/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>51035366
First mover advantage

>>51035366
They always had electric vehicles. The battery and starter moter is used to start the engine. Nothing has changed

>>51035373
>Edgelord pendant enters the room
So that's where it leaves Tesla? Interesting.

>>51035394
Number go up. Tesla is "viral" and until that status erodes due to lack of market participants or saturation it will never go away.

E.g., dogecoin and shiba

doesn't matter soon you won't have access to batteries anymore anyway

>>51035369
Not sure that's going to work with a vehicle. People are really 'sticky' when it comes to car brands. I can't see a company director going for a Tesla if he can get a Mercedes or Porsche through the company for free.

>>51035424
So Tesla is basically a shitcoin?

>>51035434
Not if those kids have anything to say about it. Lithium mines will keep going no matter what

>>51035466
you just lost CATL factory in the US. Enjoy your wait times and higher price.

>>51035366
Big fire

>>51035457
tesla is in cahoots with US government. Their cars suck, an ipad in a plastic barren interior. They generate revenue with carbon credit schemes the US has tailor made for them.

>>51035440
What backwater do you live in? Tesla Model S is a high status car in first world countries.

>>51035366
Tesla was first, but I would rather have epectric Audi or BMW than Tesla.

It's a car for basedboys

>>51035366
Tesla is miles and miles ahead, the entire auto industry knows it. Even if all Tesla had was their charging network they would be miles ahead, but they have so much more, tech, AI, integrations, manufacturing, engineering, solar, supply chains.

Only ford has recognised the danger that Tesla really poses. Every other auto manufacturer is asleep at the wheel.

>>51035505
first world country here, tesla is shit for purple haired lesbians who don't know cars.

>>51035505

Taycan Turbo, E-Tron RS are samples of luxury EVs. Tesla is the $80k/year redditor's starter pack item.

>>51035457
I genuinely believe so, yes. Their cars are mediocre and everything in society is pushing for less personal vehicles, less disposable income, and more competition. That being said though, I would never try shorting something so illogical and powerful.

>>51035503
This is absolutely correct

>>51035540
and I forgot to add the subsidy that all you tax payers will give to tesla buyers in your new climate enforcement bill lmao

>>51035536
They must enjoy charging their car

>>51035505
As high status as Porsche, Mercedes and BMW? I don't think they're in that league. I'd put them somewhere around Volvo mark. They're not cheap enough to compete with Kia, Fiat and Peugeot and haven't got the premium brand status of those mentioned above. All these manufacturers are going to take a bite out of the Tesla pie. That's just a fact.

>>51035369
where's their electric long haul truck? European companies like MAN, Mercedes/Daimler, Scania, Renault and Volvo lead.

hydrogen fuel cell cars are the future
https://www.bmw.com/en/innovation/how-hydrogen-fuel-cell-cars-work.html

>>51035536
>Tesla is the $80k/year redditor's starter pack item.
Holy shit they did just become this overnight kek
RIP Tesla owners

>>51035516
>Charging network
Not sure how it works in America but in the UK you wouldn't be allowed to 'monopolise' charging on service stations or public spaces like supermarkets and such. You'd be in breach of the Monopolies Act. Throwing in some charging points is not difficult. It's no harder than adding a traffic light or street lamp. If the 3 phase power is there, you just need to add a charging box. British government doesn't want private networks by manufacturer. They want standardized chargers supplied by third parties or electricity generators.

All electric vehicles are homo. I will take my 99 cummins and 911 turbo any day.

>>51035466
You kikes are going to wish you get a camp this time

>>51035369

Dumbest shit I've ever read.

The majority of car owners are loyal to the brand they own and the overwhelming majority of car owners don't own a fucking tesla.

Electric car uptake will occur over the next decade and tesla will fade into oblivion as genuine car makers enter the picture.. Toyota.. nissan.. Mazda.. BMW
.. Audi etc you get the picture.

Fuck I swear to God there are some fucking retards on this board. Clean the dribble off your face after you say 'first mover'

>>51035661
same in Europe. It means only something in the US with their abysmal hodge podge of electric grids.

>>51035709
It has been DEbUNKED CHUD

>>51035709
And battery dies after five years; replacing it more expensive than buying a new one. No market for second hand EVs as a result.

