/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>8684736
>how long did it take for the market to recover?
5 years or so

>>8684736
3 years.

>>8684736
Yes, the Mt. Goxxening of 2014. it didn't recover for 3 years.

3 years, but that was before normies. This is post-normie and anyone not selling is retarded. Gl HODLING xD hodl

>>8684736
Yes, from $1216 down to about $230? Just about 87% loss IIRC. This is a nothingburger crash

Oldfags remember when Bitcoin flash crashed to $0.01.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T1X6qQt9ONg
Then one guy bought 261k btc for 1 cent.

>>8684758
>>8684781
>>8684794
do you think the market has bled enough or we
re going lower?

>>8684841
We are going much, much lower. That's just my opinion though. Think for yourself

>>8684736
Yes. this is very similar to the Mt. Gox crash. It only took BTC 5 years to recover. So just HODL until 2023 and you should be even again.
hopefully

>>8684841
lower today. maybe 6-6.2. this was completely predictable.

>>8684736
Cryptocoins are not a market dumbfuck, it's a ponzi scheme

And yes it's happened many times before and people are always losing money in scams like this

>>8684736
This is where we separate boys from men. Grow some balls or get the fuck out of crypto.

Come with me OP
We can be young men together again
Take a leap of faith. Come with me...

>>8684845
>this is very similar to the Mt. Gox crash

Nope, it's not.

Mt Gox -> BTC got stolen

January 2018 onwards -> people noticed that the BTC network cannot function as a global currency

It's fundamentally very different. The decade-long idea of BTC as a future currency lost all credibility.
BTC holders are already being laughed at. In 20 years BTC will be one of those curiosities like electric shocks used as treatment in the 19th century.

>>8684861
Its only a ponzi if the coin has no use outside of being a "store of value"

oldfags dumped on us, told us to hold and now are laughing at our pain and suicides
fuck oldfags

>>8684736
It kinda reminds me less of the 2014 crash and more of something like the China FUD dip but on a massive drawn out scale.

I see the same sentiment occuring and believe or not there were people refusing to buy at the bottom of those dips insisting is was 'the end'.

2014 felt more like a shitcoin pump and dump, it went from $100 to $1000 in almost a month.

>>8684845

Likely will take less time. People often forget 2013 when BTC corrected a lot and then went on to 1200 in 2014. There's a chance that this could be the same thing. There's more interest and visibility, and if ETF's are ever approved by the SEC which is highly possible this year, expect everyone to FOMO back in. These are the main reasons i'm still hodling, and I'm looking at this as an opportunity to finally get 1BTC.

>>8684971
The dif being that during the China FUD, we all thought that since institutional money
and the Normies haven't got in, BTC will inevitably go up

This time however, I am not too sure.
Too many Normies got burnt and if you haven't dump your bags on them in Jan.
It is too late now

It's over
The whole crypto thing

>>8684736
Gox, dotcom, 2007... make your call.

>>8684910
the majority of BTC and crypto owners know it has no value. it's just an international casino. and for that function it has done very well.

I love it how Bitcoin sites are desperately trying to keep the price up with false news.

In Finland we have a BTC market for middle-aged normies and their site is always full of bullshit like "Lightning Network already complete and implemented, the dip is just because of lies from China."
"Dip over soon" and then it dips further LOL.

>>8685012
I still think it's got another rally in it, either that or at least some volatile sideways activity that can be traded.

It'll go to 2k, I don't know if it'll ever fully recover. The days of 12k+ are over.

>>8684987
When the ICO alts start hitting project goals and there is still no price action, bags are going to be dropped en masse.
Of a lot of them will exit scam or collapse too.
Altcoins.

>>8684736
if you can't hold for a decade you probably should find some other investments

the days of moon mission are ogre

>>8685066

Now, think of the fact that there are guys out there that paid 19k for Bitcoin just a few months ago.

Makes you smile doesn't it. Unless you're the guy.

>>8684910
This

The whole thing is a joke and people are finally waking up

>>8684861
this is why team mini sucks
this faggot thinks crypto is a scam
still on /biz/
fuck team mini
PB FTW

>>8684736
I feel you anon, I fucked myself over by buying at the peak too. I’m down 80%+

Fortunately, I managed to stumble into a pretty nice whale circle through sheer luck. The general consensus is:

-the bear market will last for about another year. The bottom will be around $100B market cap with $140 eth and $3/4k btc

-2020 will likely see the next huge boom

-Now is the time to really accumulate. On a weekly/monthly basis drop a certain percentage of your income into solid projects

Apart from that, all we can really do is wait. Hodl strong, friend

>>8685044
It's fucking sad

Lying scammers just trying to keep their ponzi going

>>8684736
Something I do remember about all of the previous bear periods is how quickly the sentiment can 180 when things turn even slightly bullish.

>>8684841
we're going to 3k. If youre asking questions like this please take the time to educate yourself. Look at @Swenlink's 2014 fractal projected onto this current chart....and look into wyckoff's work and see why we are going down.

>>8684987

Why would it recover now that it's been proven BTC can't function as a currency?
Did you forget about the slow confirmations and $50 transfer fees? It was all because the network had too many users. That was like less than 0,01% of the world population and it completely ruined Bitcoin. Global currency my ass.

