Anyone buying homes as an investment is just stupid.

[Anonymous No.58891681]

Do you think owning a house is a good investment? If I buy stocks, I just get dividends. I don't have to fix the roof all the time. If I have gold, it just doubles in value every 10 years. I don't have to pay property tax on any of that. Why do people think a plywood shed is a good investment, then laugh at cryptos which can 10x in value overnight?

93% of recent home buyers regret their decision. Probably because their "investment" has been losing value since May 2022 when the Fed raised rates from literally 0%. It's never going back down that low again. They're all screwed now, they bought the top. The absolute best they can hope for is their house price to crab for two decades while inflation catches up. But even that is a pipe dream, since the silver tsunami is coming in that same time frame.

Plus, how do real estate agents get away with it? They're out there giving investment advice on this loser investment. Do they have some special immunity which protects them from being sued out the wazoo for pushing their ponzi schemes?

[Anonymous No.58891711]

>>58891681
thats why the rich and black rock buy all houses
becouse they dumb, yeah ?

[Anonymous No.58891774]

>>58891711
I don’t agree with OP and own ~$800k in rentals myself, but the investing goals of the rich and those who aren’t rich yet are different.

Those who aren’t rich want to get rich while those who are want to preserve their wealth

[Anonymous No.58891784]

>>58891774
Is RE the best asset for preserving?

[Anonymous No.58891906]

Rentals are investments, they are productive, they providing housing. Its a business. You're more right about just specifically if you buy a house to live in, its not really a net "investment" for you, because you are consuming what it produces. But its still better to own your own liability, than it is to rent which is just a net liability. You will always need a home, so renting is like shorting a house. Owning is like longing the house, and if you have a mortgage shorting money. it will just always be a better financial decision in the long term. Renting is only better for flexibility in the short term.

[Anonymous No.58891928]

>>58891681
>I just get dividends.

If I rent out my house, I get rental income

>If I have gold, it just doubles in value every 10 years.

Housing averages a 5.5% return each year, doubling in value every 13 years

>I don't have to pay property tax on any of that

First 500k in home equity is capital gains tax free, you have to pay 15% if you sell your stocks.

>I don't have to fix the roof all the time

I live in the southwest, the tile roofs last longer than I will

[Anonymous No.58891945]

lots of copium in OPs post, I get paid dividends every month, it's the difference between renting a place and my mortgage which is currently over $2k a month and growing every year, also the house just doubles in value every 10 years and is actually useful unlike gold. Property taxes are nothing, less than one months rent.

[Anonymous No.58891961]

>>58891928
>Housing averages a 5.5% return each year
>The house in your picrel was worth approximately $3 when it was built in 1850
KEK

[Anonymous No.58891963]

>>58891681
>I don't have to fix the roof all the time.
Well, everyone who lives anywhere needs a working roof, and that is baked into the cost of renting. So when you rent out a home, its going to be higher than the cost of fixing roofs or any other maintenance. Supply and demand exists between investments as well. Generally investors will not buy homes when the rent isn't high enough to cover expenses + compete with alternative investment options. The one issue with real estate is that has a lot of government incentives like lower rate, fixed mortgages, less taxes, etc. so if you're aren't leveraging up with mortgage or getting the tax incentives is probably worse than things like stocks. But for example, if you put 20% on a house, you only need to get like 1/5th the returns to compete because of the leverage, and unlike stock leverage you can't get margin called and you can get fixed rates.

[Anonymous No.58891978]

>>58891784

I’d say that land is the best asset class for preserving wealth if you live in a country where nobody would steal it from you.

RE where the value comes from the building just depends on the building itself.

Houses with land in cities, farmland, industrial land, and undeveloped land hold their value very well.

Houses in suburbs, condos/townhouses, office buildings, and other real estate that doesn’t have as much land value aren’t the best for preserving wealth

[Anonymous No.58892006]

>>58891961
This is why you don't buy in rural bumfuck nowhere where there are no jobs.

