/biz/ - Business & Finance

Thanks I just sold and then bought 100k

Is this real?

>>7133751
>investment geniuses BTFO

>>7133565
???capital loss???

>paying your taxes
I'll have bought my freedom in saint kitts before those cunts find out

>>7133789
Yea he can apply it to next year’s taxes. Still has to pay $15k this year

>>7133810
ah. rip then

>>7133565
So has he actually "cashed" out and got the money or is it still sitting somewhere else aside from his pockets/bank account?

if the market hasnt recovered by the beginnign of may im just gonna declare all my bitcoins as lost property

>Sell 15k worth of BTC
>Counts as a trade
>Get raped again for that trade the following year

>>7133565
>cash out
>buy back in
why

>>7134201
FOMO anon

>>7133565

But he didn’t earn anything. He sat on his ass, and thinks that he is too good to pay taxes.

What if you just say you went all in on BCC?

What if he steals them from himself with XMR?
> But the IRS will find him and fuck him
Not the question, I'm asking if he would have to still have to pay in that situation.

>>7134306
Taking a risk is still something!

That is what happens when you bend over and allow the government to fuck you in the ass instead of using the fucking coin as a CURRENCY and being free forever.

how2larp 101

>>7134365
Yes, you made money in 2017, lost it in 2018. Nothing that happens in 2018 affects taxes incurred in 2017

>>7134390
it is, and he will still be 5k in front

>>7133565

LAND OF THE FREE

you must find the balance

I'll be paying capital gains tax this year (.au), thankfully it is a lot saner than the US. Still it's a big bill because I made $500k this tax year

>>7133565
>tfw I have an $180k and have literally never incurred capital gains, even crypto-to-crypto, since I always bought by buying BTC/ETH/LTC with cash and immediately selling for whatever coin I want

>>7134504
more sane how? we're pretty much the same rules as the burgers anon....

>>7134516
Nope, don't get hit with per trade fuckery, just pay tax on realised gains

>>7134438

Why do Americans use the calendar year as the tax period instead of the financial year?

nice "investments" you got here lads lmao

just simply don't cash out more than you're going to spend then?? in norway you just notify the taxman how much u cash out, and you get sent a bill with 23% of the gains cashed out

>>7134539
I think you better look through the ATO website anon... we certainly do get hit with per trade fuckery, realised includes shitcoins

>>7133565
Holy shill. Thank fuck Bonglandistan has at least not having to pay tax until you cash out going for it.

>>7133565
his fault he told the accountant lmao

Lmao @ los creaturas d'americanos

In NL we just pay 1.2% if you've got over 25k net. Under 25k is no charge

>>7133565
Why not just selling on localbitcoins? Sure you run the risk of getting murdered by some gang but I would rather die than pay 35% taxe

>he is registered in a country with capital gains and income taxes
How fucking retarded can you possibly be.

>>7133565
Either he lives in a communist utopia like Europe or he has a really bad accountant.

>>7134539
What the fuck are you fucking idiots paying taxes on crypto for holy fuck its like you enjoy being cucks to the government. Like you get your kicks from bending over voluntarily for the irs to assrape you like you get off on it or something holy fucking jesus.

Just sell on localbitcoins or claim you won it on bustabit i mean jesus h fuck.

>>7134604
Because I'm not a criminal? Take your libertarian wet dreams elsewhere

>>7134653
Criminal is charging 35% fees
Localbitcoins for life, cuck

>>7134604
>bustabit

land of free makes you pay taxes on gambling winnings as well
AHHAHAHHAHAHHA

>>7134653
I legit thought all these tax discussions were just a big troll I had no idea you guys were actual fucking cucks like this.

When you go start/buy a business with your crypto gains you're going to be paying company tax, then taxes on your dividends, then you go to spend it and there's sales taxes and the ride never fucking ends.

The point of BTC is it's out of control of the government. You cucks reporting your gains and paying accountants to make sure you get thoroughly assraped by the IRS.. it's just sad, it really is.

>>7134705
I didn't know that, that's not even funny that's just sad man. I feel sorry for you burgers.

I'm glad the US dollar is about to crash and their government is about to become insolvent. Good riddance to bad rubbish.

>>7134708
let's say you sell on localbitcoins, how are you ever going to spend any of your gains? the fucking government is going to ask questions when you buy shit worth a fuckton of money. And how do you explain 100k deposits in ur account?

>>7134708
No wonder burgers have such weak hands. They're constantly scrambling to cash out to pay their tax bills. Fucking kek.

>>7134740
>I'm glad the US dollar is about to crash and their government is about to become insolvent

The US becoming insolvent means the rest of the world will be insolvent. It won't be good times for really anyone on the planet unless you're off the grid

>>7134754
Just use cash, no bank accounts here

>>7134568
He did cash out. He just bought back in right after.

>>7134770
doesnt fucking matter if you're going to PURCHASE EXPENSIVE THINGS?? lets say i buy a fucking car worth 50k, in cash. the government is going to ask questions when it gets registered to your name when you havent reported any income that suggest u could buy a car

>>7134770
I'm not poor so 'just use cash' doesn't work, at all.
I have no problem with paying taxes though, I don't always like how they're allocated but the people need gibs man.

