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/biz/ - Business & Finance

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10916138 No.10916138[DELETED]  [Reply] [Original]

Is Lasik worth it?

>> No.10916147

>>10916138
LASEK is better, dumbass.

>> No.10916172

Also is it okay to go with Lasik surgeons by price or should I just go with one that has the most reviews?

I want to save money on the procedure but I don't know if it's worth trying to save a few hundred bucks when dealing with my eyesight lol

>> No.10916182

How much does this shit even cost?

>> No.10916184

>>10916172
just get contacts instead if you are too pussy to get the surgery

>> No.10916225

>>10916184
I already wear contacts. They give me what seems to be 100% perfect vision and comfort but there is an element of maintenance and ongoing costs associated with them ofc.

>> No.10916227

>>10916184
That's what I do
I'll be the first to admit I'm too much of a bitch to have the surgery
That's your eyes man

>> No.10916236

>>10916138
I've had this done my self, in all honesty it's probably one of the best decisions of my life.

I used to have -4.5 in each eye and was pretty blind. Used glasses / contacts which were a hassle.

I could see 50x further the second the op finished when they sat me in a dark room.

Few days after I had 20/20, still have it now after 2 or so years.

It cost me approx 2.4kGBP ,

I say go with a provider that does it regulary, desu it's guided by a machine now rather than the specialist.

Best decision ever.

>> No.10916248

>>10916138
depends. it works but they lie a lot about it. first of all it's not reversible and they lie about the possibility of future correction. you will never be able to wear contacts again. and if your pupils dilate beyond the 6mm area of the surgery you get halos at night or at dawn and very blurry vision that makes driving a car impossible.

>> No.10916252

>>10916172
Always go for higher price. If you're paying for eye surgery and if anything goes wrong, you can at least get some sort of compensation.

>> No.10916258
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10916258

>>10916225
>>10916227
I'm in the same boat guys, wearing contacts but thinking about getting the laser surgery to fix this shit.

>> No.10916278

>>10916258
Tbh guys, just sign up for their news letter and google some discounts..

Literally that simple, they will constantly send you discounts to entice you in.

>> No.10916280

>>10916138
You see Step 2?
There is a tiny circular saw that makes that flap.

You see Step 3?
The laser that shapes the cornea is not perfect, so in Step 4 its not a smooth surface, it has bumps, its imperfect.

Wait ten more years until technology matures even further.

>> No.10916284

>>10916138
Get LASEK. Check the one with most POSITIVE and legit reviews, but don't cheap out. Good luck.

>> No.10916297

>>10916258
the worst part of lasik is your eyes will be the wrong shape for contacts after it and eventually they get worse after surgery weeks or years but your eyes go bad again and there is a good chance there will be no surgery to correct it then. it depends on a lot of things and when you try to discuss these with the company that does it they will promise you there will be no problem and when you get a problem they will just point to the fine print that clearly says you have been informed this can happen. problem is they are understating the risks a lot.

>> No.10916305

Presbyopia/asthenopia happens way (years) earlier if you have this surgery.
Seriously, consider this.

>> No.10916312

Nah, too new. Let the early adopters take the risk.

>> No.10916317

>>10916138

I don't know man, I think I'll just wear glasses instead of getting my eyes Lazored. With my luck I'd propably just end up blind in one eye or something.

>> No.10916322

>>10916138
We used to have a family friend that was a Dr. his bro was a doc also & his bro did the Lasik surgery. We asked Our Doc friend about it as he wore glasses. Basically not a good idea was his answer, even though most have success it is not permeant and to actually shave the eye ball was something you can't come back from. I should point out though as a doc without your vision it would be difficult to do surgery...

So i have never got it done myself, i have -5.5 proscription, legally bind if i am not wearing my glasses.

>> No.10916324

These are your eyes. If there’s any goofup, it’s not coming back. I would never risk my eyes for any amount of money in the world, which is why I’ll stick with contacts.

That said, if there was any significant chance of a goofup they wouldn’t be in business, so I think it’s okay to shop by price on this.

