/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>390651
Fuck off Venus fag. Why don't you go watch The Zeitgeist Movie for the hundredth time faggot?

>sign up to my completely unrealistic ideal world.

Sure, and Communism has never been tried before either, right?

>>390657
Zeitgeist has nothing to do with the Venus Project anymore.
Never watched them, and Jacque himself said they were wrong about how they portrayed them.
Do your research before you post.
Keeps you from looking foolish.

>>390651
Only way to transition to post scarcity is to get a universal basic income rolling

>>390661
Why is it people pushing Venus always say that same shit? "Do your research", always the same lines.

>>390661
Why would people do research on something they care nothing about? You're trying to sell me. Go.

>>390661
What? No comeback?

Anyway, people here won't be particularly receptive to the Venus project for the same reason /sci/ isn't. People here are in the trenches working through the day to day grind, not dreaming of an abstract future.

We need the process not the dream.

>>390687
He describes the process. He says don't complain about something unless you can come up with a plan to fix it. So he did. People are just to set in their ways, or to afraid of change they don't fully understand. Listen to what he is saying if it doesn't make sense than ask questions. You'll either get a correction or since he is open minded he will listen and take into consideration your arguments. Everything is based in science. Don't knock an idea unless you have scientific evidence to disprove it.

>>390687
He describes the process, and if you want a process we together as the human race has to do it. No one person can do it. He says don't complain about something unless you can come up with a plan to fix it. So he did. People are just to set in their ways, or to afraid of change they don't fully understand. Listen to what he is saying if it doesn't make sense than ask questions. You'll either get a correction or since he is open minded he will listen and take into consideration your arguments. Everything is based in science. Don't knock an idea unless you have scientific evidence to disprove it.

>>390700
>So he did
>Listen to what he is saying
>since he is open minded he will listen
Who the hell is "he"? This is starting to sound like some cult shit.

Oh, look, another of those futurology fags/dreamers. Grow up

>>390651

Jacques Fresco is a fucking sham. You fucking morons eat anything he says right up. Has it not occurred to you that he has an online store where he sells merchandise, DVD's and other bullshit? This whole thing is a fucking business venture. Some old fuck talking about a Utopia that can not and will not ever happen. They don't even have any political connections. What the fuck do they think they can accomplish? What a fucking joke. Jacques Fresco is 98 years old, he's making money and enjoying his old age. You people are fucking idiots if you think this is viable in any way shape or form. I hope the old fucker bites the dust.

>>390651
Wow, I'm really glad to see Jacque Fresco being talked about on a website like this.
I actually intended on volunteering to work with one of his groups, but classes got in the way.

>>390786
He puts that money towards the project and he isn't living any kind of dream.
He's fucking 98 years old and gives tours regularly on the land that they're building shit to demonstrate how their project can work in the real world.
If I was 98 years old, I wouldn't want to be dealing with a bunch of faggots asking me stupid questions while I walk the same tour for the millionth time, unless I was doing it for a good cause that I believed it.
If he makes as much money as you're implying, then he'd have retired from his project by now.

>>390786
So what if you read his work and learn the information but don't pay for it and learn something from it? It's either a terrible business venture or he's just trying to share information

>>390651

Take this bullshit to /pol/ OP. The only pertinent part of Zeitgeist are the central banks and financial institutions. And I'll give you a hint, /biz/ isn't against the Jews ripping you off. /biz/ IS the Jews ripping you off.

>>391558
> /biz/ IS the Jews ripping you off.

False. We're the non-jews jewing you off.

I don't understand these kind of things

I mean it's not like it's really gona happen

>architect
yeah my buildings will solve society guise they look cool and modern

>>391529
old people generally do stupid shit that has some idea behind

it's the result of experience and knowledge plus age

>>391596
Fresco has been into doing futuristic stuff since the 1960s if not earlier though. His entire life has basically been pushing for utopia.

>>390651
>Take a look at his ideas before signing.
I've already seen them plastered all over the internet. It's basically communism.

Meh.

Not following a true architectural/social futurist.

Fresco can't hold a candle to the master of Arcology, the late Paolo Soleri. Masamune Shirow used his futuristic architectural concepts in his graphic novels.

If you're going to shill for a vision of the future, use one that's worth building.

http://arcosanti.org/paolo_soleri

>>391613
but utopia isn't possible or real

everyone will ann hiro

also fuck futuristic utopias and people who have agendas with them

"The Venus Project is neither Utopian nor Orwellian, nor does it reflect the dreams of impractical idealists. Instead, it presents attainable goals requiring only the intelligent application of what we already know."