>>8685119
Wait so you can predict the future by drawing lines on charts?

I can set up a meeting with the CEO of Goldman tomorrow, this is fucking HUGE.

>>8685068

Oh I agree. This is a good cleansing to get rid of all the shit. For those of us who work it's a great opportunity to buy more and ride the second wave even if we have to wait a few years. I'm just admitting there's a possibility this is a rather large pullback before even newer highs, but eventually a giant crash is going to happen. People are still hoping, so I can see it going either way.

>>8685120
>Did you forget about the slow confirmations and $50 transfer fees? It was all because the network had too many users.

You think that's the reason Bitcoin is crashing? The crash has literally nothing to do with Bitcoins functionality.

>>8685120
The delusion of cashies.
To accommodate visa's current volume alone would require 3GB blocks right now ie. totally ridiculous.
2nd layer is the only practical solution.
LN for the win.

>>8684841
We will capitulate to 3k sometime this year. Average your buy down

>>8685165
I have a bit of exposure to alts to hedge my bets in the event of a sudden take off, but I'm going into hibernation mode otherwise :)

>>8685120
yeah BTC cant scale. LN wont fix that.
That and that 80%+ is mined now is the difference to 2014. It has reached its peak regarding what was technically possible for it and with full mainstream attention. That was it. Get out while you can.

>>8685197
The word 'will' has no place when talking about trading.

>>8685168
> The crash has literally nothing to do with Bitcoins functionality.

It had everything to do with Bitcoin's lack of functionality.

>>8684910
lol team creme confirmed for braindead and retarded

>>8685217
I bet less than 1% of people who bought and then sold Bitcoin actually even tried to make a transaction with it.

kek, now the newfags want to hear from oldfags, after months of shitposting about what talented day traders they are. the irony is rich, THE IRONY IS RICH, GET IT? RICHER THAN NEWFAGS

>>8685105
I've been buying the dips for a while. still at quite a loss, as the dips keep getting deeper.
hope you're right and the bull will return

>>8685222
trips to confirm. Dubs to double confirm

>>8685234
If the coin had a practical use case less people would have dumped it and the downtrend would not have been as harsh. Its fairly simple.

BTC, as it stands right now IS a ponzi scheme. It has no reason to exist over something like Monero for example.

>>8685105
Complete bullshit. The coin is worthless, all you're doing is manipulating a market of numbers.

>>8685322
This is why it's so hard to people to put the 'buy low' part into practice.

If you believe this guy now, you would have believed him in late 2014 too.

>>8684910
>January 2018 onwards -> people noticed that the BTC network cannot function as a global currency


I'd say earlier. It really hit me when I was trying to exit in December into gold and it took a week to get the BTC transferred no matter what fee I stuck on. BTC is shit as a currency.

>>8684736
This seems like just another day to me.

>>8685058
The problem is the decreasing vol and interest, which will be the death of us.

fuck off /biz/ you laughed at me when I made this post in december
you deserve this

>>8684736
Are you really such newfags?
Since 2017 people were in constant fear of bubble bursting. Daily. Everyone knew this heppning is about to come.
----------------------------------------
Peanut butter
We nut in your mother

big issue is also this insane volatility.
it doesnt let you sleep when you check you portfolio 20x a day.
its heavy mentally and psychological. no sane person wants to endure that for sustained periods of time.

also:
ecological disaster
no central bank backing
deflationary supply (which makes ur “investment” into a gamble)
easy to copy paste monopoly money coin
backed by eventually nothing, worse than tulips

only pros: blockchain, decentralized ledger
that has killer use but i dont see it with btc but more in industry use and not in internet monopoly money.

>>8685513
so what's your advice? what is the buy in target this time?

>>8685513
So what's the buy target faggot i know it should be around 3-4k but then again I am a September buyer this is my first crash all i know is i am still up x3 from my initial already cashed out will enter back in but i dont know if 4k will be possible although you cant compare the old times of bitcoin to 2018 we have lighting network and alot of infrastructure being built to be delivered this year shouldn't this pump up the price?

>>8685752
there will be a dip down just as steap as the spike to $20k was
then the price will double and another bull run will begin
it will be extremely slow at first, build will gradually build up for the coming 3 years

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3-Ml8oAVqUc

>>8685720
>no sane person wants to endure that for sustained periods of time
Please god help me I've been stuck in this surreal anxiety attack checking the Bitcoin prices since late 2016.

>>8685752
are you some kind of fucking autist? trade with the trend, not against this.
Ive been telling people this since 14k just to get called a brainlet and a poorfag, and now newfags are asking for help. its fucking hilarious. just quit and get a job

>>8685834
there was tons of good news in 2014, none of it matters
I don't even bother with news I watch the psychology of the market
lightning is the shit but it will take time to build up confidence. nobody is ready to put his millions in this just yet

>>8685179
3GB blocksize limit isn't even that ridiculous.
1GB blocks can be run NOW on a $4,000 machine. Even 1/3 or 1/10 of VISA level would be huge for cryptocurrency.
1MB blocks simply can't support a system outside of a few niche websites for NEETs online.
Bitcoin Cash can scale onchain. Specialized UTXO validation hardware and write-once read only optical storage can eventually get us way way way past 1 MB. 1MB is a joke!!!!

