/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>4604716
Check out this soy boy

INSULT

>the middle finger that saved crypto

The signs are all there. This isn't his first meltdown. He is seriously unstable. Everyone involved with bcash that I know of is unstable for some reason: jihan, ver, mcafee. I don't trust any of them one bit.

>BCH up 3% since OP
what did the invisible hand mean by this

This is maximum autism rage.

This is "ITS GNU/LINUX NOT LINUX" levels of autism

>>4605366
Always trade emotionally.

>>4605350
sauce on this image? i want more ver freakouts

>>4605366

>>4605366
that's a bounce, after it dumped immediately after this interview and a lot of bch hodlers realized roger's a fucking retard

BUT IM A BILLIONAAREEEEE

ragequit

now pump bcash some more plz

This guy is such a fucking joke

>Carvalho constantly interrupting and talking over Ver
>never drops the bcash meme to further the interview
>probably doing this purposely for views
Core cucks are getting more and more desperate by the day

>>4605350
They're not unstable, they're overly sensitive. If you're reach The Wisdom of Life by Schopenhauer then you'd understand that geniuses are especially sensitive.

This can be observed in McAfee's body language when he's irritated from someone's conversation because they're repeating the same thing over and over or being repetitious and stating the obvious.

>>4605386
Its from a dutch documentary, skip to around 47:30.
But honestly I like ver in this moment, he seems very honest here.
Bcash is shit though, he should have remained loyal to core. His arguments in the discussion with John were weak to say the least and I hope it saves some deluded cashies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EVLdWu8j-Lg&t=1s

>>4604716
I don't understand why Bitcoin core doesn't just increase the block size. Why is there any opposition? Can someone please explain?

No one is going to use a payment system with $10+ fees and that takes hours to confirm. Yes, Roger Ver's meltdown was pathetic but he was winning the argument on every point up until he rage quit.

WHY DOESN'T CORE JUST INCREASE THE BLOCK SIZE?

>>4605350
You forgot fake Satoshi and the pedophile pirate guy.

>>4604716

>>4605554
>I don't understand why Bitcoin core doesn't just increase the block size. Why is there any opposition? Can someone please explain?
We got over this a million times. If you still don't get it, you just want to troll, I guess.

>>4604716

>>4605582
Because that would admit defeat, and also give up the monopoly they have on bitcoin. Fuck off

>>4605554
Blockstreams' intent is to run Core into the ground or centralize it. These are their only two options.
Day by day the support for (((blockstream))) dwindles and you can see the sentiment shift towards Cash as its market cap increases daily.

>>4605606
What are you talking about? Stressed out, Roger?

>>4605582
I'm all in ETH and alts so I honestly don't know. I've been researching it all day and it increasing the block size seems an obvious way to scale, reduce fees, reduce times, and actually make it competitive as a means of payment to replace fiat

Is it just that the miners in China are blocking it? Are there any technical reasons why 1MB blocks are better

Not trolling

I can see this guy putting his foot on a whore's head while doggy-fucking her and spitting on her

>>4605554
Then when the blocks are full, you do what? Increase the block size again? Then they fill up again. Then what? Repeat.

I dont know if I can trust my money with people who want to run a coin into the ground just because they dont want to change a variable from 1 to 8.

>>4605668
Yes. What's wrong with that?

>>4605619
Ummmm. No. Prince Al Alaweed was the main money behind the BCH Scam. That is why he attacked Bitcoin Core on Global News. He wound up getting arrested, and 20 Billion dollars in assets seized. He had many financing channels to take over the Royal Kingdom. All of his guards were shot and killed, or captured and interrogated until almost dead. then executed. They are working their way down the food chain. Lucky for Roger Ver, he is at the bottom of the stack, so he has a little time, but not much.

Notice any pattern here?

>>4605350
DON'T CALL IT B CASH ITS FUCKIN BITCOIN CASH

>>4605648
If you are honestly interested in some technical aspects, watch one of Andreas Antonopulous latest videos. Obviously, one cannot explain every single detail and all aspects but he covers some of the most important things in this debate.

https://youtu.be/AecPrwqjbGw

>>4605675
2 is a better number desu.
but its hilarious to watch the infighting

>>4605648
>Is it just that the miners in China are blocking it?
You have it backwards.

>>4605703
I like 3

>>4605668
uhh.. yes?

just like Satoshi intended, he wrote many times that we can just keep increasing blocksize as hard drive space and bandwidth continue becoming cheaper

what you do is raise the block size to what it needs to be now. Then later on technology gets faster and cheaper you can raise it again. Then once you come up with a better solution you drop the block size down to a smaller number after you put the new change in place.

What is wrong with this?

>>4605684
you have to be fucking retarded if you don't understand the issue.

>>4605696
fucking scam cash is what it is

>>4605730
just explain it then genius

>>4605701
watching now

>>4605724
its because core is run by neckbeard autists who will only accept a "perfect" solution. they are just wagecucks spitting out code for a boss (blockstream) who is trying to centralize bitcoin tx's into its own patented payment channels

>>4605701
The assumed knowledge when reading articles on this topic / watching videos is bizarre

>How many of you have a routable IP?
wat
>How many of you have heard of the internet of things. OK, well the internet of things is
we all know what IOT is

>>4605752
bitcoin is anti centralization, as the blockchain increases it prices out less affluent people/countries from running full nodes which is the exact opposite of what bitcoin is supposed to be. bitcoin consuming 160 countries worth of electricity to function is going to be the next massive stepping stone. If you want a bitcoin that is controlled by fucking scum like ver then go ahead and cheer for increased blocksize because between perpetually bigger blocks and electricity costs of mining fucking pieces of shit like him are going to be the only ones left running the network.

>>4605799
I have the feeling that it's just Andreas' humor. Or alternatively, I also don't understand it.

> hey im sorry man
that ending

Someone who doesn't raise the block size even a tiny bit to appease a political group is fucking scum!!

It's just hilarious that the more upset they get, the more people call it Bcash

>>4605724
literally nothing.

>>4605858
kek fucking saved, thanks anon

>>4605693
???

