/biz/ - Business & Finance

ledger shills pls fuck off

>>50726784
You really think your hardware wallet is as secure as a paper wallet?

Metamaksk doesn't store the private seed anywhere

lazy

>>50726784
I'm lazy

>>50726919
you don't need any of this shit all you need is an airgap with a barebones OS that can talk to the nodes with web3 using your own shit code (which is safer than literally anything else).

web3 isn't rocketscience it's like 3 lines of python to create a wallet and swap on PCS

>>50726784
Internet computer holder. NNS acts as a internal wallet within the governance node of the Ic where the dao votes and the protocol updates automatically. Don’t need hardware wallet- because this project doesn’t have some third party browser extension bullshit wallet- we have those too, but keep the majority of your pees on the nns for staking. Based Chinese spammer until recently was giving out mass rewards, but dom and dem boys put the kibosh and those shenanigans- good to see all the hacks happening!

crypto is just another jewish gypsy scam to steal your money

>he doesn't write down all the coins he owns and puts it in a vault
Ngmi

>>50726938
Wrong. It validates the seed on start and cryptographically stores it in their secure database.

>>50726784
>YOU HAVE 5 SECONDS TO EXPLAIN WHY YOU AREN'T TRUSTING SOME 3RD PARTY TO SECURE YOUR PRIVATELY CUSTODIED INTERNET MONEY

But anon you can just cold storage your coins for free by reading a single article about "how to make a paper wallet"

If you can't figure it out, or don't trust yourself to custody your own coins, I suggest reading Satoshi Nakamoto's whitepaper on Bitcoin to understand the principles of decentralized peer to peer electronic money!

>>50726784
I have a ledger and a trezor
probably going to add a metal wallet to my collection too

>>50726784
I need a hardware wallet and I can't get an answer on which is popular for /biz/

>>50727262
ledger

>>50727246
sorry anon i didn't mean to drop this on your usb sticks

>>50726784
am retart

>>50727299
yuck do not listen anon, get a Trezor

Open. Source.

>>50726938
how do you think it signs things?

>>50727162
>>50727413
Actually?

>>50727313
That's ok. I'll just get another one and restore it, I'll use my backup until it arrives.

>>50727431
you can literally view the seed and private key in metamask, are you retarded? you think that just materializes out of nowhere?

>>50727542
Assumed it generates when you make wallet and was a 1 time thing not stored anywhere. I have shit all in MM wallets and never really paid attention.

>>50727560
you need the private key in-memory to be able to sign things, all wallets have a copy of your private key in the app when unlocked in order to be able to sign things with it

>>50726784
paper wallet in my liberty safe drilled to the floor.
with time to spare.

>>50727560
>>50727579
this
the private key is the thing
all the "seed phrase" is is a combo of words that can be used to generate the private key, it's the same thing.

to transact the transaction must be signed with your private key

the idea of a cold wallet is to create the private key totally offline. you don't need to be connected to the internet to do it.
>create key offline via airgapped computer or meme ledger/trezor
>do not import the key into metamask and start signing transactions and using it
>record private key and public address
>ONLY SEND funds to the public address.
when it's time to use the funds, then you import the wallet into metamask or whatever unsafe javascript pile of shit tranny dev's have come up with at the time and then send your funds.
>COLD WALLET DEAD NOW
once the private key has touched a computer with internet access the wallet is comprimised. dispose of it and create a new one. drain it completely into a hot wallet.

trezor / ledger is a $400 meme. just use whatever piece of shit equipment you have to generate the private key / public address and then write it down on paper or store it on a usb or however your gonna do it.

remember your not protecting against le evil hackers trying to zero day your PC your protecting against incompetant tranny devs that design these wallets with intentional security flaws.

IT'S 3 LINES OF PYTHON TO INTERACT WITH WEB3

stop being retarded

>>50726784
>he owns crypto
holy fuck do people on this board actually purchase and own crypto??

