/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>7613870
The blockchain is already too long, which is causing longer solution and transaction times.

>>7613870
First I thought the tree huggers where just exaggerating but the energy consumption from miners world wide is actually fucking ridiculous.

>>7613870
Fuck all data.
1mb every 10 mins I think

It's all a race to solve computational problems by guessing numbers which burns fuel m8. First to guess wins and it gets harder over time

How much energy do all the banks on the planet use? Servers, heating, lights, computers, etc?
Global vs global, only fair comparison.

>>7614033
Treehuggers aside it is absurd from business and efficiency point of view. It doesn't give anything comparably worth in return for such overhead anymore.

so i guess in the begining a simple graphics card would do the trick and now u need a super computer ?

>>7614033
>the continent of Africa

>>7614093
Banks provide services for half population of this planet. I pay for stuff with my mastercard several times a day and its instant and I don't care about fees no matter the price. I haven't paid for anything with btc since 2016.

>looks up utilities ETFs to invest in. all of them are losing money even with more electricity being used than ever before.

>>7614093
Crypto doesn't really do what banks do.

>title: OMG BITCOIN TAKES SO MUCH ENERGY
>picture: chimney smoke = pollution = bad
>picture legend (tiny characters): nearly 100% of Iceland energy comes from renewable sources
if it doesn't tell you everything to know on the topic, you're a brainlet
not even a fan of bitcoin, this dinosaur shitcoin needs to die for the rest of the ecosystem to resume healthy growth (after the 90, 95, 99% crash that will follow)
but the energy argument is batshit retarded
like anon said, try comparing it to the collective energy used to power the banking system, to power armies defending that banking system, throw in the economic toll of wars waged to protect central banking, and so on. those are all costs necessary to protect centralized government currencies, whereas bitcoin needs none more than the hardware, electricity and living wage salaries for the miners involved

>>7614236
Renewable sources doesn't mean pollution free. Solar panels are a disaster in terms of pollution and burning wood for power is "renewable" as well.

However investing in energy may be a good idea.

Imagine if we put this computing power into dna sequencing or sifting through interstellar signals. Kind of makes me mad that humans are such greedy fags.

>>7614277
fair counterpoint
ultimately btc mining is not sustainable
the debate is just heavily framed in a sensasionalist way

>>7614215
Yet

>>7614033
Whats happening in the Vatican?

>>7614308
Lots of new blockchains are designed exactly with a useful purpose in mind.

>>7614308
DNA coin when?

>>7614308
That makes me wonder, as a computer semi-illiterate, isn't there a coin you can mine by solving actual real problems ?

id rather have earth disappear entirely in the next 50 years than have bitcoin drop back under 1k.

its literally a no-brainer.

>>7614331
their god AI is almost online

>>7614033
great start on a list of countries that shouldn't even exist.

>>7614127
But muh decentralized store of value.

>>7614387
Idk why you people hate the Irish so famn much

>>7613870
>homes

Lmao, it's literally nothing
Industry and business uses 90+% of energy in every country, the "scoop" is that a tiny island with cheap electricity is spending ~5% of its power on mining

>>7614410
Houses actually use 20 to 30% of the total power in any developed country.

>>7614343
Care to give a few ? Genuinely interested.

>>7614315
>the debate is just heavily framed in a sensasionalist way
I do agree.

On that matter, a fab putting out a million of chips a month consumes as much power as a 200k inhabitants city.

>>7614497

A factory produce things.

Bitcoin don't, it's fucking thin air, useless speculation,actually even normal useless speculation(stock market or traditional ponzi) don't spend this large amount of energy, just enough to keep the market running, not "mining" thin air.

That's the frame of the thing.

>>7614726
lets say price of btc drops below mining cost currently at about ~3k. mining probablys shuts down and BTC, is kill no ?

>>7614799
Yes, and afaik the difficulty only goes up with each block and increasing the cost.

>>7614726
You can't compare a factory with market goods/stocks. The one produces and the other is just a usefull medium to keep the production running.

>>7614353
No sorry. People don't invest in coins that solve real problems. That's why the human race is taking too long. If people weren't interested in money we would be terraforming mars right now and lots of people would live there.

Africa's population is such a drain of world resources

>>7614948
Sorry they don't use resources. What are you even saying.

