/biz/ - Business & Finance

There's nothing wrong with wagies asking for more pay, but if their excuse for doing a shitty job is because of low pay, then they would do the same shit job at higher pay.

depends on the industry. most industries are underpaid and the value of their labor is translated into stock growth.

These private equity firms come in and fuck shit up. slash benefits, slash pay. turn everything into performance related bonuses rather than stock options. etc.

Founders hands stay clean, sometimes selling your company is worth more than hurting your image in the process of trying to turn it profitable yourself.

>>50123915
Not true at all, I cared a lot more about my job at 30 an hour then my previous job at 13. The main difference is I don’t want to lose my current job and go back to making nothing

>>50123637
Low end and high end wages usually follow a clear correlation of skill. As in the quant finance genius as a very scarce and hard to attain skillset while being a warm body to carry food from point A to B is something anyone can do, one is hard to replace while the other is trivial to replace. The issue begins on middle management and corporate high management, case in point anyone could do the job of an HR roastie but despite this they get paid more than they should when you factor how replaceable they are. A lot of positions command a high price just for the responsibility but when shit hits the fan those same positions are the first to flee

Less. At high levels, they calculate the bare minimum a wagie can live on, subtract a little, and voila that's the salary. The gunmint is expected to make up any shortfall. The idea of paying wagies a living salary appears to horrify wealthy people, I'm not quite sure why. It could be simply they don't want to pay Manuel the gardener, or Jesus the pool boy, a proper salary, and it factors in from there.
A lot of people are borderline serfs these days, and expected to say yes massa. This won't last forever.

>>50123637
>Are most wagies paid more or less than they're worth?
Varies, I've known some wagies who aren't paid well enough and I've known wagies paid more than they should ever earn

>>50123637
Wagies are payed what the job worth. So, if some is worth $60 an hour, but the job is worth $10 an hour, guess what they are payed?

>>50123637
No. They aren't worth anything to begin with.

When you have 20% of the workers keeping the company in business, of course the majority of the wagies are overpaid.

>>50123637
less, that's the very definition of capitalism

>>50124670
This.
Most wagie jobs are just an elaborate form of welfare gibs.

>>50123637
Most wagies produce nothing, or even worse, actively slow down productivity of real workers. Thus, most wagies are overpaid relative to their productivity.

>>50124552
This. You shouldn't put a price tag on a human being.
I think there's an 80-20 rule of thumb for this kind of stuff. 20% of wagies are responsible for 80% of the productivity.

>>50124670
I also agree. The overwhelmingly vast majority of people take more than they give. The 80/20 rule is perhaps the single most pervasive phenomenon in all of human society. It shows up everywhere. In this case, 80% of the value produced by a company is produced by 20% of the employees. The other 80% of employees should frankly be lopped off and put into gas chambers, but are able to persist due to plausible deniability of their own worthlessness. There are so many workers out there whose entire workload ends up getting quietly redone by actual smart people in the company, but it goes either unnoticed or unpunished.

>>50123637
You aren't going to get an honest answer from most people here since it's easy to talk shit to others when you're a parasitic neet cunt with nothing to do

>>50123915
>money is the main motivator in modern humans
>uhh pay better salaries don't improve the quality of the work sweetie, because uhh.. because no ok?

>>50124906
If they want more money, why don't they do a better job? Do they not want to get promoted? Doing such a shitty job, it's like they hate money or something.

>>50123637
Minimum wagies, in general are paid more and most office salary cucks are paid way way more by orders of magnitude but most wagies in between the two are paid less than they're worth

Lefty /pol/ seething ITT

>>50123637
I thought value is subjective? Nobody is worth anything, including the owners.

>>50123637
you're a retard for needing to ask. Employers pay the minimum they can get away with. Not in a way that scales off of the ROI you produce (i.e. 50% the way it should be).
/thread

>>50124797
how are you measuring productivity? value is subjective.
>>50124817
> value produced
what value? all value is subjective.

>>50125937
Just read most of you guy's replies. You're all idiots for not seeing it my way.

>>50125943
>value is subjective.
Roi is not subjective. Employers will not hire someone without knowing the estimated roi they produce. They don't just guess and hope for the best because that's a retarded way of running a business and it would be sure to fail.