>>4605723
By the time one of the smaller mining farms downloads the large block and starts mining, one of the giant farms with Gov subsidized internet/power is already mining the block and about to collect the reward. Smaller mining farms can't be competitive anymore, which leads to just a few large farms confirming ALL the BTC transactions.

Decentralization is the name of the game, and the bigger the blocks get, the more centralized mining becomes.

>>4605648
Blocks are not capped to 1MB anymore thanks to 2nd level scaling solution called segwit. THis is what guys like Roger don't understand how protocols & scaling in IT works.

>>4605509
can confirm. I'm good at checking out and/or masking but it gets REALLY FUCKING ANNOYING, REALLY FUCKING FAST dealing with 90% of humans in 90% of situations.

That 10% though . . . totally worth it.

tweet "bcash" to him

>>4605723
assuming that technology will infinitely improve because it has exponentially in the past is the height of fucking stupidity.

>>4605906
>Segwit
>a scaling solution

Ignorant corecuck

>>4605906
segwit adoption peaked at 15%, is back to 9%.
and at 100% it will only allow 1.7MB of data in a 1 MB block.

>Be Roger
>Stressed all fucking night for the interview
>Watch Jihan's video getting triggered time and time again
>"this will not happen to me, im multimillionarie"
>Instead of solid arguments research this guys porn site
>Actually start lurking the videos
>Spent all night fapping to guys on guys
>"holy shit its the interview time"
>...
>"ITSS NOT-T B-BCASH ITS B-BITCOIN CASHH"

>>4605906
Technically they are 1mb but the blocks can contain about 3.8mb of regular transactions if segwit is used. Unfortunately, most exchanges didn't adapt it yet (except Bitfinex which is going to use Segwit soon).

>>4605944
wrong

>>4605520
honestly (and I had this realization back when he was blatantly shilling for mt gox as they imploded), while he may not be the anarcho-capatalist hero we want . . . He just might be the anarcho-capatalist hero we deserve.

The whole point of crypto is to be a trustLESS solution to money. If we had people we thought we could trust leading the way . . . wouldn't we inevitably be be led astray?

This is how it's supposed to be.

BCASH 2018

>mfw when i've never bought any bch

>>4605858
ftsfy

>>4605944
so thats what you do? just tell lies even though you know your faggot ass is gonna be called out on shit? how does that work out for you irl i wonder? no wonder your family is so disappointed.

>>4605648
Imagine that you have an account with Blockstream that you use to make transactions, and at the end of the day or week Blockstream actually puts your net transactions into the blockchain. This prevents blocks from getting too heavy with a 1mb blocksize. In this world, Blockstream charges you a fee to do this. That's why they don't want a blocksize increase.

>>4605653
nah, i think he's more the pay her to shit on his chest type

>>4605965
Thanks for the update

>>4605746
Wish more people would realise this.

>>4605812
How the fuck is Ver scum in any way? He helps plenty of good causes and is very passionate about the bitcoin discussion. Less afluent people aint gonna use a bitcoin with high fees anyway, and they definitely won't run a full node for a coin they don't use.

Let both bitcoins run together and time will decide which one is the best. Both cases seem to have downsides. But calling Roger scum is retarded.

>>4606000

>>4605799
lol, its because IOT is new to tech people, but routable IPS are old news. Turns out IOT is more a normie sphere thing, so people THINK they understand it. They don't, but they all have the same gross oversimplification so it doesn't matter. Routable IP is such streamlined jargon to these guys that they don't think twice about it.

Reading through this and watching videos of autists bickering about block sizes doesn't fill me with hope for the future of either BTC or BCH. This community is tearing itself apart.

I'm more sympathetic to Bitcoin's libertarian ideals but if this continues it will be eclipsed by centralized and POS coins. Normies don't care about centralization but the BCH/BTC autists are happy to spend the equivalent of New Zealand's annual electricity supply just so they can fulfill 'Satoshi's vision'.

At the end of the day what matters is cost and speed. If this can't be achieved in a decentralized way then it will have to be centralized until someone comes up with a better way of doing it

Fucking autism

So for someone that couldn't care less about the bitcoin drama, why is he so pissed about Bcash?

>>4606018
you have the foresight of a fucking goldfish don't you? what is being built right now could be the future of commerce and you want to fucking half ass it? you think bitcoin wouldn't benefit greatly poor people in other countries? ver is a literal criminal and complete fucking scum with zero tech experience, but hes your champion right? im sure he has your best interests at heart

>>4605986
corecucks are worse than linkies. resort to name calling when they have no evidence to back up any of their claims.

>>4606082
refute with verifiable and sourced evidence, ill wait. if you want to do this lets go, hope you know your shit.

>>4606081
>increasing block size would be half assing it

>>4606082
>corecucks
How is that not name calling? Also do read:
>>4605906
>>4605956

>>4606068
maybe he is allergic to bees

>>4606018
>But calling Roger scum is retarded.

its literally the only defense core has left - personal attacks on random people who hold BCH

>>4606081
Its not the future of commerce if Core is just the same old banker shit disguised as a decentralized currency. (((Blockstream))) absolutely does NOT have the poors best interests at heart, and its amazing that you seem to think they do.

>>4606018
He is literally a criminal you deluded fuck. With major crimes not some stupid shit like tax evasion.

>>4606127
ok friendo, good thing we can audit their progress and choose to not accept their updates. Core is a system of work not a defined group of people it is nebulous and ever changing id be shocked if 5 years from now even 50% of the core devs are still the same people.

>>4605906
segwit is a fucking trojan horse. It's not a scaling solution, its a future miner backdoor.

You won't be so smug when Wu and Ver switch back to mining BTC only to pay out all segwit transactions to addresses they control. Rinse and repeat until every SHA256 segwit fork is dead.

Bitcoin Unlimited was self-serving attempt to make miners hella money by cherrypicking blocks. It didn't happen because people didn't agree. But UASF got snuck in on newfag naivete, so Bcash was a last ditch fork to fucking save the blockchain from the inevitable eventual segwit disaster

>>4605947
sounds pretty accurate

>>4606148
>good thing we can audit their progress and choose to not accept their updates
I totally agree, which is why it got forked with Bitcoin Cash.

