/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>5389075
just don't cash out

>>5389075

In belgium it's unclear

Capital gainz are tax exempt but a recent ruling imposed a 33% tax on a bitcoin trader

Depends on how the fiscal administration see your gainz (safe investment 1+ years or active trading)

source (Dutch)

https://www.tijd.be/markten-live/nieuws-algemeen/Fiscus-belast-bitcoinwinsten-aan-33-procent/9965305?ckc=1&ts=1514036906

>>5389075
In Venezuela nobody gives a fuck to be honest.

>>5389227
Nobody wants to go there in the first place anyway

>>5389075
They were never like-kind trades. The new law exlicitly states it only applies to real estate. Hiring a tax attorney and paying the fines are going to be more expensive than paying capital gains.You also have to state your like-kind trades if you want to test the system. Good luck.

>>5389512
Did you even read the post

>>5389075
can you elaborate on Hong Kong and Singapore's special programs?

For fucks sake you illiterate morons.

THERE WAS NEVER LIKE KIND FOR CRYPTO. LIKE KIND IS AN EXCEPTION FOR REAL ESTATE. "LIKE KIND" ISN'T A GENERAL STATEMENT.


You pay taxes on every trade. If your btc goes up 20% and you trade it for an alt that 20% Is a capital gain. If you're worried about "paying more taxes than you made money", then either cash out your taxes when incurred. Capital losses offset capital gains.

The US literally applies the very fucking simple capital gains rule to crypto. If you're too dumb to understand capital gains taxes do the human race a favor and kill yourself.

It's so fucking easy.

>>5389753
Look up 2018

>>5389588
https://www.forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2017/08/15/cryptocurrency-traders-risk-irs-trouble-with-like-kind-exchanges/

Go ahead and test the system during their crackdown.

>>5389840


Nothing. Changed. LIKE KIND was never ever allowed before.

How will the IRS ever know you acquired that money from trading in the first place? Once you've pulled out of binance, and your trading exchanges outside of the US, how are they going to even force those places to give them your data? These places dont collect your SS number, they dont issue 1099 form, because none of this stuff is traded in USD. This stuff cant even be bought or sold for USD, so it technically has to USD value, so your gains would be 0 USD anyway, all your gains are in ETH, BTC, or what ever you trade in.
And if they ever try to crack down, whats stoping you from haveing your account "Hacked" and all your money stolen, and you writing it off as a capital loss? You trade everything to monero and send it to a private wallet off the exchange. Then a couble of years later you trade to ETH and sell for profit. And just claim you friend mined some years ago and gave you some when they were worth less than a cent, and you just found the wallet on one of your old PCs. Or that you bouth an old laptop at a thrift shop and would you found all the ETH on the HD, how lucky are you!
The only way they can make you pay those taxes is if you voluntarily comply and you dont have to pay anything until you convert to USD.

>>5389905

When your bank automatically reports latge transactions to the irs.

>>5389905

And all the scenarios you listed are also taxable.

Holy fuck biz is full of morons.

When you get audited they'll either assume your basis is $0 for all trades or send you to ass rape prison.

>>5389075

Move to Belarus

https://news.bitcoin.com/belarus-legalizes-cryptocurrencies-icos-tax-free/

This isn't even hard. You download a list of your trades and put it into https://bitcoin.tax/ and it will give you the tax you owe. You pay the tax.

Why are people making this more difficult than it needs to be.

The only real issue is moving your stack to another crypto and then it tanks and you don't have enough to pay the tax because you have a large stack. This does suck. After a real big windfall you should cash out 30 percent of it to cover taxes.

>>5389918
You can correct or amend these to clarify it was in the course of trade or business, but you wont even argue that

>>5389905
IRS will apply a zero cost basis and fuck you over more thamif you just paid your taxes.

>>5389944
Not the found one. Found assets arent taxable i thought.
Also your bank doesnt file reports for transactions under 10k, so as long as youre not being audited they wont notice if youre careful

>>5389974
Holy shit can you imagine how you can live there as a crypto millionaire when every other pleb only makes like $200 a month?

also
>hot sluts who will do anal on the first date
>everything cheap as fuck

>>5389905
This guy gets it.

>>5389983

And the irs will wonder where the fuck the associated taxes are. And you get audited. I'm a CPA and a lot of people listening to biz retards are about to get totally fucked.