>> No.10916358
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10916358

>>10916324
>I would never risk my eyes for any amount of money in the world, which is why I’ll stick with contacts

I've got bad news anon...

>> No.10916379

>>10916138
>paying to see
Lmao at your life

>> No.10916401

>>10916138
>Wear glasses/contacts all my life. There are pictures of me wearing glasses when I was 2 years old.
>Literally bought a voucher for LASIK from fucking Groupon on a Tuesday. $1400 for both eyes.
>Have consultation that Thursday. I'm a good candidate.
>>We actually have openings for surgery on Saturday if you want to come.
>Ok, book me.
>Go into surgery. The place is like a fucking assembly line cycling through people. Sitting with a bunch of bros... this is weird. All kind of nervous but excited.
>My turn. Sit on table. Bunch of drops in the eye. Suction cup comes down. Vision goes dark and I stare at a kaleidoscope light show for like 20 seconds. Smells a bit like burnt hair.
>>Ok, next eye. Same.
>All of five minutes pass while I'm on the table. Ok, done.
>Next bro is already in the room.
>Take a Lyft home and take my Doctor-mandated nap for the rest of the afternoon. Minor irritation. Reminded me of dry eyes from contacts.
>Wake up. Vision is fucking perfect. Crystal clear.
>Go in on Monday for check up. Vision is 20/15! Fucking amazing.
>Very minor dryness for a few weeks. Just use the drops as the say and it's fine.

Best decision of my life, anon. Yes, there is risk but it is very low. Just don't be a retard. Use your drops as prescribed.

>> No.10916405

I'm waiting for cybernetic eye implants.

>> No.10916411

wait for ocumetics

>> No.10916454

>>10916324
What if you were paid $9999999999?

>> No.10916466

>>10916182
>>10916138
Use a Health Savings account and do it pre-tax

>> No.10916472

its not actually permanent

my mom had it done and it lasted about 10 years

>> No.10916473

>>10916138
coworker got it
eyes were better for like a year
then his eyes have gotten worse and forced to wear glasses its so bad
has to get surgery again with unknown probability if it will improve it

>> No.10916530

I always wanted Lasik but changed my mind after looking into it. My night vision is already pretty bad and I can't afford for it to get worse.

>> No.10916560

>>10916401
That's awesome. How would you compare your previous vision to your 20/15? Is life in HD now?

>> No.10916583

>>10916401
>like a fucking assembly line cycling through people
>$1400 for both eyes

You had me at "assembly line". How much do you think the clinic nets per day?

How much capital does it take to start one of these businesses?

>> No.10916593
File: 54 KB, 887x728, lasik_pupil_size.jpg [View same] [iqdb] [saucenao] [google]
10916593

DONT DO IT.
Thank god I saved the text I posted here before so I dont have to write it all again, I am fucking tired
I was nearsighted with a prescription of -5dpt.
I wore soft contact lenses from 2013 to 2016, everyday for atleast 14h. No problems.
But because you are getting accustomed to your situation you always feel the need to improve further, even if there is nothing to improve.
So I went for refractive surgery and had Lasik in July 2016.
Since then I'm suffering from higher order aberrations.
Short explanation why that happens:
With Lasik the laser removes cornea tissue at the center of your cornea to flatten it (because nearsighted eyeballs are too steep). The diameter of this "cornea burning" is 6.5mm. Thats a standard, because removing a wider circle of tissue would also mean to burn deeper into the cornea (Munnerlyn Formula is t = S^2 D/3 with S defined as the diameter of the treatment zone), which would result in cornea instability and relating issues such as ectasia and glaucoma.
Now the problem is, that most young people with green or blue eyes have scotopic pupils of 7 to 8mm. Maximum pupil size decreases with age btw.
To sum it up: If you are young and have blue or green eyes, your pupil at dim light has a bigger diameter compared to the optical zone of the refractive surgery, which means, after the surgery you will see sharp (through the center of the cornea) and blurry (through the peripheral area of the cornea) at the same time, which is called HOA (higher order aberration). Everything looks blurry and foggy.