>>51035595
>Long haul electric truck
They're a bit of a vanity project for governments. Manufacturers know they're not going to sell many of these things. Europe has a maximum gross vehicle weight of 40 tons and UK it's 44 tons. The batteries for these things are so heavy it going to cut into payload by as much as 40% . That's not economically viable even if the truck was 40% cheaper to buy and run (which it isn't). The range is too short for long haul. The only way they make sense is for them to be fully automonous with no driver. That isn't going to happen anytime soon.

>>51035695
this. I just want a 6BT in my 80 series landcruiser

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5n-XqSb0iyI

electric basedmobiles dont sound like this

>>51035734
well then why hasn't anyone started mining for lithium in Nevada and California?
It only works if you keep subjugating poor countries so they will get cancer and ruin their environment. I hate fucking liberals so much it's unreal.

>>51035739

Not entirely true.. an Australian company found a novel way around this.

Janus electrical has managed to retrofit batteries into long haul trucks that can be swapped in and out in under 20 mins.. The idea being you have depots dotted along trucking routes so rather than typical 'refueling' trucks pull into a depot.. battery gets swapped over and off they go..

As the technology improves the battery lasts longer and so does the range..

https://www.baka.com.au/business/companies/entrepreneur-big-trucks-big-savings-big-electric-plans-20220811-p5b91o.html

>>51035739
here in Holland big cities are enforcing rules to only allow EVs in the center, which then expands every year. This include building/road works traffic, forcing every fleet owner to buy EV trucks for this too. Even deep loaders to carry asphalt rollers etc. Madness but here we are.

>>51035757

That would be nice and it might be on my list if I keep my GU patrol.. it's already got a td42 in it which sounds prettttty nice but a 6bt is something else.

>>51035661
> https://www.topgear.com/car-news/electric/all-evs-can-use-some-teslas-supercharger-network-uk-today
The networks are slowly becoming cross compatible. Tesla earns from their charging network no matter what vehicle uses it.
The main point is that in the real world using a Tesla with a home charger and the supercharger network is the best experience you can currently have with an EV.

>>51035781
I should add the only EVs applies to professional vehicles like delivery vans, buses etc, not personal vehicles.

>>51035582
It's true what you point out. That being said Tesla in addition to that has the "way of the future" factor which elevates the driver's status. See all those important people who don't wear business shoes anymore? It's a bit like that. It's a trendsetting company. They are the original EV company. Even if they won't completely obliterate EV competitors they could end up like Apple and lead in other technologies and products. You could almost call it a Tesla universe.

>>51035770
That isn't going to fly with truck manufacturers. Their batteries are hard installed. A few problems I can see with this idea -
>who owns all of these battery packs?
What if I arrive in a brand new truck and they swap out my new battery with a 5 year old shitbox from a previous truck? How do I get my new battery back?
>Standardized battery pack
No manufacturer is going to standardize their configuration. Truck layouts are different and job specific. Battery configs will be tailored to the vehicle and job.
>Damaged battery pack
What if the battery pack they install was damaged by the previous user. Who pays?

>>51035893

>who owns all of these battery packs?

Janus electric

What if I arrive in a brand new truck and they swap out my new battery with a 5 year old shitbox from a previous truck?

A battery is a battery dude.. as long as it delivers power and holds charge within whatever parameters are deemed acceptable that is the end of it..

How do I get my new battery back?

See above.. redundant question.

>Standardized battery pack

The company designs their batteries to fit the truck in place of their usual engine.. not the other way around.. obviously geared towards high mileage engines not brand new ones.. Though eventually if it became economically more efficient than diesel you would anticipate trucks being made specifically for said batteries..

>Damaged battery pack

What do you mean.. you just swap it for another one..

Think of the battery as the FUEL.

>>51035580

Tesla will only get that driving at 60mph in summer behind a semi, yes it has more range than competitors but driven at realistic speeds and conditions it's more like 25%-30% more range. It's mostly because they discharge their cells to really low voltages with their software managing the state, so far it's alright for them. Germans and others have not figured that out and are overly afraid of reputation damage in case of mass battery failures and report 0% when Tesla would still report 15% charge.

Also, Waymo is the furthest in self-driving if you talked to anyone working in the industry, Tesla is a reddit meme and self-driving will not be solved without LiDAR

>>51035811
>currently
None of this can be patented. As EV take up increases you're going to see a lot of big players entering the market. EDF, British Gas, Scottish Power, not to mention large electric manufacturers will start installing these chargers. In some parts of the UK it's the law that new houses built must have a charger installed and guess what, they're not installing Tesla.
This is no different to Uber. You can't stop someone popping up and offering the same thing even if you were the first to do it. It isn't unique or a new invention. Unless you think a plug is cutting edge new technology?

