/biz/ - Business & Finance

This shit is retarded. When it dumps it says sell and when it pumps it says buy. Did /biz/ set that up?

>>7875624
>Pump
Still going down

>>7875624
kek

>>7875624
Generally you'd wait for a confirmation of uptrend and buy in, generally you'd wait for a confirmation of downtrend and sell. Either way you're just gambling. In this way you can make more accurate decisions. Sure you lose a bit of money, waiting but you make more consistent profit.

>>7874837
Bottom is 4.5k, seriously dude, no1 is going to buy at these prices. Its retarded. BTC needs LN and way more users before anything above 8k is justified.

Sell low buy high, it makes sense

>>7875747
explain your math for 4.5k
how is 4.5k "high"

you do realize you don't have to buy whole bitcoins right?

>>7875747
mooning at monday.

It still needs confirmattion tho, when there are like 14 sells and 1 buy its time to buy.

>>7875736
>Generally you'd wait for a confirmation of uptrend and buy in, generally you'd wait for a confirmation of downtrend and sell.
No, these retards are supposed to recognize tops and bottoms, thats the whole point of TA, that's why they are all day drawing memelines. If you can't even do that just might aswel kys.

>>7875767
Yes, I'm familiar with Bitcoin. And no there's no necessary math involved just like you can't mathmetically say its worth 20k or 15k.

4.5k is technically the most logical bottom after the crash, just be patient because once it hits that price target, this whole cyclus comes to an end. And we will see slow organic growth based on Bitcoins actuall Network Value, that means

1. A large user base
2. People that use it and not hold it to sell of like a ponzi scheme.

I think BTC is amazing, but right now its nothing but speculation. Nobody uses it.

Deflationary payment systems don't work, you need light inflation and I personally think thats the only flaw of Satoshi, he should have invented a mechanism in which BTC mathmetically inflates very small percentages so people will use it instead of sit on it.

>>7875799
>>7874837

>>7875888
saved

>>7875888
Nice trips
You should add a graph crashing on the background

>>7875861
you are wrong about everything and didn't supply me with a mathematical reason for 4.5k.

You can have commodities that are deflationary

>what is gold
>what is real estate

>>7875861
Brainlet. $6000 was the mean. There is a 2000 BTC buy wall at $9700, so it's the absolute bottom.
We bounced off the downtrend resistance, we are about to go up and test it again.

>>7876014
>There is a 2000 BTC buy wall at $9700
how new are you?

>>7876014
you're retarded to think that it has any more upside at this point
it's no longer attractive at this valuation; if it were, there would by no resistance to speak of

>>7876070
>no arguments
Ok, brainlet

>>7875933

>>7876075
>hurrr durr I don't understand how a deflationary currency with limited supply works
That's you.
BTC will always go up, forever. That's the purpose of BTC, brainlet.

>>7876139
Kek

>>7876147
>BTC will always go up, forever

>>7876147
I'm not negating its current role, nor do I think it's a bad investment for the long term
I'm saying the market isn't as eager as it was EOY and still remembers the fall, the risk is piling up and concerns of diminishing returns along with it
the whales - if they are smart - will not allow any new bull runs without allowing a whole new batch of money to flow into crypto
people want quick returns, I say let's give it to them by going down to like 4k

>>7876014

let me explain a buy wall you you....

Say the price is 10005 and some rich faggot puts down a buy wall at 9999 for 500 bitcoin...

Stop thinking like "Omg rich faggot will buy them all!!! I must buy now!!"

and start realizing that somebody with enough money to buy 500 bitcoin is unwilling to pay the market price and is for some ((reason)) wanting you to fomo and buy in front of them...

Buy walls are a sign of weakness and manipulation young brainlet.

>>7876014
>2000 Bitcoin buy wall indicates a trend reversal
I'd post a brainlet if I had any. Dang dude thats fucking retarded.

>>7876279
That's not how it works with BTC, brainlet.

>>7874837
i like this wojack

>>7876377
That definitely is how it works, say if someone wants to short Bitcoin? Puts up massive buy walls to spoof the price up, then takes a short position and starts dumping.

Its exactly how it works.

>>7876279
>buy walls are bearish

you can't get any dumber than this

>>7876451
They can be bullish, not necessarily though. Buy walls are definitely manipulative so he's right about that.

>>7876418
This whole thread is a wojack-paradise

>>7876508
In the end no-one has a fucking clue where it will be in 5 hours. Could very well also hitting 10.5k again

>>7876426
You don't trade BTC, retard. Any significant price movement happens, when someone marketdumps or marketbuys 200+ BTC. It's basically a whale playground. The normal 1m volume is 2-30 BTC, and then someone put a market order for millions in a second. That's how BTC works.
The recent dip was caused completely by a coordinated market dumping. If there are buy walls to eat the dump, the price holds. If there aren't it's a free fall.

Here's a dump attempt at 9800, just a few minutes ago. The buy wall ate it and the price is now moving up.

>>7876577
the bounce post-1st contact with current support was unremarkable

>>7876601
Nothing goes straight up or down, sure I agree the recent dip was a coordinated dump. Though I stand firm with my opinion that its gonna crash

-Bearfag Eternally

>>7876601
I think what everyone is generally ignoring is when the whales don't move, we see a steady %5 a day. Not even kidding, watch the graphs if you don't believe me.

small buys over and over and over and over and over again, people just keep buying up. Then a few whales dump, and then again, and then again. And even between each dump the price is still on an uptrend.

