/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>55112043
Man I work 4h a day and get all expenses paid. I didn't even finish high school. I don't even have a real job and I get plenty of fresh air and exercise. I just do my work and after that devote to trading.

>did apartment maintenance with another guy
>3 years
>minimum wage whole time (my state jumped minimum wage over $1 every year)
>overhear boss talk about buying a new truck
>getting a 50k loan
>overhear boss talking about tiling a bathroom job I just completed
>$300 for 3 hours of work, includes material cost
>I get $45
Yeah man fuck trades. Too many super boomers that refuse to retire and will never teach you shit because they want you to stay beneath them

On the plus side I can help my family fix a screen window, caulk their door frame, install a new ceiling fan, fix a drywall hole. Etc. Lmao

>>55112043
>>55112090
Pretty much this, i went into tradecucking for a year or so now. I'm starting to think maybe i should quit instead of being another white skinned nigger.

>>55112043
I'm a tradie.

You sound like a pussy. Demand more money, you are clearly worth more. If you don't get it, just leave. There is so much work it is impossible to not walk into another job.

You want to be respected by your employers. Respect yourself. Know your worth. Don't be afraid to call a cunt a cunt.

>>55112043
Try doing it in Germany, apprentices get 700 odd euro a month. Minimum wage would be a life changer

>>55112043
Trades suck. I know because I'm one of those uncertified people that slumlords hire instead of actual tradesmen, and the work is magically easy like some people say. There's a reason they brag about high paychecks, and it's nepotism and working 90 hour weeks away states away from home.

It's a job field for a specific kind of suicidal person who feels nothing and makes money they don't have time or the energy to spend. Every one of them I talked to said it feels like years pass like hours to them because they do so much hard work.

>>55112043
>4 years
>still making minimum wage

Maybe you’re a fucking retard, or maybe you’re union cucked. Either way I stopped reading there. You could have solved this problem a long time ago and has nothing to do with the fact that you’re in a trade and has more to do with the fact that you’re obviously an idiot

>>55112202
Wow a whole year? That’s a long time! Yeah you might as well just quit now while you’re ahead and become trans. You should be earning six figures right now. So unfair

>>55112043
>>55112090
>>55112090
I dunno anons, I spent three years learning a trade restoring stone and doing high end installs. Boomer owner tried to stop me from learning his secrets, I spent three years constantly writing down product names, contacts, tips and tricks etc.

I left and got a better job as a manager in the same field for another company, got one more year of great experience running job sites/crews.

Started my own business right after that, hired a helper and I make well over 100k clean usually working 3-4 days per week. Not to mention all the benefits of writing material and tools off to use on my home, nice truck etc.

So yeah, you just failed to play the game properly.

>>55112043
Traders make 200k a year or so I've heard

>>55112688
If you own the business then sure, but if you are a worker you usually cap out at the 100-120k territory and you have to kill yourself with OT.

That said, most tradies I talk to here in Canada are struggling as the economy is slowing down rapidly, less development happening and less OT or off hour work (time and a half).

As an owner I'm pretty cozy as I don't depend on killing myself to survive, I turn down a ton of work because I don't have the manpower or desire to expand.

>>55112043
trades are only worth it if you live near a large city and can join a union. otherwise you are subjugating yourself to miserable alcoholic retard boomers who conspire to fuck you up the ass and keep you ignorant and poor while they profit off your labor.
>DUDE SHUT UP IM NON-UNION AND MAKE $130K A YEAR
>W-WELL MY BASE RATE IS ONLY $25/HOUR
>BUT I WORK 12 HOURS A DAY MONDAY THROUGH FRIDAY!!!!
>OH AND I WORK HALF DAYS MOST SATURDAYS TOO -- DOUBLE TIME AND A HALF!!!!
>THAT'S $105K/YEAR.... WHICH IS ALMOST $130K/YEAR IF YOU ROUND UP TO THE NEAREST $10K AND INCLUDE MY EMPLOYER'S PORTION OF HEALTH INSURANCE PREMIUMS!!!!

Security night shift you play videogame and watch movie in an empty building

Genuinely don't know why people don't do this instead of back breaking work

>>55112834
Because you'll always be paid shit?

