/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>54327905
why did mechanical engineering go to shit/ got superseded? auto-CAD and other design programmes doing all the work? I am genuinely interested.

>>54327916
oversaturated, it was just the most popular engineering degree and society didn't need that many

>>54327916
In the 2000s there was mass exodus of heavy machining jobs to China. Now they upped into design, undercutting their western counterpart.
tldr China to mech eng is like India to IT

>>54327952
I think some manufacturing will come back to the us so mechanical engineering will become popular again. But I wouldn't be surprised if engineering in general was next in the AI chopping block.

>>54327905
At my school cs is 85% poos and chinks.

Mechanical Engineering is at least 70% white.

I myself am studying Chemical Engineering, and when I asked ME's why they said it was because the degree is extremely versatile. A codemonkey will be forced to grovel away at lines of code for the rest of his life, but Mechanical Engineers have more options, and are treated better by larger companies.

>>54327945
>>54327952
ahhhh righto, yes that makes perfect sense. thanks for informing me.

currently doing a BSc in CS, and I'm somewhat of a brainlet in all honesty
what do i pivot to, /biz/?

you just have to learn to use AI to make money

>>54327952
>jobs outsourced to india in the early 2000s
>jobs come back to america by the early 2010s

Not sure if it was the negative interest rates, really shitty experiences by companies that outsourced, or both.

Industrial engineering is where it's at

>do more shit with analytics and data
>still learn most of the important stuff of mechanical engineering
>more business shit to understand economies of scale
>major is a bit easier so you have more time to fuck around

Join the fucking /crew/

>>54327987
>A codemonkey will be forced to grovel away at lines of code for the rest of his life, but Mechanical Engineers have more options, and are treated better by larger companies.
You're a retarded student who hasn't been exposed to the real world yet. Yeah your mechanical classmates think it's all good while they listen to the dreams of professors who couldn't cut it in the industry. I've met more Mechanical Engineers turned Code Monkeys than I can shake a stick at. The "careers" available to them all involved getting pigeonholed into a specialty and never having options for type of work or even companies. It takes a special sort of person to enjoy tuning 0.001% improvements to HVAC compressors for the rest of their life. However, you're lucky Chemical Engineering was a good choice.

>>54328036
Nothing; you’re fine. If you’re that much of a brainlet, go get a union electrician apprenticeship. Assuming you’re a white male, ask yourself, will I be better or worse at dealing with the changing tech world then a stinky feet pajeet or a hive mind chink? AI fears are also way over estimated; anyone who thinks that way has no technical understanding of machine learning and is just observing mainstream reporting on the field.

>>54328242
>AI fears are also way over estimated; anyone who thinks that way has no technical understanding of machine learning and is just observing mainstream reporting on the field.
We replaced our junior devs with github copilot. Shortsighted? Maybe, but those faggots always left after a year anyway, and it honestly takes less effort to knock out simple tickets with it than to handhold a new grad through the process.

>>54328240
This nigga knows what's up.
Your profs will tell you that your stream has options and that there are plenty of jobs to choose from. Reality is harsh. Conventional engineering companies are running on paper-thin margins. Unless your company is working strictly within your country, the cushy inspection parts of the contract will be outsourced to the local companies. Many companies will push for office work because boomer managers will do anything to get out of their homes and unhappy marriages. Getting a WFH position can be challenging.

t. Electrical engineer who took learn2code pill

Coding jobs are fucking easy compared to mind-numbing drafting and occasional inspections. If you do go the coding route, you will have an advantage compared to bootcamp grads because HR and managers think that STEM major make better coders.

>>54327905
Thanks to computer science I got to work for a lot of crypto projects, most of them are shit ngl, but I can say that Hamachi Finance (HAMI) is the only one I trust and put bags on it, and this is certified as a dude who works with this shit

>>54328240
Lol, nigger. Literally nobody who ends up doing a conventional engineering will be doing it after their 20's unlike you balding codemonkeys. The expectation in electrical/mechanical/industrial/etc is that you do it for 6-7 years to get a solid foundation and move on into strategy, M&A, management, etc.

