US Crypto Taxes

[Anonymous No.52729497]

I'm writing a movie script about an evil us citizen who successfully avoids paying short term crypto taxes for 2022
how would this fictional menace to society be able to get away with such an atrocious act?

[Anonymous No.52729548]

>>52729497
Maybe you could lose all your crypto in a boating accident. Or sell them for a stupidly low price? Nobody ever declares the real price when selling a car, always puts something much lower, couldn't the same be done with bitcoin?

[Anonymous No.52729567]

>>52729497
what kind of fucking retard actually has capital gains in 2022.

theres people who made money?

[Anonymous No.52729597]

>>52729548
the irs agents in the movie are smart and will notice

[Anonymous No.52729602]

>>52729497
or maybe you could have been living in Puerto Rico all this time?

really, you should have thought about this stuff beforehand...
there's so many ways to legally avoid paying taxes, but they just don't work after the fact.

[Anonymous No.52729604]

>>52729567
yes

[Anonymous No.52729613]

>>52729602
>they just don't work after the fact
I refuse to believe this

[Anonymous No.52729641]

>>52729602
>>52729613
He's right, the problem is once you sell, you had the taxable event, and there is nothing you can really do to avoid it. And if you held long enough to move to a tax haven, you may just have lost more from holding during a crash than you would have paid in taxes. So it only works if you plan years in advance, so you'd have to sit in puerto rico or some shit for years waiting for the bullrun.

[Anonymous No.52729730]

>>52729613
Sell your crypto at a loss to your mom (Even though that would be very questionable I don't see why you shouldn't be allowed to sell something for much cheaper than what it's worth simply because you are retarded).
Declare no capital gains for 2022.
Move to Puerto Rico.
Buy back from your mom (she'd also sell at a loss because she is retarded too).
Short term capital gains are not taxed in Puerto Rico so use that in your favor.

I don't know, there's probably better ways, but this one seems pretty obvious and low effort. If you have enough money this could be financially worth it.

[Anonymous No.52729760]

>>52729497
Sell for gift cards or precious metals like everyone else does

[Anonymous No.52729827]

One more thing.
If you really want to do this be prepared to spend weeks reading obscure regulation, IRS forms fine print, and so on. Oftentimes legalese is confusing and you might misunderstand what a regulation means and what it implies. So make sure you consult with some well rated lawyer/accountant on upwork or something like that so they can point out any flaws in your plan. Don't expect anyone to do the work for you so be prepared to do it yourself. Don't trust anyone that says they can help you avoid taxes, they are just trying to scam you.

[Anonymous No.52729830]

>>52729730

>I don't see why you shouldn't be allowed to

Government tranny spy detected

[Anonymous No.52729842]

>>52729730
That a wash trading and is illegal

[Anonymous No.52729864]

>>52729497
lol so now you jews instead of coming up with your own ideas just post on 4chins to have the goys do all the work of writing a movie script which is then used to demonize stupid goys who don't pay their taxes?
that's incredibly lazy but also ingenious.
here is your script:

>act 1
>locations: a very white racist 50s style neighborhood with one black rich neighbor and the computer factory workplace
our main villain, a white-supremacist Q boomer version of walter white, steals the privat keys of some super intelligent black computer wiz co-worker (who's also incredibly cool and will have a rap bit about computer science in the movie) by using his white privilege to have the black computer wiz arrested for weed possession (the cops are downright nazis throwing siegheils and yelling at rhe top of their lungs like hitler) then sneaking into his neighbors house and stealing the metal plates engraved with his private keys

>act 2
>inside the IRS agency and the prison
the racist white boomer uses the keys to sell the black computer wiz's blm coins he invented for many millions of dollars but because he's a fascist q boomer who hates the beloved government (here we'll introduce a charming and quirky x-files-esque IRS couple as new heroic characters played by famous jewish actors) he schemes to avoid his taxes by donating all his illegal money to a Q terrorist nazi group disguised as a tax-exempt NGO (who's chairman is essentially trump).

