/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>9898981
>i buy GOLD!

okay but that won't change the truth

it's simply a shiny piece of metal

>>9898981
can you point me out the the closest dinosaur nest ?

>2018
>not being in crypto

it is over, we have a solution

>>9898991
AND BITCOIN IS JUST IMAGINIARY 1s and 0s BACKED BY NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BUY MY ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

>>9898985
No rebuttal. When you get paid in bitcoin your value is supposed to be stored. It isn't supposed to go up, it isn't supposed to go down. That's not how money works.

You can find a passage in the Bible that says an ounce of gold bought you 350 loved of bread 2,500 years ago. And lo and behold... that gold ounce still buys you 350 loaves of bread at the grocery store today. Bread at Safeway is about $3.50.... 3.50 multipled by 350 loaves of bread is about $1,300 which is what an ounce of gold is worth

>>9898991
A shiny piece of REAL money. And the primary function of real money is to measure value of goods exahnged for it. Which is why gold has been money for thousands of years and still is today. Doesn't matter if the fucking govt says so or not

thats right, and when you MEASURE the value of bitcoin in gold it is growing exponentially

when the internet is indestructible, ubiquitous and decentralised bitcoin will make gold redundant

bitcoin cash is bitcoin

>>9899019
Looks like a classic bubble chart to me, which is fueled with hype and speculation :^)

>>9899019
What do you mean? Gold for all intents of purposes is redundant now. Gold isn't legal tender anywhere....... but it's still worth $1,300.... why is that???

Crypto isn't trying to replace gold you brainlet because gold doesn't function as money in the world economy anymore... but it still maintains its value as real money... despite what govts say.

Like I said.... a gold ounce can buy you 350 loves of bread today just like it could before Christ was alive

Silver is the new gold, brainlets.

>>9899019
Money is supposed to MEASURE value. And nothing has done that better than gold. Doesn't matter what year it is including today.

Bitcoin doesn't measure value.

>>9898981
information technology changes the way we store value.
Nobody cares that gold is shiny, it just has been a good solution to store value.
With crypto you don't need to hide pieces of metal in the basement and crypto is basically the only asset that can't be confiscated from you (if you're not a brainlet)

>>9899040

Money does not measure value, value is measured by money.

>>9899045
Total brainlet. Gold isn't valuable only because its shiny.

Also... if gold is just a shiny thing then why is confiscation a possibility?

>>9899049
And what monetary instrument has measured value best whether it's 2018... 1920 or 500 B.C?

Gold

>>9899032
gold is not redundant in any respect you can use gold as money anywhere in the world and it is certainly the only thing today that can be use to measure value over time.

bitcoin will be a good measure of value when it reaches global adoption (when it stops growing exponentially against gold)
as it is non inflationary and its loss of supply is a known quantity it can make gold redundant as the measure of value as soon as the internet is ubiquitous, decentralized and indestructible

>>9899045
Information technology doesn't change the way we store value. Bitcoin was 20k only 5 months ago. Bitcoin is the polar opposite of a store of value.

If I could wave a magic wand right now and have the bitcoin price be $6,500 from now until the end of the century.... would you be happy with that?

>>9899060

Not arguing that.

My question remains... if gold is useless and just a shiny rock....


Then why is confiscation a potential thing?

>>9898981
That's why all my cryptocurrencies are in 1oz copper rounds

>>9899095
I have that ETH token. Definitely not copper, it's just plated steel.

>>9899091
no one who understands bitcoin is claiming it is meant to replace gold (although it could in the far future)
it is meant to replace centrally controlled currency
it is peer to peer electronic cash
it is the most superior form of currency ever invented
if it succeeds it will free everyone from currency debasement

How long do you have to live to see your return.
Jewlery is the best for gold
I tried to get change and the store said they didn’t have change for gold.
Not environment friendly to mine
And if we look at it like you do it’s just minerals
Or paper that doesn’t have the actual gold to back it.

>>9899060
and before gold it was some weird stone.
gtfo you tard you have no idea how the debt system works.

>>9899095
We will be exchanging your silver to lead do to civil war
How about food
You can have all the good and no food
Problem
Fiber optic

>>9898981
Crypto is better than gold

Why do you faggots act like gold and crypto are mutually exclusive? Blind unthinking tribalism.

>>9899116
How can bitcoin potentially replace gold when gold isn't even used in the monetary system today?

Crypto (in part) is a flight to get out of fiat because fiat is failing, right? And fiat is failing because it isn't backed by gold anymore.

So gold literally has nothing to do with any issues with the economy and monetary system at all. In fact all our economic and monetary issues is because gold doesn't back the currency.... yet gold is still as valuable today as it was thousands of years ago...

So how is bitcoin going to potentially replace gold when gold has no function in the economy? Doesn't make any sense at all

>>9899149
I have both, crypto is just better.

>>9899149
You are right.... but the overall sentiment is in cryptoland is negative towards gold.

Literally branded the "new gold."

How is crypto the "new gold" when there's literally no issue with gold? And it's not backing any currencies

>>9899027
The same happened to gold
Really a stupid concept
Try the Middle East

>>9899160
How is it better? Even if crypto is at full adoption that's not going to make gold any less valuable. Gold isn't part of the monetary system today at all. And we are moving toward crypto yet gold doesn't lose any value.

A gold ounce 900 years ago is still that same gold ounce today. Doesn't matter if the dollar or crypto exist or not

>>9899173
What happened to gold? A gold ounce 900 years ago is still that same gold ounce today. The dollar value of gold is meaningless. If the dollar vanished from the world tomorrow... your gold ounce is completely unaffected. You understand that right?

So why would you be valuing gold (real money) in terms of fake money (dollars)?

>>9899179
>How is it better?
see >>9899147

>>9898981

Except we can buy Gold using DGX, which is redeemable for bullion, and tradeable on the Ethereum blockchain. So......who cares? We don't just want a store of value, we want a massive bonanza of gains in net worth. What point are you trying to make? You want us to pump your shiny metal? Once MakerDAO is updated, you can use DGX to issue DAI - a USD equivalent token. At that point, a lot of us will be locking our gains in to back the DAI currency, meaning we act like a new central bank. And that means more demand for Gold. You're welcome.

To hard to sell in its physical form for many people.
Buy store it find a buyer go to the buyer then if he doesn’t buy you got to find another have to weigh each piece transport it to you then to the buyer
Gold is not practical
And if you buy on paper that’s not gold there’s not enough gold for the amount on the exchange
BS

>>9899188
Yeah except crypto isn't real. Gold is real physical tangible wealth, it's represents unit of labor. Crypto is just a bunch of electrons running around on a circuit board inside a computer.... it doesn't represent shit.

>>9899157
>How can bitcoin potentially replace gold when gold isn't even used in the monetary system today?
gold is always the monetary system, gold is money without decree
if someone chooses to think fiat is money that's their mistake
if the internet becomes ubiquitous, decentralized and indestructible crypto will be better than gold in every criteria see >>9899147
until then it won't have the redundancy gold has

>Crypto (in part) is a flight to get out of fiat because fiat is failing, right? And fiat is failing because it isn't backed by gold anymore.
Fiat is designed to fail. Central banks reduce the value of fiat at 3% faster than the rate consumer goods get cheaper so that nobody can accumulate enough wealth to stop working. Pic related

>So gold literally has nothing to do with any issues with the economy and monetary system at all. In fact all our economic and monetary issues is because gold doesn't back the currency.... yet gold is still as valuable today as it was thousands of years ago...
gold is always money, if you wanted to rent land off a government they would give you a price in gold.

>>9899187

Do you think "value" is a magical force inherent to Gold? Tell us anon, what's it made of? Value-particles? How does that work?

>>9899193
BS
The USA needs to be called out on this
You are to have the gold in stock for every transaction
Everyone knows there is no gold there and have to wait to long and deal with brokers
Gold is bull shit at its best

>>9899179
in 2011 I was thinking in a similar way. Back then I did so math, and if the BTC supply was to be used by all people on the planet, that would account for 2 "servings" a person.

