/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.55632060]

I was listening to Peter Schiff yesterday and he said renting is far better than owning a home because you can leave whenever you want and anything that happens to the house is not your problem. I think he is right.

Thoughts on this?

[Anonymous No.55632083]

>>55632060
A lease can lock you into your house longer than a mortgage. Renting has benefits if rents are low relative to home prices at the time. Other time buying is more prudent if you can afford it.

[Anonymous No.55632087]

>>55632060
Better to get something like a condo instead, very ironically you deal with less bullshit

[Anonymous No.55632089]

I mean he's not wrong, homes aren't necessarily good in investments. It depends on total cost, interest rate, location, condition (will you need to buy a new roof anytime soon) etc.

[Anonymous No.55632109]

>>55632087
>very ironically you deal with less bullshit
careful

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBR7U9WTTyc&lc=UgxsKArICskT2Co5pT94AaABAg

[Anonymous No.55632116]

>>55632060
It's hard to argue against this. He's right but in the world we live in, property is looked at as an SoV. I personally agree with him fundamentally and hope he's proven right sooner than later.

[Anonymous No.55632128]

>>55632060
Renting is better right now in 95% of the country. I’m paying around $1600 and the average mortgage payment on something similar is around $3k

Owning in the US will only be preferable if prices dump (not likely) or mortgage rates dump (won’t happen until 2025)

[Anonymous No.55632130]

>>55632087
Imagine raising your kids in a condo and not being able to have them play outside in the garden and sunlight

[Anonymous No.55632139]

>>55632060
Depends on how much money you have. Renting is better than owning is something rich people say because they have enough money to buy, they're just lazy. But if you're not rich you better secure your home ownership in case something happens and your income is not longer there at least you still have a roof over your head.

[Anonymous No.55632143]

>>55632060
most of your rent goes to pay another mans mortgage, there might be a few specific cases where this is the "smart" move, but nah.

[Anonymous No.55632157]

>>55632083
>Renting has benefits if rents are low relative to home prices at the time
This.
https://www.numbeo.com/property-investment/rankings.jsp?title=2020&displayColumn=3

[Anonymous No.55632199]

>>55632087
Having neighbors live above/below/next door sharing walls is not worth paying for

[Anonymous No.55632271]

My home is low tax no HOA and I own it outright, so it's great. Maintenance doesn't cost me anywhere near what rent would, obviously. My condo - also no mortgage - costs me about $10k a year for HOA and taxes, which still less than half of what I'd be paying rent in the same area, but way more than my home. I can rent the condo and make money, though, and it's an appreciating asset.

[Anonymous No.55632297]

>>55632139
Yeah, having a home paid off is always a hedge against homelessness, especially as you get older.

[Anonymous No.55632313]

Making your main investment vehicle your home is pleb tier.

[Anonymous No.55632351]

>>55632083
Should I pay 300 euro rent monthly or pay 150k euro for the same condo?

[Anonymous No.55632357]

>>55632060
Partially agree, I think nowadays unless you have a 6 digit+ down payment most people would be better off looking for cheap rent and investing the money.

I still see way too many people who have been conditioned to think housing is a great investment. I think there may be some exceptions for getting a primary residence if you need one but as an investment vehicle its not the same opportunity boomers had.

[Anonymous No.55632428]

>>55632060

It depends on the location and time period OP. That's why the rent vs. buy a house arguments are retarded.

Where I live, you can rent a 2 bedroom apartment for $800/mo in a very safe (yet boring) midwest town. However, the average home price is $300k with a 7% mortgage rate. The average down payment is 5% and our property taxes are moderate (not very high, but not low either). This will average out to a monthly payment of about $2,300/mo if you get a 30/yr fixed rate.

That's absolutely fucking insane for the median income in that area which is only about $32k a year and the median household income is about $65k a year. This doesn't even include regular maintenance and landscaping. At the end of the day, you end up what we call out here as "house poor". Your entire paycheck goes into your mortgage, car paymen/insurance, basic maintenance, utilities and food. At the end of the day you have nothing leftover to save up. Nothing to invest and no money for an emergency.

I'd rather pay $800/mo for an apartment and be able to save, invest and go on vacation whenever I want, than be stuck in a house for 30 years with no money leftover.

As a side note. I like Peter Schiff, but he's stupid when it comes to A LOT of things. He doesn't even understand how the banking system works, even though he owned a bank. Take his advice with a grain of salt. He's been repeating the sane narrative for the last 20 years.