>>7134770
>just use filthy fiat! take THAT stupid goobermint tax man
the absolute state of libertarians

>>7133565
So you cashed out anon. Why

>>7134754
No they fucking aren't. I put the money in my account and I invest it or I buy shit. What part of that is complicated?

Does the US government seriously track all your money and come and get you if you spend a large amount on something? How sad is that i mean that's really something.

>>7134755
Exactly. Like I said, they get a kick out of bending over for the government. They are literal cucks.

>>7134767
Opposite is true. Your third world country is holding the rest of us back, sucking up all the capital into T bills/bonds that will be either be paid with hyperinflated dollars or not paid at all.

You aren't the engine of the world economy, you're the caboose. We cut you loose and the train goes faster.

>>7134790
I fucking lold your government actually controls your life this much. You realise this isn't normal? That you're living in some kind of communist/socialist country if this actually is happening?

>>7134540
If that happened then they couldn’t rape us as hard enough during Christmas time

>>7134770
I found a bullion dealer that takes BTC. Walked in, traded my BTC for a bit of gold and a lot of silver, walked out. Simple as that.

Holding waiting for the US dollar collapse and the paper silver market to fold, with all the increased demand from desperate burgers trying to trade in their rapidly depreciating monopoly money it should be a nice increase in value.

>>7133565
i bet that is wrong

I can't post wtf. Test

>>7134836
i'm not from america, but this is how it is in MOST civilized countries. They come looking when big purchases are made, especially when you don't have a job that suggests that you can go spending. Norway btw

>>7134600
You don't pay taxes on every trade in Europe. You only pay in the greatest country on earth America.

>>7134889
That’s awesome, how would you claim the gold if you ever cashed it out. Genuine question

>>7134708
>Does the US government seriously track all your money and come and get you if you spend a large amount on something? How sad is that i mean that's really something.


Yes, they do. Are you really this dumb?

>>7134913
You must be that guys accountant because you have no idea how taxes work.

>>7134904
I don't understand... even if they did come looking... what can they prove?

They can't see your BTC/Alt trades, they can't prove you had any gain on anything unless you hand it over to them. They can only get you on what they can prove.

>>7134917
I just sell it to anyone brah. Advertise on ebay/gumtree and meet in a bank and sell it for cash if i wanted.

If I needed to sell a lot to a bullion dealer, for all they know my grandma gave it to me, or I won it in a card game, or I've been taking out $300 a week and putting it in a piggy bank and buying gold with it. Or I won BTC on bustabit, traded it for gold and now am selling the gold. Any of a million ways my bro.

>>7134957
I'm not saying they don't. I'm saying that's fucked. They watch your bank accounts? Seriously?

>>7134998
You do not understand how this works

>>7134998
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Currency_transaction_report

And they're still commies after that. Classic reddit.
>Corporations need to pay their fair 90% share, I should get off tax free
If you're not in Saint Kitts, Eastern Europe or SEA, I lol @ you. The west is a joke

>>7134998

>They watch your bank accounts? Seriously?

If it goes above a certain amount, the bank reports it because government regulations.

Also you have to pay your taxes. What do u think taxes are? Just another way to account for the plebbians money

>>7135018
AND THE HOME OF THE BRAVE.

Seriously if you can't outsmart this your fucking retarded.

>>7134913
Bullshit. Germany has the same law. UK has the same law. I'm willing to bet there are others.

>>7134653
Cuck kys. There is nothing more I wanna do than to smack the goofy out of you

Bitch ass, go to reddit

so I bought a fair amount of BTC and have it tucked away, holding.

got it from bitstamp, a polish company i think. If I haven't sold it, do I have to declare something?

>>7135034
Honorable mention to Chile.

>>7135055
No you don't

>>7134998
>They can't see your BTC/Alt trades
Unless you're living somewhere like Congo you're in for a rude awakening.

>>7135055
Not as long as you're holding it. The moment you trade it for fiat OR crypto you trigger a taxable event though.
Also - depending on where you live - you might not pay any taxes after holding for 1 year. Or maybe a reduced rate, dunno.

>>7135043

yeah u can outsmart it. You just need more money

>>7133565
>Retards pretending to be real investor can't get gains with having to pay taxes

>>7134998
>or I've been taking out $300 a week and putting it in a piggy bank

This is what I don't get as far as the tax collectors are concerned... if you looked at my bank history over the last ~10-15 years you'd see countless transactions where I've withdrawn $100-500+ from ATM machines, they have no idea where that money went. I've also done money transfers periodically to friends/family for payments or loans, again no one knows the purpose of this money besides me.

So then if I suddenly came into say... $100k cash, whats the problem? For all anyone knows I just squirreled away those ATM withdrawals under the mattress for the last X number of years, there's no way anyone can prove that's not the case.

