/biz/ - Business & Finance

[Anonymous No.10516469]

Redpill me on usury, /biz/.
>Is it a real threat or just a religious cuck conspiracy?

>Is it as black and white as pic related or like how some people call it the "modern form of slavery"?

>Is the gold standard a good counter to it? If not what is?

>What are the flaws of the gold standard other than the fact that the amount of money is limited so you can't do stuff like wage a war, etc.

>Any books you can recommend on this?

[Anonymous No.10516867]

Its not a threat, we already max ursury

Pre-ursury, the world was basically proof-of-work. You work and get paid. Now its basically hybrid pow/pos where half of the money is earned by having money

[Anonymous No.10517005]

Some schemer persuade fools to pay him so they can give him money so he can give it to others but makes them pay for it too.

Replace schemer with bank and you've got our current system, in which the wealth produced by hardworking people is being redistributed to these schemers, and everyone thinks it's normal.

[Anonymous No.10517058]

Now replace banks with Jews

[Anonymous No.10517101]

going off the gold standard allowed the entire economy to become rigged

[Anonymous No.10517138]

>>10517101
how?

someone answer the questions in the OP. i'm curious as well

[Anonymous No.10517233]

>>10517138
When the gold standard existed it meant that every US dollar was backed by an equivalent amount of gold. i.e. dollars had a fixed, tangible value.

When Nixon said that they would stop honoring other countries exchanging dollars for gold it "unlocked" the value of USD. Combine that with fractional reserve lending and you have just created a world where inflationary practices can passively reduce the wealth of the masses without their knowing.

[Anonymous No.10517251]

>>10516469

if you dont want to pay the interest charged, dont borrow money
>simple

[Anonymous No.10517329]

Here's the problem for me. I can make 1 shoe/hour that I later sell. Or I can make 2 shoes/hour with some machine I can't afford yet if I borrow from someone. Why does the other dude have more than me? Maybe he fishes and fish is considered more important than shoes I don't know, but he makes more than me. Now, what happens if people suddenly decide shoes are shit? I get ruined, I can't pay back the guy I borrowed from. So what incentive does he have for that? Why would he not use that capital on his own thing? At that point I may be forced to promise him some shoes or something to make it worth it to him. Otherwise he's being exposed to risk for no reward. So we come up with the idea of interest and it can help with the production of good things. But it can get out of hand and it can get very vicious after a while pushing the ones high higher and the ones down lower and only some kind of borrowers can even exist.

The way I see it you have to accept usury is going to exist somwhere in the world and then decide what kind of game you're going to play. Where you take loans (or maybe loan to others) for really important things instead of because everyone else is doing it. Another option is renounce all usury and very probably, end outcompeted and poor, but chase other more immaterial things that could be more worthwhile, that's a very moral and noble stance, but for a lot of people walking the Earth, not really that attractive. The final option is some never tried before kind of violent revolution with looting included aiming towards "good distribution" where some planner tells us how we take and borrow from each other and we are happy and greed has been lifted from the world, because the second there's a slight imbalance it rolls right back to square one except that fishes and shoes are now rationed for all the population and somehow almost everyone manages to be very poor.

[Anonymous No.10517381]

>>10516469
Inflation and usury are problems that compound each other. That combined with taxes are pretty much a giant fuck you to anyone in the middle class.

It primarily prevents upwards mobility as the lower class is subsidized by the work of higher classes. Gold standard is really the way to go but some kike will inevitably run in here screaming that it prevents innovation like nothing was ever invented before the 70s and stocks didn't exist before then either. They typically point to bank runs which only happened because banks are allowed to lend money they don't actually have.

Inflation based systems are giant ponzis where the banks get infinite money and allows them to pretty much dominate everyone.

[Anonymous No.10517429]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xn6r2Nm0ZMo

[Anonymous No.10517489]

>>10517381
>it prevents innovation
What I think it fucks more is really efficient production. But then you have another problem, you can produce good things and you can produce useless fucking shit and like the line isn't that clear and like how do you choose who's going to be the judge? Because the structure of society for whatever reason can get manipulated by bad actors into believing useless fucking shit is much more important than good things.

