/biz/ - Business & Finance

PREVIOUS THREAD: >>55870131

START MINING IN P2POOL
>START MINING IN P2POOL
START MINING IN P2POOL
>START MINING IN P2POOL

P2Pool combines the advantages of pool and solo mining; you still fully control your Monero node and what it mines, but you get frequent payouts like on a regular pool.

P2Pool has no central server that can be shut down/blocked because it uses a separate blockchain to merge mine with Monero. There's no pool admin that can control what your hashrate is used for or decide who can mine on the pool and who can't. It's permissionless!

Decentralized pool mining (P2Pool) is pretty much the ultimate way to secure a PoW coin against 51% attacks. Once P2Pool reaches & maintains 51%+ of the total network hashrate, Monero will be essentially invulnerable to such attacks.

Although many inexperienced miners think that bigger pools give better profits, this is absolutely NOT the case. Your profits in the long run depend ONLY on your hashrate, NOT on the pool's hashrate.


>YOU CAN NOW MINE IN P2POOL FASTER & EASIER THAN EVER BEFORE WITH THE GUPAX GUI. USES TRUSTED REMOTE NODES BY DEFAULT!!!!

1. Download the *bundled* version of Gupax for your OS here: https://gupax.io/downloads/
2. Extract somewhere (Desktop, Documents, etc)
3. Launch Gupax
4. Input your Monero address in the [P2Pool] tab. USE A SEPARATE MINING-ONLY WALLET!
5. Select a Community Monero Node that you trust, although you can and should run your own node if possible.
6. Start P2Pool
7. Start XMRig

VIDEO GUIDE: https://gupax.io/guide/

You are now mining to your own instance of P2Pool, welcome to the world of decentralized peer-to-peer mining!

>NOTE THAT DUE TO BOTNET SHENANIGANS XMRIG IS AUTO-FLAGGED AS MALWARE BY MOST ANTI-VIRUSES, SO DON'T FREAK OUT!!!


OLD GUIDE FOR P2POOL MINING FROM THE MONERO GUI WALLET: https://pst.klgrth.io/paste/eecbe

https://www.reddit.com/r/MoneroMining
https://web.xmrpool.eu/xmr-monero-easy-mining-guide.html
https://monero.hashvault.pro/en/getting-started
https://www.supportxmr.com

*****/XMR/ Monero General Info-Dump*****
>*****/XMR/ Monero General Info-Dump*****
*****/XMR/ Monero General Info-Dump*****
>*****/XMR/ Monero General Info-Dump*****


Learn more about Monero's key features and excellent future prospects, have some common misconceptions dispelled and discover the cold hard facts about Bitcoin, Zcash and PirateChain. Also featured is a noob-friendly buying, storage and wallet guide.


>Monero: it's what new Bitcoin users think they bought. Every feature, explained
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org


>Why Monero is so untraceable: a rundown of the powerful stealth tech Monero utilizes
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#MoneroIsUntraceable


>The Writing on the Wall: Monero replacing Bitcoin as the new standard
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#MoneroReplacingBitcoin


>Breaking News: no, Monero still isn't traceable
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org/#RecognizingTraceabilityFUD


>Vaporware: why nobody is worried about CipherTrace's magic crystal ball
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#CipherTraceFail


>Very Clever Math: how we can verify that the XMR supply isn't being inflated
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org/#MuhInflationBug


>Pssst, wanna buy some Monero? Follow these simple how-to guides
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#BuyAndStoreMonero


>Bitcoin: The Original Non-Fungible Token
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#BitcoinBlackpill


>Why Monero is Better than Zcash: the "privacy coin" criminals won't touch
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#ZcashBlackpill


>The Lowdown on PirateChain: why this Zcash clone is considered a scam
https://moneroinfodump.neocities.org#PirateChainBlackpill


>LATEST UPDATES

- added Proof-of-Stake update to Zcash Blackpill
- added list of available desktop/mobile wallets
- expanded all sections with more relevant info, graphics & videos
- added easily linkable headers and sub-headers (link icon to the far right)
- added a new section about traceability FUD

Never forget what this is ultimately all about.

https://anarkio.codeberg.page/agorism/
https://freedomcells.org/

>Help grow the circular Monero economy: buy/sell goods & services with/for XMR!

https://monerica.com/
https://moneromarket.io/
https://www.reddit.com/r/moneromarket/new/
https://kycnot.me/services

>Live off XMR with Cake Pay (now available in 140+ countries!)
https://cakepay.com/

>or with CoinCards (currently US & CA only, UK, EU & AUS coming soon)
https://coincards.com/


>Monero stickers for guerilla marketing
http://monerosupplies.com/

>Buy silver/gold bullion with XMR (US only)
https://monerosilver.com/

>Monero-only VPS hosting
https://kyun.host/

>Buy books with XMR
https://monerobookstore.com/

>Monero-only Airbnb
https://safehouse.homes/

>Win XMR!
https://monero.win/


Say buh-bye to Bitcoin and support the growing number of Monero-only darknet markets/vendors.

# = recently launched, exercise caution

>Alias Market #
>Archetyp
>Asur Market
>Chimera Market
>Cloud Market
>Cypher Market
>Dark Matter
>Darkmoon
>Drugula #
>FilthyFellas
>Gofish Market #
>Mercury Market #
>Pygmalion's Refuge
>Retro Market
>Sonanza Market #
>Squid Market
>SuperMarket #
Links: https://pastebin.com/raw/h4RgmFiB


>LocalMonero is now available on I2P
http://lm.i2p/nojs/


Anonymously exchange BTC for XMR using a reputable darknet service

>Majestic Bank
>Infinity Project
https://pastebin.com/raw/75mVpfED


or a reputable clearnet service

https://trocador.app/en/ | I2P: http://trocador.i2p/en/
https://xmrswap.me/
https://unstoppableswap.net/


>Want to support further development? Donate to the Monero General Fund or MAGIC Monero Fund
https://ccs.getmonero.org/donate/
https://monerofund.org/

>Have a particular set of skills? Join a Monero Workgroup and (potentially) earn XMR!!!
https://www.getmonero.org/community/workgroups/

>Want more Monero-chan? Donate to the Community Art Fund
https://www.monerochan.art/

START RUNNING AN I2P NODE
>START RUNNING AN I2P NODE
START RUNNING AN I2P NODE
>START RUNNING AN I2P NODE


>What is I2P?

I2P is an anonymized P2P overlay network akin to the Tor network but with several key advantages over it. I2P is now replacing Tor as the go-to darknet and will play a pivotal role in growing the Monerocentric economy.


>Why should I care? Why should I run a node?

Increasing shadow economy adoption and the proliferation of an XMR-only standard are what guarantee that XMR will have a floor and won't also crash to zero when the Crypto Casino finally implodes. XMR's long-term outlook is therefore *strongly* correlated with the darknet, you may have already noticed how the number of TXs begins to drop whenever the glowies attack & cripple the Tor network, which underscores just how critical it is that the darknet wins this war against the State. Make no mistake: if the darknet is allowed to die XMR will take a devastating hit as well.

So by running an I2P node you are helping to make the network Monero thrives in that much more robust while also enraging glowies in the process. Win-win!


>OK, but how difficult is it? Do I have to store GBs worth of data like when running an XMR node?

It is literally as easy as installing an Android app and no, there are no storage requirements, the node only consumes some bandwidth.


>Cool, I'm sold. What do?

If you have no interest in browsing the darknet yourself then the simplest solution is to install & run the I2Pd Android app on any compatible (Android 4.1+) device, ideally a TV box since they don't require recharging and are permanently online. But any old phone or tablet is fine too. Make sure you activate "start on boot" in the settings.

https://github.com/PurpleI2P/i2pd-android/releases/latest


Otherwise just install the appropriate desktop client and leave it running.

https://github.com/PurpleI2P/i2pd/releases/latest


The console is accessed via http://127.0.0.1:7070/ or the menu in Android.

>Bitcoin's price = NOT the result of organic real-world supply & demand = NOT sustainable

Wash trading has been artificially driving BTC's insane price action since the first major spike in 2013.

>Wash Trading 101
1. create/maintain the illusion of high volume
2. wait for poor unsuspecting fools to FOMO in
3. dump at a fat profit and leave them holding the bag

When the supply of gullible fools finally runs out, the entire scheme implodes.

TL;DR: exciting price action means nothing in an unregulated market rife with such manipulation, real-world utilization is the ONLY reliable metric of actual value.


>No tail emission = Bitcoin is fucked

Right now, at the current hashrate, miners break even on energy expenses at a BTC price of $22K. Post 2024 halving, that break even point, at the current hashrate, goes up to $44K. If BTC does not go to $44K, miners will be unprofitable and hashrate will have to drop (miners going out of business) to reduce the cost of securing the network, also reducing the security.

