XMR is the next 50x

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XMR is the next 50x Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:37:27 2021 No.28834864 [Reply] [Original]

Monero's cap is $4B. Bitcoin's cap is $900B. Monero does literally everything bitcoin does, better than bitcoin does, and does stuff on top of all that (privacy, ASIC resistance, healthy tail emissions, an actual active use case (buying weed on the dark web)) that make it even more valuable and sustainable as a long-term currency and value store. I know, I know, "muh bitcoin killer", but this time the comparison is actually fair.

Monero should be worth at least 1/10 what bitcoin is worth based on all the above. Honestly it should actually be worth more than bitcoin altogether, but we'll be conservative. That would mean a 22x in sats once an irrational market realizes what it's been sleeping on. And Bitcoin is probably rocketing to 100-200k this cycle anyhow. That would conservatively put Monero at some thing like $10000 by this cycle top. A 50x bare minimum.

This isn't some random rugpull piece of shit hosted on a bespoke ETH killer chain that didn't exist last week and probably won't exist a month from now. It is established, it's already better than bitcoin, it's getting better every day, and it's too important to the DNM and money launderers to ever be abandoned. This is a project, literally as or more solid than anything in the top 5 right now, that still easily has a 50x left in it this year.

Why the fuck are you diddling around with your retard scams when you could just buy an unknown amount of monero and make it this bull cycle?

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:43:08 2021 No.28835170 File: 423 KB, 626x623, 1613292260189.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28834864 Shhhhhhhhh

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:43:12 2021 No.28835175 >>28834864 Just put in over 25k between a few wallets I have. Already have 10kUSD in, but just packing my bags. Hop on, WGMI bros.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:43:15 2021 No.28835177 File: 359 KB, 847x1200, 04B3B3C4-29D1-4AFF-997F-EE142D4FE1A2.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28834864 This is why I am accumulating. All-in.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:44:12 2021 No.28835232 >>28834864 Where do you buy?

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:44:59 2021 No.28835282 >>28835232 Binance, Kucoin, Kraken

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:45:07 2021 No.28835297 Is it worth mining Monero? I definitely want in on this.

Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:46:56 2021 No.28835397

>>28835232
Binance is the obvious choice for euros. Kraken would be the easiest for most burgers but they don't support some states. I use kucoin a lot and it's been good, but the volume can be a little thin there.

Later this year we will have atomic swaps and exchanges won't even be relevant anymore.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:49:00 2021 No.28835507 >>28834864 Whenever I think this cycle is coming to an end I will probably swap all of my shitcoins for as much XMR as possible. It's the only thing I want to hold forever.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:50:31 2021 No.28835606 >>28835397 >Later this year we will have atomic swaps and exchanges won't even be relevant anymore. How will atomic swaps incorporate prices?

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:50:45 2021 No.28835618 >>28835507 Pretty much this.

Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:51:02 2021 No.28835635

>>28834864
> Monero does literally everything bitcoin does
False. Bitcoin has a limited supply, thus it is the ultimate store of value. Monero is an inflationary currency. There is a use case for degenerates buying drugs, but it's a spending currency not a long-term hold.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:52:31 2021 No.28835721 >>28835635 >t. retard

Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:52:34 2021 No.28835724

>>28835297
I mine it on my old laptops, but it's not profitable. However, I am holding everything I mine and hoping the price goes up alot. For instance in 2015 I was mining about 0.01 btc per day, which at the time was $4.50, but now that amount is almost $500. Mine and hodl

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:53:41 2021 No.28835795 i..i got it on voyager, is anyone using voyager?

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:54:01 2021 No.28835818 >>28835635 Agreed, the tail emission of Monero is something that negatively affects its status as a SoV

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:54:40 2021 No.28835860 >>28835635 >Monero is an inflationary currency By the time you understand, it will be too late for you.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:54:55 2021 No.28835881 >>28835635 Limited supply commands centralization.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:56:02 2021 No.28835948 >>28835635 This. Bitcoin is the gold standard, the store of value for crypto. Monero is the medium of exchange for day to day transactions. Both have their uses.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:57:09 2021 No.28836005 >>28835860 >this To properly understand Monero people need to have an IQ higher than 100.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:57:11 2021 No.28836007 >>28835232 BTC to cake wallet and exchange it for XMR. Worked well for me.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:57:16 2021 No.28836010 >>28835724 That's what I'm planning on doing. Small, passive investments now for modest profits later.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:58:36 2021 No.28836083 File: 355 KB, 1242x1352, B898501D-1675-4A37-B57B-23E797E56ECA.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Capped your post for future use, OP.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:58:51 2021 No.28836099 It's interesting how many retards still don't understand how tail emission of Monero works. I guess it's good to accumulate as much as possible before they do.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:59:01 2021 No.28836105 >>28835507 You should always be 50% in bitcoin.

>>	Anonymous Mon Feb 15 23:59:01 2021 No.28836107 >>28835282 >I now have to sign up for a 6th exchange FUCK. I can barely remember where all my shitcoins are as it is.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:00:12 2021 No.28836178 >>28835606 as long as the base mechanism is there u can build applications around there making it easy to build an exchange-like system.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:00:25 2021 No.28836187
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currently drunk as fuck just want to say I love you all. and I am putting all my shitcoins profits in Monero. and I'm sending free Monero to my friends. and I really believe in MOnero. OP is so right. Just love you all alright. So undervalued

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:02:07 2021 No.28836285

Gotta get behind XMR -the only reason its not as big is because essentially big corporate compliance and official corporate fucking around. You can bet that lots of assholes have tons of cash IN Monero but they aren't going to pull the kind of "I just put millions into XMR " the same way Musk did with BTC / ETH leading to this spike.

XMR is the best store of value and trade as an actual CURRENCY I've seen, especially taking into account not just privacy but all the ways to make sure that both mining is viable but also transactions are cheap and fast no matter how popular they are. The sad downside is that unlike ETH its not a platform that is basically designed to have other platforms built upon it in a giant fucking grift , but in a lot of ways that makes XMR better at what it actually does rather than simply a speculator's grift.

Perhaps a Monero anon will help me out here so I can get back to a decent currency. I fucked around and exchanged a bit of my monero "change" into Doge for the price spike in the past couple of weeks and then, dumped it back out, stupidly, into a stablecoin - Tether / USDT to decide what to do (go right back to XMR or look to invest otherwise) . Having not fucked around with ERC20 tokens before I didn't realize I was about to get fucked with ETH gas (as in your need separate ETH from the Tether I was able to swap in inexpensively, in order to get it fucking out ). The whole system is fucking insane. Is there some way to figure out how much ETH "gas" I need to cover about a 300 USDT transaction ? Even the ETH Gas page only talks about how much each unit costs on average these days (ie how many gwei) but not how many UNITS you need - all they say is "sending from ETH to ETH is cheaper than token shit" - totally unhelpful. Monero bros, get me out of that hellhole?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:02:18 2021 No.28836292 It's also illegal and being actively banned by most countries.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:02:22 2021 No.28836295 >>28836107 Keep most of your portfolio in a Trezor wallet, every coin that is compatible.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:04:15 2021 No.28836391 >>28836187 cool bro all the best

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:04:46 2021 No.28836424 This coin is too good for /biz/tards to understand. 90% wont even look at these threads, but then its gonna pop off and they will be left wondering why they dint buy. Literally the comfiest hold.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:05:18 2021 No.28836454 >>28836292 When Monero is banned but other coins are not, it will expose the surveillance aims of state actors.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:05:34 2021 No.28836478 >>28836292 Drugs are also illegal.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:05:52 2021 No.28836495 How do you buy XMR? In Australia, shit's banned.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:09:00 2021 No.28836662 >>28836495 what? I bought xmr on bittrex, i didn't even know it was banned

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:09:07 2021 No.28836667 >>28836292 The fact that governments are afraid of it secures its legitimacy as a privacy coin.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:09:14 2021 No.28836674 >>28836391 thanks you too man have a great night <3 >>28836285 it depends on the dex you're using I guess and the time of day I would recommend late afternoon EST, sorry I can't help you that much,

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:09:29 2021 No.28836688 >>28836662 How do you store it?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:10:16 2021 No.28836742 >>28836495 Acquire some Bitcoin and exchange it using xchange.me [has an onion] changenow.io elude.in

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:10:40 2021 No.28836772 >>28836688 i kept it on the exchange for a few months then sold it

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:11:18 2021 No.28836803 File: 21 KB, 600x600, trezor_T.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28836688 Download the Monero GUI, create a new wallet with your Trezor, and transfer all of your XMR to that wallet address.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:11:56 2021 No.28836845 File: 889 KB, 300x300, havenlilly.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Haven is Monero 2.0 DYOR but buy in before we hit $20

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:12:09 2021 No.28836857

>>28835635
Monero is long-term inflationary, but only to such an extent as needed to sustain the health of the network via mining rewards. Longterm the tail emissions are something like 1-2% per annum max.

Meanwhile it's not clear what will happen in very far future when the last bitcoin is mined. Many people think tx fees will not be enough to sustain miners. If miners all leave and hash rate tanks, bitcoin becomes vulnerable to 51% attacks.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:13:06 2021 No.28836916 >>28836845 Is it tho? Is it really?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:13:56 2021 No.28836969 >>28836803 No such thing as paper storage for Monero?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:17:36 2021 No.28837173 >>28836845 "funded by a 5% block reward" fuck off patel

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:17:43 2021 No.28837182 >>28836292 Monero is not illegal in any nation on the planet, nor is it being banned.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:18:19 2021 No.28837220 >>28834864 Monero is an overpriced fork of Bytecoin. If you're paying over .0006usd for XMR you got scammed. I sold my Monero for 0xMonero and I 8x'd already.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:19:30 2021 No.28837278

>>28837220
nope. 0xmonero is still vaporware bullshit
just like the last hundred times you spammed it
stop trying to steal from people by lying to them about the capabilities of the project
https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoMoonShots/comments/i27fhk/0xmonero_summary_of_findings/
>>/biz/thread/S24750658#p24755504
another recent beatdown >>/biz/thread/S28670476

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:20:28 2021 No.28837323 >>28836845 fuck off scam code fork pajeet shitcoin, your almost as annoying as those 0xmr fags

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:21:45 2021 No.28837375 >>28837220 lol, imagine claiming xmr's tiny fees are bad while promoting a shitcoin that resides inside Ethereum and has the fees of it too

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:23:24 2021 No.28837461

>>28836285
when i try to estimate fees on say uniswap or exodus, i try the swap or send to see what the fee will be. if you try to initiate the swap or send there will be information windows or information in the windows that show fees. also remember fees can literally change by the minute so recheck often. i see it go from 50 bucks to 29 within a few min

stop gambling on shit coins and buy xmr forever.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:25:16 2021 No.28837565 >>28836969 Paper storage? Just write your Monero seed on a piece of paper and then delete the wallet from your computer if you want to do that. I prefer using a Trezor because it's one seed phrase for all of my various cryptocurrencies, including XMR.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:26:56 2021 No.28837666

>>28836424
true chads be in xmr. ive seen many 99% xmr folios here, makes me happy im not the only one. we literally get a second chance at btc. its amazing. maximum comfy reguardless of price. dumb, comfy and buy more. pump, comfy and buy more. you cant lose rn.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:28:05 2021 No.28837729 >>28836495 >>28836495 i onramp fiat on uphold which i think is based in london, so eu. then i send whatever to hotbit, which i think is based in china. then i buy xmr and send to my wallet. win.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:28:53 2021 No.28837779

>>28836674

Thanks, not sure I even really need a dex - (ie uniswap / kyber etc...), do I?

