/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>29516011
jews

Jews

Juden

long nose tribe

The Jews needed to invent another way to steal from the goyim

>>29516011

>its like every bet.

you bet on the value/time.

Judaism

>>29516317
>>29516307
>>29516291
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>>29516092
>>29516060
>>29516050
you WILL eat the bugs and you WILL be happy

JEWS

>>29516011
To give a non jew blame answer, short selling gives incentive for investors to search for negative aspects of a company like fraud, exposing that to the market and bringing stocks to their fair price range

>>29516011
Because freedom to buy and sell as you please is important.

>>29516011
Explain to me how are you going to ban it. By making what exactly? Borrowing things?

>>29516011
Jews is the right answer. Other answer is it has it's place to improve efficiency and speed.

without shorting u will have weimar republic and the rise of hitler

>>29516011
how else am I supposed to make money when the price is going down?

>>29516011
what's the difference between shorting and margin trading?

why shouldn't it be allowed to borrow a stock?
why shouldn't it be allowed to sell a stock that you borrowed?

>>29517020
>>29516638
>>29516489
>>29516317
>>29516291
>>29516145
>>29516092
>>29516060
back to pol newniggers we don't like your kind around here

Because White Anglo Saxon Protestants(WASPS) wanted another financial instrument that sounds complex and allows them to bet against struggling companies...

>>29516011
There is absolutely nothing wrong with shorting.

>>29516050
fpbasedp

>>29517504
If thats all it was that would be fine but we aren't dealing with tangible assets. The GME fiasco showed everyone that the stocks they are "borrowing" dont actually exist. So they are free to "borrow" and sell more stocks then actually exist. This makes short selling a destructive tool for market manipulation for anyone with enough capitol or leverage. Short selling made sense in the 20s when stocks where physical peices of paper. Now a days liquidity isn't a real issue and if it is one the answer certainly isnt this.

>>29516011
Because short sellers are the thot patrollers of the stock market. If a company's stock is inflated short sellers correct. Both in the macro investing sense and in the minute to minute trading sense.

>>29518980


>>29518980
Forgot animie milkers so you degens actually read my answer.

>>29517608
>back to pol
>newniggers
>we
>your kind

>>29517131
make a bet that the price is going down by borrowing shares selling them immediately and buying them back again when the price is low

>>29518980
Short selling doesn't need securities fraud.
You don't prevent securities fraud by criminalizing short selling.

What a terrible argument you made.

>>29517608
Hi, kike. Go shill elsewhere. Don't bother with /tv/, they're as aware of your kind as /biz/.

>>29519372
What if I want to use a derivative for leverage?
Say, I think it's going to go down a lot, but I want to spend very little and borrow nothing?
Why is buying a put bad?

>>29519020
It incentivises corporate sabotage.

>>29519020
That is the most kike answer ever. Theres no such thing as an over valued or inflated price. Price is arbitrary and subjective. The correct price of somthing is exactly what someone is willing to pay for it. Stop trying to disgues market manipulation as some kind of service as if hedgefunds short stocks because of the goodness of their hearts.

>>29517504
>>29517020
>>29517081

Why do you need shorting? Can't the price be adjusted via simple selling? If the price of a company is inflated, then said people can sell. Why do you need shortselling to do this?

>>29519438
What is your argument then that isnt some hokey bullshit avout them providing liquidity or market correction from the goodness of their heart. You bet on a stock going down by not fucking buying it. Then when it goes down you buy it. Thats your bet. If you thought it was going to go up immediately you would have bought then. But you like riding the coattails of the panic brought when a hedgefund decides to cause a 20 percent drop in a day on a whim selling imaginary shares so they can buy the "real" ones at the bottom. Its littlerally jew witchcraft and you know it. Every other market functions perfectly fine without bejng able to sell shit that doesnt even exist.

>>29519937
You don't anyone telling you otherwise is a kike.

BECAUSE IF BOB DOESNT WANT TO SELL HIS *SOMETHING* IM GOING TO BORROW IT FROM BOB AND SELL INSTEAD OF HIM BECAUSE I KNOW IT GONNA DROP IN PRICE AND THEN BUY IT BACK LOWER WHILE SCIMMING THE PROFIT AND THEN RETURNING BOB *SOMETHING*

>>29519644
>There's* no such thing as an under valued or deflated price
>The correct price of something* is exactly what someone is willing to sell it for
Both these and your statements are equal in weight.