If you know anything about the power of 2, you already know that things get very big, very fast. If we’re 3 halvings into 32 total halvings, then the estimated break even point for miners at current hashrate going into the last halving would be:

$22,000 * (2^27) = $2,952,790,016,000 per BTC

$2,952,790,016,000 per BTC * 21 Million total BTC = $62,008,590,336,000,000,000 BTC Market Cap

The block rewards shrink so fast that after enough halvings BTC would eventually require a $2.95 trillion price per BTC and a $62 quintillion market cap to sustain the current cost of $7.15 billion/year.

Even if these numbers were somehow realistic, can you imagine securing a $62 quintillion market cap on only $7.15 billion/year of hashrate? LOL

So basically BTC mining will eventually become so unprofitable the hashrate (network security) will shrivel up UNLESS it is subsidized by BTC transaction fees.

https://cryptostackers.substack.com/p/bitcoin-is-not-a-store-of-value

How would you guys setup auto transfer of daily money deposits through monero?

Like say your getting paid daily in an area away from home and want to have your money in a safe place, do you just go on binance us and pay for monero there, then go on TOR to a crypto mixer thing, send that mixed monero to the cold storage and have someone you trust take care of it from there?

That a good idea?

Reporting in
##################################
Swimng Pool - https://pastebin.com/raw/Mb7Dyg24
IRC - https://pastebin.com/kP1gZ1Hk
##################################
Education - https://pastebin.com/V0SFR8qU
Mining - https://pastebin.com/Rd1V8P5L
Nodes - https://pastebin.com/j6Vv2Xn6

Dead general for a dying shitcoin.

All roads inevitably lead to Bitcoin, its just a question of how expensive that lesson is going to be.

>>55950497
monero is the comfiest hold. bitcoiners are literally retarded still holding their old af crypto that literally doesn't provide anonymity as advertised. people can see your transactions lol. people can see how much money you have.

>>55951496
kek

>>55951496
kek retarded subpoena baggie

>>55951504
k, so I caN SEE the reserves and balances of bankers and politicians alike. No more shadow finance. No more off shore bank accounts? What's the problem here?

>Introducing Neveko: https://github.com/creating2morrow/neveko
>full-stack privacy application with gpg messaging, monero multisig and built-in i2p marketplace
>Still a work in progress, and pretty much an alpha. But run it, and give feedback, file issues---very much appreciated.
>Monero + I2P = ( THE FINAL SOLUTION to the taxman question )

Unfathomably based and agoristpilled. Kudos for going with I2P instead of Tor, this is the way.

Post a reminder in every General, this is exactly the kind of thing the circular Monero economy needs.

>>55952502
>i2p

>>55952523
found the glowNIGGER

>>55952528
he's really mad kek

>>55951725
>imagine being so retarded to believe that bankers and politicians won't have private money like monero offers

>>55950497
moNEGRO - for negros who don't know how to use unlinkability on Bitcoin (how to use coinjoin).
sad

>>55952595
>1. CoinJoin to open channel
pay 10 USD tx fees, no thanks homo
>2. Use Lightning for as long as you need.
Need to have a live server 24/7 that never goes down.
Nil receiver privacy.
Has to "top-up" your channel in order to make bigger payments than your channel capacity
Has to "rebalance" your channels
Has to pay routing fees while doing it
Central hubs probing your ass and your channels.
Chainanalysis is watching you.
>3. Close channel and CoinJoin.
pay 10 USD tx fees, no thanks homo

LN is dead on arrival.
FEDmints are dead on arrival.
Btc is dead on arrival.
Use it as a ponzi scheme that helps you accumulate more XMR on the top of the Bull cycle, or get bust.

You have been warned.

Nah nah we ain't running this nigga shit anymore. Yall gonna start acting like a bunch of grown men and stop posting AI coombait monerochans and start making monero nodes, mining monero, and flipping shit for monero. I don't want to hear none of this bullshit no more "sex with monerochan" "when moon". Yall gonna start moving monero or we going to lose territory. Your crypto territory dont mean shit when you aint selling product. None of this acting hard n shit posting monerochan and getting in fights with other crypto holders, getting banned by janitors, and niggas getting got in the process of a re-up. The shitposts bring the jannies and the jannies bring the bans, meanwhile you got XRP cornerboys claiming your territory cause you can't keep your dick in your pants and gotta act hard on the streets.

>>55953167
>xrp claiming territory
Kek, as if. We have the highest growth in merchant adoption, especially in relation to our market cap and transaction count.

/biz/ is not for productivity and it never has been. But its ideal for sex with monerochan

God, I love XMR, I hope you're buying these dips.

>>55953167
MOOON-ERO!

>new covid variant spreads
>cbdc rollout
>cash gets banned
When darknet grocery stores?

>>55953255
At least the buttcoin moonboys finally admitted defeat and moved on to another coin to shill here

if bitcoin goes to 0 do we have a chance not to drop with it?

>>55953763
Why would btc go to zero in the first place? Likely because some bug in the code which can be exploited. Because monero has a different code base, and uses different crypto, it is a decent technological hedge.

Now if it only goes down by 80%, it will have different reasons, and therefore monero will likely go down as well.

Seems like BITMAIN put a RISC-V chip in one of their frames and is calling it an ASIC.
>https://twitter.com/BITMAINtech/status/1695783295806775605
Any more info on this? From picrel it seems to be some FGPA/RISC-V SoC
>mining multiple cryptocurrencies

>>55953808
And hashrate has been sparadic lately with some spikes, there must be nonce analysis done to see if in fact these went live on the mainnet.
But I'm not sure why would they do this, Monero IS going to hardfork, the Tor project is incorporating a derivative of RandomX called HashX, so we'll see where this goes.
>212K
That means 212KH/S. This is a problem. The account is legit from Bitmain, I've checked.

>>55953875
>hat means 212KH/S. This is a problem.
whats the problem?

>>55953914
That's 2x experimental AMD chips that we have now and far out of the range that a normal desktop can pull off.

>>55953808
Do you think it's a case of risc-v being energy efficient and they stack shit load of these or some fuckery that will get hard forked?
AMD is not stagnating the way Intel did nothing for 5 years.

>>55954012
mm that sucks

>>55953808
Is this legit? I noticed it was an official tweet. Why would Chinkmain chase xmr again knowing another hardfork will make that thing useless?

>>55954217
Looking into the actual numbers, it doesn't seem awfully off. "ASIC" seems to only be a marketing term in this case. This thing has 0.0063 W per H/s and the Ryzen 9 5950X has 0.0045 W per H/s and the top contender AMD EPYC 7T83 has 0.002 W per H/s.
The shear power is more alarming though. Likely case is that they put an array of minimal design RISC-V CPUs together with heating.
>>55954232
Yea it seems legit so far. No actual tests and 3rd party reviews to prove it, but so far it's BITMAIN official.

>>55954012
>>55954283
so if my calculations are correct that new miner equates to making bank?

>>55951496
>>55951725
It pains me to disparage Bitcoin since it was revolutionary and opened the door, but these posts read like delusional levels of cope. Did you never subscribe to the original ethos possessed by most Bitcoiners and then just ignore every other development for the last 10 years?

>>55954319
sure, if you're not european

>>55954334
No? No $7,000 dollar profits everyday?

>>55954343
lol, you need to adjust the power consumption

>>55954343
>212000KHs
Aren't you like 3 decimal places off?

>>55954359
yeah ok that makes more sense

>>55954383
See it's nothing burger.
Just a week of mining and you have 1 free dinner.
Who know what the initial cost will be and the ROI.

>>55954399
thats actually negative
it's negative $2.91. So after a week Monerochan owes me dinner.

>>55954403
Kind of worrisome for the future of the network.

>>55954435
I can't mine anything profitable.
Not Bitcoin, BCH, LTC, Dash or any other coin.
Maybe if I moved to Turkey, China or Mexico

>>55953875
>nonce distribution
So looking into it, it has been discovered 2 YEARS ago. They have been testing this miner for probably nearly 3 years (and let's be honest, with that timeframe, research begun after RandomX went live) and they are barely on par with AMD's efficiency. More of a testament to RISC-V desu. See picrel and the stripes represent ASIC miners who use pseudorandom nonces that leave visible patterns. This is how we caught CryptoNight ASICs originally.
>>55954399
Guassian distributions tend towards reality and people are guessing between 2.5 to 3k USD under the tweet, so it's going to be in that price range. ie, ROI = years if never
>>55954403
With lower power cost it could be profitable, but not by much. And ROI kicks in on these high-hashrate setups.

>>55954466
You'd breakeven in ~1.5 years assuming the $3k unit cost living in turkey. Net a profit of ~$4.85 per day (at current prices)

>>55954435
There's really no way of avoiding consolidation of hashing power with ASICs nowadays. Hobbyist mining or residential scale farming is going to be a thing of the past, not that mining xmr was profitable to begin with, but you're right in that where's there value to be exploited, these companies will stop at nothing to chase it.