To work crypto has to work, id does not need 100% adoption, or 80% or 8%. It is ok. Crypto can be as it is not with 0.49% adoption and just work.

The value comes from the hash rate.

Same as gold, the value comes from the cost of mining.

I can make an order and pay it, without having to do to the place and pay in grams. Paying in grams does not work. You need a setlement layer, like goldmoney. These fuck will betray you the first sign of trouble.

The ultimate killer app of crypto is the privacy coins. Cause nobody knows how much you have and it cannot be taxed or confiscated.

It is over. Crypto won. We live in a new world.

>>9899202
gold is money because it is the value datum; all things' value degrade relative to gold over time.

bitcoin is the best currency ever invented

being physical has nothing to do with it gold is backed by its properties bitcoin is backed by its properties

>>9899202
>electrons aren't real
>math isn't real
>the labour to create the code and hardware isn't real

I can never decide if these insane goldbug threads are a really terrible attempt at fudding Gold by making Gold holders seem like absolute shit-tier retards or not.

>>9899202
Thats wrong, crypto is superior to gold in every way.
>it isn‘t real
are you retarded or something?
maybe read a book you stupid nigger.

>>9899193
I get what you are saying exactly... you don't want just a store of value you want to make gains.

But real money isn't supposed to make you gains. So bitcoin is not real money.

When you are a plumber and you make 50$ For a job... that energy you used to get paid is supposed to be stored. You put it in gold or even dollars...... you aren't expecting that 50$ to be worth 5k in 4 years because that's not how money is supposed to work.

Earning that 50$ and putting it into bitcoin in 2010 can buy you a mansion right now probably... that's not what money is supposed to do

>>9899209
>gold resilience to oxidation is magic according to cryptofag

>>9899205
How can crypto be better than gold when there is literally absolutely zero fault in gold???

There is no problem with gold right? It functions as money today just like 3,000 years ago.

All that bitcoin or crypto can hope to be is be as good as gold. But it can't surpass gold because there's literally nothing wrong with gold as far as storing value goes and measuring value

>>9898981
fkn faget

>>9898981
Value is just social construct. If the people in the parallel universe accepts wood has more value than gold then wood has more value than gold. There's nothing you can do about it.

>>9899230
Much better when that $50 is worth $20 dollar after some time. lol stupid fucking nigger.
Are you a mouthbreather? would explain a lot.

>>9899230
bitcoin will grow against gold in value until it reaches equilibrium with global demand

this is basic shit anon, it's called the adoption curve see pic here>>9899067

>>9899223
Not denying bitcoin as a currency... it's a potential currency that could very well become a currency that everyone uses...

But there is a difference between current and money... and gold is both. Bitcoin is not money tho

>>9899249
bitcoin is ledger or distributed database, not money nor currency

>>9899224
What is wrong with gold? You literally can't lose owning gold.

Literally a bible passage saying gold bought you 350 loaves of bread 2,500 years ago.... and that same gold ounce still buys you 350 loaves of bread at the grocery store today.

Let me ask you a question.... if you had to put all your net worth into either gold or bitcoin and travel 150 years into the future.... which would you pick?

>>9899239
because crypto can be everything gold is and more

I've said it like 10 times bitcoin is not meant to replace gold it's meant to replace fiat currency

it could make gold redundant as a measure of value and money if the internet becomes ubiquitous, indestructable and decentralised

>>9899241
Why isn't wood a store of value and why is gold a store of value?

Why don't we all go live on a beach and deem sand as money and a store of value. Wouldn't work out to well right?

>>9899261
I would pick BTC and buy shitcoins

>>9899261
BTC of course
asteroid mining will make gold dirt cheap in the future.

>>9899264
Except you can't touch it. And doesn't represent anything. Bitcoin isn't a unit of labor

>>9899264
redundant doesn't mean gold wouldn't work as a measure of value or a currency
it would just not be used by anyone because bitcoin can be superior in every criteria of good money

>>9899217

Read what I just wrote, are you retarded? This has nothing to do with the US - we know the Federal reserve is empty. I didn't say anything about the US, what crack are you smoking?

We can buy tokens, on the Ethereum blockchain, directly redeemable for bullion. Now. Today. It's called DigixDAO. Google it.

We can then deposit it into a smart contract, and use it as collateral to issue DAI - a USD price matched token. It's not fractional reserve banking - every DAI is therefore redeemable for an amount of Gold held in the MakerDAO smart contract.

Do you understand the implications of that? We are able to use Gold as a store of value, and then gain all the benefits of electronic exchange offered by cryptos. We're literally replacing the central banks. Again, not years in the future, but today. Well, a few more weeks until the update rolls out. I've got a bunch of DGX (the token linked to a bar of bullion) already waiting.

Fucking Goldbugs. Go read something outside your tiny bubble for a change.

>>9898981
>t. bagholder from 2011

PM-fags are the original shitcoin shillers.

>>9899279
Bitcoin isn't even 10 years old and already they are trying to get away from bitcoin as a gateway and add other fiat pairings

>>9899261
>gold buys you 350 loaves of bread
what bullshit. it depends on where you bought the bread

>>9899294
much more likely to survive 150 years than your shitty unprotected safe full of gold that niggers will loot.
how a nigger gonna loot a password inside my head?
he can't.
BTC > Gold
in every category.

>>9899284
Except there's no physical tangible wealth. It's perfect except it isn't real.

>>9899230
So your point is that investing is dumb and I should just "store" my wealth? Because somehow that would please the money gods because I'm using money "the right way"?
That's some real mental gymnastics there.
Really, tell me why I just STORE my wealth instead of using it to increase it.
I'll wait.
It's like those housewives that stash "good silverware" for a special occasion that never happens.

>inb4 w-what you're seeing is just inflated fake money valuation and not real increase!
My money measured in gold have made a 20x in the last year

>>9899230

So you acknowledge that they aren't mutually exclusive things, and cryptos aren't "threatening" gold in some way, and serve a different use case. Good! So what the fuck is this thread about?

>muh REAL TANGIBLE PHYSICAL VALUE
Didn't realise goldbugs were this retarded. Nothing at all has any intrinsic non-physical property. Nothing.

>>9899241
The idea of "social constructs" gets really bad rep, but it is so significant.

>>9899283
>buhhhhhhjh it no reel if u no touch!!1!11
Absolute moron.

>>9899291
>t. bagholder from 2018

Crypto-fags are the original shitcoin shillers.

I love your logic :^)

>>9899283
being able to touch it is not a criteria for good money
anything is a unit of labor, when bitcoin reaches global adoption and the price is not volatile it will be an excellent way to store excess labor

gold develops as money in all civilizatoins independently because it gives the advantage of allocating resources efficiently as gold is the best measure of value (price). Bitcoin can be an even better measure of value because it's supply is known to 8 decimal places

>>9899269
Just stating a hypothetical statement. It's really the consensus gives something value. If people accepts something has a value then it has a value.

>>9899297
Wtf you talking about moron? Bread is like 3.50-4$ a loaf... multipled by 350 loaves = right around $1,300 which equals an ounce of gold.

So a gold ounce buys you roughly 350 loaves today as it did 2,500 fucking years ago.

THATS the definition of real money

>>9899301
Why the fuck would niggers want to loot the gold????

I thought it was a useless shit metal?

Only person who is a dumb nigger is you.

Gold is useless.... but niggers will steal it. God damn morons

>>9899302
being physical is not a criteria for good money

I have said to you a million times the internet will need to be indestructable, ubiquitous and decentralised before bitcoin could have as much redundancy as gold

>>9899320
>3.50 a loaf
where

>>9899285
>DGX
>>9899284
>>9899283
>>9899279
>>9899275
>>9899269
>>9899264
>>9899261
>>9899257
>>9899249
>>9899246
>>9899242
>>9899241
>>9899240
shut the fuck up noobs, and look this:
https://youtu.be/DyV0OfU3-FU

>>9899325
>nigger sees shiny metal
>nigger can trade it for bread and booze
>nigger take it

in your retard fantasy, where would I store Gold for 150 years in a secure way?
impossible.