[Anonymous No.58892007]

>>58891681
Real estate agents are useful unless you happen to know the ins and outs of buying a house and things to watch out for. Lots of contracts are involved and plenty of ways to get fucked. For their service of course they'll charge you a % fee.
Unless you're a big player too, buying RE as an investment is tough. Buy a property (probably on credit right? heh) and then pay to maintain it, pay taxes, find responsible tenants, etc. and hopefully make money on it. And if the value of your property appreciates then that lowers the pool of tenants to draw from. Do all this while you're competing against all the similar sized firms in the area, and also large national/international firms.
Buying a house, unless you move a lot for work, you should just buy something in good shape you like that you can stay in for a long time.

[Anonymous No.58892012]

>>58891681
I bought a house in 2018 for $490k. $100k down payment and closing costs. Spent maybe $30k on improvements. Spent maybe $3k/year on maintenance so total $51k spent on it since buying for a total investment of $150k. Just sold for $800k and will walk away with $400k, a 2.7x on my investment.

In that time the S&P went from $2,750 to $5,600, a 2x.

Could I have made more if I dumped all that money in NVDA? Sure. I could have also put it all on a high yield gamble and done even better than that.

But for the last 6.5 years I enjoyed maintaining my own home, raising my kids in a house that was OURS to do what WE wanted to do with it, and instead of paying $3500/mo on rent (which would be what the house fetched) I paid $2600/mo with about $700 of that going to principle, so allowed myself an additional $900/mo to invest in crypto while putting $700/mo into the house equity.

In hindsight should I have bought 500k LINK or whatever? Yea, of course. But I wouldn't say owning a house is a BAD investment. It's a safe investment with relatively strong yields vs say index funds.

[Anonymous No.58892048]

>>58892012
You put too much money down. 20% down to avoid 0.35% PMI is the worst normie-tier advice that people give in real estate. You should always put down the least amount of money possible (3%) to leverage your cash.

3% down on a 490k home would have been ~15k. You would have got a 20x on your investment.

In the event of a "Global Financial Crisis", you can simply walk away or stop making payments and not care because you don't have shit invested in the property. Low risk, high reward.

[Anonymous No.58892212]

>>58892048
Eh, you significantly increase your interest payments with a tiny down payment. It's not so cut and dry.

$15k on a $490k home = $2850 at 6% and for a long time 60%+ of that will be interest, or $1700+

$100k brings you to $2340, throwing away $300 less per month on your monthly payments while also keeping your monthly payments $500 cheaper for a total of $800 in surplus investment capital every month.

Could the $75k invested then and there pay off better? Yea, sure. It might also work out in your favor to DCA into stuff over the longer period. But the bigger question is how meaty of a monthly payment can you afford? I am moving into a much more expensive house and am doing like a 35% down payment just to get my monthly costs into a range I am comfortable with. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night knowing being able to stay in my house means my investments are beating interest rates or I'm just fucked. It's a lot easier to have a job than time the market properly. I will still have money to invest in stocks and meanwhile am building equity in the home.

Risk changes here depending on your situation.

[Anonymous No.58892313]

>>58891681
You don't have to pay property taxes yet. Kamala plans to change that. Your unrealized gains will be tapped at 25%

[Anonymous No.58892320]

>>58892007
>Real estate agents are useful unless you happen to know the ins and outs of buying a house and things to watch out for.
kek, no
RE agents are the most brain dead people on the planet. they don't know either. they literally show you the house and if you want to buy type information into fields for their MLS software that fill out the contract for them. it's literally a 2 week night course to get a real estate license

[Anonymous No.58892435]

>>58891681
Mortgages are a rip-off, but the actual house is good asset to have. You can only really come out on top if you can pay in cash.

[Anonymous No.58892443]

>>58892313
The unrealized capital gains tax is only for people worth over $100m.

