/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>50431587
Keep in mind any of the taxes except for SS in 1936, were not paid or WITHHELD till the following year and paid in quarterly installments.
http://www.taxhistory.org/thp/readings.nsf/cf7c9c870b600b9585256df80075b9dd/671f701c110a19d985256e430079173d?OpenDocument
https://fee.org/articles/wartime-origins-of-modern-income-tax-withholding/
- The irs created marketing campaigns that appealed to emotions on patriotism. This was done to make the general public aware of tax filling and payments. The irs was created in 1913 and the first 1040 filling form was made in 1914.
By 1917, the irs started the marketing campaign likely because no one was paying them. They sent 4 men across the country to promote and convince the public the importance and patriotic duty of paying taxes in full. If you couldn’t tell, it was fucking useless so the government gave the irs the duty of enforcing its prohibition act as a scapegoat for the organization.
https://www.irs.gov/irs-history-timeline
The 1943 payments act, social security, we’re likely the only saving grace the irs had on effectively collecting taxes. See picrel on op. You’ll see the boom in revenue after the payments act.
So did low income wages really pay taxes prior? I’d assume the irs was not effective at all on income tax collection for lower and middle class workers. These workers likely had most if not all of their wages available as discretionary income!
- Next we have to look at benefits. Workers did not pay or have any withholdings (payments) from their paychecks. Benefits were paid or funded by the employer. For the most part this was for pensions and health insurance.

Bump

>>50431666
How does this relate to the nig spic cycle?

>>50431666
i think everyone already knows that beaners and pajeets coupled with massive tax burden on the middle class is what killed it

>>50431666
Okay, back in the good old days there wasn't a continent of 3 billion Asians willing to work for 1/1000 the spot price of gold in cities with electricity for factories and functional governments

Let alone that the overwhelming majority of immigration for the last half century has been unskilled and uneducated

If you think collecting less taxes from people's income is going to make them pay 250x more per hour for American factory workers you're insane and retarded

>>50431666
Health insurance from the 1920s was more like disability insurance for lost wages. It didn’t cover treatment. Americans paid for their treatments out of pocket. Not until WWII, during an ultra competitive workers market did health insurance start to take its modern form. Again the worker didn’t fund or pay for the plan, and these plans typically offered full coverage for treatments until deductibles and co pays we’re added much later on.
If you had any benefits that you had to pay for it likely came as a union due. You paid this out of your pocket not withheld! Mafia leadership excelled in unions as they could intimidate workers for dues. Which tactics the IRS learned and adopted likely from its prohibition experience. 1950s irs had a reorganization to change its image of the due to crime influence, which found the irs full of bribes and extortion.
Payroll withholding in any form for the creation and boom of the middle class pretty much didn’t exists and was very limited till the 1950s. https://www.thebalance.com/the-history-of-the-pension-plan-2894374
- The 1950s saw computers being implement to handle book keeping. This lead to many of the modern book keeping and tax reporting systems to be effective with collecting tax and social security payments. Again you’ll see a huge spike in the op pic. We put it on steroids with swift and ach and more modern tech in the 1990s, which, made it virtually impossible for most w-2 workers to not have any of their wages withheld.

>>50431768
If you eliminate the unfair advantage that social benefits and welfare, along with tax evasion. Also force ordinance laws not allowing 15 people in a 1 bed apartment.
Illegals would have no labor advantage besides under cutting their wage.
Black wouldn’t be a burned on tax payers so they would either have to join the work force or go homeless.

>>50431890
H1b workers have withholdings. These are also not considered low skilled jobs.
You can’t out source everything. Pay would be relative to cost of goods locally. But the lopsided advantages for low skill wages is what is holding everything down.
You could say India (typically paki) gas station and corner stores but those guys are not h1b workers. They immigrant's typically with a bunch of grants and subsidies.

>>50431587
>>50431666
>>50432000
>>50432000

>Blame it all on wagies, spics & niggers argument

The regulations you're shitting on were passed because corporate owners didn't want to install things like fire exits in factories. After to many people literally died *and* all the protesting from *unions* congress had to pass laws

So corporations got together and ended all that unionizing crap because it started affecting the bottom line.