"There are no ideal cities any more than there is an ideal television set. The future requires flexibility and a capacity for change and an adaptation to newer concepts and technologies without any utopian notion of final development. I believe future generations will evolve their own social arrangements. I do not believe in any final frontiers, and the future will continue to undergo changes based upon successive phases of social development. Being civilized is an ongoing process and not attainable. The same is true for intelligence. An intelligent electrical engineer of 75 years ago could not get a job today. He would be educated in antiquated terms that evolved from earlier times."

"The Venus Project is not a Utopian concept. We do not believe in the erroneous notion of a utopian society. There is no such thing. Societies are always in a state of transition. We propose an alternative direction, which addresses the causes of many of our problems. There are no final frontiers for human and technological achievement - it will always undergo change. Even if we can design a society having all of the modifications to improve the lives of people and protect the environment we will still be at the beginning of the next phase. We are always in transition and learning new things."

LOL. In no way is this a utopia if you would have just "done your research."

And for the communism guys.

"The Venus Project is not a Utopian concept. We do not believe in the erroneous notion of a utopian society. There is no such thing. Societies are always in a state of transition. We propose an alternative direction, which addresses the causes of many of our problems. There are no final frontiers for human and technological achievement - it will always undergo change. Even if we can design a society having all of the modifications to improve the lives of people and protect the environment we will still be at the beginning of the next phase. We are always in transition and learning new things."

"Although Marx was a brilliant man for his time, he did not foresee the methods and advantages of a high-tech resource-based economy. Communism used money and labor, had social stratification, and elected officials to maintain the communists' traditions. Most importantly, Communism did not eliminate SCARCITY nor did they have a blueprint or the methods for the production of abundance. Machine production rather than labor will dominate the future. Perhaps through no fault of their own, they also had to maintain huge military expenditures to protect themselves from invasion of fascistic and capitalistic institutions."

LOL

Clip board problems (must be communism.)

*"Communism being similar to a resource-based economy or The Venus Project is an erroneous concept. Communism has money, banks, armies, police, prisons, charismatic personalities, social stratification, and is managed by appointed leaders. The Venus Project's aim is to surpass the need for the use of money. Police, prisons and the military would no longer be necessary when goods, services, healthcare, and education are available to all people. The Venus Project would replace politicians with a cybernated society in which all of the physical entities are managed and operated by computerized systems. The only region that the computers do not operate or manage is the surveillance of human beings. This would be completely unnecessary and considered socially offensive. A society that uses technology without human concern has no basis of survival. Communism has no blueprint or methodology to carry out their ideals and along with capitalism, fascism, and socialism, will ultimately go down in history as failed social experiments."

>>392058
>is to surpass the need for the use of money.

Tot's not a Utopia guyz!
>>392046

>>392123
A utopia is an imagined place or state of things in which everything is perfect. A utopia is impossible by definition. Money didn't exist until around 650 BC. The only difference between the trading system they had before money and what the venus project suggests is that back then they didn't have the means to produce the resources everyone needs. Now we do. Some places in the world still use that system they just don't have the means to give resources to everyone so they have to trade. If they had a resource based economy then they would have access to everything they needed.

>>392224
>Money didn't exist until around 650 BC.
AHHAHAHAHH
A
HAHHAHAHAHHAH
AH
HA
HAHAHHAHAHHAHAHHA


HOLY FUCKING SHIT PEOPLE ACTUALLY BELIEVE THIS

>>392058
This is some seriously retarded, economically illiterate shit.

These people are basically authoritarian retards who think they're not authoritarian.

>>392234
I guess if you consider bartering money then yes money has existed for longer than that, but small villages like those in New Guinea work just like the venus project suggests they just don't have technology. Since we do we should be able to provide for populations just as they do.

>>392238
No no no... They're not authoritarian. They're technocratic. They believe that through the magic of Technomology, something something.... happiness!

>>392238
>authoritarian
"favoring or enforcing strict obedience to authority, especially that of the government, at the expense of personal freedom."

What person freedoms would be at stake?

>>392255
>What person freedoms would be at stake?
What about people who still wanted to use money? What about people who thought this thing was a bunch of bullshit and wanted to use resources to start companies that produced shit on their own?

What would you do to them?