[Anonymous No.55632462]

>>55632060
>I was listening to Peter Schiff yesterday

[Anonymous No.55632499]

Also, rent in my area is fucking absurd compared to the median salary. I live in a poor city that is boosted by national laboratories, so any house/apartment that's even above average has a price that is obscenely marked-up/inflated due to Government jobs.

Renting here is Hell. Buying a house is impossible for anyone under 40 not working for the government.

[Anonymous No.55632571]

>>55632060
he's sort of right. back in the day, you'd rent an apartment for next to nothing, was able to save to buy a house which took you maybe 15 years or less to pay off, no big deal. so if you're a boomer up to a gen-x, own a house, you're pretty much set for life. millennials and zoomers, not so much

nowadays, greedy renters want you to pay mortgage prices for the convenience of not dealing with issues owning a home. nowadays, owning a home is a luxury, so if you're not wealthy, you'll literally be paying a mortgage off until you die, so renting becomes the lesser of two evils essentially. sad but true

[Anonymous No.55632595]

rent beats ownership because you are a freelancer in the world, you just need assets to be liquid anywhere in the world. So have physical currency stored around the world. Have cash on different banks in the world and have crypto (nobrainer). Then you will be free to roam where ever possible to seek for the best life opportunity and to escape shitholes.

[Anonymous No.55632666]

Hes right until youre 60-70 years old and find yourself too tired to work anymore and you realize the places you can afford to rent are dwindling by the year

[Anonymous No.55632787]

>>55632666
the future sounds depressing. i've been to an old folks home before when my dad had to go live there for a few weeks for physical therapy. they literally lock you up in there like you're in jail and check up on you daily whether you want to be left alone or not. it's POLICY. living amongst a bunch of old fucks is a nightmare. you will hear a lot of random yells for help that go unheard, dementiafags screaming all day and night. The market for these institutions are growing massive since social security isn't going to allow you to rent a place next to normal people anymore

[Anonymous No.55632825]

>>55632351
With rent that low I'd say renting is better. With a 4% interest rate you'd already be paying 500 in interest monthly, add to that principal payments, home owner association cost, taxes, maintenance, etc and you'd be paying way more than 300 a month.

[Anonymous No.55632930]

>i was listening to peter schitt spout predigested soundbites about marginal substitution and preference/indifference curves dumbed down for the 2-digit-IQ goyim crowd

>>55632666
horseshit
there are elderly-only retirement communities in every single metro area in the country
many of them are low-income/rent-protected

[Anonymous No.55633128]

>>55632060
Sure the idea is fine now, but in 20 years when its time to sell... you'll wish you'd bought. In the past ten years, my house has appreciated $100,000.

Are you sure Schiff isn't shilling for BlackRock and other corporate landlords?????

[Anonymous No.55633241]

A mortgage generally has much lower payments per month than rent. I guess maintenence is a problem if it's a really shitty house because like once a year you'll buy a new tool and spend a couple hours fixing something. You can whenever you want and rent the house out. Owning offers way more flexibility than renting and saves on costs. If you sell anything that happens to the house is not your problem plus you keep the difference in price that you paid. With renting when you leave your lucky to get the deposit back. Except for a vacation home you only use for a month renting just doesn't make sense.

[Anonymous No.55633389]

>>55632060
It depends on your financial situation and if you plan to settle down.

[Anonymous No.55633418]

>>55633128
>$100,000
How much money and time have you spent on the house? I know people that jave easily spent that on their house over 10 years.

[Anonymous No.55633436]

>>55632060
He's an international jew, of course he thinks like that.

[Anonymous No.55633439]

>>55632060

[Anonymous No.55633451]

>>55632060
Own a home / acreage (your own getaway from baasedciety) or rent an apartment if you move frequently

[Anonymous No.55633482]

He's right if you're a real /biz/ness and finance person and not an average wage slave
If you're regular Joe Goyim from down the street then you're probably more comfortable locking yourself down to a box in the suburbs until you die

[Anonymous No.55633544]

>>55633439
then the question is would you pay $1 mil (over 30 years) for the freedom that comes with owning, like being able to put in a pool or swing set in the back yard, knocking down a wall here or there, or just having the knowledge that no one can kick you out (different states and counties have different rules on this but generally if a landlord wants to sell the house or move in himself or whatever he can just not renew your lease or jack up the rent a huge amount etc). is it with $1-1.5 mil of your net worth for the advantages of owning? (I know owning comes with disadvantages too like being responsible for your own maintenance and so on).