[Anonymous No.10517517]

Usury: "the lending or practice of lending money at an exorbitant interest." Some people interpret it as the practice of lending, period, depsite the actual definition.

The gold standard is generally bad (in my opinion), because the supply of money is more or less fixed. It can't account for a growing (or shrinking) population or economy.

What time was better - the middle ages where lending was outlawed and gold and silver were used as mediums of exchange, or the past 50 years, where we have made massive economic progress despite our 'fake' dollar? We really only emerged from the middle ages during the Italian renaissance, because surprise, lending and fiat took hold. Venice became the richest city in the world, and the merchant class (lol jews) surpassed the monarchs in wealth.

Very very interesting read on the practice of lending: https://www.quora.com/Why-did-people-give-loans-in-the-Middle-Ages-Since-charging-interest-was-illegal-where-was-the-profit

History of venice: https://www.businessinsider.com/the-economic-history-of-venice-2012-8

t. Jew

[Anonymous No.10517555]

[Anonymous No.10517621]

>>10517517
>exorbitant
This is something I really do not take as part of the definition. Exorbitant is a very nebulous thing and it allows the door open to the slippery slope. Which doesn't have to be a bad thing, but it's how it's going to end. It's a bit like democracy, only these people vote and then they vote to also include these people as voters and then even more voters are included... it doesn't rewind easily.

[Anonymous No.10517623]

>>10517517
>there was no economic progress prior to 1972

lol. just lol. get out of here kike.

[Anonymous No.10517658]

>>10517381
>It primarily prevents upwards mobility as the lower class is subsidized by the work of higher classes. Gold standard is really the way to go but some kike will inevitably run in here screaming that it prevents innovation like nothing was ever invented before the 70s and stocks didn't exist before then either. They typically point to bank runs which only happened because banks are allowed to lend money they don't actually have.

>It primarily prevents upwards mobility as the lower class is subsidized by the work of higher classes.

Upward mobility didn't exist until fiat. Serfs worked just for a place to eat and something to eat.

> Gold standard is really the way to go but some kike will inevitably run in here screaming that it prevents innovation like nothing was ever invented before the 70s and stocks didn't exist before then either.

Jews invented the concept of a company with joint ownership (stocks)

Along with double entry accounting, llcs, debt markets, deposit banking, fiat, other financial instruments, which led to some of the most substantial progress in the arts, sciences, and thought

The funny thing is, it wasn't the common man they robbed - it was the nobility, through financing their consumption. Sound familiar?

[Anonymous No.10517699]

>>10517517
>progress
>t. Jew
For the record: you said it, not me. Classic example of telling the "right" truth. Progress doesn't mean what most people assume it does.

[Anonymous No.10517912]

>>10517058
>>10517101
>>10517233
>>10517381

[Anonymous No.10517914]

>>10516469
Both usury and inflation as we know it represent primitive fintech that needs to be replaced with better mechanics to help move civilization to the next tier. Take Skycoin as an example of how cryptocurrency might replace these old tools. Skycoin is a deflationary currency that, once adopted, will provide excellent value storage. Skycoin also emits a secondary currency, Coinhours, at a rate of 1 coinhour per Skycoin per hour. This provides a secondary inflationary currency, the inflation of which proceeds at a fixed rate. Coinhours are established as a medium of exchange across various applications within the ecosystem, and their inflationary nature incentivizes higher prices and growth. Coinhours will also undergo burning and collateralization. Collateralization will allow many financial instruments to be used to facilitate economic activity that historically would have required the accumulation of debt. The most striking feature of Skycoin and Coinhours, is that any holder of Skycoin may generate the inflationary Coinhour. This solves the obvious flaw of centralized quantitative manipulation we see today where those who are close to the money printer are able to extract all of the value out of newly created money supply.

