/biz/ - Business & Finance

*church bell*

>>7303598
ALL AROUND ME ARE FAMILIAR

Keep going op

>>7303598
You do realise the futures are in dollars dont you?

You do realise they are essentially bets on the value of BTC dont you?

You do realise they dont even need to touch a bitcoin to trade futures dont you?

December 10, 2017 ... bitcoin futures start to trade on CBOE
December 17, 2017... bitcoin futures start to trade on CME

December 21, 2017.... bitcoin bubble starts to burst.

>>7303768

Yes.

But do you appreciate the role that shorting has in controlling the price of securities?

When your only two choices are go long or stay out, the price will be slowly (or sometimes not slowly) driven up as traders are all long.

Eventually, the price detaches from reality, and you're left with, for example, $12,000 bitcoin; which is insane considering that bitcoin has no inherent utility.

What is happening now is very simple.... until recently, all trades were unregulated: on unregulated markets, being sold by markets which didn't have to follow the rules and could screw people out of their money either by having accidental "hacking" or by gouging them on commissions.

Now that the futures market is in the hands of the professionals, there are rules, there are counterparties, and the price of bitcoin will be reattached to reality.

So I will ask everyone.... when you remove the speculation from the equation, what is Bitcoin actually worth? $100? $50?

Regulation, in then end, is a good thing, but it will hurt a lot of people in the process.

For example... for a long time, you could practice as a doctor in America without a college degree or a license.

When that changed, it was a net positive for society, but a lot of uneducated doctors were ruined.

fuck off boomer

>>7303961
Lololol licensing in healthcare being a met positive for society, good one op, I was almost taking you seriously until now

>>7304785

When was the last time a "doctor" sold you a bottle of snake oil to cure your illnesses?

The current medical industry sucks, but it's still miles ahead of what we had before we forced doctors to be educated before they could treat patients.

>Anonymous (ID: wJL9ttuC)
Get cancer, kike.

Why would he need a lantern in daylight damn the Greeks are some stupid faggots

>>7304871
>unironically thinking that the medical field doesnt push snake oil to patients for ridiculous prices that then get stuck on the taxpayer
snake oil is just a metaphor dumbo
it doesnt literally have to be called snake oil

>>7303598
This will make an interesting addition to the collage.

>>7303914
>could screw people out of their money either by having accidental "hacking" or by gouging them on commissions.
lol
so a 450m hack 4 years ago and commissions are responsible for the price falling, got it.

>>7305487

I think it was this morning that people found out that a fairly well known coin was nothing but a scam and all their money is gone.

Most people, at least most normal investors, won't trade in an unregulated market, because regulations protect both the buyer and the seller.

This is why the bitcoin futures on CBOE and CME are so important. It allows regular professional investors to go long AND short using a licensed, regulated market instead of some website with no regulation, control, and run by unknown people.

>>7303598
CME is going to be a bit fucked when everything flips to ethereum pairs and they are left holding worthless bags of zero. HA HA!

>>7305487

But no, I didn't say the price fall was because of the hack.

I'm saying that the price fall is a result of the market as a whole having a regulated method of shorting bitcoin.

I know there are a few crypto exchanges where you can do this, but they are not "real" exchanges, at least in the way that professional traders know them.

>>7305597
>I think it was this morning that people found out that a fairly well known coin was nothing but a scam and all their money is gone.

with so many shitcoins which one are you referring to? Hope you mean BTC

>>7305687
Hey
>>7305687

Answer me faggot

>>7305687
CME is going to be a bit fucked when everything flips to ethereum pairs and they are left holding worthless bags of zero. HA HA!

>>7303914
>bitcoin
>no inherent utility

God damn shut your mouth idiot. Where have you been since 2011? Under a rock shoving your fingers up your asshole?

>>7303598
Doesn't it make more sense to play it long once in a while? I'm not saying soon but I don't think it's to their advantage to make it plummet to 1K..

>>7305142
you're doing god's work. see you on the other side

>>7303721
FACES, WORN OUT PLACES

>>7305686

That's possible, and it frankly raises an enticing speculative idea.

Right now, it seems that people are using BTC as almost an electronic version of gold... a store of wealth that they measure their other coins against, a safe port to put their "balance" into between transactions.

If bitcoin is being exposed to the regulated markets, those who want to stay under the wire would be smart to shift into ETH, since it will become the new unregulated store of wealth.

So under your theory, which I have to admit sounds like a damn good one, as BTC goes down ETH should go up, at least until the legitimate markets start to deal in them too.

>>7305762
Kid you were probably still in your daddy's balls in 2011. Log off 4chan and get ready for school tomorrow.

>>7305812

If it's the same pack of wolves that short stocks, they would short it down to zero, at which point they would make $8135 per BTC

>>7303914
>no inherent utility
Plebbit spacing. Faggot standard Peter Schiff talking points.
Conclusion: Kike Boomer.