>>50727644
the secret sauce of the ledger/tezor is the ability to send transactions to it to be signed from a tranny hot wallet, while maintaining a hardware gap and not exposing the keys. It's actually a perfect solution they just need a bit better integrations

>>50727710
>the secret sauce of the ledger/tezor is the ability to send transactions to it to be signed from a tranny hot wallet
ya i wasn't sure on that one.
in my mind the cold wallet should be drained completely on the first withdraw and then recreated.

the trezor is bridging the airgap with it's usb connection; you can do this in VMs or separate computers too with a firewall but then your playing security games and the risk increases exponentially

what if there's a virus on your PC that's logging the USB connection?
>oh it's encrypted!
with what? your password you entered on the PC with the running keylogger?

how safe is a trezor / ledger on a worst case scenario PC filled to the brim with malware and a dedicated attacker that knows exactly what your about to plug in?

>>50727746
yes - you could do this, but the issue is dapps are built to specific standards to interact with hot wallets, which then implement specific ways of interacting with the ledger/tezos
Not impossible to do for sure but highly restrictive to being adopted, the hardware wallets are a very normie friendly way of doing things, so that is how it is going to be unfortunatly
Agreed about concerns around how gapped it really is, but moving forwards in this direction seems to be the most reasonable way

>>50727802
because it's signing transactions over that usb bridge it seems more like a more secure hot wallet than anything.
>dapps
dapps are where 99% of scams take place to begin with.

>>50727867
crypto has become more than internet money, and people will keep using it as such, may as well try to make it as secure as possible
anyways im off to bed, good chat

>>50726784
>you have 5 seconds to explain wh-
MOM PLEASE DON'T HIT ME I DIDN'T MEAN TO GET HIGH IN YOUR ROOM

>>50726784
I'm lazy, that coupled with procrastination issues once made me miss a huge pump of zha0, and now I'm stuck in my misery, what to do

It's in the mail arriving on monday

Same argument applies to hardware wallets. Slip your malware in somewhere on the supply chain, give them keys you already know. Major fuckups such as massive leak of hardware wallet purchasers private info have already occurred, they can't prevent this, not really, and it's a very juicy target.

Make a cold wallet with an old offline laptop instead, only interact with it using offline transactions. Maybe normies can't figure out how to do this, but it's much safer.

>>50726784
>you have 5 seconds to explain why you don't have a hardware wallet
Let's be realistic, Anon.
It takes more than five seconds to click "Reply" and type a response, let alone solve the Captcha and post.
How on Earth would someone put together a sensible response to your question and post it within five seconds?
I can't even type "N" and post in under five seconds...

>>50729176
Yea, few remember the ledger hack.
Veracrypt + air gapped laptop is miles better.

>>50729176
That's what I rolled, though I also still maintain a metammask hot wallet with a small amount for convenience. If that thing gets drained, so be it.

>>50726784
Because I'm an idiot. Here, happy?

>>50727034
i think you underestimate how retarded many of us are fren

Imagine not remembering your seed phrase, never writing it down
lmao lol

>>50727644

>>50726919

>no no i don't need a hardware wallet sir paper is fi-oh no i just lost it all to a clipboard malware

>>50726784
Relies on a (((secure chip)))
I'll take my chances

>>50727034
How would you go about encrypting your hard drives for this machine?
I've been looking at solutions where I would copy private key to multiple encrypted USB sticks and spread those in multiple physical locations

>>50727299
Ledger is based anon. I came across news recently that it would be getting hardware wallet support from Railgun. That would turn the privacy level up a notch.

>>50727533
How do you store your back up seed phrase from a physical attack?

>>50730073
>hits you over the head with a wrench
>accidentally hit your head
>never use seed phrase so you just forget it
Not reliable enough

>>50730800
Tails live usb with encrypted partition (x32)

why should i bother securing my coins when the vast majority are retarded and will crash the market and therefore my value by proxy?