>>8685838
the market's already down to november levels though, isn't the dip supposed to be over?

>>8685921
>isn't the dip supposed to be over?
kek. Sometime in the next 9 months or so is the bottom of the dip. then you get to move SIDEWAYS. That's the good news. Once you reach the real bottom, there is no more loss. Only sideways and you move up very very gradually for like 2 years. So the people saying 3 years aren't wrong if you're tring to get back up to the all-time high. But if you're just waiting for the bottom to buy back in, it's less than a year of waiting left.

>>8684910
>But but but but it's a commodity not a currency!

You fucking retards. It's a bunch of bits shared by a network of computers. It has absolutely no purpose except wasting huge amounts of electricity.

I dont think Bitcoin will bounce back this time. Coins that have some kind of actual use will be the ones to start a new bubble. Bitcoin is old and outdated. It will go up. But I doubt it will ever get to the point it was in December ever again. We will be too focused on some DAPP social media page (Steemit) or some kind of interesting idea that goes viral and is based on EOS or ETH. And THAT will cause the next boom.

Sad thing is, there is no real reason for the coin to go up in value just because of adoption. Thats the issue, when crypto booms and everyone begins using it for some cool new thing. People wont buy large amounts of the coins, they will just get what they need to use it. Nobody will HODL. It will just end up being an intermediary to utilize functionality.

There is no reason for the average user of steemit to have steem power. In fact its completely pointless if you are a great content creator you can earn money regardless. Steem power is only for people who want to promote and moderate the platform honestly.

>>8684736
I followed the charts daily from end of 2012. Completly normal. I expect it to go to 4000$ to be honest

>>8685982
B..but my anonymity
>need a bank account to use an exchange
B..but fuck the government
>pays capital goys tax

>>8685921
I sold in december so I'm actually gradually moving in again (about 15% now)
last time it took a year but this pop is much much slower than the last one nobody can tell
I was wrong about the velocity because there are way more exchanges now slowing it down.
nobody knows people are much more aware of it too but at the end of 2014 nobody was talking about bitcoin anymore.

>>8685875
So the old saying no amount of bad or good news can change the trend of a market is true, 2 years to accumulate sounds good to me last time i accumulated 2 months to reach an ath of 60k , i can't even imagine the amount of gains I'd get with 2 years of accumulation

>>8686036
You're saying the bleed is actually slower this time? It feels really quick. I thought we'd take a full year at least to reach the bottom if it's around 4k but at this rate we could be there in a month or two.

>>8686063
Watch the charts from 2014 to 2016 it looks exactly the same

>>8685210
Nor when speaking of capitulation - you absolute faggot

>>8685471
It is another day, you absolute faggot.

I first bought btc around 2011-2012. But i started to "invest" when it was around 800 on early 2014. Its much faster and bloody this time. It definitely feels like that, lots of false hope. like "overstock is starting accept bitcoin the price surely will go up". There was a bull trap in the summer of 14 that took us back up to around 750. People were waiting for that as a signal for a reversal. Then it corrected back to 450. And then it went down to 270. After that people were seriously friggin out. Thats when the bitcoin is death articles started to really pop. We then have capitulation that year on Dec. And people were angry and done with bitcoin and rage quiting. Little did they know that was the bottom.

So in short, there still a lot of hope out there. Price is still high. Honestly until we hit at least 2k I still believe people have too much hope on bitcoin.

>>8686063
well it felt faster but maybe that's because I remember pic related vividly

>>8686063
I think it's actually slower, it's just we're in the second dip of the crash and will likely bounce back up and bleed down from there.

>>8686236
That trip from $700 down to $290 and then back up to $600 in 1 week looks brutal.

>>8686063
>>8686036

this time is much faster, just look at the charts, that guy is full of shit. the price was down 40% from the ATH (1300) back then We are down almost 75%. In a way this is good news. you want this shit to reset as soon as possible. But desu people need to start losing in hope in order to get a reversal. And that takes a lot of time. There still a lot of hope

This crash isn't anything like the previous crashes. So comparing it to them is absurd.

It is however, crazy similar to the dot com crash in the 90's. The market trends. How people talk about it. Everything.

So, if history repeats itself, crypto won't die. But, the hyper-volatile market with moon missions and over night riches is long gone.

There were gems like Amazon, Ebay, and Netflix hidden among all the shit back then. There are gems among all the shit now. If you watch the market, do a butt load of research, and invest wisely you'll come out of the crash in a really good position.

Don't get caught up in the "it's the end of the world" FUD, because it isn't. This might one of the greatest opportunities to become wealthy you will have. Take it or end up like one shit head boomers or gen xers that say "man, I wish I invested in amazon when it was $1".

>>8686341
what coins do you hold? help your bizbros out

>>8686341
>So, if history repeats itself, crypto won't die. But, the hyper-volatile market with moon missions and over night riches is long gone.

Why? Penny stocks still exist and behave almost the same as crypto. Why wouldn't super volatile small-cap shitcoins continue to exist?

>>8684736
>spells it out

J O O B I L A T I O N

>>8686394
Most penny stocks actually have cash flows and growth which makes them much easier to value.