>>50125901
>I thought value is subjective? Nobody is worth anything, including the owners.
You're a complete midwit. Value is the ROI produced for the company.

>looking at job listings put out by my countries nigger unemployment agency
>(minimum wage) 70 hour working week required. Class 5 truck driver. Must have held license for 5+ years. Hours are 2am-2pm and 10am-10pm. Full time casual employee (so you can't get any benefits, overtime, sick/holiday leave, or medical coverage).
Can you imagine doing that for less than what a fucking burgerflipper makes?

>>50123637
100% more than my worth.
I literally just scan your shit and bag them up.
What kind of easy shit job does any less than this?
Food delivery drivers make equal to what i do and I don't even have a car to deteriorate

>>50123637
I am paid less than I am worth. I put up with it because I refused to mask up through COVID and I refused to get the vax despite work trying to require it. I called them out on genetic discrimination and we seem to be at an understanding. I will walk away when GME moons and take everyone who also refused to bend a knee with me.

>>50123637
American wagies are paid very well, american housing is broken though. It shouldnt cost so much to live in a box no matter how fancy it is or how close to the nice area of the city it is.

But the only way to keep niggers away is to out price them. Unless you wanna live near niggers you have to spend your whole paycheck getting raped by realestate.

>>50126492
You're a retard. Probably a baby boomer too

>>50126545
Housing costs changes everything. Go around the world and compare wages and cost of living.

America has enormous potential for fairly priced realestate compared to major metropolitian areas of Europe.

>>50126582
>Housing costs changes everything. Go around the world and compare wages and cost of living.
Take your own advice, retard boomer. You're also arguing this when we're entering a recession too? LMFAOO boomers are peak delusional.
You're objectively wrong in every level btw. Just to give you an example, when baby boomers had a median age of 35, they owned 21% of all the nation's wealth. Millennials of the same median age? 3%. They literally had 7x of the wealth compared to millennials (with less effort too i.e. not needing a degree for middle class jobs). Population of both generations are about the same so even though it's not a per capita stat, it's the next best thing.

What does this mean? MACRO DOWNTREND IN BUYING POWER
But yes. People have it better now, LOL

Also median wages in 2000 were 20,957.18. In 2020 (last time this was updated)? 34,612.04.

Wage Increase of 65%. Did inflation all around only go up by 65%? No, you fucking retard. Educate yourself.

Learn how to spot downtrends

>>50126636
Im living thailand. Housing is cheap, labor is extremely cheap. Food is cheap.

>>50126582
Also most people are leveraged up the ass. What the fuck do you think that means?? It means when the recession hits in full force, many will lose their jobs which in turn means no more mortgage payments which means massive foreclosures. Even without a recession, it's inevitable because wages don't keep up with inflation (let alone hyper inflation) meaning more and more buying power is getting fucked meaning it becomes harder and harder to keep up with costs which in itself would cause people to struggle to pay mortgages.

It's gonna crash. Depending on how much will then determine if they are affordable. You're an idiot if you don't think it's a speculative bubble at this point.

>>50126654
You shouldn't be commenting to begin with. Clearly you're not understanding the macro environment.m and how everything is going to shit.

>>50126671
It shouldnt take 30 years to buy a box made of plaster, wood, nails, pipes, and wires.

>>50126685
Why do you think im in Thailand. America problem is unfixable unless it addresses the out of control criminal culture worship.

>>50126688
Well that's america for you. Real estate isn't priced on material and labor (they way it should). Real estate is treated the same way you treat a shitcoin. As a speculative asset who's only purpose is to flip for more resulting in the fucking over of people who simply want a home to live in. That's why real estate shouldn't be some for profit industry. It gets monopolized (such as by blackrock), it gets flipped into a bubble, it prices out people from owning a home (youth in particular), and increases poverty rates of the masses.
Capitalism works 100% with luxuries. Doesn't work with necessities because then you get what I described above. The problem with necessities being treated as speculative assets is that there is no "choice" meaning they have no leverage. For instance if a bag of hot cheetos was a mil dollars, that's fine because I have a choice to buy it or not as it's a luxury. Real estate is a necessity so people get abused by the ones that monopolized it. It's similar to say needing surgeries to live. You'd ignore the price and pay as much as necessary to live because it's not a real "choice". You HAVE to het the surgeries or you die. It's not free choice in the way that a bag of hot Cheetos are.

