/biz/ - Business & Finance

>>29225239
My ledger just broke after 2 years of solid use. I am going to try out the trezor now.

For the premium version trezor, since typing the pin and seed in the device is more secure. For the cheap one ledger.
Ledger has support for more coins like solana and filecoin.

Doesn't really matter.
Use a passphrase

Depends what coins you want to hold.
Like I have to have Ledger so I can use it for signing transactions for ATOM, Treznor doesn't have that feature.
Just get the Ledger delivered to a PO box or something.

>>29225239
Nano S if you use less than 3 coins
Trezor One if you have more
Nano X if you want Bluetooth
Trezor T if you prefer a touchscreen

I've heard that the Trezor One is easier to extract the private keys from if you were to lose it or if it gets stolen, but Ledger is a black box and their customer data was leaked through Shopify.
The Trezor T has also become stupidly expensive, almost 200€.

>>29225500
You can use Amazon for Ledger, those addresses were not leaked

>>29225649
Yes, just make sure it's not a 3rd party seller on Amazon.

>>29225239
I own both. Prefer the Trezor.

>>29225587
>>29225649
You seem knowledge. May I ask a question? My ledger nano S broke, so I bought a Trezor One. I can just use the seed phrase from the ledger, and then the ledger will be able to interact with all the same websites that the ledger interacted with , right? Like metamask, binance smart chain network, etc.

>>29225239
personally, i leave my coins at the exchange

>>29225801
Knowledgeable*

>>29225877
>storing your coins in the exchange
not your keys, not your coins.

https://cryptosec.info/exchange-hacks/

>>29225801
Mostly, depends on the specific wallet though. Just search for the ones you need.

>>29225239
Just use a raspberry pi for exclusive trading and shit.
With encryption etc.

>>29226267
Implying even 1% of the users of this board would have the knowledge to do that

>>29225239
Ledger is clearly run by incompetent morons, so they're out unless you want every criminal in the world to know your home address and that you own crypto. So it's between the trezor models, which really just depends on which coins you want to hold. The more expensive trezor supports a lot more coins. More specifically, the trezor one does not support XMR while the model t does, which should tell you all you need to know about which one to buy.

>>29225239
The one easiest to shove up your ass

>>29226595
>trezor lover
https://blog.kraken.com/post/3662/kraken-identifies-critical-flaw-in-trezor-hardware-wallets/

>>29226572
Then they're not even going to make enough money to justify buying a leder or whatever lmao

>>29225239
ledger if you spoof all of your information and pay with a gift card
if you can't do that trezor
or just set up a USB stick yourself

Can Waves XRP and Avax be stored in Ledger or Trezor?

>>29225239
trezor, it's open sourced.

Does anyone use digital bit box?
thoughts?

>>29226697
>requires physical access

>>29226267
>SD card has a formatting issue
>your entire life's savings are wiped out

leave all of it on an exchange so you can cash it tonight

>>29225239
Coinbase or Binance

>>29227296
Make duplicates.

Gross. Imagine not having a chad SafePal or Cobo Vault.

>>29227275
if thats what makes you feel better. I agree that people’s PII was leaked on ledger’s website. That is the website’s fault in security. However for being a hardware wallet and being able to crack the trezor in 15min having a security flaw on the device itself. At this point probably better going with a software wallet to hold millions of dollars and not use either. A critical security flaw in the actual device should be considered a problem and not ignored.

>>29226697
>15 minutes of physical access
>hundreds of dollars in equipment
>useless if the device has a passphrase on it
trezor absolutely btfo'd hahahaha....

>>29226595
>trezor one does not support XMR
well that fucking sucks.

>>29227152
doesn't that mean it'd be easier to hack though?

>>29225239
SafePal S1

>>29225239
laptop without a hard-drive running tails
make paper wallet
enjoy safety of cold storage for $0 without worrying about niggers coming to your leaked address
but you faggots still use bitcoin instead of monero so you'll learn all of this too late

>>29226869
most people have the money. most people arent tech savvy.

do most people use raspberry pi for security camera systems?
do most people have their own home server?
do most people use pi-holes?
do most people use open wrt?
do most people use linux?

no. that's just the way it is

>>29226595
>>29226697

Why is there only 2. It's the same as everybody having the windows operation system. I want some obscure secure shit that a hacker wouldn't even bother trying since <1% of people with cold wallets use it

>>29228510
this guy knows

>>29228510
>laptop without a hard-drive running tails
I just got a Linux laptop and use it only for crypto
safe enough

>>29228894
There are several hardware wallets out on the market. Its just that Trezor and Ledger are the popular ones. Keep in mind hardware wallets basically is a hardware killswitch for approving sending transactions. Great idea. Trezor is fucked in this scenario as a hardware wallet if people can hack and extract it though.
>>29228510
If people had the knowledge its better off doing what this anon suggests but the lack of hardware killswitch is the con of paper wallets.