>>4606106
assuming technology will endlessly improve to meet the increased block size is short sighted and stupid. Its easy to be a brainlet with no experience in tech and shout increase the blocksize with no concept of what that could eventually lead to

holy shit "bcash" triggers them so fucking much

>>4606176
i dont disagree with why bcash was forked, or forking in general. i disagree with ver specifically, i also think blocksize increases are immensely short sighted and just people hoping to solve a solution now so they can get a price pump now, the future be damned.

>>4606154
>its a future miner backdoor.
Explain but do it yourself and don't refer to some website. I'm very curious how much about segwit you really understand.

>>4606154
>You won't be so smug when Wu and Ver switch back to mining BTC only to pay out all segwit transactions to addresses they control.
>Rinse and repeat until every SHA256 segwit fork is dead.


hmm yes this makes perfect sense!
1) invest millions of dollars into R&D sha256 asic
2) invest millions more producing and running them
3) hoard a billion dollars worth of sha256 cryptos
4) destroy every sha256 coin
5) ???
6) now you have $0

yes that is definitely Roger and Jihans plan

>>4604716
You Coretards better start using our preferred pronouns or youll be thrown in jail for a hate crime.

>>4606179
>what that could eventually lead to
what could it lead to?

>>4606132
fucking selling illegal fireworks is a major crime? just because they can categorize it as dealing in explosives . . . He's a fucking libertarian who literally did nothing wrong!

>>4606242
>>4605812
previous comment

>>4606209
>people hoping to solve a solution now so they can get a price pump now, the future be damned.

there is no reason that lightning network or whatever bullshit (((payment channels))) can't be implemented on BCH if its needed.

what is needed immediately is a short term scaling solution

>>4606209
Nothing wrong with using a temporary solution until we find a proper one. Can always scale the blocksize back when they start coming up half empty 5 years from now.

>>4606227
you know that "signature data" they remove to save space?

That's the part that makes the transactions secure.

>>4606179
>any block size larger than the current block size is unmanageable without unsustainable growth in technical capabilities

>>4606101
http://segwit.party/charts/
as for the block size thing, apparently its more complicated than I thought.
it effectively ends up being a block size increase for nodes that adopt segwit, because the segwit data is as big as the block data.

>>4604716
what a massive faggot :D

>>4606228
>4) destroy every sha256 coin except the one you've been stacking, which doesn't have segwit
5) become the biggest bitcoin whales

>>4606280
So, what happened to the signature data on Bitcoin with segwit? Explain please.

there shouldn't be any more debate. all the people who hate core should sell all their BTC, get their precious BCH, and have fun with that coin. period. good luck. I hope BCH increases in value, I really do :^).

ill leave you all with this since i have to run out the door for a meeting. im going to assume most of you see crypto as your way to "make it", im 29 own a few companies and let me tell you ill never have to worry about money for another second in my life. this isnt to brag its to give you a frame of reference for my perspective, this allows me to consider past the very immediate future and blocksize increases as well as the current state of PoW is incredibly dangerous to cryptos future. Crypto can be (or build to become) the currency of the future, it could be traded between planets in 200 years, but it will never get there if people keep clamoring for short sighted solutions. things will move far faster than they seem to be right now just have to have some patience. one last thing i can promise the only ones who will be crying if this all comes crashing down from corruption will be those who let the wolf in the fucking door.

>>4605965
Make one picture of his finger picture with Bcash repeated everywhere

>>4606259
OK, fair enough. But refer to my previous comment >>4606053

We're trying to achieve three things against current systems of payment:
- quicker
- cheaper
- decentralized (more secure)

Normies (mainstream) will tolerate centralization if it is cheaper and quicker. But they won't be willing to pay a premium for decentralization. If BTC/BCH keep getting so hung up on this issue they will forever remain in the domain of tech geeks, autists, and payments for illegal stuff.

I like the libertarian ideal of a decentralized currency as much as everyone but it's not commercially viable to expend so much electricity (cost) to do so (i.e. BCH bigger blocks) or have to wait days for transactions to go through (i.e. BTC with smaller blocks and tons of unconfirmed transactions)

>>4606311
it's externalized to the "segregated witness". Which requires trust.

>>4606360

>>4604716
>calls it bcash
>i have a billion dollars I'm self made you a part of a large social media push to manipulate the masses

kek. I never knew this guy was sensitive and autistic (not the good kind of autistic either). The memes made him out to be a hardened criminal, and I feel like he can't even argue the technical merits of bcash.. what a waste

he made me some money, but I'm glad I'm out

>>4606355
except it makes it more centralized by having larger blocks, i agree with you though proof of work electricty use is a MASSIVE problem, it seems almost insurmountable at the moment. i think its going to hang the price around 5-10k for the next year or more until we find a solution.

>>4604716
lol the dude was an asshole but ver was a little bitch. i would have told the dude to fuck off and ended the interview a lot earlier.

>>4606320
>if you like bch so much why dont you marry it lmoa
Making financial decisions based off politics or emotions is irresponsible at best. Just like how one can profit off Ripple without supporting its internal proprietary ledger, you can also profit off Bitcoin and its Blockstream counterpart.

>>4605350
Since when is McAffee unstable? He still seems confident as he always was...

>>4606360
That's so vague, I don't even understand what you mean. Where is it externalized? Who needs to trust whom?

>>4606322
yup. segwit was a "solution" we didn't need. So was 8mb blocksize, or dynamic blocksize.

THE SCALING PROBLEM IS NOT REAL (yet, and when it is actually relevant the solution will be obvious). It's manufactured. 95% of the people in any group will just follow the group, even in a group of typical outsiders. Few people really looked past the hype. That's the point of hype.

>>4606355
BRAAAAAAAP

>>4606360

>>4605350
This.

Typical attitude from scammers running out of arguments

>>4606426
He killed a person and likes scat

>>4606428
So you admit you supported a change that you have 0 idea of its function. Probably because you fell for character attacks against alternative viewpoints. That's why people call you guys coreKEKS.