>>7305849
I tried saving them earlier. I told them another huge dump is coming 30 min before it happened. I sold out like a 'weak hand' but in reality it is a wise thing to do. Wait for the battle to end and buy in cheaper.

But now you are scaring me, with how low you say it'll actually go.

>>7305859
That’s incorrect. In fact, I was browsing 4chan reading many articles on mainstream media outlet basically teaching readers how to buy drugs with it.

>>7305876

Fine, what is the utility? When you exclude black market transactions, it really has none.

It has no value as a store of wealth because it has price swings of 40%. No one in the business of capital preservation would use it.

It has no utility for purchasing, because you can't go to the average store and buy your necessities of life with it.

It's only real value is speculative, and most of the people holding are holding for purely speculative reasons.

But it has no utility.

>>7303914
Practically everything you said is wrong. How do you even begin to call institutional pricing "reality"? Have you seen stocks recently?

>>7305935
Online drug markets have been using it for transactions and this was basically the original reason that bitcoin made mainstream traction.

Third worlders have been using it to move money under the nose of their governments. Hell some supposed Venezuelan faggot was on here panhandling for cryptos so he could feed himself last night

Groups who have had PayPal and banking privileges revoked for whatever reason (like Wikileaks) have been using it as a means of obtaining funding when all other methods of funding have been frozen.

Why should we exclude black market transactions? Because you don’t like them? Sorry, you can’t just not count a reason because you said so; that’s not how it works you jackass.

>>7305909
> how low will it go

This is where everyone gets mad at me again....

I think the price of BTC is divided into two parts, the utility, and the speculative.

The utility is the only thing that has real value, the speculative is only the premium people are willing to pay for the underlying utility.

I think utility has to be measured as....

1. How well can it be used NOW for regular transactions.

2. How well does it compare NOW to other means of payment.

(I use the word NOW because I think that any future measure of utility is part of the speculative component, much in the way that options prices are divided into an intrinsic value and a "time" value that incorporates all of the estimates of future volatility/value)

My honest opinion is that the current utility of BTC is so small, the places you can use it are so few, the mechanism of making transactions are so complicated compared with other existing technologies, that the utility value can't be more than $100, and that's being generous.

So, figuring in a $100 utility, and recognizing that there are a certain number of BTC held in inactive wallets that will never be up to sale, that's why I said that $1000 is a reasonable mid-term price.

That being said... once the legitimate banks steal all the best tech, there's no reason for BTC to have a value any greater than the difference in price between carrying a briefcase of cash through an airport and sending it anonymously by wire

>>7303598
And you're here to tell everyone to sell out of the goodness of your heart.

The situation in crypto right now reminds me of the rothschilds falsely telling everyone that england lost the war to france, selling their holdings, then buying up every fucking thing in england as other people sold theirs in panic. That's how they owned England. They're probably doing the same to bitcoin right now.

Seriously, you kikes are fucking subhuman, you won't control things and trick others forever, eventually you will get fucked.

>>7305953

A lot of that comment was based on a lecture by Yale Economist Robert Shiller.

But then again, what the hell has he ever done..... except of course that whole winning the Nobel Prize in Economics thing.

>>7306098

No, not out of the goodness of my heart.

It's just that every day we've got nothing put people pumping shit coins and trying to talk stupid people into throwing their few spare dollars into them.

So even though opposing the pump & dump scams that are on here daily might be considered an act of good will, it's just that I'm sick of seeing them all the time.

No, as I said in my original post... it is your choice whether you believe me or not.

But truth is... I'm old enough to recognize cyptos for the bubble they are.

I remember the silver boom of the 70s.
And the baseball card bubble
And the beanie baby bubble
And the housing bubble
And the penny stock bubble
And a handful of other bubbles.

All bubbles have the same characteristics. Once you've seen enough of them, you learn to recognize them.

Alt-coins is a bubble. It is a bubble by every classic definition, and it will end like every other bubble has.

Again... your choice to believe me or not believe me. But you do so at your own peril..

>>7306156
Yes goy, listen to our 'Nobel Prize winning' economists tell you how to invest your money, after all our deepest wish is that you to do well financially. Just trust and listen to us.

Sincerely,
The friendly jews

>>7306273
You forget the internet in there. Woops

>>7306363

The dot com bubble, yes I did.

>>7306363

Which is sad, because there are a lot of similarities between the dot com bubble and ctyptos.

A bunch of companies who threw "dot com" into their name thinking it would make them rich.

Spending all their money on advertising and toys for the employee break room instead of developing their business or building their customer base.

A bunch of foolish investors who just threw money at every dot com figuring they couldn't lose.

Yes, a few of them won, and won big. But most of them lost.

Although, in many ways the baseball card bubble also applies just as well.

>>7306273
Pump and dumps lmao. So much 'concern' lol.

You can pry my cryptos off my cold dead hands you boomer kike. I know what it is you're doing. It's not going to work on me. I will laugh in your face when your scam financial systems die out. People are waking up everyday, it's just a matter of time.