Short selling is entirely normal and ethical market activity. If you think a company is doing a bad job and is worth less than what it's selling for, you should absolutely be able to sell it now and buy it later. You should absolutely be able to buy a put contract and exercise it on the fool who sold it.

You don't know how markets work if you don't think corrections are real, or that the short position is equal in ethical weight to the long position.

Bad companies (like those hedge funds you hate so much) exist. Don't you think you should be able to short them? Maybe not while we're having this argument and it bothers your dissonance, but outside of that and your childish anger, you're probably more than happy to short them. Or any kiked out company producing trash like Activision Blizzard.

The truth is you're looking for any excuse to say your poor choices aren't your own fault, and you're blaming short positions instead of actual market manipulation.

Grow up you good little goy and maybe go after failed to deliver shares and exchange-imposed position limits/closures. instead of naked options and short positions. You know, actual market manipulation.

Or stay a manchild I'll happily keep taking your money.

>>29520374
Imagine how long your nose must be to think it's ethical to sell things you don't even own lmao

>>29518422
>said no one ever

The concept of profiting off someone’s downfall is pretty fucked up when you think about it

>>29519937
What if you don't own a company but believe it's overvalued?
What if the long position is only willing to sell when it goes up and refuses to let it go down?

They can easily manipulate the market on the exact opposite end of what the hedge funds did and simply refuse to sell below a certain price. But if the security simply isn't worth what it's selling for, and you have a short position, them being able to win by buying a put and selling shares the exchange offers, with nobody willing to buy causes the price to move until the market discovers someone willing to sell, which causes a downward trend, the exact opposite causes an upward trend. You need all, not just one.

In a world with derivatives, high technology and many transactions you need these choices. Otherwise you have the exact same thing but in reverse.

It goes both ways anon, the short position allows the security to actually be worth something real, instead of just "what someone will buy it for" ad infinitum

it's an important market signal that a company is shit and should get its act together.

>>29520495
imagine having such a shit imagination.

btw thanks for your gme gains, those 450 puts were fucking phenominal.

>the same board that laughs at huge portfolio dumps suddenly has a problem with people making money off of other's failure
I dun geddit

>>29516011
Correcting market inefficiencies

>>29520622
he makes an interesting point though
minorities all think that it's rich white people messing their lives up, when it's actually rich """""white""""" people (Jews)

>>29519446
That’s why they’re obsessed with mindless Jew media right?

>>29516011
East india company
fucking cunts

>>29520862
I've been all in cash since last week and I've dumped some fantastic bags on the normans, try harder, Jew

>>29520374
Pulput at its finest.
Option contracts don't actually change the supply and demand of the market you sneaky fuck. They are outside entities that can go up or down in value and then can be exicuted if they are profitable. No one has an issue with put contracts because they actually exist outside of the main system. (Yes im aware that there is a market for the contracts that influences the price of the stock) when you naked short a stock you are directly depressing the price by selling shares that dont exist. Fuck off. In the future of crypto exchanges short selling will be regulated so that whoever is the arbitor of the exchange actually has to own the shares you are shorting. Otherwise they will inevitably fail without uncle sam to bail them out.

>>29516011
You want a real answer or muh /pol/?
Price discovery.

>>29519963
jesus christ your posts are poorly formatted.

>You bet on a stock going down by not fucking buying it. Then when it goes down you buy it. Thats your bet.

Yeah with your kiked out permission mr shekelberg. If I think your trash-ass company is going down I'm more than happy to buy a put and make you buy your trash shares at that bullshit price you said they were last week. I don't give a fuck what you tell me is "my right" to short your trash company. If it was "worth" that much and then it goes down and I think it's going down lower I sure as fuck am not going to buy it lmao, I'm going to make money on it going down ONLY. That's the point of a short position - that it's not worth as much as people are buying and selling it for and that over time the market will show that.