Since it’s somewhat easy for rich people to hide assets, it’s only going to affect people with a NW over a quarter billion

[Anonymous No.58892474]

>>58891711
Those are invaders

Some people will hunt down blackrock etc.

Regards to the 20,000 murdered Philistina kids and all the homeless and suffering of my world.


Housing and markets are not a toy, sooner or later we shoot

[Anonymous No.58892654]

>>58892435
Inflation ensures otherwise, anon. 15 years ago average US rent was $875/mo. Today it's $1500. Meanwhile, your $875/mo mortgage would still be $875 and much of that is going to equity you're building, whereas your rent money is going into the toilet the entire time.

[Anonymous No.58892715]

A house doesn't have to be a good investment compared to all other assets.
It just has to be a better investment than renting, to make sense.
Unless you plan on living in a pile of stock certificates and some gold coins?

[Anonymous No.58892877]

>>58892654
>Your $875 mortgage is >50% interest in the first 15 years, then you will move and start all over again
>Paying that is better than 2% inflation

[Anonymous No.58892885]

>>58892877
And that interest is tax deductible and those who didn’t buy recently have a rate lower than inflation

[Anonymous No.58892888]

>>58892885
>tax deductible
>I give them a dollar, and they give me a quarter!
you're still losing anon

[Anonymous No.58893122]

>>58892212
3% down on a 490k home at 4% pays 18,847 in interest and 1,662 in PMI their first year.

20% down on a 490k home at 4% pays 15,554 in interest their first year

Your savings on 17% (83,300) down are 4,955/year, which is only a 6% return on investment.

And this doesn't take into account mortgage interest being tax deduct-able.

The 3,293 difference in interest equates to a minimum of 725/year saved on taxes (likely more), meaning your net return is only 5%.

Always put 3% down.

[Anonymous No.58893157]

>>58892885
personally for me i pay a buttload of interest and still the standard deduction is better

[Anonymous No.58893174]

Typical sound financial advice doesn't apply in one of the worst buyers markets of all time. Once we get back to normal market, then we can have a conversation about what happens in a normal market. inb4 "This is the one speculative bubble that will never pop because of XYZ" - which is a logical paradox which should be in textbooks. "All Cretans are liars," says the Cretan. "This investment can't lose!" says the speculator.

[Anonymous No.58893176]

>>58891681
that house is 35K because its a liability. The city is condemning it and you have to pay money to bulldoze it or get fined by the city.

The lot its on is probably worth 100k, but the demolition is going to cost 50k.

[Anonymous No.58893192]

>>58893122
Sorry man, I really can't take practical advice from someone who says,
>you can simply walk away or stop making payments and not care
You're like 12 years old. You've never actually done this.

[Anonymous No.58893196]

>>58893176
>its a liability
you already said it's a house, you don't need to keep repeating yourself

[Anonymous No.58893213]

>>58891681
can you live in stocks? Buying things for yourself is investing in your happiness. Its usually the best investment you can make, usually.

[Anonymous No.58893216]

>>58891711
home ownership gatekeeps pussy. If you look at the best investments (guns, alcohol, Iphones), they were all tools to get laid.

[Anonymous No.58893236]

>>58893216
>home ownership gatekeeps pussy
lol, he bought a home because he thought it would get him laid. He could have just traveled and drowned in pussy, but he burned it all on a worthless shed, where he sits on the porch looking creepy, trying to lure in Stacies as they pass by.
*my sides*

[Anonymous No.58893240]

>>58893192
>I can't argue against anything you're saying and I'm too low IQ and stubborn to admit I made a bad financial decision, so I'm going to call you 12 because it worked when I was in high school.