<sech1> well, just in case we want to brick this ASIC, I already found an instruction that's available on x86 and ARM (not all x86 and ARM, but many), but 100% is not there on that RISC-V chip.
<DataHoarder> on that risc-v chip?
<DataHoarder> do we know what they have, or custom design? given extensions are plenty
<sech1> If they have risc-v chip, I know what they don't have :P
<sech1> risc-v is an open standard, after all
<sech1> and an instruction I picked, it's not even a finalized draft in risc-v, lol
<sech1> *it's not ratified yet
<sech1> and considering that they physically created their ASICs in 2021... It's 10000% not there
<DataHoarder> yeah, just saying that the standard includes instructions but there are many custom extensions on these risc-v chips out there
<DataHoarder> they probably have none though :D
<sech1> They use RV64GC+Zk at best, which leaves a lot of unsupported instructions
<sech1> RV64GC is a "standard" 64-bit RISC instruction set, Zk is needed for AES (I think)
<DataHoarder> yeah, unless they placed it in the non-standard extension in the "Guaranteed Non-Standard Encoding Space"
<sech1> I bet they used as much standard stuff as possible to reduce costs

>>55954403
1600 watts? Is your cpu an electric heater on full blast? Monero works just fine if we got a bunch of low watt shit miners mining bc “why not” and just like the early days of BTC the miners who sell everyday at a loss are just fuel for the fire, not good users or good profit.

>>55954516
Ok, profitable, but what's the point of this device?

As per >>55954283 just some plain vanilla AMD rings will give you much higher energy efficiency and thus higher profit.

The only thing that the Bitmain device has maybe going for it is that it would be relatively cheap for 212khs, if it only costs 2800 bucks.

For the same money I can only get half the khs on the used market. Namely 4 full Ryzen 5950x PCs.

That said these PCs would look pretty cool as they used to be all enthusiast PCs . Also they can be used for many more things than just mining Monero and also probably will have much more predictable and stable resell value.

That said the best Monero rig is the hardcore AMD rig that you already have and use for other things than just mining. Then the ability to mine XMR is just a free cherry on top.

Seems like Monero community had known about these since 2021 when certain patterns in the mining of XMR emerged. However, they originally suspected data centers with Xenon CPUs.

Bitmain was also nice enough to test them for 2 years and are only now selling them off.

>>55955871
Im not arguing pro or con

>>55955871
It's also worth noting that mining companies often make deals with power companies to use their excess supply and throttle usage in response to grid demands. It may be that mining companies can buy up a bunch of these, power them for free via subsidies, and also corner the Monero hash rate (which institutions may want to do anyways, for reasons besides profit).
It's at this point that the price (miner revenue, security budget) of Monero becomes important. Since that determines whether individuals can afford to compete with large scale mining operations. Otherwise institutional capture becomes inevitable.

>>55956472
This is why you should have just accepted an ASIC algorithm in the first place.

They're going to play this game and out compete small fry until it hits moore's law.

>>55958208

lol this shit isn't an ASIC and doesn't confer any meaningful advantage over existing commodity CPU hardware, observe how nobody is particularly impressed or worried.

RandomX remains rock-solid.

>>55958305
As I previously mentioned:
1 - mining companies don't have to worry about power efficiency as much due to all the subsidies they've been handed, subsidies smaller miners don't have access to.
2 - it's a lot easier for them to have racks and racks of miners that can be immediately relocated and activated than it is for them to fiddle with putting together and managing a hundred different motherboards lying around
3 - Even if they aren't more efficient now, a dedicated machine that cuts out all unnecessary pipelines (e.g., graphics) will eventually be better than a general-purpose computer. If Bitmain is selling these machines now, it means they already have a better machine to replace it.
4 - state actors probably have incentive to capture Monero's hash rate, even if it isn't financially profitable

>>55954324
Bitcoin is a captured and controlled parody of itself now. It deserves all the disparagament it gets and more.
Maxipads are just further proof of this.

How do you feel about samourai wallet bending the knee to XMR?

>>55955289
Imagine if she worked out then ripped my dick off with those insane arms.

>>55959023
And then she starts opening her mouth and those teeth are even longer than they look and she just swallows your whole nutsack and dick like a snake eating a mouse, but starts swallowing and now your heels are touching the back of your skull and your spine is broke as she starts crunching upwards and blood and all kinds of stuff is getting messier and messier but your still clean up top and conscious til she gets to your lungs and then you hear a pop and balloon leaking noise before you can't breathe and it all fades to dark as she looks you in the eye and continues swallowing.

>>55958642

Mining companies have to contend with the very real possibility of Monero being outlawed at some point, which would obviously make mining XMR illegal and restrict the importation/replacement of dedicated mining hardware.

They also have to contend with the very real possibility of a future upgrade rendering their dedicated hardware worthless, the devs are already looking at possible ways to cripple or outright brick this "ASIC" as seen here >>55955289

They might also not be keen on having botnets as competitors.

So for-profit mining companies are going to have to think long and hard about the risks involved and if they're even worth it.

Meanwhile, the pool of potential Monero home miners = literally every household in the developed world. A darknet-enabled Gupax configuration would make it easy for anybody to mine *anonymously* on *existing* hardware without needing to download the blockchain.

Remember that normies have been happily donating CPU cycles to worthy causes for years now, so as XMR becomes something more and more people need and depend on we can expect to see a corresponding increase in such charity-driven mining, especially if its culturally encouraged. A little bit of hashrate individually eventually adds up collectively.

https://robots.nootrix.com/news/donate-cpu-cycles-help-scientists-solve-worlds-biggest-problems/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_volunteer_computing_projects

>>55959013
So how is this bad?

When will you stupid niggers finally comprehend that Bitcoin cannot be outgunned by an altcoin, especially one that can have its key features duplicated by coinjoin and LN.

And lets not even mention the network effect.

>>55959192
>>55952610

>>55959077
>donate-cpu-cycles-help-scientists-solve-worlds-biggest-problems
let's donate cpu cycles to solve the government problem :D

>>55959077
They don't outlaw something if it can be used, owned, or co-opted. And Monero's hash rate is already more centralized than Bitcoin, despite randomX, and despite everyone owning a computer.
Relying on a cyperpunk fantasy scenario, or charity, or another hard fork isn't going to overcome the profit motive, nothing overcomes it. If Monero becomes more needed, it'll go up in price, making the profit motive for mining & asic companies even stronger. And electricity is only getting more expensive for normal people, while mining companies keep receiving more subsidies.

>>55959013
>bending the knee to XMR?
tf does that even mean?
more surprised about how confrontational the tweet seems to be. but maybe they are always like this, i wouldn't know.

>>55959077
kek thats my setup. Funny you'd mention darknet mining because that's exactly what those machines are doing.

>>55959192
Seems like darkweb merchants think otherwise

>>55959192
>outgunned by ETH in number go up
>outgunned by XMR in darknet adoption
network effect is all bitshit has left at this point, and will bleed out in time

>>55959192
>>55961859
Network effect goes for all chains. But has Bitcoin reached a critical mass, a point of no return?
Far from it. It's as vulnerable as myspace.

any reason NOT to run p2pool with `--light-mode --no-randomx --no-cache`? No difference in hashrate, but huge RAM savings. I'm guessing it might only matter for huge hashrates?

>>55961906
if you still think bitcoin is tech, you'll be doomed to hold your depreciating altcoin bags forever.

there's a reason bitcoin mixers and tornado cash never had high valuations or any valuation at all.

also note gentoo miners.
If xmrig crashes the moment it connects to p2pool, build xmrig with clang instead.
Don't know if it's related to the infamous 1st gen Ryzen hardware bug that generates internal compiler error in gcc, but the same workaround applies:
https://bugs.gentoo.org/724314#c218

>>55962222
Bro idgaf about you or your opinion.
If you want to convince someone so badly, talk to darkweb merchants and convince them they're better off using Lightning and Coinjoin.
Go pay your capital gains taxes you cuck.
IRS Cocksucking faggot.

>>55959077
just tried buying my own plushie.
while the transaction was confirmed on the chain, the website closed the order after like an hour without confirming they got the money, saying 0 XMR were paid.
probably gonna send an email tomorrow.

>>55954217
>>55953875
>>55954012
These things aren't even as efficient or as powerful as stuff we have now, the only thing that can be said about them is that they are more compact. There's no way in hell they will be able to compete in price if the main draw is size, because the heat that all that hash will generate in such a small package will probably kill the hype when it effects machines next to them.

>>55958929
What proof is there that bitcoin is completely centralized i mean the asics are maybe controled by state powers like in venezuela but for example the hash rate competition between russia and the usa has only increased with time

>>55962849
>What proof is bitshit centralized
>asics are controled (sic) by state powers
>Admits that the only people who can compete hashrate are publicly funded nation states.
How did you find this place?

>>55962921

>>55962993
>Thinks pools own the hashrate they're on
>Think pools
>Pools
Why do you think they're called pools, retard? 2miners has a monopoly on BTG hash, so naturally you hear about how they constantly 51% attack the network and crash its price is zero, right? I see those charts every day, faggot. Nanopool couldn't get past 40% even if they ran it as a charity, as certain miners pay for the pleasure of having their hash turn into stable payouts.