>>51035781
>>51035821

You mean they expand the radius of the area where only EV are allowed?

>>51035825
>Apple
Apple market share is decreasing. People are getting tired of the high prices and being forced to use certain things and not allowed to use others. I know it might seem like a crazy idea to imagine a world without Apple but they said the same about Nokia.

>>51035718
There was people loyal to their phones before apple came a long. Now objectively Apple doesn’t make the best phones, but they’re the highest valued company right now.

>>51035994
yes

>>51035961
Have you any idea how much it would cost to set up the infrastructure. It's mind boggling.
>Service stations
Where? How much for the land? How many stations? Nationwide?

Okay, so let's say they start with a small network. Well, it isn't going to work. It needs to be nationwide and accessible within a very short drive time. Drivers in the UK have a maximum driving time of 9 hours per day. I'm sure America has something similar. This is why the cost of fuel on motorway networks is not the main issue for operators. It's about how long the driver has to drive to get cheaper fuel too. If they have to travel for fuel then there's less time to drive and actually earn money.

That's a lot of service stations and a fuck ton of batteries. Unless they've got billions in the bank it's nothing more than a niche idea for operators on known dedicated routes who can time and predict the battery swap-outs en-route.

Most truck drivers are like an Uber driver. They have no idea where they'll be going after they've dropped off the first load.

>>51036077
Friends in Russia and I noticed on the street in Singapore also, seem to move more to companies like Mi which for some reason have an appealing (admittedly Apple like but distinct enough) design but applied to a whole range of household appliances and electric scooters. And a fraction of the cost. I see a Chinese car from them before anything from Apple.

>>51035709
It's just like muh blade runner 2049

>>51036232
I get the impression that this is stuff The Great Reaet is for. Kind of makes sense, for electric to work you've got to scrap everything and start again.

>>51036346
it is, and only the upper layers will be allowed their own EV (which can still be locked down); the rest of us will be forced to take public transport. In Europe at least this is increasingly becoming more obvious.

>>51036346
>>51036374
along with your carbon ration card (and another jew carbon trading scheme so people that want to go to Seychelles can buy carbon credits off some working class stiff that will use the credits to pay for his heating in winter).

>>51035580
I own a 3 Performance, this is true about range. I also have been bleeding range since buying it, about 15-20 miles

>>51035440
https://www.minds.com/groups/profile/1315469745230712837/feed

What percentage of market share are "Company Directors" who get free cars?

>>51035982
Same old, "competition coming" fud, but they haven't have they. Tesla has been executing whilst everyone else has been sitting on their hands.

The Tesla supercharger network is the best charging network by far. In the real world the user experience of using a non Tesla Car on the non-Tesla network is pretty awful. Even when non-Tesla EVs are using the Tesla network it's still a win for Tesla. As for home chargers, Tesla EV's can use multiple kinds of charge providers especially in the UK/EU, having a pre installed home charger is still a good thing for Tesla.

Finally the charging network isn't even where Tesla makes their money, it's their highly profitable manufacturing of EV's which is where the money is, the charging network is just there to sell the car.

>>51035781
I was in Vienna about a month ago and there was some sort of "car parade" for lack of a better term of all electric vehicles and the roads were all shut down save for these EVs driving around the city. I have to admit, it was pretty nice how quiet it all was compared to ICE cars.

t. american

>>51035366
Tesla faggots are the biggest soi consooomers in the world.

The ideal automobile is a diesel/electric hybrid, it was also one of the first engine combinations invented in 1890.

>>51035718

/thread

>>51036120

The market cap of a company has nothing to do with the underlying value. Just because tech stocks can be inflated through subsidies and 0% rates doesn't mean they are providing any real wealth (goods and services) to the general population.

>>51035977
> self-driving will not be solved without LiDAR
> Waymo is the furthest in self-driving
> https://youtu.be/2imwmwBposc
k

>>51035366
>established networks for service and support
In my country, the biggest car import/dealership chain also fixes Teslas as they have a deal with them.

In contrast, Tesla has one giant advantage that is often underestimated, and it's the supercharger network.
I recently made a 1000 miles vacation trip with my tesla. Whenever we got to a charging location, there were 10+ chargers tesla superchargers and around 2-3 for ALL other cars. While we always had a free spot, all the fancy VW's, Audi's and BMW's had to compete for the 3 shitty charging spots that require you to download an app and register at the respective 3rd party charging service. The looks that they gave us said everything. They all were coping hard, secretly cursing themselves for not buying a Tesla while waiting in line for their crappy charging spot.