>act 3
>q boomer terrorist camp and bunker complex
the IRS couple successfully free the magical black computer wiz man from prison with jewish legalese superpowers and figure out the q boomer's racist plan to avoid taxes by using their sixed sense for money and then all three go on an extremely violent matrix style rampage using their bare fists to hordes of q boomer nazis who use scary black ar-rifles and ultimately decapitate the trump stand-in with karate kicks. the final scene is the tax avoiding q boomer [to be continued]

[Anonymous No.52729875]

>>52729842
wash trading is not "illegal" and it only applies to stocks, and all it means is that you can't deduct the loss.

[Anonymous No.52729881]

>>52729497
renounce /thread
the US can revoke your passport if you don't pay taxes
https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/revocation-or-denial-of-passport-in-case-of-certain-unpaid-taxes#:~:text=If%20you%20need%20your%20U.S..,Imminent%20travel%20plans.

[Anonymous No.52729894]

>>52729864
disable your autism and re-read the op

[Anonymous No.52730031]

>>52729875
yeah, since bitcoin is a commodity I don't see why you couldn't sell it at any price you want.

[Anonymous No.52730050]

>>52729864
[continued] locking himself in the computer room of the q bunker also trapping our hero trio in a saw-movie like torture room with an ai-robot version of josef mengele but just when things seem lost the black computer wiz uses his apple watch to hack into the ai-robot and using it to break free and into the q boomer's hide-out. the tax-avoiding q boomer finally gives up and writes a very gratuitous check to the IRS couple to pay his taxes and also vowing to rebuy the blm coins to pay back the black computer wiz. just as the credits are about to roll and our trio starts laughing at some funny stand-up joke the q boomer grabs an assault rifle but the mengele robot disarms him and rips his balls off only to state in a funny robo-voice: we'll accept your family jewels as a late fee. the trio bursts into laughter and the credits roll while a montage shows our black computer wiz inventing kang coin to help entrap more white racist tax delinquents thus becoming incredible rich and turning the white neighborhood into a successful diverse neighborhood with vibrant black, hispanic and jewish people breaking into hilarious tik tok dances after paying their taxes online.
fin

[Anonymous No.52730061]

>>52729894
hmm no

[Anonymous No.52730085]

>>52730031
Capital gains still apply, earn a gain of 250k & don't pay tax, the US can revoke your passport.

https://www.irs.gov/businesses/small-businesses-self-employed/revocation-or-denial-of-passport-in-case-of-certain-unpaid-taxes#:~:text=If%20you%20need%20your%20U.S..,Imminent%20travel%20plans.

[Anonymous No.52730208]

>>52730085
the idea is that you'd "sell" them for less than what you bought them for, obviously.
Also, I can see you glow and I'm 5000 miles away.

[Anonymous No.52730279]

if you already sold and did this on a us exchange you are fucked.

[Anonymous No.52730306]

>>52730208
>I can see you glow and I'm 5000 miles away.
Kek im not even a mutt. If you haven't mined your BTC you've most likely KYCed when you bought them. Best of luck not KYCing to sell them.
All passports have the location of your birth (thank FATCA for that). Best of luck selling & it not showing up on some FATCA report.

Sorry you don't like the reality of being a mutt. Start the process of renouncing now & you can avoid all this.
Is there ways around this, yea I know Mutts that lie to banks (not going into detail). If you don't already have another passport you're probably fucked

[Anonymous No.52730467]

>>52730208
>the idea is that you'd "sell" them for less than what you bought them for, obviously.
sry, didn't address this. k, so lets say you buyed your parents house (or any house) for less than market value...the previous owner is still responsible for CG on the market value. You could argue that CG doesn't apply if it was their primary residence, but we are talking about investments here. I think you have no clue about reality.

Even if you transferred crypto to a trust the IRS would want their pound of flesh, from you the trustor.

[Anonymous No.52730533]

>>52730467
>lets say you buyed your parents house (or any house) for less than market value...the previous owner is still responsible for CG on the market value.

Its nuanced. If its not an arm's length transaction, and was sold for less than market value, then the IRS will probably see that as a non-transaction or even a gift. Same thing with selling coins to your mom. But the thing is, wash sale rules don't apply to crypto. So you can simply sell your coins to the open market, doesn't even have to be your mom, at market price, and buy them back immediately and claim a loss.