To date I've done most of my "hot wallet" trading shit with Edge (edge.app - formerly airbitz) mainly because I found it as the only Monero friendly (and suggested on main page) Android multiwallet that can buy, sell, and do exchanges using a bunch of built in (changeally etc) tech. The problem is after successfully doing that with cold wallet XMR > Edge wallet DOGE profits into > Edge wallet USDT I'm now fucking stuck.

Essentially, Edge wallet doesn't tell you how much something will cost, it only tells you it doesn't have enough ETH - but it must know somehow what "enough" is. However, not in Edge nor even on sites like - https://www.ethgasstation.info/ - does it tell you how many UNITS are needed. It can tell me right now its a safe bet that a normal amount is 103 GWEI per unit (to get it in 5 min according to blocks handling shit), but not how many UNITS are necessary in total. So how can you calculate this?

This shitheap experience has been enough that I don't think I ever want to touch ETH or ERC20 ever again because I've never run into this kind of garbage before. Transaction fees on everything else are taken out on sane blockchains in the currency used for the transaction at hand.

>>28837461

Shit, I'm not sure how to do that at least where I have the funds in the Edge wallet because it basically wont show anything except "insufficient funds" and then give me the option to use its built in shit to buy ETH (Wyre, credit card shit etc) if I wish or exchange something else to ETCH etc. Since its in that particular wallet getting it anywhere else means another address.

So it sounds like that, no matter how much USD equivalent ETH or Token, its possible that $30-50 bucks for gas is the fucking norm to move /exchange it?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:30:17 2021 No.28837851 >>28836803 i has question, i do the same, gui and trezor. is there a safer way to do it? other than a paper wallet? jw. ty

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:31:19 2021 No.28837916 >>28836969 https://www.monero.how/monero-paper-wallet-offline-cold-storage

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:34:45 2021 No.28838083

>>28837779
>
gas fee can range from 14 bucks, pre bull run to 25-80+ depending on whether or not eth is seeing any price action. high congestion = fuck poor fags with outrageous gas fees. eth is broken in current state. anyone that says otherwise is living on copium. maybe itl be great in a few years, but something else is gonna replace it. prolly ada. but STOP GAMBLING IN SHIT COINS

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:35:04 2021 No.28838095 >>28836857 In the future it could be corporate/government secured.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:35:46 2021 No.28838133 >>28837779 oh, forgot, and to send is usually a few bucks, under 10 to just send eth or a erc20 shit coin.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:40:29 2021 No.28838366

>>28838083

I've got about 18 bucks of ETH at current (which the Edge wallets claims isn't enough) in there now so that's helpful. Ill dump in around 50 and wait to get my $300 worth of USDT (ERC20 tether shitcoins).

ETH seems completely fucking broken and even worse that ERC20 tokens don't pay the fees in their "native" value autmatically (which coincidentally would make it so that miners could accept or reject various coins and thus you couldn't get anyone to take your transaction for a useless ERC20 token's value etc) It seems like the ability to create ERC20 pump and dumps is like ETH's built in way to keep itself relevant as you always still need ETH to move around those shit tokens.

>>28838133

Not sure how that relates to the volume of coins involved or not, or value thereof. Or did you mean it varies greatly depending on the particular asset. Regardless though, like $10 bucks to send ETH from one wallet to another is crazy and $25-80 to get my fucking Tether out exchanged for something else is completely asinine.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:41:46 2021 No.28838438 >>28835635 4chan is literally retarded and doesn't understand basic mathematical principles

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:43:38 2021 No.28838550 >>28837779 i just assumed you were using a dex sorry

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:43:52 2021 No.28838560

>>28838366

Regardless though, thanks for your help. Fuck, it seems like everyone is freaking out around trying to pick and invest in the next DeFi ERC20 shit token that is going to MOON , but I can't see how ANY of those tokens can really store value or be useful if it takes $25-80 ETH each time you want to send or exchange them.

I'm just trying to find the cheapest way to get my $300 in Tether (in the edge wallet) the fuck off this crazy ride and back into Monero

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:43:53 2021 No.28838564 I only hold a little XMR to do you know what but I'm glad you holders are winning, one of the very few non shit altcoins

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:44:09 2021 No.28838574

>>28838366
like previously staed, eth is broken. for the poor fags with no eth trying to play with alt coins, you CANNOT HOLD ETH AT THE SAME TIME IN THE SAME WALLET because it will just melt away before your eyes. eth is not a store of value, its fucking utility token. i personally use eth SOLELY for gamblying. nothing else. any that i end up holding dissapears in fees in seconds. fk eth.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:45:01 2021 No.28838613 >>28834864 I love Monero but institutions (banks, governments) hate it, so it can never be the #1 coin. Its banned from most mainstream exchanges

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:45:38 2021 No.28838644 >>28836187 based xmr chad. imma buy some more rn just because of you

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:45:44 2021 No.28838650 >>28837182 But it is being delisted from many exchanges.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:45:49 2021 No.28838654 Are we talking 50x compared to btc?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:45:56 2021 No.28838663 >>28836857 long term, tail emissions will asymptotically approach 0%

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:46:41 2021 No.28838698 >>28836295 ledger is better from a security standpoint. Hopefully a dedicated xmr hardware wallet comes out soon

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:47:47 2021 No.28838751 >>28836857 this. Also tail emissions are very essential when taking into account the asic resistance

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:48:17 2021 No.28838771 >>28836495 Kraken -> LTC <CAKEWALLET> XMR

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:48:33 2021 No.28838784 >>28838698 remember that time ledger leaked everyone's addresses? i member

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:48:49 2021 No.28838803 >>28838650 Good. I don't want to see XMR on exchanges.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:49:18 2021 No.28838831

>>28838560
reality check bruh. 99% of everything shilled here is garbage. vaporware. 99% speculation. even BTC is an absolutely monsterous bubble with sadly no real use case. btc is dinosaur tech and not used as it was inteed to be used. btc is not money. btc is this weird bloated thing. xmr , now thats money. and if we compare btc, should be money, with xmr, is real fking currency, then the winner is clear.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:50:29 2021 No.28838903 >>28838698 trezor vs ledger is basically open source vs secure enclave. both have their potential advantages.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:50:46 2021 No.28838924 >>28838613 fud and bs. its listed on binance and kraken. 2 HUGE exchanges

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:51:47 2021 No.28838972 >>28838650 1 FKING EXCHANGE. with next to 0 volume. but im not mad, i bought in at the prices right after delisting. im thankful for the discount

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:51:57 2021 No.28838983 Current use case is what, buying shit on the dark web and ransomware payments? #bullish

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 00:52:48 2021 No.28839034 >>28838784 same. i dont member trezor having that problem

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:01:59 2021 No.28839492 >>28838983 Since literally all other cryptocurrencies have literally zero usecases, this seems like a win to me.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:03:30 2021 No.28839566

>>28838983
unironically this. black markets have the most urgent need right now for a functional digital currency, and so the coin that emerges from that has selection pressure to be the coin which functions the best as actual currency. the darknet is a vanguard which heralds the future.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:03:54 2021 No.28839581

>>28838784
>>28839034
yea that is shit, but from a hardware standpoint the ledger is just hands down the better of the two. You need a secure element in a hardware wallet, full stop.
Also if you really care about privacy you would have bought a ledger under a pseudonym to a po box anyways.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:04:42 2021 No.28839613 File: 1.20 MB, 1149x912, TrinityQR.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:04:54 2021 No.28839623 This thread is filled with an unknown amount of newfags

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:05:18 2021 No.28839637 >>28838983 imagine fudding the only private chain to have 100% success because you cant wrap your head around not wanting the whole world to know your net worth

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:05:42 2021 No.28839650

>>28838650
Delisted from the most irrelevant 2017-era dinosaur exchange with zero volume. Ratio tanked as people were expecting other exchanges to follow suit since we'd just gone through the domino effect of XRP delistings. It never happened though and the price still to this day reflects an overreaction by the market to a doomsday scenario that never came to pass.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:12:12 2021 No.28839975

>>28836292
Look when government regulates it its best time to buy in. Didnt this happen with bitcoin people were hesitant cause stupid gov people dont understnad just ban shit cuz muh drugs. THEN BOOM TECH AND MATH ALWAYS WIN ALWAYS in the end. Literally BTC pattern about to happen in 10 years once the coin says fuckall to regulation. Screenshot this now.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:16:12 2021 No.28840178 >>28839650 Suppose Kraken delists XMR tomorrow. Can I still move my XMR out to my wallet?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:20:45 2021 No.28840383 >>28840178 cex delistings give you like 30 days to move your shit or have it locke forever

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:22:42 2021 No.28840471
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>>28836105
>You should always be 50% in bitcoin.
I was 75/25 on XMR/BTC but with the recent bull from bitcoin I'm 40/60 now. I guess I'm doing it right then.

>>28836285
>The sad downside is that unlike ETH its not a platform that is basically designed to have other platforms built upon it in a giant fucking grift
If that's your thing then just wait for Tari.

>>28836292
Wrong.

>>28836688
>>28836803
>>28837851
Seed is stored on Password Manager, requiring to input an extra password even if the software is open <- that's last case scenario, I don't intend to use my seed ever.
I have a USB stick with a Live Ubuntu and I have all my cold wallets there, inside an encrypted partition using VeraCrypt, so even if someone robs the thing they won't be able to see what's inside. I've made 4 clones of this USB stick and placed them in secure places (parent's home, office, bank deposit box) so I have multiple backups in case of a fucking catastrophe.
I know that it sounds more complicated than using a Ledger or Trezor, but I like being able to have multiple options without needing to buy multiple devices.