>>5389512
This.

He's right. The new law simply clarifies due to people trying to game the system and saying it's a grey area. Each trade is taxable now.

>>5390006
as long as the hot sluts accept monero then we good

And banks also report if you do tons of 8 or 9k transactions. And you get federal tax evasion charges.

Pay your fucking 15% tax Jesus christ.

>tfw 2 citizenships masterrace
>have accounts in 2 different names
>can move around money undisturbed
>if anyone asks, the money comes from my rich aunt which lives abroad

>>5390050
>Pay your fucking 15% tax Jesus christ.
fucking make me faggot

>>5389719
Uh no you dumbfuck, like kind HAS been allowed, up until NOW. Starting Jan 1st 2018, ONLY REAL ESTATE is considered like kind..get it fucking right.

>>5390050
>p-please p-pay for the niggers
How about no?

>>5389075
Why can't you just pay taxes, why risk it

>>5390011
Show me anywhere in the IRC or CFR that legally Defines Trade or Business as anything other than holding a PUBLIC OFFICE domiciled in Washington D.C.

Show me Legal boy I will give you a fucking whole Bitcoin if you can do this

>>5389918
>>5389944
Sure you would have to pay income tax on whatever you pull out to USD, but thats only what you pull out, and you dont have to pay all the taxes on each individual trade. Lets say you make 1 mil trading crypto, you pull out 20k to do something like pay off your car. You hay the tax on that 20k, and not the 1 mil you have sitting in you crypto wallets. You only pay taxes on what you have to.

Need monero debit cards, problem solved lol

Any of you lads know what the situation is in the UK?

I don't mind paying tax if we're not retarded like the clapistanis and try to tax every trade

Why should we give our crypto money to refugees. God I hate America.

Anyone know anything about Spain?

>>5390050
>Pay your fucking 15% tax
I wish it was only 15% where i live.

can you just keep track of what you put in and what you pull out and calculate the tax rate on that difference? Surely the maths is the same?

what they gonna do
no exchange has a pic of me nor my real name
i only trade on binance for now
if they want my money they can work hard to get it lmao
still have bittrex with a 0,4 btc daily limit but i dont trust these fucks anymore

Brainlet here. What if you travel out of the US, get a temporary shipping address, buy gold with Bitcoin and sell it, then come back with the foreign fiat to convert it. How do taxes work for this scenario?

>>5390158
Same as in the US; different rates apply

Why don't you cash out with literal cash?

That's what I do and I doubt the guy who I trade BTC with for cash will ever tell anyone.

>>5390216
No. That's the whole point.
You put in 10k into ADA it moons to 50k and then you move your 50k stack to DGB and it tanks to 5k. You still owe 5k from your ADA gains. Gains you don't have.

If you want to be ultra safe after a big windfall, trade the 30 percent to ETH to Coinbase and sell the ETH for fiat.

>>5390088

No it was never allowed for crypto. Retard.

So my exchange, Coinone, which allows on-boarding in fiat (Korean currency) has deleted all my trades and withdrawals/deposits, and I'm a US citizen.

What the hell can I do? I don't even have any idea how much I started with.

Just read the fucking book brainlets

>>5389075
Belarus just declared Crypto legal and tax-free for 5 years. If you are a burger you could go there and live for 1 year, so the IRS doesn't fuck you in the ass, and then cash out.

>>5390158
In the UK you get £11000 allowance on capital tax gain per tax year.

PS If you are not a registered trader with HMRC

If you are going beyond that then get in contact with accountants.

>>5390314
but your capital gains will be offset by your losses when you eventually cash out..working out to be the same. No? I'm not good at maths but that's my understanding

>>5390285
you'll run into tax problems when you try to cross borders with more than like 10k cash

LIKE KIND was never allowed for crypto. Never. Never. I'm a fucking cpa.

If you're audited for 2017 you will be ass raped.

My government requires me to document every single trade on top of every single address I've used. I haven't reported anything all these years (I started in 2013) and now I need to go through a process where I basically admit that I screwed up and pay what I need to pay. The issue is that I haven't kept track of what I need to, so I'm screwed. I have a 7-digit figure in crypto and I'm looking to take out a large portion so I can buy my own apartment and whatnot.