But in this guy's example >>52729730 this wouldn't work if you had a gain on the crypto and sold it to your mom at a value lower than market value, because same as I said, this would probably not be viewed as an arm's length transaction (or any transaction where the buyer has an existing agreement with you to sell it back) and probably be viewed as a gift or something. It would work if you legitimately had loses though, but then you wouldn't need to avoid taxes anyway.

[Anonymous No.52730905]

>>52730533
>sell your coins to the open market
So at this point (I'd assume) a profit was made, if you're dealing with the open market KYC is unavoidable now. even if you used a DEX those transactions are on the blockchain & your using KYCed coins....its only a matte of time.

Anon, how about this *idea* use some your KYCed coins to buy miners, pay tax if above the threshold (i don't know the US capital gain threshold amount) & produce non KYCed BTC (or whatever). If you're refusing to renounce & Leave the US i still see issues in the future. Rinse & repeat every tax year...you now have non KYCed coins & an income. How much am I glowing now kek

I know of mutts trying to bypass the rules of renouncing (by claiming a loss) in a different way than you've/the other Anon proposed. The people in the circles I keep all said it was a bad idea. He's never come back saying it worked...he was the type to gloat if it worked. He already had another passport btw. Please know he had more than the 2.5MM USD (whatever it is) exit tax requirement. i.e he had more wealth than just the 2-3k fee to renounce.

Anon simply said, the world is so much more connected than it ever has been. Maybe not today, But they'll find you eventually.
If you have less a couple of MM just pay, the IRS can access your bank account/property anywhere (pretty much) in the world.
You'll have unexplained wealth even if you stay in the US which is a huge red flag.
Sorry Anon, its a pipe dream. If you want complete freedom, renounce. End of

Hey who knows, you might getting away with it, but you'll never know for sure. You're only risking your freedom & back taxes with interest.

[Anonymous No.52731013]

>>52730905
Right, if you want to illegally evade taxes, you have to lander the money. I'd assume we are talking legal ways to avoid taxes. But as soon as you have a taxable event, that is tax you can't avoid. And people have been trying to avoid taxes since taxes were invented so its not like crypto is special in this regard.

If you want to illegally evade taxes is much easier. Just throw your coins in a mixer and withdraw them (using tor, etc. to keep privacy) and think of some way to convert that into a legitimate income stream that is also not taxable where you live. Like hide your coins, move overseas where there is no capital gains, the make a coin or something you buy and have your anonymous wallet buy them on a dex or something. Its all 100% fraud and illegal though.

[Anonymous No.52731068]

>>52729602
You realize the IRS has two fucking Head quarter there right?
You're walking into the dragons den

[Anonymous No.52731086]

>>52729597
>irs agents
>smart
your movie sounds a bit unrealistic

[Anonymous No.52731108]

>>52729497
Darkweb

[Anonymous No.52731202]

>>52731013
>so its not like crypto is special in this regard.
agreed, the USD is still the biggest currency for criminals
>Just throw your coins in a mixer
check out what happened to the tornado guy..siting in jail (not a US citizen) & can't even talk to his family...for what? Writing code. You'll get your transactions tagged, its already happening.
>think of some way to convert that into a legitimate income stream that is also not taxable where you live.
Anon, you're going to have to KYC something if you do this to convert into fiat. You're making life SO MUCH harder than it has to be, if you simply renounce, problem solved.
>Like hide your coins, move overseas where there is no capital gains
kek, your passport is going to fuck you. we don't live in times of numbered swiss bank accounts. Look at your passport (if you have one) it states the place where you were born. this is all thanks to FATCA.
Do shady shit & deal with shady people.
>Its all 100% fraud and illegal though.
yea

Anon, please you're dealing with an animal SO much bigger than you. Don't blame anyone else if your head gets bitten off, that animal can track you down at a later date.
Anon, promise not trying to be mean, speak to others that have gained wealth while being a US citizen. They all come to the realization that they're fucked. The US is not the land of the free anymore.

This is the easiest/cheapest solution i know off for mutts that are willing to put the time in.
Get a Mexican residence permit, you have 5 years to start citizenship (mexico is not cheap on taxes (income)) & live there. The Mexican passport is actually a great passport (as long as you don't want visa free US). Start the path to becoming actually free. The whole idea of having money is not just to buy shit you don't need, but freedom. You can't be free if you have to look over your shoulder.

