/biz/ - Business & Finance

Ed Felten betrayed

>>50925255
Chainlink is a failing project at this point that’s why.

Chainlink's VRF is dinosaur tech and expensive, random AI is the future

>>50925255
API3 QRNG is already live, and RandomizerAI is going live soon - sounds like CL VRF not needed anon

>>50925333
holy 3 trips for API3 lmao
>self checking
fuck yours3lf

>>50925349
>>50925333
based, API3 will soon be the dominant oracle in the web3 space. Buy now for an easy 10x.

this is just the beginning, soon they will announce using API3.

Sadly, linkies poisoned the well by posting retarded fud for years and now actual discussion of unfavorable news is nearly impossible.

kek, Arbitrum btfo LINK's partnership since inception

>more options bad
Arbitrum was the biggest nothingburger for Link there ever was. Comedy gold.

You are seeing the Chainlink scam start to crack at the seams

>arbitrum using multiple products
>api3 jeets seething
>chainlink bad

>>50925255
The code can just be copy pasted, why pay for it?

>>50925255
because token not needed
genuine answer, not fud

>>50925255
Wouldn’t this be protocol to protocol basis?

>>50925398
pirate the chains hey good idea raj >>50925404
a good tactic is to post red pills in response to these posts like 13/50 13% of the pop 50% of the crime and the jews keep importing them. really makes you think

Linkies already seething lmao

>>50925432
It's all open source, MIT license if I'm not mistaken. That means you can literally copy paste it. It's nice to see some competition in the space, drives prices down, that's great for users

real-time vrf is distinct from on-demand vrf

>>50925568
Value should stick to the genesis of the software development like glue to remain as up-to-date as possible but niche cases will syphon value as needed. Theoretically there is unlimited value that could be imported from the old world into the new and most people do not even touch real value (central bank money used exclusively between reserve banks).

>>50925255
This just in, Arbitrum is using my nuts for increased throughput on Nitro.

How will you profit from this? You will not.

Do not buy LINK.
Do not buy LPL.
You will be better off without them.

bullish that shitty teams with a single product vertical are forced to compete on smaller chains and l2s that the chainlink team hasn't deployed to yet due to resources
vrf is just one of the smaller chainlink products and will swallow these smaller competitors in time as they deploy

>>50925762
fucken cope lel

>>50925762
It's capitalism at work, Link has to compete to stay relevant. It's great for everyone, drives prices down, forces faster innovation

>>50925950
not really
chainlink is a suite of products that will dominate through brand name, familiarity and ease of use, like mircosoft office
there will be competitors but they'll be irrelevant like libre
chainlink is the standard

>>50925577
only actual answer

>>50925420
Shhh don't talk sense. This is a fud thread, just post something positive about that paki project; ape13.

>>50925577
Could you explain the difference for us brailets?
Why wouldn't you use real time for both sync and async use cases?

what is the usecase for VRF outside of gambling projects? are there even any?

>>50927107
nope

>>50927107
>>50927111
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Random_number_generation#:~:text=Random%20number%20generators%20have%20applications,an%20unpredictable%20result%20is%20desirable.

>>50927107
Gaming in general often needs randomness, not just gambling. Also shit like token/nft distribution. The usecases for "true" randomness is actually mind blowing but i dont know enough about math or coding to explain it.

>>50927333
why does it have to be verifiable for gaming and software use? the point of verifiable random numbers is so gambling addicts can check their roll and see it from a trusted source. i dont get why normal random seed is any worse for most uses, hell even just grabbing the NIST random numbers will do.

>>50927071
real time means posted in regular intervals (e.g. every block) as a way to provide randomness to any contract that needs it. real time randomness used to be generated via block hashes, which were somewhat manipulable by block producers. this is more expensive but more secure than grabbing randomness from block headers, but less secure and less specified than on demand.

on demand means a contract that needs random number calls an oracle to provide a number in every instance required. it's not necessarily a continuous stream of random numbers, and it's not a general use piece of data for many contracts to use. this is more expensive than the previous options but also provides more specific randomness guarantees on a per-contract basis.

think of it as a sliding scale with lower price/lower security on one end, and higher price/higher security on the other. there is a market for all types.

>>50925255
Well that's fucking bad.

>>50927429
>why does it have to be verifiable for gaming and software use?
security and transparency. imagine a centralized gambling service. you have to trust that they generate "randomness" in a sufficiently unexploitable manner when there's no way to verify that they do. people will choose gaming and dapps that use "true" randomness.

>>50925468
because they're retards who fall for fud like this. anyone is welcome to make projects that compete with chainlink, doesn't mean they'll get used.

>>50925577
>>50926658
>>50927071
>>50927488
hello, Chainlink Labs employees!

>>50927488
Got it, I did not know rng had been derived from block headers before cl vrf was a thing. Thanks for effort post

>>50927531
thats literally what i said you fucking moron, im asking for use cases of VRF outside of gambling! fuck

>>50925255
why shouldn't chinklink serve arbitrum?
Like asking why McDonalds opens a shop in the Antarctic, might not be profitable but its about market share

>>50927429
Protocols that have validator committees (such as Eth 2.0) can use VRF to randomly assign validator nodes to a committee and have full audit history as to how the randomness was generated. Verification of this computation is useful for sybil-resistance assurances. The amount of these committees across potentially all L1s and L2s in the future and the frequency at which it is desirable to rotate nodes will fuel exponentially growth in vrf usage demand.

>>50927649
The McVril. Lockheed employees get a free penguin shake.