>>50730932
I just want the USB partition where the private key or seed phrase is to be encrypted so I can mount it in any os, for example ubuntu installed on a lap top or raspi, something air gapped

>it's another ebic trole seed phrase scaremongering thread
if you are not a retard torrenting pirated tranny porn and using shitapps like phantom on shitchains like solana, you will be fine. don't download shit to your computer unless you know what it does

>>50731175
A double wrapped veracrypt container with all your wallet files (x32)

>>50727945
You're right. Crypto keeps gaining more adoption and as such the need for privacy and security increases. Not to mention the hacks and scams are frequent as well. Users securing their assets with shielded wallet balance and private transactions would be a good step.

>>50730800
>encrypting
what are you gay my nigga?

only retards and poorfags leave their money in a browser extension or even worse CEX
they will learn it the hard way

>>50726784
I'd rather have private wallets.

>>50727070
Not the place or time, fucktard.

>>50727945
People will likely use crypto more if they can easily keep track of all their assets spread across different chains.

>>50730801
The integration will make a lot of sense. Users are beginning to identify the need to shield their transaction histories from public visibility on block explorers.

>>50730971
And you think that is enough reason to be careless?

>>50726784
>>50732326
I FINALLY transferred my 2k link from metamask to my hardware wallet because I wanted to download wow private servers from russians lmao. Catch me fishing and cooking and not rushing to 60 and making a raidong schedule like a retarded normie.

>>50727579
How about ORE ID's single entry system that works as a gateway to several wallets across many chains? That might work in line with the in-memory utility

>>50733109
grow up

>>50727867
the transaction is signed inside the usb, the keys never leave the usb

>>50726784
I have a hardware wallet but i keep it on a cex as I fear the taxman. Crypto gains are tax free here after 12 months of holding but when I move my shit to a hardware wallet it's more difficult to prove I didn't trade with it or whatever and the tax man likes to rape lifes here, on god. I don't like it but I've heard about this being an issue in my shithole multiple times so I rather go with goybase.

Also:
Can I transfer crypto from binance to my ledger without doing a KYC? Never could be bothered to do one but I'd like to move that since I can't tax proof it anyways.

>>50726784
Opinions on ShiftCrypto? I have it for some coins but not all.
Where do you store your LPL? I have it linked to my MetaMask wallet but am not sure how safe MetaMask is. And I don't think ShiftCrypto supports lpl yet.

>>50733127
Checked.

>>50732975
Same here. Good thing we have non-custodial wallets like Railway which helps users keep shielded wallet balances and prevent targeted scams.

>>50727579
Not necessarily anymore, crypto security tech has advanced beyond this. There are tools that act like a wallet for wallets where you can access all your assets with just a single login without having to worry about several private keys or seed phrases.

>>50726784
if they can put malware on a motherboard before it leaves the factory then they can fuck with your hardware wallet before it leaves the factory too

>>50727945
To think of security one must think of privacy first,at least minimal exposure of information or transaction details that can be used for exploitation.Private DEXs are my best bet.

>>50726798
>he's coping this hard
yikes

>>50732326
More people are still falling for this CEX shit, pathetic.

>>50726919
How the fuck am I going to download my coins to paper?

>>50729176
And who's to say your old laptop never had that same procedure done to it?

>>50730801
>Ledger is based
Lmao. They have a section on their website dedicated to "diversity".

>>50733024
You should dyor on ORE ID its an identity management tool that allows multi-chain access from a single entry point.

>>50727034
>>50727644
>>50727746
>>50727867
>>50729176
>>50729239
>>50730073
>>50731252
Posts like these really demonstrate how little people understand hardware wallets vs hot wallets.

The benefit of a hardware wallet is separation between the signing entity (which requires your private key) and the transaction frontend (the code that interacts with the network/dApps).