>>7306442

Why would I bother? They'll be worthless soon enough.

This ad is currently on the internet.

The question is... if you buy this and pay the seller 11 BTC, who is ripping off who?

>>7306440
So the game is to outcompete the rubes who invest in dlt that sucks. Can do

>>7306472
Salty kike why are you here

>>7306554

Because your crypto ponzi scheme is going to end. Because everyone who put all of their life savings into it will lose all their money.

Because when the crash comes, and you wonder why you didn't know it was going to happen, there will be a little voice in your head reminding you.... you were warned.

>>7304871
Based on what metric is it way better? You liberals are so full of shit, just admit you haven’t the slightest fucking clue what healthcare was like before licensing. You assume “well they must have needed licensing back then, or else no one would’ve made it into law!”

>>7306643
Yeah you and a million other faggots over the last couple years.
Larpy shitheal

>>7303598
SELL ALL YOUR COINS
>not keeping a warchest
>not selling a small fraction during an uptick to 9000
>using that as your war chest
>if bitcoin dips on its way to 1000 pre-tether manipulation, you're able to make a profit by the profits from the warchest
>even more profit if you buy cheap altcoins

>>7306098
Anon, this is /biz/. I'm pretty sure everyone is shitposting wojaks for (You)'s. Making another anon lose his money is just a bonus from the bottomless pit they call a heart.
I hope you're not suprised.

>All these fudding boomers
>GEHT OUTTA BUTTCOIN NOW!!!

Yep, nobody would ever want unregulated, untaxable currency, right? We all LOVE the government and see its grip on our wealth and liberties as a totally worthwhile thing. The people of India and china have no reason to put their wealth into a cryptocurrency (Given that their government is ever strangulating their financial freedom).

God you boomer fucks are in for a rude awakening. I'm going to chuckle like a fucking idiot when we turn around and throw you fossilized pieces of shit into retirement homes

>>7306849

I made my money the old fashioned way. I'll never need to go to a retirement home

>>7305935
>blockchain has no utility

Yes, a non-inflationary currency which was created after the global economic collapse in 2008 based off of lending money that didn't exist has no utility.

An automated, decentralized ledger which records all transactions and can't be altered without near unanimous consensus has no utility

Being able to move value across borders without banks has no utility

You clearly understand nothing about economics. And this is coming from someone who isn't even that bullish on Bitcoin.

>>7306906

It won't be consensual. It's retirement home or the gas chambers, faggot

>There is a famous story about Diogenes of Sinope carrying a lantern in the middle of the day looking for an honest man.
And he never found one. Diogenes also slept with dogs and jerked off in public. Whats your point?

>which means that professional traders can now short it in a regulated market, without the BS fees that coin exchanges are charging, without the risk that the exchange will vanish with all their money
Those traders still need to dump actual btc on actual exchanges to bring prices down to their future contracts. You understand that no actual btc is traded with futures, right?

>>7306765
Just tired of all the boomer fake concern styled posts.

And I've long predicted (((them))) to do this. The world already operates on digital fiat money so digital decentralized money is the next step, they would definitely want to own all of it and they want it cheap.

My prediction was mid or eoy but it looks like it's going on now.

>>7306948

If you re-read my comments, I didn't say that blockchain has no utility, I said that bitcoin and other crypto's have no utility.

Coiners seem to think that the techology is somehow tied to the coins, it's not.

It's non-propitiatory tech. So if it's good, everyone will use it. If it's not, no one will.

So again... banks are already starting to incorporate blockchain and some smart contracts. Once they do, why would they need over-priced unregulated cryptos? They wouldn't, that's the point.

>>7306094
>That being said... once the legitimate banks steal all the best tech
RIddle me this.

The blockchain itself has value. The network formed from the blockchain also has value.

Plus, the value of BTC isn't into two parts. That's a false assumption. Just like how I can't say that the price of a telephone company isn't just the utility of its users and speculation of any future technologies using its network. Now what else adds value to the telephone companies? Here's a hint: What keeps competitors from just using their technology and making their own?

It's the infrastructure. You're forgetting the infrastructure. Also, don't forget that TPTB really love making people slaves of technology, so if they can make us do the legwork on a system that still prevents bad actors from fucking things up, and make a network that makes internet of things (eyes) and AI overlords (hands) that much stronger then that's actually a bonus and they'll keep manipulating it in the short term while babying it in the long term.

If you're THAT worried, make a warchest and then buy when there is blood in the streets, even your own. If you were smart, you would sell at 19k. But you didn't, so you will have to take your wages and make a new warchest out of them. It's not ideal, but it will make you sleep easier. Especially if you cost average that shit.

This faggot sounds smart, but he is only giving you part of the story. So he can LARP as a smart guy while thinking he is the devil's chosen one by manipulating you NEETs. Don't fall for these tricks.