>>55959192
Network effect is an effect and not a determinant, it can and has been overcome by Monero. Network effect is simply the effect that people prefer accepted and used stuff over the opposite, but it does not mean they will not switch.
>>55962993
>>55959333
If you take controllable and surveilled hashrate, Monero is much more resilient then Bitcoin. Also this doesn't change the fact the introduction of ASICs will make a network weaker. As a network gets bigger, the hashrate will increase alongside it, ASIC resistant hashing algorithms will avoid what BTC's hashrate has done.

>>55964237
>if you redefined your terms to suit my own ends, Monero wins
Bitcoin miners make $30.5 million a day, 415X more than the $73.5k made by Monero miners, a massive incentive. ASICs allow Bitcoin to wield electricity and hardware demand to rival entire countries, another massive incentive. Bitcoin is about wielding maximum power, the power to change the state. It's Bitcoin that's changing the state, not the other way around.
Settling for drug markets and at-home CPU miners is fine. But it's not where the big societal changes are happening.

>>55964473
bitcoin is so innovative when its only purpose is to have a fake inflated price to swap into monero to be able to use it, how much longer can something like that last

>>55964473
>Bitcoin miners make $30.5 million a day, 415X more than the $73.5k made by Monero miners
The fact that you're quantifying gains in dollars is exactly why you don't understand anything that's happening here

>>55964473
>Bitcoin is about wielding maximum power, the power to change the state.
What the fuck does bitcoin do?
Only narrative left is NGU and it's not even good at that.
Fucking cyberhornets I swear.

>>55964521
>>55964524
>>55964538
Imagine Monero flipped Bitcoin and became the #1 cryptocurrency, greatest market cap, volume, userbase, everything. Do you really think world governments, industries, blackrock, would all sit by and not get a slice of the action? No, they'd get involved and it'd be proof that Monero worked, that it was absorbing finance, not that it was being co-opted.

And now we have states and world governments incentivizing Bitcoin miners, it being accepted as legal tender, entire nuclear power plants being dedicated to Bitcoin mining, banks and blackrock going from shitting on it for years to bending the knee, and you still can't figure it out beyond "it's fake, it doesn't count, I need to be a contrarian to feel special"

>>55964473
Network security is directly correlated with token price. And turns out when you normalize for hashrate, Monero is orders of magnitudes more expensive than that of Bitcoin.
>It's Bitcoin that's changing the state, not the other way around.
Sweet summer child. Read the OP, but in case you need reminding. Feel free to use a copypasta as well.
>there are OFAC compliant blocks in the chain
>there are state mined blocks in the chain
>China ban took out roughly half of your hashrate
>Bitcoin is overwhelmingly tracked by chainanalysis companies and the rest is blocked
>over 90% of coins in existence have been KYC-d at least once
>large financial institutions are buying "virgin bitcoins" for a 20% markup
>the vast majority of BTC mining is under direct State watch
>BlockStream directly paid off u/theymos to control BTC discussion before the most important HF and proceeded to DoS nodes that didn't agree
>LN Labs is a WEF associate
>over 99.9% of BTC nodes run the same node software that is controlled by a handful of public figures
>LN is over 99% custodial and hubs own over 60% of the network's liquidity and a similarly large share of channels
>the rollout of Bitcoin in El Salvador has been done through a State-managed custodial application that freezes funds and blocks transactions with other non-approved wallets
>development on the BTC software has been non-existent since Satoshi left

The State is not your friend, its monopoly over legal tender is perhaps its single most important monopoly of all. It will undercut anyone that threatens that monopoly. At first BTC was truly uncontrollable, private, digital cash, run by some unknown person. Nobody to submit legal complains to, nobody to ask to censor transactions. No devs on taxed payrolls and no large custodians with incorporated LLCs. For that time, Bitcoin was the drug dealer's money, hosting CP. But that changed. It's not a competitor anymore, it's an alternative that is fully coopted and integrated.

>>55964657
Anyone who resorts to "sweet summer child" in an argument is a massive midwit. And your cope pasta and math gymnastics don't change the facts that Bitcoin commands the most power and institutions are changing to suit it, not the other way around. If they were winning, Bitcoin and Monero wouldn't exist.

And the state is just the state, neither friend nor enemy. We've grown up in the fiat era so have always experienced it as the enemy. But take fiat away and it starts serving human interests, it doesn't just disappear.

>>55964764
>And the state is just the state, neither friend nor enemy.
This shows that you don't get it.

The state is the enemy. It is literally a gang of criminals that has psyop'd the population it leeches off of that its rule is legitimate. Information is extremely valuable to the state, handing all of your financial information over to everyone with an internet connection, not to mention the state that rules over you, is extremely foolish. With that information they can put you in prison for making a purchase they don't like, or extort money from you for the crime of earning it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbNFJK1ZpVg Maybe this will help illuminate things.

>>55965041
The state created Hoover Dam, the Pyramids, the Saturn V rocket, and put a man on the moon, projects that wouldn't have existed without a "the state". But it also created the debt-based fiat system we all live under and is responsible for countless wars.
It is currently evil due to poor incentives, incentives Bitcoin is trying to fix, rather than abandon it for anarchy. But just because the current state is so broken doesn't mean every state throughout history is an enemy.

>>55959333
>They don't outlaw something if it can be used, owned, or co-opted.

Monero is already soft-banned in Australia, Japan and South Korea. Privacy coins in general are particularly disliked by governments due to their crime-enabling properties so a more widespread ban in future isn't at all an unreasonable expectation.

>Relying on a cyperpunk fantasy scenario, or charity, or another hard fork isn't going to overcome the profit motive, nothing overcomes it.

lol Monero mining hasn't been profitable for years yet the hashrate hasn't death spiraled. Turns out having an ideologically-driven userbase has its perks: miners willing to donate CPU cycles for a cause they believe in no matter the price or market sentiment.

>making the profit motive for mining & asic companies even stronger.

there are no ASICs for RandomX. And as mentioned, the hardware that Bitmain just released confers NO meaningful advantage over existing commodity CPU hardware, the devs literally don't care enough to tweak anything yet.

>And electricity is only getting more expensive for normal people, while mining companies keep receiving more subsidies.

Cool, they can continue trying to outhash botnets and a growing ideologically-driven userbase with unimpressive hardware that could be crippled/bricked at any moment.

>>55964764
The State does not serve your interest, it serves its own interest. And the monopoly over money is the pillar of the modern State allowing unprecedented intervention into large economies. Also repeating your point isn't going to change anything. There is no such thing as the State accepting another independent, thus competing money.
>>55965133
The products of slavery and theft are truly marvelous. Imagine if the State confiscated all wealth in America and piled it up. It would be a true work of art showcasing the achievements of this country. But no, the State does not create, at best it uses stolen money to pay the private sector to create something it so desires. They are either profitable and thus would exist without the State (see Elon's space adventures) or they aren't and just a waste of money (the wast majority of cases).

>>55964473
>ASICs allow Bitcoin to wield electricity and hardware demand to rival entire countries, another massive incentive. Bitcoin is about wielding maximum power, the power to change the state. It's Bitcoin that's changing the state, not the other way around.

Holy shit, this is comedy gold! The State totally lives in fear of industrial-scale mining operations that have to ask for permission in order to: set up shop, get plugged into the power grid and import ASICS from China. Indeed, the State is absolutely terrified of these ruthless BTC mining cartels that now feel forced to lobby politicians for concessions and more favorable treatment.

>Settling for drug markets

Black market commerce is permissionless and immune from State interference. The global shadow economy is worth literally TRILLIONS of USD.


>and at-home CPU miners is fine.

Anonymized home mining on general-purpose CPUs is permissionless and immune from State interference.

blablabla we are better than Bitcoin but worth 25x less. Money talks, niggers
I am frankly disappointed in the state of this thread and how its a bunch of bitches bitching about Bitcoin. Bitcoin and Monero have different, storied histories and are both vastly superior than hordes of endless shitcoins.

>>55966457
yes money talks, you invested in an overinflated asset and we invested in a undervalued asset

meaning you will lose money and I will win money

>>55966508
Low quality bait, or some sort of Columbian Pajeet hybrid. The power of the world wide web, ladies and gentleman

>>55966626
Haven't you seen these threads? 24/7 Bitcoin cope fest. I'm sure they're Mexican.

>day 6 million of the monero gui wallet from the arch repo not working with my trezor.

>>55962716
> the heat that all that hash will generate in such a small package will probably kill the hype

Yes, mining (any computer work, really) is all about efficiency. ASICs didn't need to 'compete' with other silicon, so they ended up creating their own market. However, to mine RandomX, you need to meticulously design every aspect affecting efficiency to contend against the toughest server providers. Assuming they manage to do that and create CPUs better and more efficient than the entire industry has produced so far, why on earth would they mine XMR? There are countless other use cases to generate greater profits with CPUs. If their design truly stands out, they can begin supplying CPU silicon to server farms and even desktops as well.