>>392249
>technocratic

The term technocracy was originally used to designate the application of the scientific method to solving social problems.

Its not magic is science. Its understanding whats around us and using it to its full potential.

>>392268
>The term technocracy was originally used to designate the application of the scientific method to solving social problems.

No, the term technocracy originally meant an authoritarian government that was based around technology.

>>392262

Producing your product for people would be easier. It takes all the problems with starting a business away. You invent your product and are able to distribute it to everyone much faster.

>>392272
>It takes all the problems with starting a business away.
LOL

You actually think some authoritarian system can magically take all of the risks of starting a firm away? Those risks are there for a reason, if the firm fails it's because they didn't deliver well enough for society.

>Producing your product for people would be easier.
>You invent your product and are able to distribute it to everyone much faster.
How faggot? HOW?

>>392270

the term technocracy came to mean, 'government by technical decision making', using an energy metric of value.

Has nothing to do with authoritarian government.
All your freedoms are still there.

>>392279
>'government by technical decision making'

>it's a government that completely controls your life and monopolizes most or all of the economy
>but you still have freedom

No, actually you don't. You're basically a slave.

>>392278
>How faggot? HOW?

If its a good product then you have access to what you need to make it, and give it out to everyone. Its as simple as that.

>>392285
>then you have access to what you need to make it
But I have access to what I need to make it now.
It's called capital goods and as the market produces a higher abundance of them for society their price becomes lower and lower allowing me to get more and more of them.

I don't see how your system will magically allow me to get more of these capital goods.

> Its as simple as that.
Except it's not as simple as that. Holy shit have you people not thought about this for more than 2 minutes?

>>392283
You're allowed to do whatever you want. The only thing its "monopolizing" is the resources, and I wouldn't call it monopolizing a better word would be managing. How do you like Wal-Mart managing all your food. How you live your life is up to you. Just as it is now. Except you don't have to worry about basic needs.

>>392288

I have many ideas for products that could make life easier, but i do not have the funds to research or produce them. Having to waste time collecting funds is hindering our progress as a society we shouldn't have to wait. Why do you think crowd funding is so successful.

>>392289
>You're allowed to do whatever you want.
No I'm not, not when there's a massive authoritarian government controlling the very means of my fucking survival. Not when I am not allowed to own property, or only allowed to own a limited amount of property.

>The only thing its "monopolizing" is the resources
No fucking shit. It's monopolizing virtually everything. That's fucking socialism. That's why the USSR failed.

>and I wouldn't call it monopolizing a better word would be managing.
Lol how does that make it any better? It's still monopolizing them.
How delusional are you?

>How do you like Wal-Mart managing all your food.
They do a pretty fucking good job actually, I would trust them far more than you, at least they have to face competition.

>Except you don't have to worry about basic needs.
How in the fuck would this magically happen?

>>392293
>I have many ideas for products that could make life easier,
No, you have ideas for products that YOU THINK could make life easier, not that would necessarily make life easier.

>but i do not have the funds to research or produce them
Then get a fucking job, or get a loan. Why should society have to sacrifice to test out your ideas they may or may not work? If they do work, fine, you're a billionaire, if not you fail. People do this all the time, it's called the market.

>Having to waste time collecting funds is hindering our progress as a society we shouldn't have to wait.
You are basically saying you want to steal others resources to test your ideas.

>Why do you think crowd funding is so successful.
Because that's how the free market works?

>>392297

>I am not allowed to own property

You're allowed to use until you no longer have use for it. Then you're asked to put it back so someone else can use it, but here the beauty you don't even have to do that. Because there is enough for everyone to live lavishly.

I suppose an even better word than managing would be supplying. The USSR failed because they didn't supply enough and they withheld. With this there is no with holding and supplies aplenty.

Wal-Mart doesn't do a good job because their quality doesn't reflect their wealth.

>>392314
>You're allowed to use until you no longer have use for it.
>until
There we go boy.
You just proved your system is authoritarian, congratulations

>Then you're asked
Asked? You mean forced right?
What if you decline when people ask you?

>Because there is enough for everyone to live lavishly.
LOL HOW?
Resources are scarce? How in the world would there be enough for everyone to live lavishly?

>I suppose an even better word than managing would be supplying.
It's still MONOPOLIZING.
Meaning anyone who tried to compete with you would be shot or arrested.

>The USSR failed because they didn't supply enough and they withheld.
LOLOL
They didn't withhold shit, they literally could not produce enough to meet the demands and needs of their people.

