaking out about this shit when we aren't even at 1 trillion marketcap yet LOL

Guys its gonna happen eventually but calm the fuck down LOL

Next period is bear and the marketcap will go down.

This doesn't happen until 5T minimum

>> No.6120237

>>6120093
How much money went into the dotcom bubble
How much money is in crypto

Now stop posting

>> No.6120283

>>6120175
Did you even read my post?
YES it is global and easy to buy. That is why the bubble will form faster than Dot com which is why you brainlets will get burned HARD if you expect the bull market to continue for another 1-2 years

BUT MARKET FORCES WILL NEVER BE DIFFERENT: THERE IS STILL HUMAN PSYCHOLOGY TRADING

Fundamentals will start mattering soon

>> No.6120430

>>6120237
You cannot expect the same amount of $ to flow in when buying 95% of coins requires you to buy a coin to send to a shitty backwater exchange with anonymous owners.

Boomers will play with a couple hundred or thousand bucks in crypto. In dot com they were able to use the broker they trusted to invest in shitty dot com stocks.

>> No.6120453

>>6117630
>the guardian
It's fucking over.

>> No.6120485

>>6119833

>he thinks using the internet as a 15 year old to watch porn and download midi files off usenet groups constitutes “serious” use.

Literally watch crypto hit 3 trillion this year dumb fuck. This shit is an addictive virus that’s like gambling and stocks on crack.

>> No.6120496

>>6120430
Projects like ETHOS will be available Q1/Q2 this year.

It wont be ETHERDELTA only for your useless shitcoins anymore.

Right now 80% of normies are still using BTC/LTC/ETH/BTCH on coinbase. You just notice the other 20% on /biz/ because they stick out like a sore thumb.

>> No.6120499

>>6120283
I never talked about how much time it will last.
But if it increases even faster than the dotcom bubble at less than 1 year, that means we will all probably be rich in 6 months. If everything keep increasing at the same rate, which is what you're pointing out, and of what you have no proof.
So, what's the problem?
Options:
1- Marketcap increases incredibly fast in less than one year. Result= You have a lot of money because you're already invested.
2.- Marketcap increases fast but not enough, so it lasts more than 1 year. Result= You still have more money because you're already invested.

The other thing is that there's no reasoning to think that the bubble should pop at the exact same time and marketcap as the dotcom one.
Why should it? It could get 3x higher, or maybe only to half.
The difference is that I admit I'm speculating. You just throw words around thinking you can predict the future.

>> No.6120548

>>6118066
>The real winner is the government and this is why they will allow the game to continue. But ONLY if crypto cannot be adopted to the point where fiat is not the desired endgame currency.

This. If crypto ever poses a real threat it will be shut down. The reason virtually every government has stepped in with major changes in the past few months isn't to cripple the market, it's to hold back the bubble and allow it to continue to grow. The real bubble hasn't even started yet.

>> No.6120556

>>6120283
Are you aware that unwashed masses of the 3rd world countries have no bank accounts, but are crazy about mobile phones?
>apps sending and receiving cryptocurrencies tied to a phone number account

Yeah

>> No.6120569

we are aggressively analytical here and i think we are getting ahead of ourselves. i have no reason to back this up but i am in the camp of people who think its going to be 2+ trillion market cap before the possibility of people freaking out and selling enters the realm of possibility.

>> No.6120578

>>6119833
I trust clif high more than your sorry ass anon, sorry

>> No.6120654

>>6120430
A few years ago all we had was repurposed trading card sites and shit like cryptsy
Now look what we have
Now imagine what exchanges will be like in a few more years

>> No.6120662

>>6120556
yes! there have already been things like this in south america. its going to be huge if crypto can figure out a way to do it.

>> No.6120667

>>6119530
this

most people i know dont own any crypto and 280 million is not even near mainstream levels considering there are so many shitskins and asians deluding this number even further

>> No.6120695

>comparing stocks to crypto

>> No.6120755

>>6120499
>So, what's the problem?
There is no problem. I will buy low in the coming bearmarket.
Im just telling you that WE WILL SEE MAJOR DOWN TURN sooner than faggots think.
If you dont understand what greater fool theory is you should not play in this market.

also nice retraction after arguing there are 2 more years left, newcoiner.

>> No.6120867

>>6119530
alexa 46 is not tiny. It means every 46th pageview in the entire US is going to CMC right now.

>> No.6120872

>>6120548
Everyone needs to understand this. Crypto traders will inevitably end up being one of two different groups of people

1- Winners. They made money (alot or a little) and must pay taxes on those winnings
2- Losers. They lost money and are now increasingly dependent on the government.

This is a massive WIN for governments. Again, the only thing they must do is prevent total adoption to the point where fiat is not desired.

Why do you think south korea just passed a law banning anonymous accounts on exchanges? It's not for your "safety". They want your TAX MONEY when you cash out.

Trumps tax bill that was just passed like last week had a footnote about crypto gains being taxable.

THIS ISNT ENDING ANYTIME SOON. IT WILL EVENTUALLY BUT THE WORLD GOVERNMENTS ARE JUST NOW PREPARING TO TAX OUR GAINS.

THIS WILL BE ALLOWED TO CONTINUE FOR SOME TIME

>> No.6120886

oh no they mentioned bitcoin on the front page of an international BUSINESS news website, whatever will we do

>> No.6121063

>>6120755
I never said there are 2 more years left fucking retard, god, learn to read.
>If you dont understand what greater fool theory is you should not play in this market.
You're the most retarded arrogant person who I've talked in this board, what the fuck. Do you think I haven't read about that? that you have some kind of hidden knowledge about shitty concepts you read on wikipedia? kys

>> No.6121137

>>6120867

No it fucking doesnt you tit.