>>50126758
How do we fix it, I think disallowing foreign money to own American real-estate might help, similar to Thailand.

>>50126780
Well if I could I'd make government be in charge of creating homes and make it be priced on material and labor rather than on the "supply of homes and the demand for them" meaning I wouldn't have say the location of the home determine the price. Would be first come first served.

Fixing the real estate problem would bump people's buying power to an exorbitant degree too and lower poverty rates which in turn would lower crime rates. Less drug addicts meaning less neets too.

Sadly this government is ruled by evil satanists so it wouldn't work.

>>50126780
Well if I could I'd make government be in charge of creating homes and make it be priced on material and labor rather than on the "supply of homes and the demand for them". I also wouldn't have the location of the home determine the price. Don't care if a home in in a beach or in some ugly neighborhood. Material and labor would be the only determining cost. Would be first come first served too.
Fixing the real estate problem would bump people's buying power to an exorbitant degree too and lower poverty rates which in turn would lower crime rates. Less drug addicts meaning less neets too.
Sadly this government is ruled by evil satanists so it wouldn't work.

>>50126780
>How do we fix it,
cool it with the anti semitic remarks

>>50124170
its simple people that make over their basic minimum lifestyle can save money, with these savings they can then bridge unemployment gaps
this means both that workers can jobhop to the competition and that workers will flee when workplace conditions become too intolerable
if a wagie however is 2 paychecks away from homelessness and destitution you can squeeze him all the harder for more output to fill your bottom line
for instance making health insurance dependable on employment is another delightful kike tactic to indenture the plebs
and this can last long anon, the plebs being barely distinguishable from slaves is the historic norm, the post war period is the aberration

Less. A lot less

>>50125978
for most workers its almost impossible to determine real roi
then middle managers come up with a lot of bullshit metrics to justify there own job and it goes from there
take middle managers for instance, depending on your viewpoint their roi is either 0 or 100%

you can determine the roi of a team that completes a functional part of your final product, but then to accurately attribute this teams roi to its individual members is impossible

>>50123637
>webm
He forgot the Diet Dr. Kelp

>>50127704
>for most workers its almost impossible to determine real roi
Objectively false. Companies don't just hire people without being able to determine if they'll be a net gain or not. If they did, they'd fail within the year.

>>50127176
Keked And Checked

t. Elder of Zion

>>50127762
didnt read the rest of the post where i explained the concept
answer me this
whats the roi of a middle manager
whats the roi of an hr roastie
whats the roi of a r&d engineer

>>50128143
Your post is basically saying "roi can't be determined" which is bullshit
>whats the roi of a middle manager
>whats the roi of an hr roastie
>whats the roi of a r&d engineer
I'm not a business owner. I'm not a business analyst either. It's common sense that you don't hire someone without knowing if they'll be a net gain or net loss because that's retarded and your business will go under. I don't need to know the whole logistics of a business to know hiring isn't based off of bringing in random amounts of people from a number someone pulls out of their ass. There's a logical process to it. Not just randomly guessing.

>>50128241
ok i am talking to a retard
not every hire has to be a net positive, only the aggregate of the company
anybody that ever had a job will know the bloat that exists in big corpos

>>50128404
>not every hire has to be a net positive, only the aggregate of the company
You're an imbecile
Yes I'm sure companies want to lose money and hire out of the "goodness in their hearts". Fucking retard

>>50128404
>aggregate
Yes and their roi can be measured in that way, retard

>>50123637
absolute majority are paid less, of course. some are paid more, but they are a minority.

>>50128688
Actually, I think it is more of an ego thing. They want to be seen as important so they hire masses of useless underlings. I think it also serves as a buffer to well moneyed parasites as it delays the threat of automation and machinery taking over since you can just pay useless wagies money to keep the scam going instead of throwing everyone out of work thereby turning everyone into a thieving murderous turbonigger.

