/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>51562829
So what is the other option? Just let inflation run totally out of control?

>>51563009
they're the ones who created the inflation in the first place though. they crash the economy to buy assets on the cheap and then inflate to sell to the goyim. rinse and repeat

>>51563055
The fed is independent. They set (((monetary policy))), but they aren’t the ones that pass trillion dollar spending bills all the time

>>51562829
we are trapped in the belly of the machine
and the machine is bleeding to death

>>51562829
Just short the market then idiot

>>51563097
The buildings toppled in on themselves
Mothers clutching babies
Picked through the rubble
And pulled out their hair

>>51563055
This isn’t an answer you fucking /pol/cel retard

>>51563080
lmao at being enough of a goynigger to believe this
fed presidents literally sold the exact top because "oh lol is it a conflict of interest for us to own stocks? sorry". you're a fool if you don't think they're all in bed together laughing at poorfaggot goyim.

>>51563113
I hate when people scream "the market will crash aahhhhhh!!!" but they never short the market. They're fucking pathetic.

>>51563133
>bro you're pathetic unless you gamble with leverage and get yourself liquidated trying to time the crash
ok

At this point im fully in the end the fed camp they provide no useful services for the average american and allow the wealthy to basically pickpocket us

>>51562829
Inflation is being caused by supply chain destruction. The unemployment figures in the U.S. do not accurately convey the real employment situation of the country. We’re raising rates in a recession. What a mess.

How is anyone surprised at this point? Jerome said multiple times that he wants to crash the markets to the ground.

>>51563132
It was about 10% away from the top. And they were very upfront about selling, which was a clear warning sign to us peasants to sell if we actually like having money

>>51563132
This, I knew from that moment they got “caught” that it was the end. They sell, then it’s “we need to cause pain”.

Powell is the most retarded Fed chair in US history. He should’ve been moderately hiking years ago. Fucking kek at “they’re independent goy”

> muh layoffs
If this is a serious risk for you, you're probably a shit employee anyways and frankly deserve it. Good employees who get caught in org-wide layoffs can get a new job in a week.

>>51563219
>Jerome said multiple times that he wants to crash the markets to the ground.
about tine somebody has the balls to do it. should have been decades ago.

>>51562829
>Crash economy
>People become unemployed
>People file for government benefits
>Instead of people working and drawing pay, they sit at home on welfare/E.I.
>This is literally the exact economic policy being implemented
lol the economy is a sham

>>51563009
There's two ways to control inflation. Make it more attractive to hold dollars (interest rates higher) or force people to obtain dollars to pay in taxes, which has the added effect of removing dollars from the money supply.

>>51562829
>>51563097
>>51563124
I know it's a reddit tier take but I sincerely think that Dead Flag Blues is one of the best pieces of music ever written. It so perfectly captures a mood.

>>51563009
new currency

>>51562829
the irony that the government is doing everything in its power to make its own citizens lose jobs

what a fucking joke

>>51563740
great music to drive slowly through the bad part of town at night to, bonus points if there are lots of homeless/drug people wandering around
>>51563009
they are crashing this system to institute the digital economy based around CBDCs and the neo-SDR/Bancor which will be XRP

>>51563795
it's also melting down every other nation on earth, on purpose

>>51563711

I didn’t understand the second one can you explain

>>51563080
Jews are a monolithic group. There is no difference between Jews in the fed that set monetary policy and Jews in government that pass trillion dollar spending bills

>>51563133
Enjoy getting raped by theta lmao

>>51563167
>Inflation is being caused by supply chain destruction
There's no fucking "destruction" it's all in hold
it's all created in purpose, if ((they))) decided tomorrow to restart commerce, they would do it in a blink of a eye

>>51563362
When the job market is healthy, sure. When everyone is having lay-offs across the board you will be in a tough spot no matter how good you think you are.