All the best Anon, you should do this legally. No point in having money but worrying about freedom. Sry to be the glownigger

[Anonymous No.52731317]

>>52730533
Could you make a back dated contract that says you were betting against bitcoin essentially and therefore have to sell them to your mom at a loss?

The basic idea is to fake losses that then turn out as massive gains after you've move to a tax friendly jurisdiction.

[Anonymous No.52731339]

>>52731202
you only have to KYC the address you use to cash out.

it works like this
KYCed coins with profit -> mixer -> private wallet
then you can sell or do w/e on your private wallet and they can't track you (illegal though obv)

then you move to a tax haven and think of some way to profit

one way is: from your KYC wallet, deploy a new token, put them in an uniswap LP.
then have your private wallet buy from the LP
rug pull the LP with your KYC wallet.

Now you have a new capital gains event from your KYC wallet, except they occurred in the tax haven. Of course selling a token, and having it entirely bought by a wallet funded from a mixer is sus as fuck, so you'd probably want to obscure it some way, but that's the jist of it.

[Anonymous No.52731363]

>>52731013
Also Anon, thinking about it (I have no personal exp with this) set up an S corp in the US (probably Delaware). When you sell an asset you have 6 months to sell & buyed another asset without paying capital gains. All completely legal.

People also know the US has a law of 'piercing the corporate veil' look that up also

[Anonymous No.52731405]

>>52731363
One problem is moving the assets from your personal ownership into the S corp, which I think would be a taxable event because you're trading the coins for ownership in the S crop. So you'd have to set up the S corp before you bought the coins.

The other issue is I think doing that in an S corp is still taxable, and would just be passed though to you. Are you talking about doing a 1031 exchange? That would work for real estate, but I think the TCJA excludes crypto from that. I don't think you can sell crypto and defer the tax by reinvesting, whether its in a corporation or not.

[Anonymous No.52731421]

>>52731317
Yeah you could do something like that. Say you sold a call option on bitcoin to your mom, but I think then your mom would have capital gains on it.

[Anonymous No.52731425]

>>52731339
>mixer
look up tornado cash, please
>rug pull the LP with your KYC wallet
this is so close to the person I was talking about btw. best of luck. I'd say its been done before & its only a matter of time.
try to work within the bounds of the law, you can do it Anon. Don't risk your freedom

take a look at S corps (i believe its called) that could be your legal salvation if you don't want to renounce...don't forget to look up 'piercing the corporate veil'.

In all seriousness, having lived in the US in the past. I'd guess (you're probably young) you think the US is the best country in the world. its not & hasn't been for a while. Please travel & don't be so dogmatic on your ideas.

All the best Anon, I truly wish you all the best on your journey

[Anonymous No.52731461]

>>52731405
>which I think would be a taxable event
it will be, but over the years you could deposit under the CG threshold...
>1031 exchange
pretty sure, yes. sorry not a mutt..not my problem
>I think the TCJA excludes crypto from that
Ah, fuck Sorry anon
>defer the tax by reinvesting, whether its in a corporation or not
Ask someone that has knowledge on that...its not me

As I said ( & I do mean it) all the best Anon
the simple answer is to renounce, as i've said. Sorry you don't like this answer

[Anonymous No.52731512]

>>52731425
>>52731461
I don't disagree with you, the only way I think you can avoid taxes without renouncing is the puerto rico thing. And you have to do it before you sell or trade anything.

And even if you renounce, I think if you have a NW over $2mil technically they charge an exit tax that might include unrealized gains, not sure. But you'll pretty much have to find some country that is out of reach of the US anyway.

Personally, I cashed out a lot of crypto, and I just paid the tax. I live in the US and its worth it. I could have save a lot by moving but then I would stuck in some foreign country without US citizenship.

