/biz/ - Business & Finance

Will I be safe on binance?
what about other exchanges? coss/kucoin?

>>5471128
The American dream, truly. Lmfao stay poor amerifaggots having to put up with getting raped by their government in every step of their lives.

You're not a millionaire anymore. You're only a 640k'aire.

>>5471128
USD will never die as you are required by law to hand over USD for any crypto trade or purchase.

It's not 36% just fucking hold for a year and you get the cheap capital gains taxes.

Also that was never a loophole. It was never like kind for crypto.

There was a thread yesterday on moving to portugal because they have tax free crypto withdrawls. So if i was to withdrawl all my crypto gains in portugal, is there anyway to be taxed coming back to the us?

>>5471374
Lmao even higher

>>5471374

Yes unless you give up us citizenship.

>>5471374
you have to pay income tax no matter where you are in the world if you are a US citizen
only way to dodge that is to hide your assets or renounce your citizenship and move to a different country

Good thing I'm not a citizen of the Land of the Free

If I make it, I'll cash out 30k for a small home in another country that's crypto friendly, expat, withdraw, and go from there.

>>5471432
100% worth it

Transfer it all to wallet, snapshot transfer, move to first tier southeast Asian country. Slowly spend 1/1000 of your crypto dividends/forks living like a king and leave rest to your 10 children birthed by your first world brown wife who gives you daily massages, brings you delicious fresh pressed juice, fans you with coconut leaf, and Puts that sweet pussy out because it’s yours.

Ps—irs sends you a letter to your globs mailing address. After laughing heartily for 10 minutes, send them snap shot showing it was a transfer, not a sale. Then tell the irs to fuck off cuz shit tier America is a communist shithole.

>>5471438
No tax as long as it’s less than 92k.

>>5471128
alright lads, see you in boston harbor

>>5471366
yes it was. it was a loophole. we dont have to pay trade taxes this year

What if you put crypto into real estate? Taxable?

>>5471374
You can move to Puerto Rico, and after living there for 183 days, you pay no long term cap gains, and I think short term cap gains are like 5%....but whatever cap gains you had before thta 183 days are taxed at normal US rates. Google 'bitcoin puerto rico' there's a lawyer/cpa who outlines the process

Give me 1 good reason I shouldn't denounce my American citizenship and move to comfy house like pic related

How the fuck are they going to know if you day traded?

Day trade till 50k
Spend 10k on shitcoin
Wait 1 year and a day, continue day trading your 40k
????
Cash out original 10k coin
Profit

>>5471548
yep...doesn't qualify for a 1031 exchange...otherwise that would be a great way to do things

>>5471128
What will this mean for using an American exchange as a European?

>>5471587
Cuz exchanges like coinbase keep your id and will eat in you. They will even report your transfers as trades, although they deny it. They mark your transfers as trades.

Stop fucking fuding and worrying and just join some groups... its practically inpossible to make it on your own. https://discord.gg/ZqkUfw

>>5471462
Made me smile anon. I get a justice boner thinking about how hard I’m gonna stick it to the IRS

>>5471526

In order to claim like kind you have to do a 2 page form for every single trade. And the irs can still challenge it in court.

>>5471655
Does this apply if i only used coinbase to initially buy in and move immediately to binance?

>>5471574
Does Puerto Rico even have electricity?

>>5471584
google 'exit tax'...at the time you renounce, the irs considers all your assets to be liquidated at the current value...you pay cap gains on that value

>>5471374
Traders have to pay tax on it in portugal. Only buy and hold investor might be tax free

>>5471699
Yeah esp if you transfer to exchange. It says in coinbase when you transfer. They ask if you are transferring to an exchange. But I think they only want high value accounts 20k/yr or above not your pleb 750 dollar account

>>5471718
good luck irs linking that wallet to a person, even with a paper trail if its in a paper wallet theres no way to know, also whats to keep you from just skipping usd entirely and going straight to yen?

>put USD into crypto
>wait until I can just pay crypto for things (2 years or so)
How will they tax this if I never cash out?

i want to be crypto rich though. i'll cash out small amounts when it's necessary. i didn't get into crypto so i could give it all to some kike bank to assume control of. i want control of my wealth.

>>5471718
Jesus fucking Christ man. Now I understand libertarians.

