/biz/ - Business & Finance

Depends.

>>55483509
Huggies.

>>55483500
Money in full every time. /thread

>>55483500
If you can secure low interest rate then it's 100% better to get a mortgage

>>55483517
Reason being that over time the property appreciation and inflation will eat away at the debt you owe. It will also let you live in a bigger/nicer place faster and means you don't have cash tied up in property while it could be growing in the stock market or some other investment

>>55483515
this, so you don't pay interest
it's financially smart to be wealthy

>>55483526
Poorfag

Paying rent to jews is worse than interest as long as the interest rate is low, you at least put money into house equity that way

>>55483540
Explain why it's better to pay in cash
>>55483557
define low interest

>>55483557
You could generally expect an inverse relationship between interest rates and house prices, such that things work out to be pretty much even. Sure, there isn't an instantaneous dropping of house prices upon hiking of interest rates, but it will happen once the home owners accept their house has decreased in value.
>Higher interest rates = low house prices
>Lower interest rates = high house prices

Your investments compound up to infinity, your debts compound down to 0. You're always worse off paying debts off early even if the interest rate vs your return rate is equal.

>>55483500
First house? You're allowed to mortgage with 20% down and no more than 40% of your after tax takehome.
Second house?
Ideally all cash.

>>55483500
Mortgage rates are always lower than the returns on investing the money elsewhere. Only idiots turn down cheap credit.

>ITT: people who live with mommy and daddy don't understand that the alternative to a mortgage is paying rent

>>55486175
>the alternative to a mortgage is paying rent
The fee for cutting my lease early is only $200. I can pick up my shit and leave town anytime.
Meanwhile my buddy who took on a $310k mortgage several years ago still has $268k left to pay and he think he's rich because the value of his house inflated to $500k.

If you like to be swimming in debt go for it faggot. I'm saving up to pay in full.

>>55486197
Your buddy can walk away from his house and rent it out to a moron like you whenever he wants.

>>55483500

mortage

>>55486175
just rent somewhere cool and trendy and invest everything else until you actually need a house. Good luck have fun as a single guy living in the suburbs

>>55486212
cope, no he can't

I currently live with my mom. I have 40k in a brokerage and 30k cash in a hysa. My wife has 30k cash and 20k in a brokerage.

We help my mom with 1k a month and bank the rest. To put in perspective 1 bedroom apartments are 1600 where I’m from.

Should I take the leap on a home or continue doing what I’m doing. I can’t decide how much money I need saved to buy a house, it seems like the answer is “more”. I want to move out but it seems so financially retarded to.

>>55486227
Depends, does your mom cook chicken tendies? This is financially important.

>>55486218
>Good luck have fun
He thinks it's about fun.

>>55486302
No, she is a terrible cook and actually difficult to live with. She is a hoarder.

>>55486227

get into the home ownership game. you have the cash to make it happen, and home ownership is the first step to making it. seriously think about all the wealthy fucks you know, there is a reason the overwhelming % of millionaires are home owners

>locking in housing costs
>inflation wipes away your mortgage debt
>property appreciates over time
>worst case disaster scenario you just sell your house and probably still come out ahead, except now you have experience with the ownership/mortgage process

dont listen to anyone telling you otherwise, you will feel you've come on a different financial level when you finally start paying into your home equity and seeing your net worth grow

>>55486227
How does/did your wife originally feel about moving in your mom's house? To answer your question, I suspect the question of when to buy a house is mostly dependant on two factors: 1) Monitoring the real estate market for a great opportunity (Spurned on by recession or chance), and 2) The desire to begin having kids and wanting more space, as well as your own space.
It's a trade-off between deciding to continue hoarding shekels and gaining true independence in your very own home.

>>55486348
We are both looking at moving out of state to somewhere cheaper. If we move to the Midwest and get a 300k house with 20 down, we can do that right now, I’m pretty sure my salary would cover everything and she would only need to work if she wants anything besides food. What I’m worried about the most is moving somewhere and worrying about shit like a stove breaking. I grew up like that and I don’t want to live like that. I am craving my personal space hard, we have lived here for a little over a year

>>55486348
To add on she gets along with my mom fine, I have the bigger issue being an adult and still living here. When my mom does anything annoying I get way too mad. Stupid shit like she filled up the trash can two weeks in a row the day after it was emptied. I know it’s small but im going bezerk here, why the fuck would you do that?