>>28837220
>>28836845
>1 post by this ID

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:22:58 2021 No.28840482 >>28836292 Just wait for atomic swaps my nigga

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:24:18 2021 No.28840541 >>28835507 Only problem with this plan is the possibility of missing some of the Monero's pump.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:31:07 2021 No.28840835 >>28840482 Who sets the exchange rate in an atomic swap? Is it auction/bid-style?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:34:20 2021 No.28840979
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>>28838831
>even BTC is an absolutely monsterous bubble with sadly no real use case. btc is dinosaur tech and not used as it was inteed to be used. btc is not money.
While I agree that Bitcoin is not money and that it's not being used as it was intended to be used, I do not believe it is possible to disregard the human capacity to assign value synthetically. Bitcoin is now abstract and has become a part of digital history. It is like real estate and has as its function something similar to flaunting gold jewellery. That's one of the main reasons Bitcoin has and will keep having value. I just am incapable to tell how much.

>>28840835
Is it auction/bid-style?
Yes. In an ideal scenario we would have 2 or 3 services that would act as intermediaries to host bids and asks and allow parties to find counterparties. Who sets the price is the market.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:38:03 2021 No.28841150
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>>28835818
>Agreed, the tail emission of Monero is something that negatively affects its status as a SoV

Gold is continuously being dug out of the ground, guess that makes it a shitty SoV.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:43:26 2021 No.28841426
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>>28840835
>Who sets the exchange rate in an atomic swap? Is it auction/bid-style?
I recall seeing a proposal where the finalized swap ratio i.e. the price is broadcast to a sidechain and then the average of all recent swaps is presented as the current market price.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:44:53 2021 No.28841495 >>28841150 Ayoooo

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:47:30 2021 No.28841618 >>28835818 SoV ≠ Fixed supply. Its inflation moved towards 0 which makes it a SoV. Maybe you shouldn't have been playing on your phone in math class retard

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:49:40 2021 No.28841721 >>28834864 Find. I'll buy 1k worth cuz I like the memes

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:51:52 2021 No.28841819
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>>28841426
>I recall seeing a proposal where the finalized swap ratio i.e. the price is broadcast to a sidechain and then the average of all recent swaps is presented as the current market price.
That's cool. I guess it would be useful once it gets a high volume so parties can trust the presented price.

Feels good to sleep every night with my head over a triple digit bag of monero. Fuck the feds.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:52:05 2021 No.28841827 File: 285 KB, 620x375, monigga.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28841721 >Find. I'll buy 1k worth cuz I like the memes

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:53:41 2021 No.28841893 >>28840979 >Yes. In an ideal scenario we would have 2 or 3 services that would act as intermediaries to host bids and asks and allow parties to find counterparties. Who sets the price is the market. I fucking love this

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 01:56:48 2021 No.28842026 >>28836292 Who gives a fuck what the government thinks? Darknet markets buy and sell in monero.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:02:19 2021 No.28842229
File: 139 KB, 747x788, 45349734945907.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Friendly reminder that Monero is poised to become the reserve cryptocurrency of the global shadow economy and is currently replacing BTC on the darknet while also making inroads into the cyber-crime and money laundering sectors.

>Bitcoin Will Never Be Truly Private Says Andreas Antonopoulos
https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-will-never-be-truly-private-says-andreas-antonopoulos

>Bitcoin is too hot for criminals. They're using Monero instead
https://money.cnn.com/2018/01/03/technology/bitcoin-popularity-criminals-monero/index.html

>Crooks opt for Monero as crypto of choice to launder ill-gotten gains
https://www.theregister.com/2018/03/16/cyber_crime_economics/

>Darknet Giant White House Market Drops Bitcoin, Supports Monero Payments Only
https://news.bitcoin.com/darknet-giant-white-house-market-drops-bitcoin-supports-monero-payments-only/

>Monero replaces Bitcoin for Sodinokibi Ransomware operators
https://www.cybersecurity-insiders.com/monero-replaces-bitcoin-for-sodinokibi-ransomware-operators/

>$7.5M in Monero Demanded in Alleged Cyber Attack on Argentinian Telecom Giant
https://www.financemagnates.com/cryptocurrency/news/7-5m-in-monero-demanded-in-alleged-cyber-attack-on-argentinian-telecom-giant/

>Latin American crime cartels turn to cryptocurrencies for money laundering
https://www.reuters.com/article/mexico-bitcoin-insight-idUSKBN28I1KD

>Criminals laundered $2.8 billion in 2019 using crypto exchanges, finds a new analysis
https://www.technologyreview.com/2020/01/16/130843/cryptocurrency-money-laundering-exchanges/

>Why untraceable cryptocurrencies are here to stay
https://www.cbs.dk/en/the-press/news/why-untraceable-cryptocurrencies-are-here-to-stay

Considering that the global shadow economy is valued in the TRILLIONS of dollars, even if just a portion of that ends up in Monero's market cap that is still HUNDREDS of billions of dollars. 5 figure XMR is inevitable.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:03:21 2021 No.28842264 >>28834864 Got my 18 XMR Suicide stack

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:17:06 2021 No.28842784 >POW sigh

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:32:12 2021 No.28843419
File: 223 KB, 550x550, 1595915352880.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28842784
A common mistake energy detractors make is to naively extrapolate PoW’s energy consumption to the equivalent CO2 emissions. What matters is the type of energy source being used to generate electricity, as they are not homogeneous from a carbon footprint perspective. The academic efforts that get breathlessly reported in the press tend to assume either an energy mix which is invariant at the global or country level. Both Mora et al and Krause and Tolaymat generated flashy headlines for their calculations of PoW’s footprint, but rely on naive extrapolations of energy consumption to CO2 emissions.
Even though lots of bitcoin and monero are mined in China, it’s not appropriate to map China’s generic CO2 footprint to crypto mining. PoW seeks out otherwise-curtailed energy, like hydropower in Sichuan, which is relatively green. Any reliable estimate must take this into account.
Now, despite all the caveats listed above, it’s undeniable that PoW not only consumes a lot of energy but produces externalizations in the form of CO2 emissions. This is not under debate. What proponents of PoW are often confronted about is whether monero and bitcoin have a legitimate claim on any of society’s resources. This question relies on a kind of utilitarian logic about which industries should be entitled to consume energy. In practice, no one actually reasons like this. The PoW-energy supplicants are mum when it comes to the energy used to illuminate Christmas lights, to power the data centers behind Netflix or to distribute untold millions of single-serve meal kits. It’s clear that because PoW’s footprint is so easy to quantify — and an object of revulsion among the chattering classes — it is singled out for special treatment.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:32:17 2021 No.28843425 >>28842784 There's nothing inherently wrong with POW since somebody has to upkeep the network.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:53:05 2021 No.28844198 File: 300 KB, 1280x933, 1605629074009.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] bump

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:56:23 2021 No.28844321 >>28835397 >Later this year we will have atomic swaps and exchanges won't even be relevant anymore. can you explain atomic swaps to me is it like morphtoken on cake wallet?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 02:58:15 2021 No.28844394

>>28835635
you do know inflation is good for a thriving economy right? fixed supply and deflation is very bad for economic growth. The dude who figured out 2% inflation is optimal won some kind of nobel prize ffs

when everyone hoards theres no growth. money in meant to be spent

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:00:13 2021 No.28844448 >>28834864 i hate monero cause I sold all of mine at $1 now I want to die everytime I see it's stupid logo

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:11:26 2021 No.28844888

Why do monerofags want their coin to moon?

The coin has genuine use-case. It mooning will bring over the moonfags who speculate on it.

Fuck that noise. I'm happy with stable appreciation, and no dips, and therefore no moons. I want a privacy coin that can hold my wealth.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:12:17 2021 No.28844929 >>28844198 LOOK AT THE SHITTERS ON THOSE CRITTERS

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:14:45 2021 No.28845021 >>28835635 Someone take this retard out back, clearly the cancer has spread.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:17:12 2021 No.28845123 Fuck off greedy Jews Don't buy monero if you ever plan on selling it for profit.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:19:21 2021 No.28845211 >>28844888 I don't want it to ever moon >t. 70% of my savings are in XMR Its philosophy matters to me more than irrelevant cash

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:22:17 2021 No.28845321 >>28845211 same. i genuinely like the coin. If it moons, I'm leaving it, after collecting my gains. i dont want a speculative coin. I want a stable privacy coin that doesnt crash.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:30:04 2021 No.28845620 god the gui wallet is a dumpster fire

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:32:43 2021 No.28845729 File: 1.41 MB, 2325x1679, 1613098376710.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28834864 STOP I'M STILL ACOOMULATING

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:33:18 2021 No.28845761
File: 37 KB, 200x200, Carl.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28844198
>>28844929
>imagine laying down on a hospital gurney
>def leppard starts playing
>one of them grabs the gurney and pushes you by all these brappers
>you lean out and let your face just slide and bump along the whole line, then she pulls back for another pass
>and you go back and forth faster, like your face is a pick and their buns are the strings on a badass electric guitar
but THEN
>then all lay face down
>booty cheeks SMOTHERED in oil
>metal cranked up to 11
>you dive in and crawl back and forth across them like you're trying to survive a live fire exercise

Hot DAMN

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:35:39 2021 No.28845849 File: 8 KB, 180x180, 1613042556950.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28845761

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:36:47 2021 No.28845897 >>28835175 >disclosing how much xmr you have ngmi newfriend

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:37:24 2021 No.28845915 >>28837220 Go home Pajeet. Your cows need milking.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:38:08 2021 No.28845949 Everyone always has great things to say about this coin yet the price doesn't really reflect that. Ratio has been shredded past 3 months, recovered a bit last week. Why won't this shit moon?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:39:07 2021 No.28845989 File: 251 KB, 452x417, 1514460685216.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28837220

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:39:42 2021 No.28846017 File: 79 KB, 1024x634, 1612267466205.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] How can I buy XMR with GBP?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:39:44 2021 No.28846021 >>28834864 2017 Bagholder cope thread

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:41:15 2021 No.28846078 >>28836292 how new are you

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:41:29 2021 No.28846086 >>28834864 XMR is an overpriced fork of Bytecoin, 0xMR is the next 50x.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:44:00 2021 No.28846181 >>28846017 You can buy it directly on Kraken with a bank card.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:44:42 2021 No.28846204
File: 15 KB, 627x352, 4894098.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28845949
>Everyone always has great things to say about this coin yet the price doesn't really reflect that.