>>5471366
This is true. But I think a lot of us assumed that we would only be taxed when cashing out to fiat. Now that it's clear that exchanging my BTC for alts triggers a taxable event, I'll have to pay short term capital gains instead of long term.

>>5471760
>Buy btc on coinbase
>Send to own wallet
>IRS asks, whose wallet is that?
What will you say?

>>5471700
i think most of the island does. who knows

>Trump says taxes are too high
>THIRTY SIX PERCENT
I fucking hate the government

Time to sell Bitcoins on the fucking corner. What the fuck is Dolan Duck doing? Why is he coming after us humble cryptopians?

Lets say you hold coin “JEW” for 1 year and a day and you’re ready to cash out, but the only way to cash out for usd is trading to a pairable coinbase coin. Will turning JEW coin into btc/eth/ltc ruin the long capital gains timer?

>>5471811
I...i...it was a phishing scam. I...i...lost it all.

>>5471811
transferred to a wallet whilst simultaneously recieving a different currency into a different wallet, shit's not mine

Explain this to me plz:

Buy 1000 of BTC and this goes to 2000. I then trade to ETH. This is taxable and now I have 2000 as a "gain" but I'm also buying ETH so isn't that 2000 as a deduction and it cancels out? When I sell my ETH for say 3000 overall I'd have buys for 1000 + 2000 = 3000 and sells for 2000 and 3000 = 5000 so for a difference of 2000 dollars. That's the same as just declaring what you cash out as income. So what difference does this make?

Please help a brainlet

>>5471872
Just wait for Request Network to start working fully. I think the entire point is to be able to cash anything out into USD. Not entirely sure though

>>5471811
also, i bought drugs

>>5471811
“It was mine but i forgot pass phrase, hehe typical NEET amirite? <shrug>”

>>5471769
That's the thing retard, you shouldn't cash out, just find the places that accept crypto for things and then you'l have an actual asset you can sell on eBay or whatever. Remember the lambo meme back on /g/ all those years ago, some fag actually bought a Lamborghini when he found someone to accept however many Bitcoins a lambo cost back in 2012 or whatever.

>>5471128
This is now a Monero Thread. Fuck Da Po-lice!

Thank you based IRS for taking my money away and giving it to Military contractors, niggers, mexicans, muslims, jews and single moms

I appreciate it

>>5471811
Lost it all in a boating accident

>>5471895
STK will also be able to be used this way

>>5471942
Fufffy Pony AKA Monero is making Digital Bitbox available for Monero.

>>5471942
Monero Man never fears The Taxor

>>5471979
Good
More things to skip converting things the better

Pol has been saying it for years. Biz just come to accept it now. Taxation is theft.

>>5471992
The part where you give out the wrong password, and when the taxman enters it, Bitbox automatically creates and shows an empty wallet. It is then locked in the empty wallet mode until another password clears it. Fuck. Ing. Genius.

>>5471587
It's not FIFO, it's LIFO.
Which means 1 year between your last transaction and the day you cash out.

>>5471128
If you aren't in Monero by December 31st, you deserve the buttfucking from the Government for being a Retard.

I cashed out 90k USD in ETH for the short term and make around 50k a year here in the states. That means I pay a 255 tax so around 20 ish grand, correct?

>>5472083
Alright so it sounds like either pay 38% holding a coin that could plummet any day or continue day trading and leave america, makes sense

The worst part is Americans can't even escape their government. If they go overseas, they're still supposedly liable for US taxes. The only way they can detach completely from tax law is if they renounce their citizenship and go through a 5-year process.

>>5472083
Wait, I've never seen that...why can't you elect FIFO? I thought the law was that you just have to remain consistent and stick with one.

>>5471128
Anon, I dumped my entire portfolio and went all in on Monero the day Trump signed the bill. I bought ( an unkown amount).

>>5471718
Sure sure, please tell me the value of my (((unknown amount of monero)))

>>5472162
If I sell $30,000 worth of crypto, does that 30k go towards determining my bracket? My yearly income otherwise is 0.

>>5472197
I really feel sorry for them.. no goverment should treat their citizens like this. Best to vote with your feet

>>5472118
AFAIK, it doesn't matter, really. If you have buy records on an exchange like Coinbase, then send to cold storage, then go to monero on Binance or something, you're still going to have to 'cash out' at some point. If you've made like $2mil and have a family, you don't want to keep wagecucking for the rest of your life while you try to buy stuff with xmr and sell on ebay to make money.