>>8686318
>But desu people need to start losing in hope in order to get a reversal. And that takes a lot of time. There still a lot of hope
absolute truth

>>8685120

People thought the internet couldn't scale, either.

>>8686456
If EOS dies / turns out to be a scam / Dan falls off a cliff and explodes, that would be it for me. I would then pull out all money from the market and wash my hands of this entire thing.

Bottom line here is that, we might need to come to grips with the idea that mass adoption may not actually have a huge effect on a coins value. If a lot more people spend and use the coin, volatility would be much less.

Who oldfag and buying EOS here?

>>8686542
I would seriously not hold ANY fucking alt during 2018
however good your fucking alt might be it's going down
this has nothing to do with rationality

What would even be the catalyst for BTC to go back to December levels? You now are reminded that Tether exists.

>>8686568
Unfortunately I have genesis addresses for my alt, which means I literally can't rebuy back in later with the same benefit if I sell, so I'm basically forced to hold. The pain is killing me.

>>8686542
dude dont be an idiot. if you have all your money in a shit coin and you know it then you are going to get rekt. Dan Larimer is notorious for dumping projects.Just look at the coins during the crash of 14. Almost all of them are abandoned or almost gone

>>8686583
>Amazon allows payments in Bitcoin
But really there are plenty of things that could make it go back up. There wasn't a single reason for it to go that high in the first place.

>>8685100
> being this much of a butternigger
Enjoy holding bags your whole life

>>8686588
well then, just like dogecoin and so many others it will rebound, but probably in 2020-2021

>>8686563
Dont hold any alts. Only hold a proven coin like BTC, ETH, BCH and maybe LTC, XMR, and XRP. Its not time to fuck around with products that dont exist yet

>>8685445
>>8684910
Blockstream's at fault, if they'd increased blocksize back when congestion first started being an issue as originally described in the white paper this shit wouldn't have happened.

>>8686608
Normie FOMO made it go up. Now that so many normies got burned so hard nobody will ever buy it again.

It already reached critical mass awareness and nobody's left to buy.

>>8686638
You forgot stellar

>>8686568
I am waiting to see how things go come June first. If EOS takes a shit and it has no potential anymore then I am out. The only coin I will continue using is Steem as it allows me to make money by making videos and blog posts. Even then I will probably dump 100% of my steem.

>>8686608
tech is nice but the volaitily turned me totally off. switches from an investment into pure gambling and ruins the tech part with it.

>>8686608
Overstock and Newegg started accepting payment on BTC on 2014. It didnt help at all. So no. The only thing that will reverse the market is pain and suffering after all the crappy investors sell at 2k

>>8686602
oh man that triggers nostalgia
I had all of these they were 40% of my portfolio and were responsible for decimating my portfolio

how do I short

>>8686633
Good news is my holdings increase by jst under 30% per year between now and then so it might be worth it in the end.
>>8686659
Overstock and Newegg are nice but Amazon would be different.

>>8684910
BTC is 100% dead. Has no real world use or adoption it cannot function as a currency because of volatility and it's not a store of value.

>>8686659
Yeah and I seriously think mass adoption is not going to drive the price of a coin up. It will go sideways and maybe even down.

>>8685105
Deluded peanner

>>8685838
>tfw when you are stage 5 victim

>>8684794

There were a lot of normies in the late 2013 bubble. It was even on TV just like 2017. Just not as much.

The 2014 crash was almost exactly identical. We're at fear right now; when we go under 6k (which we will, just wait) we will hit capitulation.

Recovery won't happen for another few months. I don't think it will take years like some people here think. The mainstream growth this time around was much, much larger than 2014. Everyone wants to re-enter the market, they're just waiting for it to bottom out for sure.

>>8686723
so was I in 2011
I assumed there would be another bubble after I was forced to move my shit from mtgox right before it all collapsed and I was right
you'll be up 4x in 4 years but just only hold btc
maybe eth, but I can't say

>>8686602
>>8686666
h-how can I tell if it's shitcoin or not?

>>8686602
I am taking the risk because even if steem drops to 10 cents again the platform will still be useful to me. And frankly it will be. So I am taking my chances with EOS.

That's my last straw. If EOS turns out to be total shit then I am out. On that note I am planning to actually use EOS if / when it goes live.

Old fag here, I bought most of my coins in 2014-2015, I have 20+ BTC and 150+ ETH.

- I am hodling and am prepared to wait years if needed. It would have been nice to sell a bit in the 15k region but now I think it doesn't make sens.
- I am connected with many other old fags, some of them being whales.
- Everybody who has been here for some time expected a crash like this to happen at some points.
- Some sold (the best of them targeted the 17k region on the rebound), some short to accumulate more BTC, other are hodling.
- There is no consensus about where the bottom is, but old fags to not believe to that "Bitcoin is dead" bullshit.
- There is nothing wrong with the fundamentals, scaling issues will be resolved by lightning network and numerous other improvement are coming (Drive chain, Confidential Transactions, Mimble Wimble..).
- This crash is mainly the result of a bubble burst: people that have no idea what they were buying when the price went up are selling now that the price is going down.
- Nobody can tell you with certainty where the bottom will be, how long this crash is going to last.
Those who say that they can are lying.
Although personally I do not believe that BTC will go lower than the 3000/2000 $ region, and this is my worst case scenario.
- Most of us do not believe we have see the absolute top yet. There are interesting papers ( e.g. https://s3.eu-west-2.amazonaws.com/john-pfeffer/An+Investor%27s+Take+on+Cryptoassets+v6.pdf ) that you can read online that have 6 digits targets for BTC.
- This is my first major crash to (I am not counting the little correction that we saw in 2017). But I do know some people that were in the game through the 2013 bubble and survive the great bear market of 2014.
Those people are now absolutely fucking rich.
That is why I am not selling.