>>55112834
you really don't know why people aren't signing up to perform low wage, mind numbingly low IQ work on a schedule that 1) isolates you from ever getting pussy and 2) shaves years off your life expectancy?

>>55112043
>go to state uni for comp sci straight of high school
>get depressed
>after first year, drop out and go to vocational school to become an electrician thinking that's the way to be happy
>complete voc school, get a job as an apprentice
>do that for a year, fucking hate it, hurt all the time, don't get paid shit, get shocked several times and other minor injuries, have to do dangerous shit in general like work on live systems because we have to get the job done ASAP to make the money
>finally quit and go back to school, pick a really good community college this time that is ABET accredited and has a good reputation with sending people to ivy league colleges after 2 years
>get my AS in EE for only $10k for 2 years.
>now work as an electrical engineering technician in a multinational semiconductor corporation
>paid way more, work way less, don't do dangerous shit anymore, get to sit in comfy chair while still getting to work with my hands, soldering and setting up test equipment for engineers
>401k, HSA, ESPP all getting maxed out
>was making $30k/year as an apprentice, make twice that and counting as a tech
>only work 40 hours a week, leave my work at work, no calls or emails or anything outside of my office hours
>get to WFH more and more frequently as I'm learning to work with software like coding and various programs dealing with statistical analysis and spreadsheets and whatnot, also increasing what I'm worth

You fucked up anon. I'd recommend you just copy me but you need to be able to handle calculus through differential equations. But if you can pass that shit it's a pretty cherry job. Otherwise enjoy your slave life i guess lmao~

Why do people believe in tradie meme anyway? I never saw a good looking blue collar ever, everyone looks 20y older and unhealthy as hell

>>55112622
it's always so weird to consider what people are willing to put up with instead of actually just facing their fears and "ripping off the bandaid" as it were. people like OP are willing to live through hell for years, decades, hell maybe they're whole life, instead of confronting their boss and standing up for themselves. it's incredible.

here this might help some anons here learn to not be pussies in life and get walked all over forever:
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0SW-FXW9h4

>>55112723
>If you own the business then sure

From what I understand, many times the business owners make less money than the workers. Because you have to constantly be looking for the next job and you have to pay for all of the overhead, which comes out of your pay. Back when I did it I saw many people quit being a master electrician and go back to being a journeyman working for someone else so they didn't have to deal with the bullshit and stress just to make a bit more money.

The main problem is that selling your time is not scalable. This is why intellectual jobs like software development are going to always earn way more for essentially way less labor, because once I make a program people want I can just put it online and sell it to the whole world for next to nothing. You only have one back to break, tradie. Same with any reasonable creative pursuit like writing a book or recording an album, stuff that is easy to scale up in sales without much extra effort.

let me ask, you're a land surveyor?

>>55112944
Actually this is probably a better video to describe assertiveness training:
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r12glGg1Ec

Sounds gay as hell, been doing AV installation for less than a year making $33/hr and ill be promoted to lead tech making $42/hr once my contract is up in 2 months. Half my time is sitting in the workshop on phone or laptop. Kek, fuck back breaking work, hardest thing i do is team lift a 82in display every once in a while

>>55112887
>>55112917
You're both dumb ass fucks

Security work pays okay and night shift is comfy as fuck

>Muh life expectancy

Enjoy doing back breaking work all your life to die crippled and depressed at 80

Vs comfy mode and dying at 70

I know what I'd rather do. Or enjoy being a good NPC slave being whipped around the field for 2 more shekels an hour lmao

>>55112043
Is this an anti trade psy op or…? I, and everyone I know in the trades, have a much different experience.

>everyone makes minimum $100k a year at full scale, sure sometimes there’s 10-12 hour days or a saturday here and there but there’s not actually 10 hours worth of work, maybe 4-6 hours of working and the rest is spent bullshitting
> excellent benefits, not the least of which is being able to say “nigger” around the other white guys and they say it right back
>if you fuck something up, tell an older guy who likes you. He’ll help you fix it or hide it. If they can’t help or hide it, Union will get it swept under the rug. Almost 0 danger of losing your job unless you’re on drugs or no call / no show a bunch.
>sure it can be hard on your body, but so what? So is sitting in an office and eating junk all day. At least the trades keep you strong and tan
>women really do love a blue collar man

Maybe this doesn’t apply if you live in bumfuck nowhere but near any metropolitan area should be similar to this. I live an hour south of Chicago.

