/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>>/biz/

i had a few bitcoins a long time ago when it blew up, sold when it was around 400

something rubs me the wrong way about them... seems like a ponzi scheme. Kinda bugs me to see they broke 1000 on jan 1 because I had this sudden urge to invest my xmas bonus into bitcoin but decided it was too gambly

of course, it was too gambly but i would have won :(

>>1701955
>something rubs me the wrong way about them... seems like a ponzi scheme, he said as Bitcoin has been stable at over 600USD for years now

You are so fucking dumb dude

>>1701955
>something rubs me the wrong way about them... seems like a ponzi scheme
because it is
lolbertarians and ancaps larpers will tell you that bitcoin is the future, anybody with a sense knows this is tulipmania of the XXI century
Now I'm not saying that cryptocurrency isn't the future because it is I'm just saying bitcoin isn't

It's tulips, over and over again.

>>1701956
>he said as bitcoin has been stable
>he said as bitcoin ballooned to over $1000
>he said before it's going to crash again

>>1701955
the main use of bitcoin is tax avoidance. any transaction involving bitcoin involve no taxes. and you can apply this to even currency exchange!

>>1701955
>>1701957
>>1701958
Still waiting on this ponzi scheme to fuck me over

Any idea when it will?

>>1701960
during the next crash, assuming you buy it now.
if you bought when it was $5 I guess it will never fuck you over since it's not going to drop that low any time soon

>>1701961
Where's the ponzi scheme then?

>>1701960
If I could see into the future I'd have made lots of money. The point of bitcoin is that you can't tell when it's going to crash, only that it will.
It'll probably crash back to $500 or so within a year. It won't crash that hard since everyone will be expecting it to bounce back up.

>>1701962
Oh I see, I thought you were actually asking a question, didn't realize you were that other guy that is still butthurt because everybody is not part of tulipmania

>>1701953
In 2010 2 out of every 3 /g/ threads were about buttcoins.

>>1701953
Because even core bitcoin devs know it will go to shit in the end. There was a bunch more that left recently.

Crypto currency is just something used by druggies and thirdworlders.

>>1701966
I must have bought all those Steam games in a dream then

>>1701965
and i couldn't even cash in 1 buttcoin ;_;
>tfw forever poor

>>1701953
>yet i never seen anyone /g/ talk about it.
The first time the bitcoin reached $1000, a huge cryptocurrency rush followed and half of /g/ was populated with *coin threads, "should I get *coin?", and advertising.
Those threads were mainly about business rather than technology and therefore it was decided that all those threads should go in >>/biz/ instead of /g/.

>>1701953

OP I have 3 close friends running an app called lawnmower. More and more banks are picking them up and they're pretty optimistic about the future of it.

Knowing this, I'm still not convinced. Until a crypto comes around that's basic enough for normies to get involved with I'm not buying any of that bs.

When I first saw Bitcoin on /g/ it was way less than a dollar for one.
I think it was something like $0.10 for one?
I used to lurk almost 24/7 at the time so the first time Bitcoin was mentioned on /g/, I saw it.

I even farmed a few coins with my HD4850 at the time, it wasn't actually that hard.

But I thought it's a scam and gave up.
Fuck.

>>1701971
imagine, how different your life would be today..

>Mfw every Bitcoin thread filled with jellymads who didn't get in early enough

>>1701971

The dirty little secret no one wants to mention is that Bitcoin is "worth" $1000 the same way a destroyed EVE Online ship is "worth" $1000: it actually isn't. You can't turn the fake currency (bitcoin or ISK) into real currency without losing 90%+ of it to the thirdworlders you're selling the fake currency to.

>>1701974
>You can't turn the fake currency (bitcoin or ISK) into real currency without losing 90%+ of it to the thirdworlders you're selling the fake currency to.

Weeeeeeeeeew

>>1701975

Feel free to show me where I can get a thousand US dollars sitting on my desk in return for my one bitcoin.

>>1701976
Right before you show us where you're losing 90%+ for selling

Made about 15k from this ride with the initial investment of 200€
Got in during the first hype period at around 150$

It was fun, but damn exhausting.
If I didn't sell them during the last high, I'd have something along the lines of 100k now.
I don't regret one bit though, if anything I'm happy that I'm out of this game.
The coin is too damn volatile to store your funds in and requires nearly constant attention.

>>1701974
>ou can't turn the fake currency (bitcoin or ISK) into real currency without losing 90%+ of it to the thirdworlders you're selling the fake currency to.
Really? Why is that?

I never held onto any of them so I never researched how you actually sell them.

I still don't understand how bitcoin is considered a currency.
Can't something only have a value if your local government recognizes it at such? How do you turn it into real money?

>>1701980
nothing has value, only IF humans desire it, for example Gold has no value but it's shiney

>>1701980
same as real currency, The goverment just states it is worth 1$. The fact that it is worth 1$ is backed up by the goverment.
BitCoin is just people saying this is worth 1$ and everyone who wants to buy them says yes here is 1 dollar, because it is harder to get new bitcoins today they get more rare so there wont be endless stream of bitcoins which helps with there growing price because people want 1 but there are not "enough" for everybody. Same with lets say rare post stamps they are only so much worth because they are limited in supplies and everyone is saying they are worth 1$.

You could literally crash the whole market if that guy who first started with bitcoins would start selling his off.

>>1701976
Okay. Coinbase.

>>1701979
No, not really. You can sell the shit on a market right now and get paid. The market will take a cut, but it's like 2% or some shit.

>>1701980
>Can't something only have a value if your local government recognizes it at such?
Common misconception. The reality is that you should replace "your local government" with "the entity you're making a transaction with"

It's dependent on who you're transacting with to accept Bitcoin or not. And yes, the number of people/companies/retailers who accept bitcoin directly is actually relatively low right now, but they do exist.

