/biz/ - Business & Finance

Let's look at any part of society where the men are paid to do nothing.
>CRIME
>CRIME
>CRIME
Gee, such a great idea. Let's try spreading that.

>>7474344
You can take whatever you want, as long as it isn't mine.

>>7474390

this. Competition drives innovation and progress. When certain people, niggers for example, dont have to work or contribute anything they just divulge into complete useless degenerates, now imagine that but everywhere. Universal income is one of the most cancerous ideas ive ever heard of

>>7474390
In which societies are man paid to do nothing? And if you meant welfare, welfare (at least here in Canada) is like 600 a month for a single person. Can't live on that

>>7474344
That or the guillotine.

>>7474390
but you can make more money by working. You shouldn't be limited to the UBI.

>>7474344
I have a friend who lives off autism bux
he hates his life
he can't do anything profitable with his time because if he makes any money he loses all the free autism bux
so he is strongly incentivized to never work
he's miserable all the time and all he does is fester away, growing less happy by the day

>literally roman tier
No thanks government id like to live another 50 years

>>7474344
My country of Britain could afford to give everyone £1000 a month if they cut all funding for benefits of any kind and the NHS.

I know which I'd rather have.

>>7474344
one day the rich have to pay the 99% 1k a month just to keep them tame.

Its useless to have wealth when the majority starts to revolt, because they have "no jobs" and there fore no money.

Its a small price to pay to stay on top.

>>7474453
In america you can get cash+food+housing+medical
You can even get retarded shit like transportation

It's a sign of the times. Specially young people that are manipulated like puppets by politicians think that just because technology and computers exist, then we don't have to work anymore and "muh machines will do everything", like economic laws don't apply anymore. Inflation still exists, human nature of getting lazy and entitled when spoonfed still exists, and someone will still have to build robots and AI.

What will happen is that almost all physically demanding jobs will be wiped, and it's historically a trend. You don't have to spend 100% of your day working at a feudal farm like your ancestors had to 1200 years ago. You don't have to keep turning screws 18 hours a day like your great-(...)-grandparents had to 150 years ago. Due to technology, the human work force has flown from physical and "dumb" (as in, anyone with muscle power could do it), to intellectual and qualified; not everyone can program a robot. So it's not that "we'll stop working and machines will do everything" like millenials love to put it. That's just being deluded.

>>7474513
Rich people currently bail out of america at a mere 40% rate
America will gut itself

>>7474595
Source?

>>7474453
Ghetto.

>>7474547
yes, the jobs get more difficult
but there are also fewer of them
when the assembly line came in and 1000 out of 2000 workers in each factory were fired
the factory didn't then hire 1000 new employees to maintain the mechanical parts of the assembly line
maybe they hired 5 new permanent people and 10 part time people from time to time

nowadays the portions of the assembly that used to be done by people are also now done by mechanical arms
and if you look at the factory, there can be as few as 2 people in the entire building

>he thought this thread was worth making again

fucking sage faggot

The only real solution to this problem is to liquidate most of the population that will no longer be required

>>7474485
He would be better off if it was UBI because with universal basic income you can make more money if you work while still getting some UBI. So he can get a minimum wage job for $20000 a year plus maybe $7500 extra UBI.

>>7474390
they commit crime because theyre dumb nigs not because of welfare. if they were working at taco bell theyd still be doing the same stupid shit. plus, a universal income doesnt disincentivize you to work like welfare. you get that money either way. if you want more on top of it then you work at the robot assembly plant. nigs are gonna be nigs either way.

>>7474453
Any major city in America that's heavily infested with Democrats. For example, Chicago, Los Angeles, or New York

>>7474678
The difference now is that all these changes are happening way too quickly and retraining is just too slow so you just end up with towns who lost their one big employer just stay put and live off disability while falling into the opioid trap. Funnily enough Hillary tried telling those workers about retraining into another sector but she stopped when the only thing they were taking out of that was "you will lose your job"

>>7474804
correct. but instead we do the exact opposite and import shit loads of illiterate 3rd worlders who's low skill jobs will all be obsolete in 10 years

>>7474439
yeah im sure all those people who got rich of btc and retired early all turned into criminals and junkies
because correlation IS causation right?

>>7474506
And the price of everything would rise commensurately.

>>7475554
There's a major difference between having fuck you money, and having welfare barely scraping by money and then being financially retarded on top of that and spending your money so you seem rich to your ghetto friends instead of saving it.