I'm thinking I'll just give them a reasonable estimation of what I should pay and whatnot, and if they ask me for documentation just tell them I screwed up and leave the rest to lady luck. Prison here is nice, so I honestly wouldn't even mind spending a while there either.

>>5389075
Source on Panama and Costa Rica?

>>5390315

Congress write the laws, not the IRS. The IRS was only issuing "guidance" to good little cucks who were way overpaying to feel safe. Since the law was not specifically made retroactive, any reasonable judge would look at the bill and say "well this law only takes effect january 1st and since it is not specifically retroactive, anything before that doesn't matter"

In USA, unless you made really, really bad investments, you won't be taxed more than you earned. Generally speaking, you will end up being taxed normally according to how much profit you earned this year. Please actually research how tax works. You deduct your trade fees and trade losses through wash sale rule from your earned income, etc.

All of you in denial and risking federal prison over 15% taxes deserve to be ass raped by Jamal.

The 2017 tax calculator on bitcoin.com taxes every trade for a reason.

>>5390404
first things first, where do you live?

>>5390433
Norway.

>>5390373
It's only income or can be tracked by the IRS until it's converted to FIAT and exchnaged through coinbase into a bank account. How do they audit you on money you don't have?

>>5390414

Did you fill out the 2 page like kind form for every single trade you made this year?

>>5390342
Oh nice - I had kinda gone along thinking we had just the tax floor on income tax, but if it's also on capital gains too, then I'm very much safe

>>5390421
What about >>5390333
?
US Citizen trading exclusively in foreign currencies via a proxxy (somebody else's name) account on an exchange that deleted all my records. This is really how I do it, so what should I even try to do?

The problem is that the IRS sees my US bank account getting $50,000 wire transfers from some obscure foreign bank account every month or so. Also I've cashed out into Gdax before going back into trading before.
What can I do about that?

>>5390458


They ask to see the transactions. And if you can't provide the transactions, they tax you assuming the cost basis was $0. So they don't care. They win either way

WHAT ABOUT MOTHER RUSSIA GUYS?

>>5390429

So tell me Mr. Wizard, if it was "thaaa lawwww" (Judge Dredd Voice) why did Congress need to bother to write it in to the tax bill?

You pay tax on cost vs sell.

Litterlly impossible to get taxed more then you made with simple cap gains

You might have to sell tho.

20 trades does not equal 20x taxes. Some people man...

>>5390369
I see, thanks. If I ever make it, I'll just dump most of my portfolio into ETH and let it sit for a year and just pay the taxes. It'll be more money than I ever thought I could ever have anyways.

>>5390429
Again, it's not that simple when exchanges literally delete your trading records.

I entered through CB, then traded on BTC-e, now that is gone, I don't have records to draw from..but they FBI..so I will just refer the IRS tot eh FBI and let those 2 deal with each other if they want my details when the time comes. I am hoping we get some crypto lobbiests and we can get some amendments passed to ease this shit for crytpo investors. If the market is big enough, it will have influence.

>>5390438
Are you open to relocating? How much is 7 figures? How much of your portfolio is in top 15 coins and therefore easy to liquidate to cover admin expenses?

>>5390500

Just to clarify it. LIKE KIND wouldn't hold up in court for crypto. I'm sure some people will be trying it once they're audited for 2017.

>>5390429
>>5390463
>>5390373
>>5390315
>>5390050
>>5390011
>>5389972
>>5389944
>>5389918
>>5389896
>>5389753
>>5389719
IRS pls go
taxation is theft
you're never ever ever getting one single fucking satoshi from me

>>5389075
Hopefully the IRS will tax cryptocurrency so high, it's worthless. Mining using way too much electricity which is bad for our environment.

>>5390517

Well then you're the dumbass for not having your own records. Tough shit. Cost basis on those trades is now $0 under audit.

>>5390538
hes right though, planning and strategizing for tax implications is important

>>5390472
Read this

http://cryptotax.uk/guide/

Make sure to back up all of your trades

>>5390487
What exchange do you guys recommend that doesn't want to verfiy you by person? Non american here btw

>>5390506
>You pay tax on cost vs sell.
literally false. you get taxed on every single trade

>>5390122
Wrong, you pay taxes on all your gains for the year. You can make 100k in gains and it’s all sitting in binance or in your wallets, you will owe the govt tax money. You moving anything to your bank account is now irrelevant. It sucks but that’s the law.