What part of "irrational market fueled by speculative hype" confuses you?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:47:10 2021 No.28846292 >>28845949 >30 dollars a year ago wtf

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:48:50 2021 No.28846344 >>28846181 Thank you. I'm going to go wild and buy £50 right now. (Sounds like a joke, but that's actually a lot).

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:52:18 2021 No.28846486 >>28846344 Everyone starts somewhere. You won't regret it!

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:57:44 2021 No.28846675

i've been holding xmr since 2017. once i found out about it all the other crypto projects didn't really excite me compared to this. once i understood that monero is a tool of freedom and in use today for that purpose, it was all i was focused on in the crypto space. not like i have much but i've been still buying coins.

>>28834864
while your number are possible, i think the probability of things going that high are not high in the near term. but way more likely during the next cycle.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 03:58:12 2021 No.28846690 >>28846344 These £50 will be some day £50000

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:02:09 2021 No.28846847 File: 220 KB, 750x1283, 64A4F41F-2F17-4DB4-98C0-1BC6A32BFA33.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28836083 Brother

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:05:02 2021 No.28846970 File: 41 KB, 680x506, 1613400910424.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28846847

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:11:09 2021 No.28847233 Bros once you make it how will you use your XMR to be financially free, as in passive incomes etc? Holding a {redacted} stack

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:19:49 2021 No.28847589

>>28844888
>>28845211
I want it to appreciate. Especially as the USD fiat money supply is increasing. Monero is one tool to not have the value of our assets tank as the dollar devalues. So the USD price should increase at a reasonable rate over time. Just like buying gold or silver, except I can send Monero online.

On the flip side I understand that the community is great and a "moon" would attract speculators that don't really understand the value here and the community could suffer.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:22:10 2021 No.28847681 >>28843419 wow, that's a great explanation - thanks

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:22:57 2021 No.28847711 >>28847233 my monero stack will grant me freedom when I need it the most. Might swing some of it into property or blue chip stocks, but will continue to hold most of it and pay living expenses from a regular job

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:23:23 2021 No.28847726 >>28846344 Good timing. Just don't sell till 2024.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:29:38 2021 No.28847965 >>28836292 extremely bullish

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:34:21 2021 No.28848136 >How do I buy??? Get a ryzen and start mining

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:39:23 2021 No.28848319 >>28834864 How can I change my shitcoins into XMR without KYC? I have ~10k on my ledger x Sorry I'm Brittish

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:43:30 2021 No.28848456 >>28834864 I truly think that privacy coins will get the ax in this new administration.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:52:07 2021 No.28848804 File: 15 KB, 300x282, xphcpxj2st861.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28848456 >I truly think that privacy coins will get the ax in this new administration. Yeah? What does that entail exactly?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:54:10 2021 No.28848889 >>28848456 wouldn't it be better for gov to have XMR in the centralized exchages so they would at least have some visibility into it? but the boomers in charge probably don't get it

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:54:49 2021 No.28848923 >>28848456 That won't have much of an effect.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:55:48 2021 No.28848957 my goal is to get 100 xmr, almost half way there, although i am poor so it will take time..

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:56:30 2021 No.28848979 File: 41 KB, 413x395, 083.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28848923 >That won't have much of an effect. I'll start to worry when they win the war on P2P piracy.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:57:03 2021 No.28849002

Please don't talk about Monero. We don't need to convince shitcoin holders because the hackers, pedophiles and drug users will keep buying or forcing people to buy Monero anyway so the price will increase without shitcoin faggots jumping in.

It also keeps the price low for us so we can accumulate over the next couple of years.

What you are supposed to do is have a share of your assets in shitcoins and re-invest the pumps into XMR as your retirement fund.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 04:59:12 2021 No.28849069
File: 354 KB, 1270x1352, satis-group-privacy-coins-.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28848957
>my goal is to get 100 xmr, almost half way there, although i am poor so it will take time..

Don't sweat it, 50 XMR could well be worth $2 million by decade's end.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:01:37 2021 No.28849153 File: 618 KB, 1568x799, bitcoin-2012-2021-coin.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28834864 >Monero does literally everything bitcoin does lol no. but Monero, Litecoin, Namecoin are somewhat ok. put 0-20% to them (80% to Bitcoin).

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:02:25 2021 No.28849191 >>28847233 funding armed insurrection me and my bros all dig insurrection

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:03:46 2021 No.28849246 >>28849069 Wasn't this published like a few years ago?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:07:21 2021 No.28849381

>>28835175
You know that 4chan is unencrypted cleartext that the US government monitors right? You just exposed to the 3 character institutions how much XMR you own and it's permanently recorded to your IP address and can be linked back to you in the future.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:08:37 2021 No.28849426
File: 1.53 MB, 1150x4384, monero-is-the-future.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28849153
>lol no.

haha, while y'all maxipads are jerking yourselves off about NUMBER GO UP Monero has been consistently kicking Bitcoin's ass where fundamentals matter.

No privacy = no future.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:09:50 2021 No.28849473 >>28849381 he will simply lose them in a boating accident

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:10:40 2021 No.28849513 >>28835507 XMR is the only crypto currency that is actually fungible, and will likely exist decades from now and still in real world use. It's unironically the only solid long term hold coin.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:10:57 2021 No.28849522
File: 107 KB, 1159x644, 89238942.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28849246
>Wasn't this published like a few years ago?

2018.

Irrational market = tentative timelines. But their core estimation i.e. that criminal adoption and black money influxes will drive future XMR growth is pretty much spot on.

In other words, less likely to be accurate in the short-term, more likely to be accurate in the long-term.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:11:46 2021 No.28849551 >>28835635 >>28835818 Don't listen to the replies, listen to your gut feeling and sell your XMR, preferably to me.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:12:34 2021 No.28849579

>>28849426
>haha, while y'all maxipads are jerking yourselves off about NUMBER GO UP Monero has been consistently kicking Bitcoin's ass where fundamentals matter.

BTC is the most conservative, most carefully devloped.
It is ASIC PoW (need to dedicate to it).
Has LN.

Most recognized.

>No privacy = no future.

BTC has coinjoin now, and coinjoin+bullet proofs in future.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:13:47 2021 No.28849637 >>28836292 Yes, you better sell it to me just to be save. (not even kidding hook me up if you want to sell your Monero, I'm on localmonero and will pay in euro)

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:13:55 2021 No.28849640 >>28834864 Hedgies will use XMR to wash their dirty money as soon as the fed pump tapers off. 20x imminent.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:15:07 2021 No.28849688 >>28838654 He's talking about 50x in BTC amount. So the rise in USD might be even higher.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:16:27 2021 No.28849733

>>28844888
Yeah I hate that people here want to make it moon. The valuation is growing organically because it's actually being bought to be used. People here should just buy it and shut the fuck up except for explaining how the coin works and how you can buy shit with it (dark.fail).

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:17:22 2021 No.28849775
File: 241 KB, 752x499, 8hdigz7uq8261.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28849579
>BTC is the most conservative, most carefully devloped.
>It is ASIC PoW (need to dedicate to it).
>Has LN.
>
>Most recognized.

So why is it getting replaced by Monero where fundamentals matter?

>BTC has coinjoin now, and coinjoin+bullet proofs in future.

Unfortunately, its not going to be enough:

>Bitcoin Will Never Be Truly Private Says Andreas Antonopoulos

In a livestream Q&A on Antonopoulos’ YouTube channel on July 7, he said Bitcoin (BTC) was unlikely to ever implement privacy features similar to those used by Monero (XMR).

Antonopoulos said creating such features on a cryptocurrency like BTC “would create an enormous amount of controversy.” In addition, he said the structure of Bitcoin simply doesn’t allow ring signatures and stealth addresses.

“I think what we’re going to see soon is Schnorr, Taproot, and Tapscript, which open the door to a lot of improvements,” Antonopoulos said, “But they still do not involve zero-knowledge proofs or the types of ring signatures and stealth addresses that are done in Monero. Bitcoin is not a privacy coin.”

Bitcoin can be better thought of as pseudonymous rather than fully anonymous, as many transactions on the BTC blockchain can still be traced even with these privacy improvements.

>https://cointelegraph.com/news/bitcoin-will-never-be-truly-private-says-andreas-antonopoulos

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:17:29 2021 No.28849778 >>28845949 I hope it never moons, go speculate on other coins.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:18:51 2021 No.28849832 Another thought. Doesn't this instantly go to 0 if ring signatures are cracked? Will glowies be able to back trace through the blockchain given that some autist figures the decryption algorithm out?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:21:34 2021 No.28849940

>>28849775
>So why is it getting replaced by Monero where fundamentals matter?

isn't

>>BTC has coinjoin now, and coinjoin+bullet proofs in future.
>Unfortunately, its not going to be enough:

it gives good privacy.

>>Bitcoin Will Never Be Truly Private Says Andreas Antonopoulos
>In a livestream Q&A on Antonopoulos’ YouTube channel on July 7, he said Bitcoin (BTC) was unlikely to ever implement privacy features similar to those used by Monero (XMR).

well he's wrong then.

>Antonopoulos said creating such features on a cryptocurrency like BTC “would create an enormous amount of controversy.” In addition, he said the structure of Bitcoin simply doesn’t allow ring signatures and stealth addresses.

doesn't now, bullet proofs are planned in future

>“I think what we’re going to see soon is Schnorr, Taproot, and Tapscript, which open the door to a lot of improvements,” Antonopoulos said, “But they still do not involve zero-knowledge proofs or the types of ring signatures and stealth addresses that are done in Monero. Bitcoin is not a privacy coin.”

yeah, bulletproofs.

>Bitcoin can be better thought of as pseudonymous rather than fully anonymous, as many transactions on the BTC blockchain can still be traced even with these privacy improvements.

no, coinjoin with equal amounts is as private RIGHT NOW.

> picrel

there are wallets that make this automatic: wasabi wallet is quite ok.

It is good that BTC by default is not private and it takes a bit of work to turn it on - XMR is being delisted and such, BTC is not. Yes it sucks XMR is delisted and in my world (ancap) govs would fuck off from that, but currently it might be the better strategy.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:22:08 2021 No.28849976

Just wanted to let you guys know that I actually read through the entire "zero to monero" book: https://www.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf

Ask any technical question you have.

One thing I didn't realize but reading the book made me realize is that Even the people active in the transaction can't 100% reasonably be sure who they send their XMR to or who they received it from only that it was send and was received.