>>7135096

>there's no way anyone can prove that's not the case.

until they knock on ur door and ask for proof. Albeit getting threatened with fines and prison time isn't bad imirite?

>>7135059
>>7135081
okay let's just continue with the hypothetical

let's say I transferred some of it to binance, and bought some Alts, how would they know?

Does binance send something to the IRS?

>>7135096
I can only tell you how it works in Germany. The banks are obligated to report any transaction over 14999€ to the Finanzamt (basically IRS). And they will start asking questions. If it happens once they will be cool with a 'I just saved that over the last few years'. If the sum is too high or it happens frequently they'll audit you. And no, they don't have to prove anything. You have to prove where that money came from. And if you can't they'll assume tax fraud.

>>7135096
your a fucking idiot, if you make payments that is more than 10k to the same place in a short amount of time they have to report you to the IRS.
say your are buying a new car from a dealer, you put 6k down, and pay 500 a month. once you hit 10k they have to file with the irs what you paid.

>>7135123
You were audited, they looked at your bank records, tx to bit coins exchange, ask for your bitstamp records

>cucks not using LocalBitcoins
They deserve it

>>7135162
>systematic

>>7135123
That's not the problem. The problem is that they know once you cash out. As soon as a large sum appears on your account and the IRS catches wind of that they'll demand a history of your trades. You are obligated by law to give it to them. If you don't they'll just fuck you without further questions.

>>7135123
>Does binance send something to the IRS?
yes

>>7135167
it literally doesnt change a thing, unless you're going to live by cash the rest of ur life and not purchase any big things.

>>7135034
Laughed my ass off.

Thats just perfect leftist mentality

>Ohh, I think ill vote for this welfare, illegal immigration, free infancide and keeping muderers alive in the jail system!
3 years later
>WHY IS THIS CORRUPT BOURGEOIS GOVERNMENT TAKING ALL MY MONEY
>AHHHHH WHY WONT ANYONE HIRE ME WITH MY 4.0 WOMAN STUDIES DEGREE
>AHH WHY THIS THIS COUNTRY SO RACIST, IM GOING TO MOVE TO A WHITER COUNTRY BECAUSE THIS PLACE IS A HELLHOLE

>>7133565
>it's like I didn't earn anything

>>7135096
That's the point. I have $15k cash out just in the last year. Can easily say I put $50k into precious metals over the last 5 years if they ask how I suddenly came into all of it.

You all seem to think the government is this all-knowing entity, it's omnipotent and knows everything.

They only know what they can prove, you cucks. And if you have any intelligence you have set it up so they don't even know about your cryptos.

>>7135198
No you autist you have this backwards, YOU need to prove it... You act like fucking cash rorts have not existed for all of time

>>7135198
And where did you get that 50k? Where's YOUR proof? THEY don't need proof, YOU do.

>>7135034
Apart from Belarus and Slovenia Eastern Europe isn't too good for crypto. Poland is devolving into a tax hell akin to its big brother, Estados Unidos de las Creaturas. Fuck those shitholes

>>7135219
Seriously so in the US you spend a moderate amount of money on one transaction and they actually make you prove where you got the money? And if you don't what, what can they prove? And you can't just say you won it on bustabit or dice or gambling or got it from fucking the milf down the street?

Oh wait i forgot, you have to pay tax on gambling winnings too in the LAND OF THE FREE

>>7135222
From my real job? They don't know / can't prove I spent my cash out on tendies.

>>7134306
Socialist scum.

>>7135332
How often do we have to spell this out for you? Once they audit you 100% of the proof needs to be provided by you. Otherwise you're just committing tax fraud. It's as simple as that. If you lost your proof, tough luck. Tax fraud. You WILL provide them the proof they want and when they check if everything's correct and there's a flaw, they will just rape your ass. I have absolutely no idea why you think that they need to prove anything. It's literally spelled out in the regulations that it's your job to keep track of everything you do.

>>7135332
Where the fuck do you live?

You're constantly missing the point, they don't care where did you get the money from, if you don't have any proof on the origin of the money, they automatically assume you made the money illegally.

This is so fucked up. Didn't we separate from Britain to evade taxes in the first place?

>>7135395
This
>>7135412
This

>>7135332
again you are thinking the IRS has to prove anything
that's not how it works
you spend 10k+ at one place, that place has to reports you to the IRS, they want to know where YOU got it from, YOU have to prove it not them, all they know is that you spent that money.
most people don't withdraw large amounts of cash to pay for something, they get a check from the bank or use credit.
>you won it
if you won money YOU HAVE TO PAY TAXES on winnings, which is like 45%

>>7135048
im german and i paid 0% in taxes on my crypto gains the second year in a row
get fucked burger

>>7134326
If you get audited you'll have to prove that.

I'm considering buying some exchange statements from someone who did that.

>>7135119
>>7135162
maybe I wasn't clear

I've worked a regular 9-5 job for the last 20 years and made a regular salary

no one knows exactly how much of it I save versus how much I spend on non-essentials. Obviously my bank history shows things like mortgage payments, and specific payments to merchants (grocery bills, gas bills, utility bills, etc) but as far as direct CASH withdrawals, no one knows where that money went or how it was spent.