People that get on social benefits & welfare literally can't stay on it for any longer for a certain period of time. Never mind the largest benefit of these welfare programs your shitting on are children....nor the fact that it can barely afford you anything.

Corproations have ran this country for the last decade, but no...its the illegals making $6 per hour and Jamal's $187 food stamp monthly stipend

keep drinking the kool aide, maybe you'll see the light

>>50432201
How are you going to bring McDonald’s wages up then?
Places like my state that had a mass exodus of illegals is the primary reason why the fast food joints are now paying $15-20 an hour.
Similar to the Dakotas in the oil boom.
The fast food joints we’re paying $20 in 2010.
The competition for both scenarios had no low skill workers available.
What did this do for truckers, rig workers and general contractors in the Dakotas at this time? I’ll give you a hint it only took a 1-3 months to make 100k.

>>50432201
Gee, you make a compelling point

Maybe, we should instead raise taxes to fund public clinics where prepubescent children can go to have their genitals removed and reorganize our economic system based on a 19th century political philosophy that has killed over 100 million people instead

We can shoot everyone who disagrees too, that'll be fun, or at least ban them

>>50432347
He completely ignores that the American dream was affordable even though the work place didn’t have a fire extinguisher.
Sad :(

>>50432342
>>50432347
>>50432387
Meds now, at least sound a little more convincing if you're going to switch ip's

It's not about raising taxes, it's about getting mega mega mega corporations to be held accountable.
It's not the people
It's not the workers
It's not the spics, niggers, chinks or pajeets
It's the *one* guy that has 55 people in Washington currying favor so that his barely legal girlfriend gets a mega yacht the size of costa Rica

>>50432497
Go back to high school you moronic commie

No, it's not about niggers and spics, though their very presence in such quantities reduces my quality of life, and I'm not even racist

It's not about muh taxes and muh regulations or whatever Ron Paul libertardian shit OP is on about

It's certainly not the fault of some antisemitic trope of some rich international globalist bankster

It's fucking elementary economics
Post ww2 as the economy began to globalize the US had a huge concentration of capital vastly leading the world, with strict immigration limits controlling the labor force, this led to labor in the US having a very high relative value as the static supply could barely keep up with demand
Over time capital investments in other countries grew allowing their much larger labor force to compete at wages that couldn't support an individual let alone a family in the higher cost of living US, couple that with relaxed immigration and of course unskilled wages must plummet in real terms.

Not sure how OP doesn't get that this is an irreversible economic reality.

Getting rid of the rich guy in the nice building fixes nothing, do you think society would be better without rich people or nice buildings? At best you'd replace him with some government bureaucrat in a commieblock which is a degradation of quality in every way

>>50432497
You have to go back.

>>50432782
Is it irreversible?
We haven’t got rid of one socialized program.
Doing nothing means everyone will join the socialized class.
Get rid of all entitlements.

>see job post
>salary "competitive"
Immediately discarded

>>50433366
Perfect and right on point.
>>50432497
This is such a retarded response. Wtf are you even doing on biz? Lurk more and study finance

>>50432167
>H1b workers have withholdings. These are also not considered low skilled jobs
Oh man now I dont know if I can listen anything else u say. H1b workers are low skilled as fuck. Ive worked with them and they absolutely lower wages in tech industry. HP and HPE hires fuck tons of them. Most of their work force is contract " temp" I worked for them thru a temp agenice for 3 years.

>>50433626
You could be a CEO of a tech company and still be shit. See twitter and yahoo for example.
As far as I know, h1bs drive down pay but they’re still making more then what is considered low class.
Your Amazon factory worker that is getting $16 an hour is your baseline. Every reported salary I’ve seen from tech faggots show the h1bs make a lot more than that.

>>50433626
Also keep in mind h1-b salaries are publicly available.
https://h1bdata.info/
I can’t find one h1b in tech that makes under $15 an hour.

>>50432201
>People that get on social benefits & welfare literally can't stay on it for any longer for a certain period of time

You absolutely can live off welfare their entire life and never work a day.