[Anonymous No.52731792]

>>52731512
>is the puerto rico thing
From speaking to other mutts that have gone this route...its a fuckin shithole + you are still tied to PR, its not freedom...God forbid your net worth goes over the 2MM+ threshold while there & want to renounce, you're in an even worse situation.
Even if you're not a US citizen/resident you can/will be taxed if you stay in the US over 90 days (i believe that number is correct). Foreign ship captains that need to be docked (for repairs lets say) (they can't leave, as they have to look after the ship, as they are responsible for the ship(being the captain)) have been taxed by the IRS on their income.
>NW over $2mil technically they charge an exit tax
yes, but under its just a fee of 2 or 3 k... which still sucks balls
>unrealized gains
it does to my knowledge of other US citizens that renounced
>But you'll pretty much have to find some country that is out of reach of the US anyway
best of luck living in North Korea, kek.
The reality is the USD is the world reserve currency, countries don't want to risk being locked out of the system. Think how they would buy oil as an example. They have to play ball, no 3 strikes. end off. How do you think they grew so much global power...its not through the military as so many have said. Look at Iraq/Libya, locked out of the USD...covered to a gold for oil system...invaded...Yea by the US military, but the start is always the USD.
>stuck in some foreign country without US citizenship
you can always get a visa or in the future do CBI (Citizenship by investment) that offers US visa free access. If you have enough funds you can bring your family to you for holiday...

Hey look Anon, (no homo), I'm a Canadian citizen (among others), gay marriage is legal, you can live in Canada for 5 years, get a Canadian passport/citizenship & go back to the US for 6 months...all legal
What do you say to my proposal? Pre nump in my favor obviously
>pic related
KEK

[Anonymous No.52732551]

>>52731339
There are limited ways to obscure a token unless you swap it to Monero, or shield it on Railgun or Aztec or any privacy tool that supports it. Mixers are not the best option at the moment considering the censorship risks it's got.

[Anonymous No.52732624]

>>52731013
You seem to be making the inference that the only reason why anyone would want to keep a private wallet is to prevent their illegal activities from coming to light. That's grossly inaccurate. I can choose to keep privacy, yet have a clean record.

[Anonymous No.52732709]

>>52732551
>>52732624
Yeah by mixer I mean any anonymous tool like aztec. I agree I used to use tornado, and I use tor to prevent being tracked, I'm not saying crime is the only use for these services and I personally pay my taxes even though I use privacy tools. I was just responding the guy saying your wallet is KYCed and that's that, there are plenty of ways to have an anonymous wallet.

[Anonymous No.52732913]

>>52732551
Aztec being L2-based is arguably centralized and inefficient IMO. I'd rather use Railgun

[Anonymous No.52732923]

>>52732551
So close to pedo tag kek...
Joking but come on...XMR has = pedo for TIME
KEK
>>52732709
So you don't want agree to my pre nump...
KEK Anon, all the best, Just know it was love...if an official asked.
= D

[Anonymous No.52732935]

>>52732709
Indeed, there are many ways to have anonymous wallet and there is a big chance that we will have more players in the privacy crypto space in the coming year with regulations speculated to become a big deal.

[Anonymous No.52732998]

>>52732935
Great image Anon...may I please have a sauce?
Simply interested
Thanks

Also, dubs of truth

[Anonymous No.52733020]

>>52732935
Great image Anon...may I please have a sauce?
Simply interested
Thanks

[Jealous No.52733022]

I think your protagonist would better expend his efforts on some scam other than tax evasion.

[Anonymous No.52733041]

>>52733022
KEK, what about the proagonist from Tenet?

[Anonymous No.52733053]

>>52729497
What happens if I owe 100k in taxes but i lost all my money in FTX?

[Anonymous No.52733063]

>>52732923
coughs...

[Anonymous No.52733411]

>>52733063
KEK
XMR is the BTC people think BTC is
All the best

[Anonymous No.52733514]

>>52733411
Maybe, maybe not. One thing is clear though; there are emerging privacy techs with better fundamentals and use cases compared to XMR in terms of keeping an anonymous wallet and profile.

[Anonymous No.52733634]

>>52733514
I think transparency has massive value - when you want it. And that having optional privacy is important. So I prefer having an open system like eth where everything is verifiable. And then you can have privacy tools to shield yourself when needed. Making everything private isn't needed.

[Anonymous No.52733886]

>>52733053
good luck, sir

[Anonymous No.52734025]

>>52733514
Dare I ask what shitcoin you're promoting over XMR...which is completely fuckin based in reality. It better be PoW...I won't reply if its not.
PoW Maxie here btw

[Anonymous No.52734629]

>>52733053
They will add on an extra fee for your counter-semitic insinuation.