>>50128709
>Actually, I think it is more of an ego thing.
No. Just stop talking

>>50128691
that was my original point you room temperature iq'ed dofus
you can only calculate the aggregate roi not the individual roi, as long as the aggregate is net positive its a viable business

if you ever had any real job in a big corp you would know how much bloat there exists, so that leads me to believe you didn't

>>50128688
>Yes I'm sure companies want to lose money and hire out of the "goodness in their hearts"
present day companies exist so that stonk number go up, stonk number is vaguely correlated to profitability but not as absolute as you think
corps will def overhire to goose their stonks, this is the business model of the big fagmans for ages hire people and let them do busywork just so the competition doesnt get them
for fuck sakes moot was hired by google to traipse around japan, i am sure he generated a lot of profit there
and other firms just hire to present increased headcounts to vc's to create the illusion of progress, see coinbase lately

>>50128738
Basically to keep the big scam going. Yes, big multinationals lose money on hires especially with all this make paper work bullshit. Why they do this? Beats me, but I guarantee you no one will respect your silly department if you don't have a mass of useful idiots under your command. It's just how it works. It is all to prop up the business which has never really turned a profit, but olds, brainlets and the grubbermint keep giving them free money. A good 80 percent of the workforce is a blithering mass of useless faggots, and that is being nice.

Most people don't actually do anything at all of value. Most work can be automated, and it is an existential threat to these "be productive" careerist faggots. So there is a need to keep the illusion going, like saying work is somehow righteous in of itself, even when it is the functional equivalent of staring at a fucking blank wall.

Us autists have a natural born immunity to this psyop propaganda bullshit due to our superior analytical brains, but man, at what cost? Somedays I wish I was a normalfag and pretend that the system has some form of equity, but instead I was born redpilled forever condemned to see bullshit for what it is.

>>50123637
It's up to each individual wagie to decide. None of your damn business.

>>50123637
Do Americans relly think walking while it's snowing is some incredibly extreme traumatizing event?

>>50128927
It was for Napoleon's army.

>>50128761
>you can only calculate the aggregate roi not the individual roi,
Yes, retard and then you can evenly distribute it from there. Dumbass monkey.
My point is ROI can be measured and companies don't hire people without logical reasoning. Keep up.
>you would know how much bloat there exists, so that leads me to believe you didn't
You're an idiot for missing my point. Read above
>corps will def overhire to goose their stonks
>>50128804
>Basically to keep the big scam going. Yes, big multinationals lose money on hires especially with all this make paper work bullshit. Why they do this? Beats me
They don't. It's probably a cost that yields enough benefits to make it a net gain
> A good 80 percent of the workforce is a blithering mass of useless faggots, and that is being nice.
Nice opinion. Doesn't matter. Pay should scale based off of ROI. Simple as.

>>50128857
>Most people don't actually do anything at all of value. Most work can be automated
Companies won't randomly hire if it results in a net loss unless they want to go under and have their business fail. Just wtf is this gibberish

>>50128951
It doesn't work like that you dumbass. You think they are like some hyper efficient machine, newsflash, they aren't. Maybe for your little mom and pop that might be the case, but for these big mega wealth corporation with an established client base, that isn't necessarily true. They can overlook being inefficient faggots for some time before it catches up.

>>50128986
>It doesn't work like that you dumbass.
Ya it does. You said it yourself. Aggregate. You can measure a department's overall roi and then determine pay from there.

>>50128986
Forgot to call you a faggot, faggot

>>50128960
The rules that apply to a small business do not apply to large publicly traded companies that get grubbermint dibs, how fucking retarded are you? These mass wealth companies are literally the biggest fucking welfare niggers that the world has ever known, and you think they somehow make money from some paper pusher jacking off after he finished his 3 hours of work? Get the fuck out of here! kek

>>50128986
ALSO my rule of thumb should be applied whenever applicable. Sure logistics can get complicated, but by your logic it is quote literally never possible to determine when a person will ever be a net gain or loss and by your logic productivity can never be measured. It's fucking retarded logic. You think people get raises for free too? No, it's usually based off of productivity (companies still jew you with pay regardless, but fact is productivity can be measured and the loss of specific roles and their effects on the company can also be measured).

>>50129008
The fat to be trimmed is definitely there, that is all I'm saying. This imagined hyper efficiency in a largely imperialist grift economy simply doesn't exist. Like I said, biggest welfare niggers the world has ever known collecting grubbermint gibs off normies' backs like a neet.