>>55113101
>You're both dumb ass fucks
i make $100k/year wfh sitting on my ass.
>Security work pays okay and night shift is comfy as fuck
before i went back to school i worked rotating shifts in a factory. working nights fucking sucks and studies show that it reduces your life expectancy.

>>55112090
>boomer
Work in ICT, making $100k/year. My job is easy mostly sitting around waiting for a project to come in. But I had to hack my way in. Worked large corporate in a major Australian City. A top 10 household name company. Asked if I had Cisco CCNA, lied (white lie), said had studied it, never finished the sentence. 3 years into job boss asks if I'm certified. I said nope, he said good job keep it up (retiring Boomers don't give a shit). Corporates want to hire experienced workers who have certs. Boomers all got trained on job with no experience from school. Uni/Tafe grads get skipped over for 457 Visa holders. The Visa holders all leave high school and work at Cisco in India/China for $2/hr. But they get cert exams for free when working for Cisco. Then they come here with 4+ years experience which Uni/Tafe grads don't have. Companies cry skills shortage so they can skip out on training juniors and preference 457s over locals. Same is happening with H1Bs in USA and UK has a similar scam running. There is no skills shortage. Corporate Employers and HR should be hung from lampposts. At this point anon, do whatever you have to do and don't be loyal to any of these cunts. Try to be smart tho, don't lie about University/Tafe degrees, you can go to jail. But if you say you studied something you did.... it's their mistake they didn't check you finished it not yours. Not a Lawyer. Just my story.

>>55112043
>be me
>wfh chad, job is easy enough to finish in 2 hours
>have to look busy so I play vidya or study personal stuff at my desk
>every meeting with the boss goes the same “doing a great job”
>making 200k per year
Honestly makes me laugh every time I see the tradies seething

The only trades you should learn are the ones which give licenses pertaining to the generation of power, water, shelter and food.
With these licenses you can live anywhere, for free.
Optionally, bribe.

>>55112090
Apartment maintenance was comfy as hell, wages weren't so bad when I started (commensurate with big-city cost of living in the Trump years, just failed to keep up in the 2020's) and the job was lackadaisical. After the first year once you're a known quantity it was basically stress-free, take your work-orders off the company phone and steadily knock them out and basically management never needed to even see you, much less talk to you. Girls on the dating websites didn't go for it as much, but sometimes you'd get to play Mr. BlueCollarWorksWithHands, act real Holy about it and snag some lefty snizz. And working actively for a living kept my body in great shape which any girl appreciated. And grown people men-and-women would "hit" on you just for looking like a tradesman, literal strangers always asking for a business card and offering side-work. Which you could steal company time and materials to do because of the slack leash.

I had about had my fill by 3 years in though, then covid hit and I was just happy to have a job, stunted my search for something else. Left in 2022, disgruntled as hell, angry as organizational changes got in the way of my "nice set-up" (which is all any blue-collar punchclock ever really wants, they'll make peace with mediocre wages in exchange for a slack leash and self-direction) benefits got cut, wages fell behind, and age set in. Picked up a drinking problem I'm still wrestling with, which is how anyone copes with living a life beneath their true potential.

For a wagie job, it beats stocking shelves or flipping burgers. I learned a lot. But yes, now I'm a property manager myself and see the invoices going out for the kind of work I used to do. I knew the whole time someone was making a profit on me but, if I'd applied myself I coulda made real money before my "work ethic" ran out. But I was too young to know how to apply myself anyway, really. Live and learn.

>>55113104
What trade are you describing? Manual machinist?

>>55112917

? You’re literally describing the trades lmfao

Trades isolate you from pussy AND age the fuck out of you

Security is literally one of the most anti aging jobs because you don’t do shit

>>55112043
>back problems
Because they don't take care of their body, before my career i was the lowest of the blue collars and they mocked me cause i protected myself from the sun or because i wanted to sleep more than 5 hours.
>surgeries
Fair
>drinking problems
Because the "boomer" is not a meme, idk why they drink

>>55112630
Suck my cock, dipshit.

