/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.19917]

Does this guy know what he's talking about?

[Anonymous No.19926]

Jew. Anything he says do the exact opposite.

[Anonymous No.19956]

He's savy judging by his business.

However, how good his advice is is anyone's guess.

[Anonymous No.19983]

He's a celebrity economist. Like the Neil Degrasse of economics. All his arguments boil down to "muh supply and demand", which he uses to basically explain everything. He's like your typical edgy libertardian that just read Ayn Rand and can't stop talking to his friends about it.

Just look at this minimum wage argument. He reiterates the same generic neoclassical speech, "its bad cos econ 101 says so!1". But when you show him empirical evidence to the contrary, or something like the DMP model, he'll conveniently ignore it.

>>19926

>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.19993]

he's a hedgefund dick so he says whatever purports his interest

[Anonymous No.20009]

Absolutely.

The dollar is going to die within the next few years.

All china has to do is let their currency rise.

If the federal reserve raises interest rates by like even 1% the economy will collapse. It's that broken

[Anonymous No.20033]

>>19983
>typical edgy libertardian
Uh, do you even know what board you're on?

> that just read Ayn Rand
Lol no libertarian even likes ayn rand.

Quit repeating talking points you heard off msnbc and huffpo.

Next you're going to scream racist and fox news right?

Get out.

>"its bad cos econ 101 says so!1".
Um, yes basic logic said minimum wage is a bad thing, and it's been shown to be extremely destructive wherever it's been tried.

See american samoa.

Why do reddit leftists hate facts?

[Anonymous No.20036]

The man is an idiot.

[Anonymous No.20031]

[Official Wrinkle Face™ creat(...) No.20048]

>>19926
Jew? As in Mountain Jew? :D

[Anonymous No.20052]

>>20036
for what reasons?

[Anonymous No.20054]

yes

[Anonymous No.20073]

>>20036

Wow, you didn't even bother with trying to substantiate it. At least redditors try to throw in "muh feelings" and "muh equality" "arguments".

I mean, fuck. We're on a finance board, we're trying to learn something here.

[Anonymous No.20064]

>>19926
Stop with the anti-Semitism, my entire family died in Auschwitz.

[Anonymous No.20065]

>>20009
>China lets their currency rise
>China loses trade surplus
>China can no longer build things for cheap
>China collapses because it has no domestic economy

[Official Wrinkle Face™ creat(...) No.20067]

>>20033
Why is he strangling snoo? :( I think you're just jelly of reddit's success >:^)

[Anonymous No.20080]

>>20033
>minimal wage has been shown to be extremely destructive wherever it's been tried.
Have you heard of Europe ?
>filthy reds don't count

[Anonymous No.20087]

>>20064
Well, I guess work didn't make THEM free, huh?

Ba-dum-tsst.

[Anonymous No.20089]

>>20080
>Have you heard of Europe ?
Yes where youth unemployment is out of control. See spain for example.

Thank you for proving my point you brainwashed shill.

[Anonymous No.20127]

>>20080

Germany actually doesn't have a minimum wage and is currently one of the strongest economies in the world

[Anonymous No.20128]

>>20033

http://www.stanford.edu/~rehall/HallTalkNobelLunch.pdf

Here's a good read kiddo. Explains why the common argument that min wage creates unemployment is bunk. It's even written by neoclassicists too, which is why it was so devastating for the right when it came out.

It might be a little harder to read than Ayn Rand, but since you don't apparently read those kinds of books, I'm sure your at the level to read this link, yes?

The point I'm making is that there's more to econ than what you learn in a first year course. Yet Schiff's arguments are exclusively limited to the most basic sort of econ knowledge. The guy is no intellectual, just someone with a big mouth who only argues with shitty libs because he read one econ book and they read none.

[Anonymous No.20118]

>>20064
My great-grand-father died in a camp.

He fell from an observation tower

[Anonymous No.20135]

>>20089
>switzerland

[Anonymous No.20159]

>>20135
>2 good economies
>several near collapse

[Anonymous No.20181]

>>20159
>anything that's not greece, spain or ex-ussr

[Anonymous No.20204]

>>20128
>The 2010 Nobel Prize in Economics
Credibility instantly lost.