[Anonymous No.10518749]

>>10517233
CONSPIRACY MORON FOUND

where do you college dropouts even come up with this garbage

[Anonymous No.10518856]

>>10516469

In the thumbnail I unironically thought the percent sign was a dreidel

[Anonymous No.10518937]

>>10518749

Everything he said was right.

[Anonymous No.10519041]

>>10518749
>college
t. redditor

[Anonymous No.10519149]

>>10516469

Gold currency and usury have nothing to do with each other.

If you are borrowing money to buy useless consumer shit, that makes you retarded, and deserving of all of the consequences.

I love borrowing money, because i use it to buy hard assets that make me money (real estate). I dont borrow money for anything else unless its something i could already afford and the terms are zero percent (cars basically)

Fuck this thread and biz are retarded. Stay poor faggot.

[Anonymous No.10519258]

>>10519149
but you use the debt based fiat

[Anonymous No.10519323]

>>10519258

Who gives a fuck, I either spend it or convert it right into real assets, fiat can suck a dick for all I care. Also, you do know you can bank in gold if you want to, right? Services like Goldmoney.

[Anonymous No.10519400]

>>10516469
liked this comparison

https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/938bc2/why_i_no_longer_support_bitcoin/

basically, lending at interest is cancer. charging 1% interest 1000x easier than increasing productivity by 1%

[Anonymous No.10519450]

>>10519323
What a good goy, maybe you will be permitted to eat a portion of your own children.

[Anonymous No.10519558]

>>10516469
Who's gonna be paying all those debts in the end?
Can they actually be repaid at the current pace of technological development?

Go read Graber, 5000 years of debt

[Anonymous No.10519572]

>>10519450

You're the goy pleb, giving all you real money to scam artists shilling (((internet gold))). I collect rent checks from douchebags like you, from experience i can tell you are not going to make it.

[Anonymous No.10519595]

>>10519400

Lending at interest is fundamental to basic economics and wont change even if you trade in fake internet money.

[Anonymous No.10519615]

Also, gold standart is retarded as the supply is too small.
I suggest a fellatio based economy.
Each note is an obligation to receive N fel-o-minutes. What's best, you can always make ur own money, if you deposit, say, at least 5 fellations at a bank

[Anonymous No.10519620]

>>10518749
So refute it then you fucking mong. It would actually be an interesting conversation if you tried. The things he says are true but the slant he takes may or may not be true. You could actually dispute it but instead you just resort to being a fucking faggot

[Anonymous No.10519652]

>>10518749
>he doesn't know wages have remained stagnant while purchasing power drops to the ground every 10 years ever since the removal of the gold standard happened

this has only been happening for half a century and you and the rest of the retarded "economists" are pretending there's nothing wrong with such a change in policy. we're basically throwing darts at the wall at this point since it's the first time the global economy has worked under such a policy and then you have brainlets like paul krugman talk about how there's nothing wrong with our current debt like it's some unshakable truth like the laws of physics. you can't call anything in economics a "conspiracy" when most of the shit being passed around is pseudoscience, and the chance of any meaningful analysis that isn't done on hundred year old economies is 0 as anything said about present markets is politically and economically motivated, not based on any objective standard.

[Anonymous No.10519657]

>>10519400
I fucking hate reddit. Someone posts something controversial and they need to preface it with that "WILL PROB GET DOWVOTED BUT..." to appease the masses. fucking cancer worse than here

[Anonymous No.10519670]

>>10517555
Can you really blame the kikes though, honestly? It's a Jew's nature to do what it does. Why would you expect anything different? Would you stick your head in a crocodile's mouth and expect it not to eat you? Why is it in our nature to be so foolish and fall for their tricks? Why don't we exercise discipline and self control to retain mastery over our own lives? Well... I actually do. So, I don't really feel bad for everyone who fell victim to Mr. Shekelstein's hamster wheel because they got on it voluntarily.