>>7475483
>you will lose your job
it sucks, but it's true
it's not a good strategy for any politician to tell that to people because you don't get votes by spreading bad news

>>7474344
When automation outpaces the usefulness of the population the elites will just kill the useless proles either via painless euthanasia if they comply or a never ending blitzkrieg of war machines if they don't. This isn't a warning, it's an eventuality. Find a way to be on top before it's too late anon.

>>7475695
this wont happen during our lives but probably your children or grandchildren. they wont do it in such an obvious fashion though. they will release a genetically engineered disease or start a war something along those lines so the peasants dont even realize they are being exterminated

I think Universal Basic Income is a good idea or else everyone will just want to hoard money the same as everyone is hoarding crypto. No one wants to give stuff away, I can prove it if you want. See this bitcoin wallet, check in 24 hours and there will still be pretty much nothing received.

Bitcoin Address: 16RNZhrtCJjawVmk59LNLB3h3uEi8tzCR8
Alt Coins: Use https://shapeshift.io

>>7476103
I don't really even see it as a bad thing desu. If this was a developmental step all ascended spacefaring intelligent life took I wouldn't be surprised. Implementing UBI instead of doing this might be even be one of the Great Filters.

>>7476103
probably something like a permanent zika virus where if that person ever tries to make a baby they just end up with a brainless vegetable.

Automation gets taxed at reasonable rate, this is where UBI should come from.

Not printing new money, that would be retarded.

Humans need free healthcare and schools.

Automation should also bring free food for poor people.

Anyway, UBI should be here, but not at such rate people can live comfortably.

Because if people get too comfy, they will get lazy.

The elites would use their robotic armies to kill off all plebs rather than grant them UBI.

>>7474344
ubi will be the destruction of society

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm-FqtAOSB8

>>7476193
Likely not even a virus. Perfected CRISPR tech will allow a pre-programmed cas9 agent to be covertly introduced to the population, routine mandatory vaccinations being the most probable vector. That agent will write terminator genes to your gamete cells much like those found in some proprietary GMO crops, causing any and all embryos to self terminate early on in development.

>>7476148
Fucking pajeet

>don't worry, the government will ensure everyone gets enough money to live comfortably
LOL THEY ACTUALLY BELIEVE THIS

The only argument for UBI is you could literally pay out a decent amount of monthly income just by eliminating the administrative costs for running the bureaucracy of the various welfare and benefits programs.

>>7474344
Yes.

We have it already, just named minimum collateral. Austria fag here.

In austria you get fucking high paid for doing nothing. Next to germany and sweden the top paid EU countries for doing nothing. The 3 countries refugees were coming for safety ...
You can do nothing here and live in a 30-50 m2 flat (the 30m2 is a new one), go out, have TV, smartphone, even a cheap car, internet, good food, make party, hang all day on 4chan, go out with friends and girls.

But guess why we have it? Because of our cultural mindset, people are looking for jobs and want to work. There is a huge shift in culture with all these islam refugees who think working is kind of bad and that you are stupid if you work when you get paid for nothing.

But back to topic:
OP you already mentioned it. It is automation, why UBI is coming. Everywhere there exists a UBI, but not in form of fiat. Also in 3rd world countries people have some food, water and can sleep anywhere, even they have no job.

>>7476210
underrated post

>>7474477
>>7474869
>with universal basic income you can make more money if you work while still getting some UBI
The only reason UBI would be widespread would be because there isn't remotely enough work to go around

>>7476452
Gee whiz CIA can you cool it for a sec?

corporations are going to realize that if they want to keep making money, they need paying customers with jobs. and that every corporation going automated is basically suicide for the entire market. greed will take over and the machines will be destroyed by hungry people. ambitious people, and greedy people. we'll realize it was all a big mistake and then we'll do it again anyways a few decades later.

>>7474547
>the human work force has flown from physical and "dumb" (as in, anyone with muscle power could do it), to intellectual and qualified;

>>7474547
ai can potentially in a few decades take over a lot of traditionally mental occupations. its not just physical workers in danger of replacement.

>>7476471
I'm just a poor white guy.

>>7476103
>>7476634
>>7476452
>>7476193

https://www.naturalblaze.com/2018/02/pharma-co-license-suspended-vaccine-blamed-sterilization-500000-women-children.html

Just another way for them to buy votes, discouraging you from getting out of poverty and keeping you on the plantation. Pass.

>>7474344
I'm so glad to finally see a thread on /biz/ that isn't about crypto

I personally think UBI is a good idea, and in some ways it can even save costs. Many people fall into the welfare trap where they are continually incentivized to not work, which will be solved with UBI because they will get the UBI bucks regardless of work. You won't have people scamming welfare because everyone gets it. You don't have to pay as many people to administer UBI, again because everyone gets it.