>>5390579
Thanks, have been doing just that

>>5390496
But how do they know you ven own crypto or how much you have? This isn't a US bank account where they can threaten your bank to release your transaction history and bank statements. What if your money is in a crypto wallet converted to a privacy coin like monero that they could never track. There no one to give them information, there's no one they can point their guns at. They have lost their power.

>>5390562

Does anyone really give a shit about $0 cost basis though?

I mean if you started with $1k in Bitcoin and traded your way up to a million dollars, are you going to bitch you can't write that $1k off as your initial investment on your taxes?

>>5390579
Although I'll add that I'm a dual citizenship so might take a look at what my other country offers

>>5389075
anons are stupid if,youre american none of these tax havens work unless you denounce your citizenship you will owe ustaxes onlu yhe first 100k is non taxable overseas

>>5390530
I mean, I could probably live like a king in some other place, but I do quite like Norway and would like to stay here. I'd like to know what options there are though.

As for how much it is, see pic related. The majority is in XRB, so it's not realistic to be able to get all that out at the current price, but luckily I only invested what was at the time worth $65k into XRB and I have yet to sell a single one of those coins, so those gains have yet to be realized.

>>5390072
Taxation is rape. Keep you're big government dick out of my asshole

>>5389227
>cashing out in Venezuela
kek

>>5390770
cant wait for them sieze half your money..again you need renounce your citizenship or else you still pay us taxes no matter where you live. failure to report foreign bank accounts result in 100k fine or half of the accont which ever is greater

http://fortune.com/2017/03/06/renounce-us-citizenship-irs/

>>5390338
Can i gt a fucking (YOU)

>>5390487
Try to reconstruct the trades through your bank account transaction records. Be ready to show how you calculated your cost bases, earnings, etc. if you get audited. You'll be fine as long as it's reasonable and you tried your best to be accurate.

>>5390911
I'm not American.

>>5390918
JUST

>>5390930
Ok..does it matter that all the trades are in somebody else's name? Meaning the exchange account is somebody else's and hooks up to somebody else's bank account and they just wire to me?

>>5390778
blame obama, "To some degree it is President Obama’s fault. It was Obama and the Democratic Congress that passed a law in 2010 that forced foreign banks to disclose U.S. citizens,” says Mitchel."

please us anons get an overseas bank anf not tell the irs cant wait cor the audit posts come april

>>5390597
I know what the fucking law says, and what the IRS wants good goys to do. The IRS has no way of knowing how much crypto you actually own. They only know what you have if you tell them. Paying high tax rates on smaller chunk of your crypto that you need to convert to USD to make transactions, even if that amount is taxed at the higher income rate, is preferable to paying 15% to ever trade and transaction on everything you own. 30% of 20k is less money than 15% of 1 mil

>>5390934
then youre good anon

>>5390770
How much $ did you start trading with? In the next 3 years you will be able to make even more since the crypto market is just starting to get big.

PS: Don't pay the tax, leave Norway for a couple years and cash out in Panama or Belize or something.

>>5391030
I started with $8000 in 2013.

>>5390958
I don't know. Why don't you look up for yourself whether it is legal?

>>5390968
I blame the GOP, fiscal conservatism and limited government my ass.

Jesus Christ, these are the retards I've been taking crypto advice from

>>5389075
Pro tip: Don't declare it. If you are paranoid about them checking up on you then Wash your trades and crypto in monero and on exchanges and never use your original accounts or exchanges that require ID again.

NEVER FORGET that btc ws created to take the power over the individual's wealth away from the banksters and governments. By conforming to their demands for tax you are being a sheep. They have no power here! This is our time, this is where we make a stand against them. They can't put us all in jail, tell them to fuck off!

Is anyone here actually a banker? Are there any IRS directives for you to send them notice of deposits from coinbase? Please no meme answers.

>>5390538
This.

IRS is a crypto-commie organization full of anti American communist kikes and niggers who unfairly target conservatives for audit. It should be dissolved on this basis alone. FUCK THE IRS.

>>5391274
yes go ahead get a bank account andtransfer the money in their and thwn the bank reports you to the irs because they have to get half of your money taken before all the fines and penalities

>>5390562
I have done half of my trading black out drunk and I have been signed up to most exchanges before they even required identification. I don't even fully know what I currently own let alone all my past trades since fucking 2012. Whatever tax man gets assigned to me can enjoy the fuck headache, i've literally sent 20BTC to a nonexistent address, give me my capital loss for life you faggots.