This means even if you have a KYC account on an exchange, buy XMR and transfer it to your local wallet the KYC doesn't know your local wallet address and the government can't pin that wallet to you. I didn't know this beforehand but it basically means you are save by buying on a KYC as long as you justify to the government that you transfered it to a wallet and lost it or spend it or something.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:22:17 2021 No.28849982 >>28849522 idk man I thought the price would at least be double of what it is now, such a slow mover.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:23:01 2021 No.28850014

>>28849832
>Another thought. Doesn't this instantly go to 0 if ring signatures are cracked? Will glowies be able to back trace through the blockchain given that some autist figures the decryption algorithm out?

That is another problem with most of ZK currencies, in case of QC being usable, you can do more sinister things AFAIR, like *silent inflation*. That's even worse then just stealing it (which would allert everyone and they would move away). Instead forever people pay into a coin, and they don't realize there is like x100 more coins on the market that there should be.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:23:17 2021 No.28850024 >>28849381 Just donate it to only fans lmao

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:24:17 2021 No.28850071 >>28839650 %99 of people are dumb

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:26:15 2021 No.28850151 >>28847233 I like dividend stocks. Ford, Yum!, etc. I'm pretty conservative which fits for someone 100% on XMR.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:26:22 2021 No.28850153 >>28849976 This is exactly why even touching XMR is going to end up being illegal as fuck.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:28:22 2021 No.28850232

>>28849832
>Doesn't this instantly go to 0 if ring signatures are cracked?
Nope. RingCT is just one layer of security on the Monero protocol. There are actually multiple layers of protection on it that all need to be cracked simultaneously to pin down the transactions to individual wallets.

They also have been audited by three mathematic firms to ensure that they aren't crackable from a mathematical standpoint.

Basically the government needs to invent new mathematics if they want to actually crack the RingCT system. It might be possible with future quantum computing.

But the Monero community have already confirmed that once they see that quantum computing starts becoming a threat in the short term future (within 10 years) that they will look at making a quantum proof version of whatever privacy mechanisms are implemented by then.

The fact that Monero changed their PoW mining algorithm 4 times to kill ASICs make me believe in their commitment to update the protocol to always adapt to new situations. That is honestly the biggest aspect of Monero.

Monero also has the most active github and research community out of all cryptocurrencies. Mainly because it appeals to cypherpunks and /g/tier privacy advocates which tend to be computer literate and cryptographically literate. This community is why Monero will prevail. Not the actual coin itself like it is right now.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:28:23 2021 No.28850233 >>28850153 then fuck off normie

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:29:42 2021 No.28850288 File: 77 KB, 657x631, XMRCOMFY.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:31:53 2021 No.28850379

>>28850153
Honestly yes I believe that is a high probability. The real question you need to ask however is if that is a bad thing or even technically possible for the government to pull off.

Monero is already the ONLY cryptocurrency that has a bounty on it to crack it from the US government. It started at 300K then it became 600K it's now at 1.2Million and the government is looking to increase it to 20 Million. Seeing the government lose its shit trying to crack it is an advertisement to how secure and private it actually is.

By the way, it's not actually going to be cracked because the person able to crack Monero would also be able to crack all other encryption so he could just crack all government emails from all governments, all bank acounts in the world. Why bother for 20 million USD at that point.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:32:17 2021 No.28850398

>>28850232
>It might be possible with future quantum computing.
They better hurry up, the "research possible quantum attacks" proposal was funded sometime last year.

>The fact that Monero changed their PoW mining algorithm 4 times to kill ASICs make me believe in their commitment to update the protocol to always adapt to new situations.
agree, it's an undervalued aspect

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:32:56 2021 No.28850426 I might as well buy stocks than Montero,it is comfy but at the cost of boomer gains

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:33:37 2021 No.28850451

>>28850232
>But the Monero community have already confirmed that once they see that quantum computing starts becoming a threat in the short term future (within 10 years) that they will look at making a quantum proof version of whatever privacy mechanisms are implemented by then.

There is no post-QC version of ZK, so they can use CoinJoin - the same as Bitcoin uses right now.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:35:12 2021 No.28850506 [DELETED]

File: 293 KB, 724x528, IMG_20200805_232102.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>had two years to accumulate
>only buying in now with a meagre 2k because that's all I have left
I know it's going to break ath this year and I feel sick
how do I rid myself of this shame?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:35:15 2021 No.28850509

>>28850426
Yeah the most reasonable strategy is to not buy XMR to speculate. Or at least have it as only a part of your portfolio. It's supposed to be your retirement fund not your growth fund. It's like cashing out of crypto and buying silver.

Speculate on other coins and invest the winnings into XMR for the long term. You shouldn't sell your XMR for at least 10 years time. Again it's your retirement fund.

Also please for the love of god transfer your funds to a private wallet.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:35:17 2021 No.28850512 >>28850379 Ultimate enforcement may end up being impossible but they can ensure it is banned on every known exchange. You’ll only be able to buy it through vpn/tor/whatever or locally or through the mail.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:36:47 2021 No.28850572

>>28834864
Monero's decoy system for privacy is dumb as fuck. It revolves around the idea of plausible deniability. It wouldn't be total trash if it existed in a vacuum but guess what? prosecutors can and do correlate circumstantial evidence (i.e side-channels), same for an attacker, or the taxman. Monero is a cute crypto and I like the community more than Zcash's but its privacy guarantees are also much weaker than ZEC and its rejection of ASIC mining makes it a meme-coin compared to BTC.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:37:09 2021 No.28850590
File: 196 KB, 800x600, meanwhile-on-the-darknet.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28849940
>isn't

https://i.4cdn.org/biz/1613470117387.png
>it gives good privacy.

Apparently not good enough as far as the darknet and blackhat crowd are concerned.

And if you're in any doubt about that pop over to r/darknet, search for "Bitcoin" and witness just how much Bitcoin is openly disliked and distrusted by people who have a vested interest in using the most reliable crypto.
>well he's wrong then.

Bitcoin Expert Andreas Antonopoulos is wrong about Bitcoin
>doesn't now, bullet proofs are planned in future
>yeah, bulletproofs

Yeah, better BTC privacy is always COMING SOON. Meantime, Monero's God-tier privacy works RIGHT NOW.

>no, coinjoin with equal amounts is as private RIGHT NOW.

CoinJoin isn't reliably private and has been cracked by Chainalysis:

>Many of those transactions were conducted through mixers like Wasabi Wallet, which utilizes the CoinJoin protocol to make it more difficult to trace the path of funds. You can see an example in the Chainalysis Reactor graph below.

https://blog.chainalysis.com/reports/plustoken-scam-bitcoin-price

What you fail to understand is that optional privacy bolted on top of a fundamentally transparent public ledger can NEVER be as reliable and airtight as default full-spectrum privacy built from the ground up.

If your freedom depends on it, you'll use Monero. Just to be sure.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:37:55 2021 No.28850617

>>28850451
Monero has already implemented an improved version of "CoinJoin" it's called the RingCT protocol. Basically every transaction already gets automixed with 11 different accounts. They also generate one-time wallet addresses for every transaction. So those 11 different accounts all generate another 11 different accounts before funds hit your actual wallet address.

This is to prevent the government from mapping out the blockchain like what has happened to Bitcoin.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:39:16 2021 No.28850669 >>28850506 Treat it as a retirement fund you're going to hold for 10 years and you'll be okay. 2K is like 10 XMR right? You'll be okay. /biz/ will call you a larper in 2025 when you say you own 1 whole XMR.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:41:10 2021 No.28850737

>>28850398
> "research possible quantum attacks" proposal
We already know of certain quantum resistant methods. However the cost of implementing them (longer transaction times, higher fees) isn't worth it until quantum attacks become a reasonable threat. The fact that the attacks themselves are still in a theoretical/mathematical phase is already telling enough. We have at least 20 years before it becomes a real threat. And if we're wrong and it becomes a threat next week. Monero can just scramble to implement the already known solution quickly.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:41:19 2021 No.28850748 >>28850572 this post reeks of rice

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:42:04 2021 No.28850783 >>28844198 I'll take the 2 on the left thanks, you guys can share the others.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:42:27 2021 No.28850798

>>28850512
>You’ll only be able to buy it through vpn/tor/whatever or locally or through the mail.
Read up on Atomic swaps. You can still trade it without tor/vpn because the government can never pin down the XMR to you as a person due to how the anonymized addresses work.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:44:59 2021 No.28850913

>>28850572
Please for the love of god actually read this. It will quell all your worries about Monero's privacy or heuristic attacks based on inference of known information.

Just to be clear, what you're suggesting here " prosecutors can and do correlate circumstantial evidence (i.e side-channels), same for an attacker, or the taxman." is mathematically impossible. https://www.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf

If you're just shilling for Zcash then ignore this post and I hope you continue to shill it so that Monero's valuation might drop a bit.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:46:14 2021 No.28850961 >>28834864 im all in with an undisclosed amount frens

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:46:31 2021 No.28850980

>>28850617
>Monero has already implemented an improved version of "CoinJoin" it's called the RingCT protocol. Basically every transaction already gets automixed with 11 different accounts. They also generate one-time wallet addresses for every transaction. So those 11 different accounts all generate another 11 different accounts before funds hit your actual wallet address.

CoinJoin itself solves all the problems - WHEN every participant of mix can use equal agreed on amount like 0.1 BTC or 0.01 BTC.

CoinJoin + some ZK allows to have any amounts in mix ins and outs - but the downside is that for most (including the one used in XMR?) QCs can create silent inflation which I consider to be the worst attack on coin, long term.

so really BTC's current method is not that bad. Not many people use it, so lower anonymity set, but on the upside the coin is not seen as "hax0r black coin" and is not blacklisted on many exchanges by pressure from stupid gov.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:49:47 2021 No.28851122 >>28834864 > thinking people actually look at the tech when they buy something LOL

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:54:34 2021 No.28851315 >not using FNT/FNC for ultimate flexibility NGMI

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:54:51 2021 No.28851331

>>28850980
The problem with BTC currently is that the blockchain has already been de-anonimized and mapped almost completely. And worst is that it means that retroactively all transactions are exposed.

This means that prosecutors can actually arrest people that bought drugs back in 2013 with BTC because it's basically a large public record of who did what.

The only thing CoinJoin swaps do for BTC is make it computationally more expensive to untangle what happens. Not impossible. Especially since they are vulnerable to heuristic attacks.

I honestly don't believe Bitcoin can ever be truly anonymous from an objective perspective.

>but on the upside the coin is not seen as "hax0r black coin" and is not blacklisted on many exchanges by pressure from stupid gov.
I agree that this can be a legitimate complaint. However I personally am banking on the idea that privacy will become the biggest issue of the 2020s. We already see the general zeitgeist care more and more about privacy in an ever more data mined society. This is where the real value of Monero comes in. True financial privacy at all levels without needing to be technical. Just wait until the Chinese government starts cracking down on the first BTC holders purely by analyzing the blockchain to pin it to certain individuals that said something bad about the government. It's when I expect XMR to start dominating the cryptocurrency market.