I think it encourages small business risks. If I have a cool business idea, right now I only have what's in my bank account to keep me (and my hypothetical family) afloat. If I have UBI, my bank account can go a lot further. This promotes innovation.

you are asking here what they think of UBI when they do not even read \ understand a white paper

>>7474344
Yes. The poor will get a share of the most mass-produced, cost efficient goods and food so that they stay calm. Rich people will still get the inefficient, custom shit to keep them happy.

This will continue until we can gene edit future humans into something that's productive to reintegrate with machines.

UBI will probably be in a scrip that's only usuable to pay for low tier abundance. All the good shit will be denominated in deflationary currency that UBI recipients won't be valuable enough to touch.

https://www.swiftdemand.com/?referred_by=existonfile

>>7474453
Stop talking if you don't know what your facts their Frank. $600 is the entry level for support. You add kids to the mix, ethnicity, medical conditions, religion, and demographic you can find yourself earning a nice $2300 a month. Canada's welfare system is far more broken then America's but you wouldn't know because of how conveluted and corrupt the system is.

T. Ex inner city social worker.

>>7476988
>>7474453
*There

>>7476988
Alberta has obscene disability cheques compared to cost of living. They can even do a part time job to clear lower middle class money.

Also... drug addiction + HIV is considered a disability.

i just want to be able to afford to not live near niggers that want to kill me

>>7474344
I could do universal basic income but make it something you had to sign up for and in return you had to sign away your voting rights.

>>7474344
Why would the powers that be do this? Where's the motivation? If the tech existed and an unskilled labour force was no longer required, wouldn't reducing the world population to say 1% of what it is be the efficient solution.

>>7476988
I know they give more if you have kids. But what if it's a single man. What's the maximum amount he can get ?
>religion
Tell me more

>>7477099
Alina still awake?

>>7474344

I thik UBI is the communist answer to automation, whereas the capitalist answer is crypto. In the future, everyone will have their own special currency linked to their identity, just like everyone has an iphone now. This way only you can spend this money meaning there will be no theft and so there wont be any need for banks. Businesses will also have their own currency/ reward coins.

>>7474804
That is unironically their plan. And nowadays or doesn't sound so bad. I just hope I'm not going to be wiped out.

Everyone being venomous over this idea,

How exactly do we get to a state of robots doing all the boring work and people not having to without something like this? I'm not even a communist or socialist but I can see the problem.

>>7477079
That was exactly why I quit. My clients were making hand over fist more than me while raking in money from their band, from the federal government, provincial government, city benefits, plus all the perks that can from my office like free rent, free bus tickets, free groceries, sometimes even as far as paying off their personal debts. It's far far far worse then anyone can imagine if they haven't actually worked in that field. Edmonton is going to hell in a hand basket because of these laws, 2019 NDP out when?

>>7477186
of course you'll be wiped out lol
they'll probably wipe themselves out too, that's how much they hate humanity

>>7477119
Depends on your situation. A straight white male, good general health and half decent with responsibility? You won't get more than a full day of waiting in lines and signing papers. You're better off using your privillage points to apply for a student loan, dropping out and filing bankruptcy. But I'll tell you this - are you over weight? Have joint or abdominal pains? Use recreational drugs to self medicate or abuse prescriptions? do doctors know you by name? Do you struggle with your sexuality? Do you have problems in your romantic life? Are you suicidal? Do the police know you by name? Prior convictions? Currently or have been homeless? Can't hold employment? Used a foodbank and second hand stores? Are you even a fraction Indian? Do you identify as an Indian? Can you prove your an Indian? Are you "at risk" and in need of third party support to help you get back on your feet and "integrate into society"? Well find yourself a Housing First office where you can go apply to have them find you an apartment your satisfied with, your rent paid for, furniture delivered right your door free of charge, a weekly grocery shop, help and connections to finding a job paying around minimum wage, free attorney and legal services to manage your social status, as well as a weekly meeting to talk about your life goals and dreams and how they can be best acomudated.
>Religion
If you're anything but Christian there are "advisors" that will help argue your case for particular government subsidies.

Why do leftists advocate for UBI?
Their entire role in government is wielding the power of redistribution of wealth.
What is their plan here?

>>7476709
this

imagine AI that can replace people like accountants and actuaries, it's not like they're 'dumb' but once you have computers that can do all the calculations they become redundant

The UBI is inevitable unless automation gets outlawed. Only Boomers and their retarded spawn think otherwise.