>>5391392
they already said they will report all accounts over 20k

>>5391395

Stop using the roads then faget

>>5391419
capped at 3k per year for capital loss

Trade A blueberry bought 1 dollar
Trade B blueberry sold for 2 dollars
Trade C blueberry bought 4 for 50 cents

Trade D 3 blueberrys traded for 1 mango

Trade E mango sold for 10 dollars

What's my taxes guys! In US at 28% rate no state. Who's a Smart Tax guy here

>>5391468
How are they going to tax me on btc to alt transactions when I ended up losing the alt in misplaced wallets?

>>5391274
> Can't cash out
Questions will arise about where the BTC or ETH came from that you used to get the XMR if you ever wanted to cash out.

>>5389093
Doesn’t matter. You still get taxed on the USD value of any crypto-to-crypto trade.

>>5391497
if its a loss you wou'd report it. the irs wants reporting. good and bad transactions.

>>5391412
Yeah, you HAVE to pay tax on any money converted to USD or they will find and extort it from you. But they don't need to have any information on how much you hold in crypto. They sure as hell want it, but they only know what you tell them. It's not like your leger wallet alerts the IRS when you make a BTC depoist. This is a decentralized, bankless system that they have no control over, don't willingly give them control over your stake in it.

>>5391594
that was my orginial plan as well. as im not cashing out till lambo land but i am on the fence. i,ll probably hold off this year and next and file an amendment if the irs starts going bat shit crazy

>>5391532
How will they ever know? The exchanges aren't in the US, and aren't regulated by the US government, they don't trade in USD and they dont interact with banks.
Well are all aware of what the law state, but for a law to matter they have to be able to enforce it or it's just voluntary compliance.

With the new tax policy in place, isn't the IRS going to be working overtime on more important things like the new estate taxes?

Secondly, with how much hassle it has to be to figure out who owes taxes on crypto, why would they waste all their time and power to try to get like $5000 out of us little fishies. I can see them going after the multi millionaire trader who's pumping millions worth of coins every day

>>5391591
fuck them, I am jobless with 0 reported income and I got into bitcoin when it was 8$ I'll wait for them to come find me, they can fucking figure out what I owe. I'm never fucking cashing out anyway, not as long as I can sell it for cash in person and get amazon giftcards.

I moved all my crypto into long term holds and plan on only making long term trades after calculating my taxes this year. I can foot 15% for long term gains, but 24% is too much for for me to gamble on internet funny money.

U.S. Citizen here who has cashed large sums with a few tips.

So far I have only reported initial cash investment to the time of cashing out. I have yet to see the IRS to prove otherwise or say not accept my tax file. Due note that sending bank statements and decent documentation when filing your taxes does a lot.

Also for most U.S. people on this board you're probably in the tax bracket that after a year you pay 0% so stop being such a spaz about it.

Depending on your state most should only tax the cash settlement as income included with any income earned in from your Job. In Ohio were I reside its 5%.

People who are concerned with getting tax fucked are mostly likely already earning at a high income which should only be 1% of this board anyway. NEETs use this time to hodl or make as much as you can to take advantage of your tax bracket.

taxes are theft

>>5389201
In Belgium you don't have to pay taxes if you treated your investment like a 'good house father' would, which means buy & hold for at least one year. The same applies to crypto.

>>5391465
Muh roads
God this is the dumbest and oldest argument in the world. Surely there is no other way we could have roads if the government didn’t make them!

Pathetic cuck you make me sick

>>5391465
I'm not even anti-roads or taxation in general but he is right that the IRS is anti-American commie kikes who belong in the oven.

>>5391840
whar are talking about. ypu dont send bank statements with your tax return.

you keep thwm youeself in thw case you get auditied

columbus anon here

>>5390050
>Pay for Ahmed to come and rape our daughters Jesus christ.

Fucking kys faggot

Any info for Canada?

