/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>57256263
>price goes up 23%
>btc goes up 0.5%

yep, it's working alright

If the ETF is up 24% why isn't BTC up 24% too?

>>57256277
Because they don't hold the entire supply of btc

>>57256308
As a matter of fact they don’t hold any bitcoins and never will.
>Verification not required

>>57256277
I’m trying to work this out. It could be because blackrock can’t actually start trading and buying the BTC to fund this yet, but honestly I can’t tell what the effect will be.

Does it mean blackrock will buy up to a 23% premium once market opens? Does it mean blackrock will buy the amount of liquidity they’ve received? Does it mean their ETF just has a 23% premium itself because of its greater security/insurance? I can’t see the latter being true, 23% is an extraordinary premium. To my mind this means blackrock will start filling these orders once market opens and that’s when price action will fall into BTC, but how much price action it equals is unclear.

How does blackrock’s ETF even gain price separately to BTC? There aren’t finite ETF tokens are there? Can’t they just sell as many as they want and fill them all? It’s difficult to figure this out esp in pre market

>>57256329
Paper rules the world

>>57256277
BTTC does a better job of tracking spot, very comfy

>>57256330
means people now expect a 23% green dildo on open and when it doesn't come they'll dump it to about 12k

>>57256337
How is that cat so enlightened?

>>57256330
Blackrock owns a large percentage of the top 5 btc mining companies which are traded. They've essentially bought the cow and now have the store to sell the milk. They won't buy it on exchanges like us. As far as the other etfs one has a meme pathetic amount so they need to top up unless they just don't care about seeming legit. Ofc chainlink is the only way to verify if they actually do hold the btc they claim

>>57256330
>Does it mean blackrock will buy up to a 23% premium once market opens? Does it mean blackrock will buy the amount of liquidity they’ve received?
didn't they already buy the btc?

>>57256400
If they had enough BTC then why is the ETF up 23% premarket? This is what I don’t understand, if they have BTC 1:1 ETF who in their right mind is paying 23% premium, unless there’s a supply shock driving up the price which will lead blackrock having to buy more BTC and issue more ETF shares

>>57256330
>>57256420
An ETF is a separate asset with different risk and benefit than BTC. It also is affected by supply and demand of it's own market, it's not going to match bitcoin price 1:1

>>57256368
If blackrock had enough BTC to satisfy the demand of their ETF then why is their ETF up 23%? BTC is 1:1 with the ETF right?

>>57256277

How is the price of the ETF derived?

>>57256420
the stock price isnt pegged to btc price even tho it seems logical for it to be that way since their basket is all btc. investors are not actually buying bitcoin more like a promissory note from blackrock. that being said if the etf price pumps i dont know what blackrock might do in regards to buying more btc

>>57256343
This lmfao. I love all these morons overthinking this shit with their fancy TA to justify their biases. It's very simple:

>number gongup
>number barely went up, dis boring
>can't go up past previous high, I could lose money if I wait too long
>doomp eet.

>At close April 26

What do they mean by this?

>>57256426
>>57256442
Correct, but this is about as pure an ETF as you can get, and the only differences between it and actually owning BTC are the following:
>have to pay a fee to blackrock
>marginally easier to trade due to familiarity with legacy system
>secured/insured more in line with legacy investments
The sun of the above I believe would give the ETFs a slightly more attractive price esp to institutions. That being said, a 23% premium is well beyond what you’d expect for that. If you look at gold for example, the ETF mirrors the price almost exactly, and physical even outshines the ETF even though physical gold is much harder to trade and store.

>>57256442
and because of this, BTC ETF will soon replace the og btc, token not needed. People will start trading just paper btc etfs and the blockchain will be shut down, because it just consumes energy without any benefits. Bitcoin as we used to know it will go to zero.

why does yahoo finance show this as trading since september?

>>57256482
the ETFs are backed 1:1 with BTC though…

>>57256480
the thing you're missing is that it's also traded for speculation. getting in on the ground with the biggest etf is attractive from a purely investment perspective. the likelihood is that it will go up.. not saying it won't dump at some point but fomo is a thing.

>>57256484
Because retards here dont understand this is Btc futures etf, not btc spot etf. Kek, absolute state of biz...

>>57256482
>and because of this, BTC ETF will soon replace the og btc, token not needed. People will start trading just paper btc etfs and the blockchain will be shut down, because it just consumes energy without any benefits. Bitcoin as we used to know it will go to zero.

Found the dirt poor communist faggot.

>>57256263
what does this mean, in dumb anon terms? please explain it to me as if im a 5 year old, or a 80 year old. thanks.

>>57256530
>>57256517

>>57256263
This is how BTC will be rolled into official 401ks. That's where the money will come from, this is BlackRock after all.

Check the inflows over the next few quarters as current 401ks get rebalanced to include this "new asset class" and new ones include it by default.

Now take a look at the trust:
https://www.ishares.com/us/products/333011/ishares-bitcoin-trust

It states only 400k shares outstanding, which should be all of them given it is not officially trading yet, with 228 Bitcoin in the trust. That lines up directly with the market price of the trust premarket, between 20-30 dollars a share. The math all works out, no silver shit going on (yet). This trust will have small impact directly on BTC, but, if BTC absolutely rips, so will this trust. Remember, there are 400k shares, so one could easily get a large stake.