>>55112723
>usually cap out at the 100-120k
In a city maybe. Try 40-50k everywhere else.

>>55112682
>larper thinks you can hire helpers and then work 30 hour weeks
>or run a business without doing meetings every weekend and paperwork at nights

>>55112043
Imagine not being a complete NEET and just getting rewards from brushing your already filthy teeth using Nilo

>>55115034
I will never be a human garbage, sorry

>>55115034
NEETing is literally the most disgusting thing in this already cursed world, lmao

>>55113490
Which? I see none

>>55115034
Cuz you're gonna get rich from it for sure kek

>>55115057
don't look at your legs, tranny

>>55113304
How do I into security please help me

>>55112723
I do residential renos in ontario and we are booked until end of July. Clientele is all old money.

I graduated from welding school. Had my aws 6g smaw certification for a year before it expired. It expired because I could not find a job anywhere because I do not speak spanish or they would not give me a weld test because I have no "experience" even though I spent 1,350 hours welding in school. I am in the united states in florida.

>>55113101
I was the first reply in this thread, how do you get into security? I hear you need cert or some bullshit. I'm a night owl and have always wanted to do it. The only thing I don't like is my state requires you not to intervene and only take notes when something happens

>>55112313
Can confirm

>>55112971
It depends on how the business is structured. Most tradecuck small business owners are control freaks and don't know how to put systems in place to delegate work in an efficient manner, so they are constantly herding their helpers and working full time in their businesses to keep things in motion. Essentially they have a high-paying physical job at that point with long hours.

So yeah, they can easily make 100-400K depending on the trade they are in but they will never scale past that because they don't know how to actually run a business without micromanaging everything. Also, they can't take more than a week off, because their business will literally bleed money without them to tell their helper wagies what to do every few minutes.

>>55112834
>Security night shift
I've played enough indie horror games to know this is asking for trouble

>>55117045
Why do trades degrees expire?
And could you be unemployed when trades are literally a good mine these days?
Tradies start at 100k.

>>55117045
OH NO NO NO NOBODY TOLD THIS NIGGA TRADES ARE ALL NEPOTISM

>>55117492
The AWS Certification expires if you don't have an employer to sign off on you welding. A "degree" from a trade school doesnt expire but it doesnt mean shit

>>55117492
And no trades start at 100k stop repeating bullshit you heard somewhere. I live in Florida and can't even get hired to mig weld trailers for $13 /hr let alone do the actual skilled pipe welding that my certification qualified me for.

>>55112090
You retards are doing something wrong. I don't have any training or education and got a good manufacturing job. Raises every year forever, good medical insurance, chill work environment. Don't stick with a shitty job there's always something better out there you just have to find it. I went thru a handful of companies before I landed this sweet gig.

>>55112834
Why do people brag about having do nothing jobs? Is doing nothing really good for you? No, otherwise the NEETs would be the happiest people around and they're basically all miserable.

Nightshift + doing nothing at work is basically asking for health problems. Your metabolism will fuck up and you'll get fat, you'll come home and not sleep properly due to no exercise, you'll struggle to keep social because everyone is on a different wavelength to you.

4chan niggers think the second you pick up a 2x4 your back breaks and you end up irrevocably crippled. Your average electrician is way healthier than your average security guard, and has a better social life, and better pay.

>>55117683
It’s the build up over time trade faggot every long term tradie is a a divorced alcoholic with nigger ball watching “friends” who only exist to one up each other I come from a family trade niggers I would never recommend that to anyone

>>55112971
>because once I make a program people want I can just put it online and sell it to the whole world for next to nothing.

The inverse of this is true as well, anything that scales up can become over-saturated very easily due to duplication. They have that problem now in the music industry where every new band has to compete with legacy bands like Queen, films are having to compete with classic films that are basically free on youtube, video game companies in Korea have to compete with Starcraft.

>>55117706
That's because tradie niggers make those lifestyle choices and it's not inherent in the trade job itself. When I did the work it was Rugby that was crippling them all at a young age, not work.