A good way to think about it is, generally in the U.S. pretty much anyone is going to accept the U.S. Dollar, but you may have trouble getting a local momNpop shop to accept your American Express card.

For example, turns out Steam accepts bitcoin directly for games, and anything on their store really.

Want to buy fancy electrogizmonics? Newegg accepts bitcoin directly.

There's also third-party companies that act as middlemen for larger retailers. For example Purse (dot io) acts as a front-end for Amazon. You give Purse an item link, and the Bitcoin-value for that item, Purse will buy it on Amazon and ship it to you. (Cont'd)

you made $15,000 with 200 dollar investment? i call bullshit

>>1701985
meant for
>>1701978

>>1701980
>Can't something only have a value if your local government recognizes it at such? How do you turn it into real money?
How does anything have value? Does the government assign value to precious metals and gems? Do they assign value to things like confederate bank notes that are not considered legal tender?
No, they don't. People agree to pay other forms of currency in exchange for these things. It works the same way with Bitcoin.

>yeah b-but gold is like useful or something
Don't give me that shit. Nobody is buying cut diamonds so they can smash them up and use them to make drill bits.

>>1701985
Depends on when he got in. It's totally possible if he bought BTC like 5 years ago. People used to give Bitcoin away on /g/ when they were $0.15 each.

>>1701953
>yet i never seen anyone /g/ talk about it.
It got old and we tried to make Dogecoin a thing but it flopped.

>>1701981
It's shiny and it's a good conductor, plus it never deteriorates, if it was useless then why would a sector like NASA spend billions on gold in the Aerospace doohickeys?

>>1701990
What about Gold 6000 years ago, was it used to build the pyramids? think before you write ffs

Ok so you can buy stuff with bitcoins but can you actually convert them directly into dollars anywhere? Is there a bitcoin exchange of some sort? Or do you have to just find people willing to buy them off you?

>>1701992
there is a exchange which is basically people wanting to buy them

>>1701992
>Is there a bitcoin exchange of some sort?
There is, but they do this for a fee of course. And generally, you don't want to do this because then you lose the benefit of having an anonymous digital currency.

>>1701984 (me)
>>1701980

Continued

There are also companies that essentially function as Bitcoin banks, though they're not 100% liked by the Bitcoin enthusiast community, mostly because a whole lot of people view Bitcoin as a way to escape the banking system.

They will issue you a Visa card and hold Bitcoins for you. In this way you can spend Bitcoin anywhere Visa is accepted.

So yes, right now it's _mostly_ a whole bunch of end-arounds and middle men where you can kind of get people to accept your bitcoin.

As per your other question:
>How do you turn it into real money?
There are several means by which you can exchange national fiat for bitcoin. Some easier than others, some give more freedom than others.

The usual go-to, if you're talking in terms of the US Dollar, is a banking company called Coinbase. They allow you to link your bank account directly (especially easy if you bank with a big national brand like Bank of America) and can "sell" your bitcoins automatically for you, and transfer to your bank account.

>>1701990
Do you think gold would be worth as much as it is if people only cared about the shininess or it's industrial uses? People pay out the ass for real gold and gems even though imitations can be made that are aesthetically identical to everyone who isn't an experienced jeweler. People pay for rarity and the value that was assigned to certain substances by society as a whole.
Think about it. A girl would be upset if her husband got her a wedding ring set with a zircon, but she'd never know the difference between her ring and a real diamond ring unless someone told her.

>>1701953
>>>/biz/
Your thread is against the rules.

>>1701985

Day trading these coins is piss easy.
The market is, or was, full of extremely skiddish people who react the most predictable way possible.
>Price is 510, if it hits 499 I'm going to sell everything!
So people sell, it's just a matter of guessing where the bottom is and I got damn good at it.
I kept on doing that, messed with LTC and other coins, got in on some good climbs and that's about it.
Many people made similar climbs from these, even more than I did. But many of them lost it too.
The difference is that I kept my feet on the ground and played things relatively safe.
I never thought that this was going to climb from 1k upwards and it didn't. It was mostly riding on hot air and China rumors and there was some clear manipulation going on.
As you can see from those sells, I never tried to chase the maximum highest profit.
Slowly sold on the way up and then washed my hands from it when it started coming down.
I got rid of my last remaining coin around 400 when I thought that the damn thing was dead for good and was clearly falling to the 200 region.
It was fun but god damn tiring.
Wouldn't do it again even if I could.

>>1701988
I mentioned I got in around 150$, that's when /g/ was hyping the fuck out of it.

>>1701997
No it isn't, you cock smoker. There's nothing in the rules that says cryptocurrency threads are not allowed on /g/.

>>1701992
>Is there a bitcoin exchange of some sort?
Since there's a fixed amount of bitcoins, the exchange happens when people want to buy bitcoins.

>>1701985
There was a Norwegian dude that turned 150 NOK (~18 USD) into 5,000,000 NOK (~578,000 USD)

https://www.nrk.no/kultur/bitcoin-historien-gar-verden-rundt-1.11327798

http://www.aftenposten.no/norge/Fra-150-kroner-til-fem-millioner-103080b.html

>>1701965
Yes, until they we're banned after the dogecoin craze.
/biz/ was created as a result.

>>1701995

>They allow you to link your bank account directly

This is going to be great for the feds trying to reclaim their lost tax dollars and it's also going to be great for the Russians that end up buying the database after this site collapses like MTGOX did.

>>>/biz/ was created to keep this shit off /g/.

>>1701969
Nope, it started getting the hype at around $100, along with 9gag and the like.
Which made it gain value and burst in the end.
Pajeets did all kind of crazy stuff for literally cents.

>>1702002
Unfortunately they have to do it to be able to operate in the US. The FBI's dick is long and hard. They shut down the only offshore exchanges that were taking US customers.

fuck, i knew i should have stocked up on Buttcoins in October.

*sigh* no more drugs til the next crash.

