/biz/ - Business & Finance

How else are you supposed to summon demons on a massive scale

>>50131905
Is that an EV factory?

>>50131905
wrong

>>50132001
unironically true

>>50131905
No, that's feeding niggers and sustaining fatties and old people

Nooo Imagine how many fatties could live in pods in those facilities.

>>50131905
Actually that's nitrogem based fertilizers. Around 4 billion people today exist solely because of these fertilizers. We need to go back to organic farming, let the useless eaters die.

>>50131905
great example of how capitalism is retarded.

Crypto mining?

>>50131905
>grown ass men using this hardware to play bing bing wahoos
Rational use of resources
>grown ass men using this hardware to try and replace the corrupt monetary system and overthrow the banking elites
MISALLOCATION ALERT! WEEEWOOOWEEEWOOO IT'S A GIANT MISALLOCATION!!

>>50134258
that's racist

>>50134430
>Crypto mining?

Looks like it. Literally burning millions of years worth of irreplaceable resources to solve unnecessary mathemetical puzzles.

>>50134480
What's your solution to fix the monetary system? Let's hear it

>>50134495
>What's your solution to fix the monetary system?

>>50131905
>The greatest misallocation of resources in the history of mankind.
>She forgot the amerifats, the eurofags and the women who the jews try to push forward to cuck white male normal hetero men.
fuck your bitch mother liberast faggot

>>50134495
>What's your solution to fix the monetary system? Let's hear it

there isnt a problem with the monetary system.

>>50133067
>old people
have respect for old fucks nigger fuck your bitch mother for having shat out such turd

>>50134531
And what did you do when an election was stolen right under your nose, LARPer? Did you fight the system? I actually do the thing I talk about, I'm mining ETH right now. You have no solution, only a LARP.

>>50134561
Get out

>>50134480
> solve unnecessary mathemetical puzzles.

Name one other thing people do with computers

Name something else that the excess electricity from a turbine generator attached to a hydroelectric dam spinning at near maximum efficiency that would otherwise be shunted to a heat sink should be doing instead

>>50134601
folding@home

>>50134572
uh oh, looks like we have a mentally challenged retard on our hands!

>>50134601
>Name one other thing people do with computers
An efficient and grown-up system of transferring and storing data about money such as with visa, sepa, bank databases, etc.

>Name something else that the excess electricity from a turbine generator attached to a hydroelectric dam spinning at near maximum efficiency that would otherwise be shunted to a heat sink should be doing instead
Charging electric vehicles... why am I even responding to this nonsense..

>>50134531
funded by american jews. try again

>>50134601
>Name something else that the excess electricity from a turbine generator attached to a hydroelectric dam spinning at near maximum efficiency that would otherwise be shunted to a heat sink should be doing instead

make fertiliser.

>>50134569
Old people are literally parasites and social security should be gotten rid of

>>50131905
PoW was a mistake. There was no fucking way Satoshi wanted mining to be centralized within China.

BTC is literally another product that was "made in China" kek

>>50134743
>why am I even responding to this nonsense..

Even if there was a transmission system capable of negligible line losses (thermal entropy in the act of pushing electrons across the vast distances between the generation source and the end-use) it wouldn't make much difference if you actually compare the actual amount of joules consumed in the mining process to the amount of joules consumed in the course of everyday life; for example, the roughly 100 million barrels of oil the world burns every day.

100% of that is a chemical energy process and creates pollution (material as microplastics and chemical species as NOx, CO2 and Particulate matter) without respect to either entropy (over half is wasted as heat) or end use, coming to the question of what purpose or value was created (minus imposed costs)

Fundamentally, a power-agnostic process that runs on electrons at a local scale is not a problem at all, compared to the distributed point-sources of pollution, across the entire planet, that is created with fossil energy. Even if we could transition all the fossil fuel cars to electric, if you include all the entropy, not to mention to pointless end-use of much of that, we would still be fucked by the pollution created.

Bitcoin may not scale in its current form and it may not have been possible to establish itself without proof of work, but it is also possible as a software protocol, it can be converted or upgraded to a greater degree of efficiency, even something other than the proof of work mechanism, and since it has undergone various upgrades in the past there is no reason to think it will not in the future; in any case as a sector, it is approaching carbon neutrality faster than most other industries because of the technical incentives and halving process.

Ultimately bitcoin will end up as specialized hardware and software mated to 100% renewable energy, and has been trending toward that destination from the beginning.

>>50131905
>The greatest misallocation of resources in the history of mankind.
Gender reassignment surgeries.

Lets say you build a renewable energy power plant to mine bitcoin but bitcoin goes to zero. What is left over? You have a renewable energy power plant.

Now lets say you make an SQL database and create a bunch of entries and call that a crypto and it goes to zero. What do you have? Nothing.

>>50135175
it makes troons rope so thats something atleast

>>50134561

t. Elder of Zion

>"I don't know what your investment bankers are telling you – buddies are telling you, but the four big American banks have sent more than a trillion dollars to the fossil fuel industry since the Paris Climate Accords were signed. That's a serious chunk of money that has enabled them to continue doing what they're doing.

