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552086 No.552086 [Reply] [Original]

Programming thread?

I've been practicing web design and development 20 hours a week for 6 months now. I've gotten fluid with CSS, Jquery, MySQL, and PHP.

I want to break into the industry. I was thinking going to small business owners and offering to revamp their sites for cheap or free. Is this a good route?

Also, anyone here in the programming industry, especially web design/development, all advice, stories, and humor welcome.

>> No.552089

>>552086
What's your website? If you don't have one start working on it

>> No.552091

>>552086
By "break into the industry" do you mean getting a job doing something bigger, or do you mean eternally freelancing making websites for small businesses? Where do you want to be in a few years?

>> No.552104

>>552086
Here's what I did, OP
>started career in high school by reading a shit ton of tutsplus tutorials
>begun reading books on the web development
>created my own sole proprietorship (i have no idea if this is the right term as i'm not murrican)
>cold-called potential clients (mostly restaurants as tiny business in my home town)
>ran my business for about year while living at home
>moved out and sent emails to 8 companies located in the new town where i moved
>got 2 "positive" responses and the rest politely declined companionship or employment
>currently working on my first project together with one of the companies
>will hopefully get a part-time employment there (also studying software engineering)

most business are the same.
when you get to interview, not only do you want to impress: you want to blow their minds and make sure they know you're not average joe

>> No.552107

>>552089
I have two websites. I'll share one kind of 4chan related. esfores.com. Just released it to s4s a few seconds ago.

Let's see if I can do this right

>>s4s/2760039

>>552091
I want to at least be making a decent wage somewhere, but I hope to have a telecommuting job, or to be living and working in a San Fran, NYC kind of area.

>> No.552109

>>552104
What do I want to be adding to my resume? Here's what I got.

CSS skills
Bootstrap
JavaScript and Jquery
AJAX
PHP
MySQL
Wordpress
CodeIgniter
Photoshop
An active GitHub
An active StackOverflow
and an active website showcasing some projects I've made

I want to learn linux or macs, plus a CSS pre processor. Anything other than that.

>> No.552110

>>552104
apparently i also can't spell for shit

is there any money in front-end programming? in the era of big data it feels like knowledge about statistics, I/O and just back-end competence in general is what's currently most attractive

>> No.552113

>>552109
that's great!
if i were you, i'd probably just MENTION my skills and then, in the cover letter, talk about you most successful projects, and lay focus on WHAT THEIR COMPANY WILL GAIN ON HIRING YOU.

things like that is was will make your CV stand out from the rest. it describes that you're competent in programming, but also know about how the business works.

>> No.552119

>>552109
That's a good skillset for a website codemonkey. Nothing wrong with that, it's just that actual programmers would laugh at you.

>> No.552126

>>552107
>>>/s4s/2760039

>> No.552127

>>552109
Do you even node.js :^)

>> No.552130

If you want you can make a free site for me mate. Or ill pay you 3,50$

>> No.552157

>>552086

Advertising and Marketing firms always need Web Devs and if you're willing to work "cheap" they won't care about lack of "experience"

>> No.552172

>>552119
aren't the "actual programmers" the real code monkeys anyways?

>> No.552174

>>552172
Actual programmers are those who create those tools that you work with. Do you think that things like Linux, Apache, MySQL, and so on, just came out of thin air?

>> No.552183

>>552113
What kind of projects should I work on? What should I be building to prepare my resume and my skills?

>> No.552185

>>552127
My cousin recommends it to me. Do you think it'll gain more widespread use?

>> No.552187

>>552183

you can revamp my site if you want. right now i'm using a free template. it's okay but it could be better. i can pay you and be used as a reference of your work.

>> No.552188

>>552130
I will if it's for a private business, or if you have your own domain.

>> No.552190

>>552157
What's a cheap wage for Web Devs? Minimum wageish?

>>552187
Sure, hit my email s4stribune at gmail

>> No.552232

>>552174
i'm 100% sure they did not come out of thin air, and as far as i'm concerned building such things is like the definition of the word code monkey

>>552183
you'd want to create projects much like the ones you'd like to build in the future.

for example, i'm recently finished my own book keeping web-app and am working on a crm. in the future i'd love to work for companies like mint.com.

>> No.552251

>>552232
>such ambition

>> No.552276

>>552185

Nobody wants to write javascript, why the fuck would they willingly choose to write javascript on the server where they actually have a choice?

(HINT: Node people are all web monkeys excited to do server side and don't know any other languages)

>> No.552291

I want to get into content platforms, messaging services,and social networks that aren't like facebook.

>> No.552352

I learn python on codecademy
Got nothing to do with business though

>> No.552355

Should I be worried about jumping into web design too early. Do I need to get my chops up before I start so I don't get a bad reputation, or do I need the experience as soon as possible.