GREAT RESET YOU RETARDS DONT YOU SEE

the fed cant hike much longer before the US government goes insolvent and needs to borrow massive amounts from the fed via QE to pay its debt
its a full on debt trap, and the US government will need to be bailed out by inflationary actions

>>51563988
Yep. But what to do

>>51563988
just means the dollar is a toxic asset, govs in the US sphere of influence are fucked without it. outsiders continue to get gaped because they never
took advantage of it to begin with and gain nothing from this event. really strange circumstance where sucking the US teat has been the optimally competitive strategy for years, cornering the market, and now everyone's getting cratered by the brutal rugpull

>>51563896
>>51563145
Shorting is, le bad! because I said so okay!

>>51564010
Accept Jesus

>>51563009
Tax rich people to pay for government subsidies until hyperinflation resets the standard.

>>51564065
>Dollar is a toxic asset
>Euro, Yen and even the Yuan are crashing.
ok

>>51564093
because of reliance on the dollar, which is now raping all of them

>>51563131
>he comes to 4chan for answers

Who is truly the retard here?

>>51564115
The dollar is the opposite of a toxic asset, at the moment it is a pristine asset since there's simply not enough dollars being created through new loan issuance, because we all know private banks create money.

>>51563888
Powell isn't Jewish, moron.

>>51564265
toxic in the sense that it has been administered for decades as stimulus that is now destructively unwinding as dollars are deliberately withheld. like a trojan horse, with bad intentions all along

I opened up my wallet
and it's full of blood

>>51564301
I see, yeah shorting the dollar (also known as "borrowing dollars") is a toxic liability. Debtors are going to see lots of pain.

>>51563009
We're not here to suggest fixes, we're here to complain number isn't going up forever

Fiat currency can have any value between 0 and infinity. It may be infinitely cheap or infinitely expensive, depending on how difficult it is to pay back debt.

This is what goldbugs fail to understand. Fiat currencies can be *harder* to find than gold sometimes.

>>51564367
the message is clear that relying on dollars is not worth it and the deal was always one-sided with the intent to take what was built with the dollars provided

>>51563131
Get fucked, redditor

>>51563009
inflation is a part of any economy, the last 52 years of deflation importing are the anomaly.

Sadly the west destroyed most of it's social system to deal with wage increases

>>51562829
>>51563219
Wasn't QE for the past 10+ years to keep unemployment low? Especially the past two years ramping up QE.
At least wasn't that their excuse?

So, the side effects of QE is transfer of wealth to the wealthy (which the FED admits) and inflation. To fix the side effects, you need to create unemployment and the wealthy that received the transfer of wealth are told to hold on to their new wealth?

What fucking clown world is this shit?

>>51564432
Of course, if you are buying real goods that you use, it's best to spend dollars rather than save it in inflationary times.

Most financial assets are not a hedge against inflation, other than maybe T-Bills and commodities.

>>51564468
>What fucking clown world is this shit?

it's called keynsianism

>>51564468
it's working well for dollar holders and the issuer of dollars. non-US economies are stuck in the prisoner's dilemma / byzantine general problem where the optimal solution requires their cooperation but they're all unreliable and distrustful of one another. so they get rekt by game theory
>>51564489
the question is whether demand for dollar debt will decline with the understanding that the gains from that debt will only last as long as it takes for the loan shark to decide to rob you of what you bought with the borrowed money

>>51563362
>be a useless eater working a bullshit job
>saved almost all of my monthly salary for the past 2 years
>now NEETing comfortably and slurping dips
Gamed the system baby

>>51563009
the solution is guillotines

>>51563220
>WELL WE WARNED YOU DIDNT WE GOYIM
>DONT BLAME US FOR SCAMMING YOU, WE TOLD YOU WE WERE GONNA DO IT!!!
absolutely talmudic

>>51562829
This is great news for me as a reforming NEET.
I know I can make it.

>>51564468
They'll never stop until you stop them yourself. You have to take everything from them.

>>51563219
>the rich get richer and the poor get poorer for 100 years
>crickets, happy headlines, life is good
>the rich get richer slightly less quickly and the poor remain poor… for maybe a year or two
>THIS IS AN OUTRAGE YOULL BE HEARING FROM MY LAWYER THIS IS SOCIETAL COLLAPSE!!!