>>9899301
Luckily gold is a bit older than 150yo and is stable for thousand of years. I don't get this whole discussion, this isn't about black or white - 0 or 1. Bitcoin wont make gold obsolete in its current value and vize versa.

Btw you are your own bank, believe me...if you leak your wallet once and you hold a decent amount of crypto, then get ready for some torture. Furthermore all the old people who are playing their own bank and throwing around their PK like they have their pin code in their current wallet. BTC is everything else than riskfree.

>>9899320
I can buy 1000 loaves with an ounce in the UK. Whats your point?

>>9899328
In his cherrypicked example. Retarded boomer is religious about his love for some rock that society happens to deem valuable.

>>9899305
No... investing is not dumb. And you aren't just supposed to store all your wealth.

My argument is btc is not money because money isn't supposed to go up in value like bitcoin has.

When I work for a week 100 years ago and earn an ounce of gold......I can still buy the same amount of shit today as I could 100 years ago. My labor and energy were stored.

Money isn't earning 20$ and it being able to buy you 100 times the amount of goods 5 years later. That's an investment, but not money

>>9899261
You couldn't, until the 70s. Now it's a speculative asset.

In the future? In 1000 years you might still be able to buy those same 350 loaves of bread. I'd rather put money in something that appreciates.

Also gold and Bitcoin have value for the same reasons. We deem they have value. If we relegated gold to it's industrial use it'd be less valuable, and if we relegated Bitcoin to it's use cases it'd be far less valuable.

>>9899312
Ok if consensus gives something value then why is the dollar failing?

I mean virtually every American says the dollar is money right? So why is it losing value???

>>9899345
BTC is absolutey risk free if you store the key in a secure way.

the question is HOW TO STORE GOLD SECURE FOR 150 YEARS WITHOUT TRUSTING A KIKE BANK?
Its impossible for the average joe, thus BTC is more secure and better than gold.

>>9899350
bitcoin is going up until its price reaches equilibrium with global demand then it will extremely stable
you literally are unable to think two steps ahead

>>9899362
>Fiat is designed to fail. Central banks reduce the value of fiat at 3% faster than the rate consumer goods get cheaper so that nobody can accumulate enough wealth to stop working. Pic related>>9899205

>>9899362
Supply and demand. The total purchasing power of the US has not kept up with the printing of extra dollars so it dilutes the total purchasing power of individual dollars. But the purchasing power of all dollars has gone up.

Something similar would happen if we are able to mine a gold asteroid. The total value of all gold would go up, but the value of individual ounces would go down.

>>9899261

Right now? Not Bitcoin, it's a piece of shit that's being toppled by better platforms.

But let's say Ethereum. Yep, I'm willing to bet that even if the current Ethereum chain itself is made obsolete, the smart contracts on it, including those capable of replacing the banking system, will be in use, and the value of the Ether (because yes, value isn't a magical force inherent only to Gold) will have gone up. And part of that is because by then the current fake paper being traded as "Gold" will have vanished, and smart contracts like MakerDAO will be used to track Gold bullion, and let it's value be used directly. Meaning the entire value of the global Gold will probably be merged into the value of the cryptos ecosystem. So in reality, my holding Ethereum ends up meaning I'm holding Gold too. The opposite is not necessarily true however - Golds value won't have benefited directly from the network effects and use value as much as cryptos did.

>>9899335
Dude fucking humor me......... I said if you are about to hop on a fucking time machine and you can bring your ledger with your bitcoin in it or bring with you 100 gold coins.... which are you going to bring with you.

It's a fucking simple exercise on what you would bring with you.

As your traveling at the speed of light into the future intergalactic niggers breaking into your time machine and stealing your gold isn't part of the fucking equation you dumbass

>>9899393
of course I'd take the BTC.
>but you can buy some bread with it

shut the fuck up nigger, I buy a medium sized european country instead.

>>9899392
Your willing to bet but you aren't for sure.

If you took a time machine 150 years into the future.... and you had to put all your net worth into gold or ethereum you'd be a fucking moron to choose ethereum.

>>9899393
It's never that simple though. One of the biggest issues with gold is that it is physical and must be transported to transact.

It's completely likely we will have gold back assets on the block chain in the near future. I think the Brits are already working on that. So if you want to argue that is a form of gold currency that's fine, but the transactional speed of physical gold is archaic.

>>9899365

Good point as well. You don't even need paper - I've memorised my wallet mnemonic phrase & I repeat it like a mantra all the time (it's a comfy habit now actually). I can literally walk through customs naked, and my cryptos are accessible. That's value. Try that with bullion.

>>9899383
Gold is savings..... bitcoin is not savings

>>9899383
by the time asteroid mining is feasible, human population wont be limited to earth so the demand would match the supply
also by that time computer can break current cypto algorithm making it worthless

>>9899413
it will be when it reaches global adoption

>>9899412
Why is bitcoin 6k but it was 20k not even 7 months ago?

>>9899365
Once again you are your own fucking bank. Everyone makes mistakes, especially the human. I doubt that you have created a paper wallet on an offline device with a virtual linux machine for a complete a secure way of storing your bitcoin? That would be risk free. Most likely you have your ledger side in side with your recovery phrases on you table. Everything else can be fucking exploited.

And in the end you are the guy, who has the access. YOU ARE YOUR OWN BANK. You can argue forever if that is riskfree or not once people know how much you are holding. Violence and threat are a disgusting thing.

>>9899422
So it gets to a certain price then it's savings???? Makes no sense.

>>9899362
Failing but still has a value. Why it is failing?, because of inflation and the fed is responsible for it. The dollar will only lose value if people stop using it

>>9899412
How the fuck is bitcoin risk free??? It was 20k now it's 6k

>>9899421
this is really a piss poor argument. you act like cryptography will not improve with technology. Look at how much is poured into right now. Do you think that amount will become less when computers are exponentially stronger? where did all the smart people go.

>>9899412
exactly, you can take your BTC wherever you want and nobody can stop you.

>>9899421
>can break current cypto algorithm making it worthless
thats wrong tho, Vitalik already confirmed that won't happen. and if it happens the same technology that breaks it allows to make it even stronger.

>>9899426
thats how markets work, prices go up, prices go down.

>>9899428
> I doubt that you have created a paper wallet on an offline device with a virtual linux machine for a complete a secure way of storing your bitcoin
But I did, with multiple backups that only I can decipher.

>once people know how much you are holding
simple solution
>move to new wallet
>"sorry guys I got already hacked"

problem solved.

>>9899444
When the dollar fails how do you value goods in bitcoin?

>>9899435
if something has a limited supply its price will continue to go up until it reaches equilibrium with demand. In bitcoins case the equilibirum price would be world adoption as currency

the rate at which it is approaching this equilibrium is describe by an S curve otherwise known as an adoption curve exponential growth

>>9898981
I own and trade crypto and metals. I don't really care much about semantics or what's the actual definition of money or its main function or things like that. I don't want to accumulate what I understand as money. Crypto is not gold or silver. Gold is not silver. I assume we would agree that it's ok to call gold, silver and crypto resources. I don't know what we are supposed to be arguing about.

>>9899408

You asked. Don't like the answer? Too bad. Point out what the flaw is, specifically. Because you think it'll be gone by then? I disagree. You can hold whatever opinion you like. There's a greater chance the Gold has been seized than anything else.

>>9899454
0.0005 BTC for a loaf of bread

>>9899457
My argument is cryptotards dub bitcoin the new money. How can it be the new money when it doesn't measure value of goods which is the main point of money

>>9899426
Why did the price of gold go from $250 to $2300 in the 70s, then back to $380 in 2000, and now back to $2000 in 2008, and now at $1300 now?