>Here's a good read kiddo.
Awww, someone expose your childishness. Projection much?

>Explains why the common argument that min wage creates unemployment is bunk.
Yet every single place that has tried a minimum wage has resulted in unemployment.
American Samoa raised their minimum wage resulting in countless job losses and poverty. Basically the same fucking day they passed the law. Also teenage unemployment in america, see pic.
Hmmmm it seems you're an idiot and a true believer for whatever the "progressive" status quo dictates.

>It might be a little harder to read than Ayn Rand
There you go again.
Lol what other liberal talking point are you going to spew next?

Fox news, racist, roads, GREEEEDDDY? I seriously can't wait.

>It's even written by neoclassicists too
Why would we care what a bunch of socialists think?

>because he read one econ book and they read none.
He has a bachelor of science in accounting and finance.

[Anonymous No.20194]

Hes basically Krugman for the lolbertarians.

[Anonymous No.20214]

>>20204
>>20128
Forgot pic.

[Anonymous No.20228]

>>20080
Actually Germany, Austria, Norway and Switzerland all do not have a minimum wage

Please educate yourself before you fucking wreck yourself

[Anonymous No.20258]

>>20228

http://www.minimum-wage.org/international/en/Austria
http://www.minimum-wage.org/international/en/Switzerland

You were right for germany and norway though.

[Anonymous No.20262]

>>20214

>implying teenage unemployment fucking matters


Raise minimum wage, you give more incentive for leeches to get off the couch and start scrubbing some toilets

[Anonymous No.20269]

>>20204

>Nobel prize
>all credibility lost

Wow. 3edgy5me.

>neoclassicists
>socialists

What am I reading. Can someone be this stupid?

I think moot needs to code in a mini econ quiz for /biz/ to be able to post, because the amount of retard on this board is seriously pathetic.

[Anonymous No.20286]

>>20214
>teenage unemployment
meaning that more adults become employed as minimum wage increases? what a novel idea

[Anonymous No.20298]

>>20262
>>implying teenage unemployment fucking matters
Yeah fuck those generation Y scum.

We baby boomers should suck them dry of everything they've got. Debt slavery is here to stay.

>>20269
>Wow. 3edgy5me.
Paul "PRINT MORE MONEY" Krugman has a nobel prize
Barack Obama the corporate drone stike child murderer has a nobel peace prize
Al Gore somehow magically has a nobel peace prize
The nobel prize is a fucking joke.

You really are a massive tool and people can clearly see that.

>Can someone be this stupid?
Obviously I was making a joke but you're too dumb to see that. Neoclassicists are still extreme statists and do not understand economics at all, austrian economics solved countless problems with neoclassicalism.

>because the amount of retard on this board is seriously pathetic.
Back to reddit then, keynesian.

[Anonymous No.20306]

>>20214
Nice graphic. Does it mean anything ? I don't think so. You could change the blue line for something like "usage of internet throughout the american midwest" if you wanted. Would it prove anything ? I don't think so.

[Anonymous No.20319]

>people who support price controls on labour
>actually thinking they know anything about economics.

Top Kek

[Anonymous No.20334]

>>20306
>I don't think so.
Okay then?

>You could change the blue line for something like "usage of internet throughout the american midwest" if you wanted.
But then that wouldn't be accurate.

Also the bit about america samoa is an absolute fact it basically destroyed american samoa.

http://www.acton.org/pub/commentary/2011/07/06/minimum-wage-law-backfires-american-samoa

You people are basically psychopaths that want to see people starve to death.

[Anonymous No.20338]

>>20135
You mean one of the few places in Europe where "Free Market" isn't a dirty word? The country that steered clear of the EU?

As a Swiss person, I can safely say they don't call this place The Landlocked Island for nothing.

[Anonymous No.20389]

>>20338
Still fairly socialist. In the good sense of the term, not like France. Fuck France.