>> No.552365

>>552352
I learned on codeacademy too. A little imperfect, but addictive.

>> No.552449
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552449

no flex zone

>> No.552617

>>552126
Holy fucking cringe. This reminds me of how retarded I was when I started learning PHP in 2004. Props to him for trying, though.

>> No.552664

>>552086
The best route is to enroll in college and study CS.

If money is a problem, go to a state college. Take one course a semester. Get a Pell grant or the like.

Full-time CS students spend 15 hours a week in class, and 45 hours studying. You'll have to spend that time studying whether you're in class or not, so you might as well get a degree.

You might get a job during boom times with minor skills, but in downturns you'll be unemployed. It's hard work to complete 40 or so college classes, so most people look for excuses to avoid doing so, and they wind up broke in their 40s or 50s, with unhappy wives, and kids who are going nowhere.

>> No.552690

>>552664
>not going to community college

The program I'm planning on enrolling in boasts a 80% full-time employment rate in related field with $40k average salary 6 months after graduation...

Seems almost stupid to not enroll in when tuition is only $3.5k/yr. 3 years of $3.5k/yr tuition and I'm practically guaranteed $40k/yr job. Gg.

>> No.552708

>>552086

Ok speaking as VP of a small software firm (~120 employees, dozen or so web developers, 30 client/server devs) experience is by far the most crucial factor in my hirings. I personally don't care if developers have a degree or where from, if they are smart and have proven it then they're on my radar. Get some real-world experience any way you can.

>> No.552838

>>552708
Fuckin' word.

I was in charge of hiring at a much smaller company (startup with 10 engineers, I had the final call on applicants and set our in-house recruiter's guidelines). #1 thing we looked for was DEMONSTRABLE experience.

We talked to HFT guys, functional programming enthusiasts, fresh-faced wet-behind-the-ears comp. sci graduates, ... everything you can imagine.

Most of the top coders we hired had no degree, but they all had good portfolios of shipped software. One guy had written and maintained his own quite popular web framework. I'd much rather see that you have substantial projects done that I can ask you questions about than a master's or PhD.

"If you could start this project again from scratch, what would you do differently? Why? What are the tradeoffs with that approach? What were some scaling problems you encountered? How did you address them? Why did you choose this software stack? Who set up the servers? Did you have to make any special configuration changes to accommodate the nature of your software?" ...

Doing Fizzbuzz or sorting a linked list on a white board doesn't tell me anything about how your brain works. I want people who can and have built and shipped software, not people who can solve basic computer science questions. 99% of those interview questions represent situations you will never encounter in your entire career. (The last time I used a pointer was 2009 and I am at least 10x better at shipping now)

Shipping software is how companies make money. Build a portfolio showing you can ship.

(NB: "ship" doesn't necessarily mean selling boxed software. Deployed websites available for public consumption count as "shipping")

>> No.552865

>>552838
Excellent, top notch advice. I'll try to build up something impressive. I keep my focus on finishing what I start

>> No.552876
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552876

I left highschool at 15 and joined college.

While I was there I taught myself PHP (15 years ago it was almost new) and made a browser based mmorpg. I used it to teach myself all different aspects of coding while building the membership base. At its peak it had around 60k members. I implemented a $4 monthly subscription and at around 1-2% conversion I was making more than anyone else my age.

I realized that making digital things could make lots of money and I've never looked back.

I also worked commercial web-design for a small company for a year and got paid an average wage. After creating a website for a guy who had a business and used what I'd created to turn over £1,000,000+ in less than a year, I realized I was in the wrong line of work.

I now run my own business and have left web design behind almost completely. But for what it's worth, it's a great way to spend your time if you enjoy it, just not as a job.

>> No.552894

>>552865
>>552838
I am currently tasked with hiring additional developers for the small company I work at. I can't find anyone for the full time positions that is able to think - not just copy paste shit.

I got an intern who is an honors student in applied mathematics - she seems to know what she is doing.

If your a developer who can actually WRITE CODE, people will be lining up, including myself, to hire you.

>> No.552896
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552896

Are there any decent IT jobs were I dont have to sit there typing code

>> No.552899

>>552876

What is your current biz?

>> No.552907

>>552896
You could be a "technology evangelist."

>> No.552912

>>552899
Vidya games.

>> No.552919

>>552912
What game(s) and for what platform(s) ?

>> No.552945

>>552907
You mean a IT storeperson
Lame.

>> No.552955

>>552107
do i have permission to pentest your website?

>> No.552960

>>552894
im a developer that can write code
i see no line at my door despite my numerous applications
i can ship software
me work long time

>> No.552965

I have unlimited ideas im young and im a money maker contact me if you are a programmer .


Lets make video games.

A worldwide network of anons and gaymen.

you know what I mean


lets do it

>> No.552968

>>552960
>im a developer that can write code
>i see no line at my door despite my numerous applications
>i can ship software
>me work long time

My only gig software development business experience is a 3 week gig I was fired from.