-Bill McKibben

>>50135236
>Lets say you build a renewable energy power plant to mine bitcoin but bitcoin goes to zero. What is left over? You have a renewable energy power plant.
You have bankruptcy due to the miners losing a fuckload of money and heaps of wasted electricity that could've served a better purpose. You corecucks sure talk a lot of shit - love the backwards rationalisation though kek

>>50134955
I hope you either work till you die or get evicted at retirement.

>>50135146
>Ultimately bitcoin will end up as specialized hardware and software mated to 100% renewable energy, and has been trending toward that destination from the beginning.
This myth has been espoused for years, yet there's zero evidence of any green innovation occurring. PoS was the innovation.

>>50135236
here's a big hint: projects like that are never paid for with cash. they're funded with loans over a multiple decade period, with operational revenues funding the loan repayment.

>>50135342
So you don’t understand?

>>50134301
>great example
in what way? in the end, Bernanke is not happy so he'd demand more money than the happy Krugman for performing the same task. The market signal will result in a net transfer from Krugman to Bernanke in a following transaction.

It's funny because "ha ha famous people eating bull crap" but it proves nothing about capitalism.

>>50135440
I do understand the failed narratives of BTC. Try spinning another one

That's not the collected mass of non-whites surviving on white largesse

>>50135444
it demonstrates the failures of the metrics used by economists. Why would 2 guys paying each other $20k (no net change) to eat poo be good for the economy? it isn't, and yet the metrics show a positive effect.

>>50135444
it doesn't drive technological or cultural innovation. it doesn't increase or reinforce our footing against our enemies. it doesn't make our lives better. it's retarded nigger cattle navel gazing at best. and i guess i should have said "free market capitalism" is retarded. state capitalism can be good. look at what the chinks have done with state capitalism. china is still a shithole, but they've transformed their country from a backwater shithole to a global superpower in less than one human lifespan -- because their government is smart enough to guide capital, rather than let it be squandered on niggerbrained garbage like crypto mining or middle man scam industries.

>>50132001
>>50133067
>>50133084
>>50134462
>>50135175
based

>>50131905
>>50134301
>>50134531
>>50134561
>>50134972
cringe

>>50135236
>Lets say you build a renewable energy power plant to mine bitcoin but bitcoin goes to zero. What is left over? You have a renewable energy power plant
why not have the datacenter powered by your renewable powerplant host some cloud software instead of calculating hashes all the time?

>>50135358
When I'm too old to live independently I'm eating a bullet t. 7fig net worth

>>50135480
>Just be like China
topkek, no need for trustless transactions if you just trust your leaders. This man has found a way to transfer wealth without middle men, turns out all it takes is a government.

>>50135475
>Why would 2 guys paying each other $20k (no net change) to eat poo be good for the economy?

a midwit is stuck on the "eating poo" part. Suppose it's instead "shoveling poo"? Does that change anything? Suppose bernanke and krugman are a couple of coprophiles. Again, does that change anything? The point is that what they do doesn't matter, they originally saw value in performing the action. It appears that bernanke might have misjudged his appetite for crap. He might as well have misjudged his appetite for shitcoins off /biz/.

>it isn't,
that's an opinion not a fact.

>>50134561
stop
>>50134743
"grown-up" come on, visa is a company btw
electric vehicles? Just attach them right to the turbine? Every time you idiots keep talking about EVs you never talk about batteries. Which is the only thing you should be talking about and working on. That's the reason tesla is marginally successful because they stayed focused.
>>50134881
Russia already does it.

>>50135566
china is flawed in many ways, including that way. but china illustrates the power of state capitalism and the ridiculousness of "the invisible hand" or "free market" capitalism.

>>50135510
Because you fucking about in Excel brings less worth to the planet than securing the world’s settlement layer.

>>50135146
Don't be ridiculous, I am far too educated and have too much professional experience in science for this, dropping words like entropy like that in an irrelevant way is just so embarrassing to the whole human race that you're a part of. I can see that nothing you can come up with is going to give me cause for thought. That obfuscated pile of gibberish says nothing more than:

1) Energy is lost through transmission.
2) Bitcoin might be upgraded to be more energy-efficient in the future.

The transmission of energy is mostly negligible and no matter how much bitcoin is upgraded it will still be many times that of visa transactions.

>>50135385
It's designed to appeal to the simple-minded to think bitcoin will be some sort of closed system that takes care of itself. Obviously nothing like that will never happen.

>>50135146
>Even if there was a transmission system capable of negligible line losses (thermal entropy in the act of pushing electrons across the vast distances between the generation source and the end-use)

i believe nikola tesla came up with that, AC power.

this is cop-out and does not excuse needless waste. switching to something other than pow would be a hard fork and you'd no longer be using bitcoin. anyone can take a snapshot of a public ledger, disperse their own monopoly money according to the UTXO's, and call it bitcoin, but this is a bit absurd considering how many time's we've heard the "code-is-law" talking point, and that people could simply use a better existing system that has been running for a while.

>>50135601
>Russia already does it.

yes Russia makes fertiliser. but they wont give it to america any more.