[Anonymous No.20413]

>>20389
>Still fairly socialist.
No it's not.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_economic_freedom
http://www.heritage.org/index/country/switzerland

[Anonymous No.20427]

>>20389
>Switzerland
>Socialist

pick one

[Anonymous No.20446]

>>20338
I like how the swiss have market based healthcare like in singapore which results in the price being extremely low so everyone can afford it.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2011/04/29/why-switzerland-has-the-worlds-best-health-care-system/

http://www.forbes.com/sites/theapothecary/2012/03/09/the-myth-of-free-market-american-health-care/

[Anonymous No.20460]

>>20413
>>20427

Socialist as in don't kill on sight the mid-lower class.

[Anonymous No.20464]

>>20286
Dat zero-sum fallacy

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20478]

>>19917
I like him OP. Though I think he talks a lot of shit and is completely in love with his own economic views of the world, which is a massive no no and probably why his bank shares aren't doing so hot.

That said, he deserves super huge fucking kudos for calling out the subprime mortgage crisis and banking sector collapse back in 2006. He seriously stuck his neck out in a way economists rarely do. I think many of his predictions will work out, the coming dollar crisis and collapse in confidence in currencies with money flocking to hard assets such as gold.

Follow Jim Rickards on twitter too. He's like Schiff but less egotistic and generally sounds like he thinks about what he says a lot more carefully. He also anticipates a currency crisis. Goes into a lot more detail about the different paths that might lead to though.

[Anonymous No.20486]

>>20460
>Socialist as in don't kill on sight the mid-lower class.
But that's exactly what socialism has always done.

[Anonymous No.20492]

>>20262
kek

Unemployment was dropping faster when minimum wage was dropping. Then the minimum wage rose and unemployment rose too. Was that graph supposed to prove your point?

[Anonymous No.20501]

>>20486
Your propaganda won't work on me, anon.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20521]

>>20262
>Raise minimum wage, you give more incentive for leeches to get off the couch and start scrubbing some toilets
Leeches? Leeching off their parents? They'll get a job as soon as their parents decide to cut their allowance significantly below what they could get paid in a job.

[Anonymous No.20542]

>>20501
>Your propaganda won't work on me, anon.
What propaganda?

Look at socialism everywhere it's been tried. It turns everyone poor.

[Anonymous No.20546]

>>20542
Except the ones in power. Is it really called socialism then ?

[Anonymous No.20560]

>>20319
Socialist policies are brought about due to successes in conservative policies.

[Anonymous No.20569]

>>20204
Are you seriously a libertarian who insults other people with the word liberal?

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20579]

>>20569
that's not in fact the contradiction you think it is.

[Anonymous No.20586]

>>20569
That's how America works. Two parties. Libertarians think they're a third party, but they're just a Republican Kid's Meal.

[Anonymous No.20598]

>>20579
>>20586
Not everyone is an american you know

[Anonymous No.20599]

>>20569
Self-identified liberals = idiots

True liberals = awesome

[Anonymous No.20600]

he's been wrong about bitcoin, that's for sure

anyone listening to schiff on bitcoin has missed out on 100x returns, and watched their gold depreciate 40%

[Anonymous No.20601]

>>20560
>Socialist policies are brought about due to successes in conservative policies.
No, they're usually brought about because other statist or socialist policies failed.

[Anonymous No.20619]

>>20601
Socialist policies need money to work, and throughout history conservative monetary/fiscal policies are the only ones that have worked.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20614]

>>20598
>Not everyone is an american you know
yes I do completely know that. I am one of these people.

[Anonymous No.20633]

>>20601
I think what he meant is that the only way there is wealth to distribute is if there is a (relatively) free market.

[Anonymous No.20623]

>>20586
>but they're just a Republican Kid's Meal.
That's cute.

Democrats are basically republicans except for a few issues.

Libertarians want to change everything.

>>20569
>Are you seriously a libertarian who insults other people with the word liberal?
Are you seriously this much of a butthurt liberal with no argument?

[Pory-goon !cWl9wC/NZo No.20652]

>>20600
Bitcoin probably weakened the gold market.