>>29225239
Trezor looks retarded and Ledger is a bugman rectangle. Make your choice.

>>29227570
Okay Im getting a ledger s

Played with all of them, Model T is the best UX by far

>>29226697
>>29226697
article is a year old, haven't they fixed that shit yet? it doesn't matter for me tho, exclusively expensive model supporting monero is the gayest shit I have ever heard today so far and I have jerked off to brazillian tranny porn few hours ago. I feel like buying the ledger now.

>>29226267
wouldn't that require keeping every software wallet updated for security reasons, having to remember or write down phrases for each wallet in case raspberry decides not to work so you can restore your wallets in different platform? sounds like a hassle.

>>29229550
dont be cheap. Get a ledger nano x it is actually better. The S doesnt have enough space.

>>29230236
why do you need space on a hardware wallet, will you store porn along with currencies?

>>29225500
i moved since the leak so i dont really have to worry about much, ill get spam texts and emails about my old address all the time. I got this crazy email earlier it was actually the most convincing ive seen, it was from "Chainlink" prompting me to update the token address for some sort of cheaper gas fee update on the network.

I keep it all on binance

just use a free desktop/android wallet or paper wallet you dumbfuck. these things are not any more or less secure than other solutions, they are made for idiots who don't understand math or think that these look cool

>>29227570
Lol I'd like to see you try & do the physical trezor attack anon

>>29229550
Don’t get the S. I wished I got the X.
S has fuck all storage.

>>29228153
Chink backdoor

>>29225746
>sure it's not a 3rd party seller on Amazon.
This. The only known to hijack Ledgers involves getting them before the target does.

>>29230354
People holding numerous altcoins on a nano s are going to have a bad time. Thats what the ledger people initially thought as well.

I use my airgapped lunix laptop and keepass but with shit like bancor where you want to interact with eth contracts with quite a lot of value in them, i am now looking at the trezor but it looks like you can only activate it via their website while online? wtf?

>>29230511
Again having physical access to the device right? Give me your trezor, I actually do have the technical knowledge and aptitude to get in. Just trying to inform anons. Not here to debate and be petty. Normies already have a bad time with pump and dump shitcoins.

is keeping your stuff on binance dangerous? is it possible that it could just disappear one day?

>>29231308
yes that shit irked me too. when you enter their website it says "Go offline. Store your coins with Trezor. " while selling a device that can only be used with a website GUI when you are connected to web. what a fucking joke.

At what point should you start using multiple hardware wallets, rather than just one?

>>29231318
answer me nigger >>29230029 I am now considering setting shit up my own, hardware wallets on the market suck shit. I want to know if I am wrong about anything.

>>29231540
mt. gox

>>29225801
yes i believe trezor and ledger are compatible with each other

>>29225649
I would only buy from Ledger directly desu

>>29226595
>trezor one does not support XMR
good thing i lost it in a boating accident

I think paper wallets and other stuff are the best

>>29227851
but it also means we know if there is a vulnerability, with ledger we dont know if there is a day 1 exploit

>>29231731
>answer me nigger
hahah got my attention
>>29230029
>article is a year old, haven't they fixed that shit yet?
I think Trezor did come with a patch workaround for the article. However Trezor has a flaw because it doesnt use a secure enclave (similar to what apple uses a special chip to store the sensitive data). Until Trezor introduces a secure element chipset in their next generation model, ngmi.
>>29229437
Like I mention before. There is a place for hardware wallet in the sense of sending transactions need to be confirmed on a hardware wallet by a physical press of a button that software wallets do not have. But if you are a “trust no one” type of person, you should have some cryptography skills under your belt, then you should be safe. Hardware wallets have a place for normies and experts alike. software wallets should stay with experts because normies will just put the information in an unencrypted excel spreadsheet. ngmi.

>>29225239
>>29232010
Trezor Model T and ONLY Trezor Model T!

I’ll say it again...
KeepKey

>>29232564
>There is a place for hardware wallet in the sense of sending transactions need to be confirmed on a hardware wallet by a physical press of a button that software wallets do not have.
I dont know how much I can stress this. If you have spyware or malware on your computer and you are a fuckin normie that hires the geeksquad. You want a hardware wallet. That confirmation press on the hardware wallet when sending crypto in a transaction is what will save you from being liquidated from your wallet.

i bought a trezor cause they didn't get hacked

>>29233662
I use linux and literally only install programs from sources I trust. I could set up an airgapped raspberry pi to function as hardware wallet. the reason I hesitate to do so is I am not very well-read on encryption and having to write down recovery seed for every single wallet I set up. I mean I use 6-7 coins so I set up let's say 5 wallets, carefully writing down 5 different seeds only to realize years later when I want to recover two wallets I misspelled two words in recovery seed now I am fucked.
trezor/ledger can restore the whole thing with one seed that's why I am inclined towards owning one.