>>9899413
You're just arguing from your own point of view and ignoring others.

>>9899469
it will when its price reaches equilibrium you fucking retard

>>9899454
How do you value it in gold? Or do you think we're just going to buy 350 loaves of bread at a time?

It's called price discovery. It happens organically in a market.

>>9899449
so if you're too late to move to newer crypto your wallet will be worthless
glad I don't have to upgrade my gold and silver every few years, worst thing is to pay a goldsmith to fix some dents

>>9899470
oil and labor

See what was the price to mine gold back then and now.

>>9899426

You're confusing price with value. And you keep flip flopping between them as if they were interchangeable concepts.

Price (in dollars) has changed for Gold as well. Why is that? Same reason the Bitcoin price (in dollars) has changed, or the price of Pounds has changed.

>>9899463
Ethereum might not be gone in 150 years. But we know for absolute sure gold will still be valuable and the ultimate measure of value in 150 years just like it was 500 years ago and 2500 years ago.

If you had to put 100% of your net worth into either gold or ethereum and take a time machine 150 years in the future.... and you put it into etheruem there's a great chance it doesn't even exist anymore where as gold will still exist and still be valuable. You may want to roll the dice and put it into ethereum but if you are wrong you would have nothing

>>9899202
>Software isn't real
>Software is just a bunch of electrons running around on a circuit board inside a computer...

>>9899491
It was speculation and people considered it a safe haven. It was more of a counter argument to him saying BTC isn't money because it's value fluctuates. Clearly gold has fluctuated as well.

>>9899501
no you fuck that's why this technology is so remarkable, for the first time in human history serious people can see the end of gold as money

>>9899470
Again, dollar value of gold is irrelevant. a gold ounce is stored economic energy. Any manipulation in the dollar price of gold is because of kikes.

My point is.... gold does not rely on the dollar for its value. Do you understand that concept???? If the dollar dissapeared from the world instantly right now...... my gold is completely unaffected

>>9899454
Same way as we value goods in dollar. Not a problem.

>>9899504
it is cost of production you brailet nigger, speculation is an oscillating line on the base line, and the base line is the cost of production

>>9899495
Again....the dollar value of gold is irrelevant. You don't buy gold in hopes that it goes up to 5k and then cash out. That's just a phantom profit cuz all that happened is the dollar is now worth less.

You buy gold because fiat is a scam and you want money and wealth for when paper fails. That's the ENTIRE fucking point of buying gold

>>9899517
So the dollar value of Gold is irrelevant to the conversation but the core of your argument against Bitcoin not being as good as gold is that the dollar value changed?

Bitcoin is a store of the electrical energy that went into mining it. And if the dollar disappeared tomorrow it would still have value.

>>9899536
BTC is better at being gold.

>>9899543
btc is absolute shit

>>9899517
>If the dollar dissapeared from the world instantly right now...... my gold is completely unaffected
Same with bitcoin. 10 sats of bread anyone?

>>9899514
Your missing the point. Gold doesn't function as money in the current kike monetary system. That's the entire reason fiat is failing.

so wtf you mean people can see the end of gold as money? It's not legal tender money now. So wtf are you talking about?

Your fleeing to crypto because the dollar is failing.... not because gold is failing or fucking shit up in the economy

You need to use your head and think more

>>9899546
its superior to gold in every way, see >>9899147

>>9899350
>Money shouldn't go up in price

Do you recall when the Euro was higher than the USD? And now it's lower? You know that both are money (well, shitty fiat currency at least) don't you?

So yes, one asset against some other asset, measured in terms of the of one of the assets can lead to relative fluctuations. But it's relative, and not always meaningful. Lets say the USD is hit by hyperinflation tomorrow. Suddenly Bitcoin is worth $1m. Bitcoin didn't increase in value really, the dollar crashed. That doesn't have anything to do with Bitcoin changing, it's the dollar. And think about that - 10 years of QE, and Bitcoin came out. Is it just that Bitcoin went up, or did fiat currency drop?

>>9899514
DES, MD5 & SHA-1 declared unsecure only after around 20 years. SHA-2 256-bit used in bitcoin won't last long either

>>9899539
But bitcoin is a potential currency that relies on the value of the dollar.

What if bitcoin goes to a billion dollars? What will that billion dollars buy you?

>>9899557
It's because gold can't transact in the modern world. If I have a shit ton of physical gold at home and the dollar is gone tomorrow, guess I'm not buying anything off the internet anymore.

Oh, and have fun when all the poor fucks who never saw the failure of fiat coming figure out you have gold in your house. Hope you put some of your store of wealth into a bunker.

>>9899557
>go to store
>wanna buy a piece of bread
>take out small saw and cut off tiny corner of goldbar
>or have to buy 350 loafs of bread at once

gold is fucking retarded nowadays.

>>9899557
the dollar is designed to fail this is the third time I've said this to you
>>9899376
>>9899205

I am saying in the future bitcoin can make gold worthless as bitcoin can do everything gold can better (not today but in the future) so given people (not you) can see the end of gold

>>9899580
you are talking to a retard who thinks you can store tons of gold in your house for 150 years with no trouble.
what a dunce.

>>9899581
I can buy 1 chicken with 1 silver drachm/dirham from local farmer, just like the people from ancient time

>>9899564
Sure.... exchange rates change.... but when the dollar was first issued and you earned a buck working for 2 days..... and you held that dollar for 3 years it didn't go up in value where you can buy 500$ worth of stuff 3 years later. It stayed the same.

>>9899571
can hard fork hashing
I agree I'm not saying bitcoin definitely will make gold reundant I'm saying it can.

>>9899580
I understand gold doesn't transact in the modern world...I'm not anti crypto. I understand things are becoming digitized. But gold is currency and money. Bitcoin is a currency but it is not money.

Also you are a moron.... gold is $1,300 in fiat. Yet nobody can buy shit with it? Why is that????

>>9899571
Wrong, here's why https://.youtube.com/watch?v=S9JGmA5_unY

>>9899536

But what's this "value" you keep speaking of? All Gold didn't require the same energy expenditure to extract, in some consistent fashion. You're just repeating the same line over and over, that Gold just inherently IS valuable, and everything else isn't. You've absolutely failed to define "value", since you're obviously talking about something the rest of us aren't, or why Gold and ONLY Gold has value.

Honestly, you're really just a Gold worshipper. As in, you literally fetishise and idolise a shiny metal. It's very unhealthy. You've actually stared into the Abyss so long, you've become a Jew.

>>9899581
You can't buy shit with gold. Yet it's worth $1,300 in fiat....

Why is that? Cmon.... show me that high IQ of yours brainlet

>>9899601
But I want bread and I only have pic related

wat do?

>>9899591
But gold is essentially worthless now in a way. You can't buy anything with it and they made it not legal tender....

Why is it $1,300 in fiat to obtain?

If you buy gold today at a coin shop.... why are you doing this?

>>9899630
but you said I can buy bread with it. 350 pieces of bread no more no less.

>>9899562
no bitcoin cash is

>>9899640
exchange with silver or smaller coin
or like in the day take it to a gold smith to mint smaller coins

>>9899202
Ok??? And when i buy things using a credit card, I am using a piece of plastic and looking at numbers on a screen of dollars backed by nothing

>>9899593
You are dumber than a nigger. It's a fucking exercise you dumbass.

The question has nothing to do with niggers stealing your gold.

The question is if you had to put all your net worth into either gold or bitcoin and take a time machine into the future... what do you put your money in.

Part of my question and scenario doesn't include fucking niggers stealing your gold.

How fucking stupid are you?

>>9899654
there is only one king and it sure as fuck is not your BTC copycat.

>>9899659
so I have to reveal to the kike how much gold I have so it isn't a secret anymore.
what if schlomo tells his black friend that I have gold?
anonymity and safety GONE.
with BTC and a DEX you wouldn't have that problem.

>>9899668
Safety is the most important aspect about wealth. if you can't secure your wealth its as good as worthless.