>>28851122
I sure as hell hope people don't actually do so and just speculate on shitcoins instead. It keeps the price of XMR low so you can slowly accumulate more over time as a sort of retirement fund.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 05:57:39 2021 No.28851451
File: 205 KB, 801x1629, 3502848505632.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28850980
>so really BTC's current method is not that bad. Not many people use it, so lower anonymity set

Hence why optional privacy = no privacy.

>but on the upside the coin is not seen as "hax0r black coin" and is not blacklisted on many exchanges by pressure from stupid gov.

Actually, "suspicious" BTC addresses are being blacklisted by the US Treasury with increasing frequency. Some poor Iranian bastid received tainted Bitcoins a while back and had the lot declared toxic by Uncle Sam. Pic related.

The issue here is that the moment these "toxic" coins touch a compliant exchange they'll automatically be seized, and with Bitcoin, unless they're freshly mined you can never be 100% certain your coins are sufficiently "clean" enough to evade scrutiny

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:01:46 2021 No.28851615 >>28849069 Thank you my man!

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:02:10 2021 No.28851630 so if Monero is too good for specualtion (since it has an actual usecase) whats a coin that i worth buying for gains? Preferrably still underrated. NANO?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:03:08 2021 No.28851665

>>28851451
>Actually, "suspicious" BTC addresses are being blacklisted by the US Treasury with increasing frequency.
Well to be fair it's possible for the US Treasury to blacklist the entirety of Monero. So I don't know if this is a good argument.
>you can never be 100% certain your coins are sufficiently "clean" enough to evade scrutiny
It's technically possible for future applications to calculate if your BTC has ever been used for nefarior purposes so people can actually avoid them.

It's still inferior to Monero but these aren't hurdles that you can't overcome.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:04:39 2021 No.28851715

>>28851630
>whats a coin that i worth buying for gains?
>Preferrably still underrated.
These things are mutually exclusive. You should buy BTC, ETH and LINK as the most shilled projects to the public for reliable gains. Put your winnings into XMR.

Other smaller projects aren't guaranteed pumps but more akin to gambling instead. I'm not a gambling man so I can't tell you what to buy.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:04:43 2021 No.28851720 >>28835795 I was but then I realized I don’t actually own my XMR because they won’t let you transfer it. I’ll play around with dumb shit on there like Doge or AVX but for Monero you want to have your own wallet and private keys

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:07:05 2021 No.28851805
File: 57 KB, 1200x1697, coinjoin-wasabi.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28851331
>>>28850980 (You)
>The problem with BTC currently is that the blockchain has already been de-anonimized and mapped almost completely. And worst is that it means that retroactively all transactions are exposed.

Yea, use CoinJoin if you don't want that.

Also, except LN transactions (they can be tracked but more actively and are to lesser degree probably, but have to take more care about network p2p security, tor obviously).

>This means that prosecutors can actually arrest people that bought drugs back in 2013 with BTC because it's basically a large public record of who did what.

Buying BTC is not illegal bro.

Also above is a reason why XMR is getting blacklisted while BTC has chance of mainstream.

>The only thing CoinJoin swaps do for BTC is make it computationally more expensive to untangle what happens. Not impossible. Especially since they are vulnerable to heuristic attacks.

Totally incorrect.

All the computation power in the Universe can't crack a CoinJoin where everyone used 0.1 BTC and then kept using mixed coins separately from other coins (new wallet).

P2P layer (tor) might be attacked but that's the case for every coin incl Monero and is more work and more active.

>I honestly don't believe Bitcoin can ever be truly anonymous from an objective perspective.

It is right now if you have medium/bigger amounts and put effort to Wasabi wallet or such.

>However I personally am banking on the idea that privacy will become the biggest issue of the 2020s. We already see the general zeitgeist

0-20% into Monero can be ok idea; but above reasons are why BTC will remain the gold standard.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:07:11 2021 No.28851813

One other thing people. PLEASE transfer your Monero to a private wallet. Why? Because it's extremely easy for exchanges to exit scam with Monero. It's untraceable and anonymous so you'll have no chance of ever getting it back and it poses 0 risk to the exchange.

Hackers are also going to target XMR within exchanges for these reasons. Transfer it to a local wallet as fast as possible.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:09:05 2021 No.28851881 >>28851715 >ETH and LINK no. They re shit. You might get lucky and get some profit, but long term fundamentals are bad. Especially fuck off shils with Link. BTC, Monero, Litecoin, Namecoin. Other's are a game if you lose you stay down forever.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:09:27 2021 No.28851889 i don't have enough money to buy a single monero fuck

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:10:13 2021 No.28851916 >>28851451 >Hence why optional privacy = no privacy. Optional privacy = privacy for the ones that use it. retard.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:11:16 2021 No.28851955 >>28851889 >i don't have enough money to buy a single monero >fuck is this a joke or just amerimutt brain? you can buy fractions of coins like 0.01 ...

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:11:55 2021 No.28851979 >>28851955 I know, but it feels better to own at least a whole of something

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:12:49 2021 No.28852021
File: 33 KB, 512x288, Ep5RFO7UwAANxn1.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28851665
>Well to be fair it's possible for the US Treasury to blacklist the entirety of Monero. So I don't know if this is a good argument.

Blacklisting Monero addresses is pointless since outgoing TX can't be traced. Blacklisting Bitcoin addresses works since it is fundamentally a public ledger so outgoing transactions are visible to everybody.

>It's technically possible for future applications to calculate if your BTC has ever been used for nefarior purposes so people can actually avoid them.

......or you can avoid these hassles altogether and just use Monero with peace of mind.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:14:48 2021 No.28852092

>>28851805
>Yea, use CoinJoin if you don't want that.
Heuristics from the rest of the blockchain means that CoinJoin just tangles up the threads, you can still untangle it and see who did what. Again it just makes it more computationally expensive to see who did what, not impossible. If the government thinks the cost of unwinding it is lower than the potential gain they get out of doing so then they are going to do so.

CoinJoin isn't magic that makes the public ledger private. All exchanges are still permanently recorded, just jumbled up by CoinJoin. You can mathematically proof that CoinJoin isn't fully private.

>Buying BTC is not illegal bro.
No but buying drugs with BTC is. Your transactions are permanently recorded on a public ledger. Meaning with retroactive mapping of the blockchain prosecution is inevitably pin every single address, transaction and coin to every person that ever owned it. This is not conjecture it's a mathematical inevitability. Due to how Heuristic works. The more information you have the more information you can infer thus the more you can infer from then and so on and on until it's completely mapped.

>Also above is a reason why XMR is getting blacklisted while BTC has chance of mainstream.
Fair enough I can't really say anything against this.

>All the computation power in the Universe can't crack a CoinJoin where everyone used 0.1 BTC and then kept using mixed coins separately from other coins (new wallet).
There isn't just computational power. There is also heuristics because it's a public chain. Meaning with every know adress it becomes exponentially easier to crack CoinJoin. If nothing is known then I agree CoinJoin becomes computationally resistant. If one address is mapped and known it suddenly only takes 100 billion years. 2 addresses known? It takes 10 million years. 3 Addresses known? It takes 10,000 years. 4 addresses known? It takes 100 minutes.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:15:28 2021 No.28852115 >>28851881 He is saying to profit short term buying meme shitcoins like eth and link because a whole lot of retards are buying them, not that they have good long term fundamentals

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:16:16 2021 No.28852148
File: 174 KB, 1024x867, 1610064478332.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28851916
>Optional privacy = privacy for the ones that use it.
>
>retard.

Private transactions in a sea of unshielded transactions stick out like a sore thumb, increasing the odds of successful deanonymization.

genius.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:17:01 2021 No.28852185

>>28852092
>CoinJoin just tangles up the threads, you can still untangle it and see who did what.

not when used correctly. keep doing more coinjoins, and ofc do not "join back" mixed coins.

also there are another similar ideas... why not execute your PAYMENTS directly as CJ.

> Your transactions are permanently recorded on a public ledger.

yea, so for sensitive stuff do the above. really the point is you don't need to do EVERYTHING that way.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:17:25 2021 No.28852199

>>28851805
>>28852092
Also Monero makes it impossible to know even 1 address. That is the entire mathematical reasoning for why "optional privacy means no privacy". You can reduce the computational complexity for every address mapped that takes place in a mixed transaction.

This is why people that actually know the technicalities laugh at things like Zcash, Dash or BTC CoinJoin. Because in the long term they aren't private at all. Only a fully private 0 information cryptocurrency like Monero can be truly private over the long term.

Again I'm not saying this as a shill for coins. I'm saying this from a mathematical perspective. You can read up on the mathematics behind it yourself.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:18:24 2021 No.28852236 >>28852148 Yeah like zcash where z addresses are used much less than t addresses

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:18:26 2021 No.28852238 >>28852185 shilling coinjoin? what year is this?

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:18:29 2021 No.28852242

>>28852148
>Private transactions in a sea of unshielded transactions stick out like a sore thumb, increasing the odds of successful deanonymization.

there's wide area between EVERYONE using it, and 10,000 out of ~200,000 transactions each day use it, and "sticking out like a sore dildo in ur mom's ass".

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:21:19 2021 No.28852366 >>28846847 i see what you did there

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:24:54 2021 No.28852504

>>28851889
>>28851979
You're going to hate yourself when 1 XMR=$50,000 in 2030 that you didn't buy 0.2XMR which would be $10,000 by then simply for purely emotional reasons like "It doesn't feel to have a whole one". Just hitch it away like a retirement fund.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:27:39 2021 No.28852605

>>28852185
>also there are another similar ideas... why not execute your PAYMENTS directly as CJ.
Woah... What if you build an entire cryptocurrency that does exactly that from the ground up that you can't disable? Oh wait we're in a thread about that exact coin.

Read up my follow up response to see why it's mathematically unsafe to have a public ledger. You want to have 0 information available for heuristic attacks.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:28:06 2021 No.28852629 File: 1.33 MB, 1242x1122, 1613436579937.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] are you guys stacking up now or waiting for the bear run?

>>	LebAnon Tue Feb 16 06:29:01 2021 No.28852664 >>28836187 BASED

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:29:32 2021 No.28852682

>>28852605
>Woah... What if you build an entire cryptocurrency that does exactly that from the ground up that you can't disable? Oh wait we're in a thread about that exact coin.

Whoah it's getting blacklisted.