PS. I don't have a side yet. I'm still analyzing. I want to be on the winning side.

>>4606419
well if you're gonna profit off of core's bitcoin, maybe don't bitch about core so much, since their work is making you so much money :^)

Core did increase the blocksize you stupids. At least they tried to. Yes, segwit adoption is disappointing but that's not cores fault. And it was late, but that was the miners fault too.

Theoretically segwit is just superior to a simple blocksize increase. It avoids a hardfork, fixes tx malleability and increases the blocksize too. What's not to like?

Core really couldn't know miners would block the update, adoption sucks and they indirectly create BCH.

It's easy to assume maliciousness but actually it all makes sense from cores POV. It was impossible to predict those roadblocks before deciding on a segwit vs. blocksize increase IMHO.

Roger Ver
>have 20-50 million
>argue with soyboy on a webchat for 45 minutes
what would you be doing?

>>4605507
wow you are seriously fucking blind mate, ver was constantly interupting and derailing, you like pro hillary sjw level cog dis

>>4605554
This is a multifaceted debate. The fact you think the answer is so simple, yet question it, is all you need to answer this yourself. Why don't you just research it?

Block increase is a short term solution to transactions cost. It centralizes the network to hardware that can handle the bigger blocks. However, being that bitcoin was invented in 2009, and hardware has progressed substantially since then, many argue a block size increase today wouldn't centralize the network any more, if any. But as another anon said, do you just keep banking on hardware improvements and bumping the block size up?

Andreas gives a solid lecture on this topic titeld "Liberty at Scale" on YouTube.

Also, if think Ver was ever winning, you're an idiot. He turned every question around into something he was prepared to answer.

>>4606450
nice demonstration of your expertise and understanding. do you suffer from normalcy bias often?

>>4605648
>I've been researching it all day
holy shit you suck at researching. Where were you researcing, /r/btc? kek faggot

>>4605554
>>4605606

This thread is made by Blockstream™ to influence your decision making, half the "people" posting in this thread are paid to shape your ideas such as this thread's theme that Roger Ver is unstable/psychotic/untrustworthy when in actuality he is one of the few trying actively to save bitcoin with Bitcoin Cash, the successor fork to bitcoin.

Bitcoin Core™ is not bitcoin. Bitcoin Cash is bitcoin.

>>4605509
not possessing that part of intelligence necessary for introspection, ie self analysis and control, is missing a big part of the equation of the mind. without this basis of self (that is non myopic) for comparison, how can one be assured their own biases do not seep into their works? genius in one sense, perhaps. but coming across as unstable and thus disrgarded. or worse, lacking the ability to guide theor works toward theor vision and being unable (due to lacking intelligence or awareness in another sense) to stop the perversion of their works? what good did their pointed, and therefore limited genius do them then?

>inb4 only do many intelligence points to allocate
yes, if you are stagnant, undriven, live in a cave or ivory tower, and believe you cannot grow, then sure.

>>4606483
I asked you in order to know how much YOU understand about segwit. But you can't explain and don't want to explain. I understand segwit but would like to know if you are just parroting things you read on bitcoin.com or if you know how segwit works and have technical reasons for claiming it is unsafe.

Now, if you may answer my question please? If you can't, I will take that as admission of defeat and will explain segwit to you, and also under which circumstances it is unsafe and why these circumstances don't apply to bitcoin.

>>4606493
>avoids a hardfork
>miners would block the update
Wow dude you just described a hard fork. Nobody gets to decide if a fork is "soft" or "hard". That is determined by the community responses.

You guys literally got FUDDED into hardforking segwit because they called it a "user activated soft fork" and called NOT doing it a hard fork. A fork is a fork is a fork.

>>4606550
yes yes, everyone who likes the original BTC is paid by the evil Jews over at blockstream.

>>4605684
>>4605684
then those next blocks are full. do you increase again?

then n blocks are full, do you increase from there? induct on n my friend


I know there's a good analogy for this situation but I've yet to find it.

>>4606564
i've never been to bitcoin.com so I don't know how to predict your assumptions of me. I didn't support UASF or BCH fork. I want the trustless financial system we started.

>>4604716
topkek, thanks for posting anon.
wew

>>4606504
But thats completely wrong. Ver barely got a word in edgewise and the entire "interview" was more akin to an ambush with personal attacks in a clear attempt to get a rise out of Ver. Did we watch the same video?

>>4606607
Stop avoiding the question: Where is the signature data in segwit? And where is the security problem? I want to learn things I don't know. Teach them to me.

>>4605895
this, we ideally want an elegant solution for smaller blocks.

>>4606588
But you can induct for BTC too. It keeps getting more and more popular until it takes 10 years for transactions to be confirmed

I'm not picking either side. Like I said, I'm in ETH and some other altcoins. I like the idea of a decentralized currency but you've got to appreciate that normies don't care about decentralization - they care about speed and cost. If BTC/BCH aren't cheaper or quicker than alternatives then they will be superceded by something that is - whether it's centralized or not

>>4606351
Now go and trigger some /b/cash faggots

>>4606564
I understand that every segwit transcation is represented in the blockchain by a single payout. I have encountered no demonstration or explanation of the security of this method. The whole point of bitcoin is to have every transaction verified by the collective hash pool.

How is that happening with segwit? The burden of proof is on changes made to a system that has already been proven to be secure. You don't get to make changes and then say "PROVE WHY THIS ISN'T THE SAME". That's true for blockstream, that's true for roger ver.

>>4606402
Yeah, PoW is the elephant in the room. If Bitcoin can't even get segwit / Lightning (a modest challenge to miners' future profits from fee income) without a lengthy hard fork battle with existential fud and ideological warfare, I can't imagine what an attempted move to proof of stake would look like

>>4605350
HOW DARE YOU CALL IT BCASH YOU DEGENERATE PEICE OF SHIT IT'S BITCOIN CASH APPOLOGISE NOW

my issue with BCH is that fundamentally while we can argue that it's a better "currency" than BTC it's sitll shit compared to etherum or litecoin or whatever so litterally what is its point?