>>1702003
Go cry about it in /ptg/ or /chinkshit/ thread #8234925 or something.

>>1701971
>thinking it was a scam
And how would they scam you?
I swear, tech illiterates like you are the worst.

>>1702008
Wasting power on an imaginary ponzi scheme.

At the time it cost more to run your GPU than what you made from bitcoins

>>1701976
But coke. You would make at least 2x as much selling it.>>1701977

>>1702009
Which is why nobody mines BTC anymore unless they're part of a botnet.

>>1702011
>>1702009
What about miners implemented in FPGAs? Do they also use more power than it's worth now?

>>1701985
People made millions during the initial Bitcoin frenzy.

>>1702012
for years, even the first ASIC generations are outdated by now

>all these etatists shilling against bitcoin
Toplel, gb2 reddit, where you belong.

>>1702013
you don't have to keep reminding me what could of been!

Bitcoin is poop. Ethereum is the future.

>>1702016
Don't worry, I hurt myself just as much in making that post.

Lmao, bitcoins are not even real.

>>1701953
what's the next fad/scam, /g/?

>>1702017

Another bagholder who bites the dust, ah? ;)

I got 300 Bitcoins for a photo of my ass on /g/ years ago, cashed out at $450. Regret nothing

>>1702094
>I got 300 Bitcoins for a photo of my ass
you should make a motivator of this with the photo of your ass and saying here is what 300btc looks like

>>1702094
tits or gtfo

>>1702094
it was obvious that it would rise again, at least to $600 or so
you fucked up

>>1701957
China and India are dumping hundreds of millions into it over the next couple of months, dumbass. I didn't know /biz/ was so uninformed. Do you think it's just a bunch of random plebs putting their money into btc at this point? Serious organizations with lots of money are in it now.

>>1702110
I keep hearing you sperge this but am yet to see a source

>>1701970
American normies? Or what's your metric here? Because I'm pretty sure the Chinese and India normies picking it up over the next couple of months will have no trouble figuring it out.

>>1701976
You realize BTC is exchanged for USD these days, right? Here you go, newb.

http://www.coindesk.com/information/sell-bitcoin/

Cryptoportfolio masterrace here

Holding 40k worth of
BTC
ETH
XMR

Diversify and get on my level

>>1701978
You know you'll buy in next time it dips significantly though. The volatility won't last forever and when it goes does, it will be more useful as a currency, but less exploitable as an investment opportunity.

>>1701990
By that argument, bitcoin has a useful function as well. As a currency, it's more convenient than gold in many ways.

>>1701994
>And generally, you don't want to do this because then you lose the benefit of having an anonymous digital currency.
It's only pseudonymous and yes, linking it to an account that requires identification exposes you. But what do you do if you want to cash out for USD? You either need an exchange or you need someone who can buy in person.

>>1702119
>I keep hearing you
>It was my first post ITT
Try google, you mong. It's not like I have some deep insider info on this.

>>1702137
40k each or just 40k total? wouldnt want to be bagholding ethereum long term, and short term i see more upside in ethereum classic

>>1702166
Why are you negative towards Ethereum?

>>1702177
long term i think its obvious that "dapps" wont see any wide adoption, and the catastrophic dao failure and contentious hardfork both make it a bad bet long term imo. etc is still ~20% of ethereum, thats huge.

most instances where "dapps" are intended to be used are unnecessary and also still need to take external information outside of the ethereum blockchain to be useful. yeah sure theres augur and others that try and provide this information but its still a giant mess. for most users they wont care and be fine with a centralised solution that does the most important part (i.e. value transfer) on the blockchain.

this also excludes all the shady money-gram "ico"s raising money in eth where the end goal is to dump the ethereum so they can pay for whatever "development" they do, sliding the price of ether down even more.

>>1702224
and i do hold ether and classic but theyre not long term bets for me in the slightest

>>1702224
>long term i think its obvious that "dapps" wont see any wide adoption,
How is it obvious and why?

>>1702233
just look at the ones being developed. at one point the "huge" one was door locks controlled by ethereum. i mean come on, this is pets.com shit. people are just in cash-grab mode without thinking about if what they're building is actually useful. in fact this explains the altcoin market pretty perfectly.

also, it seems to be a poisonous trend for each new useless dapp to require its own token to operate, how many of them actually just use eth? the complexity theyre creating will make it literally impossible to normal users to understand. its complexity for the benefit of the creaters of the applications, and theyre killing the platform in the process.

>>1702254
i will admit digix is one that looks somewhat useful, but they're still not close to launching, and instead have their shitty dgd coin trading on sliding volume for sliding value. but really aside from demurrage fees theres no reason for it to be a dapp, it could just be a tradable token like USDT.

>>1701953
/g/? Can mods move threads between boards?

>>1701957
What cryptocurrency is going to be the future if not bitcoin? If we start seeing major websites support bitcoin purchases it's over and you were wrong.

>>1702268
I've never seen it but it looks like they can. The first half of this thread doesn't have IDs

>>1701956
Wasn't Bitcoin at around $200 during a portion of 2016?

>>1702496
2015, 220 or abouts, turning point of the end of the 2 year bear trend

>>1701953

Because the less you talk about Bitcoin the more you can buy for yourself

>>1701961

Using that logic, your precious government is a money laundering Ponzi scheme.

>>1701971
>be an oldschool /g/ fag
>tfw there was a time when CPU mining was efficient as fuck
>my 3.2ghz Q6600 could mine 300+ bitcoin a day in late 2009
>still holding 10,000 coins all self mined
>still own the Lamborghini I bought with bitcoins
>no mortgage at 30
>living off investments/money from bitcoins

I'll admit, I am one of the few lucky ones

>>1701978

That's the same amount I made. It almost destroyed my relationship and was making me lose my mind.

I ended up cashing out when Dogecoin hit the exchanges. I made $8k in an evening, sold all my mining hardware (14mhash) and bought a puppy.