>Trusted technology, growing adoption

Zcash was launched by one of the most respected technical teams in the world.

Zcash is the 'https of blockchains,' protecting your freedom to save and spend as you like.

Zcash was the first project to implement zk-SNARKs, a novel form of zero-knowledge cryptography that gives its users the strongest privacy available in any digital currency.

Multiple, independent organizations are funded to innovate on Zcash.

Zcash is already available on top exchanges, digital wallets and a growing number of applications.

This is what Monero chuds dont want you to know.

Buy Zcash if you actually want to make it.

Fun fact: Monero devs have to steal Zcash's superior tech in order to stay relevant.

We all know who did ZK first and best.

>>55966763
RandomX doesn't cover every possible task and operating that a general purpose CPU has to cover, only a subset of operations that are reproducible across architectures. A manufacturer should be able to optimize for it over ordinary CPUs.

>>55966833
*task and operation

>>55965312
Again your misrepresenting the argument dipshit. It's not about coercion or forcing the state. It's about incentives and the state changing because that's where the money is. Because even they realize the USD fiat system is bankrupting itself and can't last forever.

>>55966801
>>55966813
>>55966829
>picrel
Friends dont let friends buy whatever the fuck shitcoin that is

>>55966626
>>55966738
ad hominem instead of argument, if you cared about money you would invest in monero, if you want to get dumped on then invest in bitcoin

>>55966833
Yes and then what happens after that? A bounty gets listed at the link below and gets tons of funding for a fork which slightly tweaks the algo to fuck over the new ASIC miners.
https://bounties.monero.social/

>>55966970
Your Shit's All Retarded b.

>>55951029
>then go on TOR to a crypto mixer thing
This step is completely unnecesary

>>55955871
>Ok, profitable, but what's the point of this device?
Grifting mining junkies and bootstrapping RISC-V chip production for someone I'd guess

>>55962180
>I'm guessing it might only matter for huge hashrates?
Somewhat, light-mode makes it quite more expensive to verify hashes but it's still orders of magnitude less than mining, no-cache iirc loads the remote node more by not keeping some of the latest blocks locally
no-randomx is quite a lot more important since it offloads hash verification to the monero node, if you're using a remote node it will definitely hurt you and the node
If you're using your own locally hosted node that's a good config, otherwise I'd only keep light-mode

>>55967117
ad hominem, it's ok loser, you can't win

>>55967538
You are screeching this word, I don’t think you know what it means. You are unable to construct an argument to argue against

>>55967378
thank you, that makes sense. Yeah, i run my own node, cpu utilization of both monerod and p2pool with 2 machines mining is low too so looks like i'm fine.
In this setup they only take ~520MB of resident memory together, which is great. Easily fits on SBC like RockPro64 with lots of memory to spare for other 24/7 services.

>>55966896

The State doesn't give a shit about Bitcoin, hence CBDC Fedcoins.

>>55951029
Wtf are you talking about, just get xmr to your personal wallet. You are done

>>55970001

It really is that simple.

Reminder that moonfags get the rope.

>>55967615
another ad hominem

>>55974003
>Reminder that moonfags get the rope.

Unfathomably based.

have any of you bought gold and silver using monero? if so where? I'm in europe and I did check monerica and there are two sellers there but I can't find any recent vouches

>>55976414

Try here: https://www.suissegold.eu/en/

>>55976530
I know of this site but I don't know anyone that ordered from them

>>55950531
cypherpunks underestimated the IQ of the population. if only i had i time machine i would go back to 93 and tell them about 2023 and zoomers and iphones.

>>55974003
Thread almost 404s, OP switches to new ip and posts meaningless copypastas statement
>>55975263
Almost dies again, switches back to old IP to reply with a non-answer
>>55976244
Switches back to original IP to reply to himself
>>55976414
Thread almost dies again, new 1pbtid IP, asks himself the same stock beginner question for the 100th thread in a row
>>55976530
Back to original IP to reply to himself
>>55976648
Continuing to drum up fake engagement

These threads are sad

how reliable is localmonero's cash by mail? Is this the most private method for acquiring xmr?

what kind of setup do I need if I want to mine 10+ XMR per month. Electricity is included in my rent so is not an expense

>>55976696
I spoke to one of the original cypherpunk manifesto authors at Thotcon this year. He basically agreed and said we need to make spoofing advertiser/tracker data the next form of privacy software, something people can run on a rooted phone.

>>55977818
are you implying you'll be able to get away with using that much power and no one noticing

>>55977818
I would say the currently most efficient way to turn electricity to xmr is to grow weed or something and sell for xmr.
Monero mining is joke see >>55954383

>>55978000
Cloomed

>>55978085
100 Checkems scheduled for deposit

>>55962267
Thank you fellow Gentoo retard

helmo, /XMR/ general... whre do eye bye dis frum?
ned 2 ad 2 curr 4 betr *purr*furmnce
:D

I'm planning to swap my BTC for XMR on a non-KYC exchange, then send the XMR straight to a KYC exchange (like Kraken)
is there a way for the KYC exchange to know where these XMR come from? like "oh hey those XMR you just sent to your account have been swapped from BTC, and those BTC came from this place..."

also have you ever been scammed on LocalMonero? what are some tips to avoid getting chargebacks 2 months later from the buyer who wired me money to my bank account after I sold him XMR?

>>55977818
you'll not be able because someone will see how much electricity you use
but anyway 10 XMR per month is around 1500$ per month
to net that with free electricity you need around 1500 kH!
To give you an idea with the latest intel i7 you mine around 10kH, so you would need 150 of these at 400$ (60k$ investment without even mentioning motherboards, psu and such)
basically forget it anon, mine with your computer only

>>55979508
for the first part of your question they have no way to know. especially if after the swap you move these monero to an other wallet and then sent them to kraken.
problem is depending on the amount they might ask you how you got these coins and to show them proof

>>55979537
>especially if after the swap you move these monero to an other wallet and then sent them to kraken.
understand thank you. but why would I need to send the swapped XMR I received to another Monero wallet before sending them to the KYC exchange?
since the swapped XMR I'm receiving are also coming from another guy Monero wallet, does that make any difference?

>problem is depending on the amount they might ask you how you got these coins and to show them proof
what do you think is the amount threshold before they will start asking questions? $500 worth of XMR? $1K? $5K? $10K?

>>55976707
what

Its over. Midwittero is the only coin going down now lmao

>>55979777
Woah blessed trips confirms it

>>55979777
yeah what's up with that

>>55979568
>but why would I need to send the swapped XMR I received to another Monero wallet before sending them to the KYC exchange?
they can't but it's mostly for security purpose. maybe one day the non KYC exchange will have a breach and the trade history will show
there is no reasons it happens but better be skyzo than having problems. sending to a new adress is easy

>what do you think is the amount threshold before they will start asking questions?
honestly absolutely no idea, other anons should know better than me about that but I guess that beyond 5k$ they might start to ask questions, even for less like 2k. They might ask you how you bought them, to send them proof and such... I guess it depends on several factors, how much you use Kraken in the past, your verification level and such

>>55979777
look at the 90 days return and compare that to other crypto please

>>55979831
thanks a lot this makes more sense now.
what you said about the probability of KYC exchange raising questions and maybe freezing my account is why I've considered selling on non-KYC
the problem is I might risk getting scammed much more easily there than on Coinbase or Kraken...

>>55980262
i don't think youll be scammed especially if you don't all in with several thousands but go little by little and by using "trusted" swap services like the ones listed on monerica.com
what I would fear the most is to exchange my xmr for BTC or other crypto and end up with tainted coins that you can't use
in the end, what do you want for your xmr? fiat or other crypto? your strategy is different considering that

>>55980337
>what I would fear the most is to exchange my xmr for BTC or other crypto and end up with tainted coins that you can't use
I mean this is only a problem if you intend to send the BTC on a KYC exchange right?
I never heard any story about a merchant refusing someone's BTC because they look tainted

>in the end, what do you want for your xmr? fiat or other crypto? your strategy is different considering that
I want to sell the swapped XMR for FIAT

>>55980846
Yes your problem of tainted coins will mostly be about KYC exchanges. I don't think merchant could be a problem but you never know how they work before sending them your coins...

if you want XMR for fiat then indeed there arent a lot of choices out of Kraken. Refer to the monerica link I provided, there are other less known CEX that accept monero
anyway there are risks in both ways:
you send xmr and they ask proof for it or you cant trade/withdraw
you exchange xmr for btc/eth... and you end up with tainted coins

i would personally (dont listen to me) try to swap my XMR for LTC (i believe they are less tainted but i cant vouch for that), move them around a bit (maybe even with mimblewimble) and send them to a CEX for fiat

i think you need to wait for other anons to describe their experiences with kraken and monero when making a deposit of several thousands

>>55981078
thank you for all your tips
>if you want XMR for fiat then indeed there arent a lot of choices out of Kraken. Refer to the monerica link I provided, there are other less known CEX that accept monero
what about localmonero.co? they are listed on monerica and kycnotme and they seem pretty popular

>>55981323
you can try that but it all depends on how your bank will react from a bank wire from abroad and how much
ot you can go with cash by mail, but i guess you understand the risks

>>55979619
Watch the catalog, every time the thread comes close to 404ing a new IP bumps the thread with some meaningless comment.