So if I had been withdrawing cash for 20 years, spending it on hookers and drugs, but then someone walks up to me and hands me a bag with $150,000 cash in it, I can obviously just say "oh ya this $150k is the sum of all those ATM withdrawals over the last 20 years, I was keeping it under my mattress because I don't trust banks"

and the government can't really argue with me as long as the sum of those ATM withdrawals actually does amount to around the ~$150k I now have in cash. I can even prove it by showing my bank history with the ATM withdrawals listed

>>7135395
I've tried to explain it so simply even a burger can understand.

You should have set it up so they didn't know about your cryptos.

And even if they somehow did find out, they can't actually prove what kind of gains you made.

If you're retarded enough to buy your BTC in a way that involves paying ID, then you sell it so they can see the money, or you invest your money in a way that they can easily see you had no way of getting it other than untaxed income... then sure, you have to pay.

They have no reason to audit you if you play it smart. And you should have set it up so that on the off chance they did, there is no evidence of undeclared income/gains on any paper trail that exists.

If Oprah Winfrey gifts you a car or you win a car or some other prize on the prices right.
guess what?
YOU HAVE TO PAY TAXES

>>7135444
checked. for ausfags we don't have to pay tax on gambling, but would still need to provide proof if queried which would not be hard for anybody who actually won the money gambling

>>7135464
that's tax fraud

>>7135473
They're obviously not going to buy this so it would have to stand up to thorough examination, if there's nothing linking you to the bit coins then you have a chance, if there is then you have no chance

>>7135412
>>7135412
>>7135444
Again... it's real simple... don't make transactions or investments that leave them a fucking paper trail to follow in the first place.

I explained it in all my other posts. Don't be a fucking retard and there is no way you get audited. And even if you do, if you've set it up right they can't prove that you spent or invested any money that you haven't paid tax on.

Once you start getting into the high hundreds of thousands or millions then you might considering investing in some proper money laundering.

>>7135481
in theory you could just launder it all through pokies but house will probs take about 15-20% of it at which point you might as well just pay your fucking taxes

>>7135274
Bulgaria here, comfy at 10% tax at withdrawal, get 5% back for filing offline.
If you're small game you can skip filing altogether, if you're withdrawing well into $XXX,XXX you can live with a 9.5% flat tax.
I could probably withdraw tax-free somewhere else but at 9.5% it's not worth the hassle

>>7135481
Bustabit my bro, even if you didn't win it on there you can say you did.
>"I won it on bustabit"
>"OK prove it"
>"Alright here's my 40,000 pages of game history."
>"OK we believe you"

Easy as that.

>>7134306
most jobs these days involve sitting on ass. he generated wealth for himself, hence he earned it

>>7135198
I don't think you'll listen to me, but make plans about what you would need to abandon your country in the near future and adopt a new identity. You look at this as an emperor's new clothes kind of thing but the people you want to play are not weak and they have very little concern about being fair to you. Don't underestimate the lengths they'll go to in order to make sure there's no cascade effect.

>>7134566
Not if it's your primary form of income

>>7135488
except its not
you must be literally clinically retarded
its all good with the finanzamt faggot

>>7135475
how are you going to live your life only with cash? you try to purchase something of value, a car or house, anything that gets registered to your name, guess what, the government is going to come knocking. What exactly are you going to tell them then?

>>7135488
So? Tax is theft

>>7135587
They aren't fucking mind readers mate.

My personal way of cashing out was real simple.
>Sold BTC on localbitcoins for cardless cash
>About a grand a day, just piled up under my bed
>Buy up precious metals (silver) whenever I get the chance
>Now just holding it all waiting for US dollar collapse

>>7135541
>there is no way you get audited
if you spend a large amount of money in one place a business is required to send an 8300 to the IRS, then the IRS will ask you where the money came from as long a you have proof where it came from and that you paid taxes you are fine.

they dont give a fuck if you have 200k in you closet, the only time they care if you spend it in large amounts.

>>7135587
Don't bother. He thinks he's far too smart for the IRS. This board is full of retards who are 'too cool' to pay taxes and will get fucked majorly in the next few months/years. There will be thousands upon thousands of people who realized a lot of gains in December and then held through the correction. I'm willing to bet that a fuckton of people on this board owe more taxes than they even have in crypto right now.

>>7133789

capital loss is limited to $3k per year

>>7135542
I dont know, but surely the 'won it in pokies' thing was dead in the water, there are far more fucking astute launderers out there than fucking internet money traders
>>7135565
all they really need is the ins outs and the balance
>>7135602
ESPECIALLY if it is your primary form of income

>>7135618
Just buy an acre for $1500 and a cheap, broken rv and get it fixed up.

