/biz/ - Business & Finance

youse are shit cunt fuck off

Deluded TRX and XRP bag holders.

Because their internet works only half the time due to dingo and kangaroo interference.

Can't dump if you don't have an internet connection.

And banks don't let you do shit because lolstralia

They're irrelevant. Too few Aussies to make a dent in the market

>>6833884
Sheep shagger detected.

>>6833866
Country has so many actual $ making opportunity, great lifestyle and loose puss that crypto is just a larp for us. Have $100k in XRP, ICX, WTC and NAV... it's dropping and I don't give a fuck.

Just getting fucked up and waiting by my pool for my bird to get home for root and to BBQ some meat. Great country cunts.

PS: WHAT THE FUCK CUNTS IT TOOK ME THREE TRIES TO POST THIS OUR INTERNET IS FUCKED SOMEONE GET THE PM ON THE BLOWER

Hey we have a great community for ALL like minded investors. I’d really like you to contribute as we would appreciate your knowledge.

we’re currently a small group so please give it time. There will be absolutely NO VIP/premium subscription membership b.s . It will be free forever. I want to make it more fun but more crypto oriented - LESS Spam, would you like to join?

i don't care about having 15,000 members, 100 contributing members is enough. i'm only asking people i think will bring value to the community
1
discord (dot) gg "/" WMwVeW5

>>6834146
I am having issues too, you on the nbn?

>>6833915
can confirm

also sometimes the internet signal just falls into the sun so that's a bummer. :/

>>6833866
They aren't. Cunt

>>6833915

>This
Optus HFC network is fucked and shit banks like NAB stealth freezes accounts when we cash out.

Still didn’t sell. It’s too nice here to worry.

MR PRIME MINISTER

i'm holding so i dont get fucked by the taxman

itll go up she'll be right

>>6834422
YEAH APPLE'S CUNT JUST CHUCK HER IN THE UTE.

I'll hodl for 24 years behind 8 locked doors my lads, not even a mild tremor in these strong hands.

Fuckin OAAAATH cunts chuck some fuckin crypto up ya, ya big pack of POOFS

>>6834167
Nah cunt. TPG. Brissy. Who fucken knows.

who /millionaire/ here?

Because no fucken exchanges are accepting PoliPay anymore so all our fiat deposits for quick entry into a dip take a year. Fucking banks, shitty NBN, coons and the fuckhead SJWs around here. Losing money isnt shit compared to those cancers. Go cut up some garden hose, grab an old gatorade, punch some beugs and wait for it all to sort itself out

Austraders master race

yeah nah get fucked

The John Howard era was the best era

Copypasta'd from Zuckbook:

Not my favourite topic to discuss with you all by a long shot, but it's something we all have to face head on roll around to 1st of July.

I was lucky enough to be apart of a call the other day with a well experienced accountant whom also trades in the crypto space and has been able to decipher the ATO's regulations as best as possible into the english language.

Let's me start off with telling you the first thing we should have all done before purchasing Bitcoin (Cryptocurrency), which is setting up a 'Company Trust' to pay ourselves through especially if you are a trader and not just an Investor. This has the best angle at reducing the amount of fiat you owe to the ATO.

Define what type of position you have in the space.
- Trader (Should set up Company Trust)
- Investor (Subject to C.G.T - Capital Gains Tax)

You can be both but the best way to know what category you fit into is by wether or not you play in ALT's or just sit long term in Large Market Caps (BTC / ETH / XMR / LTC / etc).

Setting up a company trust maybe expensive in the beginning but it will save you enormous amounts of money in the future when it comes tax time if you have done very well for yourself!

Okay straight into it...

You should be keeping track of every single trade you make, you can do this with good exchange order books and systems like blockfolio to take to your Tax Agent come tax time... The government will penalise you to the fullest if you can not keep records of your trades even if what you are saying is honest and true they will rob you... hey it's tax it's wrong but they hold the guns!

>Do I pay Tax on the Initial Capital?

No... this money would have already been taxed and come from your savings, if earned this year you will pay income/business tax on your capital.