GF and I are very happy, puppy is 3 now. I buy about $25 in bitcoin a month just to hold on to now. I checked recently and was surprised that I had nearly $1000 worth, so that was exciting.

I'm assuming we're going into another bubble based on trends, so I will probably sell when/if it hits 10k a coin. Otherwise I'm just happy with what I have.

>>1702478
xmr will almost inevitably replace bitcoin.

>>1702576
And I'm one of the retards who didn't look into it enough to bother with it.

>>1702576
>still holding 10,000 coins
What's your long game? When do you plan to get off this ride?

>>1702606
clutch those bags tighter. if theres a large enough market for the privacy monero offers bitcoin will inevitably support something similar. it doesnt even need to be added to the protocol.

Tbh a nocoiner but have honestly considered setting aside $100 a month to buy in btc just in case.

It's honestly getting so many big name investsments lately that it would be dumb to assume it won't inflate (in the good way) atleast a little bit more, my guess is $2k then crash.

Even then that would be doubling my investment if I bought now. Maybe increase the amount per month if it keeps going.

>>1702639
Shit coin is shit coin.

>>1701953
Y'all have a discord channe;?

There is a strong evidence currently of a strong manipulation. Watch out for wild price swings

>try to get in on the bitcoin meme
>see this
what in the fuck?

Is there any actual place to buy BTC online with USD via credit card, and not pay 40%+ transaction fees?

Is Kraken safe for US users?

Also what does it mean on local bitcoins when payment is "serve2serve"?

>>1702639
its a good idea because its a good bet against inflation. if you are not a good trader, there is nothing bad about dollar cost averaging.

>>1703168
they must have a problem with people doing chargebacks. go normal route, like coinbase or something that uses bank wires.

>>1703168
You can buy with credit card on bitstamp. Just pay fees up the ass.

>>1701955
>seems like a ponzi scheme.
Retards who don't understand technology probably shouldn't be investing in it.

Bitcoin is digital currency. Saying bitcoin is a ponzi scheme is like saying gold is a ponzi scheme. Yes gold. The us dollar can be inflated, that's the ponzi scheme, Bitcoin cannot be inflated.

Crashing to $100

Shit don't be gay send me some coin
Poor fag here would appreciate it

34WUhmnUM6Q1gdkSY1BmEaEgcXedTbFdEF

>>1702137
good work coin brother, I'm at 60k.

Only BTC for me tho, I don't do alts.

There is some big money coming into BTC this year with the new ETFs coming online. Very big Wall St money is about to wash in. Even at $16Billion market cap bitcoin is tiny. Hold on...

>>1703384
hope they become trillionaires so they can buy FB and fire the JEW.
WASPS THRIVE AGAIN!

>>1701977
Holy shit you are dumb af. Myself and a friend mined for BTC about 5 years ago. We ended up getting about 5 BTC each. After that, I just made a wallet, and thew them into Coinbase.

> MFW I woke up and saw they were over $1k after the New Year
> I sold one BTC on the exchange yesterday for $1,033 and Coinbase only kept around $19 USD
> I linked my Chase bank account to Coinbase to withdraw the funds, delivery into my account of $1,014 USD by Friday
> TFW I sold fake, internet money for shits and giggles, and have an extra $1k that I can afford to spend on house renovations to build more equity.

>>1702620
If bitcoin hardforks to copy monero it will die.

Bitcoin will probably win in the end if it gets side chains off the ground. In the short-medium term though Monero is private and can scale. Bitcoin is hitting the 1mb block limit on every block that isn't mined unusually fast. Monero has utility that Bitcoin does not.

The Bitcoin network is safer than Monero due to having more miners and a simpler protocol that has been around for longer. A sidechain that allows for private transactions and more transactions built on top of bitcoin will make bitcoin functional again and if developed in time will probably make bitcoin the unassailable leader as the future of money.

Monero is the best currency there is in the world right now though. It will still need sidechains to support visa levels of transactions but for now it should be able to support all the drug deals people can throw at it with the bonus that no-one can trace your transactions and throw you in jail. It's just a shame that multi-sig hasn't been completed though there is a theoretical implementation.

>>1703384
The black swan event will be when one relatively important government starts to acquire some and seeing this, other governments battle each other to buy up as much as they can.

Though I can't help but think how funny it would be if Monero takes Bitcoin's cake and the Winklememes get nothing again!

Many years ago my little brother (he was 13 back then) mined bitcoin because he thaugh it was cool. I laughed at him because i just thought of it as pretend money. He laughed at me when he sold his coins for like 0.2$ and made like 50$.
I was like no way, i could have made 50$...
For some reason i dont remember we never tried to mine any coins after that.

>>1703638
You don't get it. Monero's dynamic blocksize will be it's downfall. If demand increases = blocksize increases = network becomes decentralized.

Bitcoin's conservative blocksize is a feature, since it's the only way to keep the network decentralized.

>tfw when $50 worth of btc sitting in a wallet i cant access
fuck m e, man

>>1703645
>The black swan event will be when one relatively important government starts to acquire some and seeing this
fbi has quiet a few bitcoins neger

>>1703820

>he doesn't know about the dynamic fee

its expensive to get in the Monero blockchain it can't grow uncontrollably

>>1703828
Doesn't matter. If Monero had Bitcoin's current usage (and is still far from mainstream) the blocksize would be too big for people to host on their computers. They will not bother.

>>1703832

I'll be far too rich to care about this problem

>>1703832
>If Monero had Bitcoin's current usage

btw this is a lie and you'll eat these words like all Monero haters over the years, Monero increase 8x faster than Bitcoin in the worst case scenario, if you can store 100 GB you can stora 800 GB

whats the right price to get in on bitcoin?

waiit for it to go back down to 300$?

>>1703841
Monero is not going to have a second layer solution like LN so good luck with that.