>> No.10916603

>>10916593
it goes on:
Of course nothing of this is mentioned by surgeons and they deny any problems when you talk to them when you are suffering from these issues.
I read hundreds of papers on this topic, I had to neglect my studies for it, because I just had to find out where my vision problems come from.
In 2017 I saw another surgeon to tell me if he could fix it. He told me I should stick with it like it is, because at least at daylight my vision is good.
Then I tried to get fitted with scleral lenses, which solved the vision problem but I couldnt stand them for more than 5 hours per day and they were super expensive. Then I tried custom fitted rigid gas permeable corneal lenses and they solved the vision problem, too, but the lens fitter couldnt get the lenses to stay at the center of my cornea.
I wasted 3000eur on Lasik and 2000eur on tries to fix it.
Through this journey I got in contact with someone who had three surgeries with one of the best ophthalmologists in the world and every surgery made it worse and he lost his job and his wife because of his issues, and he wasted more than 20000eur in the process.

>> No.10916634

>>10916147

Can confirm, did it one month ago at KSA Silmakeskus in Tallinn, Estonia for 2300EUR. Fantastic staff and aftercare, top notch equipment, stellar results already that are only going to get better.

>> No.10916655

and for those people who say "well, it turned out bad for you, but most of the times everything is alright"
actually its not.
Search for the following study:
"Induced Higher-order aberrations after Laser In Situ Keratomileusis (LASIK) Performed with Wavefront-Guided IntraLase Femtosecond Laser in moderate to high Astigmatism" (I cant post the link, otherwise my post is detected as spam)
like you can see in this study HOA rms in preoperative eyes is .47 on avg, but its .77 in postoperative eyes, which is a highly significant difference.

>> No.10916660

>>10916603
yeah they are like okay 1-2% reports problems with halos and blurring but it's very rare instead of hey your pupils are 8mm you will 100% get halos and blurred vision at night.

>> No.10916676

>>10916138
http://lasikcomplications.com/index.htm

>> No.10916680

>>10916560
Huge difference. I was very near-sighted and had a moderate astigmatism in one eye. I was really amazed how well I could see in the distance. Things like making out leaves on a tree a block away. HD is a good way to look at it.

>>10916583
No doubt they make an absurd amount of cash. My Doctor was closing in on 100,000 surgeries over ~15 years. You can do that math. The machines are specialized and are a huge upfront cost but you'd make it back in no time. Newer tech is coming out though which is probably worth paying for.


They showed me the numbers on on success rates. Risk is REALLY small. It is typical that people need a "touch up" in 10 to 15 years. The eye continues to change shape.

>> No.10916688

>>10916660
like i showed in >>10916655
its not rare at all and its absolutely common.
its just that most people are such retarded NPCs that they dont even realize that they have vision problems, just like 99% of people dont realize that the media they are consuming for 8hrs/day is completely owned by jews.

>> No.10916706

>>10916688
no i mean the doctors that try to sell you on it.
they are like
>okay 1-2% reports problems with halos and blurring but it's very rare
instead of
>hey your pupils are 8mm you will 100% get halos and blurred vision at night.

it's what happened to my gf

>> No.10916710

>>10916676
this site is actually pretty good.can recommend reading this site..
for those of you who still consider going for Lasik:
please, if you cant stop yourself, at least go for topo-guided TransPRK instead of Lasik.
Lasik damages your eye forever. I was told before my surgery in 2016, that the flap would regrow to the cornea which is a lie. With Lasik the patient has permanent eye damage. With TransPRK there is no permanent eyedamage and less cornea tissue is used

>> No.10916743

I've worn glasses since I was about 7. Fuck changing it now. I like my glasses. From a long term bizness perspective, it might be worth getying it done so you don't have to spend money on glasses. But even then, my glasses cost like 50 bucks and last a year or two. How cares

>> No.10916747
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10916747

A friend did it and a few years later he is back wearing glasses

But much thinner lense.....