Whoah with QCs you will get silently inflated not only destroying anonymity but also destroying entire value of coin, without people realizing why it goes down and down (while someone steals/inflates 90% of coins...)

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:29:42 2021 No.28852689
File: 58 KB, 856x656, bitcoin-blacklist.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28851805
>Yea, use CoinJoin if you don't want that.

Why take the risk when Monero has a better track record? CoinJoin might be "good enough" privacy but its not "the best" privacy, and when it comes to staying out of prison or protecting your wealth, "good enough" just ain't enough, you want "the best."

>Also above is a reason why XMR is getting blacklisted while BTC has chance of mainstream.

Atomic swaps = BTC/LTC/whatever become XMR's on/off ramps, so the prospect of being outlawed doesn't really bother people all that much.

>why BTC will remain the gold standard.

But for how long? Insufficient privacy and fungibility mean BTC taint issues will continue to snowball and thus BTC will continue being blacklisted by governmental agencies, primarily OFAC aka the US Treasury. Pic related.

And as Bitcoin develops a more publicized reputation for being vulnerable to governmental blacklisting and effective seizure, confidence will inevitably begin to erode and hodlers may start to jump ship to more secure protocols, primarily XMR.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:31:48 2021 No.28852790

>>28852629
I'm slowly accumulating over the next 5-10 years. Im putting in more and more of my portfolio into XMR as it's the only project that will be viable in the very long term.

I still hold other projects as well because they have more short-term moon potential. But I fully intend to cash them out into XMR over time. I don't wait for bear runs to accumulate because you don't know if the "bear run" means XMR crashing down from $2000 to $1000 or from $500 to $100. It's best to just buy some every day/week/month or whatever you feel comfortable with.

I highly recommend you actually read about the project though and not just think you should invest because you see some anons like me talk positively about it on /biz/.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:32:27 2021 No.28852820 >>28852629 XMR hasn't really mooned like most other coins, I think it's solidly in buy territory

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:33:06 2021 No.28852844 File: 72 KB, 750x1000, raf,750x1000,075,t,FFFFFF 97ab1c12de.u3.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28852664 Hey what's up lebanon good to see you here

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:33:15 2021 No.28852851 How private is this though, really?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:34:46 2021 No.28852918 >>28852790 thanks anon, I've already done my research and am accumulating just wanted to know about others

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:34:58 2021 No.28852933 >>28852851 completely verifiably private. which is why its being used for drugs on the darknet.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:35:04 2021 No.28852939
File: 38 KB, 749x353, 1611115617239.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28852682
>Whoah with QCs you will get silently inflated not only destroying anonymity but also destroying entire value of coin, without people realizing why it goes down and down (while someone steals/inflates 90% of coins...)

You can verify the integrity of the supply by:

>Summing up all the coinbase outputs, which are unmasked (i.e. in the clear).
>Verifying the underlying cryptography (mathematics) of the confidential amounts implementation.
>Verifying the correctness of the implementation in the code.

Pic related.

Those essentially guarantee that the supply has not been maliciously inflated (i.e. unintended inflation has occurred). Note that a similar procedure has to be followed for transparent chains. Furthermore, a hypothetical inflation bug can go unnoticed even on a transparent chain.

https://www.coindesk.com/the-latest-bitcoin-bug-was-so-bad-developers-kept-its-full-details-a-secret

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:35:13 2021 No.28852950

>>28852689
>>Yea, use CoinJoin if you don't want that.
>Why take the risk when Monero has a better track record? CoinJoin might be "good enough" privacy but its not "the best" privacy, and when it comes to staying out of prison or protecting your wealth, "good enough" just ain't enough, you want "the best."

The real patrician choice is to use both. You can even do multiple iterations (sender -> coinjoin -> monero -> coinjoin -> monero -> recipient) if you don't mind burning a bit more principal on fees.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:37:24 2021 No.28853068 im fucking all-in , xmr is a masterpiece

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:38:35 2021 No.28853137 >>28852820 ik, but I would feel really stupid if it dropped back to $40 after the run, even if I'm holding for the next 5 years. Maybe its just me

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:38:45 2021 No.28853145

>>28852689
>Why take the risk when Monero has a better track record?

CJ works since 2009.

> CoinJoin might be "good enough" privacy but its not "the best" privacy,

CJ done properly can not be broken by any amount of computational power.
QCs can deanon it only if attacker recorded in the past the P2P traffic done to create given CJ (if all tor traffic is recorded now and deanoned later... which is sort of possible, but then probably also XMR is fucked, and anyway that can be mitigated by post-QC p2p layer which DOES exist right now, post QC pub key encryption).

>Atomic swaps = BTC/LTC/whatever become XMR's on/off ramps, so the prospect of being outlawed doesn't really bother people all that much.

Kind of.
Atomic swap of Monero<->BTC work yet? I hope they can, not all coins do this.

I guess you can BTC<->anything over hidden exchange with some escrows.... but more effort. And institutions and shit will not get into it - will not be the gold standard, will not become reserve currency and replace (((FED))). XMR has adventages but can't replace BTC.

>>why BTC will remain the gold standard.
>But for how long?

forever

> Insufficient privacy and fungibility mean BTC taint issues will continue to snowball and thus BTC will continue being blacklisted by governmental agencies, primarily OFAC aka the US Treasury. Pic related.

not rly. few CJs and you would need to blacklist so much shit. Also if we can replace FED and be less anon, or be more anon but can't replace FED... I take the former option.

>And as Bitcoin develops a more publicized reputation for being vulnerable to governmental blacklisting and effective seizure

as you pointed out you can swap BTC in distributed places to other things in worst case

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:39:38 2021 No.28853187
File: 597 KB, 1680x1050, 579045.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28852933
>completely verifiably private. which is why its being used for drugs on the darknet.

This is all you need to look at really. The people with the most to lose will be the most discerning when it comes to using crypto.

Its why Bitcoin is being phased out on the darknet, its just not good enough anymore.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:40:51 2021 No.28853228 >>28853137 why, because you couldn't predict the future? it will be a buying opportunity if anything. if you're scared of not having any capital available, just DCA in.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:43:02 2021 No.28853330 i dont hold any of this coin but I like it. Its a great coin. I like it. I dont hold any monero. but its a great coin.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:47:04 2021 No.28853500 File: 110 KB, 644x858, 1610945886605.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] Any monero chads have thoughts on Haven/XHV?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:48:53 2021 No.28853580 >>28851889 get a job

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:51:53 2021 No.28853706

>>28852682
you're glowing
it's not getting blacklisted
quantum computing would fuck everything up and the price of monero (or bitcoin) would be the least of your problems also see:https://github.com/insight-decentralized-consensus-lab/post-quantum-monero/blob/master/writeups/technical_note.pdf and fuck off back to plebbit

>>	LebAnon Tue Feb 16 06:55:58 2021 No.28853876 >>28852844 likewise brother couldn't be comfier

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:56:15 2021 No.28853890

>>28852851
Even if you have 0 knowledge about the mathematics behind it knowing that Monero is the only cryptocurrency that's actually used on the dark web to buy shit with as well as it being the only cryptocurrency that the USA put a bounty on to crack should let you know how private this coin really is.

If you want to know why from a mathematical standpoint please read this as it's pretty brilliant. https://www.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:57:45 2021 No.28853958 >>28853145 Imaging having to coinjoin everytime you receive BTC because you are unsure if they are tainted just because you want to be on a transparent ledger without any advantages at all. Good luck

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:58:45 2021 No.28854009 >>28842264 same here, but accumulating everyday

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:59:35 2021 No.28854044 >>28853187 moneromaxi here, while its really great that the coin is used in a functional economy, I feel the need to point out that it also makes exit scamming effortless. this is the main issue right now, imho

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 06:59:48 2021 No.28854053
File: 329 KB, 963x933, 7574348.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

>>28853145
>CJ done properly

See, this is what I mean. Unlike Monero, you can't just use BTC out of the box without jumping through all these hoops. And since most users will never be bothered to go to all that effort, the whole thing is rendered ineffective.

Optional privacy = jerking off. And that is why Monero has a superior track record, you're FORCED to use full-spectrum privacy by default, thus ensuring the whole blockchain is uniformly shielded.

>can not be broken by any amount of computational power.

In theory. In practice, as mentioned, Chainsalysis has successfully traced CJ transactions.

>Many of those transactions were conducted through mixers like Wasabi Wallet, which utilizes the CoinJoin protocol to make it more difficult to trace the path of funds. You can see an example in the Chainalysis Reactor graph below.

https://blog.chainalysis.com/reports/plustoken-scam-bitcoin-price

>Atomic swap of Monero<->BTC work yet? I hope they can, not all coins do this.

Already working on testnet, dropping Q4 2021, there are several teams working on this.

Not only does this ensure Monero's continued availability, it also provides BTC a reliable privacy layer since BTC -> XMR -> BTC swaps render all other mixing options instantly obsolete.

So in that sense, XMR can provide BTC its fungibility while BTC can provide XMR its liquidity.

>forever

I remember thinking that about MySpace. So I don't think that about FaceBook. Or anything else, including XMR.

Sic Transit Gloria Mundi.

>not rly. few CJs and you would need to blacklist so much shit.

Yeah, in theory. But as seen, this isn't likely in practice.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:01:14 2021 No.28854111

>>28853958
>Imaging having to coinjoin everytime you receive BTC because you are unsure if they are tainted just because you want to be on a transparent ledger without any advantages at all. Good luck

Imagine not needing to hide every transaction.

Also if you open LN then all of them never land on blockchain at all. LN privacy is not yet ready, but at least you skip BC, and there is some support (Tor) with more to come.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:03:06 2021 No.28854187

>>28842264
>>28854009
Never disclose how much Monero you have on 4chan. The US government is known to tie it to your IP via 4chan like they did in 2017 which can be used against you in the future. Just say "I bought a small amount". Or "I am holding some amount".

This should actually be put into the OP of all Monero threads.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:04:44 2021 No.28854264 >>28854111 so why all these worksrounds and ifs and whats when you can onboard masses on XMR that do not need to worry about anything, but have fungible, private coins? but it‘s good that BTC maxis are here, it shows they fear XMR.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:06:13 2021 No.28854343

>>28854264
Because he wants the price of XMR to stay low so he can accumulate. I realized this once that ID started talking about QC inflation and moved the goalpost away from privacy.