>>7135096

>these are the people giving financial advicd on this board

Taxation is theft

>>7135700
why the fuck would i go from upper middle class living arrangements to the absolute bottom? just because i refuse to pay 23% of my gains in taxes? what kind of logic is this

>>7135660
US taxation system is stupid. You guys have no VAT, low effective rates on corporation, got cucked by fb, apple and amazon while average joe has to pay crazy amount.

>>7134306
By using his mind and seeing the value in bitcoin before others did, he invested his resources where they were needed at the time with anticipation demand would be greater in the future. Taxation is theft. Bitcoin is taking the government out and putting parasites like you off welfare.

>>7135559
I envy you. I thought it was that simple here with 18/32% income tax, but lately there's been a ministerial interpretation that pretty much said that every transaction, even crypto to crypto, is taxable.
The government will pay with fucking blood.

>>7135724
Why there fuck would you avoid taxes if you're upper middle class?

>>7135660
unfortunately this... i have hope it's all a larp to cuck cashing out, but merely butting heads with the jew is not the way to play this game

>>7135761
>implying most billionaires arent doing over aggresive tax planning bordering on tax evasion

>>7135783
Yeah this is different

>>7135746
>make an EXTREMELY profitable order on Etherdelta
>(if you have a 100ETH portfolio, make a sell order of 1 shit token for 100 ETH)
>Go through the order yourself
>Tell tax authorities that you started with this one shit token, and someone fatfingered to make you 100 ETH. Only pay tax that transaction.
Can this hypothetically work for you people from countries with better sidewalks?

>>7135395
So let's say I have books where the math adds up. It's the most flawless Excel sheet you've seen....
How the fuck do they then prove any of those TX actually took place
>Hi Yobit? We need the TAX history of user with IP addresses X,Y,Z.
There are legitimate trasnactions I can only prove through an Excel sheet. How would I prove any of my legit transactions from BTC-E? Get my own subpeona issued to them? Do you have screenshots or HTML backups of every trasnaction you've made or just a CSV file?

>>7135742
I'm not even from the US. I'm from Germany and every trade is taxable here as well. Which is why you sell everything you have on Dec 31st, calculate your gains, cash out enough to pay taxes, and buy in after that. And I actually agree that taxation is theft - I just don't want you guys to get fucked by the government, just because you didn't plan this through.

>>7135761
i'm going to pay taxes when i cash out. Why would any1 want to buy a fucking field and a shit rv to live by, just to avoid paying taxes from crypto gains? They would have to literally be homeless to go that route, and then, how would they even get access to crypto and get any big gains from it

>>7135799
This doesn't make any sense... You pay tax on the net gain from all transactions, the legal requirement is merely that you record them, the big boys version of showing your workings

>>7135806
There is no point to it adding up in some different way

>>7135618
Just talking cryptos here. I should be earning a decent enough living to pay for those things legit later on my bro.

>>7135677
>>7135655
Then don't do transactions where they send an 8300 to the (((IRS)))... or any transaction that involves telling them you have undeclared income. Or if you do, make it look like it came from a legit source. Simple.

Slav fag here

Cant he just... not report the trades, maybe?

>>7135816
I dont know. How did your govt know your transaction/trade history? It may be taxable but I dont see how they can find out unless you declare it yourself.

>>7135823
>Why
Because everyone in this thread is wondering how you cash out without paying taxes. That's how. If you aren't currently a NEET or homeless then you shouldn't be retarded enough to think that advice was for you.

>>7135906
Cmon, even in Slavland more than 15k will raise suspicion.
The fag pictured in OP is a small fish and it might work for him but most people in this thread are well into 6-digits

>>7135533
why wouldn't they buy it?

"I withdrew money and saved the cash in my house"

"we don't believe you"

"well thats what happened"

I mean what more can they do there? once i've withdrawn from the bank into cash I'm free to do whatever I want with it including saving it

>>7135893
hey made it look like a legit source is as good as it is good, most of these anons seem completely unable or probably more so unwilling to comprehend the very basics though so i worry about their abilities

>>7135906
>>7135917
These burgers are so brainwashed that they think the omnipotent IRS knows everything and unless they hand over all their records and pay every cent of every CGT on every trade that they're going in the can.

Makes me glad i live in a first world country.

>>7135957
because it sounds like bullshit, but maybe they will, if you have a bank tx to cuckbase or something though be aware there is a fair chance they will see that and demand those records and go from there... just make sure all your shit is clean and accounted for.

>>7135953
True dat.
But in slav land I can pump $500 each week into my bank account with raising zero suspicion. It will take half a year to cash out 15k.

If we consider relatives, I can handle 60k/year easily

What I was meaning to say: he hasn't cashed out yet, so y did he report the trades that remain hidden?
How will anybody learn I have 15k in crypto if I don't cash it out?

>>7135975
They're fucking retarded. At least the non-burgers in this thread seem to have some sense.

I'm convinced the burgers all got (((brainwashed))) into believing that they have to pay all these taxes. Like somehow with no paper trail and no records they are going to magically know you had crypto gains and come after you.