Guys, just get rimlesd glasses with very thin arms and small lenses. They are basically invisible

>> No.10916765

>>10916710
yeah they tell a lot of lies... that's my main issue with what they are doing. understating risks not documenting complaints properly and lie to your face about your applicability because it's a fucking big business and some retard allowed them to mutilate people.

>> No.10916778

>>10916710
so there is still no fixing it aside corneal transplant?

>> No.10916787

>>10916593
OP here, I admit your post concerned me.
Maybe I should have my mentioned my settings in my original post

>27, no prescription changes in years
>moderate astigmatism
>bluish green eyes

Plenty of guys like me get Lasik with good results. Are you sure you're not one of 1% of people with problems? Is LASEK a better procedure?

>> No.10916798

>>10916593
Also how is driving at night for you?

>> No.10916807

>>10916787
they say 1% but actually 35.5% experiences this shit.
they could literally put you in a dark room and measure your pupil dilation in infrared light... and tell you frankly what's going to happen. but no. they just lie to your face.

>> No.10916819

>>10916660
also it sounds like something the doctors can check properly beforehand. It's not like measuring your pupils and cornea depth is a rocket science

>> No.10916858

>>10916787
I lined this out in the other posts.
>>10916798
I can still drive at night, but its not fun. I only drive at night If I have to now. Before the surgery I loved driving at night.
I know a few guys from 4chan who are suffering from the same issues btw. Some of them are wearing postlasik scleral lenses now.

>>10916778
I am waiting for a new procedure, called LIKE.
its in early test stages right now. Basically LIKE is LASIK, but its partly reversible, because the Laser treatment is done on an implanted lenticle (that is placed on the cornea, under the flap) instead of the patients cornea tissue.
If the patient doesnt like his visual outcome, the lenticle could possibly be removed.

>> No.10916864

>>10916819
you would think so right?
when the cunt explained to us what is happening years later when we went back with complaints and to talk about what is going on and why i got so fucking angry i thought i will stomp the shit out of her.

they also always try to pretend your eyes are better than they really are. they say oh your eye is 120% when you can't even read the bottom 2 lines.

>> No.10916880

>>10916297
>the worst part of lasik is your eyes will be the wrong shape for contacts
>>10916138
That's even more important than complications, because smart ar contact lenses are going to be the basic requirement of civilized life in 20 years.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bionic_contact_lens
Imagine living today without a smartphone and using only a desktop pc.

>> No.10916884

>>10916858
>LIKE
yeah honestly i was wondering a few years back how is this not a thing i will look into it thx!

>> No.10916889

>>10916747
What is up with celebrities wet in beaches? seriously, I see so many pictures like this, I swear they go to the beach for a private photoshoot or something

>> No.10916908

>>10916880
maybe 20 years from now they figure out how to fit lenses to irregular shaped eyes and get them stay at their place...

>> No.10916910

>>10916819
Oh, the funny part is, they have to measure the pupil size before Lasik here in Germany, its stated in the guidelines.
But they didnt measure my pupil size, because why would they?
They dont want to turn patients down.
Rejecting patients means making less profit.
So they just wrote "5mm scotopic pupil" in my report.
They just pulled that 5mm value out of their ass..
If I was in the States I would sue them, but here in Germany its basically useless. Our justice system is so retarded, I would probably go to jail for "Verleumdung" before they would give a penalty to the clinic.

>> No.10916933
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10916933

>>10916864
meaybe they knew you weren't a good candidate for this procedure but them being the greedy jews that they are they gave you a green light anyway.
Maybe it's good to get na unbiased diagnosis from a 3rd party first

>>10916910
that's what I thought. Kikes being kikes

>> No.10916945

>>10916884
here is a video on LIKE (by the guy who invented it)
youtube.com/watch?v=n58P-ijPbcA
I talked about some guy who had a Lasik and two more surgeries which made it even worse in a previous post...this guy is having LIKE in 6 weeks..i am very sceptical if it works out for him after all the shit he's been through

>> No.10916948

>>10916583
The best money in medicine
They rake insane amounts
Organisation I'm familiar with bought private jets to mass transport krauts for lasiks

>> No.10917011
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10917011

>>10916138
Please don't OP. I had PRK (the more painful, but safer with less complications version because it does not carve out a flap) and I regret it every day. Yes in the daylight my eyesight is 20/20 even 7 years after having had it done. But in dim/no light my pupils expand past the optical zone and let in light from untreated parts of my cornea which creates horrible glare, halos and starbursts around light sources. My visual acuity in low light also in general is like my untreated vision was, except I can't put on glasses to fix it anymore.