Think of it like this:
If you only have a hot wallet like MM, it holds an encrypted copy of your private key(s) on your computer and you unlock it via your MM password. When you interact with the chain/dApps, MM generates a transaction, displays it to you, and signs it when you click confirm.
There's a lot of potential attack vectors there because the signing entity is the same as the transaction frontend.
If your PC gets compromised with malware, then the moment you unlock MM it can drain your wallet without any user input (there's confirmed cases of this happening).
Malware can also spoof browser extension txs. You also run the risk of bugs with the hot wallet sw itself leaking sensitive info (like your private key) to MITM attacks (this is the recent Solana hack).

Hardware wallets mitigate all these issues.
Instead of MM handling all actions, it can only pass unsigned txs to the HW wallet where you can then inspect and choose to sign the tx.
Your private key(s) never leave the HW wallet and the hot wallet doesn't have access to them.

>>50726784
I'm not that smart, i dont know how

>>50726784

FUD. If that was possible to do, they would have done it already.

>cant buy from Amazon it could be fake
>cant buy from ledger or trezor they'll leak your address
yeah no thanks

>>50732326
Sad but true. Keeping money in a CEX ends up the same way every time with people losing funds. I resorted to using DEXs a long time ago. I recently came across Railway which enables private swaps and trades too. I think it's a good innovation for crypto.

>>50726784
because hardware wallets are stupid. I just use software ones because its better. have your computer encrypted, only update when needed and it'll work much much better

>>50735561
Actually, address leaks are strictly a ledger problem.

>>50726784
I bought one when I started getting into crypto in 2020, but I ended up just keeping all my shit on metamask anyways. I barely have any BTC but what I do have is on my CEX account.

>>50736160
>because hardware wallets are stupid

Your hardware wallet doesn't have a backdoor installed into the CPU by Intel/AMD/NSA, and if you're using Windows I don't even know what to say to you

>>50727034
>just invent your own computer to hold your shit coins and you wont get hacked!
>always enter your home through another home and then through an underground tunnel so nobody sees you
>always send your coins to a new wallet every 5 seconds to make sure they dont stay in one place for too long

>>50736201
hardware wallet is like the windows of wallets

>>50736201
no, but my hardware wallet's client database got hacked, so now I'm afraid people are stalking my house
so fuck you, paper wallet is the only way

>>50735331

Right, hardware wallet is a more secure hot wallet, so you can activally use your wallets, is no more secure than the recovery words which is just a paper wallet. If you're just storing coins it doesn't do anything.

>>50726784

FOR ANYONE READING THIS WITH METAMASK PLUGIN, THIS IS WHY YOU TURN AUTO-UPDATES OFF.

>not easy to do in chrome
but super simple to do in firefox

TURN OFF AUTO UPDATE FOR METAMASK

(but seriously get a ledger and trezor and only keep a low % in metamask)

>>50726784
You can write your wallet on paper via hexadecimals, it's not long, don't tell these retards anyway they won't understand what a beast bitcoin was actually meant to be

>>50736294
A hardware wallet is significantly more secure because
1) you only plug it in to sign txs (security via physical separation)
2) the surface area for attacks is small and simple (the USB port comms) and thus easier to secure in firmware

In the incredibly niche scenario where you have a dedicated encrypted PC for crypto + a hot wallet with a high entropy password that doesn't get saved AND it just holds coins so you never unlock it, then yes you can call that "secure".
However, the moment you type in your password to the hot wallet to unlock it, all that security goes out the window.
And let's be honest, there zero point to crypto if you're not allowed to use it.

Remember the old saying: complexity is the enemy of security.
Just get a hardware wallet.

>>50730810
you cant be this retarded...

>>50736604
kek, fucking mumble-bumble talkshit. Why you just don't use some antivirus program+disconect MM from any site that your wallet is connected+revoke all shitcoins contracts that you are connected too?