>>57256510
Yes but so is BTC, the only advantages for the ETF are the ones I stated. Those do not warrant a 23% premium v BTC, suggesting there’s a supply shock on the ETF side, meaning blackrock will want to buy BTC & issue more shares until supply equals demand again

>>57256545
Aren’t you missing the fact that if the shares were worth 23% more than the initial listed price, blackrock would have listed them for that to earn more from the sale of those shares. To me this highly suggests the ETF is experiencing a supply shock, which means blackrock will issue more shares to take advantage of this. That means they first need to buy more BTC to back the new shares

>>57256480
There is also (counterparty) risk associated with buying ETF as you do not hold your keys.
We'll see, the market will determine prices but my feeling is, it will trade lower than the bitcoin it is supposed to be backed with, after some initial volatility of course.

>>57256580
you missed my point but thats ok

>>57256525
Imagine being a police officer in New York

Patrolling the city, eating hot dogs, shouting to people with a beooklyn accent, making sure your haircut is always slick
> Ay Tony!
> Whats good Paulie
>Im walking ere!

Coming back to a tiny apartment which you get thanks to support from the gov, and watching TV. What a life

>>57256805
chuds do the same thing in the middle of the woods

bobos have literally 2 hours left to buy under 50k lmao

>>57256517
no, retards (You) here don't understand that it was previously a different ETF that was trading under the same ticker:


MIAMI, April 06, 2023--(BUSINESS WIRE)--The Board of Trustees of ETF Series Solutions, upon a recommendation from Defiance ETFs, LLC, the investment adviser to The Defiance Daily Short Digitizing the Economy ETF (IBIT), has determined to close and liquidate the Fund immediately after the close of business on April 28, 2023. Shares of the Fund are listed on The Nasdaq Stock Market LLC.

Effective on or about April 17, 2023, the Fund will begin liquidating its portfolio assets. This will cause the Fund to increase its cash holdings and deviate from the investment objective and strategies stated in the Fund’s prospectus.

Etf.rocks

>>57256330
First pump it, dumb money gets in, then short it, then dump it. Cake walk.

>>57257017
>The Board of Trustees of ETF Series Solutions, upon a recommendation from Defiance ETFs, LLC, the investment adviser to The Defiance Daily Short Digitizing the Economy ETF (IBIT), has determined to close and liquidate the Fund immediately after the close of business on April 28, 2023. Shares of the Fund are listed on The Nasdaq Stock Market LLC.
kek they got big boi'd by blackrock

>>57256263
This is going to moon violently today, right? Sh...Should I buy in? Will it be grayscale link all over again? Is fink going to have boomers paying 250k a coin for btc?

>>57256277
Welcome to ETFs. We told you btc would become like gold and silver

>>57256263
It's gonna hit $300 eow

>>57256879
You have literally 1 hour left to sell above 40k

wow this thread is stupid. fuck off back to rebbit u braindead buttcoiner fucks. you will be eternally PRICED. OUT. just kidding. heres a sat kid.

>>57256277
It only just came out. These aren't even available to trade on a lot of brokers, and, the US market hasn't even opened yet. You sillies have no patience.
>>57256330
The ETF has a secular premium. As of now that amounts to a tracking error. Premia like that wasn't unusual in the crypto trust products.

>>57257193
yeah, because then we'll be able to sell above 50k only

>>57256263
i wish i wasnt retarded and i could understand this

>>57257134
No, it's been posted elsewhere but the fair market value is currently around $26, so it's only trading on a small premium. The launch price is technically incorrect and that's why you see the big jump in pre-market.

>>57256263
Welcome new generation!!

I'm so sorry you thought that billions of inflows into "BTC" were actually going into BTC and not just IOUs. Watch and see in just 1 hour, as people slowly learn that blockchain BTC doesn't even really exist any more now that there is an easy button entirely funded with tricky IOUs on an exchange. Miners still need to sell, there are no buyers. By about 10am people are going to slowly start clueing in on what this means for actual BTC. I know it's disappointing, there there.

>>57256368
This guy gets it. It’s all about Chainlink PoR

>>57256275
Seriously, how THE FUCK do people not immediately recognize this and see there is a problem?

>>57256805
>90 IQ
Can confirm. I lived in NYC for 8 years. The NYPD are simple gentle people.

>>57256277
all this time crypto cucks saying crypto is far better investment than stocks yet it looks like another W for stocks

>>57256263
2 year high bitches

>>57258037
jfc you're stupid, these ETF dont hold 100% of the btc supply you fucking normie

>>57258335
It should move proportionally with the market based on how much they own, midwit. That's the point. (((ETF))) are designed to fleece simpletons such as yourself.

>>57258037
>>57258386

It's calibrating you fucking moron. All stock is seriously volatile the first time it's issued.

>etf was such a massive success they rushed to stock up on btc
>>57258037
>nyoooo this is unfair
Every big asset will have derivatives. Cry about it piss your pants about it, it's gonna happen. You can't stop it so stop whining

>>57256368
Insidious. That's like giving a bank a money printer to fulfill loans. There is no way this will not end well.

I bought some at 27.50. Was this a mistake?

>>57258386
Who owns the most? Grayscale or Blackrock

>>57259250
why tf would you buy an etf when you can own the actual thing?
Also aren't they backed 1 to 1 with bitcoin? like if they had 1 bitcoin in the fund they would have one share available right worth the same as btc?

>>57258386
>>57258037
Biz is so heavily in denial about this. Btc is going the way of gold and silver. The tail wags the dog from here on out. If BTC wasnt in their control before, it definitely is now.
So many btc maxis dont get how legacy finance works and theyll think I'm a bear based on what I've posted.

why is the ARK etf going for 47?