>>5472236
And how are you going to cash out that monero? The IRS will ask you how you obtained that monero when you cash out.

>tfw IRS doesnt touch Puerto Rico unless you're a federal employee
Stay kekked mainlandfags

>>5472271
not entirely certain, but i always thought it was considered your AGI (annual gross income), so if you cash out $500k as a short term cap gain, you're going to pay 39%...if you hold for a year, you'd pay 20%...perhaps a /biz/ cpa can enlighten us

Secure Automatic Lending Technology

>>5472293
a freind of mine is in the exact situation you describe. He buys gold coin and bullion with Monero, then sells it on "Megs List" for "Green Leaves". He uses the green leaves for every thing but house payments and utilities.

>>5471128
We never had this "tax break" I haven't heard of any one who successfully was able to report their trades as like-kind.

Will buying items on overstock/newegg get around the small capital gains tax? I know it doesnt help for lambolanders but its something

>>5472732
nope...once you convert it to anything else, alts, cash, property, clothes, gold, artwork, etc, you are on the hook for capital gains

the USA is a fucking joke nowadays lmao

>>5471655
good then I'll have all losses, because I never send shit back to conbase.

>>5471718
buy "an unknown amount" of xmr. Oh no I lost all of my assets after trading them out of my monero wallet

>>5472271
yes the 30k goes to determining your bracket. it's cap gains + income that makes it 39%.

>>5473286
you're technically self employed, you'll do a 1099

If i just trade on binance on a throwaway email can i avoid crypto to crypto tax? Should be fine right

>>5472271
Yes.

>>5472379
Holding for capital gains won't work that well.
It looks like the holding they mean will have to be a cessation of all trading -not just your oldest trade being over a year old- because there's no way to prove which specific trade gained which specific asset. IRS would argue it and you'd have to prove your case, which of course would cost more than just paying the taxes would be, just like they intend it to do with being unable to trade your holdings.

I guess maybe put every single trade into cold storage separate from the others, but then they could claim you were trying to hide the assets and do civil forfeiture.

Hillary Clinton would have extended the short term capital gains tax rate to six years. SIX FUCKING YEARS. So yes, fuck Trump and the Republicans for this tax bill that fucks over crypto traders... but Democrats are way worse when it comes to taking away your money so just remember: it could always be worse.

>>5473312
Self employment is one thing, day trading is another.

>>5471128
just wait till these exchanges get regulated, shutdown, or blocked because y'all want to be edge lord tax evaders LARPing as FireFly captains

>>5471910
You joke but anyone could write off their entire income from this.

>>5473493
no, they will assume it's profit unless you prove otherwise...with the IRS you are guilty until proven innocent.

>>5473493
you never cashed out if you lost your password. You're better off just keeping the crypto

>>5472352
>tfw your Puerto Rician
Stay poor.

>>5473523
Casualties are legal deductions. Any Jewy lawyer would be able to defend you.

>>5473541
I'm not talking about crypto investors. I'm talking about someone writing off their entire capital gains by
>Buying a large amount of crypto
>Having their wallet "stolen"
>Cashing out
It's quite easy to cheat this way.

>>5471128
What if I never cash out, is that okay?

>>5471128
get cucked amerimutts

>>5473838
O B S E S S E D
B
S
E
S
S
E
D

All you fags have to do is hold until someone is willing to take crypto as leverage on a loan, then default on that loan. They take your crypto, and you take the cash, and it's 100% tax free and legal. It's called an asset swap.
And how great is it that the coin that might allow this to happen is called SALT.

>>5473877
you misspelled "obese"

>>5471856
>he thought Donald fucking Trump, a daddy's boy kikelover with no grip on reality, would care about him and have his best interests in mind

>>5473896
O B S E S S E D
B
S
E
S
S
E
D

>>5473413
>b-but Hillary

She's not relevant anymore and never will be again. Stop defending this fat retarded cheeto fuck.

>>5471667
Just....fucking buy Monero, transfer to a paper wallet, then transfer into sime anonymous foreign exchange and don't pay taxes. Or trade with anonymous ETH accounts on Etherdelta. And if they ask you lost the address. There is literally no way to tell if you own yiur ETH address or someone else does.