>layoffs
kek you're all too naive
fed means bankruptcies, bankrupt companies can't pay wages

>>51564709
they sure can
that move is called the 'bailout' and it's a common occurrence in every healthy economy

>>51564709
Soon we’ll all be eating iguana on a stick or sopa de macaco like you

>FED keeps hiking rates to the point where people are priced out of housing and other loans
>Stock Market won't collapse because of all the buybacks, pump and dumps and Covid-era money propping it up
>Inflation still nowhere near to being controlled and keeps growing

I don't think the U.S has been in such a ominous economic shitstorm

>>51564709
>>51564694
>>51564637
>>51564623
>>51564590
https://pastebin
.com/f2psRh2D

>>51564296
Powell is the shabbos goy put in the public facing role used as the liability shield and to catch the blowback.
Come on man, this is like 1st grade-level kabballah.

>>51564727
>>51564728
enough with victim mentality and defeatism, it's off putting

>>51563009
A world war so they could distract the proles with patriotism and send all the dangerous ones into a meatgrinder on the other side of the world. Always remember that if its either the gallows or the Apocalypse for the elites they’ll press the red button and retreat into luxury bunkers

>>51563843
If you collect taxes in the sovereign currency, it means people and businesses require that currency to pay taxes. In other words, it drives up demand for the currency. Second, when taxes are collected, they are taking the currency out of circulation. In other words, taxes both create demand and lower supply, driving the value of the currency up.

>>51564938
I'm sorry, anon, but I wasn't alive to assassinate keynes

>>51563133
>just time the market, bro!
if i was retarded enough to trade using leverage i'd do it in crypto. at least it's fun.

>>51563133
is fixed by searching like a faggot for 73 hours straight for some cheap shitcoin on dextools while feeding on cheetos

>>51563009
Come on, you can't seriously not know.

We are ruled by retards.
Inflation is driven mostly by extreme supply shortages. The trillions of dollars they printed in the past years have also an effect, but the driver is the supply side.
ALL policies, no matter what country, is aimed at the demand side. Taxing profits, give people more money so they can afford stuff, tell people to consume less (energy in Europe for example).

>>51563896
>>51566114
>Hurr placing 200$ in SQQQ is le hard!

>>51566457
theyre not really retards though. theyre inducing worldwide currency crises on purpose

>>51562829
>nigger cattle who think 2-3 years of 6% unemployment is much worse than everyone's net worth dropping by 1% a month indefinitely

>>51567400
Well, then call them evil retards if they are doing this shit on purpose. Millions of people are going to die due to their actions.

>>51563167
lol
>>51563219
No one should be surprised, this was evident months ago.
The poor will be punished though. This is the first time in a long time where the workers have more collective bargaining power than employers and it's all about to get rugpulled as more companies halt growth and thus halt hiring and even resort to layoffs. This trend will work its way down to the service sector where once again those with masters degrees will be looking for part time jobs as waiters alongside the high school dropouts.

>>51567980
Sounds like a dream. All that matters is free gibs

>>51562829

You idiots are so fucking gullible. They talk like this to make you think a recession is coming and to sell your shit, stop spending, and keep waging. Its just a psyop, retards. As soon as inflation "levels out" around 3% they will turn the printer back on and tell you how great the economy is. And I'm saying 3% on the fake CPI, so really just getting down to <10% real inflation.

>>51566457
>muh supply shortages
Stop letting them off the hook. The federal reserve and federal government are entirely at fault. There's many reasons.
1. Supply is always short when money is loose because fewer people are incentivized to be productive and more are incentivized to spend.
2. The shortages were primarily created by the government's responses to the "crises" rather than the crises themselves. Coronavirus and the Ukraine war really aren't that big of a deal if the government wasn't using them as an excuse to do retarded shit.
3. The government never would have been able to implement those bad responses without the federal reserve to monetize it.
4. The fed's job is to contract or expand the money supply in accordance with a contraction or expansion of the economy to maintain price stability. Everyone could see the covid hysteria was going to contract the economy and reduce productivity. Instead of contracting the money supply to maintain price stability, they did the exact opposite and expanded the money supply to artificially stimulate it.

Powell is right to raise rates and do qt now. The only problem is he isn't doing it nearly fast enough.