>>55117715
It’s almost like the shitty job they had forced them to cope with alcohol

>>55117722
They're all extroverted normalfaggots that love the work from the ages of 18-30, what are you on? They drink, party it up, have girlfriends, sleep around, do drugs, work in large building companies that house 33% of their sports team.

Not all trades are the same either. Concrete cutting is the absolute worst for your health, and that's why they hire literal crack addicts to do it.

>>55117683
>you'll get fat if you work graveyard
Uh oh kike, turns out it was the graveyard gas station chud you were replying to. What's your cope now?

>>55112043
I’m a tradesman ALWAYS GO UNION. Somtimes it’s true what they say about union guys it can be easier somtimes… but to go one further hire on at a utility gas electric whTever meter reader. The work load is a lot chiller and no rushing on units was a contractor now a utility fag and now life is much easier

>>55112834
Second shift master race reporting in. Get leasure mornings, turn up at 3pm and still have at least half the hours to myself. Ending at 11 preserves reasonable sleep hours too.

>>55117083
>>55115157
Literally just apply to a position online. If you pass the interview they'll get you licensed but it'll take a few weeks of waiting depending on how fast your state moves. Having former law enforcement or military experience is a plus but I got in without them because they were short staffed. I've also been told that some use the job as a stepping stone for becoming an actual cop but that doesn't interest me.

Nonintervention is common practice regardless of state laws since you have no actual legal authority. You're trained for de-escalation and your ultimate goal is to get nogs to leave and be someone else's problem.

>>55118050

>>55112682
Shit larp

>>55112887
Money is a spook. Free time is way more valuable.
Lie flat.

>>55112580
>years pass like hours to them because they do so much hard work.

I fear this but I also don't wanna be poor.
Wat do?

>>55112043
>He actually, unironically fell for the le trades meme
kek don't you realize that was a psyop we preformed on /pol/tards to make them miserable.

>>55112971
>muh swan-man
Fucking retard faggot. Programmer wagies don't get royalties.

The reason real wages have been declining over the last 50 years is rampant debasement combined with HUGE supply-side labor subsidies "social welfare programs" paid for via BRRRRRR, literally suppressing the market rate for labor while pumping asset prices. Neat trick until you can't print anymore

>>55117683
>Why do people brag about having do nothing jobs

Because intelligent people understand that the bullshit about the virtue of hard work is a meme by those with power to get people below them to do the things they need to benefit off of.

>>55112043
>trained his entire life to do the back breaking shit jobs made for low caste plebs that nobody else wants to do
>shocked that he has to live like a wetback low caste beaner
How dumb are you OP?

>>55117683
>Why do people brag about having do nothing jobs
Because they get paid to shitpost on 4chan while you break your back doing work you absolute shit for brains.
Of course I'd like to get paid to play video games than do repetitive soul crushing tasks 8 hours every day.
How is that even a question? How big of a retarded cattle slave do you have to be to even ask this question? Kill yourself goytard.

>>55120652
many such cases when it comes to low IQ shitters who were raised by a single mother and programmed by /pol/ memes.

wagie caste is as follows:
>unskilled, works with his hands
>skilled, works with his hands
>skilled, works with his mind
>manages/directs others with his mind

>>55117492
Most skilled and experienced tradies don't make 100k a year unless they're highly specialized, live in a part of the country with a high cost of living, or maybe if they run their own business. And I know plenty of guys who run their own trade business and, at best, make a little more than they did when they worked for someone else.

>>55120731
Where do neets sit on the scale

25 years old making 150k as a tradie with no degree, no union, and almost no OT.
Specialize, learn how to read drawings, and do basic math the other mouth-breathers cant do

>>55121265
untouchable because they have no money. NEETs on disability get like $900 a month from the government. NEETs not on disability get an allowance from their parents.