Just let him FUD. It only helps us if the price stays low so we can accumulate as well.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:06:43 2021 No.28854379 >>28854187 requesting: more info regarding "like they did in 2017" comfy non-holder maxi here just interested in the tech

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:07:55 2021 No.28854428 >>28834864 best way to buy monero?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:09:43 2021 No.28854505 >>28854428 Locally on localmonero. But most people won't bother with that so I would suggest just going with the market that is best for you. Even KYC are save to buy from due to how Monero works >>28849976

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:10:31 2021 No.28854540 Cousin is in FBI cyber security these threads are literally made by FBI Monero was hacked two years ago

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:11:17 2021 No.28854580 >>28834864 Literal fucking scamcoin.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:11:32 2021 No.28854595 >>28854540 And my dad works at Nintendo

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:12:33 2021 No.28854638 >>28835635 Monero won't surpass the bitcoin supply until 2040

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:12:42 2021 No.28854654

>>28854053
>>CJ done properly
>See, this is what I mean. Unlike Monero, you can't just use BTC out of the box without jumping through all these hoops.
yea

> And since most users will never be bothered to go to all that effort, the whole thing is rendered ineffective.
>Optional privacy = jerking off.
no, by that logic Monero is ineffective because not every person uses Monero at all, >99% use fiat/bank wires/CC. So what? Still many people do use it.
Same, >99% of Bitcoin probably isn't CJ, so what. Still many people do use it (or will).
LN is another approach. Wasabi your big stash, then ride LN with no record in BC.

>>can not be broken by any amount of computational power.
>In theory. In practice, as mentioned, Chainsalysis has successfully traced CJ transactions.

only if wrongly used, and that claims are made by people running the company that sells deanon solutions so take it with some SJW salt mine.

>https://we-seell-product-to-gov-and-fbi.com/reports/OUR-PRODUCT-BEST-scientists-agree
aha

>Already working on testnet, dropping Q4 2021, there are several teams working on this.
cool

>>forever
>I remember thinking that about MySpace.

Do you remember thinking that about gold rocks? or about TCP/IP?

Btc is the most long-term minded coin out there.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:12:44 2021 No.28854658 monero will get banned and it'll become worthless

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:12:50 2021 No.28854661

>>28854379
In 2017 they pinned some IPs of people proclaiming to have specific amounts to wallets and transactions made on the dark web because people are retarded.

It led to some websites even being infiltrated by the Dutch government and farming all those transactions then slowly putting them next to retarded people on 4chan (can't use TOR here) and reddit (without TOR) and arresting them based on the overlapping information.

The risk of that happening with Monero is severely reduced due to no public ledger but still it should be "best practice" in OPSEC to never state the amount of XMR you own on 4chan.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:13:31 2021 No.28854691

>>28850913
>Just to be clear, what you're suggesting here " prosecutors can and do correlate circumstantial evidence (i.e side-channels), same for an attacker, or the taxman." is mathematically impossible. https://www.getmonero.org/library/Zero-to-Monero-2-0-0.pdf

Can you link to a specific paragraph, it's 40 pages

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:14:37 2021 No.28854745

>>28854264
>so why all these worksrounds and ifs and whats when you can onboard masses on XMR that do not need to worry about anything, but have fungible, private coins?

while it might be one of less shitty altcoins, it's not btc, and is not as conservatively and carefully developed (consensus changes etc).

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:14:39 2021 No.28854751 >>28835232 Ask your local pedophile, drugdealer, police department, mafia, or Islamic comunity

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:14:45 2021 No.28854759 >>28854540 >he doesn't know that 4chan is 99% glowies

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:15:00 2021 No.28854775 >>28852148 That's not exactly right, the anon set for Zcash is cumulative AFAIK. That means that it compounds over time. Monero's is discreet (increase by a constant factor every round).

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:15:33 2021 No.28854799 >>28854691 Go to the topics of RingCT to see how "circumstantial evidence from side-channels" would be impossible due to the entire ledger being private and no single transaction being able to be linked to any wallet.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:16:02 2021 No.28854832 File: 21 KB, 550x397, 1537402434507.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] post yfw senator joe biden makes XMR illegal so americans can't buy any

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:16:19 2021 No.28854842 >>28854658 >bitcoin will get banned and it will become worthless you must be new here

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:16:33 2021 No.28854855 Quick lads, sell everything, it's getting banned. The IQ of this place was never above two digits but at this point leddit has less spastics on the monero threads than we do.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:17:10 2021 No.28854893 File: 119 KB, 929x1175, 1613414505221.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28854832 they already can't

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:17:25 2021 No.28854911

>>28854661
You should really be in charge of running the general breads anon with an opsec section added, thanks for the info.

I realize these threads inherently skirt a lot of BEST PRACTICE opsec because discussion tied back to identifiable IPs is inherently risky and listy, but a set of guidelines on how to discuss XMR in order to bring it's awareness into the public consciousness, without making yourself into an obvious target would be fantastic.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:17:52 2021 No.28854930

>>28852199
>This is why people that actually know the technicalities laugh at things like Zcash, Dash or BTC CoinJoin. Because in the long term they aren't private at all. Only a fully private 0 information cryptocurrency like Monero can be truly private over the long term.
That's literally not true though, Monero does have source addresses and it is enough to mount successful de-anonymization attacks. Zcash's shielded pools are stronger by fluffy's own admission (src, dest, amnt are opaque) but it comes at the cost of expensive and novel cryptography

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:18:21 2021 No.28854955 File: 178 KB, 500x245, 1537402574492.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28854893 really? lole

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:19:19 2021 No.28855002 >janny deleted my post about missing two years of accumulation before caving in at $220 what did he mean by this?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:20:14 2021 No.28855043 >>28854540 >>28854580 >>28854658 >>28854832 >>28854855 >1 post by this ID Try harder samefagging glowie

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:20:19 2021 No.28855048 >>28854930 See: https://www.zfnd.org/blog/blockchain-privacy/#decoys Monero's advantage is NOT stronger privacy. You can make an argument for it in terms of lower inflation rate (ZCash is like ~12%) and DKM adoption, or decentralization

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:20:53 2021 No.28855073 >>28855002 Guess it's because it looks like gore and this is an sfw board

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:21:08 2021 No.28855081 File: 62 KB, 1041x400, 1537402378102.gif [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28855043 retard nigger

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:21:47 2021 No.28855115 what wallets do my fellow xmrchads like to use? currently using exodus and it seems good enough for me

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:22:33 2021 No.28855153 >>28855115 gui or cake wallet

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:22:54 2021 No.28855167 >>28855115 Cake Wallet for IOS Official wallet for pc

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:24:10 2021 No.28855242

>>28854930
>Monero does have source addresses and it is enough to mount successful de-anonymization attacks.
I hope you realize that every transaction is actually sent to a fake address and then to your real "source address" Basically even if you know a source address of someone you still can't know from what they sent and what they received thus you can't use de-anonymization attacks.

This is actually explained mathematically in "zero to monero".

Zcash itself is not even decentralized. So you need to have trust in the institution behind Zcash. I won't go further into Zcash as something not being decentralized is the biggest red flag in crypto.

If you're here to shill Zcash then go ahead, I'm not interested in coin wars only in educating anons on the technology behind cryptography and specifically Monero.

I'm still in the middle of accumulating so I don't mind you shilling other projects to keep the price of XMR low.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:25:18 2021 No.28855292 >>28855073 hm

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:25:58 2021 No.28855328 >>28855115 How technical are you? If you're /g/ linux user technical use the CLI wallet. If you're reasonably technical use the GUI wallet. If you're a normalfag use cakewallet on your smartphone.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:27:32 2021 No.28855429 File: 99 KB, 769x1285, 1595797789702.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] XMR threads are comfy because they are the only ones where people posting FUD get absolute thrashed and are left without any argument.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:30:13 2021 No.28855577 >>28852629 look at xmr/btc chart

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:31:32 2021 No.28855670 >>28855577 AAAAAAAAAAAAA we’re falling down

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:32:56 2021 No.28855757 >>28855670 you know what to do

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:34:05 2021 No.28855817 File: 26 KB, 739x415, images (5).jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28854855 Yeah, kek

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:37:03 2021 No.28855986 kraken is selling xmr 3$ higher than its original value 225?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:38:27 2021 No.28856063 >>28855328 just got my cakewallet set up now, will take a look at GUI wallet another time. I tried to get it working on tails before but it was a bit beyond my understanding, will try and get it again cus I like the privacy of it

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:39:15 2021 No.28856103 >>28855081 you have to be 18+ to post on this board

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:39:32 2021 No.28856127 mymonero is legit and good yeh?

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:42:49 2021 No.28856313 >>28856127 No it's a confirmed scam. Not sure if you're trolling or not though because that has been the biggest scam in the monero community thus far.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:44:24 2021 No.28856395 >>28856127 type mymonero.com in your browser any other thing is a scam. That said it's far better to use CLI/GUI on Desktop and Cakewallet on mobile phone. Especially because mymonero has been targeted by hackers, scams and the like.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:45:15 2021 No.28856430 good entry point for xmr ???

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:45:58 2021 No.28856469 >>28856430 Now

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:46:54 2021 No.28856532 >>28856430 fomo in at 1000

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:47:05 2021 No.28856545

>>28856063
GUI doesn't work out of the box on TAILS. You need to switch to Advanced Mode and got to Settings and manually input a remote onion node, as clearnet nodes cannot be used from Tor. You can easily find lists of remote onion nodes by just searching.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:48:43 2021 No.28856634 >>28856545 yup I need to do my homework on it all thanks

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:49:15 2021 No.28856666 >>28856395 cool. will switch soon. defo used the right website to download tho.

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:49:50 2021 No.28856693

>>28856430
Good entry point of XMR is to actually know how it works and why it's the future.

https://youtu.be/aC9Uu5BUxII

And yes I know you meant price, but it's more important that you know what Monero actually is and does. If you decide it's worth the risk after watching this then step in, or don't.

Ignore anyone that gives you an actual price estimate.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:53:44 2021 No.28856917 >>28856693 much oblige... interesting

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:54:05 2021 No.28856939 File: 140 KB, 420x420, shouldveusedmonero.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google] >>28855043 Thanks for proving my point.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:57:30 2021 No.28857104 >>28856693 Oh my god, the global economy is going to go down the toilet isn't it...

Anonymous Tue Feb 16 07:59:58 2021 No.28857229

>>28839581
>from a hardware standpoint the ledger is just hands down the better of the two
uhh how come? correct me if I'm wrong but they are both encrypted usb sticks essentially and neither has had a case of getting cracked by a hacker and loss of funds afaik.
so how can you say one is better than the other, in what technical terms ledger is better? I was planning to buy trezor that's why I am asking.

>>	Anonymous Tue Feb 16 08:11:28 2021 No.28857833 File: 272 KB, 788x669, 1608626637224.png [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]

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