Ok, say I only used coinbase to purchase btc, which I then sent to various exchanges. I completed various trades on the exchanges, but have never returned funds to coinbase. If i planned on cashing some out, would the IRS be satisfied if I recorded the amounts I initially purchased on coinbase vs the amount I eventually cashed out, and paid any taxes owed on cap gains? Is the IRS simply content to get their money? Can't see them bothering to audit a small time poorfag who voluntarily paid cap gains. Not sure if that makes sense...

tl:dr. record initial investment, pay cap gains tax when you cash out. Don't bother with recording and calculating every single trade.

>>5392141
>>5391840
Columbus Ohio niggas!!! What's goin on!!!

>>5392801
You'd have to convert it back to BTC to cash out. If the number of BTC is higher than the initial purchase, it would raise question since BTC isn't created in thin air. You'd probably be fine if it isn't a substantial difference, but I'm not the IRS.

>>5389075
Just don't report it. They can't audit all of us!

>>5391465
Federal income tax doesnt pay for roads you idiot.

>>5391050
Might as well tell the tax authorities you can't tell them what you started with, so assume 0$. It really doesn't make a lot of difference getting taxed on 7mil or (7mil - 8k).

>>5391392
This entire thread is IRSniggers undercover, just like every biz tax thread.

>>5389075
>Hong Kong and Singapore have special programs for foreigners that exempt crypto taxation

PFfff, singapore has capital gains tax 0% for all and everything

>>5393544
>PFfff, singapore has capital gains tax 0% for all and everything
Yeah but that doesnt relinquish your USA tax obligations does it? Also how much do you have to pay to get setup in Singapore?

>>5391532
>binance (hong kong) and cryptopia (new zealand) are going to send the irs all of my hundreds of dogecoin and trx transactions
>some irs cuck is going to go through it all to say i owe taxes

yeah, nah

>>5390050
>Pay your fucking 15% tax
>pay for more welfare for low iq niggers and beans
how about fucking off?

>>5390050
Can we just do this?
[($ out + value of trades for all coins currently held) - (Money in)] * (rate) for cap gains?

>>5389075
I'm not paying shit. Brain wallet and send me to jail, or go out shooting. Central banking/government fiat ponzi can't end soon enough.

>>5390373
>If you're audited for 2017 you will be ass raped.
how are they going to know my trade history?

fuck off.

>>5393618
>USA tax obligations

Dunno about muricans. What tax obligations do you mean?

>>5389075
i live in the cayman islands. So i just dont' give a fuck about taxes.

I won't be taxed. it's that simple.

I just gotta prove to my bank where the money is coming from. IE. kraken. Or crypto

We need to spam the IRS with bullshit. How can they tax "Virtual currencies" does this money not include bullshit like runescàpe or wow money? How can we make this as ridiculous as possible for the IRS

>>5393744
>he's rubbing in the worldwide slave tax
stop that

>>5393778
I'm sure we'll think of nothing short of physically mass mailing dick pics to the IRS headquarters by the millions and clogging their offices with pictures of throbbing gristle. Its our style.

>>5393778
And what about hard forks? Were taxed on the capital gains of bs shitcoins we never asked for. We just need to make millions of shit coins hard forked til the IRS can't keep up

>>5390562
Mr. CPA, if I bought 1 ETH at $400 and 1 ETH at $800, and traded 1 ETH for $800 of LINK, how much gain is taxable? Are we to use FIFO, LIFO or averaging?

>>5393744
If you get out of taxes by putting the money into Singapore, how do you end up spending the money at home? Say you put 2million in and save yourselve 300k on taxes. How do you go buy an apartment building back home with that?

>>5390011
Kys parasite

>>5393716
This.
According to my tax return, I paid tax on every cent I made at my wagecuck job, in fact the IRS will likely write me a check in a few months.
I haven't sold any crypto, I have made no income. There's no money coming into my bank account expect my paychek which is already taxed. What are they going to do if they audit me? Ask for my bank statements?
The better questing is WHY would they audit me? According to their system, which is all in USD, I've payed all taxes required.

>>5391698

This is what I've been thinking. Where are they going to jail the thousands and thousands of NEETs who don't pay their taxes.

>>5393992
YUPPPPP. Keep the income low and don't cash out til past a year

>the irs is somehow going to get all of the info from my bittrex, cryptopia, polo, binance, and livecoin accounts
>the irs is going to somehow convince these sites to send them info on millions of users
>most of these sites aren't even based in the us
how about fucking off, irs niggers?

Why can't we sell crypto locally with cash and never reveal the assets?