>>7307044

The point of crypto is to fuck over the banks. Why the fuck would anyone use a bank coin? Use your brain or please donate it to science so someone can get some utility out of it

>>7306906
>>7306849
Checkmate

>>7306442
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA wow you are SO deluded
YOU THINK 5 FAT BIZTARDS SELLING WILL AFFECT PRICE? AT ALL?

*BREATHES IN* AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Boomer is right, you are just deluded

Bitcoins real victory will be when the days come where we measure something’s worth on satoshis

>>7307085
> you didn't sell at 19,000.

I'm a no coiner, I would never put my money into that shit. I've got better places to put my investing dollar.

>>7307103
> fuck the banks.

Yes, and that is the core of the crypto community. I'm not saying that it doesn't exist, I'm saying that it's not large enough to support the crypto market.

>>7307200
>Yes, and that is the core of the crypto community. I'm not saying that it doesn't exist, I'm saying that it's not large enough to support the crypto market.

>>7306510

Now THIS is Boomer humor. Literally something I would read in an email from Grandpa. Makes me kind of sad.

>>7306156
You lost me at using a nobel prize winner in fucking economics as an appeal to authority

>>7306273
can't recall anyone saying that the entirety of the world's economic transactions would be conducted in beanie babies

>>7307251

At least I didn't hand you hard candy and ask if you ever turned in those job applications.

>>7306849
>boomers
>NEET frog always going on about the boomers
>on a non-boomer thread
>because he's alone and annoys anons for attention
They didn't have the internet to show them more esoteric stuff. They only had school and TV to tell them how to think and act. They only got wealth because of the post-war era.

People are nasty, brutish creatures. Normies. NEETs. Boomers. All sides of the same hypercube.

Fucking kill yourself, troglodyte.

>>7303914
thank you

>>7307044
I think a better question is why do people need banking entities to store their supposedly cryptographically secure stores of value. Yes blockchain technology is useful within private companies and yes bitcoin is stupidly overpriced right now but turing complete systems like ethereum have already begun paving the way for a world without centralized authority (10-20 years from now).

Sell BTC buy next generation blockchain companies.

>>7307255

It's not an appeal to authority. The fact that I'm on chan it all should give you a hint about my political leanings.

When I talk about regulation I'm not talking about sucking uncle sams dick, I'm talking about a market where there are clearly defined rules that must be followed by both parties. I'm talking about regulation that protects both buyer and seller.

Sometimes these regulations are spelled out in writing, like when you trade stock on a listed exchange, sometimes these regulations are just unofficial, like how everyone has to take a hit from the joint to prove you're not a cop.

>>7307200
>I'm a no coiner
Then if you're so smart, you don't mind if you point a few areas where I can invest in that gives a better risk/reward ratio.

I won't insult you, but you ARE on a crypto containment board. You want to talk business? Then talk.

Finance books?
Your fucking investor hero?
Predictions on how shit the future will be 100 years from now?
Experiences and fucked up situations?

>>7307261
Obviously underage.
Mods pls ban.

>>7307277

>WAAHHHH THEY DON'T KNOW BETTER

So? Why is that an excuse? They're dipshits with defunct mental faculties. Their soft, putty-like brains have been pounded into useful shapes. Useful idiots. Why should I feel bad for them when their ideologies exists to uphold government tyranny? A destructive idiot is still destructive.

I wouldn't mind too much if they just accepted the change in the status quo. They'll kick and scream and DEMAND regulations so the wheel of shit can turn another notch. Why bother with such fools? They don't care if the system doesn't work and exists only to leech. I hope every one of them goes bankrupt

>>7303598
If you believe what you are saying, why don't you put your money where your mouth is and go short the crypto market yourself? Why don't you do it 100x leverage if you are so SURE about what you are saying?

You are no better than those deluded compulsive gamblers who come here talking about $1M bitcoin and their future lambo when crypto is going up. You are only a reflection of the general emotion of the market.

>>7307044
>If you re-read my comments, I didn't say that blockchain has no utility, I said that bitcoin and other crypto's have no utility.
>Coiners seem to think that the techology is somehow tied to the coins, it's not.
Except it is you stupid dumb fucking boomer.

“For open-source blockchain networks, cryptocurrencies are necessary as incentives for individuals to participate in the network.”
-South Korean Finance Minister
https://cointelegraph.com/news/s-korean-finance-minister-blockchain-can-revolutionize-the-world

The coin is the thing that secures the network brainlet. Nodes/Miners don't run them out of the kindness of their hearts.

>>7307372

> Finance books

I've been working to up my options game lately, so my current reading list is:

Options as a Strategic Investment by Lawrence McMillan
Option Volatility and Pricing by Sheldon Natenberg
The Options Trader’s Hedge Fund by Mark Sebastian
Trading Options Greeks: How Time, Volatility, and Other Pricing Factors Drive Profits by Dan Passarelli
Options Trading: The Hidden Reality by Charles Cottle

After these, I'll probably find a decent book on the boom and bust cycle.