The optical zone is 6mm and 99% of peoples' pupils expand beyond this zone in the dark. 99% of people will experience these issues in the dark to some greater or lesser extent.

There is also dry eye which many people get after, because the nerve ends on the surface of your eye have been ablated so your eye can't tell when it's dry and send signals to produce tears. Also the nonzero possibility of serious side effects, like scarring, kerotoconus and flap loss(!).

I know contacts and glasses are a chore, but LASIK is not a perfect fix and comes with its own baggage. I won't tell you to not get it done, but at a bare minimum ask your opth for a preview lens, it is a kind of contact that simulates the tiny optical zone you will be stuck with for the rest of your life if you get it done. Put that lens in and walk around outside at night and see if you can tolerate the visual artifacts. You owe it to yourself to do this, because it is a decision you cannot reverse. You should know as best as possible what you're in for before you potentially damage your eyesight permanently.

>> No.10917039

>>10917011
DUDE
do you have telegram?
contact me at
whitepilled@protonmail.com please!!
if you have Telegram, We can literally open a Telegram Group for 4chan/biz/ers with Lasik issues now

>> No.10917092

>>10916858
>sclerals
Shit man, I even went to the famed dr. g in dallas to get a pair of his sclerals, my night vision was driving me so insane. They help a little, but not enough to warrant training my eyes to tolerate them. Sometimes I force them in and deal with the irritation just so I can walk around at night and feel sort of like how I used to feel during my night walks, back before I'd permanently fucked my vision.

I am not anti-LASIK (the technology), but I am really sour on LASIK practitioners. They are complete jews and don't adequately warn patients that this is PERMANENT decision with potentially PERMANENT bad side effects. If someone wants to get their eyes ablated after being fully apprised of the risks, whatever, it's their body. But most screenings are a complete shitshow, 5 minutes with a vision chart and a quick corneal thickness test and that it's, most opths will wheel unsuspecting patients right into the operating room straight from their test, greedy fuckers.

>> No.10917111

>>10917092
I know another person from 4chan/biz/ who had PRK and went to Dr G.
Are you this guy? That would mean I already have you on telegram and we have talked a lot about this on telegram before.
If not, please contact me on whitepilled@protonmail.com
so we can get in contact

>> No.10917112

>>10917039
I try not to dwell on it daily anymore as it's not healthy for my mental state, but I'll send you an email in a bit.

>> No.10917140

>>10917112
yep. I dont try to dwell on it daily, too.
the other guy I have on Telegram had the procedure just last year (so this cant be you, i guess) and when I chat with him I can really feel his pain..he is in the same state I was in 1 year after the surgery. Hope he is alright, he talked about his depression and he was last online on august 13th....

>> No.10917153

>>10916147
Best decision of my life

>> No.10917207

>>10916933
>Maybe it's good to get na unbiased diagnosis from a 3rd party first
those that consult you and do the procedure are all medical doctors it would be their duty to do no harm and act advise in your best interest.

>> No.10917357

Be a pushy and keep buying glasses goy

>> No.10917358

talked to gf she had the surgery 5-6 years ago something like that. and her eyes are getting worse and worse. she wears glasses again even tho she hates them and told me she feels like her right eye gonna be blind in a year or two it's much worse than the left.

i really hope somebody figures out a way to correct her vision again or undo the lasik so that she can at least wear contacts again.

>> No.10917372

There is a possibility, small, that you will go blind. I'd prefer to keep my contact lenses and glasses unless I decided to join the Air Force.