>>8686695
Are you a brainlet?

Mass adoption means demand for money. Demand for money means its price goes up.

>the absolute state of /biz/

>>8686638
Doesn't matter, if the market is in the gutter, everything is in the gutter. Alts just go a bit harder.

He'll deliver.

>>8686764
He is
just rollin for digits tho

>>8684736
Btc was literally at 6k for like 3-4 months ago and then went up to 13k or more i think

>>8686394
You're right but the entire market isn't volatile like crypto was a few months ago and dot com before it.

>>8686368
Right now, I am pretty much a nocoiner Sold off before this dip and am shorting BTC. I'm not buying back in until there is enough evidence that the bottom has been hit. Looking at FUN, TRX, ADA, ARK, OPT, and BAT at the moment. This will change as time goes on.

i rather have my holdings vanish rather than pull out now and see it explode again without any crypto in my pockets

>btc was $1,000 just one year ago
>people are mad about a $6,000 btc

???

>>8686756
when it's going up the biggest shitcoin will explode in price
when it's going down the best alt will shit the bed harder than btc

>>8686764
Mass adoption of a coin means the coin will trade hands a lot more but it also means roughly the same number of people will be investing in it.

I don't think mass adoption is going to work the same way for this tech like everything else has. All it will do is reduce volatility. You might see a spike to a certain amount and it will basically flat line.

Nobody will be holding the coin en mass, everyone will trade it for what they want and dump right back to fiat again. There is no logical reason why a crypto will reach 20k again.

>>8686341
Protip to all of you replying to this mong thinking he has good advice. If he had anything worth saying he wouldn't need to post whorebait with it.

the most important thing i've learnt in trading that never ever give any credits to anons opinion, maybe do the opposite that sometimes works

>>8686746

Capitulation by the retail investors, maybe. Anyone with a brain realizes that BTC's longterm outlook is bullish. Big money is waiting and accumulating. If this is the price and people haven't even started using it yet, what will be the price when it's made more accessible and easier to use? There is real demand for this, a currency that is immune to hyperinflation and has cheap fees (once scaling is implemented) is a game changer financially, especially to the unbanked which comprises a huge portion of the world population.

The question is, when will big money be satisfied to enter, and where will the front running start? My guess is 5800 is where the front running will start to get significant and turn the tide.

>>8686840
they are late to the party.

>>8684736
>Got here in December, what happened before this you guys?

>>8686756
Here are signs to be able to tell your coin wont make it:

a) Its a chink coin
b) Its shilled non stop by pajeets on reddit/4chan
c) Its an ERC20 Token
d) Its an Appcoin
e) Its main function is not as currency

If you say yes to two of the above, you have a shitcoin on your hands. No partnerships, no announcements, no listing on exchanges will change that. In this thread ill post snapshots until 2016

>>8686862
Maybe I posted whorebait cause I'm a big fan of tits you virgin neet brainlet.

>>8686666
Nice quad

>>8686840
>>8686874
I got in at $300 BTC and it still sucks watching my portfolio shrink this much.

>working shitty 30k salary job right now
>coworker won't shut the fuck up every week about his $200 Bitcoin "investment"
>never talk to him about it
>he keeps whining about prices
>know that the day he shuts up and sells will be the day I buy the very bottom
Goddamn I hate the mainstream media for turning this market into shit.

>itt: newfags pretending to be oldfags and dumb opinions

>>8686779
dude, those alts never came back. they didnt recover. in 2 or 3 years there is a very high chance no one heard of EOS

>>8686917
>I got in at $300 BTC

>iktf

so did i. i moved my from gox to btc-e. Took a break then came back to find my account hacked and the site shutdown

>>8686921
Embrace it. They'll be back and we'll buy the bottom.

>>8686901
>a) Its a chink coin
>d) Its an Appcoin
>e) Its main function is not as currency

Yeah, because crypto needs more currencies and everything out of China is shit... Stay poor.

>>8686917
This, bought in around $900, sold 1/3rd at the top, and this still blows.

>>8686901
>Wow look at these awesome coins. Im sure they are all smart investments in 2 years

>>8685222

This. Team Creme is pathetic.

>>8686924
Even if you bought BlackCoin in 2015 you still made good money

>>8686924
Nobody has heard of steem either but its still a solid platform and you dont have to invest anything into it other than time to make an income.

If EOS is the same way and turns out to be a decent platform then fuck it, this will be the face of crypto from now on.

What was Bitcoin again? Oh yeah that ponzi scheme right.