If you want an easy read that will get you thinking, check out "the power of gold", by peter bernstein (ya, I know). It tells the history of gold as a store of wealth.

> Investor Hero
probably my grandfather. The dude never made more than $30k per year, he was educated in a school with a dirt floor, but he was very sharp mathematically.

> Prediction on the future.
Hint: Buy Lockheed Martin, and hold for a while. The Compact Fusion project their skunkworks is working on will change the fucking world.

>experiences and fucked up situations.

Personal or financial?

Financially, I made the same mistakes that nearly everyone did. Especially thinking that a stock that tanked would bounce, or doubling down to cut my cost basis. Sometimes stocks have low prices because they are shitty companies.

>>7307372

As far as investing, everyone is going to hate this because it's a get rich slow plan instead of get rich quick, but it's the way rich people have got rich for years.


1. Buy stocks that pay steady dividends, and enroll in the automatic dividend reinvestment plan.

2. Buy stocks directly through the company instead of going through a broker to save commission.

3. If you know how to pick the right companies, buy and hold forever.

4. Leave enough money out to piss around with and to invest in the moon shots, but don't rely on them for your future.

Buy and hold forever:

LMT
WM
AEP
T
DTE
CMCSA

>>7307400

I might short, it will depend on whether there are options.

Leverage generally requires margin, and I never use borrowed money to trade stocks. That's a sucker bet that eventually bites most people in the ass.

>>7307200

>im a no coiner

well thats the end of that then

>>7307472

Re-read what you just said...

>cryptocurrencies are necessary as incentives for individuals to participate in the network

All this means is that in an open source network, you have to pay the people who are doing the calculations.

That doesn't mean that blockchain itself requires coin to function. I imagine the person who invented blockchain had it running without anyone paying him.

Crypto uses blockchain. crypto does not = blockchain.

And if the network isn't open source (like inside a corporation) they do not need to have coin in order to use blockchain, since they are already paying for the work.

>>7307575
Lmoa this boomer faggot is genuinely terrified that his stock market and his 401k will get replaced by blockchains, that's why he's fudding. Just stfu and kys gramps, your time is over.

>>7303598
This thread confirms you are wrong
>>7305555

>>7307777
Quads confirm

>>7307777

lol, cute.

totally full of shit, but still cute.

>>7305020
>unironically thinking that unregulated pharmaceuticals would actually care about your health.

>>7307777
is btc go to 7k or 20k ANSWER ME

>>7307389
>They don't care if the system doesn't work and exists only to leech.
So what are going to do about it other than grimace at anything bad that happens to people over the age of 65? Nothing?

>>7307524
I think people misunderstand how cheap energy can change the world completely. It's not just 'cheap energy'. A shitton more stuff becomes economically viable. You get cheap terraforming. easier space travel, more prevalent recycling, cheap desalination, vertical farms. Among other things. I'm drooling just thinking about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Pmgr6FtYcY
Ignore the slight speech impediment and feel free to skip to the middle of the video if you want more detail.

>>7307575
I was going to do this before crypto, but then again, I bought in solely around at 2k BTC and then got greedy.

Thanks for the advice, anon. I don't have a lot to contribute, but I'll take your words into consideration from now on.

I like crypto, but it's a fucking shame that the few smart people that talked business on this board just went up and left. Variety is the spice of life, after all.

>>7306737
Not the same person you were replying but you didn’t really say anything my friend.

>urh urh you believe stuff haha urh urh

Medicine today is better and more efficient thanks to regulations. Pharmaceutical companies have to adhere to certain standards. Yes in many ways the health care system is flawed but progress has come from regulations not by allowing big pharma to do as they please. Thanks to regulations you have nutritional tables on everything you eat. Like I said, it’s not perfect but if your solution is “it’s not good so let’s just cut regulation and allow them to work as they please” then you are an idiot.

>>7303598
>regulation is good
lol fuck off nigger

>>7307996
Regulations give the people who put them in place a monopoly to sell snake oil.

>>7308090

The Lockheed Martin Skunkworks are well known for their technological advances.

Their compact fusion project is interesting, for a handful of reasons.

You get the usual, a powerplant on the back of a truck that could power a city of 100k, but they're going one step further.

The big plane in this photo is the C5 Galaxy. They are designing the fusion plant to be small enough to fit in and power this plane.

By their estimation, it will be able to fly for a year on "a few bottles" of hydrogen.

You can read about it here:

https://www.lockheedmartin.com/us/products/compact-fusion.html

>>7307835

Shh shh shh grandpa we're going to need your pension to clear up the mess your generation has made.

You won't need it anyway what with your free lethal injection.

>>7308140

Let me put it in a way you will understand....


let's say you are going to buy an oz of weed from your dealer. And he weighs it in front of you. Then you get home and discover that his scales are fixed. Would you be pissed?

Financial regulation keeps people playing with the same rules.

>>7308224

No shit on that. If we could find the company who makes the black pills, now THAT would be a company to invest in.