>>6834650
Top kek thanks cunt

>>6834772
>Do I have to pay TAX if I haven't cashed out into AUD including on-shore exchanges?

Short answer... No. But if you have hedged against the AUD and bought back in then yes you will need to declare that as liquidated position coming tax time! (e.g Bittrex>Coinjar>BTC>AUD>BTC)... That's taxable.

>What is a taxable event? And do I get a 50% offset for holding a coin for longer than 12 months?

Every. Single. Transaction is a taxable event swing/scalp/day traders should have Tax in mind when doing small swings all day as your exchange fee's may end up outweighing the total Tax you owe... Ouch!

Bitcoin>Ethereum>Tron>Bitcoin... That's 4 taxable events so If you ended up holding TRON for 1 whole year then you get 50% off the investment, then you would need to hold Bitcoin for another whole year to get 50% off that investment... Each coin must be held and not transacted for a whole 12months.

>Can I do transactions under 10k non-taxable?

The ATO have made this statement almost a trap for investors and traders... It's simply not true for those investing-trading!

You can buy things with Bitcoin for <$9999 AUD, assuming you go FIAT>BTC>PRODUCT/SERVICE so buying say my course or some gym supplements you won't be paying tax on that at all! Then volatility during that purchase from AUD>BTC>PURCHASE can not be claimed with a capital gain or loss. As for the vendor receiving the money they pay GST on the payment unless they invest it or trade it which it turns into trading/investing tax!

>>6834789
>Living Room Of Satoshi

As there is a trail of money flowing into crypto and then spending it anonymously through living room of satoshi... you still must declare where that money went! If it was direct from fiat>crypto>LROS then it could fall under the above tax free under 10k. But seeing as it's probably from an investment it'll still be declared as a taxable event selling out of that investment!

>Hedging in USDT / CEX.IO (GBP / USD / YEN / etc)

Although you might skip around tax this year and next and next doing this off shore not on home soil / home subsidiary skip around exchange you will still eventually have to pay tax when you do cash out and this will simply accumulate into that cashed out years taxation! Remember each hedge starts the 12 months again.

>What If I am a day trader what kind of tax am I looking at?

Say you are day trading back into AUD quite often and it has taken over as your main income source you can bring tax back down to general income tax. This will work in margins assuming you don't have any other sources of income:

First 17-20k (Tax Free Threshold) [These are estimates]
17-87k - 21%
87-87k - 35%
87k-183k - 39%
183k - ^ - 47%

>No Private Health?

Anyone making over 90k AUD a year will incur a 1-2% tax on top of your required tax! Along with setting up a company trust it would be best to get private health!

>Losses:

Capital Loss is only if you lost your initial investment not the paper gain you made! So you put 10k in, 2k comes out... investors can claim 8k against their capital gains, traders can claim 8k against their salary/business offsets!

Trader: Depending on individual, employment, salary you maybe able deduct losses against your overall tax.

Investor: You can claim 'Capital Loss' but not offset your normal salary / business tax return, only for future capital gain.

>>6834801
>What if I " Lost " my crypto!
You can claim it against capital loss that will down the track reduce capital gain, you can not offset it on your salary tax. However if you " Loose " it... Just remember if you made it big time and want to avoid tax doing so at your own risk, they now have task forces keeping an eye on the big fish in Australia. If you are getting around in a 200-300k sports car with nice big homes and you don't claim your tax they will throw you in a rape cage. Tax evasion is a bigger prison sentence than armed robbery!

If you don't want to pay tax never cash out... you can be transparent with governments let them know what you hold but if it hasn't hit a country centralised bank or holding account then it's as good as xbox game tokens.

That's pretty much what I can remember from the conversation and the notes I have written down hopefully I have covered up some questions and misconceptions!

Set up a Trust, Record your positions, Get a good accountant!

Cheers cunts

>>6834772
>>6834789
just go to fucking NZ and cash out there, fuckin simple. not a chance the aussie government are taking 50% of my gains

This is probably a retarded question, but as a jobless neet with about $1k invested in crypto, do I have to declare taxes or some shit?

I'm constantly trading shit coins and I guess with 30 or 40 transactions over 3 hours I might make $80 or $90.