>Wal-Mart doesn't do a good job because their quality doesn't reflect their wealth.
That's just your subjective opinion. Not the facts.
Everyone else seems to like wal mart.

>>392298

I have jobs and have gotten loans,but it hasn't been enough. With the venus project I wouldn't be in the hole. If i fail I try again its called trail and error its how everything works even now. It would just be easier. There is nothing to lose or for others to sacrifice only for us all to gain.

You're making no valid points and just running in circles.

>>392319
>but it hasn't been enough
That's a shame.

>With the venus project I wouldn't be in the hole
It would be virtually impossible to supply every single retard in the world with an idea unlimited resources to test his idea. There are simply not enough resources in the world to allow this to happen.
Also the resources that exist are already being used and are required to continue to produce enough consumer goods for people to survive, if you disrupt this you would be fucking everyone over with disastrous consequences.

>If i fail I try again its called trail and error its how everything works even now.
Yes which is why you should try it with YOUR OWN RESOURCES. Not my stealing the scarce resources of everyone else in society.

If you fail you would bring everyone down with you.

>It would just be easier.
Yeah for you. Not for everyone else.

>You're making no valid points and just running in circles.
Read your posts again and tell me that with a straight face, holy fucking shit kid.

>>392318
>That's just your subjective opinion. Not the facts.

Double standards? Like yours on the venus project.

>Everyone else seems to like wal mart.

Not even people who work their like it. People just tolerate it because its convenient. You shouldn't have to settle for lower standards. Wal-Mart is monopolizing.

>>392324
>There are simply not enough resources in the world to allow this to happen.

Which resources are you talking about? Please give evidence.

>Yes which is why you should try it with YOUR OWN RESOURCES.

It shouldn't be considered my resource. It a world resource. Does common heritage mean anything to you? What makes it yours? The fact that you traded paper for it? I put just as much time into my work as you do what makes yours worth more than mine?

>>392327
>Double standards? Like yours on the venus project.
Except it's not a double standard. People go to wal mart because they like it and it benefits them. The venus project on the other hand would force everyone into it and there would be no way of telling if it benefited anyone or not.

>Not even people who work their like it.
Some of them don't. They still choose to work there.

>You shouldn't have to settle for lower standards.
What if it's the best standard but stupid people like you just like to complain?

>Wal-Mart is monopolizing.
But they are literally not a monopoly nor could they ever become one.
Why do you continue to lie?

>>392332
>Which resources are you talking about?
Capital goods? Different metals? Concrete? Wood?

What do you mean what resources?
ALL OF THEM

>It shouldn't be considered my resource. It a world resource.
But that's fucking bullshit. You said you wanted to have some resources to test your thing you think could benefit society.
It is yours, meaning you are taking it away from some place it is currently needed to produce goods for people and using it to try your idea out.
You can call these a "world resource" but that doesn't mean it belongs to everyone, at certain periods of time, humans are going to exude someone else from using it, YOU for example. If it belonged to "everyone" then people would be allowed to take your resources you are using for your project. It's impossible for anything to be owned collectively.

>What makes it yours? The fact that you traded paper for it?
The fact society respects my property rights and aren't dicks who would take my stuff.

OP I've read the thread and so far:

1. I don't know what the fuck this project is
2. I don't know why I should care
3. I don't know why I should invest my money into it

So sell me. I'm not following any links, I'm not watching any shitty youtube videos. Sell this to me right here.

>>392346
>Sell this to me right here.
Basically all of your property now belongs to us because we magically know what's best for you and what technology to create. We have all of the knowledge in the world so the technology we create with all of the resources you gave to us will magically improve your living standards because it would be run by a giant computer that loves us all.

:^)

>>392336
>People go to wal mart because they like it and it benefits them

People go to Wal-Mart because its cheap or its all they can afford.

>Some of them don't. They still choose to work there.

Most don't. When people need jobs they take whatever they can get which unfortunately most of the time is Wal-Mart. If they had a choice they would be able to pick where they wanted to work not apply. People settle for work they can get. And it still puts them in poverty.

>But they are literally not a monopoly nor could they ever become one.
Why do you continue to lie?

You're right they literally are not one, but they are as close as they can get. If they could they would. They already destroy small business for no reason. Only other large corporations can fight them and that is in no way a free market.