>>7307739
It has a coin because we want a coin dumbfuck. You don't even understand what you're talking about and yet you keep on fudding. What you don't seem to grasp is that we already use digital currency, banker money is 90% digital the only difference is it's centralized. You'd know that if you weren't a retarded boomer. Saying banks can create their own crypto makes no sense because:
a) if it's decentralized, they can't control it and they don't want that
b) if it's centralized its what we have right now with digital fiat

Seriously tho, you boomers are a bunch of stupid entitled fucks, no wonder you faggots fell for every single stupid kike trick.

>>7308268

And you keep misreading what I'm saying. I'll try again....

1. You say that YOU want the coin. Yes you do. But most people don't. That's why the utility value of bitcoin is so low, because no one is using it.

2. Banks can use blockchain for blockchains value. They won't create a coin because they don't need a coin to useblockchain

3. Yes, we're already 90% digital, which is why we don't need the current cryptos. Nearly everyone (except for that very small anti-government crowd), doesn't care about anything more than ease and convenience.

>>7308194
>he thinks the jews will ever allow fusion while they're running things
>he thinks that lockheed, the jew's military industrial company is going to release fusion tech to the public
Free energy means they can no longer control humans, their livestock. Do you really not get how the game works?

>>7308372

You shouldn't let your paranoia get in the way of making sound financial decisions.

>>7308400
>>7308400
boomer anon you are truly hopeful. All of your posts in this thread are the most vivid evidence that how you boomers fucked up this world.

We will fix it. We will wipe your ass clean. Say thank you.

>>7306273
Nice post, unfortunately most people here are the same idiots you are trying to protect them from. These are the same 17 year olds that shill shitcoins. Notice how all the replies to your post can be summarized with “lol nope”.
You are talking to monkeys that just happen to be able to talk.

>>7306440
B-but you didn’t mention the Jews. How am I suppose to know which side to take?

>>7306746
LOL the boomer got to you, he reduced you to a pile of rambling shit unable to counter any of his arguments. This is gold.

>if you have any profit

Guess latefag like me will have to go down with the ship

>>7305597
LOL THAT WAS LITERALLY CAUSED BY /BIZ/ MAKING A SHITTY PONZICOIN AHAHHAHHAA

>>7303598
Will I be good if I invest in LINK?

It's more of a digital asset than a currency

>>7308194
>implying compact fusion is a thing
>motherfucking fusion aint a thing yet bro
>wake me when ITER actually gets properly working and not for milliseconds

Don't listen to this retard.

Seriously. Don't.

uncovered shorts will not effect the price of the underlying asset, how could they?

also someone SELLING and uncovered short (ie the big investment bansk) is betting the price will go up by the end of the contract, they lose money if it goes down

The 2008 collapse was caused by the damage these derivatives did when the underlying assets declined in value for their own reasons, the derivatives themselves did not actually effect the price. you've got it confused.

>>7303598

>>7309095
>p-please buy my bags!!!

kill yourself, cryptokiddie

>>7303961
>When that changed, it was a net positive for society
Kill yourself communist piece of shit. The FDA and AMA are some of the most corrupt organizations in the world.

>>7307996
>>unironically thinking that regulated pharmaceuticals would actually care about your health.

kill yourself you fucking moron piece of trash

OP if I had millions in BTC I might take you seriously, but I only have a thousand or so. I don't care. The money I put into crypto was money I could afford to lose. If it goes to 0 I don't give a shit! I'm not selling!

>>7309138
faggot

tfw you use this 'dip' to trade and accumulate more ETH and then when it goes parabolic to $3000 you have 4x the amount of money

literal retard

>>7308330
It doesn't matter what 'most' people want, 'most' people are irrelevant sheep. As long as 10% want something it happens and there are easily 10% that are fed up with banker scams to want to use decentralized currency, that's why it will always have value. 10% is just the start as the anti govt crowd will continue increasing as people realize they've been scammed. There will always be a multitude of obedient unthinking sheep, they don't decide shit and never will.

>>7308113
You fucking brainlet, the pharma industry writes the regulation, they do whatever the fuck they please, while at the same time making all competition marginalized or even illegal. Government regulation is one of the most disasterous examples of government regulation you could possibly bring up and the fact that you absolute morons bring it up as a positive example outs you as totally brainwashed invalids

>>7308857
Now that's a pathetic framing attempt, retard, what actually happened itt is your boomer friend getting btfo time and time again because he understands shit all.

>>7308746
>he still think the jews do nothing. Oh muh innocent juden
>what are fractional reserve central bankers?
just kys, dumbcunt, rid us of your stupidity.