>>9899230
A) it should because im holding a strong currency
B) it should because if im not investing my money to make more money then what am i doing

>>9899653
Yeah if you exchange the gold for fiat you get 1300$ which still buys you 350 loaves of bread just like it did 2,509 years ago.

You can't actually take the gold to the store you fucking worthless brainless nigger. But the value of gold was stored for thousands of years and you can still buy 350 loaves of bread once exchanged for legal Jew tender.

Fucking stupid ass fucking morons you Are

>>9899692
>dollar fails
>want bread
>only have this shiny goldbar
>anon on internet tell me I can't take gold to store to buy something
>but grugg hungry what do?

>>9899685
segwit
replace by fee
1 mb blocks
disabled op codes

good luck

>>9899685
Jesus Christ you fucking asshole. You get on the time machine and go to the future and you bring your gold with you on the time machine or your ethereum with you on the time machine.

You stupid fuckig asshole idiots

>>9899692
50 years ago that same gold bought you 1200 loaves. Why has the value gone down?

>>9899602

But that's the ENTIRE point. In the past, it wasn't possible. You had to use some crappy paper and trust that the Jew who gave it to you actually had something in his vault. Most currencies have purchasing power due to someone pointing a literal or metaphoric gun at your head and declaring they do. Cryptos increase as the network of users increases. The growth has to be organic, because there's no coercion, you're welcome to keep using government money for your electronic needs. And it'll stop increasing eventually, when there's a sufficient balance of supply and demand. Or, everything is measured in terms of sat value, instead of USD.

Your whole thinking is mired in the past, like someone arguing that the Internet won't work because Telegrams don't have pictures on them or something. Your whole frame of reference is off.

>>9899703
>go out of time machine
>gold is confiscated by future cops the second I step on a street

feelsbadman

>>9899700
You can go on YouTube right now and see starving African niggers panning for gold in riverbeds and when they accumulate .01 gram of gold you can watch them exchange it for a loaf of bread.

The entire fucking point is that gold oz still buys you 350 loaves of bread just like it did 2,509 years ago you braindead nigger. Doesn't matter what currency it is.

>>9899623
The vulnerability may not only come from brute force, there may be a weakness inherent to the algorithm
NIST already published SHA-3 as a successor to SHA-2

>>9899202
>What is real?

>>9899722
your inability to see the unprecedented nature of
bitcoin is incredible

>>9899722
but I don't want to buy 350 tons of bread at once, I only need 2 bread.
how I get single bread? I only have this big goldbar?
wat do?

>>9899302
You’re so fucking illiterate man. By your logic, computers have no energy or mass. They just aren’t real. LMAO. Nobody wants to buy sand because its everywhere and nobody gives a shit. Maybe a sand collector values sands from all around the world but nobody gives a shit about sand, its a nuisance just like sandniggers. 150 years from now would you rather have a rare genesis coin, gee i dunno like rare coins sold in pawn shops or museums today??? or would you want to hedge your money in gold which just holds its value???

>>9899705
Dollar being reserve currency and short term price fluctuations as a result of it

>>9899717
>all your crypto algrithm is broken and is all worthless
feelsbadman

>>9899709
But nobody spends bitcoin really. When dollars were issued everyone spent them. And when they saved them their value was stored because gold backed it.

I mean most of the bitcoins are concentrated in a few hands.

Lets say everyone in the world buys .1 bitcoin, and we get rid of the dollar. Then what? 99% of the people own .1 bitcoin and they can do what with that? Buy a Toyota Corolla?

>>9899750
So why hasn't Gold just gone up if the dollar keeps losing purchasing power?

I'm all for a gold backed crypto. One of the great things about crypto is being able to adopt a currency which fits your monetary opinion. But with asset backed crypto you are involving a trusted third party, which goes against the entire reason BTC was created.

Physical gold is pointless in the modern world as a means of transaction.

>>9899725
Is there already an implementation to sha3-256?

>>9899763
>implying that even makes sense
If you have the resources to destroy BTC it would make more sense to be part of the network and get even richer.
checkmate. logic BTFOs you.

>>9899685
>>9899733
if you really don't trust anyone, buy minting equipment and mint small coins yourself
I buy coins regularly from local workshop and they're using small equipment

>>9899743
The point is.... if you put all your wealth into gold and hop on a time machine 150 years into the future you have absolutely NOTHING to worry about as far as your net worth being gone.

I don't know if bitcoin or ethereum is even going to be a thing in 150 years let alone 10 years.

I give you 10 million dollars to take with you to the future 150 years from now. Do you put it in gold and have a sure thing? Or you put it into ethereum and hope?

>>9899557

I'm really struggling to see why you think pointing out that fiat is failing, is somehow a strike against crypto. We know, that's kinda the point. What the anon means is that there's now, for maybe the first time in history, another alternative to Gold. It's obviously got very different qualities, but what it shares with Gold is the fact that its value doesn't derive from any coercion by the governments. Now, you may be of the opinion that it's got less value. That's fine.

Like I said, it's increasingly irrelevant anyway as we're just going to do away with all the fake paper (including all the "Gold" and other metals traded on commodity markets that doesn't exist) and replace it with mathematically verifiable, provable, redeemable Gold backed tokens and get the benefits of both worlds.

>>9899786
QE.... comex..... naked short selling.... and the dollar being the reserve currency still to keep gold and silver from breaking out

>>9899786
Gold has been useless as a means of transaction for more than 50 years yet it's still $1,300.... why?

Because the dollar value of gold tracks how unstable, volatile, and lack of store of value the dollar is.

Which is why 100 years ago 20$ = 1oz of gold and both were a weekly salary.

And today that gold ounce is $1,300 and still worth a good weekly salary

>>9899469
We can measure price, I'm not sure it's that simple to measure value. When measuring some things against other things we usually find a relation somewhere between zero and infinity but everything that's truly valuable is not for sale. This only makes sense depending on the definitions you accept of what value and price are. They're words. I'm not saying that words are meaningless, we use words to try to convey meaning and communicate. What I'm trying to get at is that when you speak of cryptotards, dub, bitcoin, money, new money, measuring and goods, the meaning of these words may be crystal clear to you, but others are making assumptions about what you mean by them so you have to cut people some slack if you want to understand them. If you want to present a point and have it challenged, there's nothing wrong with that, but try to make sure the thesis you present is completely yours if you're actually open to modifying it.

>>9899790
alright, from your statement now I understand how brainlet cryptofags are

>>9899786

I'm just going to point out that you don't need the trusted third party, if you have a trusted sensor that can detect the continued presence of the Gold, and feed it into a system of decentralised oracles to validate that the Gold backing the system is still intact and in place.

This is now a Chainlink thread.

>>9898981
Actually, good money is supposed to go up in value with time.
People will get better at making goods and offering services, and also more people move to those sectors, reducing costs and increasing supply - meanwhile, you have a set amount of currency.
For the same reason, salaries that are measured in good currency should go down with time (at a slower rate than goods/services), not up.

>>9899824
says the retard who has zero knowledge, go shove some bullion up your ass faggot.

>>9899828
And when it suddenly isn't and your tokens are now worthless? You're still trusting a third party to hold the gold.

>>9899793
Why mint a fucking big ass gold bar?. It's so fucking inefficient. We already have the technology to make a transaction instantaneous across the globe and yet you autist wants to go backwards living in the Stone age.

>>9899813
Because it's used as a hedge against fiat now, the same way crypto started. I appreciate how you keep parroting the current price of gold and then talk about the manipulation of the price of gold. Then talk about how BTC isn't a store of value because it's price in fiat went down, but say the price of gold is irrelevant.

BTC as a store of value isn't a sure thing. It will rely on adoption the same way gold does. It could very well fail, but the potential is there.

>>9899798
No, fiat failing isn't a strike against crypto. That's part of the reason your fleeing to crypto.