>>392351

that sounds suspiciously like another failed experiment

>>392355

>Most don't. When people need jobs they take whatever they can get which unfortunately most of the time is Wal-Mart. If they had a choice they would be able to pick where they wanted to work not apply. People settle for work they can get. And it still puts them in poverty.

Except people who move to new cities for work, such as is happening now in the midwestern oil boom, or the exodus of tech jobs out of California into Texas (same with film jobs into New York). Humans move to where the jobs are unless they do not have the cash to move. And in a country like the US where upwards of 90% of people have a car, mobility is not an issue. In the end, the vast majority of people putup with the bullshit from a Mcdonalds or a Walmart job because they don't want to move.

>They already destroy small business for no reason.
>no reason.

except that's wrong, there is a reason: because a large company like Walmart can provide:

1. similar goods and services at a lower price
2. maintain a consistent experience across stores, which is something customers (especially in the US) really like. If someone wants to get a can of WD40 he will go to the same aisle no matter what Walmart he is at. This is even more true for restaurant chains like McDonalds where people want a similar menu and taste no matter what city they are in.

>>392343

All of your points are invalid I'm done with you.
Just do your research, and come back when you've emptied your cup.

>>392355
>People go to Wal-Mart because its cheap or its all they can afford.
Exactly, wal mart is able to provide goods to people for cheap. They're clearly doing the best at this.

>When people need jobs they take whatever they can get which unfortunately most of the time is Wal-Mart. If they had a choice they would be able to pick where they wanted to work not apply.
Of course, if people could get a trillion dollars they would take that too. The fact remains that they cannot get a trillion dollars, they can not get better jobs right now because their labour is not productive enough to work in a higher paying job. They work at wal mart because society needs people to work at wal mart to provide low prices to people.

> but they are as close as they can get.
So a company is successful and they get a greater market share due to your success and you think this is a bad thing? Why?

>They already destroy small business for no reason.
Wow, you mean companies that charge HIGH prices and don't serve society as well as wal mart FAIL and are forced to sell their resources so they can be used by firms who actually ARE productive for society?
Fucking duh.

>>392365
>All of your points are invalid I'm done with you.
HAHAHAHHAHAHA

Dude you can't just give up and leave so quickly?

I know me proving your bullshit theory wrong upsets you, but don't leave. This is too fun.

>DO YOUR RESEARCH
>DO YOUR RESEARCH!
>DO YOUR RESEARCH

LOL HOLY SHIT

THERE IT IS AGAIN

>>392364

I see where you're coming from. And you do have valid points. But imagine a world, where you wouldn't have to move for jobs, youwouldnt have to have them. Where we keep the earth running at its potential for every human on earth. Your "job" would be your hobby, and by doing it you'd advance the whole human race. There would be no money, no price tags, and no withholding, only an abundance of anything you could want. Take away the grunt work, and replace the laboring people with some sort of robot. Unpaid, and works continuously. Where we govern how we act by the best interests of human kind and the planet we call home. Housing structures that are self reliant and in abundance for anyone who could need a home. You wouldn't own anything, but borrow and use until you don't need to anymore. Of course you could in essence "own" anything, but you could just return it whenever you don't need it.
It's in no way a perfect world, or some sort of heeby jeeby magic thing, just a world running for the betterment of our race and fairness for all.

>>392365

>Just do your research

and why the fuck are you here? OP you're supposed to tell us what the fuck it is we're supposed to care about

Car ads are not "we're so great, do your research!" it's "we're the most dependable car company according to X, we have over X years of making high quality cars that come with X features at X price with X bonuses"

the whole goal of advertising is to tell people ABOUT a product, to generate interest. Specific details, so people can imagine in their mind's eye what it is. So far you have told us nothing aside from random hippie bullshit and buzzwords which is the telltale sign of a shitty marketer.

>>392374

>I see where you're coming from. And you do have valid points. But imagine a world, where you wouldn't have to move for jobs, youwouldnt have to have them. Where we keep the earth running at its potential for every human on earth. Your "job" would be your hobby, and by doing it you'd advance the whole human race. There would be no money, no price tags, and no withholding, only an abundance of anything you could want. Take away the grunt work, and replace the laboring people with some sort of robot. Unpaid, and works continuously. Where we govern how we act by the best interests of human kind and the planet we call home. Housing structures that are self reliant and in abundance for anyone who could need a home. You wouldn't own anything, but borrow and use until you don't need to anymore. Of course you could in essence "own" anything, but you could just return it whenever you don't need it.

this perfectly demonstrates the point I made here >>392375

>Specific details, so people can imagine in their mind's eye what it is. So far you have told us nothing aside from random hippie bullshit and buzzwords which is the telltale sign of a shitty marketer.