I do have years of Unix sysadmin experience followed by going back to college though.

My Android apps made $437 last week.
I also have another Android account I made $216 on last week.

I guess that would be $30k over a year. I just have to repeat what I did four more times and I can just lie back. I just started doing web stuff.

You can program. Why do you have to wait around for someone to say "yes" to you? $30k a year is not a lot, I used to make over $90k a year. It's better than nothing though.

>> No.552976

>>552960
Go to where the jobs are. If you have proof of your skills (LinkedIn, Github, Stackoverflow, whatever), aren't from a third world country, and are as good as you claim, create a profile on Angel.co, list all your skills, set your location to San Francisco, and you'll have startups firing six figure job offers at you.

Startups are so desperate for talent now that they're not even doing normal negotiations. I have multiple job offers sitting in my inbox on Angel.co for over $170k/yr. They'll even give you like $3,000 to relocate to San Francisco or wherever they're based. It's hilarious.

If I left my current gig, I could literally have another job within two days. You gotta go to where the jobs are and network with the people there. Establish cred.

>> No.552982

>>552968
why did you get fired?

>> No.553059

>>552955
Yeah sure, a few people already have

>> No.553063

>>552965
Got an email?

>> No.553066

>>552976
Hmm, that brings me to my next important question.

Is it a good idea to move to a tech valley sort of place like san fran? Should I wait until I have more of an expertise? How will I know I'm ready? I don't want to move to San Fran just to get fired.

>> No.553106

>>553066
If they pay you to move take it.

Just be smart and room share or equivalent so you keep more of your 100K salary . Then when the boom ends in a few yeaers youll be rich, and if you inbested properly might never have to work again.


BONUS points if you work for a company that Ycombinator has paid. Win at life if you get some equity in company that employs you - if Ycombinator is interested at some point you'll be bought out.

>> No.553475

WebDev is good for the entrepreneurial spirit, but hosting/DBA/infrastructure work would be more stable and higher paying. Really just depends on the risk you want to take.

WebDevs are a dime a dozen these days so I'm skeptical to recommend it to those starting off.

>> No.553513

I think if you are a webdev it's better to come up with some idea and implement it yourself, be the owner of it, instead of working for someone else. I'm a programmer but I'm not sticking to one thing, I do Android development and a little web dev.

>> No.553718

>>552896
BUMPING for more ideas

>> No.553745

So I just graduated (business/comp sci) and started a web design/development business making wordpress themes.

The name of the game with the web is design. You can know all about css (should be using SASS), js (I use angular), and html, but if you have no taste for visual interfaces then you're fucked.

Being good with design, being able to implement it fully in css, AND knowing your way around javascript for more complicated web functionality is a really valuable combo. But if you're working solo, prioritize design above all else.

Oh, and fucking never work for free. No one respects people that work for free. Ask for something, even if it's just $50.

>> No.553746

>>553475
>hosting and infrastructure

Really? Doesn't amazon just do this for everyone now? Even huge business use cloud computing.

I don't see why companies would need to hire someone to set up servers for them. DBA I could see, but you probably better to able to do other things too.

>> No.553834

>>553745
>html, js
>not using Slim, Coffescript

It's like you enjoy typing or something. These should make you more productive:

http://coffeescript.org
http://slim-lang.com

>> No.553841

Okay, so I'm currently a Chemical Engineering major. It seems incredibly useful as a basic job guarantee, as long as everything else is competent, since you can use it for a lot.

However, I also really really like programming. I'm not sure if I can double major. Is it worth it if I can't major in CS?

>> No.553964

>>553841
The combination of c.s. and c.e. is incredibly sought after by big chemical companies, since most chemists don't know shit about programming and most programmers don't know shit about chemistry so most companies don't have a person who can use computers to simulate/calculate/program reactions, specially the complex ones that can lead to breackthroughs and inprovements in the i dustrial processes.

But don't be deluded, it will be hard as fuck, both disciplines are difficult to master (one of the reasons why this is such a rare combination)

>> No.554069

>>553746
>Doesn't amazon just do this for everyone now?
You know amazon hires people too, right?

>> No.554116

>>554069
I'm not sure I want to be involved in a field with only one potential employer.

>> No.554720

>>554116
Microsoft
Apple
Netflix
and a ton of infrastructure companies

Also, the cloud is far from predominant.

>> No.555066

People shit on VB but you can automate nearly all accounting and finance jobs with VBA. Bare in mind these jobs usually pay about 60-80k. If you are smart enough to program you are smarter than every accountant or finance monkey. It is some of the easiest money you can make.

>> No.555080

>>555066
good luck with that m8

>> No.555081

>>552968
That's decent cash, any tips for someone wanting to start developing apps? How long have you been developing android apps for?