/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.52648323]

After extensive research on Kleros-Skleros (PNK) I’ve found some eye opening info. If you look into the original devs you’ll find out they tried to pitch this project for a while and it never took off for a reason. Someone else here mentions it but even with current crypto tech we can’t solve the lack of intelligence needed across the masses to be able to have a system as complex as kleros work. A few legal firms looked into the project and released reports stating that through their research they concluded that the margin of error within the system which can’t be removed (which is obvious cause we’re introducing the human aspect into code) due to the fact that there is no vetting system as its decentralized. DYOR but you might have to do some digging. They’ve been really good about covering their tracks while they laid put out this ‘amazing project which totally isn’t too good to be true and a scam.’

[Anonymous No.52648380]

didn't read. never buying

[Anonymous No.52648724]

>>52648380
Good decision

[Anonymous No.52648787]

>aoe2
Based

[Anonymous No.52649524]

Let's be real here, the only thing this token does is pay for Francisco’s alcoholism.
Kleros does nothing useful besides trick idiots into paying for some stupid kleros court or whatever. This is why only heroin addicts like vitalik keeps blabbering about it simply because it makes no sense to anyone reasonable.
He just thinks he can get eternal jury duty checks to pay for his bags of yellow powder.
If you just buy some every month, by the time it is $0 you will not care whether you bought it for 15c, 10c, 6c, 4c, 1c, whatever.
You’ll be a strung out heroin addicted alcoholic like them. There has never been a more overrvalued project in crypto and /biz/ is just incredibly retarded.

[Anonymous No.52649605]

[Anonymous No.52650004]

>>52649524
>Francisco
I have no idea who this guy is, but I already hate him

[Anonymous No.52650097]

>>52648787
>>52648323
This guy actually win aoe 2 tourneys for money? What's his screen name?

[Anonymous No.52650157]

>>52650097
No, he "organizes" AOE2 tournaments and falsifies the so that his friends get all the money

[Anonymous No.52650624]

>>52650157
Despicable!

[Anonymous No.52650811]

>>52650624
Yeah, many such cases

[Anonymous No.52651387]

>>52650157
>>52650624
if only there was a protocol such that the outcome could be fairly determined

[Anonymous No.52651412]

1c

[Anonymous No.52651740]

>>52651387
If by fairly you mean determined by a single whale-CTO when we already have a such protocol.

[Anonymous No.52651931]

>PNK is fine.
>PNK will be fine when the bull run resumes.

And I will continue PNK posting when deciding noPNKer bankruptcy cases.
We no longer live in the era most people identify with the 20th century. The problems and solutions are different, and a technology like Kleros will inevitably be turned to in a society that embraces the notion of free will, liberty, private property, and many of the other ideas that have characterized Western civilization since the thinking of the Greek philosophers. I am of the opinion that Western civilization is dying a la Spengler, but that does not mean that there aren't a few more gifts to be wrought by the dying breath of the West. One of those is the remarkable legal system and judiciary that we have inherited. Kleros, in my eyes, embodies the synthesis of many of the political values espoused in the West, alongside the legal innovations utilized widely today. If it isn't Kleros, it'll be a fork of Kleros, or some offshoot that captures the spirit of the project. It is just such an incredibly fascinating concept, one that really stands out against the backdrop of crypto. And as the West dies, so too will the qualities of a judiciary that truly functions in a way that preserves a healthy society. (And if it isn't obvious, we are currently engaged in a slow and decadent decline into moral depravity) As corruption becomes more prevalent, the need for Kleros will become more acute. The microprocessor will put beyond the reach of any individual man the justice of a society. It is merely a matter of cracking the nut.

[Anonymous No.52652065]

>>52651931
I will continue posting 1c when PNK declares bankruptcy.

[Anonymous No.52652129]

>>52651931
It is with this in mind that I submit the wonderfully prophetic thoughts of Alexis de Tocqueville in his most famous work: Democracy in America. AT puts forth the unusual qualities of the American judiciary that make it stand out against the backdrop of the West. If any of you are interested in this sort of philosophy, I encourage you to read his text in full, for it has many valuable insights into the wise ways that America's founders constructed the judiciary, and where innovation in western legal systems may be found. Additionally, the irony is not lost that Kleros is spearheaded not by Americans, but by a Frenchman and an Argentine. To this I am convinced that while the general political and cultural values of Federico and Clement are greatly imbued with their upbringing and permeated with the spirit of their peoples, we are all greatly influenced by the same new Nation: that of the internet and the dissemination of ideas via the digital realm. We have all (mostly) grown up with the Internet as kids and young adults, and are as such impressed by the new experience of growing up in the digital age. I speculate that the internet will produce the next great evolution of law, in the form of something such as Kleros. And we digital natives know the law instinctively, any denizen of this god forsaken underwater basket weaving forum understands the customs and habits of 4chin, and to a wider extent, the internet as a whole.