Am I supposed to declare this shit or do I just ignore everything because I'm too poor for them to care anyways

>>6834830
They will take ur anal virginity then, over 7k transaction/abnormal income and ur bank will flag ur account.

>>6834881
Did u cash out? If u did declare it, if you’re a poor neet with an income below 17k u pay no taxes.

>>6834947
((((they)))) as in the aus government? ill just move to fucking nz then i dont even care, i'm not giving them 50%. 20% i could live with, but 50% is a fucking joke

>>6834830
The problem is Australia will consider your gains realised when you change tax residency and still want their share. Sure you can not tell them but if it's a large enough amount to be worth going to NZ for (and hence too large to just turn into cash and spend) you're probably going to get audited and be fucked hard.

>>6834973
fuck sake

>>6834972
If you’re considering moving to avoid taxes I’m assuming is a large amount, consider moving far away because the kiwis will throw ur body to the ato and they will ravish ur anus.
Do you think they’re retarded? Unless u hold for a year while in NZ they will consider these capitals gains were made in Aus and they will come for you.

>>6834827
so should i be writing down every trade i make pretty much?

at least when Fairx comes online you could sell your shitcoin directly to aud without resetting the clock. I hope

>>6835014
ill hold there for a year no dramas. my portfolio is at about $600k right now but i'm mostly invested in long term projects, i'm done with flipping shitcoins. ill gladly cash 10% of it out and pay 25-50% tax on that and live in NZ for a year to avoid paying 25-50% on my whole stack

>>6833886
My normie mate at work was telling me to buy TRX and XRP

And I did. Feels good knowing I'm gonna make, how about any of you fellas?

>>6835122
You have to pay tax on your entire stack when you leave. If you're going to go to NZ do it now, pay your tax, and then enjoy tax free gains in the future.

>>6835155
Anon your work mate hates you clearly.

>>6833866
Millenials in Australia have no mortgages. It's a depressing display of gambling.

>>6835189
Mate I'm looking for ways to minimise my tax as much as possible (got a million in crypto myself) so I've already sussed this option out.

>>6835155
can't move now, gf is preggo. cant really uproot everything and move just yet, was looking at doing that towards eoy. honestly what gives those cunts the right to take fifty fucking percent? just fuckin pissed because i know im going to have to pay it

>>6834801
aus gov states that if you buy a crypto and it's price appreciates and you sell it into aud, you pay no tax

so piss off dumb cunt

>>6835242
kek no they don't. You don't pay tax if it's a personal use asset, but if you hold it long enough for it to significantly appreciate then they consider it an investment.

>>6835241
Yeah it's fucked, I'm not a fucking hippy so I wouldn't mind paying 20% or whatever, but as it is it's fucking ridiculous. At least the 50% CGT discount is there for my long holds from ICO.

>>6835242
wrong

>>6835258
>>6835304

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made

https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Gen/Tax-treatment-of-crypto-currencies-in-Australia---specifically-bitcoin/

kill yourself

>>6833866
Because

>>6835313
Yes and if you hold longer than a week or whatever you are investing. kys brainlet.

>>6835052
Yeah I’m waiting for solutions to come into market before cashing out, I think we still have a good 1-2 years of crypto bubble, hopefully we don’t have to trade our alts into btc before being able to directly sell, that way the 1 year 50% discount is much easier to obtain.

>>6835353
show proof of this or kill yourself

stop talking out of your ass dumb cunt

>>6834827
Jesus Christ anon! You are a patriot. Thanks for taking the time to transcribe this. Bravo

>>6835390
Dude it's fucking everywhere. Browse here for starters: https://community.ato.gov.au/t5/Cryptocurrency/bd-p/Crypto

>>6835412
>https://community.ato.gov.au/t5/Cryptocurrency/bd-p/Crypto
>providing no proof, just a forum for me to get lost in

ok time to kill yourself now fagget, or give me address

>>6833866

We gotta make it before we get skin cancer cuz

>>6834772
>>6834789
>>6834801
>>6834827

samefag gov employee or larper telling anons to register their investments as a business, as this is the only way for your investments to be taxed