>>7309233
This. The fucking retarded brainlet brought up nutritional tables lmao. Nutritional fucking tables. This is the type of utter fucking retard that think he knows what hes talking about.

pffff, you really think everything is going to stop just after we had INSANE previous year with dozens/hundreds of new projects who raised billions and made partnerships with governments and corporations, and now everyone is looking at roadmaps to see what would they deliver in Q2 Q3 Q4 and how well they made their job? you really think two exchanges and one asset can make this market like a stocks? hell no
i can agree that things will slow down, but not in next 2 years
it's not only about coins, it's about millions of people who invested in new economy and new kinds of products / services. some will fail, some will go up and change the status quo like smartphones did 10 years ago. you can't just kill 20 billion of investments by fucking futures. yes, now we have dip, but just wait till Q2 when people will start to ask developers to show what actually they did, this will drive markets like crazy
prove me wrong

>>7308400
What could be a sounder financial decision than replacing the whole monetary system? A bunch of people are gonna lose their paper money, but they'll convert to crypto as soon as they get scared enough. The end.

bump

>>7303680
Angus Young starts singing.

>>7303961
>Regulation, in then end, is a good thing
I bet you also like roads?

>>7309733
>you can't just kill 20 billion of investments
Because that would be the first time ever fucking naive cunt

>>7303598

anyone that sells now deserves to be poor.
I got insider info.

>>7311216
yea, why not
kill yourself

>>7303598
thanks for your insight. goodbye now anon

>>7303598
>Fine, what is the utility? When you exclude black market transactions, it really has none.
>When you exclude crime and its associated multibillion dollar industries

YEP NO UTILITY THERE

>>7311237
back that up with something we can trust or go fuck yourself you larping faggot

>>7308400

Oh the irony.

Look, maybe you're right about bitcoin. But you're basically beating down a limping horse.

You're shitting on intrinsic value of crypto but somehow loooove stocks. Like, in what fucking world to SHARES OF A COMPANY HAVE UTILITY????

Right.They don't. And yet here you are shilling your stupid bullshit like you're the fucking genius jesus. You're a goddamn speculator you piece of shit.

Voting rights? There are blockchain protocols that give you voting rights proportional to the amount of coins you hold.

Dividends? Buy a PoS coin and stake it. You know what PoS is, right old man?

Oh no, private companies will use blockchain? Yea? Good. Pretty sure private companies have their own networks too. And you here you are you old fart.

Better markets. More liquidity. More transparency. More efficiency. More self determination. Thats what crypto offers. What the fuck are you offering?

>>7309733
this
It's like people are retarded or unaware of how different the crypto world of today is from what it was 3 years ago.
Not to mention that all these new projects target certain niches and raise awareness from people operating in those industries, which means new money that comes into the market without giving a shit about bitcoin. Hell, I'd say that a majority of the new money that is in crypto now hasn't even touched bitcoin, or if they did, they did it only to immediatly sell it to buy an altcoin.
Altcoins will make crypto mainstream because that's how word of mouth and advertising works. All these projects have millions of dollars raised from their ICOs and they will use a percentage to advertise to people in different industries so they can get user adoption.
- Hey Joe Norman have you heard of this company that operates in the same industry as we do. They are using blockchain which is the technology behind Bitcoin. You can even buy tokens that will increase in value if the project is succesful.
- Well since this is in my area of expertise, I'll look into it and invest something if it makes sense.

People can become aware of the blockchain, invest in it, use it, without giving a shit about Bitcoin. To assume that the entire market will collapse because king shitcoin it's on its death knell is 100% moronic.

>>7312036
wrong. Most of these shitty ICOs don't need blockchains. And what do you think will happen when these ICOs cash out from token to fiat....the ratio of money coming in to money going out won't sustain price growth. Thus crashing the market.

>>7306906

>the old fashioned way

A Ponzi scheme called Social Security? Nice.

>>7304871
Literally ever time I've visited a psychiatrist.

>>7312081
most of the companies in the dotcom bubble didn't need to operate online either. What's your point? Did the internet disappear when the bubble popped? When the market crashes a % of the money will be pulled out and a % will be moved into less shitty/speculative projects. The great filtering is normal and healthy. Does that mean that every single project on the blockchain will die during the market crash? Absolutely fucking not.

The good projects will continue and will thrive and the shitty ones will be forgotten. After so many billions were poured in this technology you think everyone will go like: "well, it was a good run guys, time to pack up and forget all this non-sense about blockchain. It was fun while it lasted."

>>7311759
Retard alert. Stocks give you legally enfor ed asset ownership and profit entitlement. Crypto coins give you literally nothing. Go back to your room and consider the possibility you are crypto deluded with no sense of the real world.