Kek

[Anonymous No.58893252]

>>58893240
gottem
confirmed 12 years old

[Anonymous No.58893301]

>>58893192
don't blame people who play the game, blame the idiot government and racist regulators who encourage irresponsible behavior in the name of DEI. I've got multiple millions in debt on rentals and you bet I'm going to stop paying on them if the market crashes. until then i'll keep banking 50k a month in profits. unless its illegal everyone is "playing by the rules" if you want to take the moral high road and be a poor forever whatever, no skin off my back. the idea that anyone with a pulse can get 10-15x their annual income to buy property is straight up stupid economically. we collectively didn't learn anything from 2008, if anything it's now a playbook to get rich quick.

[Anonymous No.58893312]

>>58892313
>t. poor.

[Anonymous No.58893504]

>>58891681
The topic of home-ownership reveals the midwittery of people. If someone says that you need to stop renting and buy a home because you're throwing your money away, then they're a midwit. These people do not think critically and do not consider alternatives because they either want to justify their purchase, or follow the bygone investment wisdom from boomers. Home-ownership isn't a bad choice - real estate will appreciate, but at the end of the day it's a lifestyle decision you pay a premium for. Real estate as a pure investment decision is different though, but it's more of a job than some passive investment.

[Anonymous No.58893524]

>>58893122
again, it's not so cut and dry. On a $1.2M house 3% is a $8k payment monthly right now. I can't afford that.

What I can afford is 35% and $5.5k monthly.

If I put the $390k into the stock market there's a chance I lose a considerable amount of that, and if I'm banking on drawing from that to make my payments then I'm fucked. A HYS right now is paying slightly less than 5% so net return beats that.

Higher down payment in this scenario is lower risk by a lot.

If you can't make payments and you can't sell the house you're getting foreclosed and you're never buying a house again plus losing everything you put into it. I'd rather be able to make the payments reliably than risk that.

[Anonymous No.58893743]

>>58893524
>Higher down payment in this scenario is lower risk by a lot.

Bullshit. Dumbest fucking thing I've read today, and I read this board full of broke idiot zoomers and loser millennials buying meme coins.

Any scenario where the markets crash will bring down home values down with it, and potentially put you out of work.

With 3% down, you have access to 384k in cash to buy the dip, can walk away from your property and only be out 36k, and even buy a cheap property in cash elsewhere.

If you dump 420k in the house (35%), you can't buy the dip, you're potentially underwater and out hundreds of thousands, and you're unemployed.

And if the market continues to appreciate, your investment is gaining 11x the returns that someone who puts 35% down is.

>you're getting foreclosed and you're never buying a house again

Foreclosures clear from your record after 7 years. Everyone who walked away in 2007-08 was able to buy again in 2014-15 and get in on cheap prices and low mortgage rates.

You can rent, or because you're sitting on 400k in cash, you could buy a property outright and bypass the lender completely.

[Anonymous No.58893869]

>>58893122
Lay off the Grant Cardone.

[Anonymous No.58893997]

>>58891681
i would only do it if i had friends who i knew would rent long term without causing trouble and can talk the seller down at least 10%

[Anonymous No.58894223]

>>58892715
I have $700k in index funds $50k of BTC and live in an old van/sometimes homeless. It's viable if you don't care about owning physical

[Anonymous No.58894230]

I have never fixed a leak in my roof ever. I have it annually inspect though so yeah

[Anonymous No.58894249]

>>58893524
>investing 40k is riskier than investing 400k

nigga what?

[Anonymous No.58894307]

>>58891928
>Housing averages a 5.5% return each year

*2-3%
T. Landlord

[Anonymous No.58894335]

>>58891681
Hmm, it depends on your preferences. If you think it's not profitable, consider exploring crypto to invest in. Holding VET, ZIL, FTM, and SUI might be profitable for you, froglet.

[Anonymous No.58894338]

>>58891681
Hmm, it depends on your preferences. If you think it's not profitable, consider exploring crypto to invest in. Holding VET, ZIL, FTM, DUA and SUI might be profitable for you, froglet.

[Anonymous No.58894359]

>>58891711
Blackrock and the rich buy everything.
That's why they always win.