>>5394097
The IRS won't know how much you made on foreign exchanges, but you'll have to find a way to cash out without alerting them. It will probably lower the average anon's tax liability long term if he pays capital gains at poorfag rates now rather than millionaire rates later.

>>5393992

You millenials are way too naive and selfish.

Grow up and pay your taxes.

>>5394192
>but you'll have to find a way to cash out without alerting them
>implying i even want cuckbucks anymore
tip top lmao, friend

Monero (XMR)

>fungible
>anonymous and private
>untraceable transactions
>fungible
>stable coin
>cpu mineable
>FUNGIBLE
>FUNGIBLE
>FUNGIBLE

fuck off irs niggers

>>5389075
Some crypto faget needs to setup an anonymous exchange. If thats even possible.

Trump really sold out his constiuency with this.
He's now an offical kike-traitor in my book.

I wish him peace so that i may be peaceful.

HAHAHAHAA

cryptards thinking they can hide their wealth from UNCLE SAM

>>5394198
>selfish
Selfishness is a virtue
Look at the state your boomer cuckoldry has put the world in.
When your taxes are being used to fund the destruction of your race in culture, why would any sane person want to willingly pay them?
Fuck off kike slave

>>5394396
not an argument. i have no wealth in USD until i convert back to USD. fuck off irs nigger

>>5394198
fuck off and die, boomer bitch.

crypto is the younger generation's revenge. we're going to rob you of those pensions and social security that you gave to yourself 40 years ago and all you can do is shit in your adult diaper about it

>>5389982

You just spelled out the problem you fucking idiot. You will owe more taxes than you make under this structure. If you do any amount of trading it's inevitable. Owing taxes on a gain you haven't realized is ridiculous. You can make "gains" in on year, pay taxes, and then the market crashes next year and you pay money on something you never realized.

>>5394482
you forgot to answer how the fuck the irs is going to get your trade history on offshore exchanges, irs nigger

IRS anon here. We will find you. You can't hide.

>>5394146

what is localbitcoins
ding ding ding ding

>>5394555
All I have to do is dispose of my US citizenship and move to a sanctuary city in commiefornia
Illegals don't have to pay taxes

>>5390350

No, because you already paid the tax. The government is not going to give you a refund on your taxes.

>>5391840
You're a cuck.

>>5394555
you want my buttcoins? cum and get them.

>>5389075
>imposing a capital gains tax on every trade to the extent where you can actually pay more than you've earned.
you don't know what capital GAINS means

The most evil thing in the world is people who do what the government tells them instead of living by their own rules so they can get by in life. You're going to create so much suffering in the world by giving your property and time away. Then the people who received it, it will be wasted on or twisted in a corrupt global power game. It is slavery and the people who accept income slavery are not Christians. Remember that the matrix is christian themed and red-pilled and how they subvert their given reality until Neo lives by his own rules. This is a serious moral issue that no crypto holder should back down on. It is only important to help the seriously mentally ill and elderly. The people selling their crypto are the robots and evil ones who accept instructions without question. Evil.

>>5391530

I mined it. Tell me otherwise.

Belarus wants you to bring crypto to them https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-23/bitcoin-climbs-finding-floor-after-worst-selloff-since-2015

I am from Costa Rica, nobody gives a shit here haha

>>5390315
>>5389719
No Mr. CPA. You are wrong. Wrong wrong wrong. The Loophole was indeed valid for 2017. It is 2018 in which the loophole no longer works. In 2017 you may take the stance that any coin transaction is a like kine exchange under Section 1031.

The tax act in Sec. 13303 amends IRC Section 1031 (a)(1) to delete “property” and replace it with “real property”

If you were a real CPA, you would know that amendments are not retroactive.

>>5395287
larping irs nigger btfo

>>5394657
don't you guys fkn do tax once a year? why would you pay tax on that gain immediately rather than offset it with ur losses come tax time? wtf

If I were to buy:
1 btc for $2000
1 btc for $9000
and put them in the same wallet and then later sell 0.5 btc, how do I know what my gain was??

>>5393942
Not a CPA, but I think it's FIFO by default unless you can prove LIFO (separate wallet, etc.)

>>5394861
You still have to pay taxes on mined crypto.