>>7136002
well they don't know anon until they start poking their big ass nose in shit, this is their job and the bit coins has a stench

>>7135660
I've realized quite a lot of gains but only cashed out like $1200. I am certainly going to pay full taxes on that $1200 but I really can't imagine the IRS being capable of knowing what erc20 tokens I've profited on. If I cash out any this year I certainly will plan on paying roughly %35 on it or whatever. Are people really expecting the IRS to have a crazy amount of manpower to know if people have profit that hasn't been cashed out yet?

>>7133656

I also did this but with tether

>>7136034
most of these cucks do have a paper trail starting from cuckbase though... they fomo the fuck in without thinking ahead

>tfw cashed out and paid taxes and still have $1MM

Did I make it?

>>7135797
No it's not. Only a fool doesn't try to minimise their tax to utmost

>>7136048
So far all I see is anons paying their accountants to make sure they pay every cent because they're scared.

How do they know to go looking for your crypto gains before they even know you had any?

I can't wait to see what happens to you autists when you try to evade taxes.

I started crypro this year, so I'm going to see how many people actually get fucked before deciding what to do about taxes next year.

>>7136048
Its unlikely. I dont know what kind of taxation system that burgers use but if they use self-assessment system its easy to hide crypto gain.

>>7135048

No, google which countries have 0% tax on crypto. You'll see a number of European countries.

The US does things to fuck over the average joe, like taxing every crypto trade. And demanding tax from US citizens who fucking live (literally live) abroad.

>>7135602
>t. brainlet

Why the fuck would you buy a burger based centralised shitcoin like usd anyway, they can print new supply out of nothing at any time and the whole idea of usd is created from debt ffs.

>>7136117
>decades-old tax code exists to fuck over the average Joe
No denying that the current code hurts crypto, but the reason those European nations have such low capital gains taxes yet high everything else taxes is BECAUSE they fuck over the average Joe to prop up the Rothschilds and other royalty

>>7135444

We don't pay taxes on gambling winning here in the UK

>>7136065
they won't have the manpower

millions of people making countless transactions

it would take like a billion man hours to figure it all out with records required from dozens of different exchanges linked with each wallet address loosely tied to personal identification.

They're heavily reliant on your good will to make an accurate and truthful filing. They'll go after any big whales with obvious discrepancies but wont have time to deal with small fish

>>7135672
tired of seeing this meme everywhere -- this ONLY applies for rollover. same fiscal year the limit is like half mil

meanwhile the government thinks im poor while i have 200k in crypto

>>7136195
This is true. Taxation officials have risk algorithm for auditing criteria. Its simply a waste of time to investigate each neet in basement.

>>7136089
>>7136096
There's a point where you do it yourself, where you get a friend to help, where you get a professional to help, where you get the best in the country to help... An extra percentage point savings is obviously a very different case for a newcoiner and a billionaire

>>7136155

Tax rates vary wildly between European country to European country.

I'm not saying this to be condescending, but IME Americans seem to view Europe as a monolith. Rather than a variety of countries, and various (white) ethnicities.

Switzerland is radically different in economics to Germany for example.

>>7136110
To a degree sure, but crypto is nothing special to the tax man, he is familiar with cash cheats who literally go out and do actual work for the money, the difference with bit coins is he actually has an electronic trail to follow

>>7133565
Meanwhile gold in my country can be bought with no VAT and any gains are tax free

>>7134653
>still not realizing that govts are the biggest criminals on the planet

I’m not going to pay taxes. It would be around 20K

Lol I’m not a cuck

>>7136298
>electronic trail
Tell me, I'm genuinely curious in case I miss something.

>>7135745
taxation is required for any country to function. you must be really brain deficient if you dont realise that.

>>7133565
>if i sold now i wouldnt be able to cover costs
If he sold now he could claim the loss on his taxes as long as he is filing his crypto as investment property.

do people really declare they crypto gains? I thought it was just retarded redditors that are paying money to lawyers. These crypto gains are mine and no way will I willingly spend money, time and effort to say, hey here is free money. If they ever want access to my accounts they can have them and guess what they will find. At some point all the money is consolidated into Monero. If they want access to this, the wallet will be empty and I will say it was hacked.

>>7136085
Exactly.

>buy coins on cuckbase after giving them your ID
>sell them back to cuckbase so its easy for IRS to see gains/losses if they subpoena
>transfer the money directly into your bank account in a transaction they can see
>spend it in big transactions that lead to a 1488 report direct to IRS
>tell your accountant all this shit anyway and give them all your records

"HURR ARE YOU STOOPID OF COURSE YOU HAV TOO PAY TACKSES"

>>7134653
I knew /biz/ had been flooded by normies but I didn't know it was this bad

>>7133565
uncle sam can suck my cock

>tfw live in Denmark where crypto is considered property, not financial assets, so I'm able to trade as much as I want without it being a taxable event ever UNLESS I sell an asset for the national currency that I have no held for at least 2 years (in which case, I pay 57% tax)
>coins held for 2 years and then sold are literally tax free
Feelsgoodman

>>7136370
Until they start giving tax break and loophole in transfer pricing protocol to big guys. US corporation in general pays far from the stated rate with their accounting magic.