You have told me nothing about this project, I do not know what it is. For all I am aware, you could be describing sex slavery in Bangkok. Your entire argument is "imagine a world where X". At the very least, you need to follow that up by saying "and X product creates this by A, B and C"

>>392364
In a sense we cut out everything we don't need to do. We, as a race, could be so much more than we are, replacing old energies (Like fossil fuels) with Solar, Geothermal or any number of easy to obtain alternatives.

We aren't trying to pry money, just a signature on a partition to get the word around, spread the alternative to the rather distasteful state the world is in now.

More than anything it's a way for us to progress further and without bounds. making it a place where we could grow exponentially.

>>392379

you still have not told me HOW you are going to do

>>392379

you still have not told me HOW you are going to do this

HOW do you plan on bringing about this future you want?

Tell me, specifically, what are the core fundamentals of the project. How does it's director plan on turning his ideas into reality.

>>392375
>Car ads are not "we're so great, do your research!"

You can't depend on others t find the answer, lies are told all the time, I'm assuring that you get the truth through all the various answers given so far.

I believe in proof, and word of tongue/being told isn't hard proof, only words being spat.

You might say you're best at X, X, and X, but until I see proof, or research it, I won't believe a word.

>>392383

>You can't depend on others t find the answer

no, but I can depend on others to tell me why I should give a shit and why I should do research at all

right now, you're not generating that spark. You're just saying that "trust me, this project is great! Look at how great it's goals are!" without telling me WHAT the specifics of the project is

and that's what I want, specifics

HOW do you plan to bring about the vision you're trying to sell me?

>>392383
To test its designs and proposals, The Venus Project is working towards putting its ideals into practice by the construction of an experimental research city. Blueprints for most of the initial technologies and buildings have begun. Fund-raising efforts are currently under way to help support the construction of this first experimental city. This new experimental research city would be devoted to working towards the aims and goals of The Venus Project, which are:

Realizing the declaration of the world's resources as being the common heritage of all people.
Transcending the artificial boundaries that currently and arbitrarily separate people.
Replacing money-based nationalistic economies with a resource-based world economy.
Assisting in stabilizing the world’s population through education and voluntary birth control.
Reclaiming and restoring the natural environment to the best of our ability.
Redesigning cities, transportation systems, agricultural industries, and industrial plants so that they are energy efficient, clean, and able to conveniently serve the needs of all people.

>>392375
Hey you,

you,

Do your research.

>>392382
-cont
Gradually outgrowing corporate entities and governments, (local, national, or supra-national) as means of social management.
Sharing and applying new technologies for the benefit of all nations.
Developing and using clean renewable energy sources.
Manufacturing the highest quality products for the benefit of the world’s people.
Requiring environmental impact studies prior to construction of any mega projects.
Encouraging the widest range of creativity and incentive toward constructive endeavour.
Outgrowing nationalism, bigotry, and prejudice through education.
Eliminating elitism, technical or otherwise.
Arriving at methodologies by careful research rather than random opinions.
Enhancing communication in schools so that our language is relevant to the physical conditions of the world.
Providing not only the necessities of life, but also offering challenges that stimulate the mind while emphasizing individuality rather than uniformity.
Finally, preparing people intellectually and emotionally for the changes and challenges that lie ahead

>>392376
>You have told me nothing about this project, I do not know what it is. For all I am aware, you could be describing sex slavery in Bangkok. Your entire argument is "imagine a world where X". At the very least, you need to follow that up by saying "and X product creates this by A, B and C"

There is no venus project, it's just a bunch of meaningless bullshit with no real plan.

It's basically communism.

>>392387
-cont
Within the experimental city, a theme park is also planned that will both entertain and inform visitors about the possibilities for humane and environmentally friendly life-styles planned by The Venus Project. It will feature intelligent houses; high-efficiency, non polluting transportation systems; advanced computer technology; and a number of other innovations that can add value to the lives of all people - in a very short period of time.

A circular city would be a transitional phase and could evolve from a semi-cooperative money-oriented society to a resource based economy. This could be the prototype for a series of cities to be constructed in various places throughout the world. The rate of progress will depend on the availability of funds raised during the early stages and the people who identify with , participate in, and support the aims and direction of The Venus Project.