>>1703841
you sound just like the litecoin + dogecoin supporters did

>>1703852

you are right, its going to have something better than that and before bitcoin

>>1703860
such as?

>>1703844
Never getting anywhere near back to these prices, it may have a slight correction but nothing like it did last time with the crash of mtgox.

>>1703841
Storing 800Gb is not that big of a deal. The problem will be downloading a 800Gb blockchain. Who the hell gonna do that?

>>1703871

It's generally accepted that you can't scale on-chain. If you were to throw Visa levels of transactions per second at any blockchain (Monero, Ethereum, Bitcoin, etc.) it would catastrophically fail.

Second layer solutions are needed to take the load off the blockchain. That's what the Lightening Network (LN) is designed to do. It will allow people to spend money without generating an on-chain transaction. Only in disputes (and other edge cases) would it be necessary to resolve back onto the blockchain.

LN is initially being developed for Bitcoin. But theres nothing special in its design preventing it from being used on Monero (as far as I know). If it works on Bitcoin, almost assuredly someone will port it over to Monero. Someone may even be working on a Monero version at this point in time, but I haven't heard of anyone doing it yet.

>>1703638
it wont have to hardfork, you can build trustless perfect mixers on top of bitcoin right now, the main problem is transaction malleability which segwit is one way of fixing.

then monero's only benefit is balances remain invisble, something most people wont care about when you can mix and split balances between multiple addresses anyway.

sorry your attempt at getting rich after missing the bitcoin bubble isnt going to work out. remember monero is already 15-20x from where it was a few months ago. if you wern't in monero then you've already missed the boat.

>>1703982
LN is nice and all but it's not a magic bullet.
for it to really work seamlessly you need financial institutions (and real world legal and trust relations with them) to be involved that can extend a line of credit so your unspent money is not tied up needlessly.

>>1704034
and if you already got that you don't really need the LN at all the institution can just run a SQL database to settle balances.

>>1703860
the problem with monero is if you want privacy you HAVE to run the full blockchain yourself, connected over tor, or some other ip anonymization network. you CAN'T use a web wallet, a mobile wallet, a shared wallet, etc.

that means everyone that wants privacy (which is its only selling point, as it scales worse than bitcoin when it comes to resource usage) needs to run an independent copy. obviously this is a non-starter for most people. just look at the DNM's, the people doing shady shit that absolutely need the privacy monero offers and most of them are still using bitcoin and the off-chain tumblers that exist today.

for 99.9% of crypto enthusiasts monero just isnt necessary, and for the ones that do need that privacy don't think they wouldnt jump ship to something that becomes easier to use in a heartbeat.

just like every other alt, its maybe 0.1% real usage by people using monero as a coin tumbler for their bitcoins, and the rest just waiting to dump their coins on the next bubble.

>>1704037
on second thought the LN could still be used effectively in trust-less transactions spanning multiple providers. it's just a foreign concept to the financial services that always tried to lean on established trust and legal background.

>>1703168
I actually bought lindendollars (second life currency) with my credit card and bought btc with that, was pretty reasonable, don't know if it still is

>>1701953
How many Chinese do you know in China?

>>1704126
a lot since i am chinese

>>1701953
Most people on /g/ are consumer whores who replace their smartphone every six months

They know how to virtue signal, make gay headphone threads, and scold anyone who posts about crypto and tell them to come here

>>1701962
You need more cryptocoincucks to buy your bag or it is worthless.

Ponzi

>>1705198
sorry you missed the boat, bud.

>>1701985
I made 40k with a $400 investment in Ethereum which is bitcoin 2.0

Suck my dick

Then i lost all the bitcoins gambling fml

>>1701992
Im suprised you have the braincells nescessary to breathe

https://discord.gg/jtBmHwJ


>>1701953
/G/ IS RETARD

>>1701953

Does BTC inadvertently create new currency when it's cashed out?

>>1701980

>Can't something only have a value if your local government recognizes it at such?

The market is what determines what has value, and how much value something has.

An exception is fiat currency, i.e money that only has worth by fiat, which means government declaration.

Fiat paper currency is not money. The U.S Constitution even says that only gold and silver can be used as money, since you can't create them at will like you can paper currency.

BTC is more of a "money" than paper dollars are.

>>1703821
wow $50 which color are you getting your lambo in?

>>1701955
that's why peeps like you shouldn't even posting here

>>1705705
>Fiat paper currency is not money.

I know you think you're trying to make a point but come on.

>>1701976
i used coinbase in '13

>>1701978
Lets not forget the fact that you will be quite fucked if it decides to dip one day.
Unless you'd wait until the next bubble and double down.
If there's a next bubble.

>>1702156
gyft.com they also have an app. you can buy gift cards for any of the major big box stores and amazon gift cards for bitcoin.

problem solved dumbasses

>>1703168
>buying actual bitcoins
>not just investing in them through an online trading account

Fucking retards, enjoy your transaction fees. Meanwhile I will buy and sell as I please, with just a couple of clicks and 0% commission

>>1701970
>Until a crypto comes around that's basic enough for normies to get involved with I'm not buying any of that bs.

In other words, you'd only get involved once it's too late?

>>1706823
>implying this is a bubble

Steady uptrend for the last 15 months bru.

>>1701959
> the main use of bitcoin is tax avoidance
WRONG

i'm not sure how anyone would know the main use of bitcoin.
The current price increase is because people/the markets are looking at it as a very liquid alternative to gold.

>>1701960
i'm not sure how big it will crash when it does.
There are BILLIONS if not TRILLIONS looking to buy the dip once it falters even 3%.

>>1701963
i wouldn't be convinced we're ever going to see $500/BTC again.
When it crashes, the capital and infrastructure is there to keep it stable.