But we barely have any adoption right now as it is and the price is already outraegeously high. What happens when 5% of the world is invested in bitcoin? The price will probably be 200k. Now adoption is hitting critical mass but 95% of the population can only afford .001 bitcoin if that...

What happens to them???

>>9899857
Potential CURRENCY..... not money

>>9899855
exactly, you can't buy shit with gold, gold doesn't work for daily life.

>>9899864
so what, then a piece of bread costs 0.000005 BTC.
whats exactly the problem?

>>9899007
The bread at the bakery costs a dollar

>>9899855
how is 215 kWh per transation efficient ?

>>9899855
But it's real tho. Why do you think that gold bar has value? Because it's fucking real.

>>9899864
price is irrelevant
price > drives hash rate > hash rate supports price

>>9899875
You can't buy shit with gold yet it's worth $1,300 in fiat. Why?

>>9899778

Ok, again you're assuming a lot. I'm a software developer. I have my own company, and yeah I actually accept Ethereum (or Bitcoin, but I'm not a fan) in payment. And here in Australia, we actually CAN use cryptos to pay our bills, directly, without cashing out (ie we have a bill payment service almost all Australian companies use, anyone can become a Bpay partner, and many accept cryptos ). So I actually already both earn cryptos, and spend cryptos. Why wouldn't I? Saves cashing out, and on the whole, recent months excepted, it's been a damn good way to hold my wealth. And now that I can even hold Gold using it too? Hell yeah.

The hold up in most countries is regulatory, not the technology. It's governments & bankers fucking with things again. But similar services will keep popping up, even in the US eventually.

>>9899875
Your problem and most of your guys problem is...... is that you don't even understand that gold is SAVINGS.

That's how uneducated you guys are

>>9899874
Except it has intrinsic value. The energy required to mine a BTC. Same way gold has an intrinsic value in the energy required to mine it.

It's money whether you like it or not. Gold isn't going anywhere, but you have your head in the sand if you can't see what's coming.

>>9899885

So is a bar of Lead. Why is that not the store of value?

>>9899875
government says gold is not legal tender, but fuck the government, there are community market that accept gold and silver as currency

>>9899894
Kikes gib u paper for shiny metals
me kike print paper can maek as muhc paper as kike need! kike have much shiny rock now!

>>9899911
Lead doesn't have all the properties money has to be like gold does

>>9899904
but BTC is better savings. Gold is just clunky pieces of metal.

>>9899914
Gold is shit as money, BTC is better.

>>9899864

What happens is, whatever they have in purchasing power measured in dollars, is what they will have in the equivalent value of Sats. You do know that's why all this shit is divisible to 18 places right?

>>9899885
If your argument is something has value because it's real then I would also argue cryptocurrency has value because it's real. It's made up of 1s and 0s — an electrical signal inside of a computer.

>>9899929
Any sufficiently rare piece of metal does.

>>9899797
I would put it into bitcoin because
A)genesis digital currency of the future, even if quantum computers come out, miners will switch to them and wallets could be upgraded to more secure methods
B) nobody will care about gold because you’ll have your own virtual reality
C) even if the power grid goes down and my predecessor loses it all he also has a high chance of being robbed and losing his gold
D) if i keep the gold my predecessor will probably sell it at a pawn shop for a digital currency and think im a dumbass for hedging money in gold instead of investing in digital currency

>>9899909
I see what's coming and I understand that bitcoin is a potential currency and wouldn't be surprised if it becomes the de facto currency. But it's not money there's a diff between money and currency. Gold is money and dollars are currency.

ALSO.... what you guys don't understand is the world is swimming in debt. Bitcoin or crypto doesn't solve the debt problem... gold does... with a gold revaluation.

China, India and Russia have been accumulating record tonnage of gold for a decade now. What do you know that they don't? You think they are accumulating gold like there is no tomorrow for fun?

>>9899940
retard probably thinks you need a "whole" BTC.
fucking retards man.

>>9899929

Name the properties, please.

>>9899935
How the fuck is bitcoin better savings? It was less than 500$ 2 years ago and it was 20k 6 months ago and it's 6k now.

That's the fucking opposite of savings you stupid asshole

>>9899940
Crypto doesn't solve the debt problem the world is swimming in. Gold does

>>9899965
>goes up in value over time
sounds good to me.

>>9899965
You continue to use this as an argument while hand waving and saying "Price fluctuations in gold doesn't matter."

Either it matters for both or neither.

get LINK 1000$ EOY

>>9898981
>nsa exists
>have so much power not even the constitution stop them from spying people and wasting loads of money into doing that
>use any other argument against crypto

>>9899950
Nobody will care about gold....a rare earth metal. Niggers in Africa with no formal education are smarter than you.

China, india, and russia have been accumulating thousands and thousands of tons of gold the last 10 years. Wtf do you know that they don't?

>>9899978
Crypto actually solves it because it will make the whole economy more streamlined and more efficient, long term this will fix the debt problem.

>>9899956
Gold is chemically very inert.
Does not react with oxygen, most acids and most bases

>>9899999
What is it with linkfags and gets?

>>9899956
Rare (not too rare tho) fungible, unit of account, indestructible, anonymous, medium of exchange, store of value!etc etc

>>9899999
CHECKED

>>9899984
That's fine.... it's an investment, but not real money.

Gold as money requires banks, lets say someone wants to send some money to someone else across the world:

They'd have to send it by depositing their gold in a bank so the bank could transfer the funds to another bank and that other person can withdraw it. Even a gold backed currency (second layer solution) requires a bank to issue that currency.

With Bitcoin (BCH) you can send that money to someone else anywhere in the world almost instantly for free and REQUIRES NO BANK OR BANKING SYSTEM.

This cuts out the jewish banking cartel completely and makes fractional reserve banking impossible.

Satoshi's vision is a world free from the international Jews.

>>9900032
Crypto is the realest money nigger, in every category better than Gold or Fiat shit.
deal with it goldcuck.

>>9899999
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED
TOTALLY WASTED
> TOTALLY WASTED

fucking cancerous faggotry

>>9900035
strange way to spell BTC.
BTC is the one and only, the one true King.

>>9899952

We know exactly what they know! The dollar is ending, the EU is going to implode, the debt bubble is going to pop and the world is going to have a bit of an economic reset (by which I mean a financial apocalypse). Again, lots of people here are stacking Gold as well. But, we're also willing to bet that short of global nuclear war, the Internet will remain (and maybe even then). And we can replace most of the banking infrastructure (and most of the government functions for that matter) with cryptos and smart contracts, so whatever comes next will be better off than you think.

That's my theory on why the bankers are trying to bring it to heel - I think they want to have it as an exit strategy for the same reason we do. Which is why we hold and stack it, and make em pay us a premium for everything. No more global financial monopolies for (((them))). They share power, or consequences happen.

>>9899994
Price fluctuations in gold do not matter. The only reason the price of gold is going up is because our govt is out of control.

In fact, as a gold owner.... I would wish the price of gold would go back down to $250/oz because that would mean our govt has become fiscally responsible and you wouldn't even lose on real terms either....

Cuz gold at 250$ means that prices of all goods would fall too.

18 years ago gold was like 300$ and not gold is at 1300. Prices of goods have roughly tripled since 1999. I just paid 12$ for a jimmy johns sandwich, chips and drink. That same meal probably cost 5$ 20 years ago.

So gold tracks how worthless the dollar is becoming. Higher gold price equals more worthless dollar equals higher prices

>>9899999
Nice digits.

>>9900035
And most of the people would agree with that flawed logic.

By what will Bitcoin be backed or whatever cryptocurrency you believe in? This wont work any better than the current fiat system, lmao. The problem is the debt system, not the banks per se.

>>9899229
You need electricity for crypto. checkmate

>>9900081
The point?

>>9900018

But all of those could apply to Lead. And you used "store of value" as a property of the thing you're describing, which is "store of value". You're literally using circular logic.

"Gold is money because money is Gold" is a damn tautology.