[Anonymous No.52652148]

>>52650157
What does he falsify? The game winners?

[Anonymous No.52652160]

>>52651931
>>52652129
Alexis de Tocqueville's Democracy in America:IN visiting the Americans and studying their laws, we perceive that the authority they have entrusted to members of the legal profession, and the influence; that these individuals exercise in the government, are the most powerful existing security against the excesses of democracy. This effect seems to me to result from a general cause, which it is useful to investigate, as it may be reproduced elsewhere.

The members of the legal profession have taken a part in all the movements of political society in Europe for the last five hundred years. At one time they have been the instruments of the political authorities, and at another they have succeeded in converting the political authorities into their instruments. In the Middle Ages they afforded a powerful support to the crown; and since that period they have exerted themselves effectively to limit the royal prerogative. In England they have contracted a close alliance with the aristocracy; in France they have shown themselves its most dangerous enemies. Under all these circumstances have the members of the legal profession been swayed by sudden and fleeting impulses, or have they been more or less impelled by instincts which are natural to them and which will always recur in history? I am incited to this investigation, for perhaps this particular class of men will play a prominent part in the political society that is soon to be created.

Men who have made a special study of the laws derive from this occupation certain habits of order, a taste for formalities, and a kind of instinctive regard for the regular connection of ideas, which naturally render them very hostile to the revolutionary spirit and the unreflecting passions of the multitude.

[Anonymous No.52652179]

>>52652160The special information that lawyers derive from their studies ensures them a separate rank in society, and they constitute a sort of privileged body in the scale of intellect. This notion of their superiority perpetually recurs to them in the practice of their profession: they are the masters of a science which is necessary, but which is not very generally known; they serve as arbiters between the citizens; and the habit of directing to their purpose the blind passions of parties in litigation inspires them with a certain contempt for the judgment of the multitude. Add to this that they naturally constitute a body; not by any previous understanding, or by an agreement that directs them to a common end; but the analogy of their studies and the uniformity of their methods connect their minds as a common interest might unite their endeavors.

Some of the tastes and the habits of the aristocracy may consequently be discovered in the characters of lawyers. They participate in the same instinctive love of order and formalities; and they entertain the same repugnance to the actions of the multitude, and the same secret contempt of the government of the people. I do not mean to say that the natural propensities of lawyers are sufficiently strong to sway them irresistibly; for they, like most other} men, are governed by their private interests, and especially by the interests of the moment.

In a state of society in which the members of the legal profession cannot hold that rank in the political world which they enjoy in private life, we may rest assured that they will be the foremost agents of revolution. But it must then be asked whether the cause that then induces them to innovate and destroy results from a permanent disposition or from an accident. It is true that lawyers mainly contributed to the overthrow of the French monarchy in 1789;

[Anonymous No.52652196]

>>52652179
Five hundred years ago the English nobles headed the people and spoke in their name; at the present time the aristocracy sup- ports the throne and defends the royal prerogative. But notwith- standing this, aristocracy has its peculiar instincts and propensities. We must be careful not to confound isolated members of a body with the body itself. In all free governments, of whatever form they may be, members of the legal profession will be found in the front ranks of all parties. The same remark is also applicable to the aristocracy; almost all the democratic movements that have agitated the world have been directed by nobles. A privileged body can never satisfy the ambition of all its members: it has always more talents and more passions than it can find places to employ, so that a considerable number of individuals are usually to be met with who are inclined to attack those very privileges which they cannot soon enough turn to their own account.

I do not, then, assert that all the members of the legal profession are at all times the friends of order and the opponents of innovation, but merely that most of them are usually so. In a community in which lawyers are allowed to occupy without opposition that high station which naturally belongs to them, their general spirit will be eminently conservative and anti-democratic. When an aristocracy excludes the leaders of that profession from its ranks, it excites enemies who are the more formidable as they are independent of the nobility by their labors and feel themselves to be their equals in intelligence though inferior in opulence and power. But whenever an aristocracy consents to impart some of its privileges to these same individuals, the two classes coalesce very readily and assume, as it were, family interests.

[Anonymous No.52652221]

>>52651931This aristocratic character, which I hold to be common to the legal profession, is much more distinctly marked in the United States and in England than in any other country. This proceeds not only from the legal studies of the English and American lawyers, but from the nature of the law and the position which these interpreters of it occupy in the two countries. The English and the Americans have retained the law of precedents; that is to say, they continue to found their legal opinions and the decisions of their courts upon the opinions and decisions of their predecessors. In the mind of an English or American lawyer a taste and a reverence for what is old is almost always united with a love of regular and lawful proceedings.