[Anonymous No.20653]

>>20614
I dont think I explained what I meant well, its silly for a libertarian to insult a liberal as liberal because libertarians believe in liberal ideals, and insulting someone with the word liberal sounds stupid to anyone who isnt american anyway.

>>20623
Argument for what?

[Anonymous No.20662]

>>20633
Oh, I agree.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20667]

>>20600
they also missed out on the housing boom and .com stock boom. Oh wait, those were bubbles. Simply because an asset increases in value by 100x doesn't mean anyone who didn't recommend investing in it is retarded. bitcoin is scarcely recommended by anyone as an investment. Most people on /g/ who invested in it bough at $20 and old at $40. People who didn't sell after a 200% increase or so likely still haven't sold and could yet lose everything depending on how things go.

Gold had a bad year last year but I understand beat the s&p500 over the past 6 years. It's off to a great start to 2014.

[Anonymous No.20681]

>>20633
The problem with most socialist policies is that they fail to cut off the people who will eventually stop working due to the fact they will receive a steady stream of benefits, telling them they won't have to work in order to get shit.

Another problem that arises with socialist policies is an increase in immigration due to people wanting shit. Basically, if it's to work, you need to cut off the leaks and tighten immigration, which no one has done yet.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20693]

>>20653
you're a retard. Liberal and libertarian have completely different meaning in the US. It only sounds retarded to non US people if their too retarded to understand what associations certain terms have to Americans. Do you call everyone stupid who comes form an English speaking country besides your own that has different associations with different words and phrases?

[Anonymous No.20729]

>>20693
Why are you being so defensive? I literally just explained what you are telling me right now and then you sperg out on me pointing out the obvious in your post. There was literally no point even posting what you just posted.

[Anonymous No.20718]

>>20619
Yes, that's why we are in such a beautiful world with no problem whatsoever right now.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20746]

>>20718
the world has lots of problems right now. Many hold the view that under socialism it would have many more. history seems to back that up.

[Anonymous No.20751]

>>20718
Are you seriously implying Bush and Obama use conservative fiscal policies?

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20765]

>>20729
>its silly for a libertarian to insult a liberal as liberal because libertarians believe in liberal ideals
because that quote is stupid and wrong.

[Anonymous No.20779]

>>20214
What happened in 2008?

[Anonymous No.20776]

>>20765
>and insulting someone with the word liberal sounds stupid to anyone who isnt american

[Anonymous No.20815]

>>20751
I imply that america sold its soul to a few big corporations and brainwashed its citizens into submission.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20820]

>>20776
I don't even know why that's relevant. It's like saying Italian sound stupid to anyone who doesn't know Italian. Anyone in any English speaking country who vaguely familiar with the American political landscape knows what the terms mean.

[Anonymous No.20828]

There are too many threads all over the place, so I'll just ask here:

>higher interest rates will make gold go up!
>higher interest rates will make gold go down!

Which is it? I hear both regularly.

[Anonymous No.20829]

>>20815
That's corrupt government in general, I meant actual conservative policies with no one who shouldn't be pulling the strings doing so

[Anonymous No.20830]

>>20262

You know your graph disproves what you say right?

[Anonymous No.20841]

>>20214
>teenage unemployment
have you have you ever actually worked with teenagers, as an adult? They tend to be obnoxious, melodramatic assholes who couldn't give two shits about their work and fuck things up repeatedly as a result; the only general exception to this is teenagers with kids, and most teenagers do not have kids (most teenagers not having kids is precisely the reason why the teenager unemployment rate does not matter)

[Anonymous No.20848]

>>20828
>>higher interest rates will make gold go up!
It would make gold so down because people would use dollars instead of gold.

Interest rates aren't going to go up though lol

It's pretty much impossible at this point.

The economy will collapse

[Anonymous No.20855]

>>20820
You know words mean different things to different people right? If I came to your place and called your chips crisps youd think it sounds stupid too, which is exactly what I was explaining, so then you pick up on my post and explain that theyre different in different countries, which is incredibly obvious. I dont think there is a reason to respond to you anymore.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20875]

>>20855
>If I came to your place and called your chips crisps youd think it sounds stupid too
I wouldn't personally say I think that sounds stupid. and if I saw two Americans talking about chips to each other I certainly wouldn't find it stupid. What's "stupid" about it? Because it's not what I say? jesus.