>>51036077
People in America won't leave Apple largely because of the iMessage/Facetime ecosystem and easy syncing amongst several devices. There is a lot of peer pressure in the US to have Apple devices for kids.

I've used only mac computers for nearly 15 years now, and to me, they are by far the best product available. And no, I don't play video games, so any anon who is going to follow up about his 1337 gaming rig need not.

>>51035718
You still own a Nokia?

>>51035709
>big random fields of toxic shit in the middle of nowhere or car exhaust coming through your bedroom window
hmmm

>>51038914
kek, gottem

>>51035580
holy fuck Germans btfo yet again

>>51035709
I don't care about the environment at all, I drive an EV because they're fast cuck

>>51035516
Tesla is still cheap plastic interior and drives like a golf cart compared to the taycan.

Their a.i. is a meme to sell you 10k+ subscription and doesn't even work unless you have perfect road lines in an unobstructed area and even still you need your hand on the wheel.

I'd rather own the Porsche, and I'd rather have a combustion engine if I needed a reliable car.

>>51039314
Rent those cars on turo and drive them.

The Porsche is much nicer

>> they don’t understand why China taking Taiwan is a good thing.

>>51039336
based

>>51035366
would brother Elon sell out Tesla to another major car company in 5-10 years? Heckin no he would never! He's not like other billionaires! He's our fren.

>>51035580
midwit take, that's like buying a chinese phone over an iphone because the spec sheet says that it has a better processor & more ram.
Teslas are utter trash when you compare their build quality, interior, exterior, service, etc to a mighty Porsche.

>>51038209
In the UK it's around 100% it's called a company car.

>>51035366
Retards who shit on Tesla because other automakers sound exactly like console warriors from /v/, only with cars. Any car with an automatic transmission is equally bitchmade. The only outliers are ghetto shit like Kia that don't have modern antitheft hardware so they get stolen every 5 minutes.

>>51038628
Or you can drive a gas-powered car and not have to worry about any charging stations ever, and not needing to wait around for 20-30 minutes so I have enough fuel to make the next 100 miles

>>51035366
Don't lithium batteries perform like absolute shit at best in freezing weather? How are electric vehicles going to be viable at all in Michigan, Minnesota, Maine, etc.?

>>51035734
damn that's convenient, just don't do any studies and you get to shrug and say I dunno. Surely this won't lead to widespread societal consequences like when we put lead in gasoline and packaged every consumable in plastic. No, surely not. Also the covid vaccines are safe and effective, because we haven't had time to complete the full studies. And as we all know, if a study doesn't say something is dangerous, that means it must be assumed to be safe.

Capital is so evil and the plebs eat it up.

>>51039336
Only correct answer for owning a EV.
If a greenie cared about environment they would drive a 50cc - 150cc scooter. They will get around a 100 miles per gallon.

>>51035369
sorry, you think they're the first to make a car?

>>51039837
Update your fud. Tesla cars drive great have the highest satisfaction ratings and with the new model s plaid the performance and interior to beat anyone.

Their AI is the best, no question. You'll be shilling against it right up until they kill the entire transportation industry with robotaxis and robotrucks. Latest build:
> https://youtu.be/7xjXPfLLCqc

> combustion engine vehicle
> More reliable than an EV
This is how I know you are a shill.

>>51035977
Not to mention top and even medium speed are subscription based service so is not included on the base price

>>51035366
The environment is fucked because mining the material required is worse than burning gas.

Tesla probably makes the software for other vehicles, or they could do. Being the Windows OS of cars is huge.

>>51035366
Tesla's main asset is not the cars but the patented battery tech which is an entire generation beyond the competition.

>>51041821
Half the range makes those cars unusable garbage unless you are some kind of bugman with no life.

>>51035366
Well nobody wants to buy anything but Teslas, so pretty much it leaves Tesla as the market leader.

>>51035977
A lot of assertions with 0 evidence to back that up. Ripped it straight out your asshole didn't ya? Or better, from Thunderf00ts channel? Lol!

>>51035366

Tesla is literally this cycles enron

>>51035740
Lol no it doesn't fucking retard : DD

>>51043618
>Capital is so evil
Yeah commie countries were ecological paradises.
Fucking retards on this board I swear.

>>51043518
Well then just buy one with an LFP battery in it if you live in cold climate?