>some nonsense about long positions intermixing the two concepts
don't care, but it's still wrong, if I think it's about to go up immediately I'm buying a covered call, not the stock.
>But you like riding the coattails of the panic
Are you high on something that makes you seem charismatic to yourself? This is fucking cringey. And no, I'm not emotional about this like you, I'm capitalizing on an overvalued stock correcting downward like it objectively should.
>Its literally* kike* witchcraft and you know it
No, KIKE, it's literally the opposite position of the long position. I think stock go down, I sell stock. The part where shares fail to deliver is the securities fraud, the shares that didn't exist. What you're selling is shares that do exist that the exchange sets as "owned" by one party and "sold" by another. If that person wants to sell their "owned" share, then I have to buy it back. That's part of how puts work in options, and how shorting even exists. Saying shorts are KIKE (say it with me scholomo, K I K E) bullshit is like saying crypto transactions or smart contracts or Dapps are KIKE nonsense. You simply don't know what you're talking about.

>>29519937
>If the price of a company is inflated, then said people can sell. Why do you need shortselling to do this?
because they don't own the stock, so in order to sell it they have to borrow it first from someone else.

>>29520758
>What if you dont own the company but think its overvalued.
Dont buy it or sell call contracts. Or buy put contracts.
>What if the long position isn't willing to sell?
What the fuck is the issue there its his property to sell as he pleases. If every owner of a stock decides to never sell untill a certain price thats littlerally fine. Either somone will pay that price or nothing happens. You people act like stocks have to accurate reflections of all of a companies assets. They dont they are a reflection of one thjng and one thing only and thats how much somone is willing to pay/ sell them for nothing more and nothing less.

>>29521478
Pilpul, you kike freak, say it right.

Oh god the "only long position" expert is going to lecture me on options.

Puts are an option contract you fucking idiot, just like calls.

You'd be found legally incompetent if a court heard this is the knowledge you trade on. You'd make a great SSI recipient, you retard.

>>29522056
I never said anything about put contracts being bad. Option contracts are seperate entities outside of the market for the stock. Its just an agreement between you and somone else to buy or sell a stock by a date at a certain price. You know damn well the difference between that and a naked short.

>>29522049
Jesus you emotional cunt.
The problem with fraudulent inflation by an exchange refusing to allow sell transactions (or by long positions not allowing a short position to exist) is that there is no counterbalance. You need an equal deflationary force. If the actual value of a security is 20% of what it's selling for, and there is no short position, that 80% still does not exist.

You have no fucking clue what you're talking about, and you can't spell. What a first second and third person embarrassment you are, freaks like you are what caused the 20's to happen, I can't wait to make you poor.

>>29519446
>>29519335
can't wait for bobo to leave you both gaping
polnpcs are honestly worse than r*dditfaggots
just go back to your dogshit burger board

>>29521849
that you're writing such long and irate posts tells us everything you need to know: you're a Jew
if you're explaining, you're losing

>>29522056
Im not against making a bet against a stock which is what a put contract is. Im against be allowed to littlerally sell more imaginary shares then actually exist. If brokerages had to actually own all the shares they "lend" you to short everything would be fine because there would be actual checks and balances. Put contracts are littlerally just contracts. They have no impact on a stocks price directly.

>>29522228
The only difference is that you have to buy back a naked short, fool. That's not market manipulation.

Selling shares that don't exist period is, and it's true that happened with GME and AMC. Forcing people to only close positions in exchanges is also market manipulation. How about you go fight them instead of the bobos because you're sad number go down, retard.

Seriously, you're too stupid to trade effectively, don't stop trading I'd love to take more of your money.

>>29522318
>polnpcs
>dogshit burger board
You were never one of "us," and the only reason you bash reddit is because you think it helps you lie about living on there exclusively until the election.
Go be a good little goy somewhere else, I have niggerfaggots to correct on basic market forces.

>>29522252
Yes it does the correct price of a stock is whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Like littlerally every other asset in existence. On in magic jew stock land can you sell somthing that doesnt exist to correct the price. Its an insane idea that only made sense when stocks where paper and liquidity was a real issue.

>>29522405
Ah yes x isnt wrong because y is more wrong. Thanks for proving why the stock market wont exist in 10 years you manipulative fuck. Have fun bro.

>>29516011
because its a somewhat free market and you are free to enter any contract someone else offers

>>29516011
because sometimes an employee or executive will fuckup big time, or their product/service sucks balls

>>29522651
no, x isn't wrong, and y is wrong; x is not, was not, and never will be wrong.
Here let me help you:
>>>/pol/sticky
go read the strawman section and learn how to argue without disingenuous statements... assuming you actually understood what I was saying and aren't pretending to be (more) retarded.