What the fuck is wrong with all of you?

>>5471374
Please don't do this. We're only tax free because our legislators are incompetent. Once they have figured it out you will be taxed accordingly.

>>5473807
What part of crypto to crypto trades are taxed don't you understand?

>be american
>get shot
>be american
>get taxed till death
f-free I am f-free!

>>5474057
They would get a huge tourism boom

So does anyone have a personal anecdote about being fucked by the IRS over crypto?

I've yet to hear any stories about them coming after crypto.

>>5474080
what gives a government a right to tax a currency that doesn't belong to them? Seriously, that's like the US taxing the japanese every time they buy a pair of used underwear out of those vending machines, and then expecting to collect, lmao good luck bitch

>>5473760
>It's quite easy to cheat this way
Unless you're going to cash out via cash or something, it's when your bank sees the money they tax you. Even with foreign national currency.

>>5472067
Its not just theft, its a scam

usdebtclock.org

The national debt is $20 trillion dollars. The government does not need taxes. In fact taxes are a drop in the bucket. I find it hilarious so many idiot sheep say "hurr durr, gotta pay your taxes to keep things running!" No, you dont, you fucking idiots. Everything RUNS ON CREDIT!!!

EVERYTHING IS ON CREDIT! THE SYSTEM IS A SCAM!! WE'RE BEING SCAMMED

$20,000,000,000,000 IN DEBT, HOW CAN PEOPLE MISS THIS?

The government does not need your tax money. They borrow infinite amounts of money from the Federal Reserve, a private bank run by (((them)))

It is one big scam, its criminal and we should have had a revolution a long time ago. Now, crypto is that revolution.

This is such fucking bullshit.
I just started actively trading literally a week ago and am so close to finally getting 1BTC.
Now I'm going to have all of my shit CONSTANTLY FUCKING TAXED at EVERY FUCKING TRADE throughout the day starting next week?
This is fucking trash. God fucking damn I always get into shit too late and get the shaft.

>>5474080
What part of untraceable decentralized currency do you not understand?

>>5474156
>Now, crypto is that revolution.
If it's that worthwhile how do we keep Uncle Sam's shit-stained hands off our gains?
I'm fucking mad.

>>5471128
time to get a VPN and trade on chinese exchanges

>>5474119
It's so fucking easy to hide this shit there is no way.

>Send to friend in foreign country
>Friend sends you cash
>Said cash is a "gift"

>>5474157
> throughout the day starting next week?
Sorry buddy, its always been this way. That loophole was never a loophole.

Let's start the revolution already.

>>5474193
EXPLAIN THIS TO ME PLEASE.
HOW DO?

>>5474080
hmm, I have large amounts of coins I have to buy for work so taxing BTC -> ALT would be pretty bothersome. I guess all I can hope is more coins have USD pairs and then I just avoid taxes when getting into alts as I never sell any coins but need to buy them.

>>5474099
>>5473838
>He didn't take his gains to an imperial tax haven in the Carribean

Keep on plebbin, eurocuck. I doubt your shit country is getting COLONIZED by your former vassals on top of it.

>>5473896

Just mad because that one picture is showcasing more testosterone, and more guns, than you have in your entire country. Get launched bitch boy.

Is the dream dead?

Why are you idiots so retarded about taxes? Like kind exchanges already excluded crypto. And its not 36% tax its treated as income tax. For most people that will be far less than 36% even if you make hundreds of thousands a year.

I wonder how it works for mining. It's not capital gains, the closest real world thing is probably something like income from a rental property

Lol, I'm paying on what I buy in for, and what I cash out on.

Do you think the IRS has the manpower to audit tens of thousands of crypto trades I made over the years to try and get an extra 5k out of taxes out of me? Pro tip, they don't and won't.

>t. cpa

>>5471811
not mine

So whats the easiest scenario for jumping ship to cashing out? Caribbean? I looked up poland/switzerland but you need to be a resident for some years

>>5474192
Bro its over. Crypto is the answer and the revolution, its already begun. Why do you think so many smallcaps have obfuscation now? Presstab is running around handing out his baseline PIVX source code technology for free.