>>51563131
>Well whatta ya expect em to do? Just let inflation run rampant?
>Anon kindly explains that they don't care and what their real goal is, so that other anon can profit from this knowledge
>That's not what I wanted to hear! Go back to le meanie board!
Reddit is not sending their best.

>>51566457

There are supply issues but there has also been 50% more money printed since 2020. So even if you went back to jan 2020 level supply chains, there would be 50% more money circulating.

And cutting demand does work to reduce inflation. It means yes, you get less, because it makes room for the government to get theirs with their strong(er) fiat.

Why is the government so much of a greedy asshole? Because MMT money printing funds the endless expansion of government since there are zero fiscal restraints to expansion. The profit is 100% money printing.

Oh yeah, and those supply issues are a result of covid bullshit lockdowns due to... government forcing the lockdowns on people.

>>51568304
>The profit is 100% money printing.
I mean the problem is money printing.

>>51568175
It is the FED hand in hand with governments. Don't be so naive to believe that they aren't of the same cloth, the same ideology of big globohomo is behind their decisions. I'm blaming ALL of them.
Who created those supply shocks? The same retarded elites who went into Covid psychosis the last couples years. The same retarded elites who try to reinvent the wheel and shift away from fossil fuels that are the basis of progress and our well-being, there is no alternative to it except crashing our current system.

>>51562829
>The car is on fire and there is no driver at the wheel.
Thank god the driver made it out on time.

>>51562829
It's okay all you had to do was invest your stimmy checks and cash out at the top. You did invest and remember not to be a greedy bastard, yeah?

>>51568304
This is not true.
>Covid hits
>government shut down world economy with their retarded rules
>businesses adapt, they fire people, stop investing, people retire early...
>now they want to return to the time before 2020 and it is not possible
>they fucked up the systems that wer in place at the time
>look up energy, how refineries, gas and oil business lost know-how
>there you have your energy supply shock
>now consider all other industries in a connected world with connected supply chains


So inflation was a given without the crazy money printing. Of course it is a factor, but most of the money went into stocks, stock buybacks and just digital numbers on computers shifted around. Money circulation during Covid was very low. Even now the money circulation is low, so the inflation driven by the crazy amount of money printed is still limited. Like I said it is mostly the supply side of businesses.

>>51568457

Where do you think money goes when people buy stocks? Into big sacks of cash or something? The money goes to the seller. And most of the covid money was not QE, but direct payments to people through PPP and various stimulus. People were given printed money from nothing to go out and buy shit, but you're saying the problem is supply, when for the vast majority of goods consumption is around the same.

Supply issues are only the problem in that it can not longer cover up money printing like improvements in supple chains have in the 2010s.

>>51562829
fuck yes, anon.... A Godspeed! ref

>>51562829
HELLO SIR I NEED MY FREE MONEY AGAIN SIR

>>51568754
$200,000 this time. No more crumbs.

>>51568669
There is difference between Wall Street and Main Street. The circulation is bigger when people spend their money on real estate for example than buying stocks. Look at this board for example, most of the money here goes into some meme bullshit coins. So if a company buys back their own shares instead of investing it into projects the money stays where it is. Those direct payments and loans kept the system afloat, they saved the Wall Street guys. Real money supply inflation hits when people start to sell their paper wealth and buy physical goods. Not sure if that happens because we'll see A LOT of demand destruction or in other words bankruptcies of companies and whole countries. This will will burn a lot of printed cash in the system.

>>51568851

Right, they're trying to contract the money supply to offset money printing. That's how demand destruction can reduce inflation even if supply is not improving.

They'll do this for a year until YoY price comparisons are favorable and it seems like inflation is low and confidence is restored in fiat so they can loosen and reinflate the money supply again. Its all about keeping confidence in the currency. If inflation is high, it doesn't matter if its supply or w/e, the fed needs to fud the shit out of everything to make people run scared back to fiat.

>>51563009
Do what Hitler did, it worked for Germany

>>51568930
This is not the impression I have. FED is way too passive, a few months ago I thought they are forced to go full Volcker but nothing happened. They kinda continue their money printing despite all their talk about QT. Are they trying to destroy demand by keeping inflation high and forcing a recession? Because let us be real here, the first ones to collpase are going to be third-world shitholes, they are going to be hit extremely hard. We in Western countries will probably have a small recession. Which brings me to my point here >>51567451

I'm looking forward to the time when millions of refugees move to Western countries and the same elites will call them climate refugees and blame climate change for their starvation and war at home.