>>5391465
MUH ROADS

Doesn't the IRS not care if you're making <$600 from a given source of income? Which is why those surveys for cash sites don't send you a tax form until you make over $600 in a given year?

Could I apply this to crypto and buy myself something nice for Christmas?

>>5390007
More like gets audited

>>5390770
Easiest for you fellow Scandianon would be Bulgaria(10%) or Belarus(no tax)

>>5390585

>You pay tax on cost vs sell.
>you get taxed on every single trade

tax on total profits
50+20+30=100
0.15*100=15

tax on profits per trade
(50*0.15)+(20*0.15)+(30*0.15)=
[50+20+30]*0.15=15

hope that helps

>>5395504
What if you claims it was mined before 2014 before the IRS made a determination as to what the laws even were on cyrpto mining? What if you claim you got lucky and found or bought an old laptop with a crypto wallet on it and the password saved to a .txt on the desktop? Or what if you claim it was given to you by a friend?
There's plenty of ways to acquire crypto, especially when it was under a cent, and you could have claimed you held it for that long and are just now realizing you gains and selling it.

>>5395287
Like kind wouldn't hold up in court for most crypto. The tokens and coins all have varying utilities. It'd cost more money to fight the IRS about it than to pay your taxes if you get audited. Also, you have to report like kind transactions, which pretty much let's them know which crypto lords to fuck over.

>http://www.blogtalkradio.com/ghost/2017/12/23/true-capitalist-radio-hosted-by-ghost--episode-522
>108 minutes

>>5395852
Lol why would I get audited? I paid taxes on every cent I made in USD. If I get audited I would happily hand over my bank statement. I could just be shitposting and have $0 or I could have $300k, you or the IRS has no way of knowing because everything in crypto is unbanked and decentralized. There's no bitcoin bank to subpoena for records. All I have to do is wait until asset swaping with becomes a thing and I would legally pay 0 tax, just like all the other big boys.

>>5396542
You'd still have to convert the mined crypto to BTC to cash out which would be a short term capital gain with a zero cost basis.

>>5396852
Sure, but if i'm a crypto millionaire paying that tax on the 30k USD I need atm is still a lot less than paying taxes on my millions still in crypto. That way you only pay tax on what you spend, like a sales tax.

>>5391465
Fuck the roads. We paid for that shit because the gubment fell down to GM's demands. Give back our private train networks!

>>5393697
Tfw no answer. Pretty sure like kind holds up. This method would also set you up for 2018 taxes.

>>5396635
>Like kind wouldn't hold up in court for most crypto.
Yes, it would. That's why they made these changes in the first place. Crypto may be defined as "property" but not "real property".

>Also, you have to report like kind transactions, which pretty much let's them know which crypto lords to fuck over.

Not for 2017 and any years before that. Tax bills and amendments are not retroactive for the previous years.

Come 2018, and yes, you will have to report all transactions you make.

>>5397166
>Come 2018, and yes, you will have to report all transactions you make.

Not if you're trading on a foreign exchange like Livecoin or Binance, on an Americuck exchange like Polonies and Buttrex yes.

>>5397018
If you want to be a good goy, it doesn't hold up. 2018 makes it clear that like kind doesn't apply to crypto. The way the law is defined you realize a gain every time to make a trade, and its defined as a taxable event. If you want to follow the law, thats how you have to calculate the tax.
But they really have no way of enforcing this, so its basically voluntary compliance at this point.

I will not pay a fucking penny tax

I would rather die poor than hand over my hard earned crypto gains to these fucking parasites.

They can take my wageslave bucks but they will have to pry crypto gains from my dead cold hands.

>>5395898
Actually, forget Belarus, I don't think it works.
Seems impossible to get any long term visa or residence permit there

>>5390496
Is this really that bad? I made like 10000% so my original investment isn't going to make much difference from my gains.

>>5397527
Why???

You better not fucking be American.

If you are, get off my fucking roads. Unlearn the 12 years of public education. Never call the police in an emergency. Never call the fire department in case of a fire. COMPLETELY disregard our military, the strongest in the world and see how that goes...

You're the parasite, faggot. Pay your dam taxes...

>>5389227
Yeah but you are still loving there so that's that


You also cant cash out in Bolivares and even if you could that'd be retarded

>>5397593
You are beyond retarded you good goy.

>>5390285
You must declare at customs if you're carrying more than 10k with tou