You see, he understands - crypto is not about making money. It's about breaking away from the USD debt-tax system. It's about a revolution and is the beginning of the END of the American Empire (and world empires). They are all based on fiat currencies from this Bankster-Zionist cabal.

Anon/Privacy coins are already here to help you with that.

Once the decentralized exchanges come, along with the New Darkweb, its OVER. Its done. You will be able to do anonymous trading. The IRS cant do jack shit. The New Darkweb will be un-censorable, so finally all of the massive amounts of censorship going on especially on platforms like Youtube will be revealed.

Its the beginning of the end, the IRS is a dead man walking. They are too invested in the USD and cant keep up with the technology.

>>5474304
I'm thinking I'll probably just trade as usual and when tax time comes IF I cashed out anything, I'll pay taxes on that. That should keep the ugly fucks happy enough. I hope. If not, what are they going to do? Doesn't it start with them just sending letters telling me to pay more?

>>5474304
This my spreadsheet is probably like 1mil trades im sure others too

>>5474129
Except you can't buy things with or use crypto

>>5471792
You could have made a difference.

>>5471953
It goes to the military. Proportionally nothing goes to the rest of them.

>>5474335
But that all sounds so complicated to a retard like me. How am I going to learn to do all this shit?

I don't even know how to use a VPN to try and hide trading from those cunts.

>>5472271
It honestly depends on the scenario but more often than not especially with larger amounts like that it usually ends with whatever ur gains are being added to ur income then the percentage is taken away from that number.

Ie: i make 37k, 15% backet. I invested 2k and it turns into 30 lets say so now that 65k , you are paying 1/4 of that 30k to the gubbaments.

>>5474355
They will send you a letter that you are being audited. In which case you print of your bittrex, binance, yobit, and cryptopia account logs for the entire year, scramble up all the pages and put it in a shoebox, and then it is their job to figure out your actual tax obligation. If you think a 70 year old IRS agent that is probably about to retire is going to spend three months figuring out what a "satoshi" is and then calculating the fair USD value of my ten thousand chain link trades this year on a 24 year old kid for a few extra thousand in taxes I have a bridge to sell you.

>>5474423
The beauty of it is that you won't have to learn how to do it. Like any other technology, the developers will fine tune it and make it much more palatable for the mass userbase. If you are already trading crypto, you are halfway there.

>>5472392
This is what I was thinking. Taking out loans backed with crypto as collateral.

>>5474376
says you, people have bought land, houses, lambos, pizza, and more with crypto. the free market gives no fucks about muh taxes

>>5472392
>>5474481
SALT + MONERO

get on it people

>>5474466
What concerns me about this scenario though is what if they don't feel like sorting through all that shit and then this happens:
They decide it's on you to do the correct valuation. If they have to do it, they're going to take a higher value than what stuff is actually worth and put all your trades at this value. Grossly over estimating everything about your tax bill. You either do it yourself, or they will do it and fuck it up so bad to get more money out of you. If you refuse to do it yourself, and don't except their bullshit figures, then you're just refusing to pay taxes and will get the shaft then.

Something like this I can see. You're right about them not wanting to go through it. They'll make you do it or else.

>>5472236
when is this bill effective ? what about past trades ?

>>5474469
Butt this shit will happen next week. So if I need to start hiding my trading, I need to start hiding in a week. Right? I make all trades with my phone anyway because I'm a homeless fuck and so everything will be tied directly to me. Right? I know the IP address constantly changes, but other than that I don't have any idea how to hide this stuff or if I even can.

>>5474304
I have 2 btc, and easily over 750k trades between bittrex binance and coinexchang. Never reported shit and not going to oly cash out small ampunts of 500 or so to a paypal from coonbase the a chase account that sees no more than 20k a year. Fuck the IRS, and if they come for me, im lawyering up heavily as my family is well off and dad made 160k off ETH. So lets take it straight to em, i’ll do it for you if i have to but seriously they need to leave us be. The Second they realized this was no longer nerdy virgin ahit and we are making cash they want it, but not when we are gettin rekt fuck em

>>5474482
Source? You know that shit still gets reported to the feds right?