Unlike you CS niggers, who can only afford bachelor's degrees. Many of us have the luxury to afford to study different disciplines and go to law school, mba etc.

Imagine being 33 year old geezer and and still using javascript and c++ with your 25 year old chink/poo colleagues to make a living "working from home" when the mechanical and electrical engineers, have moved on and are being tasked with product development, corporate strategy, and marketing.

>>54327971
Your AI is going to turn a wrench?

I make 300k at age 26 with my CS degree.

>>54328240
Chemical Engineering is absolutely fucking horrible so now I know you’re completely full of shit, there’s literally no job openings for Chem E’s exclusively, any “chem e” job also lists ME’s and other garbage like Industrial Engineers on there as acceptable equivalents. ME sucks in 2023, but Chemical Engineering is fucking awful now, a complete wasteland.

>>54328036
>currently doing a BSc in CS, and I'm somewhat of a brainlet in all honesty
>what do i pivot to, /biz/?
Nothing Econ + Cs is probs the best combo you can get if you want to work in coporate.

>>54327916
Jeets

>>54328675
You sound like a newgrad who just started working in engineering. That's the kind of crap companies peddle to newbies.
>i will get experience and get my P.Eng (if in NA)
>I will get promoted to Project engineer, Project Manager, Dept Manager
>It will be glorious
That's literally what every fresh engie thinks. Get off your high horse. Engineering does not pay nearly as much as software. Just as many jeets as any other STEM, but they're generally older


If you are working, look around and draw conclusions.

>>54327987
You're in a for a rude awakening.

t. MechE

>>54328240
No he's right mech E degree feels like being a chad. Literally a qualifying paper that proves you have a shape rotator brain. Much cooler than a chem E degree (wordcels)

>tfw work from home automation engineer with bs ME

>>54328698
Engineering is not blue collar labor. It is raw logic that computers excel at.

Lmao at various engineering plebs here fighting it out over who has it the least worst. Data science jobs are the meta.

> Barely changes YoY, statistics remains the same as it was back when I learned it in uni
> Mostly automated, literally just click a few buttons and "run the analysis" while I sit on my ass
> Only real work is having to explain shit to people, but chatgpt writes the first draft for my reports
> Meanwhile actual coders have to learn new shit all the time, working till 10pm to find that illusive bug in their code, and broader engineering chumps like ME earn jack shit.

It's not as bad as getting a Master's in Psychology and having to be a shrink for an AI.

I make $270k as a software engineer (I'm 28) and I have a mechanical engineering degree. An ambitious mechanical engineer will peak out at maybe $150k. I try to reply in these mechanical engineering threads that pop up a lot on biz to help my fellow mech e bros. MECH E is DEAD. DO SOFTWARE ENGINEERING. IF YOU ARE YOUNGER THAN JUNIOR YEAR OF COLLEGE, DO COMPUTER SCIENCE

>>54332977
I don't even know why I come to these threads, maybe for masochist reasons. I'm a mere wagie than got into lmao community college at 21, fucking floundered getting through it as I just got older and more irrelevant than ever. I finally graduated with 2 shit tier degrees to allow me to transfer to a real school in 2022 but by then Vax mandates and having to get loans put me off on it all. I felt like I was filtered by my stem classes anyways. Fucks sake, it took me 3 tries to get through Trigonometry. Funnily enough, it was hard to determine what was worthwhile back then, Chemistry felt like a dead end, CS was over saturated by zoomers and Mech E felt like it wasn't worth it in this country. Still though, I desired the accomplishment of a STEM degree.

>>54327905
>gay is the new gay
Very cool thread op

>>54332977
I should also mention that I'm the same age as you. How would you salvage being 28 with just an associates in science and in communications?