>>51569066

Well when I say "inflation is low" I mean the faked CPI is <2%. Real inflation is much higher than what government calls inflation. This year they are still printing money, expanding the monetary base, but they are also FUDing, like talking about volcker, and raising rates at least fast enough to cause enough people to panic sell, stock spending, and worry about recessions so that overall circulating money supply has leveled out this year. Its enough for them to rig the CPI back to "low" levels in a year so they can fool enough people into trusting fiat, even though they still print it and real inflation is about 10%/year.

>>51568353
Obviously. I even acknowledged that they worked together. I only call out their names separately because spergs will jump in and say "ackshually..." if I lumped them together.

>>51563009
It's the same thing over and over again. The 80s, the dotcom bubble, 2007. The economy heats up too much so the fed has to increase rates and induce a recession

>>51569335
And who's power grows with every boom and bust cycle?

>>51564835
This exactly. Once there is enough backlash biden will remove him and replace him with a jew to ride to the rescue and fix the economy that the shabbos goy trump appointee ruined.

>>51563711

Problem with raising taxes is that it's political suicide if not impossible to pass..

>>51569472
And not before midterms

>>51568116
>calls everyone idiots
>thinks you go from 8% inflation to 3% inflation without a recession
Don't you have an English lit class to get to?
>>51569472
>>51569660
Democrats/leftists entire platform is literally built on higher taxes

>>51563009
I’m unable to see how people with jobs making a wage adds to inflation while forcing layoffs and paying unemployment reduces it. Anyone care to explain the logic

>>51570597
The labor market is still red hot right now, which means wages are running up on average. This creates a positive feedback loop with inflation.
Fed is trying to force the labor market to cool down. Unemployment is a side effect. Paying unemployment benefits to an extra million or so people is the lesser evil compared to the entire population's average wages continuing to skyrocket.

>>51570597
It only makes sense if you believe the lie that inflation is increaes in consumer prices. (Really, inflation is something that happens to the supply of currency, and rising consumer prices are just one of the possible effects.) They want us to believe that inflating the currency supply is fine as long as prices for consumer goods don't increase too fast. If they smash the consumer, he should be able to buy less consumable stuff and "Inflation" should go down. The main reason They want us to believe their fake definition of inflation is because they can't actually significantly slow down the speed of the increase in the currency supply for very long because the entire debt-based monetary system would collapse due to insolvency.

>>51570784
This

>>51570784
This post is the Dunning-Kruger effect personified.

>>51570597
I see you’re still in denial about the unmitigated success of socialism. Bad apples like you are the reason we need a communist police state.

>>51564546
Demand for US dollar debt is correlated to demand for commodities because almost all commodities are traded in dollars.

This will be true so as long as the US navy rules the ocean. Deglobalization would also end the global dollar system.

Stocks, bonds and fiat are not a hedge against deglobalization. 3D printers and owning a domestic/regional manufacturing plant or ore mining company is a hedge.

>>51562829
Cancel welfare and EBT/Food Stamps. Most expensive federal program outside of Military which is basically the same thing.

>>51572786
I wonder if that explains the recent failure in the EBT system... oh no.

Get out of the city.

>>51572882
This was just a friendly reminder for the upcoming election.

>>51562829
the american financial system literally requires high unemployment to work
businesses arent in anyway free market, corrupt and croney capitalist politicians have created a very very controlled market and it requires a large surplus of workers to keep costs down in order to off set the inefficiency this causes

>>51573787
But isn't the market more or less driven by consumer demand? Wouldn't making sure people were gainfully employed and buying items make more sense than having millions of people out of work barely surviving on the dole?

>>51569472
There are things you can do like close the carried interest loophole which would help. But I agree, especially in the USA, because of how effective the Red Scare propaganda was, they view taxation as if it's an unmitigated evil, despite the fact that inflation is ravaging their country and taxation is the best tool to use against it. They'll probably do something hilariously retarded like dole out billions in subsidies to international corporations (again) because clearly it's a supply issue that's causing inflation.