>>4606680
topkek.
saved

>>4606645
>>4606706
Why are you asking me? Why didn't you ask UASF supporters before the fork?

>>4606209
>blocksize increases are immensely short sighted
Blocksize increases are how it was designed to work, shit head. Just progress as planned until you can find something actually better. Paying some company to use their lightning channel isn't a better solution no matter how much you autists chimp out in favour of it.

>>4606784
do you altcoiners ever learn.
You can't cash out

>>4606643
dude, ver had a fucking baby-style tantrum and is clearly unstable. and here you are defending him. something is wrong with you.

APOLOGIZE TO THE MILLIONAIRE!!

>>4606817
>ad hominems
Sup Carvalho
Ver is a retard but atleast he doesn't invite people to an interview under false pretenses and attack them

>>4605858
>>4605965
post the real one you fucking bcore cucks

>>4606706
Don't bother anymore, I'll explain it to you.

Segwit does not remove the witness data, it segregates it and puts it in compressed form to the end of the block. That's where the increased block "weight" is coming from.

This change is backwards compatible since older clients don't check this part of the block. The new clients verify all transactions including the segregated witnesses.

Now, the security risk is if the miners start spending from segwit addresses. Older clients would accept this.

Why is this not a problem? Because the new clients don't.

If miners try to spend from segwit addresses without the correct signature, the chain would split into the valid Bitcoin chain and a worthless corrupted chain. So in effect there is no risk because miners who mine invalid blocks lose money.

It's literally the same as any other hardfork. It leads to two chains. I could create a client tomorror and mine invalid blocks and spend from segwit addresses. Problem: Nobody would care and nobody would buy the stolen coins.

That's it.

>>4606793
>Why are you asking me? Why didn't you ask UASF supporters before the fork?
Bacause you are a retard who claimed that segwit is insecure. Please consider not talking about things you don't have a clue about in the future.

>>4606132
you're a literal cuckold bitch and probably supported hillary as well

kill yourself

>>4606360

>>4604716
holy fuck it's Elliot Rodger's reincarnation
100% mentally unstable psycho

>>4606924
t. increasingly nervous bcuck

PooJeets do it for free!!

>>4606937
go suck on that beecash fagget meanwhile I'm making sick ass gainz on BITCOIN.

>>4605554
They do plan to increase the block size but its not enough,if you want to scale to visa/mastercard levels its impossible to do it with a blocksize increase alone you would end up with something like a 500mb blocks.

I must admit i fell for this shit myself and wanted to know why they wouldnt increase the blocksize but i think segwit+lightning is a much better option.

Degenerate faggot kike confirmed

>>4606643
Dude re watch it and monitor talk time, I think you have a bad case of mind rape

STUPOTICA

bitcoin barely doubled in a month while BITCOINCASH has gone like 6X so there I give you the finger too

>>4606993
Yes I now understand why it's not that simple

Is it something like: bigger blocks = more computing power needed. People are worried this would make the barriers to entry too high thus causing BTC to become increasingly centralized among those who have the rigs to mine?

>>4606865

>>4606963
lmao bcuckie mad!

>>4606993
>DURRRR MINING CENTRALIZATION IS WORSE THAN GOING BACK TO A TRUST-BASED SYSTEM

bcucks are fucking retarded

>>4606861
he in no way attacked him, he just offered view points that counteract the narrative that ver is trying to push. that is not an attack its called a debate and to react like you are being attacked or think that is the is what reaction of someone who is ideologically subverted would do when their believe system is threatened by conflicting information

oh god this is golden
this man is a PR nightmare sometimes

>Jihan made Roger make a fool of himself so he could acquire more bcash
>dragonslayer confirmed

justed ver template
do with it as you please

>>4606884
Wow, we're almost having a fucking dialogue, I didn't think it was ever going to happen.

You've described what happens ideally.

What happens when the miner and the witness are the same entity?
What happens when witnesses get attacked? I don't think these forms of attack are pragmatic or economically feasible . . .YET. Remember how we just created the most powerful computer network ever? What happens when attacking side chains becomes more lucrative than mining the main chain? How will that scale?

We just took the most secure entity created and added a limitless number of extra attack vectors. Even if it ends up being secure, it was unnecessary and too soon.

>>4607123
lmao you bcucks are fucking pathetic

MC Caffee currently shilling his MC Caffee coin which is none other than ETHEREUM token
> muh bcash fast transactions and low fees
Top kek
Bcash BTFO

>>4607146
You're retarded. The bcuckie changed subject everytime he realized he had no argument. Bcucks cannot win unless they shut down all competition, that is why they try to censor Bitcoin Cash everywhere.

IM A MILLIONAIRE!!!
ahahahaha fucking hell why does he act so narcissistic when he has an image amongst a lot of people of having ambitions for being an oligarch

>>4607296
>unintelligble bcuck rattle

>>4605554
>WHY DOESN'T CORE JUST INCREASE THE BLOCK SIZE?
Because their business model relies on keeping blockspace limited and costs high.
They actually never got enough coin to get rich that way so they have to resort to these jew tactics

>>4606154
Wtf u talkin about it has no sense at all just FUD.

>>4606865
>>4606886
>>4606937
>>4607127
>>4607144
>>4607286
>>4607308
>>4607331
Somebody sure bought at the top.

>>4607373
I earned more on Bitcoin Cash than if I had kept my money in Bcuck.

>>4607308
Oh look you moved the goal posts from he was attacking to he was changing the subject coz he had no argument, he let ver have the last word on nearly every subject then wanted to move on to the next one, look how angry and offensive you are getting. By the way the symptoms of cognitive dissonance are assuming to know what others think and being triggered by it, both can be seen in this last response from you. But seriously this has been fun, I wish you peace fellow person

>>4607271
Did you take all that time to find these things on some website? Because I don't think that you actually had any clue about segwit at all when I asked you.

Educate yourself, I'm not your personal info whore. Just a small appetizer: If segwit is broken, Bitcoin is broken, Bitcoin Cash is broken, Ethereum is broken, the internet is broken. Next.