>>1701970
95% if not more people don't invest in gold.
doesn't have to hit mainstream for it to be HUGE.
you only need:
- Paypal to introduce it
- Stripe to push it more
- 1% of Gold investment to move to BTC
one of these to happen and BTC will hit $2k

>>1701971
the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over again and expecting different results.
You missed the Super early signs, your disappointed now.
How are you going to feel in 1 year when BTC $2k and you ignored your gut feeling a 2nd time?
Even if you just understand crypto, your in a better position to invest now than the average joe.

>>1701973
i only got in 6 weeks ago. already 35% returns.
currently making more than minimum wage on passive income.
> comfy.jpg

>>1701974
> Bitcoin is "worth" $1000 the same way a destroyed EVE Online ship is "worth" $1000: it actually isn't.
well done anon, you''ve figured out fiat currency.
The gold people horde is only worth what people will give you for it.
The cash in your wallet is only worth what someone will give you for it

> without losing 90%+ of it to the thirdworlders
What? its not 2013
The huge difference being the billions invested in bitcoin infrastructure.
Bitcoin are more stable and liquid than gold, have been for 24 months.
You can't take a gold bar and exchange it in shops, doesn't mean its a bad investment.

>>1706905
>The current price increase is because people/the markets are looking at it as a very liquid alternative to gold.
This.

Bitcoin is about to hit gold parity btw.

bitcoin: $ 1,130
gold: $ 1,166

Might happen in a few hours, maybe tomorrow.

Strap in boys, this rocket is counting down for liftoff.

>>1706905
Is it a good idea to buy more bitcoin now or wait for a big drop in the future?

>>1702576
pics or didnt happen

>>1706918

I don't think you know what parity is. The gold market is trillions larger than bitcoin.

>>1706925
Not market cap parity obviously, price parity.

>>1706920
I waited for a "big drop" and it never came.

Then some bank fuckery made me have to wait even longer.

Then when I was finally able to buy I immediately went all in, fearing I was buying too high.

That fear didn't last very long, and I'm making money ham over fist now.

By all accounts, this ride only just started. Think of how many non-autists you personally know who own any bitcoin.
Normies haven't even begun to wake up. Now is the time.

>>1706925
Yeah. "BTC price = price of x" is meaningless.

>The gold market is trillions larger than bitcoin.
This is kind of the point. Gold is, at least in part, a hedge against currencies. A tiny fraction of that capital going into bitcoin raises the bitcoin price greatly.

>>1706920
> big drop in the future
I'm not sure there will be a "big dip" anon.
Talk of a dip down to $500 is laughable at this point.

IF it dropped 10% i would BUY BUY BUY the dip and plough money into bitcoin because of mid to long term projections.
I'm sure there are BILLIONS waiting to buy the dip, aka the dip will never come.

>>1706926
>>1706925
do you or anyone have the meme of how much bitcoin market cap is worth compared to mastercard, visa, gold and retirement?


>>1706935
THIS
A MILLION TIMES THIS

Think how esoteric bitcoin is to the normies.
Their retirement funds are going to put TRILLIONS into it before they even need to know anything about Bitcoin.


Simlest way to explain to a normie what bitcoin is, is:
> Digital Gold

>>1706943
>Yeah. "BTC price = price of x" is meaningless.
Except it makes for terrific headlines.

Imagine all those paranoid goldbugs getting wind of a vastly superior way of stashing/investing/transporting wealth than heavy shiny metals.

Just so everyone realises what they are missing.
BTC has gone up 10% in 22 hours.

>>1706949
the banks will figure it out BEFORE the normies do.

Bitcoin and crypto as part of a well balanced portfolio will become standard practise 2017

>>1706935
Why are you so confident in your ability to predict something that has not been around for even a decade? There's no established trends. You're full of shit and guessing just like everyone else. All it takes is bad news, a better product to gain acceptance, bad leglisation and many other factors such as technical limitations and it can tank. Will you admit your just wishing for the best and you don't have any actual in depth analysis?

>>1706955
Yes.
Bankers are pragmatic, they'll join 'em if they can't beat 'em.

Even if that Winklevoss bitcoin ETF thing doesn't go through (decision to be made on March 11 btw), there are going to be many more foaming at the bit to get the scoop.

>>1706935
>>1706947
This convinced me.
Just bought some more BTC.
What's a good wallet to use?
I currently use electrum on a tails bootable, is that safe enough?

>>1706935
>ham

I decided there wasn't going to be a correction and bought more at 1k it's at 1120 now ,there are no brakes on this train

>>1706960
>Why are you so confident in your ability to predict something

The way things are going, it's looking VERY good for bitcoin.

Just look at:
- geopolitics (EU eating shit, China's economy on thin ice, war on cash and gold in many key places, ...)
- the consistent bitcoin uptrend these past 15-16 months
- upcoming headline fodder (gold price parity, ETF acceptance incoming, tech improvements like segwit, ...)
- the vast (VAST) potential for growth (1% of the gold/silver market = $ 6k per bitcoin)
- the basic features of bitcoin (no executive boardrooms full of sharks and politicians, easy-to-achieve anonymity, ...)

And a bunch more I'm skipping over off the top of my head.

Of course there's going to be risk, but right now is probably the best possible time to get into bitcoin for anyone without the power of foresight.

After all, Bitcoin has already bubbled, and is now showing a very strong resilience and stability for over a year now. That's about as "proven" as it gets without waiting for mainstream acceptance.

>>1706951
Nearly 100% since I first bought in september.

>>1706960
> bad news
bad news about bitcoin all the time
bitcoin has recovered successfully from all prior trouble and come back stronger

> a better product
happens all the time
thousands of alt coins
bitcoin will remain the "gateway coin" for some time tho. another will come along to serve as "pocket cash", this doesn't threaten bitcoin.

> bad leglisation
except bitcoin is possibly bigger already than any single state.
its getting to the point that "you couldn't tank it if you wanted to"

> technical limitations
bitcoin has had them before, and will have them again.
in the next 6 months there are more bug fixes and improvements that will be done than discover.