[Anonymous No.55634934]

>>55633418
25K. And in a major metro.

You are being played yet again. This rent logic can only make sense in Manhattan and a few other areas.

Highly Disappointing. I thought 4ch niggas could see through BS corporate narratives. I guess people deserve to eternally rent pic rel via UBI.

The only question you have to ask is if Schiff himself rents.

[Anonymous No.55634946]

>>55632060
rent and buy Vanguard Real Estate ETF (ticker: VNQ)

[Anonymous No.55635993]

I have to say that Schiff is looking good in the nomad getup. I guess he got some kind of wizard to turn a camel into a girl.

[Anonymous No.55636026]

>>55632143
My landlord is a black lady who refinanced and took out a home equity line of credit to put a down payment on a second property in chicago. I pay less than $700 for a fully furnished 1100 sq ft apartment in the middle of a major city and my commute is 2 mins to the office. I don't think ahe is getting over on me at all lmao. She owes like 5% interest on two separate properties now.

[Anonymous No.55636093]

>>55632060
Why is that old hag dressed like a zoomer tik tok ethot?

[Anonymous No.55636115]

>>55632139
Truth to this, the thing is for lower class or middle class, a home is a great way to build wealth over time because of the government subsidized leverage you get from having a mortgage (only up to 750k) and the fact that regular folk are terrible at saving so literally their only way to save is by forced savings from social security and their primary home. And for poorer people, your time is less valuable so having to spend time doing DIY shit to maintain your house isn’t too bad of a deal. You might waste a few hours a month worrying about upkeep etc but for a normal person this doesn’t translate to a ton of “money” lost.

But for a wealthy person
a) your time is WAY more valuable and better spent trying to earn more vs the headache of maintaining a primary residence
b) most of the tax advantages for home ownership only apply to houses 1M and under, which in a tier 1 city like NYC or SF doesn’t get you a very nice place
c) wealthy people don’t need to rely on “forced savings” vehicles like social security and home ownership to build wealth, they have tens of millions or more in their business or in equities investments

Tbh if I was an UHNW individual I probably wouldn’t own a house either

[Anonymous No.55636192]

Renting is better because I poor grease down the sink

[Anonymous No.55636246]

most of the people consuming this type of advice are making below $40/hr and should address that pressing issue way before they start worrying about buying a house.

[Anonymous No.55636298]

>>55632083
>Renting has benefits if rents are low relative to home prices at the time

If there is a marker where rent is cheaper than a mortgage then some real estate investor will move in, buy up housing, and charge cost plus.

This has been happening since early 2000s. The places you are describing do not exist. The people telling you to rent are the ones that own the houses, or stocks on the corporation that owns the houses.

[Anonymous No.55636304]

>>55632825
>oy vey pay the rent, goy

What if I just buy it with 150k cash.

[Anonymous No.55636325]

>>55633439

This literally never happens. 100% of people have created more wealth through real estate than the S&P. Nice larp, though.

[Anonymous No.55636332]

>>55636298
RE prices and rents are affected by different forces, for one you can borrow money to buy but you can’t borrow money to pay rent, this is one reason why in a lot of markets we get speculative bubbles

[Anonymous No.55637876]

>>55632128
Average rent on a 2 bedroom apartment is $1700/mo. Average home value is $350,000. With 20% down, at 6.75% the mortgage payment is $1816/mo. Principal ~245/mo, interest ~1570/mo to start. Gets better every month as the loan amount goes down. Annual property tax is roughly $2700 on a 350k house. You also need home insurance, which varies based on where you live. I pay $800/year.

The mortgage interest alone (18,840) puts you over the standard deduction, so you will have tax savings on that as well as the property taxes (2700). Roughly 20% of $8600, or ~$1700/year. More if you have other deductions. Homes will appreciate with inflation, roughly 2%. You will gain ~$7000/year in equity.

Total payments if you buy = $22,600, but you get $1700 back in taxes. Net is $20,900. Appreciation at 2% will earn you $7000/year and $3000/year in payments goes towards equity.

If you rent, you will pay $20,400/year. No tax benefits, no equity gained. However, you can invest the down payment instead ($70000 @ 5% = $3500/year), which is roughly the same amount as the principal paid. Net $16,900.