>>50434088
Don’t tell ‘em.
That anon is likely only going to figure out a way to be a neet by visiting this place

>>50431587
>stagnation due to an ultra competitive low wage/skill labor market.

No, it's because we're getting shafted. There aren't enough of whatever demographic you disdain to push wages so goddamn low.

There's Satans who say verbatim that everything they do is to keep wages down and you ignore them

>>50433788
>CAMERA MAN IN THE BUILDING
CAMERA MAN IN THE BUILDING
HE THE MAN AND THE CAMERA IN THE BUILDING

>>50431587
yes but illegal immigration was allowed because white people didn't want to have children, you NEED to produce children above replacement or society starts collapsing economically, and why did they stop having children? because feminism.
so
feminism -> women work -> double the workforce -> lower wages -> less children -> immigration -> even lower wages
and who created feminism? yes, you know it: the jews.
so jews -> shit wages
as always, they are to blame

>>50433626
When they say "low skilled" in an economic context, they mean low skilled. The like waitresses, store clerks, people who mow lawns etc. Are you saying a H1b is not beyond the skill level of someone who fills boxes at an amazon fulfillment center?

>>50432201
see what light faggot, go back to plebbit, we don't want retards here.

>>50434259
Want or afford?
Utah is 90% and the average age is 32. Must be a whole different world over there

>>50431587
Nice fud. Wages are great and if you don't like taxes go move to Somalia you commie piece of shit

>>50431587
Is this graph showing fed gov alone is syphoning off 33% of GPD?

I wonder what could possibly possibly be done to stimulate the economy.

>>50434905
Wants to limit the governments ability to collect tax on income and social security.
Wants to eliminate all pay roll withholdings including benefit payments.
Suggest getting rid of all socialized programs.
>commie
????

>>50434905

>>50434922
We will do it at a snails pace because >>50434259

Fact is low class job competition is killing the middle and upper class.
Killing off all entitlements is likely the only solution. Otherwise, the great reset will be fulfilled and everyone here will eat bugs

>>50432782
im not saying to get rid of the rich guy, but at a certain point the “rich”guy will have power & influence that the other guy(s) will not

this can (and has) leads to a situation where governments operate like the peaky blinders where even the cops are on their side.

Im all for businessmen getting rich but the economy looks like one massive ponzi scheme with the bottom supporting the top. Economic social mobility is in the gutter so much that kids would rather show their assholes while eating cheese fries because that’s more profitable than working a job.

there needs to be checks and balances on corporations because they run the country now, and will continue to do so for their own best interest. I’m not talking about mom and pops or even chain stores i’m referring to the obnoxiously super wealthy. The top .001% controls everything

don’t think government should step in there to old and grandpa would fuck shit up

>>50437151
>Checks and balances on companies who would control said checks and balances
Anon, I...

>>50431587
The US government is evil.

Seems like the big things started in the 40s, where the social security ponzi was set up, WWII military build up that never went away. Then in the 60s healthcare started being taken over by the government. Those three things alone are like 2/3 of federal spending excluding debt interest.

At the least we need to get rid of fucking social security, but boomer fucks bitch about having "paid in," we are stuck with it. The healthcare spending could be cut in half if it was just universal care. Being world police has its benefits, but I can guarantee you can probably cut defense spending by 1/3 and the military would figure out what it really needed to achieve geopolitical objectives.

You could cut like 40% of the spending right there to get back to taxing around 20% of GDP. But boomer fucks want their SS gibs and cuckservatives would never go for government healthcare or touching the military.

>>50433788
Ya 16/hr sounds about right. I made 18/hr. Ya it was better than working in restaurants making 12-20k. 30-40k in 2015 was decent but not once you hit late 20s. Its still pretty low class and sure the 20k retards are jealous. Its splitting hairs tho. Shit is awful at both levels. I moved into higher cost of living area to stop getting held at gun point. There goes all that extra money I made. Wasnt even extra you just can afford to pay your bills. Point being hb1 drives down wages.

>>50437151
You have to be 18 years old to post here

>>50432201
> corporate owners didn't want to install things like fire exits in factories

Maybe the Irish retards working at these factories should have just went a found a job at a factory with a fire exit???

