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234267 No.234267[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

How does one turn a profit on this stuff? The markup is over 15% and I can only imagine how they lowball you when its time to sell. I get its longterm but how much of my investment gets lost by being jewed from both ends?

For the record, looking to buy about $3-5k worth of precious metals and Silver is at a good low so it seems much more promising than gold.

>> No.234276

I have a coin shop in my town and they don't markup that much for silver.

I just bought a 10 ounce silver bar for $209 just two days ago. I asked him how much he buys them for and he said $201.

That's less than a 5% markup

That being said, you hold onto silver and other precious metals for the intrinsic value it holds; not necessarily to hold it for an investment.

>> No.234288

>>234276
Well course, I do intend to hang onto them for quite awhile (hoping we see $50/oz again at least). I'm more or less trying to calculate my breakeven per oz price.

>> No.234293

>>234288
I actually believe there are precious metal fund you can invest in. Most of them commonly hold gold, silver, platinum, and palladium. This way you don't have to physically hold onto anything and the only costs you sink are the transaction fees.

>> No.234295

15% markup? I paid $1.49 over spot (spot was $22.40 att) just a week or so ago from APMEX, so I'm not exactly sure what you're talking about... I guess it depends on WHAT you purchased considering there's a difference in premium from say, blank silver rounds and American silver eagles.

>> No.234301

>>234295
A 1 oz bar is $22.99, current price is $20.30/oz. That's about 13%. I would prefer bars over rounds, but is there a benefit to coins other than less markup?

>>234293
I have a lot of funds, looking for something physical. I'm at the point of investing where I want to do some "fun" stuff like stacking some bars but I'm not so dumb that I would buy something that won't be a nice return someday.

>> No.234305

>>234301
What ARE some funds that let you invest in precious metals? I know they exist but I haven't invested in any.

I only have physical silver (no gold) because it's affordable and has the "fun" factor that you are talking about. Also, where do you keep you precious metals? Safety Deposit Box? In a safe? Under your mattress?

>> No.234313

>>234305
Safe bolted inside of a heavy (solid wood, not ikea crap) piece of furniture with linens in front of it. Assuming someone broke into my house when I was away and managed to find it, I doubt they could get it out of the house or break into it without raising too much attention.

I may switch to a safe deposit box in a bank but right now its only for documents.

>> No.234327

>>234305

There are various ETFs for precious metals. Also, safety deposit boxes are wonderful things.

Getting a decent safe will cost more than it's worth unless you have A LOT, and in the end there's no such thing as a safe that can't be cracked.

>> No.234350

>>234267
>profit
>Silver

pick one.

>> No.234353

>>234327
While I agree there is no such thing as a perfect safe, one thing to remember is a home invasion will only be at most 20-40 minutes long. They want to get in, grab what they can, and get out. Your goal with a safe, after finding a good place to hide it, of course, is to make it not worth the effort of removing, lest they get caught. Sure a professional could probably crack it, but I doubt Bro-man fromt he fif floor can and if he can't carry it under his arm it'll stay put. If you are really paranoid, buy a dummy firesafe and put a brick in it and put that int he obvious place. They won't realize they got boned tillt hey're back at their crackhouse or whatever

>> No.234361

>>234353

The problem is if they know that it's there (worse if they know what's in it). There are plenty of stories about people who go on vacation and return to a broken open safe.

Safety deposit boxes are cheaper and statistically safer.

>> No.234365

>>234361
How much does a safety deposit box cost?

>> No.234371

>>234365

Depends on the size, but usually around $25/year for a basic one. My bank let's me have one for 'free'.

The cost can also be tax deductible.

>> No.234374

>>234305

I can answer this. You can invest in closed end funds, which quality for preferential tax treatment (capital gains are treated like stocks instead of commodities). Closed end fund means that NAV may differ from that actual market price for the shares. These are:

1. Central Fund of Canada (CEF) -- Holds roughly a 50%/50% mix of gold bullion and silver bullion.
2. Central Gold Trust (GTU) -- Holds almost 100% gold bullion
3. Sprott Physical Gold Trust (PHYS) -- Holds almost 100% gold bullion
4. Sprott Physical Silver Trust (PSLV) -- Holds almost 100% silver bullion

Each of the funds above holds a percentage of funds in cash for day-to-day operations costs and such.

You can also buy ETFs that are backed by gold or silver:
1. GLD -- Gold
2. IAU -- Gold
3. SGOL -- Gold
4. SLV -- Silver

Capital gains on the ETFs are taxed at commodity rates.

>> No.234372

>>234361
Oh yea I'm not saying its foolproof. Keeping a safe, well, safe is the key. If people know about it, its not safe anymore.

>>234365
$25 a year usually, maybe more if you want something bigger.

>> No.234385 [DELETED] 
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234385

I have a related question.

When it comes the time to sell, how do you proceed? Will local coin shops pay you back in cash? I know for a fact APMEX sends you a check. Should that be avoided?

What if it's over 10k, would they have to report it if they paid you in cash? Can you do it over several instances and they won't report it, or would you need to go to different coin shops?

>> No.234389

>>234385

Unless you're planning to commit tax evasion I'm not sure how it's an issue.

>> No.234391

From someone who is studying finance and economics, gold and other precious metals are basically a bet against fear within the economy. Price of gold raises when economy is bad and lowers when economic outlook is getting better. Looks like you are going to lose money, OP

>> No.234401

>>234391
Potentially, yes.

>> No.234413

>>234391

Bad economies (I'm assuming you mean recessions or depressions?) by themselves do not cause the price of gold to rise.

The finance and economics curriculums in the universities do a very poor job of explaining how real things work. They are totally wrong about gold. If they were so clever (and they should be since everyone has a PhD), they would have figured out the gold trade from 2001 - 2011 and they would have figured out the dot-com and housing bubbles and not lost their asses on them.

>> No.234437

>>234385

Depends how much you're selling. If you go in and sell $1500 in coins/bullion, your local coin shop is likely going to cut you a check as well. Not sure why you would want thousands of dollars in cash, but most coin shops won't do that anyway.

>> No.234520
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234520

>>234374
Im actually pretty interested in the PSLV etf

>> No.234586

>>234520
Pedantically, it's not an ETF; it's a trust. It is also closed-ended which means that if you hold for more than one year, capital gains are taxed at 15% (20% if you have a very high income) instead of the 28% or whatever it is if it were viewed as a commodity.

If you buy PSLV outside of an IRA or 401K, make sure you file the paperwork so that you get the beneficial tax treatment.

>> No.236120

>>234350
Short term? Probably not.

But Silver is reasonably rare and only set to get rarer as more and more of it is consumed.

>Implying it's also not massively undervalued

Then there's this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZg6xm2yIiE

>> No.236126

>>234313

You could also have a dummy safe that they'll snatch and not even think of looking for anything larger/more secure.

>> No.236269

>>234267
You can't turn a profit on that shit.
The only way to turn profit in that shit is to be a Jew or to find some in the ground with a metal detector.

>> No.236543

>>236269
I am a Jew