>>50129014
>The rules that apply to a small business do not apply to large publicly traded companies that get grubbermint dibs, how fucking retarded are you?
Just because you say it doesn't doesn't make it true, you bumbling fucking retard. Again, you retarded faggot. Aggregate. Roi as a whole can be determined. Saying otherwise is fucking retarded. And yes I know zombie companies are a thing. That simply means they shouldn't exist if they can't operate a profitable business on their own, you low IQ stupid fuck.

>>50129032
No. If that were the case scientists like Kary Mullis wouldn't be getting 10k severance after a breakthrough in DNA amplification netting the company he worked for 300 million dollars. Rule by capital doesn't necessarily imply merit, dumbass.

A lot of people on minimum wage, maybe even most, work far harder than those paid twice as much. The reason they get paid so little is because these are usually jobs literally anyone can do. If you have a functioning brain and body then you can do this job. When employees are as easily replaceable as that you will ALWAYS find workers willing to settle for minimum wage. It's the sad truth.
The only solution is to raise the minimum wage to a level people can live comfortably on, but this would enrage those who studied and trained for a specialist job who feel like they deserve more. It would throw everything out of whack. Society needs to keep most people in poverty to give the rest motivation to do more.

>>50129056
No, because capital owners leverage their undeserved wealth against you. They are literally the original murderous thieving niggers and want to laud that fact over you.

>>50129041
>The fat to be trimmed is definitely there, that is all I'm saying.
Again. Aggregate. No fucking shit in some cases individuals that are useless go unnoticed. For instance I've seen stories of people that didn't show up for work in months and even years without being noticed while still receiving a check. That's a logistical problem. Every individual is still expected to put out some "average" amount of work. Not catching shit like that is the issue. Their pay was most likely determined by the output of the department as a whole rather than on the individual (with some jew kikery in the mix to lower pay as much as possible).

>>50129056
Not even skilled labor is paid what they are worth, because it is still ultimately up to your piece of shit boss to acknowledge your contribution.

>>50125385
>they are all thin

>>50129072
Yes, aggregate. You are not saying anything. Just calling the inefficiency "aggregate" doesn't mean it simply disappears.

>>50129055
>No. If that were the case scientists like Kary Mullis wouldn't be getting 10k severance after a breakthrough in DNA amplification netting the company he worked for 300 million dollars. Rule by capital doesn't necessarily imply merit, dumbass.
That's literally my point, you fucking idiot. Examples like that scientist exactly. Pay should be determined based on roi. Clearly they got jewed. With my idea, they'd get 50% of the roi since going by what you said, they alone discovered the breakthrough and I believe in a 50/50 relationship. My idea not being implemented is exactly why people like that scientist get jewed.

>>50128927
Do eurofaggots really not watch videos to the end before opening their cock holsters?

>>50129105
Well there you go, what should, obviously isn't what is.

Some more, many less

>>50129090
I am saying pay should scale based off of roi rather than the minimum the employer can get away with. Say a department generates 10 mil roi a year and they get the equivalent of 2mil while the jews pocket the rest. With my idea another 3 mil would be going to that department. You're not reading what I'm saying.

>>50129120
No fucking shit. My original post was literally just answering op's question about how people don't get paid right because pay is based on the minimum an employer can get away with rather than on the roi itself.

>>50124552
This quote is meant to be inspirational and wholesome but really it just says "steal as many of the animals' resources as you can"

>>50129125
a side gig is the answer wagie.

>>50129127
some wagie just need to learn new skills to get a higher-paying job. Most of the things can be learned for free and it's readily available on google.

>>50129161
>a side gig is the answer wagie.
Yeah let's just forfeit every second of spare time until we die.
A full time (meaning 40 hours a week at most) job should be enough to sustain a life. If it isn't, the system is clearly broken.

>>50129161
>some wagie just need to learn new skills to get a higher-paying job. Most of the things can be learned for free and it's readily available on google.
Do you have reading comprehension issues? No fucking shit some jobs pay more than others. That's not the point I'm making.

>>50129189
kek, of course, you still keep your fucking full-time job. what I'm saying is to use your extra time for something useful.
I know a lot of content creators earning a good amount of money and they are just doing it with their spare time.