Sidechains: consider how side chains actually are actually secured by the maining process on the main chain.

I'm out.

>>4607367
nigger deteced

>>4607400
>moved the goalpost
You subhuman retard there are multiple posters on this board lmao

Nice psychobabble you fucking retarded ape, I wish you die in a fire :)

>>4607432
Oh look there he is >>4607127

Bcucks are so fucking predictable

>>4607437
Look how triggered you are

>>4605350
This. He fucking cries when talking about bitcoin.

>>4607464
U mad Bcuck?

>>4607454
Dude you resorting to ad hominans and insults constantly, its clear that your only tactic is to try and sway the opinions of newbies who have wandered here and are susceptbale to such tactics

>>4606081
>>4606101
>>4606148
>>4606179
>>4606209
>>4606322
all noobs. read these posts to understand why the updates we all want cannot be rushed out. you have to look at the big picture. buying coffee will come, it's just not important right now. big money knows this and that's why big money is getting in Bitcoin. the time is now to set you and yours up for generations

>>4607500
the comparisons of the post made you and by me are evidence enough of who is the mad one here

Why do bcashers get so mad when you call it bcash?

>>4607432
>all that time
The time it took to type it? I multitask, I'm not just sitting here being your ego plaything. I haven't once tried to get you to educate me, your arrogance has offered that up freely.

Bye!

>>4604716
lol is he because of this?
https://discord.gg/Z34m5Yr

>>4606937
Nervous about what? Bitcoin is ATH and Btrash is dipping.

The only reason that Btrash is not back again to 300 USD is because of the stupid deluded fucks that keeps buying it despite they know is a scam
>But muh coffee
>But I am a poorfag

Once we have >40% sewgit adoption and LN Btrash will go to page 8 of coinmarketcap along with Bitcoin unlimited

>>4607528
Holy shit. There is a point where you either admit that you have no idea or you stop posting. This is embarassing.

I don't think you would post like this if this board weren't anonymous.

>>4607670
I would do this in person. I'd be even more in your face actually, because I could bring body language into play. I have a highly adaptive reality-tunnel and thus have no problem playing the fool in yours.

Bottom line that you aren't realizing:
We can change the blocksize of bitcoin cash back to 1mb. We can't ever remove segwit without destroying bitcoin core. So if segwit works out and is favored, everything is fine. If bitcoin cash works out and is favored, everything is fine. Bitcoin cash won't ever go away. bitcoin segwit could.

To me, in the long run (10-50 years) that makes segwit a riskier investment. Like I said earlier, I haven't ever held BCH, and I still hold 3 BTC. But I'm cashing out.

Say what you will about Roger but he actually won this debate.

>>4606355
Secure decentralization is all that matters, it can take days for it to transfer but as long as it's decentralized it can't be shut down. The fact that they can't take down bitcoin is why the other centralized electronic currencies are even allowed to exist. Before bitcoin all attempts at electronic currencies were always taken down by state actors.

Bch has no trust that it can operate as securely, it's already failed at least once. Other coins do fast transactions and all that better. Bch a marketing scam by a guy who prematurely sold people on bitcoin as a payment system simply to raise the value and get rich quick.

>>4606322
There is no good reason not to have bigger blocks. None.

Roger Ver is a fucking hero to Bitcoin and did more to get it where it is today than almost anyone including most Core devs

you can hate Bitcoin Cash yet still accept that, otherwise you are just a worthless statist cunt

>>4605509

Narcissists are more sensitive than geniuses.

>>4607794
you think this is an investment and it's just the free market deciding.
topkek

>>4606402
>the centralization meme

This is BS. Corecoin is already centralized and what do you think LN nodes will be? Not to mention the security the miners provide which BCH incentivises while BTC runs them off.

>>4606493
Exactly, segwit adoption is dropping. If they can't get people to use segwit how will they get people to use some dumb LN shit? The only way is by running up the fees on-chain but that's more likely to just kill their coin since it's so shit compared to all else.

>>4607942
>Secure decentralization is all that matters
Only to code geeks and autists. I like the idea too but you've got to appreciate that speed and price matter far more for normie adoption. If you see BTC as some sort of hedge against government tyranny then fair enough but most people don't worry about central authorities

This is not an endorsement of BCH. I agree, there are other coins that are much better for payments

For me, this is about making money only. I'm not in it for any ideological reasons (even though I am sympathetic toward the BTC ideals)

I just see this as a nit-picking debate among clever autists and techy people while normie coins are concentrating on mainstreatm adoption and will surpass both because they focus on the only things that really matter to them: speed and cost

>>4604716
This is what happens when people get rich on bitcoin. They think they're God's gift to the world and everyone gives a fuck about them, which makes it appalling when someone doesn't do whatever they say or agree with them.

Fucking faggot bcash shill. Fuck Jihan if you want fuck.

>>4607794
>I would do this in person. I'd be even more in your face actually, because I could bring body language into play. I have a highly adaptive reality-tunnel and thus have no problem playing the fool in yours.

>>4608099
>Only to code geeks and autists.
No, it's all that matters to the price like I outlined in my comment. Centralized private currencies are illegal and states put you in jail for it, e-gold is not the only example, there are probably hundreds internationally that have been jailed for it. Eth and the other centralized currencies are illegal, they only continue to operate at the mercy of alphabet agencies.

>>4605554
Nobody uses it as a payment system either way because the block time and confirmation counts make it prohibitive if you need instant confirmation. Cashies will shout about how you can trust 0 conf but nobody actually does. It's the dumbest joke because 99% of people using Bitcoin think of it as an investment. Nobody gives a fuck about buying a coffee with it, and nobody will so long as its value is volatile and trending upward. Bitcoin isn't a payment system unless you absolutely can't use fiat and paypal for reasons we all know, and isn't going to be for years yet. Nobody considers those qualities valuable and that's why every "better than Bitcoin" fails.

>>4605695
It's an analogy to bitcoin.

>>4604716
>some cunt interviewer purposely provokes the guest to get a funny sound bite for views
how will bch ever recover!?!??!