>>55486366
In addition to the amount you've saved, the other obvious factor in determining feasibility of buying a house is your income. Determine the general cost of the types of houses you are considering, how much 20% down would be, and then do a full budget breakdown of monthly costs. Play around with the numbers to determine what you can comfortably afford with and without your wife's income.
>When my mom does anything annoying I get way too mad.
She is saving you two a considerable amount of money by letting you stick around, the least you can do is not be a sperg while you are staying there

>>55483500
Gamble on crypto/stocks


Buy if you can pay the house with 1/10 of your portfolio

>>55483500
I'll give you a clue. The bank, that understands money better than you is willing to buy the house, yet it give it to you in exchange for the mortgage payments. Pretty obvious which is more valuable in the long term.

one reason ill always like america over europe are big houses, europe is filled with shitty little apartments and streets thinner then my dick. i like BIG WIDE streets and BIG houses with BIG lawns. the american dream will live on.

>>55486366
>stove breaking
Just wait until your roof leaks or your furnace or AC shits the bed and you can't fix it.

>>55486225
If you're Canadian, like I am, your newest property is cash flow positive because renting poors.

Fuck poor people

>>55483500
owning one's home outright is one of the most important things to strive towards imo. i'd say pay for the home with cash, especially with current mortgage rates as high as they are.

i personally am terrified of homelessness. there's a nice sense of security that comes with owning your home outright that shouldn't be underestimated.i also highly value reducing expenses wherever possible so having no mortgage is attractive to me as housing is the single biggest expense most people have. that $XXXX a month you've been paying in rent/mortgage your whole life goes away. forever

>>55486175
im sorry your parents are terrible people

>>55486415
The bank prints the money out of thin air. They're commonly known as a driving force in inflation even without central banks and money printers.
They win either way. They give you non-existent money, you give the non-existent money to a guy, he gives his non-existent money to a bank again and the banks settle these non-existent moneys every now and then by moving a tiny negligible sum between each other. Meanwhile they get to take a cut of everything you do, every interest you pay.

>>55486175
my parents let me live with them until i was 25 and made it from crypto and could finally move out.
i never paid rent ever, they didnt even make me pay for food they just wanted me to save and invest and make it.

>>55486227
You are married with a wife, you shouldn't be living with your mother and paying her rent.

>>55483500
beautiful
i wish i lived there instead of commie block
pwople prefer down paypemts if they can i think

>>55483500
Depends. If you have a mortgage that is the same amount as the rent you are paying, you could save money to pay it off but also be paying it off with your monthly mortgage payments so that final pay off amount you'd need to save would be lower at that point.
If rent is lower than what you'd be paying for a mortgage than you could save it faster possibly.

>>55483581
I did it because when you sell crypto the money has to stay in your bank for 60 days before they will let you use it towards a mortgage and even then you jump through hoops. I went ahead and just sold and used it to buy a house outright.

>>55483500
Let's assume you have the money on hand, and it's either
>Pay up, be done with it
>Mortgage and invest the money
If your gain is higher than the interest, you have a nice deal on your hands, right? House price go up, investments go up, debt goes down with inflation...
But you are ignoring the risks.
Your investment's might rug tomorrow, and you'll only have debt.
If you think you can pay the mortgage with your job, without touching the investments, fine, it works... or does it?
You could pay in full and accumulate in investments instead, and wouldn't pay the mortgage investment rate. Otherwise it's like taking a personal loan to invest, great when it works but risky.
But there are tax exemptions for mortgages, so you have to do your math and see what's better for you.
Generally speaking, it is advantageous, but there's a slight risk, as with anything in finance.

>>55483526
>means you don't have cash tied up in property while it could be growing in the stock market or some other investment
i sold a house in 2022 but it appreciated at a higher rate than SPY over the 8 years i owned it so this isn't always the case

>>55488675
>Your investment's might rug tomorrow
not if they are something sensible like S&P500 tracking index

>>55488675
>But there are tax exemptions for mortgages
Really? What exemptions? Which country?

>>55489948
There could be, but since the standard deduction is so high now, likely there is no benefit.