>>51575276
I think you're mistaking corruption for retardation
they know what they're doing, they just aren't hoping to achieve what you think

>>51565118
What if more government bux are spent than in taxes collected
Trudeau loves throwing away money to shithole minority countries

>>51575584
the government doesn't spend taxes
When the government spends money it prints more
tax is purely a mechanism to control inflation

>>51563009
inflation is going to be out of control whether they raise rates or not

>>51563362
> tfw you're told today that we need 10% reduction
> have to decide who gets the axe
Tough choice as there are many I don't like. Lazy unionized fucks

>>51569393
Ancaps have been screaming about this for decades but /biz/tards have been psyoped by lolbertarian and Schiff gold memes so they remain ignorant.

>>51563080
dont be so naive anon. the banks that control the fed are the same ones that finance the careers of the politicians that pass the legislation.

>>51564010
reject modernity

>>51575584
As long as the economy is expanding, it can absorb extra money supply just fine. In fact, as long as inflation percentage is higher than interest rate on the national debt, the national debt is shrinking in value even though the big scary dollar number keeps going up. The problem is trying to contract the economy (raising interest rates) but instead of lowering the money supply to fit the smaller size of the economy, they do a half measure of trying to convince more people to just hold dollars and not spend them rather than simply taking those dollars directly out of circulation via taxation.

>>51575621
based MMT poster

>>51563131
buy crypto shitcoins for ebin wins xDDDDD

>>51577504
I should probably clarify because of how retarded rate hikes are. So the problem with inflation is that there are too many dollars out in the economy, and since there is a certain total value in the currency, that value is spread too think across all the dollars, meaning each individual dollar has less value than it should. The most obvious and direct solution is to simply take dollars out of circulation so that the remaining dollars each have more value. But instead of doing that, the Fed literally says "we're going to print more money and pay you high interest rates to hold dollars on the sidelines and not spend them". Again, the government has the power to simply take the dollars out of circulation, but instead they want to pay individual holders to hold dollars out of circulation (for a nice interest rate of freshly printed dollars, defeating the whole point!)

>>51563740
>I know it's a reddit tier take
just own your own opinion, don't compare it.
>>51563837
crash it all

It’s funny how /pol/fags have immediately done a 180 on accelerationism the moment it affected their three figure portfolio and started advocating for MMT
The fact that based Jerome is pissing off both /pol/fags and tech trannies is proof he’s right

>>51578003
that's not true at all i am full on accelerationist and i have authored some of /pol/s best posts

>>51577598
Yeah, all that ia true, but interest rates can have a bigger effect than that implies because it is a debt-based currency. Raising interest rates discourages people from taking out new loans. Less new loans means fewer new dollars created. The problem, and the reason why inflation will continue to increase, is that real interest rates (adjusted for inflation) are still negative. In real terms, as in actual purchasing power, they're basically still paying people to take out new loans.

good thing I don't have a job

>>51563080
You do realize Bankers and Feds constantly transfer to work for each other like they were traded NFL players right? They even laugh about it during their faggy Boomer CSPAN meetings

>>51578023
That does make sense, but I still think taxes are the better solution, since that's the only way to remove the dollars. Imagine you are on a boat which is taking on water. You start filling buckets, but instead of dumping them over the side and getting rid of the water, you simply place those full buckets off to one side. And just because you feel those buckets aren't full enough, you periodically fill them up with water from the ocean and set them back on the deck of your boat. That's what increasing interest rates on government bonds does and it's laughable.

>>51563133
it's called LARP

>>51563131
>/pol/cel
why are trannoids so cringe all the time?

>>51562829
cool, I look forward to collecting neetbux while pretending to find a new job

>>51575621
this is true and big
few understand

>>51563009
>So what is the other option? Just let inflation run totally out of control?
You are begging the question. Raising rates doesn't 'control' inflation, as the last several reports have demonstrated.

>>51578209
That's only true if the government actually removes those tax dollars instead of recirculates them thru government accounts.