>>9900035
>With Bitcoin (BCH) you can send that money to someone else anywhere in the world almost instantly for free and REQUIRES NO BANK OR BANKING SYSTEM.
With Bitcoin (BCH) you can send that money to someone else anywhere in the world almost instantly for free and REQUIRES NO BANK OR BANKING SYSTEM.
Bitcoin (BTC)
ftfy

>>9900071
But if your gold is only worth $300 it no longer buys 350 loaves of bread and hasn't stored value for 2000 years. And it's no longer a good weekly salary.

>>9900101
"Gold is money, everything else is credit." -JP Morgan

Not lead.

>>9900035
>>9900108
>215 kWh of electricity is free

>>9900101
>>9900009

>>9900120
You didn't read what I wrote. If the gold price drops to 300$ that means that prices of all goods will go down as well.

Not sure how you don't understand this basic simple example.

100 years ago a good weekly salary was 20$ and 20$ equaled a gold ounce.

100 years later the fiat value of gold today is $1,300 which is still a good weekly salary.

So that gold ounce 100 years ago..... still buys you the same amount of shit today as it did 100 years ago.

>>9900055
>>9900108
>BTC
>free transactions

>>9900138
$0.01 per 100 transactions on the BCH network is effectively free

>>9900004
I can use a plastic card backed by nothing to buy gold, which is supposedly worth something to you. What do you know that they don’t?

>>9899409

See: >>9899285

>>9899000
check out the trips

>>9900187
Gold has been worth something to every living human being going back thousands of years. Until you dumbasses got indoctrinated by govt schools.

Why do you think we have the income inequality that we have now? Because gold doesn't back the currency anymore you dumbass.

There was no such issue as "income inequality" when gold backed the currency.

You could "make it" as a fucking bus driver 60 years ago under a gold standard. Today you have hundreds of NEETS on an anime board investing in crypto trying to make it because you can't make it otherwise because of massive inflation BECAUSE gold doesn't back the currency anymore.

Then you come here and blame the Jews for all the economic hardships they have created not even realizing that the reason the Jews are fucking you is because you don't have sound money backing the currency anymore. The irony of it all. Hate the Jews and you don't even understand that the Jews are fucking you because they've brainwashed you away from the only true store of value gold. Which allows them to devalue your savings

>>9900125

So, JP Morgans statement is now the definition of money? Fuck everyone else, just that guy? Not that list you gave?

I'm done, you're too retarded for words. You're just arguing in a circle, failing to address a single point raised and you act like you've already established your premise, when you've clearly done the opposite. You're a tribute to kikery.

>>9899007
How retarded are you? You specifically mentioned how an ounce of gold has changed in dollar value over time, but that is a store of value because an ounce of gold is still an ounce of gold. It's like you're LITERALLY comparing gold to btc. 1 btc will always be 1 btc, and that's what matters if/when it becomes the backing of all currencies.

>>9900247
BTC is the better gold

>>9900247
>>9900238
just stop replying to this super brainlet.

>>9898981
Gold is suppressed by the dollar since the dollar is not backed by gold.

>>9900230

See? Circular reasoning, absolute Judaism. We've ALREADY discussed how Gold is going to be a major part of the value backing cryptos, and that a large number of us are ALREADY in Gold as well, and that we know all the shit you think you're revealing about the Jews. We know. Half of us are on /pol/ as well ffs.

>>9900266

It's fascinating though, like trying to beat someone lacking all pain sense into submission. You keep hearing bones snap, and they've got nothing to retaliate with, but they think they're winning. It's amazing.

>>9900247
Wait what?

Yes.... the dollar value of gold changes.... but that change is only showing how volatile, unstable, and lack of store of value the dollar is.

Did you not read my example that shows this???

100 years ago a good weekly salary was 20$ or an ounce of gold. If you kept that gold ounce for 100 years until 2018... and you exchange it for fiat at a coin shop you'll get $1,300 for it...... which is STILL a good weekly salary.

Now what in the fuck do you not understand? A literal retard could understand that if you worked for a week in the year 1918.... and earned that gold ounce..... it still buys you the same amount of shit today as it did 100 years ago. Gold didn't change... the dollar did... since 20$ doesn't by you jack shit today.

Wtf are you not understanding?

>>9900238
What do you mean fuck everyone else? Literally every fucking human that ever lived going back 3,000 years knee gold was money you stupid braindead nigger.

>>9900238
JP Morgan was alive 120 years ago.

Gold has been money for thousands of fucking years and everyone knew it.... and every non white non Jew educated person in the world today knows gold is money. Doesn't matter if the fucking govts recognize it or not

>>9900395
but now we have something better than Gold.
which is BTC, its simply superior.

>>9899015
Store of value is the property of money that isn't a property of fiat that you're expounding on here. Still remains to be seen if BTC will be a good store of value. Right now it's still in the experimental phase. Basically you're saying because coins can vary in value rapidly, they aren't good money. And that's true, because they are speculative investments. I don't know what the argument you're trying to make that isn't obvious to any non-brainlet. Also you keep saying goods and services, but a more accurate description would be that money (real money) is an efficient storage of you economic energy that you trade your time working for

>>9900423
cryptofag brainlet circular reasoning

>>9900433
check >>9899147
BTC is superior to Gold and Fiat.

>>9900423
You guys literally market crypto as the new gold... except it's not gold. It's fucking nothing.

If it was better than gold you'd market is as better than gold... except your literally marketing it as gold.

So if gold is useless and just some shiny rock... why are you marketing it as the new gold?

Also... the problems in today's economic world have nothing to do with gold because gold is not legal tender anymore. All the problems in the economy are a result of gold not being used to back the currency anymore.

You are brainwashed and can't grasp logic

>>9899141
I got food and guns up to my eyeballs, can support my family and maybe even some of my community for more than a year (Auguson Farms is a better deal than Mountain House). So after I secured the things that I would be trading for in the apocalypse, I started stacking silver (better upside potential than gold, IMHO) and trading shitcoins

>>9900461
because BTC is superior in every way.
look at >>9899147
that picture explains everything, your tiny boomer brain should be able to understand this.

>>9900431
Also cryptos aren't "battle tested" through crisis yet, but those who have gold during great depression, asian financial crisis, great recession, hyperinflation have done better.

>>9900431
Yes it's a store of economic energy.

But there's no issue with gold being a store of value. Govts don't recognize gold as legal tender today yet it's still the ultimate store of value just like it was 500 or 2500 years ago.

So.... let's say that btc does become a great store of value.... that's not going to change gold as being the ultimate store of value.

What btc is trying to achieve has nothing to do with gold, right? It's trying to mirror gold.... but that doesn't mean gold will lose its store of value status at all

>>9900491
cryptos is only as secure as the algorithm, once a weakness found the crypto is worthless
also it's not scarce since everyone and their dog are making their own shitcoin

>>9900537
Shitcoins backed by empty promises are worthless. Algorithms have been hacked and ASIC'd daily for years, and they always fork and change it up to preserve their value if their teams are worth anything at all

>>9900537
If you funded that kind of computing power theres no incentive to attack the network when you can support it and make money back

>>9900537
>once a weakness found the crypto is worthless
almost 10 years and nobody found a way to exploit it, BTC is perfectly safe.

It is secure and BTC survived the test of time.
other cryptos are still new and time will tell if they manage to survive.

>also it's not scarce
then go on and make your own crypto you dumb fuck, you clearly don't understand anything about how crypto works.

>>9900586
>kid dont understand that if BTC ever becomes a real thing there will be armies of experts through the world employed to find a way to exploit it

>>9900498
I don’t see it as a store of value, but it’s more like a car to me. It does a job but will inevitably be replaced by something better. It’ll depreciate and eventually appreciate as an antique. You can upgrade it but it’s a money sink unless you are sure it’s worth it. kek

>>9900612
if you have the resources to do this you might as well use the resources to mine BTC to enrich yourself even more.
Do you even understand how incentives work?