>>50135822
>this is cop-out and does not excuse needless waste. switching to something other than pow would be a hard fork and you'd no longer be using bitcoin. anyone can take a snapshot of a public ledger, disperse their own monopoly money according to the UTXO's, and call it bitcoin, but this is a bit absurd considering how many time's we've heard the "code-is-law" talking point, and that people could simply use a better existing system that has been running for a while.
cont.

or rather, one's motives are rather transparent when the only reason they favor bitcoin is its present set of UTXO's.

>>50135510
This >>50135686
Web2.0 "cloud solutions SaaS web marketing" BULL FUCKING SHIT is value-extracting. Bitcoin mining is purely value-creating. They are not the same, and death to web2.0 containerized cloud flask fucking bullshit

>>50131905
Likely to be true.

>>50131905
Literally every billionaire. SpaceX, blue origin all a waste of precious resources

>>50135803

What happens to your money sitting in a fractional reserve system? Well, 9 multiples of it are loaned out to do things like build McChicken factories, and if 90% of all new businesses fail, what you are left with is a bunch of McChicken factories you can't do shit with. This "churn" is the financial economy falsely presented as the waste-free alternative.

>Bill McKibben: There’s this new data, new interesting study, out last week that I wrote about at
some length in The New Yorker, that demonstrates just how much carbon actually is contained in
your bank account. What they found was that if you keep $125,000 in the banking system in
America, it generates more carbon than all the things a normal American life does in the course
of a year. All your cooking, and heating, and flying, and driving, just because that money is
being used to leverage loans to build pipelines and so on and so forth. And that's why one of the
reasons so many people are joining in this pledge at Third Act to cut up their credit cards from
Chase and Citi and Wells Fargo and Bank of America at the end of the year to begin switching
accounts, that kind of thing. It's been very powerful to see how this new data is making it easier
for people to understand where they need to be pressing and pushing.

Its a complex issue, and my only motivation here is to convince you that bitcoin is not a problem in terms of "waste" of energy.

But, if your position is essentialist, basically, in other terms, that any bitcoin mining is not strictly justifiable in the sense of it being necessary (to end, arbitrarily, the contingent chain of assumptions implied by the essential premise, whatever "necessary" means) then you are not actually arguing with me, or vice versa.

I'm talking over your head; you are having a discussion better suited to psychotherapy ("Where did bitcoin touch you anon? How did you feel when you read the Pop-sci article about how bitcoin was destroying the climate?") etc.

>>50131905
>still can't propose a better alternative or practical solution for borderless/trustless near-instant payments
you are no different than the libchuds who shriek about the pitfalls of oil while being entirely reliant on it with absolutely no practical solution simply because a negative of the system has been shoved down their throat
>reminder: ALL of this is a product of our system REPEATEDLY failing us
>reminder: 2007-2009 gross negligence will happen time and time again in a trust-reliant system

>>50134258
This planets humanoid population needs to undergo at least three halvings.
Collective human consciousness needs to heal.

>>50134495
>What's your solution to fix the monetary system?
Lynchings and genocide.
There's no other solution any longer.
You can't even rely on the common person any more because everybody is born, bred and raised into our current (((System))) and nearly everybody has lost the ability to even imagine things without the (((System)))'s omnipresence.

>>50134972
you know mining was banned in china right?

>>50134561
shalom

>>50131905
Not even close.

>>50135480
>Look at what the chinks have done
The exact same thing Americans did with real estate in the 2000s but way more extreme.

>>50134972
Satoshi sold his wallets to the Chinese.

>>50131905
i think you meant food in walmart or any other supermarket for that matter

>>50131905
Not even close. Think pyramids.

>>50134301
you forgot the part where nobody wants to eat shit

>>50131905
What a load of crap. Having new iPhones for those mindless iDroids every year for over a decade, now there we have spoilt resources. Just one example.

You could turn it off and use crayons. Meanwhile the USD is backed by pic related and is still slow rugging.

>>50134628
Has this actually led to any breakthroughs?

>>50131905
ever heard of the welfare state?
or any government ponzi for that matter

>>50134822
>this meme
this psyop is like 100 years old at this point, imagine being so stupid you fall for a 100 year old psyop. moron

>>50135594
You're seriously arguing that two people eating shit improves the economy? That was the net result of the activity. Keynesians are mentally ill.

>>50131905
I used to work in kind of a similar room at a bank. Just me and a bunch of computers at night. Except we weren't running a bunch of VGUs. It was AS400s, Tandems and Dec Vax's.

>>50137511
and yet McDonalds is making more money than you'll ever see in your entire life and creates billions of jobs worldwide. Are you fucking retarded?

>>50137539
If Steve Jobs was such a genius why did he bother to iterate the iPhone 1-6, to get to 7?

Because he's not that smart, and he was the best there is.

All we have left is Woz... and we know what Woz says

>>50138889
>McDonalds is making more money than you'll ever see in your entire life

Challenge accepted

>>50134628
Sorry, protein folding is a solved problem. Solved, in fact, by another "evil," "wasteful" energy vampire: artificial intelligence.

>>50131905
Feeding Africans costed us trillions, we could of built space elevators attached to an orbital ring if we didn’t give gibs to nigs