>>5473411

isn't the IRS just great? also

> but then they could claim you were trying to hide the assets and do civil forfeiture.
>civil forfeiture
>on crypto

I welcome them to try it. This is why I love this new decentralization tech. Once decentralized exchanges roll out (no more getting goxxed), and secure decentralized cloud storage takes off (save all of your crypto keys securely, and unreachable by goverment hands), I am really going to laugh my ass off as these fags,

Also, to every ameribro out there that has either the chutzpah or the technical know how: do your part in making crypto spread in the USA (it hasn't really taken off as it should). Any cool business idea that takes advantage of crypto, make it happen. Any cool software or service that involves crypto, at least give it a shot. Do your part in making crypto as legitimate as possible as a technology and as a currency

>>5471966
this, same place as all my funs
it was a horrible day, but I just had to move on

tfw growing up I always thought of Ron Paul as a meme or a crackpot. Then in '08 when my measly 401k went to basically zero, i began to research the US Financial System, once you learn about things like (((fractional reserve lending))) and (((quantitative easing)))
son...its a dark fucking world out there anons, and i suggest you take whatever precautions you can to hedge against the mathematical certainty that is the collapse of the USD. Crypto, precious metals, whatever you can do to protect yourself and your wealth will surely be worth it. This is proof that the government has realized, that they will not be able to ban crypto outright, they can't shoah it now, its gotten too big, but they can tax the shit out of it. If you guys honesty think that the gov't and the banking cartel are going to simply stand idle while people make enough money to become free from them? oy vey i should fucking think not.

So if I'm unemployed and don't make any trades in a year, how will I be taxed?
t.brainlet

>>5474633
im not going to source it learn to internet shill, the moment crypto becomes usd it's capital gains, until then taxes are unapplicable.

>>5474223
get a vpn
make an account on binnance

>>5474561
Make them do it. It's on them.

You have to accept the changes. If they fuck it up, go through the transactions and point out some flaws in their formula and give it back to them, just keep going back and forth until they give up.

>>5474812
I do all my trading on Binance now. Nothing is on any other exchange.
I make all my trades on my phone. Is a VPN still able to hide stuff?

I'm not paying you shit you dirtbag piece of shit kike slave soldier irs

captial gains one things but capital gains on top of this bullshit?

not paying you a fucking dime and im gonna trade away till I make my fortune and leave

Too bad. I love trading, but the bookkeeping will be a nightmare. I guess I'll just HODL now. Too bad, because the IRS will be miss ing out on my gainz too.
Also, an American living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore. Is Trump trying to drive us crypto geniuses to saftey, before the inevitable civil war?

The guy that bought verge at 2000sat and sold today at 600 would have to pay taxes on that. kek

>>5474870
a vpn tunnels all traffic though ssl encryption so yes, all traffic will look as if it came from the vpn server

>>5474888
>american living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore

what? since when? source?

>>5474870
Binance has an app?

How good is it?

Mobile trading sounds comfy as hell but I don't want to fat finger anything.

>>5471718
Can't wake up

>>5471663
whale group here as well: https://discord.gg/p5WpXp

>>5474685
THIS
we're in the beginnings of a revolution, don't give them an inch.
you cannot tax a currency that you don't control. It's illegitamite, it's theivery, and it will not be abided. Burn it down.

>>5474888
>an American living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore.

Source? If this is true, this is huge. I will vote for Trump in 2020 if this was actually in the new tax bill

You made up the 36% part though. Liar

>>5474919
you only have to pay tax on profits

>American living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore


don't spread bullshit you faggot

>>5474888
>an American living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore
Is this true now? Did this change with the new tax plan?

>>5474924
So youd recommend binance over bittrex especially for an american? i dislike their system and UI alot compared to buttrex but im about to go full shil for the ref codes.

>>5475034
Muh double taxation agreement

>>5475071
He's probably just lying and being a faggot

But in the off chance he's not, that is massive, it means we can cash out no problem in a tax haven

>American living abroad does not have to pay income tax anymore.

This is not true

fuck outta here with that bullshit

>>5474931
>Binance has an app?
Yes.
>How good is it?
Overall, very. But doing stuff like some indicators and trend lines is much better on the website or desktop client. I don't do a ton of analysis with my phone, but it has basics like moving averages and bollinger bands.
>Mobile trading sounds comfy as hell but I don't want to fat finger anything.
You have to be careful for sure. Sometimes putting in the price to buy/sell is a bit of a squeeze and going between coins quickly has led me once to accidentally sell at the lower price I used to buy. I was mad, but fortunately only lost a few percent of my stack.