>>54328240
>However, you're lucky Chemical Engineering was a good choice
Jfl it's the same shit
I have a masters degree in chem Eng and the indusrty is as saturated as for mech engineers
The only good thing is that we, like our bros from mech eng, can be used in shitton of different positions and tasks ( did finance, automation etc in the past)
Engineering just died, codemonkeys killed us completely over the last two decades

>>54333286
I have a friend that is probably about as smart as you. He has no degree. He did a bootcamp and self studied web development and applied to a shit ton of coding jobs. He now makes 120k. It might be unrealistic for you to break into big tech like me and make the big $, but his path is absolutely doable even if you are a midwit. You are ahead of my friend because you at least have a degree on your resume. My advice is to live like a NEET and grind learning software engineering and web development for about 4-6 months for 8 hours a day. Then, start mass applying to jobs and hopefully it won't take you longer than 6 months to get hired. The whole process might sound brutal, but you will literally get hired for 90-130k for your first job and it only goes up from there. Also, consider lying on your resume about having 1-2 years of experience already. And have a fake company or a friend with a company for the background check. Hope this is helpful to anons, I gave you the game plan and if you are willing to grind and eat shit, you can fundamentally change your lifetime earning potential. Also software engineering jobs are extremely comfy

>>54332977
big deal, I make $430k and i'm a plumber, i'm 21.

>>54327905
that was fast

>>54328675
>strategy, m&a
kek
t. corporate finance wagie

>>54328675
Serious cope. Do you think those roastie-tier positions just don’t exist in software companies, assuming I even wanted one?

>>54327905
Idk and honestly idgaf, I just want marlin to finally do fucking something so I can brag about it with my family for being retarded

>>54327905
2 more weeks.

>>54333735
I think the one with severe retardation is you

>>54333735
Not a chance faggot, that vaporwave shit is doomed for good

>>54333589
It was too slow even, I thought it was gonna get fucked sooner

>>54333735
Well...

>>54333735
That's not something to brag about anon, do the coping

>>54328698
If AI is a threat to one job, its a threat to all jobs. It could be used to develop robots at scale that could turn a wrench. The tech already exists for robots like this.

>>54328294
This mf is spitting facts. I'm also an EE who is learn2code pilled. However I did do a bootcamp and I think certain bootcamps & project experiences they offer can help you be a better candidate and land a job vs your peers, but the degree definitely helps a ton.

As shitty as modern university study in America is, a degree effectively shows that an individual is both not completely retarded and dedicated enough to pass the corporate shit test of whether someone's deserving of a job. A STEM even more so because brainlets get filtered out.

>>54328819
>>54327916
Every single nerdy white guy, asian guy and indian guy who was born in the 90s went engineering. Most of them cant get jobs now.

I went into medicine because cocky CS majors kept FUDing medschool, as they do every profession. CS job security is tethered to the NASDAQ. Doctors are hedged against humans aging and getting sick.

Start my clinical rotations this fall. Comfy as a motherfucker

>>54327905
buy the rumour, sell the news.

what is the future of civil engineering?
t. graduating next month

>>54330265
Retard, you have no clue what you are talking about

>>54328814
I was Econ and math, ended up in private equity research working 60+ hours a week. The money was good but the hours weren’t worth it. I was getting in really bad shape and not sleeping much at all. Trying to shift toward data science and eventually just entrepreneurship. Fuck working for other people man I’m over it. All I will say about Econ is, if you want to study Econ make sure it’s at a reputable university. I’ve seen some schools Econ curriculum and it’s a joke.

If the main math requirement at your school is calc 1 and econometrics isn’t required to graduate then don’t study there. Calc 3 was the minimum requirement at my school and linear algebra/diff eq was required for some electives and for the math + Econ program.

>>54327905
OOOPSIES!

Sure would be a shame if we made your entire industry obsolete!

>>54327905
Computer Science bachelors degree + economics minor or business minor or finance minor = millions per year on Wall Street.

If the worldwide banking system doesn't shit the bed Monday.

>>54328240
>>54328294
wait so you're telling me there are no new developments happening in the field so these people with degrees can't get employed? how is this possible?

>>54333584
I’m 19, hvac. Pulled 600k last year shit you not

>>54335527
Jobs are there, but they pay below living wage. You will literally be making the same or less than non-stem wagies. Not sure if you mean innovation or new projects when you say developments, I will assume both.