This predisposition has another effect upon the character of the legal profession and upon the general course of society. The English and American lawyers investigate what has been done; the French advocate inquires what should have been done; the former produce precedents, the latter reasons. A French observer is surprised to hear how often an English or an American lawyer quotes the opinions of others and how little he alludes to his own, while the reverse occurs in France. There the most trifling litigation is never conducted without the introduction of an entire system of ideas peculiar to the counsel employed; and the fundamental principles of law are discussed in order to obtain a rod of land by the decision of the court. This abnegation of his own opinion and this implicit deference to the opinion of his forefathers, which are common to the English and American lawyer, this servitude of thought which he is obliged to profess, necessarily give him more timid habits and more conservative inclinations in England and America than in France.

[Anonymous No.52652246]

>>52651931In proportion as you introduce the jury into the business of the courts you are enabled to diminish the number of judges, which is a great advantage. When judges are very numerous, death is perpetually thinning the ranks of the judicial functionaries and leaving places vacant for new-comers. The ambition of the magistrates is therefore continually excited, and they are naturally made dependent upon the majority or the person who nominates to vacant offices; the officers of the courts then advance as do the officers of an army. This state of things is entirely contrary to the sound administration of justice and to the intentions of the legislator. The office of a judge is made inalienable in order that he may remain independent, but of what advantage is it that his independence should be protected if he be tempted to sacrifice it of his own accord? When judges are very numerous many of them must necessarily be incapable; for a great magistrate is a man of no common powers: I do not know if a half-enlightened tribunal is not the worst of all combinations for attaining those ends which underlie the establishment of courts of justice. For my own part, I had rather submit the decision of a case to ignorant jurors directed by a skillful judge than to judges a majority of whom are imperfectly acquainted with jurisprudence and with the laws. of the jury consequently invests the people, or that class of citizens, with the direction of society.

[Anonymous No.52652264]

>>52651931In England the jury is selected from the aristocratic portion of the nation; the aristocracy makes the laws, applies the laws, and punishes infractions of the laws; 6 everything is established upon a consistent footing, and England may with truth be said to constitute an aristocratic republic. In the United States the same system is applied to the whole people. Every American citizen is both an eligible and a legally qualified voter.7 The jury system as it is understood in America appears to me to be as direct and as extreme a consequence of the sovereignty of the people as universal suffrage. They are two instruments of equal power, which contribute to the supremacy of the majority. All the sovereigns who have chosen to govern by their own authority, and to direct society instead of obeying its directions, have destroyed or enfeebled the institution of the jury. The Tudor monarchs sent to prison jurors who refused to convict, and Napoleon caused them to be selected by his agents.

However clear most of these truths may seem to be, they do not command universal assent; and in France, at least, trial by jury is still but imperfectly understood. If the question arises as to the proper qualification of jurors, it is confined to a discussion of the intelligence and knowledge of the citizens who may be returned, as if the jury was merely a judicial institution. This appears to me the least important part of the subject. The jury is pre-eminently a political institution; it should be regarded as one form of the sovereignty of the people: when that sovereignty is repudiated, it must be rejected, or it must be adapted to the laws by which that sovereignty is established. The jury is that portion of the nation to which the execution of the laws is entrusted, as the legislature is that part of the nation which makes the laws; and in order that society may be governed in a fixed and uniform manner, t

[Anonymous No.52652332]

And finally I will discontinue the spam of AT's work, but ask the the reader of this post to consider the ways the internet has influenced his character, his beliefs and values. Consider the way the internet has restructured the fabric of society, and it is inevitable that some form of law, some internet based jury/ court will spring forth to meet the demands of this century.

[Anonymous No.52653073]

Youd better have at least a suicide stack for next bullrun. Buy now or cry later

[Anonymous No.52653321]

>>52652332
Bro I just don't want to be poor, too demoralized to read any of it

[Anonymous No.52653323]

>All that schizo posting
Is Kleros the next XRP?

[Anonymous No.52654343]

>>52653323
Without the pumps

[Anonymous No.52654681]

I have no way of proving this and I know I'll just get sneeded and tuktukposted to death but I was the guy who rolled 4moonxgg way back in the day
I'm so sorry that I led you people to baghold such a steaming pile of shit. If it makes you feel better I bagheld half my profits away after getting in at around 6 cents on average in 2019/2020

[Anonymous No.52655166]

PNK is justice