>>50927429
imagine something simple like cs go or whatever skins being distributed fairly and with a set supply
no dodgy stuff from the developers to make more money

>>50926124
The market for price data is tiny and already saturated. There is nothing differentiating all these protocols, they just aggregate data from multiple sources and calculate a median, that's like an afternoon of work, make it a week for proper testing. It's not a hard problem, so the only thing users of this data care about is price. And the only direction for those is down, it's a commodity, that's what happens.

>>50927734
>The market for price data is.. already saturated
das rite

>>50925255
Your picrel literally says it's only available on the testnet for now..

>>50927608
fuck off, i'm a drug addicted NEET

>>50927648
it's the same principle for gaming. i don't know if you've played blockchain games but they are all glorified gambling and loot boxes when you strip away the 'game' aspect. for general software, random numbers are how you guarantee security of encrypted communications e.g. tls handshakes (you know, like for deco). if you can't intuit the value of that idk what to tell you.

They support anything eth developers are willing to port.
Chainlink vrf has been live on arbitrum since 2021.
The Bulgarian orgy is over.

>>50925255
They don't need to.

>>50929048
Sure thing, chuddy boy

>>50929048
How many bongs a day? Or is it worse than that?

>>50931304
not weed

>>50927333
"one time pads" or some shit

>>50929048
based fellow addict

Is arbitrum still going to pump the price of LINK in 2 more weeks?

>>50927488
>this is more expensive but more secure than grabbing randomness from block headers
i thought block headers were the "best randomness source", since essentially that's literally all what proof of work is: trying out lotto tickets until you hit one that one that wins
and predicting that winner i imagine would be hard, or trying to fiddle with those kind of numbers
but vs proof of stake, where it's more deterministic, vs pure random pow, idk how they'd fix that
(unless it's explained here, and i'm too brainlet)

>>50927531
isn't there some company or service somewhere, that gets their input seeds via the randomness of like a video feed of 20 different lava lamps all going at once?

>>50927659
>Protocols that have validator committees (such as Eth 2.0) can use VRF to randomly assign validator nodes to a committee and have full audit history as to how the randomness was generated. Verification of this computation is useful for sybil-resistance assurances.
i heard forever ago ETH was going to implement some smaller still aspect of PoW for their randomness, like a smaller secondary chain being mined, but i suppose that got trashed earlier on (likely due to non-zero risk of it fucking up the 12 second block times)

>>50931536
this shit
https://ethresear.ch/t/pos-based-on-synthetic-pow-using-vdf-and-vrf/7271
https://ethresear.ch/t/verifiable-delay-functions-and-attacks/2365
https://ethresear.ch/t/nakamoto-consensus-with-vdf-and-vrf/5671

>>50931480
SmartCon - Sept 28
Macro
ISO20022
Nitro - Aug 31
Ethereum
Merge - Sept 18

Like an old fisherman can feel a big storm coming while all around them are oblivious. Like birds anticipating bad weather long before you hear the first thunderclap.
It's going to happen so fast you are going to lose what's left of your little mind. There is no "I hope you're ready", because you're not. Nobody is ready for what is coming.

>>50931514
cloudflare

>>50931675
that sounds right, thank you

>>50931496
nice screencap
in pos, block producers can alter headers by selectively ordering transactions or excluding transactions from a block. it's not 100% control but it presents opportunity to fuck with contract outcomes that rely on randomness. vrf solves the problem by introducing randomness generated offchain, through an oracle network.

>>50929048
Addicted to what?
>smoke weed / vape 5-6 days a week
>2cb (20-30mg) once a week
>acid (~50-70ugs) once a week
>usually valium once a week

>>50931744
depends on the month but right now it's GHB

>>50931651
Fucking based. I have been feeling the EXACT same thing. I feel like the craziest storm is forming, and no one can see it but me. Thanks for making me feel less schizo.

>>50931744
hows that mid dose of acid treat you? i used to take 20 mics 2 days a week followed by a 100mic dose to close it out. i got hppd after a whole summer of that. j hated mid range doses like that, for me they're all of the body load and reflective headiness with none of the enjoyment.

>>50927734
2 man Team all you need
>>50931779
I've found that's the best range for what I want, I don't want to trip, but I want more than a microdose, especially the headspace, I want to feel it & be high. and at around 50ugs, you don't get too much tolerance. I know what you mean though. Acid is a strange one, it's a personal substance, I've been taking it regularly (weekly) for like 7 years now with some breaks thrown in here & there

>>50931742
>vrf solves the problem by introducing randomness generated offchain, through an oracle network.
that part makes the absolute sense, and why link would fit with that
but i'm not sure on what base protocol level a layer 1 smart contract would work on relying on outside oracles to ensure 100% uptime and delivery for the next needed bit of randomness in a block (assuming, they choose in PoS something like "next node" or "next validator" or something, trying to keep it perfectly random)
or a "why would they trust a vrf from off-chain (even if it's verifibly random, but more an issue with just "relaying the data in time" or somehow the oracle network having a non-zero chance of going down or failing. having 500,000 validators is great but if they rely on one single DON then it doesn't look so great) "

>>50931651
based

>>50925333
>>50925349
>>50925792
this is ugur 100%. his posting style is very memorable and distinctive

>>50931651
SmartCon - no one cares ( smart "con", they are literally telling you they are all con men)
Macro - BigMacro
ISO20022 - everyone has known about this for 4 years, token price 8$
Nitro - Nova, Nitro no one uses this shit.
ETH Merge - already 40% priced in

What's coming is a 16$ LINK token price due to ongoing intentional price supression by burger shitting fayboy.

>>50936476
Cant wait til I see you buying Link at $1000