>>50434259
>white people didn't want to have children,
They are called boomers because of the population boom. Of course the following gen didnt have as many kids they also didnt go thru ww3 to cause another boom. When there is death people have kids when there isnt its less. Boomers had it good then told their kids not to have kids and to wait when they are 30 thus compounding the issue. Avg white is 40 and white kids are a minority. This all could be managed we dont need a constantly increasing pop. Boomers wanted to live it up and pass nothing down. Here we are. Im one of 5. Im the only one with a kid. My step bro kid doesnt count cause hes mexican.

>>50432201
>Corproations have ran this country for the last decade
always weird seeing how much lefties have swallowed the neoliberal rhetoric on cheap non-white labourers not being bad for american workers
they've made unions practically useless as the american worker has almost no leverage over companys while companys have an almost unlimited supply of cheap labor to hire from
it seems like the commies and socialists all switched from being completely against it to doing a complete 180 at some point.

>>50431587
The U.S also outsourced most of it's manufacturing to poorer countries
Most low-skill jobs now revolve around the facilitation of consumption of products, not the manufacturing of products

>>50438119
Omfg and water is wet.

>>50438048
>unions
Rope yourself, commie.

>>50432201
>Corproations have ran this country for the last decade, but no...its the illegals making $6 per hour
False dichotomy. Corporations that rely on low-skilled labor love illegals because they can pay them well under market rates, make them work longer hours, and cut other corners because they can always threaten deportation (see: Agriprocessors). Illegals greatly strengthen corporate hegemony.

>>50440267
Forgot to mention:
>Corproations have ran this country for the last decade
>Corproations
>last decade

>>50432342
>How are you going to bring McDonald’s wages up then?
By taxing everyone less, even the lowest earners will have more liquid income to work with. The only reason taxes are so stupidly high now is because the people at the top fucked up big time thanks to their greed.

>let's raid 4chan and bombard them with our great arguments!
it doesn't seem to be working, transsisters.
what do we do now?

>>50431587
>>50431666
Really cool post, OP. I think that referencing gold is a great comparative tool.

>>50431587
When you say competition you mean affirmative action to place these shitskins in these positions. Service sucks across the board because literal homo erectus brains are doing tasks that high school aged humans used to do.

>>50432497
Do you believe this drivel you spew?

>gold

>>50433858
hey man, you are completely wrong
I am sure you have worked a real job before in your life and you're not some 20 something conservative retard in college or anything.

let me explain the inner workings of an H1B pajeet:
>I want to come to america, my country sucks.
These people come with a drive to better their situation by fucking their own country and our country. They fuck their own country by failing to innovate in India, and they fuck our country up by being voluntary corporate slaves.

The statistics you quote are completely wrong and totally fucking retarded. I am a Ph.D who has worked at some for-profit research institutions and let me tell you a story on how shit really goes down.

>two h1b visas with Ph.Ds in material development work with me. they are married and from india
>the husband gets cancer and is no longer able to contribute, he is fired
>management realizes that if the other one is fired, they are going to be forced out of the country by immigration law and their work-visa expiring.
>they immediately cut the wifes hours in half, but make her work her entire shift and extra hours while her husband has cancer
>she has no choice but to stay here as a corporate slave for the remaining 5 years until she can become a citizen, the company controls her access to citizenship-- NOT the government itself

I imagine this shit happens all the time, H1b is a corporate slave program that destroys the quality of life of American workers. It destroys the quality of life of H1b imports. It makes companies fatter, and contributes to the brazil tier wealth inequality in America. They only way that you do not understand this, is if you have not actually worked a job with them.

Hitler was right that you should not be able to vote until you are 30, because you have no life experiences to back any of your opinions up. You quote meaningless statistics from the bureau of truth.

As an European, it is funny to see how Americans whine about their wages. You are earning more than in any other country. You are privileged as fucked and don't realize it. Get real

>>50433298
Is it irreversible?
maybe, we've just actually entered a new era for the first time since just after ww2. so maybe we'll finally see some real change in institutions. the only draw back and something a lot of people don't talke about in these types of discussions is real changes come usually with huge social upheaval and shit. I just hope we become less commie not more so.