As these new communities develop and become more widely accepted, they may very well form the basis of a new civilization, preferably through the process of evolution rather than revolution.

>>392390
>>392394
lol notice every single one of these are extremely vague and uses countless meaningless buzzwords

This shit just gets more hilarious by the post.

>>392387
-cont
No one can actually predict the future. We can only extrapolate on present information and trends. Population growth, technological change, worldwide environmental conditions, and available resources are the primary criteria for future projections.

There is no single philosophy or point of view whether religious, political, scientific, or ideological, that someone would not take issue with. We feel certain, however, that the only aspects of The Venus Project that may appear threatening are those which others project onto it.

The Venus Project is neither Utopian nor Orwellian, nor does it reflect the dreams of impractical idealists. Instead, it presents attainable goals requiring only the intelligent application of what we already know. The only limitations are those which we impose upon ourselves.

But if you want to know more, either sign the petition to watch it on the History channel/Discovery channel. Or head over to the main website and check out the facts.
Or if you feel extra curious, go to Venus, Florida and ask Jacque for yourself. He loves answering questions.
In fact, he would rather you question him at every turn.

>>392393

ok then

I checked the website in the OP and here is what I have been able to extrapolate about your project:

1. complete abolition of currency
2. some sort of great "enlightenment" that will change politics and culture making things like "war" and "poverty" "impossible"
3.

>Human behavior is subject to the same laws as any other natural phenomenon. Our customs, behaviors, and values are byproducts of our culture. No one is born with greed, prejudice, bigotry, patriotism and hatred; these are all learned behavior patterns. If the environment is unaltered, similar behavior will reoccur.

these are myths created by Psychologist BF Skinner

so after doing my "research" on your site I'm left with more questions, namely:

1. how do you expect to run a modern, industrial society without a currency?
2. how do you expect to bring about "enlightenment" when even the most passive Americans can't agree on abortions?
3. how do you override human nature?

so far I'm guessing that "doing your research" means buying the books listed on the site, which tells me that you're a spammer

>>392397

the website is even funnier, it reeks of new age cultism

I'm 100% convinced now that this is spam

>>392399
>>392396
>>392394
>>392390
>>392058
>>392056
>>392046

I love that all this faggot can do is copy and paste the incomprehensible nonsense from the venus project website. He can't actually explain this shit on his own.

This retard came to a fucking economics board with an ideology riddled with countless economic fallacies and outright stupidity and actually expects to convince us of anything.

TOP LEL

>>392401
>No one is born with greed, prejudice, bigotry, patriotism and hatred; these are all learned behavior patterns.

How the fuck do people actually believe in the blank slate theory.

Science debunked this ages ago and the evidence keeps piling up.

>>392401
>1. how do you expect to run a modern, industrial society without a currency?
2. how do you expect to bring about "enlightenment" when even the most passive Americans can't agree on abortions?
3. how do you override human nature?

There is no such thing as human nature in the conventional sense of being a set of predetermined, preprogrammed behaviors and values to which all human beings are predisposed. What we are concerned with is human behavior and values, which can certainly be changed. If they could not, we would still be living in caves.
The question we should be concerned with is, "What are the factors that shape human behavior?" We feel that human behavior is just as lawful as any natural phenomenon. Our customs, behaviors, and values are by-products of our culture. If the environment is unaltered, similar problems and behaviors will reoccur. The Venus Project proposes to provide an environment that will bring out the best in human behavior and to extend maximum courtesy to all nations.
Take, for example, the situation witnessed after W.W. II: even the most respectable families could be seen fighting over scraps of food. When people's basic needs are not met, they resort to whatever behavior is necessary to ensure the necessities of life for themselves and their families. By making the necessities of life available to all in this participatory democracy and through a meaningful and productive education, we can dramatically reduce counterproductive behavior.

>>392379
>We, as a race, could be so much more than we are, replacing old energies (Like fossil fuels) with Solar, Geothermal or any number of easy to obtain alternatives.
Have you made the switch to these power sources, or do you still purchase electricity produced from diesel through an electricity company?

What power source you use has nothing to do with what you "are".

Except for those who choose more expensive and inefficient power sources that have no cost-benefit even over time, in which case they are morons.
If you buy solar because you want to feel "clean" and "superior", you're an imbecile.
If you buy solar because the cost upfront for a lifetime of power is the cost of 10 years of power from a local utility company, and you intend to stay where you are for 20 years or more, you are a rational actor.