>>55483509
>>55483513
Pampers

>>55483500
Definitely save up money and pay in full. Better to rent an apartment while you save money for a house even if it takes longer. But a crash is coming soon so you're better off renting now anyway. Wait until after the crash to buy, keep paying rent.

You don't have a choice. The prices are as high as they are because of the mortgage system. If everyone paid cash prices would be 30% of what they are. You don't have that kind of time, you have to finance.

>>55490344
>Better to rent an apartment while you save money for a house even if it takes longer
why?

seems to me money(fiat) is always loosing value while assets are appreciating againts it. Hence debts(mortgage) are being devalued over time. Hence property values always goes up in LONG TERM(I had to use emphasize this part cuz you fuckers wont get it). LONG TERM. LONG, TERM, got it ?!. Which makes it simple, which is good because you'r average smuck who don't know any better anyways.
prove me wrong.

>>55490348
you really think its the mortgages and not the 50 billion mexicans and arabs buying houses?

>>55490611
nta but

>>55486197
>I can hustle and bustle anywhere I want.

>>55490324
Luvs

>>55486366
Kek you missed the COVID 2% interest rates. Enjoy those 7% interest payments

>>55490963
>t. mortgagefag

>>55486197
your friend could just sell his house if he wants to move

>>55483500
I would say right now is generally a bad time to buy a house either way. Usually real estate prices go down when interest rates go up, but we really haven’t seen that yet. So not only are you paying crazy inflated home prices, you’re also getting a shitty interest rate on top of it.

>>55491069
from what i can gather, interest rates won't fully take off until the holiday season 23'/start of 24' so that'd be a pretty decent way to start.

take this with a pinch of salt though, i'm still a newfag on economics.

>>55483500
With 7% interest rates a $400k house will cost you a million dollars over 30 years iirc
You'll also be hard pressed to beat 7% in the markets on top of inflation so I wouldn't do it

>>55483500
Holy shit this thread

Nobody here owns a house or has a job

>>55490576
Because im a landlord and I want you stupid wagie zoomers and millenials to keep paying rent instead of buying houses

>>55490963
>t. subhuman rentoid

>>55491023
>t. subhuman rentoid

>>55486227
We are in a housing bubble with hoomers unironically saying “it’s a new paradigm!!” Good luck.

>>55491302
There is no housing bubble, house prices are just going to crab until rates come down in 5-10 years. The supply of housing is too low for there to be a crash because there's millions of people sitting in cash waiting for one

>>55491379
>It is different this time because it’s a new paradigm.

Good luck.

>>55491302
There is a bubble, some loser I know just qualified for a house and got it. She makes shit money and didn't put down more than 10%. It's also in a very desirable area. This means bubble.

>>55491267
>you either mortgage or pay rent
or you know just pay it in full like a normal person

>>55491221
>Nobody here owns a house or has a job
busted

>>55491545
>or you know just pay it in full like a normal person
most normal people don't pay in full. using leverage is better

how do you even afford it when rates are over 7 percent at current prices?

unless you live in bumfuck of nowhere

>>55486308

Get a FHA loan on an affordable property - $1000 to $1200 in mortgage - and move out.

>>55483509
>>55483513
>>55490324
>>55490938

>>55493054
I got a mortgage at 4.6% (5 year fixed rate) in UK just this week. I put down 20% deposit

>>55483500
Would you rather save 40k or 400k?
Also if you're bot looking for houses the question is pointless because houses go on and off the market every day. You need to he ready to pounce on the one you want.

Just watch scuffed realtor. Yesterday's episode was great.

>>55483500
It's smart to take out a mortgage with a low interest rate and pay it off as quickly as possible. Buy a house that you can pay off in a few years.

>>55483500
yes

>>55483526
Until it doesn't and you are underwater hundreds of thousands of dollars. Buy only what you can afford and treat it like a loss. A house is very expensive to own anyway.

>>55493733
>low interest rate
what is low in your opinion?
>>55493737
which are you saying yes to

>>55493741
>Until it doesn't
just buy in a popular city like new york or something

>>55486162
If houses were a good investment then banks would buy the houses for themselves instead of giving you a mortgage. There is a some risk priced in that you are ignoring or aren't aware of.

>>55483500
mortgage debt is suppose to be cheap so that as many people as possible will be in debt and therefor an be coerced into doing anything. so financially its beneficially to you but you literally trade you freedom for it. if you are already rich you can make lots of money risk free with no work by taking on loans and buying more and more real estate

>>55483500

Wait my son.