>> No.10917453

Any anons know about optegra?

>> No.10917521

LASIK is great if you don’t have any reactions or negative side effects. It’s just a shame if you happen to get any of the negative side effects you are going to think about suicide every day. Here’s something an anon shared and hopefully it can help someone who may not want to take the surgery risk.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/1591793904/ref=cm_cr_arp_mb_bdcrb_top?ie=UTF8

>> No.10917568

>>10916138

There was anon posting in thread the other day titled "Post your biggest financial mistake"

He said getting LASIK because he experienced a ridiculous amount of medical issues afterwards and it fucked his vision up. The catalyst was the diameter of his pupils is naturally large - look up problems that result if you receive lasik on naturally large pupils

>> No.10917621

>>10917011
This is me.
I used to be farsighted. +5,5 on left eye and +5 on right eye. Still had a perfectly "clear" vision and could see fine into the distance even looking at details. Close up however it was very noticeable and i needed lenses/glasses while using my computer/reading etc to not get a headache over time.

Had IntraLasik back in 2011. Immediately noticed the halos/artifacts or whatever upon starting at a street light walking out of surgery and asked the surgeon about it, he told me it was perfectly normal and would disappear over time.
It never did. My night vision is fucked up. More so on one eye than the other and it makes me crazy from time to time. Small things like watching the speedometer on my car while driving in a dark setting i have to close one eye to even see how fast i'm driving. because the two of them together can't. Halos around every lightsource. "sparkling" light from approaching cars etc.
This made me severely depressed for several years after the operation and i dropped out of college in year 3 because of it. To make things worse i live in constant darkness 6months+ a year.
Had to redo the operation on one eye a year after the first because it had reverted to being nearsighted (-1,5) it helped temporarily for a few years, but now i'm back to where it was.
Wake up with foggy eyes every day. Feeling constant dryness every day.
During the summer it's ok i guess, and i learned to live with it (kinda) i mostly try not to think about it, but i used to want to smash the place up for the longest time.

>> No.10917640

Thank god i read this shit before doing it, i always preferred glasses since you can choose different styles but now i am convinced i'll die with them, still getting a vasectomy tho

>> No.10917756

I accompanied my grandad to one of these laser eye surgery places for cataract surgery, they also did lasik/lasek there. I noticed that pretty much everybody working there, from the surgeons down to the receptionists, wore glasses.

>> No.10917768
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10917768

>>10917568
yeah, that was me.

>> No.10917811
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10917811

>>10917756
>I noticed that pretty much everybody working there, from the surgeons down to the receptionists, wore glasses.
oy vey

>> No.10917812

Did it about 5 years ago
Cost 3000
Whole week afterwards was hell
Overall 9/10 smartest thing ive done

>> No.10917932

>>10917621
>>10917011
damn that sounds really bad. sounds worse than glasses or contacts.

>> No.10918483

>>10917521
That is complete BS you can't train your eyes to get perfect vision.

>> No.10918530

>>10916858
It's the same as ICL?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwdS9nZskUc

>> No.10918551

I would kill myself if I went blind. Money is one thing, but your physical health is priceless. No amount of crypto is ever going to bring back your eyesight.

>> No.10918630

check out Jake Sachs

>> No.10918644

>>10918630
sorry, Jake Seiner*

>> No.10918670

I got it and yes. Best decision of my life, used to wear 1/3 inch thick glasses and I literally can enjoy playing sports and other shit now. Without my glasses I was seeing a blur of random colors. Just make sure you don't hire some shady no name doctor. And don't cheap out, generally, you'll pay $4000 an eye or so. Anything cheaper than that and I'd suggest you really consider if being cheap is worth damage to one of the most important parts of your body for day to day living.

>> No.10918687

>>10916138
Best purchase of my life. Now I just wish I did it sooner.

>> No.10919291

can i get lasik and still be pilot, usaf

>> No.10919615

has anyone tried this instead of going for the lasik jew?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x5Efg42-Qn0