[None !ZkdamFhldE No.20891]

mandatory

[Anonymous No.20904]

[Anonymous No.20901]

>>20820
and the terms are retarded, and I'm saying that as an American
also
>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.20913]

>>20848
"Like a money bazooka ! Pew pew !"

[Anonymous No.20949]

>>20904
Wow reddit, so creative.

:^)

[Anonymous No.21034]

>>20080
European countries with a strong minimum wage
>Greece
>France
>Spain
>Portugal
>United Kingdom

All have incredibly high youth unemployment and are in the economic shitter

European countries without minimum wage
>Germany
>Austria
>Norway
>Switzerland
>Iceland
>Denmark
>Sweden

[Anonymous No.21048]

>>20258
http://www.minimum-wage.org/international/en/Switzerland
>While Switzerland has no official minimum wage, a majority of the voluntary collective bargaining agreements contain clauses on minimum compensation, ranging from 2,200 to 4,200 francs per month for unskilled workers and from 2,800 to 5,300 francs per month for skilled employees. Switzerland's minimum wage was last changed in N/A .

http://www.minimum-wage.org/international/en/Austria
>none; instead, nationwide collective bargaining agreements set minimum wages by job classification for each industry; the accepted unofficial annual minimum wage is �12,000 to �14,000[4] Austria's minimum wage was last changed in N/A .

>Posting a source that proves your opponent correct
ISHYGDDT

[Anonymous No.21159]

>>20064
All jokes aside, seven of my grandmothers were turned into lamp shades in Auschwitz. :/

[Anonymous No.21220]

>>20949
>Da 4chins are muh sekrit right-wing club

>>>/pol/

[Anonymous No.21226]

>>19983
>empirical evidence on the contrary
>all studies show increased minimum wage means lower overall employment
>follows logic as having to pay for more expensive labor means having fewer laborers do more work
>not even a counter-intuitive subject, yet people still too fucking dumb to understand
I hate this world.

[Anonymous No.21227]

>>21159
how does one have more than two grandmothers?

[Anonymous No.21231]

>>21034
THIS

I love when leftists get blown the fuck out.

[Anonymous No.21241]

>>21220
>>Da 4chins are muh sekrit right-wing club
This board was created for economics. It's basically the libertarian board.

Please leave.

[Anonymous No.21252]

youtube.com/schittreport

[Anonymous No.21255]

>>21227
Are you some kind of holocost denying anti-semite bastid?

[Anonymous No.21273]

>>21048
You mean voluntary contracts effectively provide a minimum wage?

FREE MARKET FIXED IT

[Anonymous No.21288]

>>21241
>This board was created for economics.

>Therefore my magical, fringe economic theories are automatically accepted

>>>/somalia/

[Anonymous No.21334]

>>21288
>somalia

[Anonymous No.21356]

>>21034
You mean to say, rich countries don't actually need a minimum wage because corporate can naturally provide a living wage to even the lowest rung of their employees? What a shock!

You lolbergtarians just love getting your causation backwards, don't you.

[Anonymous No.21385]

>>21288
>This board was created for economics.

>Therefore my controlled economy beliefs are automatically accepted

>>>/northkorea/

[Anonymous No.21411]

>>21385
That's evidence of a manipulated dollar, NOT a manipulated wage.

>the rich get richer while the poor get poorer
Well... yeah.

In a society where all entry level jobs are either outsourced or automated, the only jobs left are white collar jobs, where anyone not capable of white collar jobs are left competing for a handful of badly paying jobs.

Welcome to the west, get a degree, get a technical skill or go to Asia to work in a sweatshop

[Anonymous No.21454]

[Anonymous No.21459]

>>21288
>not understanding that quote is an epistemological statement about economics in general

[Anonymous No.21470]

>>21411
>In a society where all entry level jobs are either outsourced or automated
I wonder if the minimum wage or the needlessly complex regulatory system has anything to do with that...