>>50444276
We set an example that worked and now are trying to copy you and it’s killing our innovated spirit.
What lower or middle class innovations have come out off Europe since the 90s?
Where are all the European entrepreneurs?
>Volkswagen
>oil and gas
>banking
Can Europeans make anything new?

Yeah, it sucks. But once you develop an upper middle class valued skillset it's awesome. People beg to hire you and you name your price, while all of these little people underneath you squabble for shit jobs and long hours.

Get useful or get lost.

>>50444276

We're here because we've always strived for better and will continue to. You guys continue to get buried deeper in muck because you're satisfied in it. People can laugh at our free marketeers but they're the reason our economy stays head, even while the united welfare queens and bureaucratic grifters of the world continue to character assault us and demand soft socialism.

>>50445445
You’re not considered at all with the issues of not having middle class will cause?
My cities homeless population has tripled post Covid. The crime has significantly increased with it. Package theft is so bad Amazon is sending marketing reps to teach boomers how to hide packages or give garage access.
If we just continue along this path, you and I are going to be in a gated community surrounded by shit.

>>50443972
>doctor
>low class job
Why do you h1b anons not understand this?
How is the h1b doctor affecting the burger flipper job at McDonald’s?
How is it affecting the Amazon warehouse worker?
Also see op
>fraud
>illegal immigration
You don’t think the op is covering this?
Yes, I’d stop h1b program, because eventually, it will turn your job into lower class.
But none of these tech or doctor jobs are currently considered low. Tech still is paying high salaries that is not considered lower class to non h1bs. Doctors still make higher class incomes.

>>50445676

I do and in fact this has been one of my biggest political priorities for like the past decade but seeing the general apathy, stupidity, and willing delusion of the American people in recent times has made me mentally check out and accept whatever kind of shitty stratified society we're going to keep moving towards.

Have the serenity to accept the things you cannot change. The average human is a stupid monkey that inevitably reverts to some form of serfdom. Focus on yourself and your family.

>>50443972
Also you should report this to the department of labor. Get evidence of the fraud first though. Show they’re not getting paid for all the hours worked.
She will get forced out and sent home
>problem solved.
You have a phd why haven’t you done this?

>>50445423
>>50445473
>we
You are not America. You are just two losers who can't stop whining while playing life on easy mode

>>50447104

Nah I am. Get fucked retard.

outsourcing should be illegal. h1b insourcing should only be legal if you pay $1 million/month minimum because it assumes there is not 1 person in a country of 160 million workers that can do the job.

>>50447104
Couldn’t answer my questions.
>Avoids debate.
Show nose

>>50447252
What is there to debate? I am an individual, I don't hold responsibility for the shortcomings of Europe. Just like you don't get to claim the achievements of USA

>>50443577
>>50434611
When you prefer to drink you're kool-aide do you like ice or lukewarm?

>>50437620
here's a pro tip: They never existed in any factory prior to regulations

>>50440267
>>50440285
Are you implying that Amazon & Tesla have gained massive strength solely off the backs of illegal immigrants? How many illegals are entering the country per year?

>>50437319
Is it possible to have a watch dog committee? Is it possible to have a system of checks and balances for corporations? Or are you saying its impossible to do that?

>>50437581
and then?

>>50447647
Oh look more pilpul. Careful or that reddit faggot might start to notice

>>50447959
Let me help you out.
Amazon took off from 2 things.
2 day free shipping (government subsidized)
Sale tax avoidance
Without these 2 things, Amazon would of been killed by Walmart.
Bezos took advantage of government funding and low/subsidized labor cost. The company now is the 2nd largest low skill employer.

>it’s not the government!

https://goodjobsfirst.org/ending-amazon-giveaways/

Lurk more

>>50432201
It's both the corporations and the spic/nigger cycle (+h1b).
Btw the biggest shills for immigrations are corporations (which always triggers extreme cognitive dissonance among lefties for some reason).
If the US hadn't signed the Hart Celler act it would probably have lower GDP but wlso vastly superior conditions of livings.

>>50431587
Half the voter base is propagandized into allowing many of these things, legal or not, to not only happen but in some cases get worse. No surprise its the party of wealthy and dependents.