>>50128996
but that is my entire argument you retard
you can determine a teams roi and distribute pay evenly
but you don't hire a team, you hire an individual so within a team you have overpaid underachievers and underpaid overachievers
is your reading comprehension really this dimwitted

>>50129032
raises are not based on productivity, as mentioned again you have never worked a real job for a big corp before have you

>>50129075
True. But at least with a skill you can always try shopping around for a better offer. If you work stocking then you don't really have much choice.

>>50129224
what the fuck are you saying boomer. a lot of remote jobs offer a good rate. My fucking friend is earning a good amount by just making content about crypto.
I'm just waiting for KOLnet to go live and I will fucking show you how it's done, I do keep reading about crypto every weekend, now that I'm qualified to be a mirco-KOL I can earn for helping projects with marketing.

>>50129311
1. Retard. Doesn't matter if roi of an individual can't be measured hence why I said in case where applicable it should be based off aggregate. My point still stands, you stupid fucking retard
2.
>not based on productivity
It is to an extent, faggot. People that actually show their merits are more likely to get a raise than those that are lackluster (only thing is it isn't a direct scale off of roi).
You're an imbecile. With my idea though asking for raises wouldn't even be a thing since it would automatically be determined bu the productivity of the individual (or team aka on the aggregate). Keep up, retardo

>>50123915
you're retarded as fuck bro

>>50129105
you cant make that calculation directly, that is why i asked you to do the roi on a r&d engineer
you have the 300 mil profit excess of the whole project and you want to attribute 50% of that to the leading scientist that made the breakthrough
so you are already ignoring all the junior scientists that made all the measurements etc on which the breaktrhough is based and yes these also require new discoveries
and then you ignore all the engineers that take the lab based prototype and turned it into something sellable they also made groundbreaking contributions
then you ignore sales and marketing, tho granted less technical necessary and then you ignore ;gov compliance people who are both useless and all important at the same time

hence my argument of contributions can only be seen in aggregate
how would you fairly distribute the 300 mil to the various people that made it possible, what's your fair distribution between the compliance paper pusher and the r&d engineer that made the energy system on the final product

>>50129348
>what the fuck are you saying boomer.
finish your ESL classes
>a lot of remote jobs offer a good rate.
Not relevant at all to my point
>My fucking friend is earning a good amount by just making content about crypto.
I don't care. It's not relevant to my point about roi
>I'm just waiting for KOLnet to go live and I will fucking show you how it's done, I do keep reading about crypto every weekend, now that I'm qualified to be a mirco-KOL I can earn for helping projects with marketing.
Read above. You're a fucking moron

>>50123637
more

1: minimum wage laws and the artificial price floor they create forego market equilibrium, resulting in some people being paid more than they're worth at the cost of higher unemployment. NEET is not wagie so all else being equal, more people are paid more than they are worth.

2: If you provide value to your employer in excess of your wage, but you do not take the initiative to seek higher wages or work for yourself and earn more, you are paid exactly what you are worth.

3: Unions, nepotism, and poor management all more often than not result in higher wages for the beneficiaries despite there being no increase in value.

I tend to agree with the 20/80 rule however individuals need to advocate for themselves if they want to make more.

I'm probably going to switch jobs after I milk my state's paternity pay benefits.

>>50129364
>with my idea
>reality
nobody who ever worked will tell you raises are based on merit
i don't think there is any point in discussing the intricacies of labour policy with a 16 year old or a perma neet

and you are self contradicting now :
>in case where applicable it should be based off aggregate
so per definition underpaying some and overpaying others, for its pretty fucking unlikely everybody had the same contribution in the team now is it

>>50129371
>you cant make that calculation directly, that is why i asked you to do the roi on a r&d engineer
Nigger. I don't know the logistics to a company. I said as much. I also said companies don't fucking hire if it's going to be at a loss and you basically just said "they do because somehow it helps the stock go up" in which case it's still a net gain in those instances.
>you have the 300 mil profit excess of the whole project and you want to attribute 50% of that to the leading scientist that made the breakthrough
>so you are already ignoring all the junior scientists that made all the measurements etc on which the breaktrhough is based and yes these also require new discoveries
Are you retarded? I went by the info you gave me earlier on. I'm not going to look up that scientist to verify your shit. If more people helped, they should catch that money too. If there was a whole department and the total roi was 300mil, then that whole department should get 150mil. Like holy fuck I already gave an exact example above >>50129127