>>8686963
who /rimbit/ here? Still holding

>>8686963
No ERC20 tokens though

>>8686963

>comparing random Bitcoin clones to new ages tokens with actual use cases

The absolute state of brainlet /biz/

>>8686855
>people increasingly want to use btc to buy and sell things with
>there is a limited supply of btc
>the price of btc will _________

Fill in the blank.

In your brainlet mind, explain what mechanism drives foreign exchange rates. Genuinely curious.

>>8686963
Thats a stupid fucking argument and you know it. Point to a list of things that failed and acting like it applies to the entire list is dumb. Especially when many of those coins could have turned you into a multi millionaire for investing a few grand.

>>8686963
That's neat, you'd be filthy rich if you held most of these.

>>8684910
This! Anyone of thinking crypto are real is being retard!!!

Fuck you team creme

>>8686958
I wish I had, would have been enough to buy a house where I live.

>>8684910
>people finally realize ripple is the most realistic

>>8686950
That sucks man, this is why I don't trust exchanges and leave coins on them, seen that happen too many times to too many people.

>>8686047
What do you plan on accumulating?

>>8687001
God damn how did 4chan sort all the brainlets into team creme? Do you know basic economics, the exchange rates are controlled by governments and people only buy foreign currency to invest travel or flip. Bitcoin is pure speculation, it will never become a really currency. Your shitcoin is dead, get over it faggot

>>8687005
Almost all of them performed worse than bitcoin.

>>8686901

>>8687004
If you buy btc at 270. you would also be multimillionaire. The point is that either those coins are completely dead, or they performed worse than BTC

>>8687078
Did you even do the math?

>>8687036
i had 10btc and 20 ltc. I still get depressed thinking about it. Hard lesson learned

Sure bitcoin is dying, but from the ashes will rise other crypto, mostly utility based.

>>8687001
Coin will stabilize in value. Investors are more likely to cause scarcity but mass adoption and use of the coin doesn't necessarily correlate with the value of the coin increasing. It just means the coins change hands more often. If nobody is holding the coins the value can even go down considerably even while people continue to use it.

I don't think mass adoption is going to do much for the value of most coins outside of a sugar rush before volatility decreases.

>>8686855
If mass adoption actually occurs then the velocity of money would necessitate a higher price since bitcoin is finite. Let's say that 100 million people worldwide use bitcoin. That would mean that on average everyone would have less than $4000 even at a $20k bitcoin, that's obviously not plausible. Whether mass adoption will actually occur or not is an entirely different matter though, I've always thought that true mass adoption won't because normalfags don't like difficult things and bitcoin requires them to be more responsible with things like checking addresses and safeguarding their own funds than they are accustomed to. To me it becoming the predominant vehicle for black market and money laundering is where it can acquire a huge value which is why long run I'm most bullish on things like monero.

>>8687155
I think the problem is people buy bitcoin just to "make money". Almost any coin.

>>8684951
you are right they dumped on you but that's not what caused the crash. there are a handful of whales out there that own 90% of all btc. even the biggest biz whales are nothing compare to these fucks. the gox guy alone probably caused most of this crash

>>8687097
>Performed considerably better than btc
Monero, Stellar

>Slightly better
Litecoin, Dash

>Worse or Dead
Everything else

>>8687091
That doesn't make it not a stupid fucking argument. You cant point to a list and then use that to say, "EOS is exactly like all of these!" When 25% of those coins had massive ROI.

Ripple for example was massively superior investment compared to BTC had you sold in December.

Whats your point dude? You saying shit fails sometimes. Cool bro

>>8687155

Mass adoption comes when utility is built in. Utility takes time. Internet utility in 1992, compared to 2002, compared to 2012, is night and day. The problem is the hype came way too early, so now we're stuck waiting five more years before the true bubble begins.

Good news is, we all get to be early adopters again. We're not too late. Everyone crying about not buying in 2015 will get that chance again.

>>8687005
>>8686978
>>8686973

>Yeah dude im going all in on BANX they have partnerships with chink banks. Im in it for the long run

Thats EOS and any other shitcoin

>>8687235
The problem is that bitcoin is actually less useful than it was two years ago, merchant use has decreased, not increased.

>>8687219
25% is bullshit. Im saying your chances of success are pretty fucking low by buying shitcoins on a bear market. its better to go through it holding something safer like bitcoin, and then you can buy your shitcoins once we reach consolidation and people are not in it for the money like EOS. or Waltonchink

>>8686963
If you bought XLM at .002 you won

>>8684736
not quite an oldfag, but everytime last year, whenever bitcoin climbed to a new all time high, he would come back to bottom at the previous top. The only time this didn't happen was when he crossed 5k to go to 20k, never coming back for the 5k top. This time he's coming, and he's late. I wouldn't rule impossible it bottoming at 4k, given the circumstances.