>>4606884
Thank you for the comprehensive explanation sir
Since you sound very knowledgeable about btc protocols, could you please explain the "malleability bug" and how SegWit fix it?

>It's about the technology
>muh whitepapers

LOL!

>>4607670
>I'm out
>keeps posting

what a fag lol

>>4608450
yes, it actually is. go chase your hypey shit coins to multiply your 500 bucks while the big boys look for actual good projects to put their big daddy money in.

>>4605695

>>4607998
Probably

>>4604716
Honk Honk Honk!

He posted a sorry video!!!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8uNkcvtRtA


These are both great fun watches

>>4608553
>muh big conspiracy against BCASH

>>4605695

>>4608553
>I support Bill C-16

Roger Ver is a SJW cuck

>>4604716
>watches video
>thinks: wow, I'm smarter than a crypto millionare. I'll make it

>>4604716
Roger: Bitcoin core, bitcoin legacy, bitcoin segwit.......
Anybody else: Bcash
Roger: FUCK YOU IT'S BITCOIN CASH YOU SCUM! I HAVE MORE MONEY THAN YOU PIECE OF SHIT!

thanks for the free publicity bcore cucks

>>4608443
Too tired, please read about it here
https://bitcointechtalk.com/transaction-malleability-explained-b7e240236fc7

Jimmy Song is a Bitcoin developer and also able to explain things pretty well.

There was actually another important problem with the signature hashing which was solved by segwit. The worst case time of block verification is Theta(n2) without segwit and Theta(n) with segwit, where n is the transaction size. In short, doubling (trippling) the transaction size increased the time to verify roughly 4 times (9 times) and so on. So, segwit solved a prerequisit for larger blocks on the fly (other solutions for this problem are possible, though).

https://bitcoincore.org/en/2016/01/26/segwit-benefits/

This is not a comprehensible list, there were other problems with transactions that were addressed by segwit.

The coolest thing ever is actually that you can version segwit (v1, v2,...), and you can introduce many cool things without hardforks like Schnorr Signatures (most likely 2018).

>>4608769
>Theta(n2)
*Theta(n^2)

Why can't he at least bring us another BTC dip and pump BCH again? Been too long since there was any BTC dip, need to dump fiat again

>>4605668
Yes, you do just that. In the meantime, you work on other scaling solutions. What Core is doing is keeping the block size unnecessarily low on purpose, because it suits their personal interests.

>>4604716
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HOLY FUCKING SHIT ITS BITCOIN CASH NOT BCASH

>>4605701
Good video -- thanks.

>>4608743
>he fell for the "all publicity is good publicity" meme.

lol. Enjoy holding those bags.

>>4608798
Soon, it will inevitably happen, I'm feeling 2k within 6 days.

>>4608928
>Enjoy holding those bags

believe me, I am

>>4608942

>>4608619
Yeah mate, you caught me. :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjqGEvpUMvE

WE

>>4608994
WUZ

>>4604716
I DON'T NEED TO BE INSULTED, I WAS A SELF-MADE MILLIONAIRE

>>4609101
HOL UP
*Eats dog*
AYO AYO
*opens city wok*
WE
*Watches 10 year old be run over by tractor*
WUZ
*buys canada*
BITCOIN AND SHIEEEEETTT

>>4608942
Holy shit its so obvious. Bch is the greatest decision ive ever made

>>4604716
holy fuck, when he gets mad his voice is really gay, he sounds more of a faggot than usual

>>4607794
>But I'm cashing out.
But you can't.
You can't cash out.

>>4608897
>beecash beecash beecash
>AAAAAAARRRRRGHHHH!!!!! MOMMY, HE CALLED IT BEECASH AGAIN WHAAAAAAAA

roger fucking manchild hahahaha

>>4605598
Firecrackers you hyperbolic nigger

IT'S NOT BCASH MOMMY TELL THEM REEEEEEE

WE WILL SLAY THE DRAGON YOU WILL SE I AM A MILLIONAIRE ITS BITCOIN CASH STOP CALLING IT BCASH AAAAAAAAA

>>4605350
Also Craig Wright:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YUTq7_vO3A

>>4609791
DR. CRAIG WRIGHT FOR YOU, PLEB!

>>4605507
>>Carvalho constantly interrupting and talking over Ver

The fuck are you talking about...? Roger was the one interrupting and he was doing it the entire time.

Is Roger gay? He sounds like a 12-year-old. And how can he call himself a libertarian but then tries to control people's speech? Aren't libertarians all about non-censorship?

>>4606550

BCash support is astroturf. Fuck off.

>>4610037
There are only two cases in which you can be libertarian.
1. You are deluded enough to think that a society without laws can work.
2. You are rich as fuck and you know that in a society without laws the only law is money.

You can do anything that is considered a crime anywhere else because you have the money for your private army that protects you. You can have slaves, you can rape children, and so on.

I don't think that Roger Ver falls in category 1.

>8GB blocks

There be two types of faggots. Fags from 4chan and dick in the booty fags.

-RV

>>4610110
its true dude. when we (the public) are storing data in NAND RAM made out of diamond, the storage size will blow your fucking mind.

We're probably already there in military tech.

Bitcoin Cash is Bitcoin

Guys he polagized!

https://twitter.com/rogerkver/status/935246251544793088

>>4604716

wtf. I thought this guy was supposed to be a chad. Was the whole jaw thing just a meme?

>>4608954
you got it all wrong, you buy the huge green candles and sell when the reds are popping up...

>>4606495

riding a hoverboard

>>4606426
>Since when is McAffee unstable?

>>4605520
Yeah, I like Ver for his anti-war stance but he fucked up his reputation by supporting Bshit big time.

>>4607331

well if bobby doesnt like it IM OUT

>>4604716
both cunts.

>>4607523
STOP

>>4607396
i have a strong feeling you're a neckbeard

>>4604716
within the first 2 minutes, this fucking retard just said Bcash was getting offended by people calling it Bcash........he just personified a digital "currency". 0 logic, what a fucking downie

>>4607331
>anti LN/atomic swaps
>brother made LN/atomic swaps
??????????