>>7136344
cash has no paper trail, bit coins does

>>7136425
more like uncle scam

>>7136423
fucking right

>>7135957

>"we contacted the bank who issued this debit card, there are no records of these amounts being withdrawn"
>???
>anti-profit

>>7134504
They havent figured out just how royally rhey will fuck the auatralians yet. Might be income or cgt. If its income and you already have a job, enjoy your 45% tax on it. If it is cgt, guess what they said it will be every single trade regardless of loss. Time to lose those coins champ. Put it on a ledger then declare the ledger stolen in police statement. Move funds overseas. You are welcome

>>7136540
they have and it is income or cgt, your choice

If you participate in reporting an exchange of digital goods, then I really don't hope you play any video games with marketplaces. Guess what? Those digital goods in video games, their currency and items, also have fiat value. You should be reporting all of your trades, all of your currency, and also be paying taxes on your digital goods inside of video games or any other online virtual marketplace.

Yes, every time you use the auction house in WoW, or loot a valuable item that can be traded, is a taxable event. Any time you destroy a ship carrying billions in ISK worth of equipment and EVE and take items, its a taxable event.
Get gold from a quest? Taxable event. Trade cloth for gold? Taxable event. Distribute gear for gold bids while giving carries? Taxable event. Every generation and transfer of in-game currencies is a taxable event. Especially in games like Path of Exile with established dollar value for items, since they are traded on external item exchanges.

Do any trading at all? Taxable events. Pick up a chaos orb? Taxable event. Trade a chaos orb for something more valuable than a chaos orb? Definitely a taxable event.

Better keep a careful record, since the companies that run these games do, and will give the info out instantly if a subpeona ever arrives from the IRS. Pay your taxes on your digital goods, goy.

>>7134836
>t. Delusional europoor

>>7136640
I frequently traded keys for hats in TF2 a few years ago. Am I an audit waiting to happen?

>>7136787
good night and good luck faggots

>>7136640

Before you say 'but that's fucking crazy anon! It's totally unreasonable!', listen to this: in every mmo and every game with a marketplace, items and individual units of currency are tracked by unique item ID's, kind of like entries on a database...or ledger. Those items and units of currency are simply centralized digital currency, effectively no different than any crypto you trade away. Trading them is a taxable event, because they have established fiat value due to external currency trading exchanges.

WoW gold DEFINITELY has established fiat value, since you can buy tokens and trade them for gold. Anything you ever spend gold on in WoW, is a taxable event, and any gold you gain from anything is definitely a taxable event.

So guess what anon? You'd better be real careful about what games you play.

>>7136787

According to the IRS you are, since those keys and hats have established fiat value, and you failed to report them.

There's no way he owes as much as he now holds, unless he sold at a major loss multiple times. Is he taking cost basis into account?

>>7133565
soo he cashed out into his bank account?

>>7136723
Keep paying those taxes, cuck.
And keep saving up those US dollars ready to pay your share of the national debt
Don't worry, they will hold their value, (((we))) promise.

Yes, it is unreasonable, and very, very stupid. This is why less than 5% of crypto trades in 2016 were reported to the IRS, and its why less than 5% will be reported in 2017. This tax fud is just that -- fud.

Pay your income tax. Stop fucking worrying about trade of digital goods being a taxable event. It is completely unenforceable, and even if the IRS were 100x the size it was right now, they still wouldn't have the manpower to figure it out.

You are not a giant hedge fund, you are not a trading company, the IRS does not give a shit about your lunch money. Even if they did, they are as an institution, incapable of enforcement.

>>7134653
Right, You are a retard. I'm getting your tax money, while not paying my own taxes.

so yall wypipo wanna make crypto too complex for POC to understand but then when its time to pay us what yall owe yall wanna dodge taxes...man fuck yall...pay us what yall owe...we built dis muhfucka...

>>7135488
Not if you don't get caught and cash out in a non-EU country.

>>7136223
>only applies to rollover
Ok, so buy 100 btc for $1 ea in 2011.
Sell 100 btc for $14,000 ea Dec 31st, 2017.
>Owe $490,000 in taxes for 2017
Buy 100 btc for $14,000 ea Jan 1st, 2018.
Sell 100 btc for $1 ea April 1st, 2018.
>Hey you owe us $490,000 in taxes for 2017, but its ok my dude take $3,000 off your taxes for 2018.

>>7136432
Did you even read the op?
In america you can do the same thing but op sold his crypto at max gains and rebought crypto without paying the taxes so he will have to sell his crypto again to pay the taxes which will also be taxed.
Op is wrong on the fact that if he sold his crypto at a loss then he wouldnt be taxed on it and could file the losses against his gains as long as it is filed as investment property.

>>7136942
This guy gets it.

Imagine the cucks ACTUALLY going out of their way to inform the government about their crypto gains so they can hand over 30% of it.

>open a bank account in Hong Kong
>???
>profit

>>7134913
Can you even math?
Paying on every trade and paying on the net total of all trades is the same thing.