>>50129413
yes you are too retarded to engage in conversation with
you cannot do a hypothetical and you dont know we have id's here

>>50129396
>nobody who ever worked will tell you raises are based on merit
>i don't think there is any point in discussing the intricacies of labour policy with a 16 year old or a perma neet
You're a literal retard and also ignored the later part.
>contradicting
Where, retard?
>so per definition underpaying some and overpaying others, for its pretty fucking unlikely everybody had the same contribution in the team now is it
You're an imbecile that can't read. I'm not saying a supervisor should get the same pay as the underlings. I am saying the extra money should be distributed to the department. Fucking hell, are you pretending to be retarded just to try to find some holes in my reasoning?

>>50129430
That's right. Give up like the dumb little bitch that you are. Stay quiet now and learn your place.

>>50129430
fyi retard when I was in a union I didn't have to haggle for pay because pay was predetermined. I know people that do have to haggle and yes they mention their accomplishments (cs guy I know), you fucking clown

>>50129372
you pajeet then die with the fucking cycle, be a wagie for the rest of your fucking life.
If you don't adapt to change you will be an angry anon forever, soon wagies like you will be replaced by robots. good luck.

>>50129435
>I am saying the extra money should be distributed to the department
in which it will then be unfairly distributed because individual contribution is hard to determine, which is again my original point
i really am arguing against a mentally handicapped person here

this exchange has lost its meaning

>>50129455
and here we have union blue collar retard thinks he understand how the world works and he can do his bosses job easy peasy
predetermined pay is the very definition of mispriced labor

>>50129456
Kys for being illiterate. You COMPLETELY missed my point because you are an ESL dropout.
>>50129457
>in which it will then be unfairly distributed because individual contribution is hard to determine, which is again my original point
Should simply scale off if their initial pay i.e. leadership role getting more of the lionshare. What percent allocation exactly? Honestly at that point it would be completely arbitrary, but it's still the better alternative over how things are now where the head scientist that made the discovery only got 10k, you stupid fucking retarded jew
>whaaa I don't care that your idea is an improvement. It's too hard to determine individual roi so let's just keep the current jew system
kys

>>50129457
kek both of you are retarded. Just open your own fucking thread.

>>50129469
>and here we have union blue collar retard thinks he understand how the world works and he can do his bosses job easy peasy
>predetermined pay is the very definition of mispriced labor
Wrong, retard. Unions negotiate and pay in a way that closer scales to roi. Superior than getting jewed by non-union employers. Employers that have union worker contractors are not "operating at a loss vs hiring non-union". They are getting paid closer to what is being produced. Faggot.

>>50129518
*employers are paying closer to the roi
it's a common misconception. It simply means the jew games are lessoned for union workers when it comes to pay. Probably not perfect, but a better alternative

>>50129518
eventually, some wagies will resign, the internet is evolving they can get a better job their while working at home.

>>50129528
Stop talking to me because you aren't understanding what I'm saying.

>>50123637
Of course less. Because profit comes from the difference between how much value they create, and how much they are paid.

>>50124170
>At high levels, they calculate the bare minimum a wagie can live on, subtract a little, and voila that's the salary.
Marx's theory of necessary labor.

>>50124170
>This won't last forever
Yes it will

>>50123637
The rate of exploitation nowadays in around 200%. So there is the answer.

>>50129891
that says rate of surplus value tho

>>50123637
Yeah I'd say so.
Particularly white collar office jobs.

After reading the book, "Bullshit Jobs" I'm convinced HR is a completely worthless department filled with equally worthless, skilless people being overpaid for basically doing nothing.

>>50123637
most wagies are paid exactly what they are worth.
in fact thats the defining metric.
i see what you did there OP
clever, at least to a dipshit like me.

>>50126847
>Making government in charge of pricing material and labor.
See Soviet Union.

>>50129072
Things get different when the income of the company is completely divorced from the actual work they do, and when they need all sorts of makework employees for various liability reasons

How do you measure the ROI of some middle management queer making sure noone sues for sexual harassment ?

>>50129014
For me, some days I have 1 hour of actual work

>>50131284
you had to read a stupid book written by a leftist to understand that HR is worthless ?