«I’m a multimillionaire you have to respect me»
«It’s bitcoin cash not bcash»
«Bitcoin core»
«Bitcoin core and segwit are brainwashing you on social media via human proxys»
«Bcash is my project, my business «
You don’t need much more to understand, look at bcash twitter account fot brainwashing propaganda (reminder ver owns bitcoi
n.com domain name wtf conflict of interest ?)
Whats wrong with lightning network? It makes bitcoin more decentralized, if you run a code you can validate transaction and collect fees; speaking of fees, always wonder why it pisses of jihan to have high fees (reminder he owns most of the hashpower of bitcoin). Duno the porn dude but he seems pretty cool. Another reminder for satoshi’s zealots, the first use case he tought for bitcoin was porn, i’m glad he disappeared, decentralization doesn’t need neither «charismatic leaders» nor power hungry pathological liars (which in most cases is the same thing) that’s the whole point.

Typing from a shitpad sry for the poor layout

>>4610494
Just shows how really typical low iq normie plebs with addition of bunch of mental problems running most of thse 'alts'

>>4604716
didn't jihan get really mad about the bcash thing too? why is it so triggering to them?

>>4611310
because the value of their fork is in the name

>>4606417
I DISAGREE WITH WHAT YOU SAY AND HOW YOU SAY IT. FUCK YOU I'M RAGE QUITTING /BIZ/, THIS CONVERSATION ENDS NOW GOOD DAY YOU INTERNET HOOLIGAN.

>>4604716
I N S U L T E D

>he let the bcash term get to him
Great job Ver, you fucking sperg.

>>4605379
I want my coin developers to be maximum autism.

>>4605695
Limp dick rage

>>4611526
this
raw autism is a powerful sight to behold

wow first time I've heard his voice. fuck this cunt. you would think he would be more chilled with all the money he made(doing fuck all apart from buying coins) but this faggot wants to be the "king" of crypto cos his cash isnt enough to feed his ego

>>4604716

>>4611526

Shame Roger doesn't know jack shit about development then

>>4606550
I haven't seen delusion like this since the US presidential election

>>4611654
he wants to be king of a lot more than that

https://www.freesociety.com/

>>4604716
That is awesome, Bitcoin Cash is my favorite coin!

>>4604716
He encouraged everyone to switch to Bitcoin XT, Bitcoin Classic, Bitcoin Unlimited and then all of a sudden Bitcoin Cash came along, looked like it might have a chance at dividing the Bitcoin community, so guess what? Ver suddenly got right behind that project and chummied up with Jihan Wu (of ASICBOOST and AntBleed fame), Fake Satoshi Craig Wright (of pretending to be Satoshi - endorsed by Gavin Andresen (Satoshi himself left the project after Gavin announced his intended involvement with the CIA)), John McAfee (General madman), Calvin Ayre (Plotting the death of BTC) and anyone else with enough cash to burn to try to grab power away from Bitcoin. Then they started pumping Bcash on Korean markets on exchanges with zero fees while recommending that their followers put their money into this shitcoin.

You really couldn't make this shit up.

>>4605648

You should watch the interview, they are discussing that

>>4611924

I so badly want this shit to kill all things Bitcoin outright (slowly though to not crash the damned market), with a better alt taking its place so Ver loses everything

Oh wow I just saw the video and basically Roger Ver destroyed that other guy. He basically had zero arguments except he just wants BTC to make him money

>>4606550
truth

I'm going to start using BCASH from now one if it triggers them.

>>4611233
Well said

>>4612225
Yeah I don't mind ver now

>>4610105
>You can have slaves, you can rape children, and so on.

You know nothing about libertarianism.

>>4612225
>Oh wow I just saw the video and basically Roger Ver destroyed that other guy. He basically had zero arguments except he just wants BTC to make him money

The fuck are you talking about? Roger got exposed multiple times as a guy who doesn't even understand the technology or the history of crypto. John pointed out flat out falsehoods over and over.

>>4612490
>>4612225
Are you guys the mythical sock puppets?

passion is good for crypto unless of course you want the soul-less banking scrooges to inherit it and grind everyone else out like a machine.

call a thing what it is. you can apply name calling anywhere in society. look how divisive it is. america can be torn to shreds in an instant if for example trump decided to use a certain derogatory remark in context to a certain racial minority. words have power and meaning. if you say bcash and know that you are using it to undermine bitcoin cash, then you a perpetrating a hate crime so to speak. its touchy feely of course, but that is the nature of our society in these times. unfortunately.

>>4604716
I wonder how "stable" Satoshi Nakamoto (if that is one man) is? Would everyone make fun of Satoshi if he did this? What is Roger exposed information within the next 48 hours?

>>4605350
I don't think he can take much more. Only a matter of time until he hangs himself imo

>>4606784
Not true. Ethereum doesn't have a supply cap, and it requires orders of magnitude more investment in POW to attack Bitcoin Cash than any other coin (except Bitcoin Core).

Bitcoin Core on the other hand has proven it is impossible to get any kind of tech advancements whatsoever, whilst Bitcoin Cash has already hard forked to implement necessary scaling advances once and indicated a desire to do so in order to adopt fungibility technologies along the same lines as zcash / monero etc, meaning it has both the thickest armour in terms of proof of work and actually wants to incorporate the best of breed technologies from the most promising alts.

>>4606476
There’s literally and unironically nothing wrong with either of those things.

>>4605963

Nice Motorola.

>>4605350

>>4612559
Got exposed how? I don't think the troll guy won a single point

>>4612978

>how is he unstable?
>there's nothing wrong with that

>>4612616
fag

>>4606426
have you seen any video of him ever?

sometimes you gotta tell trolls to fuck off

>>4605554
>he still hasn't got the memo
>he still doesnt know
>hes going to lose all his neet bux

AHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHA

>>4604716
this is gold

i should have seen this earlier.
BCASH it is then

>>4611736
>yfw you realize Ver is the future libertarian Soros

ITS
NOT
BBBBBBBBBBBBCASH

REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

>>4605507
>never drops the bcash meme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mB0mG7wMvM8