But fear not, bitcoin will be worth 100 thousand in 3 years max

I think you guys are forgetting about the major role that Consensus will play. Attendance this year blows 2017 and previous years out of the water. My guess is that we continue dumping with some bounces along the way until May or maybe late April where price will be 5-5.5k. We'll see an extended bull trap of a few weeks to a month where we will hit anywhere between 10-15k. Shitcoins will also pump but not like December. If anyone is holding shitcoins that'll be your chance to dump. After some consolidation, a bearish trend will form and we'll start dumping again over the next few months to a year following May with the bottom being anywhere between 2-4k, maybe 2k worst-case. The pump and subsequent dump will serve to break the spirits of everyone that is currently hopeful of a bullish return, it will be the real purging of the weak-hands. December was just phase one. When the bull run returns 2019-2020, I have no idea where we'll go but I estimate 50k+ BTC with 2 trillion or higher total market cap. After 2017, the crypto space attracted eyes of real major players and they won't buy in until the cheapest possible entry point. I'm putting money on everything I just said but not more than I can afford to lose because anyone who claims to know without doubt what will actually happen is an absolute dumbass. I may be completely wrong but I have a hunch I'm not. Screencap this.

>>8684736
Ofcourse there was but I don't think we will recover to ath prices anymore.

>>8687257

Like I said, the hype came before it was ready, the the speculation has been damaging for adoption. This crash will give crypto a chance to cool off and come back later with superior tech. The people entered the amusement park before the rides were even finished.

>>8687274
and held*

>>8687319
in other words
WE ARE THE EARLY ADOPTERS
JUST HOLD YOU DUDES AND LAMBOS WILL BE HERE

>>8687235
Satoshi said something about btc needing to move slowly. It became a problem during gox and last year. Internet had use in the late 90s. You could email, upload files, and play games over LAN. It was clear where it would go. Bitcoin has remained the same since 2009. Its overvalued now. Ethereum has a brighter future because of the capabilities of building apps on it.

>>8687240
Solid point, but there's a chance it could compete with ethereum

>>8687155
Currently right now, the best way to actually use a coin is to have it act like a intermediary. In other words fiat > Crypto > Fiat right after. This means nobody is going to be holding the coin other than a middleman. Most people dont give a fuck investing in a coin. They just want to buy something.

The more complex systems for things like staking. Maybe video games where you can earn the coins or maybe gain upvotes or some means in which you accrue said coins actually cause inflation. But that would be the only time you might see people actually holding the coins rather than instantly dumping them for fiat right after.

You wont be increasing the number of investors and the price of the coin in an actual no bullshit use case scenario the price is practically fucking irrelevant.

It will probably go up a bit then flatten out completely. There will be no more of this get rich quick shit. And frankly Bitcoin or most other coins can FULLY function for what they are meant to do regardless of the price.

>>8687269
Bitcoin is the last thing you want to be holding. It was the worst performing coin of 2017 in the top 10 on CMC. Bitcoin is not safe, it was dog fucked by Doge coin on ROI last year. And no it has zero fucking future and caused the market to crash super hard when it showed that the coin is useless and lightning network is complete shit.

>>8687473
DigiByte is the future!

>>8685099
Its a joke because people bought in to get rich and cash out back to fiat. Its like catching a knife in the dark. Bitcoin cash is the only thing that could save the bitcoin name. But governments are looking at making their own blockchain. That would kill bitcoin.

>>8684736
Gag

>>8684736
Some of you dumb fucks still don't understand that market sentiment is not same as 2-3 years ago. Everything has changed. We have a billion dollar industry now and bitcoin was always pumped with fake money which is tether, and dumped for real money which is cash.

>>8685838
>tfw early investor from stage 3 but fell for the hodl meme

Now I'm up only only like 50% that is like $500, that sucks.

>>8687568
You remind me of arguing with religious nut jobs.

> If you dont believe in god then nothing else can be true! All hail jesus! (Bitcoin)

Uhh god kind of sucks ass and here is endless proof that the bibble is bullshit. ( All counter arguments means buy digibyte!)

> YOU MUST WORSHIP SATAN!!!!!!!

kys please,

next

>>8687294
>My guess is that we continue dumping with some bounces along the way until May or maybe late April where price will be 5-5.5k.
At this rate it'll be 2k by then

>>8686901
>a) Its a chink coin
>b) Its shilled non stop by pajeets on reddit/4chan
>c) Its an ERC20 Token
>d) Its an Appcoin
>e) Its main function is not as currency

tfw VIA holder
>autistic dev
>dev hacks exchange to test pump your bags
>privacy txs coming
>lightning coming
>already atomic swapped with decred
>no marketing yet

>>8687709
w-what are you talking about
i was praising DigiBee

>>8687413
>I don't understand velocity of money whatsoever

>>8687729
It won't keep dumping at this rate just because that's what you expect it to do.

>>8687771
Your wishful thinking that BTC is going to 100k is quite amazing but I hate to break it to you.

This shit doesn't just go up and when you remove the volatility you end up with 5% gains a year. Kind of like the stock market.

Your lambo is never going to happen.

>>8687821
It won't slow down just because you expect it to.

>>8687834
Are you illiterate? I specifically said that that was IF mass adoption occurred followed by stating that I don't think mass adoption ever will.

>>8687862
Mass adoption will happen. The price of these coins will mimic the stock market to a T. And most tech adoptions plateau.

Same shit different toilet. Crypto is not going to continue being a money fountain forever.