>>29228510
any reason why this isn't the best way to go?

>>29234185
If you know linux then you should start learning cryptography, no reason not to. There are several ways to encrypt and can be multi-faceted and layered upon each other. Not going into details but lets say I use four different layers of encryption. I still use a hardware wallet however because “muh physical button.”Airgapped cold storage wallets with layers of encryption is probably the best scenario in a digital world. Seedphrases that never touched the digital realm have their own levels of security and integrity that need to be taken accounted for.

>>29230502
What happens when your hard drive fails?

>>29230502
explain

>>29225239
Paper.

>>29234890
>Airgapped cold storage wallets with layers of encryption is probably the best scenario in a digital world
it seems to be the safest solution but convenience is out the door. I eventually wanted to set up such device but I am really lazy so I thought till then might as well just use hardware wallet that can be bought and use it till I set my own thing up.
>still use a hardware wallet
which1

>>29235217
you recover the wallets with your recovery seed that you were supposed to wrote down on when setting them up.

They're both shit.

>buy ledger
>try using monero
>ledger live doesn't let me make a monero "account"
>try native monero wallet
>fails to interface with ledger
piece of shit cost me 2 LINK, I do not recommend.

>>29235910
Can you connect monero account to metamask? If so connect the metamask and ledger and boom you got a bridge.

>>29235910
Bullshit post

>>29235910
Use the offiicial Monero wallet, Monero GUI.

Works perfectly with Ledger, I store my undisclosed number of Moneros there.

>>29236280
I can try it I guess, I'll keep it in mind.

>>29236346
>>29236461
This is the Monero GUI, my Ledger is currently connected. I can't even create a wallet.

>>29233662
now. I didnt talk about seedphrases. These hardware wallets generate the seedphrases, well software wallets donas well. The nice thing is the hardware wallets do it without needing an airgapped computer. Normies are literally better off writing these seedphrases because stupid ones will again put it in a fuckin unencrypted spreadsheet. If you have to like in the movie christmas story little ralphie uses orphane annie secret society decoder pin to store your seedphrases plain text. Be creative, think outside the box. People will start to think harder on how to keep their shitcoins safe, when? When your assets start going into the thousands, tens/hundreds of thousands or fuckin millions of dollars? We are have entered the crypto bullrun. Lots of normies, hardware/software wallets, big investment firms and cryptoexchanges are gonna get fucked with security exploits. Encryption, airgapped computers in a faraday cage and obfuscated written seedphrases with little orphan annies secret society secoder pins are going to keep the autists of chans safe. Normies are too stupid and will have to figure out whats their best course scenario would be. I am informing you faggots because I am an adovate of cryptocurrencies and we have to share our knowledge to make shit go to the moon when normies come in. Without them we are going to be poorfags. Lets inform them.

>>29236646
My bad, forgot pic

>>29236646
Do you have the Monero app installed on Ledger through Ledger Live and then did you open thhe app in the Ledger screen?

>>29236899
Yes, the monero app is installed on the hardware device and it is opened. This is what I see in Ledger Live. It's like monero doesn't even exist.

>>29236899
>Monero app installed on Ledger through Ledger Live and then did you open thhe app in the Ledger screen?
imagine buying such crap device man

>>29228894
The point is to protect you from online attacks, not physical attacks. It doesn't matter if they can extract it from the device, they can just beat the shit out of you until you give up the pin

>>29225587
What is the deal with the nano s having a few kb’s of storage? What year is this?

>>29237107
The account part doesn't matter, those are just for checking balances with public keys.

What matters is the Manager part, make sure the app is installed and running.

Aren't hardware wallets just a meme? What exactly makes them safer than using an offline wallet on a pc or phone?

>>29225239
Airgap Vault installed on an old android.

>>29237309
>offline wallet on a pc or phone?

Offline on a device that is usually connected to the Internet?

I was deciding between those two a few months ago. Trezor can be hacked within a minute if you have physical access. That's a deal breaker for me.

>>29237107
Do not have ledger live opened when trying to connect your ledger to something else (monero gui, metamask, etc.)

>>29228894
Just download a paper wallet generator, install it on an offline computer that has never been online, engrave the keys into metal that won't rust or melt, store it in a fireproof safe, and then securely format the offline computer you used to generate the keys.