>>55981479
how is asking where to get gold a "stock beginner question" when there has never been a real answer that's not the same site with no real vouches for it

>>55964598
>Imagine Monero flipped Bitcoin and became the #1 cryptocurrency
I can't imagine this scenario happening under any circumstances. The old fiat system is a private ledger and it would make absolutely no sense to move from a private ledger to another. This doesn't mean Monero can't hold second position, because in some weird world you could have state actors use public ledgers (eg. Bitcoin) and common citizens could use private ledgers (eg. Monero).

Generally I think Monero is a huge gamble with little reward. As it is, it absolutely relies on its privacy features without which it's just another alt. If its privacy features are ever compromised it would be catastrophically for the currency. And the thing I ask myself is how is it that Tornado Cash developers were arrested, detained and charged meanwhile Monero devs appear to be untouched. Something doesn't sit right with me.

>>55981579
according to some stuffs I read there is a difference between building a private protocol (like PGP, ssl...) and creating something made to basically launder money

>>55976707
>These threads are sad

lol says the autistic faggot diligently 'connecting dots' on an Afghani goat milking forum.

Monero is going to pump so fucking much when CBDCs come into play and we go cashless.

The trillion dollar black market that functions almost entirely on cash right now is going to need Monero

>>55981579
>The old fiat system is a private ledger and it would make absolutely no sense to move from a private ledger to another.
Brainlet take. Nobody will give up private ledger. In fact being private is mandatory for anything that can be called currency. Therefore if any crypto will succeed in a real wold and I'm not talking about pump and dump ponzi schemes, it will be the one that is private(and currently there is only one)
>state actors use public ledgers (eg. Bitcoin) and common citizens could use private ledgers (eg. Monero).
Oh yeah gubmint will publish their every deal(cause they just feel like being the good guys) while letting the little guy having switz bank account. Oh and they will also use btc instead of literally any other way to do it.
And I thought xmr people very delusional.

>>55981579
>I can't imagine this scenario happening under any circumstances

lol it is literally happening RIGHT NOW in the very darknet economy Bitcoin spawned and dominated for 10 long years. Just 5 years ago maxi faggots were confidently mocking the "delusional" idea of a Monero-only economy, now we're more than halfway there. BTC just keeps on bleeding more and more market share to Monero, we're basically witnessing the slow death of "muh hardest money ever created" in the most laissez-faire free market in existence.

The lesson here: maxifags really suck at anticipating future outcomes based on developing trends. Maxifags would have you believe that BTC losing the darknet to an altcoin doesn't really mean anything and it absolutely positively does not endanger BTC's position elsewhere because privacy, fungibility and low fees only ever matter in the shadow economy and will never, ever become mission-critical features anywhere else. lol


>The old fiat system is a private ledger and it would make absolutely no sense to move from a private ledger to another.

Note how the maxifag suggests that banking privacy is an outdated concept and that the future is actually in transparent accounts with user balances on full public display. How much copium do you need to be hopped up on to say something like this?


>This doesn't mean Monero can't hold second position because in some weird world you could have state actors use public ledgers

Here we see the maxifag actually suggesting that global state actors will relinquish their respective monopolies on money (and Fedcoins) in favor of a clunky & slow append-only db that the most pragmatic market in the world has already rejected.


>As it is, it absolutely relies on its privacy features without which it's just another alt.

- tail emission
- ASIC resistance
- adaptive blocksize

>Monero devs appear to be untouched. Something doesn't sit right with me.

It would appear that you were deprived of oxygen at birth.

>>55981970
>Brainlet take. Nobody will give up private ledger. In fact being private is mandatory for anything that can be called currency. Therefore if any crypto will succeed in a real wold and I'm not talking about pump and dump ponzi schemes, it will be the one that is private(and currently there is only one)
How would a private ledger help the real world economies? Go on, I'm listening.
>Oh yeah gubmint will publish their every deal(cause they just feel like being the good guys) while letting the little guy having switz bank account. Oh and they will also use btc instead of literally any other way to do it.
An absolutely naive take on how the world works. There never was a question of good or evil. Take for example the states' insistance on transitioning from gasoline-operated cars to electrical. This campaign to push for green energy can be viewed as good-natured, at least dumb common folks are inclined to believe this. They really believe it's for their own good, for the planet's good, failing to realize there may be ulterior motives behind. So yes, as was aptly demonstrated, governments can push "better" norms but for entirely the wrong reasons (ulterior motives). Unless you honestly thought that governments are giving you 12k to buy electrical cars so we can save the planet and live green. Don't be stupid. There's no reason why the government can't adopt a public decentralized ledger and a private one for personal spending, because it benefits it in ways that you can't understand. The government is always several steps ahead of you. You're always the last one to get the news.

>>55982200
>lol it is literally happening RIGHT NOW in the very darknet economy
Stopped reading there, I see you're not serious about this discussion. Muh darkness economy is pocket change in the grand scheme of things. Take care.
>It would appear that you were deprived of oxygen at birth.
What's your excuse for debating like a room temperature IQ retard?

>>55982258
>Stopped reading there, I see you're not serious about this discussion. Muh darkness economy is pocket change in the grand scheme of things. Take care.

Nice try. Its the principle of the matter, retard: the "hardest money ever created" absolutely should not be losing dominance in the freest market in existence. End of fucking story.

>What's your excuse for debating like a room temperature IQ retard?

"I can't actually refute anything so I'll just talk tough instead."

>>55982227
Something like XMR will always exist because glowniggers always need some private way of moving their money around, and hiding in the mix of normals using it too is the easiest way to stay hidden. Same reason TOR is still around, which by the way started as a glownigger project but they let us use it because otherwise it's ludicrously easy to pick them out by sniffing packets
>>55982258
>Muh darkness economy is pocket change in the grand scheme of things.
It's a multitrillion dollar market, anon. If tomorrow FAGMAN announced they're not going to use US dollars anymore and everything (including payroll) is moving to another currency that it wouldn't have a huge effect on the broader economy?

>>55982347
Tor’s built in PoW DDOS protections sounds better than the fucking http internet. And monero is the currency of tor as we know. Exactly how bullish this is for Monero is not talked about imo.

>>55982227
>How would a private ledger help the real world economies?
As I said previously nobody is willing to lose this feature.
I do not know what "real world economies" you are talking about that willingly will operate on public ledger because of... reasons? Pls don't repeat the muh government/institutions meme, it's getting old.

>the next point is literally all about muh government
No point of arguing further. You do you lad, have a good one.

I recently got moneropilled and decided to start accumulating. I know price talks are a bit frown upon here, but what amount would you say qualifies as a "make it" stack?
Also in what time-frame you expect XMR to substantially appreciate in value?

>>55982703
anon...no one knows the answers
just invest if you believe in it and the ideology behind it
act according to what you might lose in case a flaw is found one day and all monero value proposition left

but i guess a bare minimum of 100 would be a make it stack if one day it catches up

the amount of FUD around XMR is so bullish brothers

>>55964598
Beceacuse they controll the mining and hold most of it for pumps and dumps, a perfect trasparent ledger to ruin and dominate you and extra tax revenue . You stupid nigger cattle.
Do you know what else they promote: fiat and bad vaccines as well. Fagot.
If they want it. Smart people dont

>>55982703
Just like when people first invested in Bitcoin, they didn't know if they were going to lose it all. Mining wasn't profitable and the general public thought that it was going to zero "any day now".

it's not about the money, it's about sending a message. Monero is a ideological project, like Bitcoin is/was.

>>55979076
pls...?

Hi babe, I couldn't help but notice your bra strap near snapping from the colossal magnitude of your sloppy, giant, curvy, perky, lactosious breaticular boobs. Your fun sized blazing bazinga bazookas, your money making bosomous bing bongs. I bet they must be spewing with milk constantly, much like the velocity of Niagara falls: fast, dangerous, yet sexy and provocative. I can only hope to experience the true weight and glory of your gargantuan, epic, splendiferous milky mommy breasty boobies one day.

>>55954435
Not really because people will solo mine with the hardware they have. The market balances it out.

This thing is DOA. At normal electric rates it's profitable but if you expect for it to pay for itself in 2 years like you do other capital expenditures it needs to cost about $2K. It'll probably be more like $10K. Buying 212K hashrate is going to cost a good fraction of that.

If you want to make real money with XMR you need free hardware and preferably free power too.

>>55976707
no

It it worth buying this new Monero asic? I would be willing to take the plunge if the returns are adequate.

