/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.56881869]

Wages are determined through the antagonistic struggle between capitalist and worker. Victory goes necessarily to the capitalist. The capitalist can live longer without the worker than can the worker without the capitalist. Combination among the capitalists is customary and effective; workers’ combination is prohibited and painful in its consequences for them. Besides, the landowner and the capitalist can make use of industrial advantages to augment their revenues; the worker has neither rent nor interest on capital to supplement his industrial income. Hence the intensity of the competition among the workers. Thus only for the workers is the separation of capital, landed property, and labour an inevitable, essential and detrimental separation. Capital and landed property need not remain fixed in this abstraction, as must the labour of the workers.
The separation of capital, rent, and labour is thus fatal for the worker.
The lowest and the only necessary wage rate is that providing for the subsistence of the worker for the duration of his work and as much more as is necessary for him to support a family and for the race of labourers not to die out. The ordinary wage, according to Smith, is the lowest compatible with common humanity, that is, with cattle-like existence.

[Anonymous No.56882013]

Lets look at the facts. Everyone is going to lose their jobs and the government will grow as a consequence. Was he right? Well yes he was

[Anonymous No.56882056]

>>56882013
his solution was for the state, or the government, to have complete control though. not some, or more, but all.
I haven't read Das kapital to be fair, but from the shallow knowledge I have, it seemed like the goal was to push the common man against large businesses, as to weed them out and claim the people seized it for themselves while in reality the state became the owner of everything.

[Anonymous No.56882081]

Wrong already in the first sentence from the fake economist. Why would I read further. KYS. This deadbeat psychopath literally abused every poor person around him including his own family.

[Anonymous No.56882088]

>>56882056
Well thats going to happen. But you wont be the owner.

[Anonymous No.56882102]

>>56881869
Étienne de La Boétie proved him wrong over 300 years before he wrote any crap, in Discourse on Voluntary Servitude. Marx was nothing but a neo-serfdom gay. Slavery by the state.

[Anonymous No.56882121]

>>56882081
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLdZtU-RhPI

[Anonymous No.56882125]

>>56881869
too gay, didn't read
I'm going to hire some mexicans for a slave wage and have them deliver me some champagne and steamed mussels now

[Anonymous No.56882166]

What is a worker? What is class?

[Anonymous No.56882194]

>>56882166
A worker is a wagie from the humble gardener all the way up to a ceo even. I mean technically cause most ceos make most if their income from stocks so

[Anonymous No.56882215]

>>56882194
I see, so Joe Biden is a worker as well. Who owns the means of production? China?

[Anonymous No.56882243]

>>56882215
No silly investors. Those are the capitalists. People who derive their incone from owning property.

[Anonymous No.56882280]

>>56882243
Don't investors only own shares whereas truck drivers, farmers, and the local convenience store or restaurant owner actually own the whole property

[Anonymous No.56882296]

>>56882280
Well they have a term for small business owners petit bourg

[Anonymous No.56882324]

Reminder that Marx was completely refuted by Bohm Bawerk over 100 years ago and Marxists today are still absolutely seething about this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uOzotWrHheU

[Anonymous No.56882338]

>>56881869
>Combination among the capitalists is customary and effective
wrong, never been a single example in the history of humanity.

[Anonymous No.56882345]

>>56882056
Marxists will counter this by claiming marx was an anarchist and communism is stateless.

The amount of cognitive dissonance in their heads is beyond anything I have ever seen.

[Anonymous No.56882353]

Look im for giving honest working people gibs, just not to niggers. Besides that all his economic philosophy is just midwit tier justification for making the government take things from the guy who has more then you. Prices of things only matter to the beholder. For fucks sake just look at this board or look at the money people will spend for cosmetics in a vidya game.

[Anonymous No.56882387]

How much "surplus value" do the capitalists take from the worker according to marx's theory.