>Disposing of bitcoin acquired for investment

If you have acquired bitcoin as an investment capital gains tax could apply (although see information about using bitcoin for personal transactions). If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made. However, if your transactions amount to a profit-making undertaking or plan then the profits on disposal of the bitcoin will be assessable income. Note: There are no GST consequences where the bitcoin is not supplied or acquired in the course or furtherance of an enterprise you are carrying on.

fucking kill yourself

>>6835530
https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Gen/Tax-treatment-of-crypto-currencies-in-Australia---specifically-bitcoin/#Bitcoinexchangetransactions

from the ATO

>>6833866
I used to like aussies 20 years ago. Now I just turn away when I hear the accent. Don't want them as customers or staff, Literally subpoo tier. Actually wrote to a couple of politicians asking to increase trade tariffs against Australian goods (EU).

>>6835698
too much banter lad? hahahahaha

>>6833866
Fucking Americans waking up rn and BTC is dumping AGAIN. Like fucking clockwork every day retarded burger Amerifat faggots.

They've increased their hand strength by prepping all those emu bills for their women

>>6835698
you sound like a soft cunt

>>6835698
lemme guess, part of the EU

kek you don't even have a country

>>6835698
kek imagine being this jaded. aussie fucked your wife eh?

>>6835698
>Use to like aussie when I was climbing out of my mums womb

You trying to banter with us? Come on then cunt!

>>6835698
20 years ago, fuck off boomer cunt

>>6835933
>you sound like a soft cunt

You sound like a newgen Australian not understanding why you have become global untouchable cancer within two decades. Please remember when you head to the airport. You are not welcome where you are going. Well done.

>>6835988
Because we fuck all your women, we understand mate it's ok you can let it out.

>>6835988
>muh n=1
>i hate aussies, so must the rest of the world

european union boomer fag detected

>>6834801
You're the smartest aussie cunt I read on your forums. Saved. Bookmarked so I can show some normies.

Thanks for this anon-aus m8 - legend.

>>6835988
let's hear your reasoning for that then retard

NBN

>>6835988
too ashamed to even say which europoor country you are from...

>Make mad dosh on Ripple
>shit starts going south
>sell for aud on BTC
>sit here with 21k ready to buy the bottom while the seppos have to rely on tether or eat shit
Feels tops.

>>6836040
enjoy paying tax when you literally legally don't have to
see >>6835530
>>6835551

>>6836088
I'm still not sure if you're memeing or not, surely nobody is retarded enough to believe what you do when all the info is readily available online.

>>6836103
asked for you to show me it, you failed to link it instead showing forum posts with no information

are you a faggot or just stupid?

the ATO says if your investments aren't part of an enterprise to make gains from bitcoin, then no tax inclusing GST is applied to profits and no losses can be claimed

https://www.ato.gov.au/General/Gen/Tax-treatment-of-crypto-currencies-in-Australia---specifically-bitcoin/

>Disposing of bitcoin acquired for investment
If you have acquired bitcoin as an investment capital gains tax could apply (although see information about using bitcoin for personal transactions). If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made. However, if your transactions amount to a profit-making undertaking or plan then the profits on disposal of the bitcoin will be assessable income. Note: There are no GST consequences where the bitcoin is not supplied or acquired in the course or furtherance of an enterprise you are carrying on.

>>6836158
Why should I spoon feed you cunt? It's not my problem when the ATO rapes you. But please tell me why you think you aren't investing in BTC when you literally are?

Make money even in this bear market.

https://discord dot gg/6ddqFHd

>>6834623
Only Straffo would wish he could reverse-project

>>6836201
i tried to help you anon, have fun getting taxed

are hands are strong from holding our babies away from dingos, burgers not so much

>>6836158
>I live in the same country as this retarded cunt.

You're a fucking dickhead.

>>6836330
>doesn't even answer a very simple question
Some people are meant to be poor.

>>6836346
>storing money in btc instead of in the bank is investing

this is your brain

>>6836393
>he thinks he doesn't pay tax on bank interest as well
A-anon...

>>6833866

Because they inherit the market after Americans and Europeans have endured and addressed the mess left by the Orientals and Pajeets.