>but I can leave when I want, you have to sell and pay realtors fees

Sure. If you're a retard and plan on buying and then selling <2 years later, then you should be renting. Your equity gained ($7000/year) will be less than your costs to sell (~$17,000) and the costs to buy ($3000). After 3 years, you're breaking even.

You don't have to sell when you're done living there, you can rent it out. Landlords get to deduct depreciation (3.6%), maintenance/repairs, in addition to mortgage interest and property tax. If you hold onto the property long enough, you will get a chance to refinance for a lower interest rate. Low interest rates will also mean increased home equity, since buyers have increased purchasing power.

>but you have to maintain the house

Get a home warranty if you are concerned about mechanicals, appliances failing. These are $500/year, you will spend less yourself.

[Anonymous No.55637964]

>>55632428
If you are paying $800/mo in a Midwest town, chances are you are in a USDA eligible area and you can get a mortgage for $0 down and a 4.125% interest rate.

You are also comparing the rent for a 2 bedroom apartment to a house that doesn't share walls/ceilings. You should be comparing apartments to condos, although condos have less transiency and can set limitations on the percent that are rentals.

Homes rent for more than apartments, if you want acreage you're going to have a harder time finding it on the rental market than the resale market.

[Anonymous No.55638130]

>>55632787
>check up on you daily whether you want to be left alone or not. it's POLICY.

that means it's actually a really good old folks' home. The shitty ones don't check up on them and sometimes they die as a result

[Anonymous No.55638316]

>>55637876
lol I'm not reading all of that, remember to pay your rent to the state landcuck, because you don't fucking own ANYTHING

[Anonymous No.55638349]

>>55632060
I've rented for 12 years now have the freehold to my own house. I wouldn't ever rent again.

Combo it up with shelf stacking and you're literally a 21st century surf.

[Anonymous No.55639014]

>>55638349
for me the worst part of renting is handing over the rent every month to management. they always had a shit-eating, hand-rubbing, greedy kike grin on their faces, cracking jokes about " hey it's mr. money bags" or some shit because i always paid on time, but i never felt like this was an accomplishment or something to be proud of at any time. i always felt the opposite. just utter repulsion. especially since i had a door that they always forget to fix. some days i'd come home to my apartment to find my door completely open because it wouldn't shut properly unless you double checked it, so the exterminator comes in and literally leaves my place wide open for niggers and spics every month. glad as fuck i own a house now, bought and paid for. fuck those cunts

[Anonymous No.55639216]

>>55632087

depends on the condo building and the hoa

sometimes the management of the property is an out of touch boomer with 3 years to go until social security and you constantly wonder whats going to go wrong next

but yes, at least in those cases its not your responsibility to get it fixed. however, it is yourinvestment (the condo) losing value because of the incompetence of others

[Anonymous No.55639365]

>>55637876
>Get a home warranty if you are concerned about mechanicals, appliances failing. These are $500/year, you will spend less yourself.
Anon, I think Schiff was low key talking about niggers moving into a neighborhood, destroying the property value.

[Anonymous No.55639399]

>>55632060
the rent to buy equation in my area is all fucked up. You can either rent for 4k or buy at 15k. And for less than that you get a literal mansion in a better area as a rental. Instead of a 1000 something square foot house.

[Anonymous No.55639468]

>>55639399
i used to live in cali. it was overdeveloped when i was a kid. when i google map my home town i noticed that houses haven't expanded much. the only thing that evolved were mininum wageslave businesses. yeah, it's fucked. my parents moved out of there when i was a kid because the rent was ironically too high back then. now homeowners literally have to beg rentoids to stay in their homes

[Anonymous No.55640210]

I think the real answer to this debate is to make enough money that it doesn’t matter. When you can spend a single digit percentage of your net worth to buy a house with cash there is no debate about renting, as long as you’re planning to live there long term.

[Anonymous No.55640572]

>>55632060
I've been living in a different country ever year or two, and I often spend a month traveling somewhere.
Renting is a huge factor in allowing this. I can give my month's notice and gtfo. I don't depend on selling the house, if I need to reduce expenses I can just move to a cheaper place, I don't need to deal with any landlord responsibilities, etc.
I wouldn't buy a house unless I'm financially made and the house costs 20% of my savings to buy at once (easy to find many houses for ~100k or less in the Balkans and the Americas).