[PlατΩ ( ´∀｀) !!kGRAAvdSlhs No.21482]

>>21288

>implying empiricism

inb4 you call me an Austrian, because I'm not.

[Anonymous No.21505]

>>21459
SO THIS

[Anonymous No.21522]

>>21470
Of course, but it's actually to plan (a bad plan...)

The west has this delusion that it doesn't need a lowerclass and can maintain equality at a middleclass level, with a handful of taxpaying upperclass people who have foreign investments. When you realise that the east is very willing to play the part of our lowerclass, this idea makes a lot of sense... until you realise that there's a sizeable minority (between 20 and 50%?) of people in the west who are completely incapable of contributing as a middleclass or upperclass person, their only option in this scenario is to be welfare queens... to which this costs the government lots of money.

Greece is the perfect example of this idea failing hard.

[Anonymous No.21706]

>>21505
Why is Raven so damn sexy

[Anonymous No.21808]

>>21288
>being a keynesian
>on a libertarian board

Lol seriously, why do you think everyone makes fun of your retarded beliefs on here.

Go back to reddit, this is the economics board.

[Anonymous No.21824]

>>21356
>You mean to say, rich countries don't actually need a minimum wage because corporate can naturally provide a living wage to even the lowest rung of their employees?

Uh yes, that's what we're actually saying.

Are you seriously this retarded?

Kill yourself

[Anonymous No.21859]

>>21808
>Go back to reddit, this is the economics board.
This.

BRB, emailing moot to change the name of the board to business, finance and economics

[Anonymous No.21958]

>>21859
>BRB, emailing moot to change the name of the board to business, finance and economics
I was JUST going to fucking do that.

Damn

[Anonymous No.21971]

>>21958
Do it as well, it's more convincing if two or more people email moot than if one person emails moot.

[Anonymous No.22000]

>>19917

Well, his company Euro Pacific capital has done well as far as i can tell. Assuming he puts his money where his mouth is then I figure he's not the worst person to take advice from.

[BismuthVectoring !FRESHtYylA No.22073]

>>20033
>and it's been shown to be extremely destructive wherever it's been tried.
>American Samoa
>Relevant economy

>>20089
>>21034
Spain entered recession because they lowered the minimun wage and began to give billions in loans. The Spanish economic crysis was pretty much a prelude to the 2009 crysis.

Argentine here. minimun wage is what saves the country from crumbling under the goverment's retardation. Minimun wage also prevents abuse of the lower worker rungs, something that's a huge problem.

High minimun wages are not a cause, they are a consequence of bad economic policies on part of the goverment.

Lowering the minimun wage on times of economic recession is basically suicide. On certain not-in.recession countries, like America, lowering the minimun wage would be also problematic because Americans are rabid dogs when it comes to caring for workers.

>>20135
>Comparing a small country to a major power

[Anonymous No.22104]

>>22073
>>American Samoa
>>Relevant economy

>YOUR EXAMPLE THAT COMPLETELY DESTROYS MY ARGUMENT DOESN'T COUNT BECAUSE MY BUTT HURTS
>THE LAWS OF ECONOMICS DON'T APPLY WHEN MY BUTT HURTS

[Anonymous No.22124]

>>22073
>Spain entered recession because they lowered the minimun wage
I seriously can't stop laughing.

>Minimun wage also prevents abuse of the lower worker rungs, something that's a huge problem.
Minimum wage makes sure the lower rungs don't even exist. It destroys the lower class and prevents from from getting jobs.

Why do you think the countries in europe with NO minimum wage are doing so good?

>Lowering the minimun wage on times of economic recession is basically suicide.
Then why are all of these other countries doing far better than countries with mimimum wage.

You're really really desperate here.

>because Americans are rabid dogs when it comes to caring for workers.
Businesses have no control over wage rates, they cannot dictate wages, the labour market does that

[Anonymous No.22135]

>>22073
You actually think economic laws don't exist in smaller countries?

Are you actually this retarded?

Get off this board lefttard.