>>55982703
>but what amount would you say qualifies as a "make it" stack?
My current thinking is how much gold you would had needed to thrive through collapses like those of Weimar Germany or 2001 Argentina
I don't have an answer, those who fled Vietnam in 1976 said an ounce of gold ensured their escape to freedom, there's similar stories elsewhere, so I'd guess something similar in current value should be the minimum you should have (10 XMR is a nice round number and what I believe should be a minimum stack)
>>55954435
PoW coins can go negative on profitability with normal electricity prices since they can take advantage of excess electricity and get much cheaper electricity as swing consumers, or use energy that would had been wasted otherwise (like mining for heating), Monero being mined on general purpose hardware also has the advantage of not needing to ROI on hardware since there's plenty of resale value

>>55987332
>It it worth buying this new Monero asic?
Remains to be seen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9BFnn2-TDM

>>55987332

Its not an ASIC.

>>55990521
Leve the reatard alone, or suffer the consequences.

Why's OP recommend monerujo over cakewallet for android?
What's the status of both of these wallets as far as phoning home, or other unwanted network connections, goes? (I've got my own node to connect to.)

>>55993212

They're both fine.

>>55966756
Try downloading the app image from the site

>>55950497
anyone bought xmr with cash? im unironically wanting to send bank notes in the mail to someone i've never met so that I cant be audited

>>55997631

LocalMonero has that option.

>>55981756
>>55986607
It happens whenever the thread hits the bottom of the catalog, like >>55997631 >>55993212 and >>55987332

>>55964764
>And the state is just the state, neither friend nor enemy.

kill yourself FAGGOT

>>55997821
you have autism

Good morning sers. Are you are for some ASICs?
2 days left.

>>55999140
>Are you are
Are you ready

>>55999151
Unless they give them away they aren't better than what's already out there, esl.

>>55997821
I genuinely just got a smartphone for the first time after like 5 years of not using one so I'm looking at which apps are good.
I don't think the thread was even that low when I posted.

>Bought monero two years ago thanks to the shilling threads
>price has pretty much stayed the same throughout

>>56000372
You say that like it's a bad thing.

>>55950497
it's time

>>55959023
>she
ngmi

>>56001901

Brutal.

>>56002540
>raised moles
fucking so gross, get that shit lasered if your career is your body

>>55950497
how to swap eth for xmr?

>>55999009
So?

>>56004810
See, it happened again. I swear OP has a bot running.

>>56004829
its a genuine question only thing I can find on my own is about atomic swaps

>>56004853
See >>55950497

>>56004902
How can I do it from eth to xmr without a cex though?

>>56004930

>>56004939
morphtoken is down and the others dont appear to support eth

>>56004974
Changenow & exch, both listed on kycnotme

>>55982227
>How would a private ledger help the real world economies? Go on, I'm listening.

If anyone needs branding/logos for their biz or name, please respond.

>>56005331
thanks

The problem of the bitcoin equals energy narrative is that its fucking retarded first with energy you do work to do things like machines working or grow food but with bitcoin you can't do anything and last is that economics rely on circulation snd bitcoin 7tps is still fucking retarded

This may be retarded to ask but couldn't xmr become like an artificial inteligence i don't know how to explain but a sidechain dedicated to compute ai it means we could have ai as a blockchain?

>>56007866
Lets say for example every single decision of the ai was stored in the blockchain

>>56007866
Take your adhd pills
>>56007871
Monero is money. I'm sure some Rajeet has the perfect chain for you.

LTC to XMR cope

>>55970001
Tf was that! Mixed monero! My god bro! If you get paid in crypto or cash, you can just go to local, agoradesk, or some non kyc crypto exchange and exchange your crypto to monero. Make sure to paste the xmr address where you want to receive the xmr on your xmr wallet.

>>55951496
Stfu. At least my coin doesnt get tons of people caught lmfao. Kek

>>56007935
both dead alts, litecoin in late 2013, monero one cycle later in early 2018, almost in perfect symmetry.

>>56008218

Oh, are we doing that thing again where we pretend Bitcoin's price action isn't largely the result of fraudulent trading and that Bitcoin isn't being driven out of the online black market it completely dominated up until recently?

Post some damn charts so we can laugh at you even more.

>>56008218
Tell that to btc buyers that are behind bars coping.

Why does it take forever to start the node in the Monero wallet on Windows?

>>56007866
>>56007871
I am indirectly involved in the Tau.net project and will push that as soon as possible XMR might consider a self amending governance chain where people could automatically vote via "AI" agents according to their preferences thousands of times per day. However, the tech is still experimental and also it's a deterministic system vs today's common statical AIs.

>>56008675
This would still be at least 2 years in the future.

>>56008383
Give more info
Official gui wallet?
Local or remote node?
What do you mean by 'start'?

finally got a rope stack :)

>>56008247
if it was fraudulent then monero's still underperformed in a world of literal free unbacked money
no amount of imaginary fraud in this market can make monero look good against bitcoin

>>56009371
>if it was fraudulent then monero's still underperformed in a world of literal free unbacked money

"underperformed" = less manipulated, you unmitigated retard

>no amount of imaginary fraud in this market can make monero look good against bitcoin

Yeah, guess Monero will just have to settle for driving Bitcoin out of all fundamentals-based markets.

Now where are those damn price action charts?

>>56008675
Interesting anon can you explain a little bit more about the project, i tried to read the page but i am not that smart

>bitmain releases a dedicated monero miner, based devs already thinking of ways to gimp it
>same bitmain which was cucking the competition on bitcoin by owning a government granted monopoly (patent) for asicboost in china
yep, i'm thinking based

>>56011388
>based devs already thinking of ways to gimp it
no they're not, literally noone cares
they farmed using those machines for the past 2 years, as they always do before reselling asics, which btw this isnt one, its less efficient than ryzens and there's literally no reason to buy them

>>56011431
>its less efficient than ryzens
we still don't know their price, if they are cheap enough they will be more profitable in shorter time horizon.
Why would they try to sell it (and more importantly reveal the existence of monero dedicated mining CPUs) if no one was going to buy them?

>>56011496
because people are retarded and they need to sell because the hardware got raped and it's not profitable for them anymore

There are two (2) manufacturers of Monero mining chips
Two megacorporations that need to comply with the law

>>56011950
yes this is very unfortunate

>>56011496
Because they already made roi and are dumping it on retards who CONSOOM the word "asic." Its either going to run so hot it will harm other machines or cost more than even hobby miners can afford. The fact that its not even as efficient as gaming cpus and pulls more than a standard120v circuit can hold is a huge mark against it. Not that it matters, since power is so expensive in 240v countries that its a net loss just trying to use it.

>>55953875
>>55954012

depends on the price. you probably can buy 2 desktops for it.

Cool tech, shame about the infinite supply.

>>56012950
To match efficiency and hash rate you'd need about 7500 USD worth of off the shelf hardware. Assuming you can resell the ryzen systems after 2 years of mining for 60% of the original value, you'd only pay 3000 USD. If you can optimize the hashrate even better, or if you can resell for more, the cost drops even further. This is the value bitmain needs to beat.

>>56014091
How much will my stack devalue in 100 years?
Is HODL the only use case that matters? Is it even a use case?

>>55954217
you're better off just building an amd rig

>>55954217
to be clear the only reason they're using riscv is for its license, so they don't have to spend money on it, it's not about efficiency at all

>>56014266
just look at the chart. if the trend against btc was up it would have made a new high this cycle, but it didn't because all alts spend most of their life trending down.

in 100 years the question is really just going to be "what's monero" much like it's "what's peercoin".

>>56014091
the """"infinite"""" supply gives miners a reason to mine, making the network stronger which is a necessity for a currency, in your lifetime it won't impact you at all, they can just fork it after you die if it has a negative impact, it's a non issue and I don't understand why people keep bringing this up when the only thing you should care about with monero is that its encryption remains untouched and it keeps getting used

I guess bit of offtopic but what is next for zcash devs once they run out of money?
Will they jump ship to xmr projects or are the chains way too different?
I know they are basically payed contractors but if they are good enough they could bring in value from working on some CCS.

>>56015386
yeah infinite supply is a red herring. the real issue is the infinite blocksize which has managed to undermine the entire ring signature model by keeping fees intentionally artificially low.

>>56015395
>I guess bit of offtopic but what is next for zcash devs once they run out of money?
They will probably go back to working at Silicon Valley tech jobs. Monero doesn't have a steady or guaranteed paycheck.

>>56014091
Here, have some cool tech with fixed supply

>>55976414
https://monerosilver.com/

This guy is legit. I've seen plenty of vouches.

>>56016043
USA only

>>56014091
>shame about the infinite supply.

You failed the IQ test.

>>55950531
>https://monerobookstore.com/
Are they down permanently or is it just a website error? Can't get on currently.

>>56011496
They just listed that machine for 3k (not including tax and shipping). Bitmain likes to do initial offering coupons which knock the price down 15 or even 30% for first come scalpers to try and sucker in more people before they sell out in a couple minutes. I'm guessing this isn't going to be like their other products where there multiple batches if they just want to dump the stock they have. That being said, these things will still most likely sell out immediately.