>>55112043
I make 64 an hour as a steamfitter. Shut the fuck up degenerate

I've worked as an electrician's apprentice for over a year now and I can't stand it. My boss sends three different people on a residential job that can be done by one person, MAYBE two people, and as a result I have to stand around and wait to get my hands on something. There are many times where I have to argue/compete with others over whether or not I get to do something since there isn't enough shit for us. The reason my boss sends more people is because he can charge extra for labor. Commercial jobs are awful because when there's nothing to do I have to 'act busy' (aka make my brain rot doing pointless work) so some guy doesn't see me doing nothing and psychotically screams at me.
>Uncle makes over 150k a year working for a utility with fantastic benefits and gets to relax most of the day
He's the only person that gives me hope. Trades work for many, but I've encountered too many people who brag about how much they make, only to realize they make $24 an hour with 90 hour work weeks.

>>55121403
4 real my nigga. I be came an expert generalist in my field and now do emergency service most days. I drive around being the first responder to situations then dispatch people to come finish the work.

>>55121439
Union ?

>>55112043
>>55112090
What trade?

>>55112313
Notice how generic his post was.

>>55113304
Then why do so many trades have children?

>>55112043
Should've joined a Union, NIGGER

>>55121477
I've been an HVAC apprentice for a short period of time, and I can say that I don't think I've met a more unproductive group of people in my life. It's remarkable how little we get done in a day. And the worst part is that I don't know if it would even be possible to be more productive.

>three different people on a residential job
Installation days are my do little to nothing days. For some reason, instead of me and a journeyman doing installs, which is more than possible, we have usually have two journeymen and me doing installs together. This doesn't result in us getting done any faster. Instead, it result in me standing around for a few hours and occasionally fetching tools and thinking about how much I'd like to shoot myself.

I make $15 an hour, and somehow, I manage to regularly clock in less than 40 hours a week. After taxes, I take home around $450 a week and I get no benefits. People who work at Walmart make more than I do, and they don't have to crawl around in crawl spaces, work in 100+ degree attics, or be in filthy houses that reek of cat piss. I don't think any of the journeymen I work with make particularly good money either.

This week we're installing duct work in a small crawl space that was recently flooded. The owner doesn't want us to use flex, so hard duct only. We have two hoarders' houses we have to go to. In one, we have to replace a 40+ year old system. That house has boxes of shit everywhere and smells like a dirty litter box, cat food, and body odor. And in the other, which is comparatively less severe hoard-wise, some dumbfuck installed the air handler incorrectly and it needs to be replaced and the duct to the air handler needs to be modified. That house has dog shit and dog food smeared into the carpets.

I think maybe I'll try to get a job at a supply house.

you kind of sound like a sissy faggot

>>55112630
weird trans comment
your brainworms stink like rot.

>>55112043
You are lying and anyone that's a tradie knows it.
Enjoy drowning in your college debt.

>>55112682
>>55118320
shit larp or not it's good advice
The real method to making it is absorbing/stealing as much key info as possible while working under someone else.

Power plant worker is basically the tradie aristocracy job. Huge worker shortage, barely physical (cramped spaces is worst you’ll deal with if a technician). Clear 100k easy with OT. Bonus if you work at peaker plant (hardly even runs). Basically a well paid security guard with some cool troubleshooting every now and then. Only paths to enter are tech school specialization, enough transferable tradie experience or military basically.

>he thought scabs get paid real money
Lol sorry redstate niggers boomers don't actually want to reward hard work

>>55121477
I'm a commercial electrician and if anyone who isn't my foreman or my superintendent says I'm not working hard enough I tell him to fuck off. I've never faced consequences for this

>>55113239
>Picked up a drinking problem I'm still wrestling with, which is how anyone copes with living a life beneath their true potential.
For what it's worth, I just use furry porn. I've had a bottle of Kyrgyzstani bourbon that's followed me 1000 miles up and down the East Coast for almost a decade and it ain't even half empty yet. Phone is full of werewolf dick and that has its own problems, but at least it isn't destroying my liver. Take the yiff-pill, anon.

>>55113304
If you're unlucky, security can age you instantly.

>55112924
>401k, HSA, ESPP all getting maxed out
>was making $30k/year as an apprentice, make twice that and counting as a tech
Help me understand how you put $22.5k in a 401k and $4k in an HSA while making about $60k a year. What are you post tax savings like?
$60k a year is fine in most places for a single man with 0 aspirations who just wants to get by. You'll never build wealth, attract women, support a family, or have money for anything actually fun (trips, decent cars, decent home, medium cost hobbies), but at least you won't starve.