>>9898981
What you just said with $20k to $3k means you believe money is inflationary. It wasn't always like that, there were long periods in history when money was deflationary and savers not spenders had the incentives. The world is in debt, the current system showed it doesn't work back in 2008 bit it's just been plastered over. Crypto is unironically as true to money as it can be since it is entirely controlled by supply and demand instead of cb issuances

>>9899797
basing your value proposition on a impossible scenario with a time machine is next level stupid

Congratulations on discovering the concept of inflation. Bitcoin is a store of value because it has fixed monetary policy among other properties.

>>9900623
Yes but it is interesting that recently there was a team that found an exploit with EOS and revealed it for a bounty of 15,000$. They were more incentivized to see the success of the platform than to destroy it. Even with exchange hacks, albeit more damaging to reputation, hackers can steal more funds than they do but they still depend on the network to cash out

>>9900642
Welcome to a goldstandard or bitcoinstandard, fucking newfag

>>9900656
Why? It's a great example because you and I both know gold will obviously still have value 150 years from now just like it has the past 5,000 years

>>9900615
Fortunately a rare earth metal doesn't have to be seen as a store of value to you for it to be a store of value. And unfortunately you have to convince almost 100% of the planet that bitcoin is a store of value.

>>9900663
Except it's not real like gold is.

>>9900744
Bitcoin isn’t a good store of value. You can see a small example of it when the trade war started. Its value is purely supply/demand. It doesn’t do much but make money from trading. When its image dies and its limitations of use are seen, it will also die.

I never said gold isn’t a store of value. You are 4/10 troll for attracting this many replies. Do you have an argument? If people use gold instead, nobody is incentivized to spend it. You won’t get paid in 1oz for driving a fucking bus. You’ll get paid even less. What do you think of space rocks my guy?

>>9900851
You moron..... I said you could "make it" driving a bus 60 years ago because we were on a gold standard. Not that you get paid in gold you fucking braindead nigger.

Example:

In 1964 min wage was $1.25 and a gold ounce was 35$

So a min wage worker could purchase an ounce of gold after a week of working.

Today min wage is 9$ and gold is $1,300. So a min wage worker today has to work an ENTIRE month before he can purchase that same ounce of gold that a min wage worker could purchase after a week 55 years ago.

So a min wage worker in 1964 was much better off than a min wage worker is today because we were on a gold standard back then.

$1.25 was 5 silver quarters and if you go to a coin shop and sell 5 silver quarters you'll get about 18$ for them in metal value.

So a min wage worker in 1964 had the equivalent income of someone making 18$ today or about twice the purchasing power as a min wage worker today

Get it now? Now that I have spoonfed you?

>>9901030
>>9899230

Now read what the fuck you wrote earlier and gtfo

>>9899722
1 bitcoin buys you about 2000 loaves of bread.

>>9901030
We weren't on a gold standard. The gold standard was abolished in 1933. The government just tied the private sale price of gold to the US dollar and gold actually lost value for 35 years until 1968 when they stopped controlling the value of gold.

>>9898981
>$1,300 in dollars which is still a good weekly salary,

it's a month salary in most of Europe actually.

>>9901145
What are you talking about???? A gold standard means low prices. The end.

Life is good and prices are low on a gold standard.

Go offa gold standard and you end up having so much income inequality that a crazy community in Bernie sanders almost becomes president. Because the riffraff don't understand that they can't buy shit anymore because there's no value to their money anymore

>>9901294
No it wouldn’t. You can’t afford to do a lot of things you can do today

>>9901294
That has nothing to do with what is backing the currency and everything to do with monetary policy.

In 1935 the US government changed the fixed price of gold from $20 to $35. It wasn't the gold standard, just the set price of gold in the private market.

>>9901030
Also you’re comparing to today. Compare to 1990-2000. You talk as though you would’ve bought gold in 1964 but why do this when you’re living the good life, and how can you predict inflation and geopolitical stability. If you bought in 1975 you wouldve been down for nearly 30 years

>>9900680
Good luck carrying a gold bar around imbecile
Goldbugd are fucking retarded

>>9901938
only retards buy bars and rounds.

>>9901815
You didn't need to buy gold when it was backing the dollar. The entire point of buying gold is because fiat is currently a scam because it isn't backed by gold.

>>9898981
By your reasoning the dollar is not money neither.

But it is and you’re faggot.
What are u going to do walk around paying people in silver coins? Next time u want to order online u going to mail them some gold?


You know why the gold standard was abolished right?
Yes yes the Jews and bankers, but it was he same thing you criticise about crypto that ended up with gold being replaced.

Debt runs out society, if not for debt and inflation people would hoard gold, why would I Invest when I could just keep gold which will inevitably rise in value against other goods due to scarcity and continuous population growth.
And that’s exactly what everyone did, hoard gold and it was that stagnation and the impossibility to stimulate the economy that pushed the government to finally give in to the bankers.

>>9899950
>you’ll have your own virtual reality
yeah Martin u are right, just need my hoverboard.
> pls stop watching rick and morty

>>9902276
Yea cause facebook bought oculus rift as a joke.

>rick and morty

>>9898985
I am so fucking tired of seeing this mother fuckers face

>>9899000
Checked

>>9902066
>You didn't need to buy gold when it was backing the dollar. The entire point of buying gold is because fiat is currently a scam because it isn't backed by gold.

>>9899007

And guess what:
When I buy crypto, I am not buying money. I am buying a speculative asset.
Gold is not speculative. It has proven steady value.

I am buying certain crypto because eventually I am expecting people to go "shit, I should probably get on board." Nobody is FOMOing into gold. Utility coins that actually provide real tangible value and efficiency that drive profits are going to sharply correct once their systems get online.

That is why early tokens that rely on someone else's work are not considered money, they're securities.

Monero>Gold>Bitcoin>Litecoin>Bcash

>>9902369
>>You didn't need to buy gold when it was backing the dollar.
He's right. When currency was backed by gold, your dollar value was inherently worth an amount of gold and would not change.

What it means though is that unless currencies decoupled from gold is that economies could not produce more than their gold supplies because they were unable to inflate to actually "give out" equivalent to the new work being done. Deflationary currencies are bad because there's negative incentive to invest, as you get returns by NOT spending.

>>9898981

Silver tried to break out yesterday. Failed today.
Though it is doing well especially at this time in the year
What do you guys think? Short term Manipulation?
How much silver is in a bitcoin miner?

>>9899147
>bitcoin
>fungible
laughing_fat_ricardo_spagni.jpg

Anyway, OP is a super brainlet and a few of you who aren't reddit spacing mouthbreathers explained the advantages that cryptographically secured financial instruments have over muh metal that I can touch.

>>9898981

>>9902866
You can touch your metal all night.
But you don't find the xau spot price drop today a little suspicious in light of the news?
It's like it's...manipulated or something.

>>9899999
>>9900000

>>9899147
>>9902866
friendly reminder Monero is the only true fungible cryptocurrency
>unkown_amount_of_monero_alphabay.jpg
>related

>>9899999
*bags of link get heavier*

>>9898981
>Gold goes from $20 to $1,300 in 100 years
>if you invested $20 in stocks 100 years ago, it’s be worth $7,360 today.

Gold is for retards.

>>9898995
>2018
>still falling for the crypto meme
Boomer detected

Average weekly income in 1918
>$25
Average weekly income in 2018
>$881

>>9904220
Yes, hording PMs is for retards. I don't think most people horde the shit though.

>>9899040
not yet, because it needs to fill its awaiting 50-500 trillion marketcap, before the exponential growth can end

once it filled the mcap, bitcoin will be as stable as gold

until then, as more and more ppl realize what it means, it'll keep getting exponential bullruns

>>9904275
But how many people had a JOB in 1918 total population was only 105 million and only 15% of women worked.

>>9904393
That doesn’t affect the value of a weekly salary. Unless you’re admitting that Gold is shit as a store of value. (You are.)