>>55483500
It is extremely tied to your personal circumstance. Are you married, have a secure job and can ensure that even if you get fired and have to settle for a job paying 40% less than current you can still meet your payments? Then a house might be a good idea.

On the other hand, if you are just together with a girl for a few years, have no plans to settle down anytime soon and you're at the start of your career? Moving with her and splitting the rent makes sense.

>>55483500
Buy the house with as much leverage as possible. The idea is to use OPM (other people’s money) to buy assets. The ideal is to buy a multi family property so you can live in a unit and tenants can live in the other. As long as it’s manageable, or you have positive cash flow, real estate is literally the best investment you can make other than if you are a crypto god or a warren buffet type, which statistically you aren’t either of those thing. Real estate is one of the oldest and best ways of making cash, and will never become out of date.

>>55483500
The only debt Dave approves of is a 15 year fixed rate mortgage.

>>55494633
Economics isn’t a zero sum game anon.

>>55494633
when banks issue a mortgage they dont actually have any of the money

>>55495148
So the money just magically appears in the seller's own bank account from thin air? What the fuck are you talking about

>>55495502
yes. its one of the ways fiat currency is printed. there was a rule that they had to have a small percentage of the actual currency to give out a loan, like 5% or 10%, but during covid this was change to 0%

>>55483500
If you're renting, buy ASAP

>>55486197
You lose like 10k a year to rent and have a lease breaking fee
He loses a few thousand a year to interest and his equivalent to breaking the lease is selling his house, settling the outstanding debt and walking away with 200,000 dollars profit.
You are a rentoid and retarded.

If I'm poor with no debt and no real expenses but make shit money what can I do to be on track for owning a home/land someday
I'm already trying to get a better job no luck so far

>>55486175
Im still in my 20s so it’s ok

>>55483500
I am the idiot who saves while paying rent people talk about ITT. I was born to a single poor mother.
my job pays good but IMO it isn't safe enough to guarantee paying a mortgage for years. OTOH, I've saved enough, to be able buy the shittiest house in some shitty part of some shitty city in my 3rd world country, something I won't do for obvious reasons.
I've been looking for "opportunities" for quite a long time but the current state of the market really sucks for me right now because prices in my area haven't fallen, and in fact, they more than doubled in the last ~12 years adjusted for inflation... also, interest rates are starting to go down, which, on one hand, means I could get a cheap mortgage, but OTOH means my investments will not be that good anymore, and that more people will be able to compete against me. also, politically speaking, my country is an unstable mess...
wtf should I do? should I leverage my position to get a low interest mortgage to get an expensive house? should I stop paying rent, buy some shitty house and move from there asap? should I just keep saving?

>>55483515
Dumb.
If you are under the age of 50, you are 50000% better off risking your money on wealth building. Your home should be the cheapest available place to live a life you want. If you can survive in a nigger-park for $200/month and invest literally everything else into businesses and stocks and assets, DO THAT.
If you are some metro faggot that cannot bear to be outside of walking distance to a starbucks and faggots, then pay the $4000/month for a 1 bedroom and the rest you can on something speculative.
Theoretically you should focus around 10-30% of your net worth into highly speculative assets. The remaining 70-90% (depending on age obv) should be going into low risk things like bonds (high interest rates are great), gold, land and bluechips so long as they do not DETRACT from your ability to invest into the risky assets in the proper proportions.
>T retired by 30 chad traveling the world.

>>55486227
Buy a house bro! Get a high end house and go all in, it will pay itself back!

>>55497071
>retired by 30
Kek, and here I am, 25 years old and didn't even start working.

>>55495502
yes lol

>>55494849
why 15 year?

>>55497727
I started at 27 after i had a business partner steal my credit score and take out a ton of loans under my name. I took all the credit cards I have open and maxed them out to start a business before they were closed when my credit dropped from 780 to 400. I now passively make $45k-150k a year depending on a couple factors (aka a fucking recession) and have around $200k in alt investments (gold, collectibles, patents, assets) and $400k in business assets. I gained (and obviously lost) about $1m in crypto from my original $15k investment but I was too lazy to take profit like I should (oops). In such a scenario I should have sold 700k of it and put it in cash but I only took off $150k. RIP