>>56015363
>just look at the chart. if the trend against btc was up it would have made a new high this cycle, but it didn't because all alts spend most of their life trending down.

lol due to the copious amounts of wash trading trading and price manipulation in effect since 2013 that chart is utterly meaningless.

The only chart that objectively means anything is the one tracking demand related to actual economic activity. And as we all know, that chart doesn't paint a rosy picture for BTC's long-term outlook.

Isn't monero the anti big tech coin? Big tech only exists around its cloud servers, its cloud servers only exist cause of government subsidies, its customers are big corporations that have no other option to use the cloud. Top down in company size the corporate world falls into using the cloud sooner or later. Now universally VC tech firms hate proof of work cause it means power plants used for proof of work not their cloud servers to shit up another shitcoin like link or xrp. But then bring down that proof of work to CPU based proof of work, there are always going to be more individual machines with CPUs people can turn into nodes/miners and if its around a coin that always beats a fintechs payment technology fees it checkmates the entire tech industry. So thought exercise here, isn't monero a multi decade short on every tech company from oracle and IBM to apple and amazon and not just a short on government issued currency?

>>56016043
wtf this niggers selling gold coins for $1000 over spot price, what kind of mongoloid would take that deal?

>>56016940
Props to him for milking the privacy grift.

>>56016577
>Are they down permanently or is it just a website error? Can't get on currently.

Just checked, they seem to have shut down for good. :(

The commercial hardware wallets look really cool and cyberpunk but it would be unwise to use them to store an XMR stack, right?

>>56016977
holy shit take 5 minutes off god damn

>>56016940
He has rare coins and its completely non-kyc. Welcome to the future, where your rights are commodities priced into other commodities.
>>56018378
There's nothing a hardware wallet can do that a disposable amount sitting in a software wallet on a phone can't also do. Have stacks in cold wallets off-grid, for all else make it work for you.

>>56018378
the best cold wallet is a piece of paper hidden somewhere safe

>>56011295
I understand the website can be a bit high-level, so let me distill it for you:

Security Through Formal Verification: Tau places a lot of emphasis on mathematical rigor, ensuring that software doesn't just do what it's supposed to do, but also can't do what it's NOT supposed to do. This could add an extra layer of security to Monero's already robust privacy features.

Adaptive Governance: Unlike the fixed rule sets in most blockchains that require chaotic forks to update, Tau allows for continuous real-time, community-defined changes. This makes the governance smoother and more adaptable to rapidly changing scenarios. (I understand Monero might want to be very conservative about this one, so maybe it could be used just for suggestions.)

AI-Driven Voting: Imagine a system where you could employ logic-based AI to vote on your behalf based on your preferences. These agents could cast votes multiple times a day, making community decisions more dynamic and accurate. What sets it apart from something like GPT is that Tau's AI is rule-based and deterministic. It can make decisions that are transparent and can be formally verified, instead of generating 'best guesses'.

Decentralized Knowledge Base: With Tau, the Monero community could have its own blockchain-anchored 'library' or 'university', where insights and discussions could be securely stored and reasoned over. (Difference from IPFS: IPFS stores files in a decentralized manner but doesn't allow for advanced querying or reasoning over the data. Tau's knowledge base is both a storage and a 'thinking' mechanism.)

Hope this clarifies things a bit. This tech is promising but experimental. We're looking at a 2+ years horizon here. Not a silver bullet for now, but a potential game-changer in the long term. I'll keep you posted as things evolve.

>>56018243
I wanted to see if the had The Unabomber Manifesto lol

>>56019699
they*

>>56019699

Its available online, just print it out.

>>56020193
I realize this, I am just autistic and like the thought of a physical copy.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dV466B8VVtw

I fucking hate first-time node syncs
>CPU usage low
>disk usage low
>RAM usage low
>still takes three days to go from 90% to 100%

>>56021729

Take the pain.

>>56015420
everything scales

Get a load of this whiny faggot.

>>56024124
I agree with him.
Mouth breathing morons like him won't change their views no matter what so why allow them to remove some alts and not others?

>>56024124
>Top 25 crypto
>2bln$+ market cap
>The only actual privacy coin that gained steam
>One of countless
I love it, more for me.

>>56024124
which one of you posted that?

>>56021729
Nigger make copies. I have 2 full nodes, 2 pruned nodes running and a backup of each on a spare hdd.

I don't have to pay for electricity, what's best mining system I could set up for under 2k?

>>56026981
iPhone14s, they get hella hash for the size.

>>56025842
>which one of you posted that?

OG thread: https://bisq.community/t/why-is-the-scamcoin-monero-unremoveable-from-bisqs-list-of-altcoins/12234

Coinjoin and lightning. That is all.

>>55959333
>And Monero's hash rate is already more centralized than Bitcoin
People using a pool doesn't mean it's centralized. Miners can abandon a pool and go to a new pool easily.

>>56027868
>>55952610

>>56027868
coinjoined bitcoin is still unclean

>>56024124
>>56027153
>Why does "Monero" live rent free in my head?

>>56026981
maybe look at motherboards with 2 CPU ports and build a computer from that
depending on the motherboard price then you adjust which CPU you'll buy and other components
or get a single CPU, motherboard, get a great CPU
there is no good answers anyway, all you have to do is get CPU

>>56027868
>Coinjoin and lightning. That is all.

kek

>>56028075
the same way all xmr are treated as unclean, yes.

>>56030064
>the same way all xmr are treated as unclean, yes.
By who? Gold vendors. XD you really need to rope your self fagot

>>56030064
>the same way all xmr are treated as unclean, yes.

All or nothing, nimrod

>>56024124
>using a giga-autist sub-niche product designed for guys too autistic to use the main products in a product space for guys too autistic to use money
>"why is there an autistic niche product here why are they not using the slightly less sub-niche thing"
The retarded kind of autism.

Been out of the loop for a year or so, has anything big happened in the space since?

>>56032752
money network still working
faggots still fighting over which nerd tech is the best
my weed keeps getting delivered
I keep stacking XMR
my digital wealth is still real

>>56032955
>my weed keeps getting delivered
assuming you're talking about gta online, I'm having trouble with mine, it's been 2 weeks already, did I get fucked?

>>56024124
I love maxipads seething but I think he's trolling

>>56018754
> There's nothing a hardware wallet can do that a… software wallet on a phone can't also do

Is there any value in hardware wallet for disposable amounts (maybe one of those Bluetooth hardware wallet) in-order to better protect your funds in case your phone gets hacked? Or is that just stupid and a paper wallet / phone app combo just the best?

Putting on a trip just made for this general and its lurkers. I'm a designer that specializes in making logos for people among other things like business cards. If anyone is interested in having a personal logo to their name/biz or a a complete brand set (logo, biz cards, etc), please reach out with your email and we will talk about the process . I'll solely use this trip code to respond to people so people know it's me.

>>56033286
>all the real criminals use bitcoin
>source: the ones that get caught all use bitcoin
maxipad cope never ceases to amaze me. Does it ever occur to these losers that xmr chads never show up in these statistics because the ledger is impossible to read unless you have a supercomputer the size of the sun?

>>56033561
>maxipad cope never ceases to amaze me

This tard is a prolific activist, was incessantly posting on Plebbit a while back.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/szca6o/a_circular_economy_as_the_pinnacle_of_privacy_as/
https://www.reddit.com/r/MadMaxi/comments/t8dwt8/the_us_government_owns_more_than_half_of_all/

https://www.reddit.com/user/Mallardshead/submitted/

Cakewallet or Monerujo?

>>56035046

Featherwallet

>>56033821
>muh circular economy
Why is it so hard for maxipads to accept that bitcoin has failed as a currency?
They celebrate bitcoin pizza day because it was the first use of it as a currency for a real world good but ignore the fact they've lost the largest market of that kind they had (that being the darknet) without gaining in any others.
Its use as a medium of exchange outside of finance has all but vanished (to the point that bitcoin conference stalls don't accept bitcoin - staged twitter displays not withstanding).
Even in the turd world with government backing it has failed yet maxipads still think a bitcoin only circular economy is right around the corner

>>56036512
>to the point that bitcoin conference stalls don't accept bitcoin
Kek, not even the all mighty LN?

>>56036558
Nope.
It's even better, the conference itself stopped accepting BTC for tickets lmao
https://www.bitcoininsider.org/article/13862/bitcoin-conference-stops-accepting-bitcoin-tickets-blames-network-congestion

>>56032752
monero chan got pregnant
no pic. soz.

>>56032752
transaction flooding attacks continue, developers once again suspiciously quiet, no technical solutions other than redesigning the entire cryptography have been tendered.

NEW THREAD: >>56037000
>NEW THREAD: >>56037000
NEW THREAD: >>56037000
>NEW THREAD: >>56037000
NEW THREAD: >>56037000
>NEW THREAD: >>56037000

>>56036979
>transaction sneeding
Damn, qrd/link?