Whales are just taking profit and trying to keep BTC low for now, but this won't last forever. The market will soon bubble over the lid that the whales are trying to keep on this boiling pot

>>7876654
Same thing was happening almost 24hours ago, look where are we now.

>>7876656
Thats what the whales want. If you think we control the price with our shitty purchases you are in to be wrecked.
Follow the whales.

>>7876656
Yes, it's true.
Blame the futures.
>be a whale
>short 5000 BTC with x100 leverage
>wait for BTC to get near a support
>market dump 1000 BTC, triggering stop losses
>market crashes
>cash out

>>7876719
obviously the whales don't want to keep BTC low forever, they have tons of it, they would be shooting themselves in the foot

best way to follow the whales would be to stock up on BTC during every dip

>>7876728
my theory too but this can't keep happening forever. Eventually they will either run out of enough BTC to make this profitable and will have tons of fiat, at which point they either never touch crypto again or use their massive fiat fortune to do the opposite, leverage long 100x and buy 10k BTC at a time

>>7875624
it's from tradingview lmao. it's going based off formulas that tend to be accurate in traditional markets, aka it's completely irrelevant and inaccurate when it comes to crypto.

>>7876756
Why not? Get it low, shake people out start buying it up again, retail investors have no clue what they're doing anyway but nobody wants to miss out when BTC does hit infamous goals of 100k-1MM. I bet they can push the price down to 4k and start pumping it again and people will again buy the top.

>>7876756
Why would whales care about the btc price? They only need trading percentages.
even if bitcoin was going from $10 to $6 that is still 40% just like 10k to 6k.
They dont give a damn shit, they just want to multiply their money.

>>7876756
>>7876656
The whales don't care about the BTC price anymore, they makes more money short/long roller coaster.
The futures are killing the crypto market. Blame the US government.

>hurr durr with futures market we can watch BTC markets more closely
>except everything is anonymous and decentralized and we can't do shit about manipulation anyway
>derp

Many of these buy/sell walls are just people closing their positions.

>>7876833
they literally can't get it that low, you don't think they are trying right now? You can only sell all of your bitcoin

>>7876833
>Reply to myself for additional comment

Why do you think HODL is so popular? Because no1 has a clue what the fuck they're doing.

I'm not saying i'm a pro but aslong as I'm making money, even in downtrends I'd like to think I'm beating the 90% of the market.

>>7876893
Ofcourse they can, why did it reach 6k if they couldn't? Down from 19k, exactly the same is happening right now. Tons of threads started popping up everywhere, Bitcointalk, 4chan, Reddit saying they are buying back in (11k) because all the dooms talk turned out to be a lie.

Now they're trapped again.

>>7875736
While this is obviously optimal, I'm skeptical that a layperson should ever try this. Seems like a recipe for buying high and selling low. On the other hand, trying to identify an overall trend gives us a chance to be intuitively correct, in which case it's at least somewhat profitable to assume some conservative variance around the moving average to determine when to trade. I do see where math people with bots would be a different story.

>>7876377
Wolong literally describes using that strategy lol

>>7875861
found the leddit autiste

>>7876939
A laymen shouldn't bother timing the market, he should just monthly average into a commodity or stock or asset. Not worrying about the price aslong as he believes on a longterm picture (5-10 years) it will go up.

>>7876975
You can't do fake walls with BTC, because when the whales are pumping/dumping they will get eaten faster than you can pull them.
Fake walls only work with shitcoins.

>>7876934
they would still make more money going long at a certain point, and they would regain their control over the market

as you sell all your bitcoin, your also selling the grip and control you have on the market. The whales are shedding their size. At a certain point it will be more profitable to go long. I believe next future will be a long. If the current whales get too careless, new money will come in and become the new whales as well.

>>7876139
>/biz/

>>7877056
>t. brainlet

>>7877058
I'd say its an interesting point but i'm doubtfull about its validity, because at some point you will get the price low enough that people start panicselling, and depending on the buy support at those levels it can drop very rapidly without sacrificing big amounts of your stack.

>>7876861
You're an absolute brainlet if you thought futures and the ability to be able to short/long an asset class wouldn't exist in a market.

Pic relevant. It's you.

>>7877104
I feel like this describes 20k to 5.9k. Yeah, I know, 20k was extreme parabolic growth, but the fact remains we fell just about 70% from ATH, which is literally gox levels of crash. I don't think they'll sell off more than an actual gox crash. The absolute bottom is 2k and I really really really really doubt we'll ever see that.

>>7877246
We'll see, I personally think 4-5k is very plausible.

>>7877354
I doubt it will go that low, 7-8k is what I currently believe.

>>7877354
idk with futures closing tomorrow, and the inverse head and shoulers forming from it, I feel like 8-8.5 is the final bottom we'll see.

but then again we'll see. If they so decide 5k is within reach

>>7875624
I always think of /biz/ when I see this thing

That site is a fucking text-book example of buy high, sell low; whenever BTC is down, they tell you to sell. Whenever it's up they tell you to buy.

>>7878655
BUY BUY BUY

>>7876656
>>7876656
t.retard
The reason it goes up is to meet the demand from being oversold. It meets the demand but that high ends up being much lower. When it stops rising people see this and start a chain reaction to dump to a lower low. Repeat ad neaseum.

>>7875938
commodities != currency

>>7879940
but these are both currencies are commodities