>>5474924
Would I have to keep the vpn on at all times always? I feel like this is something that will have to be perfect because one little slip up will have them know I'm me. Or however this shit works.

>>5475079
im on bittrex and only have an account on binance, never done a trade yet.

>>5474156
I'd argue the real revolution is finally seeing (((them))) hang for everything they've done. But sure, crypto is a step in the right direction.

>>5474983
>If you are a U.S. citizen or resident alien, the rules for filing income, estate, and gift tax returns and paying estimated tax are generally the same whether you are in the United States or abroad. Your worldwide income is subject to U.S. income tax, regardless of where you reside.
>https://www.irs.gov/individuals/international-taxpayers/taxpayers-living-abroad

>>5471811
"Bitcoin wallets are anonymous"

>>5475132
the vpn is more for if binance for whatever reason in the future decides to release or the IRS aquires all the names and emails of all accounts accessed with US ip addresses.
Its extremely unlikely since they're not based in the US but its still a posibility since the FBI did seize the BTC-e website and a portion of their funds.

>>5471128
I dont understand this,

Let's say I trade $1000 of bitcoin for $1000 of fun. What tax do I pay on this and why?

Then fun goes up 10% in value the next day. And I taxed on this increase? or just when I trade it back?

Say I hodl and that $1000 of fun is worth $2000 but to cash in I need to trade it for $2000 of bitcoin and then sell the bitcoin with fees making about $900 profit. Surely this profit at this point should be the only thing taxed no?

>>5472298
He's gonna cash out in kilos of coke

>>5475245
So maybe I'm fine as it is? Probably not, but probably am. If I just keep doing all of my trading on Binance even without a VPN they can't do much about requiring a foreign company to hand over records, right?
I've been thinking about getting VPN anyway.

With a VPN you can do any trading or private whatever even on like public wifi at Starbucks or someone else's wifi and nobody can see your stuff even the owner of the internet connection, right?

>>5475218
>Your worldwide income is subject to U.S. income tax, regardless of where you reside.

Reminder that the US and Eritrea are the only countries that do this to their own citizens

How can day trading ever be profitable if you have to pay 36% to the government when you want to trade BTC for some shitcoin you're betting on?

>>5475407
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_taxation#Taxation_systems

>>5475500
That's the point, they don't want you to day trade

>>5475372
the only person who can see what you're doing is the VPN provider. you have to trust that they are not keeping logs. everyone else sniffing the wifi just see's an encrypted connection to some IP address.
>>5475269
>implying the tax code is supposed to make sense
probably the same way sock taxes are taxed right now under this law:
26 U.S. Code § 1031(a)(2)
Exception This subsection shall not apply to any exchange of—
(A) stock in trade or other property held primarily for sale,
(B) stocks, bonds, or notes,
(C) other securities or evidences of indebtedness or interest,
(D) interests in a partnership,
(E) certificates of trust or beneficial interests, or
(F) choses in action.

>>5475372

If they really wanted to come after you, your VPN won't do shit.

>>5474006
The only person who wouldn't approve this is Ron Paul himself. Don't be delusional.

>>5475568
This is what I expect. In the end I feel hiding from the government is futile. Only giving them the finger and pushing back hard enough. But how hard can we actually push?

IF YOU HOLD CRYPTO FOR OVER A YEAR IN GERMANY, ITS TAX FREE

https://www.reddit.com/r/ethtrader/comments/7kegk7/cryptocurrency_taxation_in_germany/

>>5474304
same, it's the only thing that makes sense to me

>>5475862
yeah but then you have to live around muslims

>>5474156
>Taxation is theft meme
By that logic they could simply pull all that money out of the reserve and pay back all it's debt.

But the issue is that to get that kind of change, you'd need both the federal reserve and congress to agree to the new fiscal and monetary policies.
Which would never happen as releasing that much funds into the back into the public, as almost half the debt is to the reserve, social security, bonds, basically investments in general, and repaying those funds would cause interest rates to crash, investments would increase, but the general price level of goods and services would rise substantially, secondly killing us on the foreign exchange market.