>>29237470
True, but as other anons have said, if they have physical access, they have probably physical access to YOU.

They won't bother with expensive hardware, they'll just beat the password out of you.

>>29237279
>the account part doesn't matter
Who says? I should be able to easily copypaste my public key for receiving XMR and be able to view my balance. The manager is running but this is a pretty basic functionality for a wallet I'm missing out on. How would I even send monero from the hardware wallet if I can't interface with it?

>>29237495
I assure you that isn't the issue, I did each wallet independently.

>>29237598
Well if you've got ledger live opened your ledger won't be able to interact with monero gui. You don't need to add an account on ledger live, it's just there for you to see your balance but it's basically useless.

>>29237572
I take my ledger on the road. That's why I bough it. What if somone steals my backpack?

Binance.gov

>>29237598
Ledger Live doesn't support it yet. You'll have to open one program instead of another, big deal. GUII is better as a wallet anyways.
And having the GUI installed helps the network if you decide to act as a node.

Just have the app installed and open, close Ledger Live, open the GUI. Should work.

>>29237787
I didn't have ledger live opened while trying to use monero GUI. I simply can't create a wallet for my Ledger using monero GUI, at all.

>>29237862
I CAN'T MAKE A WALLET WITH GUI, I appreciate the help but I feel like I'm talking in circles right now. "Should work." Great, it doesn't though!

>>29237789
If they don't have the 24 words you are safe.

Fun fact, you can buy another new Ledger, "recover" it using your 24 words and effectively have a physical backup. It's your seed what matters.

>>29237922
Check tutorials, maybe you missed a step.

It took me 5 minutes and worked first try, don't get discouraged.

>>29237959
or they can hack it and transfer all the funds then when he recovers the wallet he sees 0 balance.

>>29238055
I'm wondering if using Linux is part of the issue, I've already checked all the top hits on google and recommended solutions like changing udev and all this crap I really don't understand and none of it has solved the problem. I can still use the Ledger for my ERC-20s but I'm definitely frustrated.

>>29237959
But then they would only need to brute force one word. Why risk it? Just buy a ledger and done. You're safe untill they guess your pin within 3 tries

>>29238109
>or they can hack it and transfer all the funds

How?
No one has cracked a Ledger yet.

>>29238176
He's talking about trezor

>>29238147
>But then they would only need to brute force one word.
What the fuck are you talking about.

Trezor, and it’s not even close.
Ledger software is so goddamn buggy.

>>29225239
Both

>>29238134
https://www.getmonero.org/downloads/
GUI supports Linux. I use Windows so maybe there's a step there.

Check this.
https://support.ledger.com/hc/en-us/articles/360006352934-Monero-XMR-

>>29237398
>airplane mode
I hope you fully de-soldered all the wireless radios including GPS for maximum security.

>>29227347
Yea, I don't see why between the two, you'd need a hardware wallet

>>29238176
I read that it has been by security experts.

>>29225239
>company that gets hacked and reveals home addresses of all buyers vs company that has never gotten their customers doxxed
Gee I wonder

I ordered a ledger nano off Amazon and this thread has made me paranoid even though I have barely any crypto

>>29238342
i know the story behind this, she (he) was an angry ex who tried to steal his bitcoin so he cracked her (his) skull with a hot iron

>>29238742
A fully offline paper wallet is the only cold storage solution, anon.

>>29238402
>>airplane mode
>I hope you fully de-soldered all the wireless radios including GPS for maximum security.

It's not going to turn itself on. The Android device is encrypted, so no one is turning it on either. But if an adversary can physically interact with your hardware wallet then you should consider yourself fucked regardless.

This is still far superior than keeping coins on a hot wallet where your private keys are loaded in plain text in to RAM on your internet connected device every time you sign a transaction.

>>29226117
There are also the times where exchanges just shutdown and stole your coins (Mt Gox, Cryptsy).

>>29238742
People here are just schizos and autists. Unless there is someone who is specifically after you, you do not need to worry, your funds are safu.

Why not an encrypted VM?

>>29227296
Would you believe me if I told you setting up a backup system to sync changes every minute is easy? With the ability to roll back minute by minute if necessary?

>>29239791
but they ARE after me, man

>>29233001
What the fuck is this shit?

Support:Optimized for MacOS. Not recommended for Windows.

>>29227335
transferring from a wallet to the exchange maybe takes like 3 minutes lol

>>29238993
>gets keylogged when he withdraws funds from the cold wallet

>>29232451
>day 1 exploit

I just got my Trezor One wallet. It makes me pretty comfy.

>>29240602
>he doesn't create a brand new offline wallet every time and transfer the remainder of the funds to new, uncompromised storage
ngmi