Typical profit margins economy wide are around 5-10%.
Communists are complaining about missing out on a one time 5-10% raise lmfao

[Anonymous No.56882395]

>>56881869
>The capitalist can live longer without the worker than can the worker without the capitalist.
You can live off neetbux in the Anglosphere and Western Europe kek

[Anonymous No.56882461]

>>56882387
Well lucky we have bard
Rate of profit (p) = Surplus value (s) / (Constant capital (c) + Variable capital (v))
The rate of profit has declined 1-2% since 1970 on average.
Bard also said the current world rate of profit is at best 5%
But you know how reliable ai is with numbers

[Anonymous No.56882499]

>>56882461
>falling rate of profit
Empirically and logically debunked.
https://socialdemocracy21stcentury.blogspot.com/2016/02/marxs-tendency-of-rate-of-profit-to.html
https://socialdemocracy21stcentury.blogspot.com/2016/03/the-us-profit-rate-was-abnormally-high.html

[Anonymous No.56882652]

>>56881869
I'm not gonna read all that, your commie ass can suck my cock and go back to /pol/, I'm not gonna stop going to work until I have enough KAVA accooooomulated, so you either stfu or kill yourself, and yes, this last bit is financial advise

[Anonymous No.56882751]

>>56882652
Kek fucking based

[Anonymous No.56882763]

>>56882387
Worst part is communism doesn't work precisely cuz they take from the rich not to give to the poor but to themselves

[Anonymous No.56882769]

>>56882652
I'm feeling a little too much hatred coming from you

[Anonymous No.56882774]

>>56882652
>Anon, close the markets, communism has failed again

[Anonymous No.56882867]

>>56882652
>I'm not gonna read all that
Kek

[Anonymous No.56882870]

>>56882774
comunism always win

[Anonymous No.56883106]

Yes because without the workers, the capitalist at least knows what to do to survive. Without the capitalists the workers have no clue wtf to do to survive that's why a job from the capitalist is considered essential. Without the capitalist the workers all die to go tribal.

[Anonymous No.56883845]

>>56882345
in practice capitalists bear none of the risk because they control levers of power
>see 2008 bailout
there is nothing wrong with capitalism other than it eventually deteriorates into neo-feudalism

[Anonymous No.56883861]

>>56882056
>his solution was for the state, or the government, to have complete control though. not some, or more, but all.
His goal was the total dissolution of the State you fucking ret-
>I haven't read Das kapital
Should have started with that so I didn't have to read your post

[Anonymous No.56883903]

>>56883845
The vast majority of capitalists do not have that power though. Only a tiny minority of capitalists do.

>there is nothing wrong with capitalism other than it eventually deteriorates into neo-feudalism
It's government intervention that gives corporations so much power.
We need a free market.

[Anonymous No.56883910]

>>56883861
>His goal was the total dissolution of the State you fucking ret-
By creating the most authoritarian giga-state imaginable?
How do you square that circle?

[Anonymous No.56884735]

>>56883106
this

[Anonymous No.56885316]

>>56881869
I like that marxfags get mad at socdems because they might make workers living conditions better and therefore won't starve and do le revolution, kek.

[Anonymous No.56885391]

>>56882345
Marx wasnt utopian and didn't provide solutions. He just theorized on how capitalize evolves into the next stage by necessity. For good or worse.

He descried a historical process that cant be influenced by a single individual. You cant instate socialism on a whim because it will not work - as is explicitly stated in Marx works. When socialism comes it will come because it is sustainable not because some retard decided to instate something he called "socialism" but instead is just a form of reactionary capitalism trying to defend itself.

[Anonymous No.56885877]

>>56885391
what he did advocate is for the workers to fight for their living conditions to be improved, with which he helped by providing them theoretical underpinnings as to why their lives are being shit

[Anonymous No.56886724]

>>56885391
>Marx wasnt utopian and didn't provide solutions.
lmao what about the communist manifesto?
He explicitly listed things that a communist party would do if they took power.

>e just theorized on how capitalize evolves into the next stage by necessity.
But he wrong totally wrong.

>>56885877
>with which he helped by providing them theoretical underpinnings as to why their lives are being shit
Which were refuted by the marginalists.