Lastly, it's not a drop in the bucket, payroll and individual taxes make up over 2/3rds of the US's income in the annual budget. Otherwise, ya' know, the debt will skyrocket with the new huge deficit spending. It's not too easy to shift the budget without pissing a lot of people off, increase taxes, people like you and I get pissed, decrease something like military spending and military members and die-hard patriots get pissed.

If you want to shoot the US economy in the head, be our guest and run for office. Otherwise put down the tea mister revolution and stop whining.. The new crypto tax is high as shit, but hey, we'll get to it when we get to it.

>>5474397
Unfortunate reality of the US gov.

>>5471893
That first 1000 of BTC it's value in USD when you xfer into Eth triggers a taxable event on the capital gains you made on that BTC thus far. So you bought 1000 BTC and sold for 2000 you owe cap gains on 1,000 usd value as like kind exchange no longer exempts the exchange of btc into eth so nothing is cancelling out you will owe tax for every transfer event.

>>5475269
you'd owe capital gains tax on any capital gains. So whatever price you bought the btc at and the value of the btc when you spent it. so if you bought 500 in btc originally and it increases to 1000 in value and you spend that 1,000 on 'fun' you owe the government capital gains tax on the capital gains at the point you spent the asset or on $500

>>5476338
how the fuck im sposed to keep up with that

>>5474193
OK, but how do I spend the profit without taxation

>>5476391
That brings up an interesting thought about trading alts with a vpn on Binance, but then how DO YOU CASH OUT.
If they see me cashing out various amounts of buttcoin with no more purchases they'll probably wonder where it's coming from.

>>5474652
>chutzpah

a jew wrote this

>>5471769
>How will they tax this if I never cash out?
They won't. This isn't even a crypto bill; it's clarifying a completely different tax codes. Until you move it back out to fiat you've earned nothing. (No, converting straight to Lambos is not a loophole and never was... it's just a bit harder to track for evading taxes when it doesn't hit a bank first.)

Jews die if they ever tell the truth to a goy. They're doing this to get more people to attack Trump, and to damage the Crypto markets that threaten kike banking systems.

Why not "cash out" in usdt and hold that for a year = no tax

>>5471438
If you renounce citizenship you still have to pay taxes for an additional 7 years iirc

>>5476338
that makes me not want to deal with crypto at all desu

I don't think I'm depositing anymore, and I'm sure as hell not paying taxes on my slight ltc gains when i've lost it all right after.

this doesn't take into affect yet? they aren't going to give a fuck until next year right, wayyyyyy too many people not reporting trades and my 400 dollar gain that I lost is nothing on their scope right?


fuck them, I'm not depositing anymore, I'm saving my money in the bank.

>>5476648
awesome, thanks anon, now I am good, i knew it was this way.

>>5471462
t h e d r e a m

>>5476761
dont let em blackpill ya son

especially not with that sorta change no offense

>>5471128
guys I use [cointracking . info] to track all this shit. It costs some money to sign up for the automatic imports but it covers your butt tax-wise. You just give it API keys for all the exchanges you use and it can grab all your transactions for you.

Assume I sell everything I have for cash now, I wouldn't have to pay the gains this year, then I could immediately buy back before the new law goes into effect?

Long term holder here.

This is my strategy, has worked successfully so far.

> buy cryptos and hold
> sell for BTC
> Buy XMR with all I want to cash out
> Sell XMR for BTC
> Cash out BTC on coinbase and only claim long term gains tax on a whole chunk.
> Let the IRS figure it out

all that being said I've only "cashed out once before earlier this year and this was my method. low amount as well, as I said I'm a holder.

the longer you hold, the bigger your return and the lesser amount of tax obligation.

>being american

>>5471374
The problem then is you'd have to live in moortugal

>>5471128
>File: 1453422901675.png (390 KB, 494x596)
>All you fags have to do is hold until someone is willing to take crypto as leverage on a loan, then default on that loan. They take your crypto, and you take the cash, and it's 100% tax free and legal. It's called an asset swap.
>And how great is it that the coin that might allow this to happen is called SALT.


This. Use SALT to cash out in the US.

so decentralized exchanges will be huuuge!
thank you meridumbs

>>5471286
This will shock you, anon, but - other countries exist

>muh maga

>>5476545
just say it was a gift from a friend and pay normal tax on it

>>5478343

Better than hillary lmao