>>392405
>There is no such thing as human nature in the conventional sense of being a set of predetermined, preprogrammed behaviors and values to which all human beings are predisposed
This is literally untrue and science has proven this dead wrong countless times. This is called the blank slate fallacy and flies in the face of all sociobiology/neuroscience and evolution.

Instincts ARE hard wired into the brain.

The evidence is so overwhelming you cannot deny this.

>The question we should be concerned with is, "What are the factors that shape human behavior?" We feel that human behavior is just as lawful as any natural phenomenon. Our customs, behaviors, and values are by-products of our culture. If the environment is unaltered, similar problems and behaviors will reoccur. The Venus Project proposes to provide an environment that will bring out the best in human behavior and to extend maximum courtesy to all nations.
This is word for word marxism, seriously. It's what marxists actually believe. Change the wording around and you have dialectical materialism.

>>392405

>There is no such thing as human nature in the conventional sense of being a set of predetermined, preprogrammed behaviors and values to which all human beings are predisposed.

Yes there is, humans are inherently concerned with the preservation of their own selves and their clan. This is so that they can create a stable social environment where they can preform their main biological function to reproduce.

>W.W. II

who the fuck even abbreviates WW2 like that?

>even the most respectable families could be seen fighting over scraps of food. When people's basic needs are not met, they resort to whatever behavior is necessary to ensure the necessities of life for themselves and their families.

this contradicts your very first point that there are no "predetermined, preprogrammed behaviors and values" in humans

>By making the necessities of life available to all in this participatory democracy and through a meaningful and productive education

this is literally the modern day USA

>we can dramatically reduce counterproductive behavior

what do you mean by "counterproductive"? Because things like war and poverty are very productive. The World Wars gave us computers, jet aircraft and satellites, and poverty in France and Britain brought Democracy to Europe because the mob wanted a say in politics.

this is starting to sound more and more like a sermon and less like a viable economic theory

>>392390
>Realizing the declaration of the world's resources as being the common heritage of all people.
Wrong. Other people's resources are not your resources. Take your malevolent anti-human philosophy elsewhere.

>Replacing money-based nationalistic economies with a resource-based world economy.
But that's ridiculous because a barter economy is an undeveloped economy. In any sufficiently developed network of individuals where there is exchange, there will be a common medium of exchange as to avoid the harsh barrier of trade that is the coincidence of wants.

These mediums of exchange, i.e., money, do not exist because of States; States have confiscated money for their own purposes. Money is a naturally arising human phenomena, State or no State, that has existed in various forms from wheat, which prevents the accumulation of capital, to precious metals, to the reserves and credit of banking institutions and their own private issuance of banknotes, to modern cryptocurrency initiatives.

To this day, The Venus Project refuses to accept donations in any form except State banknotes. If you attempt to donate 20 bags of concrete to their cause, they will refuse.

>Reclaiming and restoring the natural environment to the best of our ability.
Why don't we just roll back the entirety of the human war on "mother nature", and enjoy the natural, pristine, untouched-by-human-hands states of chronic starvation, rampant disease, and brutish lifespans?

DDDOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO


YOOOUUUURRRRRR
REEEEEESEEAAAARRCCCHH!!!!!

>>392406
>If you buy solar because you want to feel "clean" and "superior", you're an imbecile.

I would want it because it's endless and clean energy.
"In 2009, the total global electricity consumption was 20,279,640 GWh. The sun creates more energy than that in one hour. The tricky part is collecting that energy and converting it into useful electricity with solar panels. How much area would need to be covered with solar panels in order to capture enough energy to meet global demand? Actually, it’s not as much as you’d think.
Read more at http://www.iflscience.com/environment/how-much-room-do-we-need-supply-entire-world-solar-electricity#DpA4Bz2vv8eboRif.99"

>If you buy solar because the cost upfront for a lifetime of power is the cost of 10 years of power from a local utility company, and you intend to stay where you are for 20 years or more, you are a rational actor.

Don't power an individual, power the world. Powering a person is useless and outdated. It would be thousand of times aper just to power everything.

However I would like Geothermal to be more widely used and researched, It was what Tesla was researching. And seems to be a good option.

>>392414
It's literally impossible to power the entire world using solar power.

If it was solar would be incredibly cheap.

But it's not.