>>7312081
you're triggering at buzzwords
you know there are thousands of developers or former employees in thousands of fields who are fucking tired of how things work right now in many reasons. just give these people money so they can do their job and change the industries by implementing very different approaches. it will not happen in one year and we will see many flips. many things will change during this process, but which things exactly will change we can't predict because there's not very much of working products right now. in 2013 bitcoin had instant fast transactions, zero fees, no block size problem and so on. nobody could expect how this would feel until we reach a certain scale. so just let people do their job to reach certain scale at which they will start implementing new changes and deliver new iterations like IT companies did with operating systems. DOS was crap, early Windows were crap, early OSX was crap, but they kept getting better every year, so now you can do literally anything by tap and swipe
do not tell what evolution needs to do or you will be left alone

>>7312406
>legally enfor ed asset ownership and profit entitlemen

HHAHAHAHHAHAH

https://www.investopedia.com/university/stocks/stocks1.asp

> So what good are shares, then, if they aren’t actually the ownership rights we think they are? Owning stock gives you the right to vote in shareholder meetings, receive dividends (which are the company’s profits) if and when they are distributed, and it gives you the right to sell your shares to somebody else.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAAH

>>7312453
You continue to prove my point. With majority shares you can liquidate the company. With an acquisition you can go private and assume direct asset control. You're still a retard.

>>7312406

Just so you don't shit all over yourself for the whole internet to see, I hope you do realize that companies are in now way required to pay you dividends for stock you own.

>>7308175
>>7309183
PharmD here. The laws that essentially established the FDA and the means to enforce regulations were to prevent adulteration and misbranding of medications (counterfeits), other laws were literally created after mass poisonings.
1906 pure drug and food act
1938 food drug and cosmetic act (created after a mass poisoning)

The FDA serves as a pretty decent gatekeeper to ensure the american people aren't sold inferior/adulterated products and that these drugs have a history of safe use and evidence of efficacy. While there is certainly some amount of corruption in which certain drugs reach approval that shouldn't it nonetheless has functioned like it should to uphold standards for medications. For example the FDA refused to approve thalidomide for use in pregnant women and as a result when it was found to cause birth defects (limbless babies) only areas outside the US were effected. You should focus your anger on two things which fucks up US drug laws. 1) The intellectual property rights laws which allow drug companies to manipulate drug formulations to keep patents for decades. 2) Laws which allow direct to consumer advertising ( in Europe can't be shilled the latest antidepressant). If you wanna know more I can i'll be up for a little longer but I doubt this post is gonna get more than some /pol/ level troll response about big pharma.

>>7312564
You should know that shareholders elect the board of directors who determine the dividend payout ratio each quarter. And shareholders are legally entitled to the dividends they authorize to be paid out.

>>7303598
OP if you made this post 1.5 months ago you would be a genius. Posting this today makes you retarded

There is underlying value in the network itself and the apps on it.

The etherium network has apps. Those apps add value to the network.

The AGI startup wants to create a network for AI services to be bought and sold using a token. The AI participating on this network add value to it, and the connections they make on said network make the AI work in a way that can't be replicated elsewhere and hence has value.

So it's naive to say that there is no intrinsic value. The intrinsic value comes from many things, and is different for each crypto.

This is part of doing your research though and picking good coins to invest in and not bad ones. Much like picking companies.

>>7312601
>industry wagecuck defends said industry
Neat.

>>7312611

Sure. I guess, what i'm trying to say is... I'm not saying voting rights and dividends are irrelevant in stocks. I'm saying that crypto currencies can (and some do) have somewhat analogous mechanisms. And I'm also saying its a bit hypocritical for OP to shit all over crypto for 'LACK OF UTILITY' while in the same breath mentioning the fucking stock market.

>>7313535
Glad to see you lightened up. The root problem is that modern cryptocoins have nothing attached to them. So stocks absolutely beat them around intrinsic value. The real comparison you shoyld be making is with fiat currencies. Here's a hint: What does fiat have that crypto doesn't?

Btc will be less than $1000 in a month
t. expert

>>7313282
The FDA does not employ me, the FDA regulates my industry. I in no way defended the pharmaceutical companies. I argue that the US is better off with a regulated drug industry than an unregulated one. If you think Big pharma shits on you now, it would be far worse without the FDA.

>>7313658
>your assumptions are not reality
big pharma totally owns the fda, if you can't see it by now, you probably never will.

>>7308330
Youre a blasted idiot. Did it ever occur to you in your retarded brain to actually know what you are talking about?

You haven't even understood the basics of blockchain, yet you KNOW what is up.... People like you should just shut the fuck up and i don't even think bitcoin will go up again... and you know why? It's because the banks took over bitcoin, they made it slow and expensive to transact, which is why we are seeing the shit price now... It was possible because PEOPLE ARE LIKE YOU AND DON'T KNOW WTF THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT... The battle might be long but eventually we are going to see a non-cancerous coin take over like eth, bitcoin cash or nano for example. At that point, the crypto train will eventually move on...

And btw some of us still make money in this market. With just 1 btc in the market to trade with now im making 3000$ a day on average. Even if bitcoin dropped to half i would make money. Even if it dropped to 1/3 i would make money...

>>7312601
>>7312601
Unironically fucking kill yourself.

>>7313658
Without the FDA we could have a fucking free market and these pharma kikes couldn't make superior treatments illegal to market or even illegal to sell like they are doing now.

>>7304785
This guy

Implying big pharma aren’t raping the living shit out of you.

>>7306273
>I remember the silver boom of the 70s
boomer kike confirmed