> wishing for the best
yes

> don't have any actual in depth analysis
you tell me.
where is yours?

Normies will be begging my cock for bitcoinz, but I wont give them any. They will work at Mcdonalds for fiat and end up cannibalizing themself, and it will be a zombie apocalypse. Bitcoin will be the only currency in the world and there wont be enough.

>>1706969
Good choice anon!

Don't panic sell the dip when it comes.

BUY THE DIP and look for med to long term gains.

>>1706951
Bubble about to burst

>>1706969
I use Electrum.

Here's a super easy step-by-step for setting up a "cold" wallet and creating an encrypted back-up.
http://www.w3bdeveloper.com/how-to/how-to-store-bitcoins-on-a-usb-drive-using-electrum/

Keep the wallet and back-up on separate drives.

Some advice: don't try to short bitcoin (i.e. trying to buy low and sell high after a few hours), and don't keep your coin on exchange websites.

Keep it in cold storage, and keep an eye on how things develop.
Don't sweat the dips, you'll regret it.
There was a dip around Christmas that fucked with my head and made me act a fool, and I was lucky to break even.
I bought in again last Sunday, and I'm simply going to hold now.

>>1706994
this

i have a dream of the future, i'll share it with you.

> 2025
> bitcoin destroyed fiat
> alt right bought in big to bitcoin in 2017
> used the sweet gains to fund sex robots, right wing death squads and real political power
> autism rules the world
> we jews now

anyone else seen this future?

>>1706969
>>1706999
And write down the seed phrase (all those random words).

Write them down on a bunch of piece of paper and store them in different locations, so you don't lose them all if your house/building burns down.

>>1706999
>>1707023

Checked.
Yeah I have got into the habit of moving my bitcoin off the exchange as soon as I get it.
Don't want to get Goxed.

Good idea, I will make a backup for the install and write down the phrases in a few other places.

Also, is 2fa worth having or just a meme?

>>1706997
>Bubble about to burst
you've been coping with this since 400 dollars.

>>1707036
It's really easy to do, you just install an app that generates new codes every so many seconds, and you enter that code after you entered your password.
I guess it's another layer of security, for peace of mind if nothing else.

>>1707042
Yeah I already have it, just figured I would ask.
There's something magical about buying bitcoin, I don't want to get off this ride.

>>1707069
Let's just be grateful we got in when the getting in was good.

>>1706990
not a single altcoin is a better product

Chinks discovered it and are trying to launder their money outside of Commieland.

Be ready for a sharp reversal.

>>1706860
where?

>>1707126
Except a lot of the latest boosts aren't even coming from the Chinese.

>>1703428
mfw when I mined a coupled of btc because that SETI screensaver became too boring.
sold them all last year for 400 euros each

>because I thought this whole thing is going nowhere anymore

>>1707006
just remember, once they switch off the internet, it's over for bitcoin

Should I buy?

>>1707509
> once they switch off the internet
IF this happened, it would also be the end of:
- google
- facebook
- twitter
- amazon
- paypal
- ebay
and a billion other internet companies.

come on anon.
>over for bitcoin
coping this hard.

Have a look at Lightening Network.
It takes the load "off blockchain", you'd only need todo refunds "on block".

you could have a remote village that uses bitcoin and only gets a secure connection to the internet ever week or so.... and it would work FINE

SF Bitcoin Devs Seminar: Scaling Bitcoin to Billions of Transactions Per Day
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zVzw912wPo

>>1701957
>tulipmania of the XXI century

compare the charts of other bubbles like tulipmania, the south sea bubble, beanie babies, etc. and you will see that Bitcoin doesn't fit. If Bitcoin was simply a bubble, the price would have crashed in 2014-2015 and never recovered.

Tulips, beanie babies, etc. have no functional use. Bitcoin and the blockchain are becoming the basis for a new monetary system that is going to be a part of everyday life within the next 10 years. Be careful nocoiners, the window of opportunity is rapidly closing, even though I could care less if you see it or not.

>>1707618

I should also add, it is only a matter of time before you become a "coiner" whether you want to or not. The only difference will be by the time you a forced to become one, the price will be orders of magnitudes more expensive.

>>1707625

How do you think pricing of products/services will go if btc breaks through as a viable currency? It's hard to list a days work for 0.00000123 btc, will units be changed?

>>1707581
>Buying at a 3 year high

>>1707667
>millibits
>microbits
>nanobits

OUTTA MY WAY NANOBIT FUCKING SHITS

>>1707618

>>1707667
I guess it would be priced in as satoshis so like 20k satoshi ,at that point owning a full Bitcoin would be a pipe dream.

>>1707618
Nigger we just got aboard chip and sig (which is garbage compared to chip and pin) in the US (several years behind everyone else) and you're saying this will be good to go in 10 years. Give me a break.

>>1707734
A lot can happen in 10 years ,id say cash will start to be phased out by then

>>1707769
I'd say your full of shit. Governments all of the world aren't going to let that happen, if you think they are going to give up control over their currencies you have another thing coming. US hegemony is based on the petrodollar. They fight proxy wars all over the world to keep it that way and you're telling me buttcoins are going to undermine that.

Get
Fucking
Real

>>1707781
They can't stop it from happening ,not saying Bitcoin will completely take over though but it's going to have a big effect.

>>1707781
I think you misunderstood; governments are cracking down on CASH, not currency.

>>1707801
Sure but if they are worried about trackless cash and willing to crack down on it stands to reason they'll do the same with an outside currency.

I don't doubt crypto can be the future but Governments will implement their own instead of rolling over for bitcoin, which still has technical issues not even mentioning it's outside their immediate control.

I understand this is exciting but you guys need to curb your enthusiasm and try to be realistic. Hope for the best but plan for the worst.

>>1707781
What if citizens reject government issued money? Remotely possible.