If that was true, CMC would have as many visits as google.

Jesus fuck how are you even breathing?

>> No.6121160

>>6120867
You are unironically retarded

>> No.6121227
File: 102 KB, 676x673, 1421200327660.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6121227

>>6120867
>alexa 46 is not tiny. It means every 46th pageview in the entire US is going to CMC right now.
LMAOOOOO

>> No.6121338
File: 452 KB, 669x603, Screenshot (5).png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6121338

>>6119585
Just happened today

>> No.6121366

>>6120556
Hope you own some kin

>> No.6121446

WHAT WEBSITE IS THAT

>>6121160
WHY IS HE RONG

>> No.6121851

>>6119838
Which are they?

>> No.6121878

>>6121366
...why?

>> No.6121897

>>6117630
HODL is dead. Say HOLD from now on. Thank you.

>> No.6121912

>>6121446

There's >5b google searches every day. That's 150b a month. For CMC to have 1 in every 46 pageviews, google search & CMC would have to be the only two websites in existence, and CMC would need to get 11x more traffic than it currently does.

>> No.6121985

NORMIES ARE GOING TO CRASH THE MARKET REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>> No.6122013

tfw the crypto bubble will pop and then the normal stock market and housing markets crash again


honestly can't wait for america to be back to living in tents in the park and waiting in breadlines

>> No.6122022

I'm just hoping the btc bubble will pop and the 35% marketcap will flow into (good) alts. This way the total marketcap doesnt inflate to fast but big profits can still be made with alts. I feel like FairX, if succesfull, could be real helpfull in doing this.

>> No.6122138

>>6121851
actual platforms like ICON, or ETH

Privacy coins like MONERO (Better versions are emerging and one may dethrone monero)

MAYBE lending platforms like Salt or Ethlend but i am unsure on this one

I think ETHOS is promising if they launch a working product soon

That's about it, 90% of coins do literally nothing but use fancy words in the whitepaper

>> No.6122216

>>6117788
Think you're the only deluded one bud.

>> No.6122316

>>6117630
It's just algorithm. Ask around, people might own a bit but not many are putting in major amounts.

>> No.6122341

>>6122138
Thats what I thought. I tend to invest in coins that have some use in the real world.

>> No.6122802

>>6122341
I think you're good chasing whatever idiotic Bounty0x pump is going around right now and getting those sweet 4x gains, but I wouldn't go all in with stuff like that.

I think when bear comes money will consolidate into actual coins with real usage, and alot of other money will leave the market entirely (tether or fiat)

The people who will get JUST'd the most are people holding dumb shit like ARK

>> No.6122896

>>6117630
This ain't the bubble kiddo, this is a Mars mission. Normies are going to lose a shit ton, a shit ton which we autists will gain because we're better at this shit than them.

>> No.6122967

>>6122341
Invest 70%/30%
70% in coins with an actual talented team, platform or a real usecase.
30% in shitcoins that can go 5-10x

i feel very comfy, even on a crashday like today.

>> No.6123472

>>6121338
Dogecoin was making headlines in winter of 2017, still a normie tier coin.

>> No.6123541

>>6123472
I meant 2013
>https://www.theverge.com/2013/12/16/5216862/bitcoin-is-so-2013-dogecoin-is-new-crypto-currency-on-the-block

>> No.6123621

>>6117702
more like 6-12 months.

>> No.6123772

>>6118876
meh it won't get worse than september-december periods.

>> No.6123829

>>6118501
> muh bubble popping
total crypto mcap is less than aplles mcap. kys

>> No.6124176
File: 174 KB, 537x765, babel.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
6124176

We are FAR from bubble status.

Crypto is a new paradigm of capital investment, in the future every company that wants to start something, even unrelated with blockchain, will have to think of a way to generate a coin.

People who are investing in crypto, doing diligent research about companies and technology are people who used to have their money sitting at the bank, banks are centralized and their allocation of resources is far less reliable than a decentralized free market with millions and millions of new agents, thus why cryptocurrencies will lead us to an era of prosperity.

We're pioneers, even joining today will guarantee massive returns. If you don't believe this, short cryptos or get the fuck out and fomo in when everything I just described begins showing true.

>> No.6124926

The dollar is going away this time, and there's nothing the issuing bank not the govt. can do about it.

You guys are so cute getting rich and you don't even know how money works.

>> No.6125103

keep in mind they target ads to you based on your internet history. across all platforms too, phone other devices ect ect. take it with a grain of salt. im gonna wait til someone in the bar i work at starts flashing his blockfolio like some retard to jump out

>> No.6125374

>mainstream paper talking about lambos

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/jan/07/bitcoin-crypto-currencies-mcafee

>> No.6125492

I have head a lot of speculation about corrections and long term trajectory. I would like to hear some opinions on what adoption should have looked like.

Keep in mind digital revolutions.

Was the 'social media' adoption a bubble. Was 'netflix' a bubble. They are all technology.

I believe people are comparing the rise in the crypto market to non-tech markets.

>> No.6125650

Just remember to buy the dip when it pops.

>> No.6126345

>>6119370
Yep. We are in a bubble. For reference I got in to crypto in 2014 to buy drugs. Drugs went away, crypto stayed. It needs to pop. Shit coins are pumping and everyone has an ico. FFS there are youtube ads on my prowresting videos advertising blockchain bs. We need new money. Exchanges have pulled the handbrake by closing registrations. Shit coins are pumping because the values of the majors are so inflated. I think we should all cash. Let it crash, then start again.