>>7133565

>>7136831
You never actually own those assets per the tos that you agreed to. If you sell them for fiat, you are in breach of that contract. Gaming companies foresaw the possibility and had their lawyers act accordingly.

>>7136904
>Keep paying those taxes, cuck.

You are going to do the same eventually, mongoloid

Playing the tough guy on an anime imageboard isn't going to do the trick

>>7136987
An unlucky few will get made examples of mainly due to odd bank activity (reported by bank). The state of normies is hilarious. Dont declare shit. Put everything onto a ledger, last resort report ledger stolen.
Thus police will have to talk with cyber police who will have to liase with the blockchain police to seize the assets.

omg yeah fukin idiot, my plan is just to hodl iExec, not gonna trade or anything along the lines to avoid shit like that

Would you invest in this shitcoin? Heres the promotional video...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t5ayg3hbhoM

>>7137030
>You are going to do the same eventually, mongoloid
No sane person making over $300k is actually pays taxes, brainlet. Offshores and double citizenships exist for a reason.

>>7137026

>he thinks the tos means anything

Oh sweety, no.

>>7137026
Hey guys, it's me. Samtoshi Nakamoto. Inventor of Bitcoin. Just wanted to let you all know that by using my software, you agree you're not the owner of the "assets" on my distributed ledger and you are not permitted to sell them for cash.

>>7136370
>if I don't know of any other way for something to function then it can't

>>7137026

>he thinks he "owns" a bitcoin, which is nothing more than an entry on a distributed ledger

>>7137111
It means they (gaming companies) reserve the right to reclaim or delete any digital asset you are licensing from them.
If you do cash out 100k in wow gold, you would owe taxes on it, because it is now income. The gold itself is not classified as such, since you never actually own it.
Quit being purposefully retarded.

>>7137236
Ah yes, the same way we never actually own coins that never leave an exchange, right?

>>7137283
You are the signatory, so yes.

this is larp right? why is he paying 35% tax on 40k gains? Im likely paying probably 21 % effective tax on 90k profit here in florida. and i only make around 50k.

>>7136370
"> taxation is required for any country to function. you must be really brain deficient if you dont realise that.

Yet burgerland spends more on muh terrorism than on reversing coronary heart disease when theres 630,000 a year difference in deaths from eating shit food. Good to see your crypto taxes are going to good use brainlet

>>7137030
Meant on cryptos ya cuck. But also what this anon said >>7137094

>>7137314
>willingly handing over $19,000 to the government for no reason
this is the real larp friendo.

>>7136424
Yes, it's hard to believe but there are "communists" in this board.
Truly despicable.
It would be 100% preferable to eliminate that disgusting kind of people than indians.

>>7136117
Bullshit, the only countries in europe that has no tax on crypto is Belarus and possibly Slovenia.
Most countries tax active trading also differently from holding, no matter how much these 18yr old virgins cry about it
t. tax expert

>>7136370
so you're paying taxes on crypto because "muh moral obligation to hand over X% of my capital gains because gibs need gibs."

>>7134504

How did you make 500K AUD though in one year?

>>7135559
So wait is it 10% or 9.5%?

So what happens if I decide to not pay? What's going to happen when I try to purchase a house or a new car?

>>7137384
id rather not go to prison friendo

>tfw living in the middle of nowhere
>tfw havent paid taxes to the government for years
Fuck off IRS, come here and I'll fucking blow you away before I give into your extortion.

>>7136964
in the us you'd owe less than $490,000 because long term capital gains rates are lower than 35%. but yeah, you'd still owe tax on the gains.

on the second part, when you sell for a huge loss you can still deduct the $1.4mil loss against any 2018 gains before you carry the rest forward.

why would anyone sell for a gain at the end of the year and buy back the next? that's asking for trouble.

>>7135190

>tax people who can afford it
>why am I being taxed, I can't afford it

the inconsistency! the gall!

LEFTIIIIIIIIIISTS!!!!!!!

>>7137527
>victim blaming
Neck yourself.

>>7134595
Recomend a country and i will move to there this befor march.

>>7137283
yeah pretty much
Ownership implies ultimate control. with both an exchange and an online game "asset", you are only in control of them at the discretion of a 3rd party and so can't claim ownership of the item

>>7135057
Tell me more about that, Chile is like 30 hours by car from my country.

>>7137507
Show me one person that went to jail for not paying taxes on crypto gains.

>>7133565
stop panicking OP, your accountant is shit or you are larping. You should be able to ask the IRS for a payment plan.

I currently owe like 30k to the IRS and they gave me 7 years to pay it off

>>7133565
I've been continuously warning you fucks about this and you just said I was "FUDing" .

>>7120104

>>7138235
they only do payment plans if you dont have money to pay

>>7133810
Yeah, people don't realize this but capital gains are calculated yearly

>>7136994
Wow you are actually retarded

>>7135048
UK doesn't have the same law. You pay tax on profits when you cash out to fiat.

>paying short term capital gains on crypto