[Anonymous No.10519712]

>>10519595
you mean the keynesian model you were indoctrinated with, yes
get woke son

[Anonymous No.10519761]

>>10519595
"fundamental to basic economics" you mean fundamental to not even century year old scam economics? economic school dominance changes all the time btw, no one will look at you brainlet keynesians kindly in the future for pretending that the shit you say is anything more than pseudoscience

[Anonymous No.10519773]

>>10519595
Yes, lending at interest is a valuable function, but not when theft occurs. Above, i have described how Skycoin splits the currency into 2 different types to better model human econonomic activity. We should approach such innovation with an open mind because the problems we face today are clear and present.

[Anonymous No.10519906]

>>10519761

>thinks interest is only a century old
>in a thread about usury
>a term that literally goes back thousands of years
>still believes hes going to make it

>>10519712
>>10519761

>both of these financially illiterate retards think loan interst is keynsian

>>10519773

Yes theft occurs, at the rate of 2% a year currently (and much higher in the late 70s and 80s). There are financial tools and methods you can use to mitigate that entirely, without having to resort to crypto. You only pay that tax in two scenarios: 1 you hold large ammounts cash for a long time, so retards, 2 you sell an asset many years down the line and have to pay cap gains tax, a portion of which will be from fed instigated inflation. The answer is to not be a filthy communist. Crypto is a ways off and will most likely be subverted by statists anyway.

[Anonymous No.10520143]

>>10519906
>taxcucking
In the united states, taxes are collected for the purpose of paying off bonds it has issued. It issues more bonds in order to fund its various projects. Other countries its similar, u got IMF for shitholes. Bonds are often purchased by the central bank. in the case of quantitative easing, the bank is able to print up money in order to buy the bond. During a round of QE the bank will also buy other bonds and other debt assets from other financial institutions with the newly printed money. Those who have access to these new funds are in the position to take advantage of their existence. Even though the money was printed from nothing, the debts must be paid back to the bank so fuck you taxcucks eat shit.

[Anonymous No.10520556]

https://ia800402.us.archive.org/33/items/MarkJeffreyTheModernIdolatry_201605/Mark_Jeffrey_-_The_modern_idolatry.pdf

[Anonymous No.10520663]

Simple actually. Wall Street banks lend you money with interest. If they make bad bets. Taxpayer refunds their money and they confiscate your shit.

[Anonymous No.10520779]

>>10520663
How is it a bad bet if you're getting paid? U cant lose.

[Anonymous No.10521099]

>>10517517
Define 'progress' son

In what way is it an improvement?

[Anonymous No.10521220]

>>10516867
Kek you just explained the world you autist

[Anonymous No.10521291]

>>10517517
>Comparing today with the middle ages to make a point.
You weren't joking with the t.kike thing huh...
The things that make us where we are today aren't banks, if anything they just make tough wagecucking a necessity, it's rather fundamental scientific progress starting with Newton, Faraday, Maxwell, etc... those are things humanity will never unknow, which means you can destroy everything, but we'll still be able to make a turbine and put it in water and make life a little more comfortable.
As I said if anything, the destruction of banks would allow people to have the necessary things, and stop wageslaving to buy the last macbook pro.

[Anonymous No.10521331]

Within the Peace of Augsburg 1555AD was the replacement for indulgences against Protestant uprising.

A contractum trinius was a set of contracts devised by European (((bankers))) and (((merchants))) in the Middle Ages as a method of circumventing canonical laws prohibiting usury as a part of Christian finance. At the time, most Christian nations heavily incorporated scripture into their laws, and as such it was illegal for any person to charge interest on a loan of money.

[Anonymous No.10521359]

>>10520779
u win less
only the population loses in this game

[Anonymous No.10521481]

>>10521359
Yeah, you win less and less over time, but perhaps less is more. Come to think of it we got about too many fucking people living in our world at the moment. Best way is to just starve them. they will go mad, start destroying things and eating babies. When they are done everyone will agree they deserve to die anyway.

[Anonymous No.10521863]

it was in one of gottfried feder's lectures about interest and the international banking system that drew adolf hitler into the NSDAP.

>>10517517
fuck off kike with your (((progress))) and (((economic measures))).