You aren't arguing what people will pay for it you're arguing what people will sell it for when you take the long position.
Short positions exist to cause price deflationary discovery, or, in combination with long positions, to peg the price of a stock to the real world value of the underlying company.

Selling borrowed shares that exist isn't fraud. It's taking a loan out in shares (or it's equivalent fiat value). That's not "making stocks up that don't exist."

Tt's not insane, just over your head now because you can't think past a barely literate person from the 1800s.

Keep trading please.

cause shorting actually makes the price go up. all shorts must close as a buy order eventually. people trying to short and getting stopped out is what drives the price up faster

>>29516011
Jews

Nothing wrong with shorting anon. It's literally just
>ask friend to lend you his book
>"alright anon but you'll pay me $10 per month for it"
>sell the book for $80
>buy the same book like brand new on ebay for $60
>give back the book to your friend
>both of you made $10
You're technically shorting every time you borrow or rent something. You might not literally cash out from it, but your cash is worth more to you than just buying whatever you borrow or rent, and you think you won't hold as much value in whatever you borrow a while later.

Now shorting things that do not exist is indeed retarded and needs to be illegal.

>>29516011
i believe company A is doing the right thing. I believe company B is doing the wrong thing. I short company B and invest it back into company A. shorting can be good and bad.

>>29523286
Im just letting you know that all you have done is convince everyone the stock market is a jew scam i hope you hold all you USD monopoly money until its useless.

>>29516011
jews

>>29523432
And what happens if you shorted a company like Enron?
When you pay back 1000 shares of enron for $0, how much did that make the price move?
The only time shorts cause a price to rise is when the stock was undervalued.

>>29516011
So you can hedge your long positions. When it’s used speculatively that’s the issue

>>29516011
JUDEN

>>29516489
BIG DOG BIG BEAR

>>29522651
like I domt understand
are you all joos pol spammer unironically advocating for the removal of shorting? are you retarded?

>>29523665
Keep hoping faggot, my link and btc position are doing great from the 10's.
My GME puts are doing real good too, I wonder if I should exercise them now or later? I think I'll go make someone kill themselves cause you said that, for fun.

>>29523764
Yes or regulate it.

>>29522252
Let's assume you own a house outright and it's worth 500k.

My buddies and I decide we want property in that area and dont want to pay 500k for a house.

So we group up and short sell your house even though we dont own it and repeat until the perceived value is well below 500k. Then start buying up land and moving our people in.

Does that seem okay to you? Now apply that we logic to any other form of property.

*Yes, I know I can't short sell a house, just an example.

It's a basic function of borrowing something and having the ability to do what you want with what you borrowed.

It provides great incentive for people to, without any taxpayer-funded incentive, highlight and expose fraud, over-valued investments etc. saving lots of people wasted investment money if they care to listen.

There's a lot of fuckery that can happen with shorting, but it's not inherent nor exclusive to shorting.

>>29516011
Non troll answer:
It used to be a method to hedge against volatility. You promised to buy a commodity back at a certain price at a certain date.

>>29517608
>my fellow whites

>>29516756
no
>>29525965
yes

>>29521849
>jesus christ your posts are poorly formatted.
>complains about typos in another post
I accept your admission of defeat.
But go ahead and commence the pilpul

> why are people allowed to call out bad companies
Dunno, every company is good and tells the truth and deserves to be successful.

Kikels.

>>29525825
*apply that same logic

>>29526293
I would agree with this if jews didn't have almost 100% control over what people think is "bad" or not

>>29516050
>>29516060
>>29516092
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>>29516291
>>29516317
>>29516638
>>29517020
>>29523542
>>29523672
>>29523750
>>29526361

>>29516011
Normal shorting is allowed. If you only short what their is in supply you wont affect price much. Its when they do "naked short selling" that it becomes a horrible practice that ruins companies. Heres a video from 2007 on the subject.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0WXg5T3cBE

Shorting is not allowed in China stock market.

>>29516011
You must be 18 to post here

>>29527426
Thats littlerally all the proof i need. Chinks are the only non jewed place on Earth surprisingly.

>>29528281
Yes, but aren't they almost worse?

>>29516951
selling stuff you don't actually own?