[Anonymous No.22186]

>>22124
>Minimum wage makes sure the lower rungs don't even exist
This.

The only way to ensure both minimum wage and lower rungs exist is by devaluating the dollar to stupid levels. For instance, to keep up with China and have a 15 dollar minimum wage, the USD must devalue by 1500%. This is essentially tricking the people of a nation, instead of tricking the corporations which a responsible government should be doing.

Then again, it's easier to trick the people instead of trick the corporations.

[Anonymous No.22219]

>>22000
Are you serious? His clients post 2008 have lost upwards of 60%. He's been wrong about everything except the housing bubble.
Or do you mean him and his company? Because I'm sure he does okay for himself.

[BismuthVectoring !FRESHtYylA No.22226]

>>20830
It disproved it on the long run.

A well managed economy will recover even if it has a high minimun wage. Then the wage can be safely lowered.

>>22124

>Minimum wage makes sure the lower rungs don't even exist. It destroys the lower class and prevents from from getting jobs.

Then why is unemployement on Argentina not a problem (Even whem everything else is)?. If we don't rise wages our country risks a nationwide strike, so we literally rise the wages every passing year. However unemployement beyond people who don't want to work hasn't been a problem since 2001.

>Then why are all of these other countries doing far better than countries with mimimum wage.

Because their goverments are not shit and know how to manage an economy? Context is important. Examples of things that look the same but have entirely different causes does not to refute the argument, just tries convince others you are right and makes you look like an idiot. It's some sort of fallacy I can't remember the name of. The state of a country's economy ultimately befalls on the goverment's conpetence when it comes to regulating it, including wether to adopt socialist-like measure or liberal-like ones and how it responds to certain problems.

You can't simply compare an easy to manage country with low population with a monster with over 50 million people living in it. The difference in complexity is just too high.

>Businesses have no control over wage rates, they cannot dictate wages, the labour market does that

Yeah well who are we talking about when we say wages should be lowered or raised? Santa? It's the goverment the one who decides wether to let their companies abuse their workers or not.

>>22186
Exactly, but if you've reached the point where you have to rise the minimun wage, then you have no other choice. In a way, your currency's value indicates how strong your economy is, and trying to force a fake value will only make you bleed money (Like Argentina did in the 90s)

[Anonymous No.22263]

>>22226
>and trying to force a fake value will only make you bleed money (Like Argentina did in the 90s)
Well, that's not entirely true, the Chinese Yuan is essentially a fake, contrived value and they're not doing too badly, unless you're judging China by its living standards.

>Argentina
Aren't Argentina and Chile relatively strong? My impression is that the whole "south American shithole" thing was a bit of a myth.

[BismuthVectoring !FRESHtYylA No.22338]

>>22263
>Aren't Argentina and Chile relatively strong? My impression is that the whole "south American shithole" thing was a bit of a myth.
>Argentina
>relatively strong
>Argentina
>strong

Not since 1900. And even that economic stength was completely fake, as only the burguoise had money, neither the state nor the people had any.

Chile is a regional power, but nobody notices them because they are quite isolationist. They are extremely stable and prone to replace Brazil as the economic powerhouse whenever Brazil fucks up. The third and fourth regional economic powers were us and Venezuela, but dear Cristina and Chavez, not to mention the turk, made sure that is no longer a reality.

>Well, that's not entirely true, the Chinese Yuan is essentially a fake, contrived value and they're not doing too badly, unless you're judging China by its living standards.

China has other things in the ecuation - It has had trillions invested on it from foreigner companies, and the Yuan has been and still is low compared to the dollar. Here we are talking about extremes like making the Yuan on par with the dollar. Even then, Chinese living standards are rising, albait very slowly (To be expected of a 1 billion population).

However if you are talking about them making the Yuan worth less than it actually worths, I have no idea about what would happen on the long run, AFAIK China is the first to do such thing.

[Anonymous No.22379]

>>22263
Argentina is dead in the water. Chile, on the other hand, is easily the best off country in LatAm. Its tremendous mining industry is consistent enough to keep the country's credit and currency up, and Chile's population in general is much less poor than the rest of the continent.