>>1707781
they can't even stop people using BitTorrent, no matter how hard the music and movie industry cried.

So how the fuck can they stop Bitcoin. And how the FUCK are they going to stop things like ZCash and Monero.

Bitcoin and things like it will undermine governments and the nation state itself. Get ready

>>1707816
>Hope for the best but plan for the worst.
No arguments here.

But the war on cash (and gold) is very real.
You can't travel with large amounts of cash, you can't buy something like a car with cash, large denomination bills are getting phased out, etc.

From personal experience, when you die the judicial system in mainland Europe will even go through all your withdrawals from the past decade or so to determine how much cash you were supposed to have for inheritance and tax purposes.

>>1707781
>Governments all of the world aren't going to let that happen

They can't stop a P2P currency like bitcoin any more than they can stop illegal P2P file sharing.

Case in point is China, where the government has already tried to outlaw bitcoin by making it illegal for banks to handle any btc related transactions. As you can see by the recent price surge, Bitcoin is still alive and thriving in China.

>>1707821
I don't think that's a realistic assumption to be making. There isn't a precedent for that I'm aware of, besides governments that can't control their currency and monetary policy end up like Greece. Which is bad.

>>1707831
No but those bitcoins aren't in the hands of every day people in China. There in the hands of people already with money trying to shore up against a devaluing yuan.

Have you ever been to China? I have. I taught English there for a year and the only time I heard bitcoin mentioned was from expats and that was maybe once or twice. The average Chinese person isn't worried about internet money and would laugh in your face if you tried to explain it.

>>1707831
>>1707826
They don't have to stop it all. Just enough to be a deterrent.

>>1707831
>They can't stop a P2P currency like bitcoin any more than they can stop illegal P2P file sharing.
all they have to do is very strictly censor the internet.

something they already do.

How is this going to affect bitcoin

>>1701953

jumped onto MGTI when they got delisted and bitcoin was like 700. Thats when they had 1 Petahash mining op and did 170-180 in a month. Now they running 10 petahash which is largest in NA right now and bitcoin is at 1100. On top of that they just released some anti intrusion hardware for business. This stock is about to be a moon mission when q1 reports come out.

In last 2 days stock price has gone up liek 45%. Cant wait for april and q1 report published, gunna not know what to do with all my monies.

>>1707961
A slight drop in activity in China on the eve itself, and then a new Chinese boost when all those rich kids drop their new year's allowances into bitcoin.

>>1701953
Pick several top alt coins and move your profit before gox 2.0 happens

>>1707088
Mondeo is.

>>1707587
>IF this happened, it would also be the end of:
>- google
>- facebook
>- twitter
>- amazon
>- paypal
>- ebay
>and a billion other internet companies.

you mean like
-yahoo
-lycos
-limewire
and napster?

newfag here, why does the price fall when people sell? isn't it that websites actually buy the bitcoins of people when they sell them wtf

COPING THREAD TTT

COPING THREAD TTT

COPING THREAD TTT

>>1701953
if you bought last year, you probably already blew it off on the ETH dump or the ETC scam

>>1707781

>>1702576
I have a CPU exactly like yours, but I got it way late in 2012.
I also didn't pay electricity so that would have been an extra bonus.
I saw bitcoin numerous times when googling, but I never actually sit down to read about it.
I'm in debt now, but I've always been poor since 2008.
I wanted to kill myself in December 2012 without even knowing about shitcoins and Kickstarter.
I'm a talentless faggot with no instincts and I'll continue being a do nothing faggot.
I had many dreams about funding video games, animations, websites, and living in a beautiful third world country where my millions make me look like a billionaire.

Maybe I should end it now. There hasn't been a moment I fantasized harder about time travelling than I do now.

>>1710569
Stop being a faggot, dear faggot.
There are possibilities for investments everywhere. You have to teach and train yourself to see AND seize them! Go to a library or download books about economice, personal finance etc. educate yourself!

>>1707781
petrodollar won't be here forever, BRICS in cooperation with Iran will see to that

>>1707781
Governments can't do shit about bitcoin. They would need to agree globally, which is not going to happen due game theory.

memers btfo

>>1708882
>Yahoo

True.

Damn I wish I had invested in Yahoo back in 1998.

Nice reminder anon, I'm 100% buying Bitcoins now.

>>1710783
>Plunges
>Still more valuable than it was in December.

Yeah.

It's a volatile commodity, sure. But it's holding very well considering both the Mexican and the Chinese governments are trying to manipulate their coins.

>>1702018
>tfw 13 during the dawn of bitcoin
>tfw hadn't even heard of 4chan
>tfw came to this hellhole after it could no longer change my life for the better and inform me of untold riches.

>>1711936
It's literally at $840 now, and falling

That's lower than it was in December.

>>1712002
It was US$750 in december 1st, dumbass

>>1708882
yes very similar.
except ALL of them disappearing, overnight, with no replacements

Put it this way:
> Internet worth > $19 TRILLION
> Bitcoin worth < $20 Billion

yeah, i'm sure they would kill the internet just to stop bitcoin.

Is it worth getting into mining nowadays for bitcoin or any of the alternative ones?

>>1712073
Where do you live?

>>1712074

Germany, why?

>>1712075
Mining is only worth it if you have really low costs of electricity, like in China, Peru, Iceland......

I don't know about Germany though, but I really doubt it is worth to mine there.

>>1712079

Ah gotcha! Yep looks like Germany has like it has among the most expensive electricity costs, about 3 times as much as China's.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/477995/global-prices-of-electricity-by-select-country/

>>1712091
Yep, there goes your profit down the drain.

>>1712091
>https://www.statista.com/statistics/477995/global-prices-of-electricity-by-select-country/

Why do you pay 49 dollars a month to have this statistics?

I know they can be useful, I'm just curious about you.

>>1712097

Oh I dont pay, it was just a quick google search and the prices for most countries are easy to see on the chart. At least for me.