>>7614130
you have to go back

>>7614971
>they don't use resources
Where you clueless fucks even come from jesus christ

>>7615098
Africa doesn't use resources. They live in mudhuts and grow corn to survive

I can't believe I wasted precious time responding to a white supremacist

>>7613870

This is beyond retarded. Bitcoins value derived in part from its difficulty to produce. Tell me how much energy is expended mining gold just so cucks can store it in vaults and never use it? We already have more than enough gold to cover industrial uses but we mine it to produce the surplus for losers who want to stockpile it. Meanwhile because you have the brain of a monkey that gold seems more “real” simply because it is tangible. Furthermore if you start saying humans can’t use energy on this where do you commies draw the line? How about no more cinemas? After all we can do without spending energy watching pictures move on a screen, etc etc.

>>7615222
Lol this is amazing. This proves you people are fcking commies.

>Dig a hole with a showel for entire day
>Put dirt back in at the end
>Dig a hole with showel next day
>Put dirt back in at the end of 2nd day
>Ask for pay because you where digging for 2 days straight

>>7614876
So it's kinda like that game bop-it or digital Simon says for computers

>>7614277
What about geothermal power plants? They have these in Iceland.

I've been mining etc. On some second hand gpus and it's actually netted me the best profit after electricity. Not just that but it's set to pump before the fork in march.

>>7614799
No. Just, no.

>>7614726
Of course, it was just a comparison.

>>7615907
Those are relatively clean

And what's wrong with that?
People pay to use that electricity, Computational power is directly related to electricity consumption, if we want to move forward as society we have to look at ways to provide ever increasing amounts of energy for consumption, the approach some movements and even countries are taking at aiming to reduce the amount of energy consumed is ridiculous and will set us back as species and society.
In fact all the different approaches to measure how advance a society is are based around the amount of energy produced and consumed.

Instead of using retarded and incredibly expensive solar, we should be looking at using nuclear, gas turbines combined hydropower, Bitcoin is only the first, soon we will have world wide computers like etherum, quantum computers working together in large numbers, AI, etc.
The question is not how much energy we are consuming, but how can we provide it.

>>7616220
Wasting energy on useless shit won't make up move forward. It's even more stupid than building moai on easter island. If the computational power of miners was used for something productive it would be something to be proud of, but here it's just retarded e-luxury.

>>7616269
You miss the point of my thread.
Bitcoin is just the first, Ethereum aims to be a super computer using millions of computers around the world, AI, quantum computers, we have to adapt to the the possibilities of the future.
If people decide to use energy in bitcoin who are you to say that's wrong?
Freedom is what powers creativity, You can say bitcoin is useless at face of value, but so is paper money, is what backs it that gives it it's value, BTC is backed by countless nerds and speculators and therefore it has value, if people chose to use electricity to mine it because they think it will invebitably replace our current system it's their choice, they pay for electricity, we as society shouldn't look for ways to limit this choices and instead we should look at ways to provide more electricity, because if we shut down bitcoin we are closing the door to a potential world changing technology.
You could argue that back in the 18th century looking at planets and wasting endless hours looking at the stars and developin telescopes was an absolute waste of time and resources, 100 years later we landed on the moon.

>>7616415
paper money is dirt cheap to produce

>>7616415
>they pay for electricity, we as society shouldn't look for ways to limit this choices and instead we should look at ways to provide more electricity
Or we could make everyone pay more for electricity and make more money that way. Because we are free to do so.

I went to Iceland a few years ago. In cities they literally pump geothermal water under the pavements and roads of keep them ice free and toasty.

They can warm up roads they can mine a few shitcoins nigga

The sad part is it is no doubt ONE guy sucking up all this energy in iceland, only one guy mining shit in an entire country, but no Bitcoin is totally not centralized!

>>7613870
Well that's a given. I would be quite surprised if BTC mining would be consuming more homes than energy, or in fact, any homes at all!

Proof of Work has doomed our species

>>7614033
this map looks like "How can we cover the most amount of territory in scary orange whilst still remaining somewhat accurate regarding the amount of energy being consumed?"

>>7617260
I know! Let's pick all the places in the world with the lowest per capita energy uses and population densities, and throw in an extra one here or there to make it not so obvious that's what we're doing. Motherfuckers will eat it up.