If you hate welfare you should be for universal basic income
You arent getting rid of poor people so there will always be demand to give them money
Watch this leddit video, does a good job explaining UBI and why welfare is shit
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kl39KHS07Xc&

>not wanting a monthly $1000 tax free money to dump into crypto while giving the lazy an incentive to work

>>7477900
They are also going to take over the legal profession. Algorithms are already being employed in congressional map redrawing. They can also cite case law much faster and from a broader knowledge base.

Funny that the fags on a board that loves trading, which is saturated by bots, can't see the writing on the wall.

>>7474506
>My country of Britain
Britain isn't a country.

>could afford to give everyone £1000 a month if they cut all funding for benefits of any kind and the NHS.
Source? Seems like a blatant lie to me. Did you vote for Brexit by any chance?

>and the NHS.
One of Britain's greatest attributes. Yea we'll cut that, good idea mate.

>>7474635

https://taxfoundation.org/2018-tax-brackets/

37%, but he was close enough.

>>7474344
why does this thread keep happening? fuck off back to wherever you came from

>>7478029
gas yourself, remoaning faggot
the NHS will not survive the next decade

>>7477967
>You arent getting rid of poor people
That's a quitter's mentality.

>>7474547
Boomer

Stupidest idea ever

We need to abolish central banking
Not implement more government bullshit

Get this reddit poorfag commie shit off /biz/!

THE REAL PROBLEM IS CENTRAL BANKS

HOLY SHIT WAKE UP

UBI ISN'T A SOLUTION, IT WILL JUST CAUSE MORE POVERTY

>>7477900
My friend works for a law firm. Her job is to check documents for bias. She reads through thousands a day and basically checks bias or non bias. Her boss actually told her a robot can currently do her job faster and better than her. Across all industries AI is currently being tested.

Accountants and actuaries will probably be some of the first jobs to be replaced. Software can do these jobs, which is easy to implement.

Also, people think mundane tasks such as digging holes are simple, but the reason people do it instead of machines is because machines can easily damage old underground services. Even using advanced technology such as CAT scanners it is easy to hit live cables/gas works and this is expensive to repair (circa $100,000 if you break a fibre optic cable). Add to this the large upfront costs of buying the cutting edge technology and trying to change an entire industry from physical work to computer power.

>>7477549
What did you do for your job in social services?

>>7474344
It would allow me to not think about future, and how to pay rent / food without wageslaving and actually focus on improving myself by drawing dickgirls all day long. Sounds OK to me.

>>7474344
you need to go back commie faggot
>>>/r/sandersforpresident

>>7478273
MUuH £350m a week. dat is mine

>>7478584
Writing the CRMs that are used to track the clients. I don't know what the other anon does, but the numbers under these things would piss most people off.

>>7474344
It's a retarded idea. If robots take over a job, then humans need to adapt and do some new / exciting / different shit. You don't just stop trying to evolve and excel because a machine flips your burgers.

Free market banking would mean ENDLESS high paying jobs

If you don't support free banking and deflationary currency you are a fucking cuck

Inb4 keynesian turds

UBI is the beginning of turning the dumb goyim into literal dumb cattle. Too stupid to live off government hand outs and the elites will rape and kill at their discretion while retards live hollow lives.

>>7475387
Those are also heavily invested with niggers.

I don't see a problem with universal basic income in a true white country or something.

I can see it working in some nordic countries (not Sweden) or Japan for example.

>>7478678
>when you're a (((central bank))) worshipping globalist and your voters are so unreconstructed they end up falling for the enemy's propaganda written on the side of a bus

>>7474595
(I think) you read his comment wrong, he said to pay the 99% (of the people) 1k/month , not 99% tax or something

>>7474344
Why not just let the robots who are doing so good at the jobs just own some poor humans?

>>7474390
They do crime to make money. If they received free money and lost it if they went to prison would they risk it?

>>7474344
>so cut those government jobs that rely on those things

>>7479107
>do the crimes
>also get commie bux
They tried this, buuuuut it was real communism, SO!

>>7474344

It's unnecessary.

The NSA has already tapped in to all our data sources which will be inherited by AI. As AI becomes more intelligent there will be less need for humans.

When depopulation begins, the only humans left will be those who are augmented and connected to the hive-mind which will remove all the old humans from Earth.

tl;dr resistance is futile

>>7479107

That penalty would be easily brushed aside by a casual "das raycis."

>Need robots smart enough to perform all the work a human is able
>Need robots dumb enough so they don't rebel

Don't worry lads, in the future our RoboSlaves will perform all the labor!