>>8687841
Do you honestly think a drop like this is sustainable and will go on for a month? Did you miss the Bart memes? BTC has specific patterns it moves according to. The patterns are well-known and defined. The problem is figuring out which pattern should be applied to the current price movement. A 5k drop over the course of a month is absurd. That was over and done with in January as a response to the absurd bull market of the time. There is no catalyst for it to happen again other than you being scared seeing price drop so quickly and so suddenly. Think logically not emotionally.

https://medium.com/@super.crypto1/4th-dimension-bitcoin-manipulation-cartel-can-it-be-burnt-no-way-c53de65c166a

This is why

>>8687922
Its absolutely impossible for mass adoption to occur without bitcoin being worth far more than $20,000. You cannot have both of the things that you're saying occur because bitcoin does not change hands quickly enough to handle trillions of dollars a day with each bitcoin only being worth $20k. Choose one and only one.
>>8687937
The manipulation has been to attempt to keep the price as high as possible so that people can squeeze as much money as they can out while selling. We are now seeing people who have held actually start to get scared so if anything I anticipate the descent to speed up.

Is ChainLink a good investiment guys?

>>8688011
>Its absolutely impossible for mass adoption to occur without bitcoin being worth far more than $20,000.

Hey guys it might dawn on this brainlet that it wont be Bitcoin that obtains mass adoption. Lets wait and see until it clicks in his mind. It might take awhile though, gotta clear out all those "HODL" meme cobwebs.

But this is an important step for you anon. This means you are starting to understand! You are peering into the window of the future!

Bitcoin is actually very fucked. It has no future, it cant scale and LN is quite literally impossible to actually implement.

>>8688011
People had 3 months to be scared and sell. I just noticed while typing that we've already bounced back to 6.8k. The people still holding now (I mean holding because of tech not people trying to play the market on bitmex or bitfinex) need a lot more despair before selling. Even a drop to 2-3K alone probably won't be enough to shake them out. That's why we have to see a strong bull trap to 10-15K first before reaching 2-3k levels. Consensus 2018 is the perfect catalyst for that. When they see prices going to 10-15K, they'll think the bull market is finally back and they'll let their guard down. The drop to 2-3k will completely shatter their will and they'll finally sell. That's when institutional investors come in and another bull market happens that will blow December out of the water. In any case, we can agree that BTC prices will be very low before the bull market starts. That's good. Good luck to you anon. Hope you time it right.

>>8688141
>Hey guys it might dawn on this brainlet that it wont be Bitcoin that obtains mass adoption.
I have already told you that I don't think it will hit mass adoption you retard.
>>8688157
They were in denial and 6.8k is a DCB.

>>8688178
>I have already told you that I don't think it will hit mass adoption you retard.

I already told you mass adoption IS going to happen and its going to require something as big as facebook to do it.

Since Bitcoin cant scale, and it sucks for literally everything its supposed to do outside of show its possible to use the tech. It wont be Bitcoin to do it.

It will probably be NEO or EOS or some 16 year old kid the programs a new dapp that becomes massively popular.

>>8688263
>mass adoption will occur
>It won't be bitcoin
We're talking bitcoin you stupid faggot. All the prices that we've been listing up till now are specifically about bitcoin and now you're retreating to this bullshit because you know you fucked up.

>>8686638
Stay away from litecoin it went from $40 dollars to under $2. You know what charlie lee said?

>>8686917
Could have got in at $500 But waited for it to go down. Will you buy more?

>>8685322

doubt you have even read the white paper. one of the most genius invention I have seen in my lifetime. If you really think censorship resistant, secure, p2p electronic currency is intrinsically worthless you are a brainlet.

Bcash is the reason we are getting fucked so hard. It printed free money to toss around everywhere without regard. Basically tripled our mcap overnight. Now we are in for a multiyear bear market with scary lows because there is not anything to look forward to. Normies are either in or dont care. Nothing is increasing in use case. Most alts stuck in missing deadlines and awful half partnerships. It is a mess.

>>8688157
Already happened. 6k to 11k was the trap. Now back down to 6800 and going lower.

I've been in BTC since 2010. There have been multiple bloodbaths. At first I was confident because of that. However, this one is different. The worst historical bloodbath was Mt. Gox, but that was a sharp decline followed by a bleed, followed by a very slow recovery. This one was a sharp increase followed by a brutal, consistent bleed for months on end. This is nothing like what we've seen in the past. I liquidated all of my holdings and am sitting completely in fiat waiting for us to retrace to 3-5k, at which point I'll begin buying in as we go down. I won't be surprised if we hit 2k.

>>8688698
Christ...can't imagine how easy to become a whale was in 2010

Anyways do you see Bitcoin going sub 1000$, IMO this would be full despair stage

>>8688736
Truthfully, I think this could be the end. There comes a time when it's all over, and this might be it. Keep in mind that Bitcoin will be 10 years old soon.

>>8688613
Whales buy alts. The alts are fomoed into by normals. Couple of dumps by whales. They get people to panic sell into btc. Whales dump btc for tether. Everything drops. They buy back alts and btc. Rinse and repeat. Goal is to obtain all the btc.

>>8688736
Remember they bought a pizza for 10,000 bitcoins? Wonder if they held.

>>8688736
>easy

Yeah, all you had to do was ignore all crashes, hacks, MT Gox, ignore all you have learned about economics and there you go.

>>8684910
> t. bought in at 12k.
Spoken like a true team cremetard.