Big projects are still happening, but profit margins are slim and it's not uncommon to have "creative interpretations" of code to meet deadlines and not lose the contract. Lots of projects do get outsourced for design and that means that those assholes will have code violations that will pop up only during/after construction stages.

Innovation does not happen because building codes don't change much and companies/engineers do not want to risk careers signing off of some cool new tech that might land them in jail if it collapses and kills someone.

Layoffs are rampant. It is common practice to hire dozens/hundreds of engies when a new project comes in and lay them off as soon as it ends. Latest tech layoffs are nothing compared to what has been happening in engineering over the past 20-30 years. It just comes with the territory.

I do have friends in civ/mech/elec who are happy with their jobs. Pay is meh, but better than some other professions.They love what they do, but I have to say that they are in a minority.

Unironically, learn2code. It will help you either way. Whether you will automate processing excel and report generation (fucking endless reports) or switch entirely to swe.

So from this thread, what I've gathered is:
>Computer Science is over saturated
>Mechanical Engineering is over saturated
>Chemical Engineering is over saturated
Now something doesn't add up here, how can most engineering and software dev fields be oversaturated when the general stigma is that most people in college get useless degrees in liberal arts, psychology, etc.? Where is this saturation coming from?

>>54328240
>HVAC compressors
Tiny subset of an extremely broad field. MEs who do robotics are just as valuable as EEs and CS codecucks.

>>54336043
Immigration. Especially pajeets

>>54335787
Pure bullshit.

>>54336043
>Now something doesn't add up here, how can most engineering and software dev fields be oversaturated when the general stigma is that most people in college get useless degrees in liberal arts, psychology, etc.?
>implying that non-engineering degrees aren't ALSO oversaturated
Everything is supply and demand. There is still more demand for engineering degrees than liberal arts relative to their supply, so they'll pay better than average, but it used to be much better in the past when the supply wasn't as large. Most recently CS had its boom because it's a relatively new field, which drove high demand and the supply was low so salaries were extraordinarily high. One decade later wherein everyone and their grandmother were lining up to study CS combined with a developing recession in the tech industry, we now have a glut of CS people and a sudden contraction in jobs, which means that CS salaries will go down over time, and this will only get worse as more and more CS grads come onto the market at such a high rate (because the perception of a cushy big tech job will last much longer than they actually exist in reality). This process already occurred in ME and EE in the late 20th century wherein they got rugpulled by outsourcing of productive industry to Asia.
>Where is this saturation coming from?
More graduates than jobs in their respective fields. One whitepill is that if you can get past the early-career phase and fill a lucrative niche as an experienced engineer then your situation improves considerably because you're harder to replace. This is true of any engineering field.

>>54336400
Makes sense, and lines up with all the threads on /g/ about anons getting CS degrees and struggling to land jobs even after sending hundreds of resumes. Sucks since I decided to go the CS route as well and will probably have to deal with the same thing after (if) I graduate.
>One whitepill is that if you can get past the early-career phase and fill a lucrative niche as an experienced engineer then your situation improves considerably because you're harder to replace. This is true of any engineering field.
What if I've currently got a job at a company and might have the opportunity of pivoting into an engineering role since there's going to be a position open soon that I'm being recommended for? Granted, it's entry level stuff, I figure it might still be worth it if I'll be harder to replace.

>>54336596
>Makes sense, and lines up with all the threads on /g/ about anons getting CS degrees and struggling to land jobs even after sending hundreds of resumes. Sucks since I decided to go the CS route as well and will probably have to deal with the same thing after (if) I graduate.
For the moment it is still one of the better choices as long as you're actually interested in the field and would enjoy the job enough to stick with it. However, if you're only in it for money then you're probably screwed.
>What if I've currently got a job at a company and might have the opportunity of pivoting into an engineering role since there's going to be a position open soon that I'm being recommended for? Granted, it's entry level stuff, I figure it might still be worth it if I'll be harder to replace.
Depends on the engineering role. You want to target a niche which is in demand and hard to find expertise in. This probably means something highly technical that requires high IQ, because there are simply far less smart people than retards in the world. What are you looking at currently?