>>50736178
I can't trust CEXs anymore fren. We keep seeing cases of them going solvent and denying users withdrawal or cases where we see them hacked. I'd rather keep my funds in non-custodial platforms and wallets where I can move them around whenever I like and live without having to look over my shoulder now and then. An extra security measure I take is using privacy-focused protocols to keep my transactions and assets hidden from scammers and hackers.

>>50736739
There's no need to sperg out just because you don't understand things.

>antivirus program
This will do fuck-all for crypto since pretty much every new exploit/attack is a zero day

>disconect MM from any site that your wallet is connected+revoke all shitcoins contracts that you are connected to
Yeah you can also live in a cave, wrap your head in tinfoil, and completely isolate yourself from society.

A hardware wallet will always be fundamentally more secure than jumping through all these hoops and not being allowed to do anything with your crypto.

>>50726938
I've had my Metamask wallet hacked once and seen many more complain about same occurrences.
Fucking ditched that for Sylo SDK wallet, it's bringing decentralization to communication and now moving to the metaverse through Seekers NFT

>>50726938
>Metamaksk doesn't store the private seed anywhere
they don't also...
>know your IP
>know everything about your browser
>know your name, or at least what your browser thinks your name is
>know everything
you literal fucking mongs

>>50727542
>you can literally view the seed and private key in metamask, are you retarded? you think that just materializes out of nowhere?
private key = wallet
private key = seed
>my mind is fucking bending that this is not understood
>its also an app in a brower
>it knows everything about you that your browser knows

>>50734740
*facepalm*

I have my entire lifes savings on browswr extension and there's nothing you can do about it

>>50726784
You could also create a GUI interface using visual basic to track the killer's IP address.

>>50739252

>>50736739
>kek, fucking mumble-bumble talkshit.
That's right, enough talk. Time for action. Meet me in the server room and I'll dropkick your head out the window and into orbit. You pencil-necked little punk.

>>50726784
Anyone that holds crypto should be using a hardware wallet
>but muh paper wallet
That's fine as well but you cant sign a transaction using a paper wallet so if you ever want to send coins from a wallet you should have a hardware wallet. All the retards who think a paper wallet is a substantial equivalent to a hardware wallet have no idea how either work.

>>50726784
because i dont pay 50 dollars for a 50 cent chink android stick.

how do we know they're not installed with shit in the factory that lets "them" steal your coins at any time. how do we know our wallets wont get intercepted in the mail. anyways ledgers have proprietary software behind the key generation so its possible they can recreate every private key generated who knows.

>>50739942
meanwhile trezors can be hardware hacked
and aside from ledgers and trezors none of the other wallets are compatible with any dexes or defi places anyways.

>>50739942
>>50740001
So developers of new technology don't deserve to get their beaks wet? Fuck off.

>>50740069
if it doesn't interface with any dexes what's the point, might as well have a paper wallet. if it has proprietary code behind key generation there is in assurances that they cant just recreate my keys at the factory so whats the point. if it can be hardware hacked then why bother. if i have to trust that its not being intercepted in the mail then why would i even.

>>50740239
>there is in assurances
there are no assurances

>>50740239
Imagine being this stingy.

>>50740286
it's not about money
almost everyone has a ledger or trezor, you think the five eyes haven't already bugged that shit right in the factory. and if its not a trezor or a ledger it can't interface with any dex anyways so what use is it?

>>50740365
>>50740239
>>50739942
If you're paranoid about it, you can just import your own BIP39 seed to the ledger instead of using their key generator.

In that case the only remaining thing to be paranoid about is that they've created some kind of backdoor in the device that can use your PC to send sensitive info back over the internet.
But at this point we're talking schizo-levels of paranoia.

>>50738181
Partnerships with Flufworld is a bold step towards a metaverse with decentralized communication. The Sylo node reward program will fucking melt faces

>>50734408
Lol that's not an advance in "crypto security tech". It requires other people holding private keys on your behalf, and you have to trust them not to fuck you over.

The Slope hack on Solana, earlier this week, was enabled by precisely that type of "secretly custodial ownership".