>>6836415
are you really this retarded, the question was not about bank interest, but what constitutes as "investing as an enterprise"

did you pass year 12?

>>6836448
Dude your argument just then was drawing an equivalence between BTC and banks. Both are investments. I'm actually amazed at how dumb you are, I'm convinced your IQ is below 70.

>>6834972
Fuck off we're full

>>6836486
>dropped on head as a baby

storing money in btc is different from a business of investing in btc

is that clear anon?

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

>>6836516
>puts money in an asset
>receives profits
>thinks he isn't investing and the tax man won't want his cut
It's one thing to be this stupid, but it's a whole other level to not be able to do two minutes' research to discover you're wrong.

>>6834827
IF I HOLD VEN FOR 12 MONTHS -> BTC -> AUD

I HAVE TO FUCKING HOLD THE BTC 12 MONTHS TOO!???!!! WHAT THE FUCK. FairX better be out by then Fuck this country

>>6836557
so what is my business called then anon?

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

>>6836563
No you don't, the VEN to BTC trade is a CGT event and you apply the 50% discount at that point.

>>6836573
You don't need a business to invest, anon. This is how legal terms are constructed.

>>6836593

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

you fell for the (((tax man))) meme
you don't have to pay anything unless you do what this larping anon said >>6834772

>>6836593
oh so i won't be taxed then since i don't have a business of investing

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

>>6836563
You don't need to hold the BTC for 12 months because you only pay the taxes on the profit at the time of transaction.

For example if you have 1000 VEN, which you bought for $5 ea. then sold traded them later on for $20k worth of bitcoin, which you then immediately sell for $20k AUD you've made no profit on the BTC -> AUD trade, so there's no capital gains.

$5k VEN sold for $20k BTC = $15k capital gains
Half that if you've held for a year = $7.5k capital gains.
$20k BTC sold for $20k AUD = $0 capital gains.

>>6836626
>>6836647
I think I'm getting trolled now but oh well. Explain to me why bank interest is taxed even if you don't have a business? I'm 99% sure you won't answer this.

>>6836759
bank interest isn't cryptos darling
>boomer realising the world is different from the one he group up in

it's ok, in time your generation will cark it and be replaced by people who can read

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

i don't have a company, enterprise, trust, business etc. just an australian who has money in btc that went up then sold it back to aud

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

>>6836825
>doesn't answer the question again
I wish I could see your face when you realise you're wrong.

>>6836759
but then again, you are probably one of the gov shills just like >>6834772

AUSSIES!

Are we ready for shopping tomorrow morning?

Going to be so many bargins when we wake up. BTC going under 10k USD when we wake up.

>>6836845
that question has nothing to do with crypto and was only asked (and brought up again) to distract from the fact that i am exposing (((you)))

>>6836845
tell me jew boomer

who falls into the category of non-business investing ?

>If you are not carrying on a business of bitcoin investment, you will not be assessed on any profits resulting from the sale or allowed any deductions for any losses made.

>>6836747
>>6836593
Cheers boys

>>6836897
>The line between personal use and investment can be very thin. It will be difficult to argue that you hold cryptocurrency for personal use if you use it irregularly to purchase goods and services and you made a large gain from holding
https://www.fieldgroup.com.au/how-are-cryptocurrencies-taxed-in-australia-taxing-bitcoin/

pls respond

>>6836960
>who falls into the category of non-business investing ?
People who buy bitcoin to use as a currency on personal use assets (hint: this doesn't include fiat)

>>6834739
Kill yourself you fucking degenerate.

>>6836894
Got my yearly bonus ready to go when we hit the bottom in 2 weeks

>>6837119
>2 weeks
Where are you pulling that one?

>>6837006
>>6837028
>being this retarded in the age of the internet

not clicking your link, that's obvious malware (((fielding))) and trying to collect my user info

>>6837219
His mother's dick

>>6833866
Because they are chinks

>>6837270
kek you were gone a while, I know you read it and got btfo. ggwp now pay your taxes you dumb cunt

>>6833915
yeah this fuckin sucks sometimes the roos bounce to high and hit the innnanet wires